quote:[OOC]I'm not sure whether Iain M Banks or Douglas Adams will be a better guide to this ship...[/OOC]
Originally posted by la vie en rouge:
(I thought about being a super-intelligent shade of the colour red but sadly I don't think I have the writing talent to make it work. Someone more gifted than me is welcome to steal the idea tho )
quote:Douglas Adams. Really. I was hoping there might be a hooloovoo in our cast, but having the RCG make another appearance—well, we can't argue with that one! I may just have to add one to the non-player character list if nothing else . . .
Originally posted by Rev per Minute:
quote:[OOC]I'm not sure whether Iain M Banks or Douglas Adams will be a better guide to this ship...[/OOC]
Originally posted by la vie en rouge:
(I thought about being a super-intelligent shade of the colour red but sadly I don't think I have the writing talent to make it work. Someone more gifted than me is welcome to steal the idea tho )
quote:Neversaid found himself in the recreation deck with a variety of other passengers.
Originally posted by Eliab:
Decide now not to kill is foolish. May smell guilt - why not take throat in our teeth if do?
quote:People is appropriate for all sentient beings capable of living socially. Lifeform discriminates against us androids.
Originally posted by la vie en rouge:
There are certainly some lifeforms* acting very oddly
*not sure "people" is quite the appropriate word here on the Ariston…
quote:Same true of everyone. Soon as odds "good", MAFIA win.
Originally posted by leonato:
Well, Herodatus said I was picked for nomination completely at random. There are 15 possible MAFIA members on this ship, I guess at most 3 are (currently) members. So there is only a 1 in 5 chance that I am guilty. Not very good odds.
quote:Ignore this. Stupid. Erratum. This make difference:
Originally posted by Eliab:
Hellenes use psionics. If aboard, make sense to listen. But better trust own nose than stranger's brain. Psionics not always reliable. Not see change of mind in future. Not see past neural shield. May see only what can do, not what side. We rely on them only, we die.
quote:Ergo all innocents be told by psionic who others are. And psionic not break cover. If two psionic clear one other per diem, could have majority three days.
Originally posted by AristonAstuanax:
2. Unlike previous games, behind-the-scenes communication, unless otherwise noted, is permissible.
quote:Herodartus started his work of collecting sources. This looks like an important excerpt from recent conversations to include if he wrote this up.
Originally posted by AristonAstuanax:
"The usual—uniformed officers, a few plainclothes—as well as some psionically adept agents. Naturally, those are in deep cover and of varying ability and function—I met one the other day who could read my every intention, but couldn't tell you what my position was even from my uniform. Another? The exact opposite. I've heard rumors that one of our passengers is a medium of some sort—able to commune with spirits, that sort of thing—though, quite frankly, that seems rather unlikely. There's also that security officer we recruited; you should have seen the demonstration of the ancient art of close-quarters pen combat I saw! I certainly wouldn't want to be on the wrong side of that one's ledger . . ."
code:Obble woke up in a corner and tried to figure out what was going on and why it'd rebooted. All it could tell from it's error logs was that it had been hit by some kind of radiation surge.Loading...........................................100%
Sirius Robotic Cybernetic Operating System Ver. 3.11.
Share and Enjoy
obble@hospitality-bot:-$
code:Oh Smeg. Now I'll have to hack myself again to turn off the worst of those personality circuits.1st person module active...
quote:Too dangerous to fake. If I not psionic, and claim to you I am, have to give you true facts or found out. And same to one more each day. Would be found out.
Originally posted by la vie en rouge:
I think I'm wary of behind the scenes communication on the whole. There's no way of knowing that anyone's telling the truth. It may be allowed, but I'm not sure it's wise most of the time.
quote:Not at all. When we start having more nominations, voting, lynchings and mysterious deaths in the night we will have evidence to decide who is MAFIA. But as Herodatus said there is no evidence against me, I was chosen at random. As such I am far more likely to be innocent than guilty, as is everyone else at the moment.
Same true of everyone. Soon as odds "good", MAFIA win.
Best see this as one of five chances to get right. Bad to waste chance. Even if slim.
quote:We kill at random, have 21% chance never get MAFIA. Assume three.
Originally posted by leonato:
You seem to suggest that we should just lynch at random, sacrificing innocents in the vague hope of lynching the mafia, which seems to me to be just what the mafia would want.
quote:Was wrong. 17%.
Originally posted by Eliab:
We kill at random, have 21% chance never get MAFIA.
quote:Agree. MAFIA know, not guess. We think, not guess. Random chance show odds before we make better, they worse.
Originally posted by Dafyd:
Neversaid thinks that Eliabus is overestimating our chances of not lynching a mafia member.
quote:Not surprise that snake want rat snack. You want fight cat for, fine.
Originally posted by Banner Lady:
"Interesting how Eliabus clearly and firmly wants to direct everyone away from voting for the only self-confessed rat on board." thought BL to herself.
quote:Rudi Rattelschneck agreed with Neversaid. The other strategy had now failed six or seven times. Why not try the alternative? And he had insufficient time to even read the thread, never mind think about it.
Originally posted by Dafyd:
In the meantime Neversaid hoped that there wouldn't be any lynchings. Admittedly, the other way where we randomly lynch innocents and then make inaccurate guesses based on misguided suspicions of other people's behaviour is more fun. But Neversaid hoped that there would be detectives on board, and it was his opinion that our best chance was to do our best not to kill them.
quote:You are right, I had not considered this.
Originally posted by The Great Gumby:
"The flaw in the plan is that any time one of us guesses an alignment incorrectly, either expressing confidence in a MAFIA member, or pointing a finger/tentacle/appendage of choice at an innocent, we prove ourselves to the MAFIA not to be a detective, and narrow the field.
quote:"Of course, there's nothing to say you haven't already - there's no way to tell, is there?"
Originally posted by la vie en rouge:
I still don't like secret communication, for the same reasons that I tried to explain to the poor unfortunate dog. If I was a murderer,* here's what I'd do: tomorrow I would send you a private missive saying "Dear Mr Tastymorsel, I am the psionic. I have investigated you and [whoever] and found you both innocent" and consequently influence your voting behaviour. To shore up the plan, I would then murder you the following evening to stop you telling anyone about my little fib. The only danger is that I might send this message to a real psionic, but OTOH maybe there's more than one so I might still get away with it.
Now do you see why I don't like it?
*Rest assured that I'm not a murderer. If I was, I wouldn't be be putting telling you about this plan, I'd be putting it into action
quote:describes his voting behaviour. Reverse's vote was pretty much the last one that could have swung the ballot towards a lynching at the point when it was going in the opposite direction. Two votes later the majority had become impossible.
Originally posted by la vie en rouge:
Now the initial votes were pretty much evenly split between the two candidates and no lynching, before the trend started to drift towards no lynching. A daring MAFIA operative might have gently tried to swing the vote at this point in the hopes of securing the early lynching of an innocent. This would have to be done while enough votes were still uncast to make a lynching numerically possible.
quote:From a conversation between Ship's Officers:
Originally posted by Sylvander:
2. Does the detective actually
a) see the role or
b) does he only see "innocent" or "guilty"?
quote:I think the first one is a detective, and the other is a role-spotter. The same conversation lists a medium (allows dead people to communicate their findings?) and what I take to be a veteran (if killed in the night, kills their killer).
Naturally, those are in deep cover and of varying ability and function—I met one the other day who could read my every intention, but couldn't tell you what my position was even from my uniform. Another? The exact opposite.
quote:All too murky for me to make any sense of, let alone enough to base any speculations on. I'll stick with our usual glorified guesswork and waiting for a perhaps non-existing detective's revelations.
Originally posted by Dafyd:
From a conversation between Ship's Officers:
quote:I think the first one is a detective, and the other is a role-spotter. The same conversation lists a medium (allows dead people to communicate their findings?) and what I take to be a veteran (if killed in the night, kills their killer).
Naturally, those are in deep cover and of varying ability and function—I met one the other day who could read my every intention, but couldn't tell you what my position was even from my uniform. Another? The exact opposite.
quote:You mean we don't even now know whether he was? I hope that at least Mafia know who and what they are!
Originally posted by Dafyd:
We know of one other role: it wasn't possible for the detective to tell whether Eliabus was innocent or guilty. I think it's safe to assume he was innocent.
quote:"Not true," said the human. "Look at Mycroft's notes two votes after mine:
Originally posted by la vie en rouge:
Reverse's vote was pretty much the last one that could have swung the ballot towards a lynching at the point when it was going in the opposite direction. Two votes later the majority had become impossible.
quote:meaning that a lynching was still possible when Mycroft tallied the votes, and that the 'swing' votes (those who pushed the vote towards a lynching or not) followed mine. Your 'logic' makes no sense. Look elsewhere for your guilty party, Red - I've killed no-one."
Rudi: IIII/
Leox: III
Nobody: IIII/
16 voters; 8 votes needed to lynch
A list of names followed Mycroft's columns; 13 had been stricken out after their owners had voted, but three remained:
Artichoke Smudgeson
Zoink
Obble-42
quote:Ah, but you overlook that this adds a lot of fun to the proceedings, which is the whole purpose of playing at all. The greatest fun-factor difference between Mafiosi and citizens, as you know, is that the latter mostly have nothing to do except wait while the former happily spin intrigues. I like the new set-up far more. So much room for double bluffs and using their own weapons against the vicious conspirators
Originally posted by la vie en rouge:
I still don't like secret communication, for the same reasons that I tried to explain to the poor unfortunate dog...
quote:"Hi there! I'm Demosthenes 0.9, your Beta-test version artificial-intelligence advocate, provided as a complementary service as part of your selected passenger package!
Originally posted by AristonAstuanax:
Mr. Minuto has informed me that, due to certain Difficulties he could not enumerate, he will be unable to properly defend himself. I would welcome a volunteer, even from the World Beyond, who wouldn't mind defending him.
quote:And if this checks out, you prove yourself to be a Roleblocker. However, I'm not sure that this necessarily demonstrates you to be innocent. AIUI, you could still be MAFIA with a Roleblocking ability.
Originally posted by la vie en rouge:
My proof that this is true? Simple. I can tell you who I have blocked.
quote:It seemed unfair to lynch anyone on such shaky evidence... but the Red Cat was certainly up to something. Might as well kill her and find out what.
She's so twisty you could use her to open bottles!
quote:The blancmange has a fair point. I think there’s an answer to it, though which is: the psionic.
Originally posted by The Great Gumby:
quote:And if this checks out, you prove yourself to be a Roleblocker. However, I'm not sure that this necessarily demonstrates you to be innocent. AIUI, you could still be MAFIA with a Roleblocking ability.
Originally posted by la vie en rouge:
My proof that this is true? Simple. I can tell you who I have blocked.
Care to comment?
quote:No, it's not the same. Saying "I have been investigated and found innocent" can be falsified by the investigator. The investigator may not reveal her role by announcing this publicly, but she can be counted on to nominate the liar for lynching.
Originally posted by Sylvander:
1. The Cat's claim "I have been investigated and found innocent" is equal to the statement "I am innocent". Everybody will say that and - we cannot verify.
quote:Agreed.
Originally posted by Dafyd:
I think that shows that the Red Cat goddess is almost certainly on our side.
quote:I'm not so sure about this. There's a hidden false assumption in there. I don't think we know whether Minuto was attempting a hit on Obble-42, picking the wrong robot to mess with, or Ruby, who was being guarded by the robot. If it was the former, it was a remarkable coincidence. If the latter, let's consider the implications:
I would tentatively clear everyone who voted to lynch Reverse Minuto. The mafia might have decided to clear themselves in case anyone ever found them out in future on the assumption that they knew it was safe, but I think it's a bit early for them to try playing those games. They always feel clever when you're not mafia, but should one ever be mafia I think it feels better to play safe.
quote:Fair enough. I had it in my head that you would be protected by him, but obviously misremembered that as a claim you'd made, rather than something you'd requested. And looking back, I can't see any indication that the security officerbot would kill/be killed in preventing a hit, although it may be what happened. I like devious strategies, but they probably did just get lucky.
Originally posted by la vie en rouge:
At any rate, the securitybot never contacted me prior to getting done in.
quote:I don't think we should have just one person up for lynching. Therefore, I nominate Jorfh (even if, by my own reasoning, that makes it likely for y'all to suspect me of being Mafia protecting AA. I'm not, but then, we'd all say that, wouldn't we?).
Voting for your own when there is no chance of lynching seems like a good tactic to me, which makes me suspicious of Grstamjuarlt and Jorfh.
quote:I'm willing to believe that, and regret my nomination. Unless, I suppose, he is a traitor, but we've got no evidence to suggest that.
Originally posted by la vie en rouge:
Ahem. I have it on good authority that Jorfh the Moose is innocent.
quote:Well, that's up to you, but I can assure you that I'm innocent of everything but a burning desire to win the Intergalactic Pan-Dimensional Tennis Open (Wimbledon was so 20th Century, you know). With luck, someone will be able to confirm that.
Originally posted by Dafyd:
I'm more suspicious of Gumblor, Leox and Miss Smudgeson than of Jorfh myself.
quote:Well, I hope not! At least YOU should have enjoyed it. This was a very nasty bug indeed and if you don't behave from now on, I'll tell everybody all the little details of what you inflicted on me. Believe me, the mere description will make the more fainthearted passengers sick to the point of rocking this boat with their convulsions!
Originally posted by la vie en rouge:
On role-blocking: I don't really regret blocking the rat.
quote:Not so. Relax, it's a game.
Originally posted by la vie en rouge: I sometimes get the impression that rat likes to disagree with me just to be contrary.
quote:Sour grapes? Wouldn't I have had to know in advance you were going to make me sick? Instead I went to bed unsuspecting of any impending doom. Just as I was in the middle of the sweetest dream full of nubile rats that give delight and hurt not, a thousand dangling instruments humming about mine ears when I abruptly awoke and found myself in the process of dying an agonising death ... and things got worse from there.
is probably just sour grapes about the nasty bout of Xhoronos that he now knows is headed his way. (Sorry mate).
quote:Our doctor is dead?! Who was he/she/it? How? When? Why? By whom? I am only a rat, nobody tells me anything. This is very exciting.
our security guard is unfortunately deceased
quote:Imparting all information to one player only is unnecessary. After the psionic's death there should be an unmistakable trail in his posts. The web of knowledge is only relevant for lynching, i.e. during the game, not after the psionic has bitten the bullet.
The psionic has told me he/she/it doesn't intend to contact everyone he/she/it finds innocent, in order to reduce the number of people in the know and the chances of someone inadvertently letting something slip before investigations are complete.
quote:Is there such a role? As I said in that case my (or rather: originally Dafyd's) idea won't work.
The psionic is also concerned about revealing his/her/its identity to a potential traitor.
quote:I'm not worried about the traitor for the time being.
Originally posted by Sylvander:
Is there such a role? As I said in that case my (or rather: originally Dafyd's) idea won't work.
quote:Coming from the mighty Eliab himself, I'm pretty proud of that one
Originally posted by Demosthenes 0.9:
But, hey, check out the cat chick! Is she smooth or what? I mean, we are talking FRICTIONLESS BEARINGS here. If the beer here were that smooth, I'd be in the bar ALL DAY, dude, and I'm an AI construct, man!
quote:That's fair enough - how were you to know? But I'm a little hurt you thought I was a bad guy. I didn't reveal myself before that point because I didn't have a vital role, and I wanted to wait long enough to be sure you were who you claimed. Even then, I held out on you a little - as well as being able to "protect" people, at least as far as temporarily being able to speak from beyond the grave, I could (if I chose) turn someone else into me (my role, my alignment) but at the expense of my own life. That was my fallback if I came under too much suspicion or became too obvious a target for the MAFIA.
Originally posted by la vie en rouge:
And truth be told, the Red Cat had just made a rather embarassing tactical blunder. I'd just blocked Gumby (because I suspected him of being the third murderer) and it turns out that he had limited keeping-alive powers and was planning to use them to save me. (It was to my advantage to get my pick in ASAP because of actions that would cancel each other out. Whoever got in first would have their action counted.) Whoops
quote:I totally thought you were the psionic because of all the "My friend the psionic says" stuff! You were going to die as soon as I could make it look like a coincidence.
Originally posted by la vie en rouge:
The psionic (I'll let him reveal who he is) and I were just having a big strategic discussion about what to do next. I'd taken it for granted there was a third killer.
quote:Possibly fair, depending on the drafting of the rules and roles for this game by mine host, but a typical Traitor should only achieve a win in the event of both a successful defection and a victory for the mafia, to prevent just this sort of situation.
Originally posted by Dafyd:
Question: one person contacted me privately to out themselves as the traitor and expressed a wish to keep playing on the innocents team. (They can identify themselves if they wish.) The mafia were weaker than they might have been given that the traitor was actively trying for an innocent victory. What do people think? Is this fair?
quote:I was given the letter by the Master of the Universe with the instruction to add my name to the list and send it on to whom I liked. Once it came back to me I was to give it back to where I got it from with the list of names at the bottom.
Originally posted by Imaginary Friend:
What was with the round-robin letter by the way?
quote:Her reasoning is what I wish I'd sit down and think. Greatly impressed.
Though this is probably the only time it's ever been (or will be) said about her, Ruby the Red Cat Goddess is innocent.
quote:Sorry laying low had nothing to do with guilt, but lack of internet access and moving during the game!
Originally posted by Banner Lady:
On the second night I decided to investigate either obble or Zoink, as they were laying low in below deck service roles. Typical mafia behaviour, methought. I went for Zoink, and discovered Zoink was innocent, while obble was killed along with Reverse Minuto. Obble proved to be the security-bot. So for the second night I failed to find any felons.
quote:The letter stopped at me - I sent it to Obble (he was keeping quiet and I wanted to know if he was hiding or just off line) and then he promptly get murdered.
Originally posted by Sylvander:
quote:I was given the letter by the Master of the Universe with the instruction to add my name to the list and send it on to whom I liked. Once it came back to me I was to give it back to where I got it from with the list of names at the bottom.
Originally posted by Imaginary Friend:
What was with the round-robin letter by the way?
I was not allowed to tell from whom I got it.
It never made it back to me.
As to its purpose Ariston best can tell.
quote:
Originally posted by JFH:
Therefore I picked Smudgie for the second investigation... She's rather quiet, which in my mind made her somewhat expendable
quote:I mentioned a while back that I was working on a spot of Cluedo, which would allow everyone to roleplay to their hearts' content in a non-mafia environment. If you give me a while, I should be able to get that in order for a game.
Originally posted by Hart:
I'd probably be up for a mafia rest too, but at some point I'd like to go on another outing as the clueless-but-keen historian who ended up being rather fun to play.