Ship of Fools: Are we going to have a purge?

Thread: Are we going to have a purge? Board: Purgatory / Ship of Fools.

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Posted by Schroedinger's cat (# 64) on :

This is a quote from a book or film that I cannot remember (I suspect 1984, Brave New World, a film based on these, or a story based loosely around these). The full quote is this:

"Do you think we will have a purge?"
"Open your eyes. We are having a purge"

The fear they had was a "purge" - the radical change in the world, the change of regime, the radical system change that they all dreaded, without understanding what it actually was they were dreading.

The quote has stayed with me, because it really struck a chord. For most people, the radical changes that they fear most creep up while they don't notice, and they (we) accept the little changes because they are not the "Big change" that we really dread.

And it seems that this is the situation we are in - the real dread of X means that we accept Y, without understanding that Y is actually partly the thing we actually dread. If that makes sense.

Does that make sense?

Posted by Barnabas62 (# 9110) on :

Creeping totalitarianism? Emerging neo-nationalism legitimising hate? Impatience with real world complexities and a penchant for simplistic sloganisers? The loss of respect for honest analysis and truth-telling? Careless jumping on bandwagons?

Eternal vigilance is still the price of liberty. The trick is to avoid paranoia!

Like you, I can discern some quite nasty national and international trends. But I think you have to do your best to speak against them, stand up for what is dear to you, in whatever ways you can.

Posted by Garden Hermit (# 109) on :

There's two Worlds. The one on TV and the Newspapers. The one involving Politicians and Reporters. The subjects they want to 'entertain' you with. And there's the other Life, of people trying to get on with each other, have a good job and housing, worried about their health and their future, and trying to do the best for their kids. Most of Life is a complete pretence.

Posted by Martin60 (# 368) on :

Reality is classified.

Posted by lilBuddha (# 14333) on :

quote:
Originally posted by Martin60:
Reality is classified.

Reality is in the Classifieds? Which newspaper?

Posted by Martin60 (# 368) on :

In the double incontinence pants (for the purge) requiring Framley Examiner.

[ 15. April 2017, 12:47: Message edited by: Martin60 ]

Posted by Bishops Finger (# 5430) on :

[Killing me]

Posted by Gramps49 (# 16378) on :

At least in American politics every eight years there seems to be a purge. If an Administration can make it for the full eight years, the next administration will be of the opposite party.

There is no doubt Trump thought it was his duty to purge everything that smacks of Obama. He named cabinet secretaries who are bent on reducing, if not eliminating, their own departments. He literally purged the ambassador corps overnight and has yet to bring it up to full compliment (I don't believe we even have an ambassador to Russia yet).

He is even beginning to purge his supposedly inner circle. Steve Bannon is on his way out. If you are not part of the Trump family you mean nothing to him.

There may even be a time when he will turn on his family, or the family will turn on him.

Posted by Gramps49 (# 16378) on :

Another example of the Trump purge. Then, maybe not. Originally Trump called the Export-Import Bank an excess, but now he is saying it helps small business companies compete internationally--which is what it was intended to do. Still he nominates two people who have a history of wanting to kill it.

Posted by rolyn (# 16840) on :

Is war a purge?
The manner in which some are currently contemplating the possibility of a nuclear weapon being used in anger makes me think that your 'X' is fear and tension. 'Y' is the concept we think will cure 'X'

And as you say we have clean forgotten that 'Y' , (a self inflicted humanitarian situation of unimaginable proportions), is the very thing we always dreaded the most.

Posted by Martin60 (# 368) on :

quote:
Originally posted by Bishops Finger:

IJ

It's bloody hurtingly funny isn't it. I start to suffocate every time.

Posted by Schroedinger's cat (# 64) on :

quote:
Originally posted by Barnabas62:
Creeping totalitarianism? Emerging neo-nationalism legitimising hate? Impatience with real world complexities and a penchant for simplistic sloganisers? The loss of respect for honest analysis and truth-telling? Careless jumping on bandwagons?

Eternal vigilance is still the price of liberty. The trick is to avoid paranoia!

Like you, I can discern some quite nasty national and international trends. But I think you have to do your best to speak against them, stand up for what is dear to you, in whatever ways you can.

While trying to avoid paranoia, it seems that some people will not accept that the rise of the right is dangerous, because Trump doesn't speak in German or have a stupid moustache.

Currently we have concentration camps in Chechnya, we have blatant racism and anti-Semitism from the White House, desperate isolationism from Number 10, and yet some people are still supporting these leaders, because they are offering something that people want (generally, not giving them what they want, but offering it).

People are still asking "what if this continues", rather than accepting that what has already happened is quite bad enough. They seem to be asking "Do you think we will have a Far Right takeover" without seeing that it is already happening.

Posted by nickel (# 8363) on :

quote:

//... the real dread of X means that we accept Y, without understanding that Y is actually partly the thing we actually dread. // [/QB]

So true, in so many senses. X = Climate Change. Y = habitat fragmentation. What, my need for a weedless stand of green grass is damaging the environment? Why yes, yes it is. Especially if you insist on achieving said lawn with chemical shortcuts. Argh. Must go outside and plant some more proper insect food.

Posted by Martin60 (# 368) on :

Turkey is.

Posted by no prophet's flag is set so... (# 15560) on :

No, Turkey isn't. Purges come from the outside now with mostly bycatch and collateral deaths, which is somewhere between 20 and 30 million in the this century, mostly at the behest of acronyms and slogans. Which somehow translates into heros, freedom, oil, fast food, walls, cocaine, blockbuster movies, prayers, genetic modifications, curses, plastic recycling, and, as you note, poopy pants. The latest additions are bad hair, the nonbiblical land of Moab, Godwin's law, and Jesus not deciding to get crucified a second time but we kill him again anyway. The revolution will not be televised but it will stream triumphantly and bogusly on the internet. In the greatest way.

Posted by simontoad (# 18096) on :

While Trump talks about purging the executive branch, he and his handlers also talk about the deep state - Obama appointees acting against the Trump agenda from the inside.

The fact is that there are still an awful lot of appointments that new Presidents are supposed to make that haven't yet been made. Meanwhile, Trump is sailing away to Maralago again this weekend.

My mate from Vietnam would piss himself laughing at this thread. A purge? You don't know the meaning of the word.

Posted by Brenda Clough (# 18061) on :

Only his own selfishness, distractibility, and immaturity keep Lyin' Don from being a very dangerous man.

Posted by lilBuddha (# 14333) on :

quote:
Originally posted by Brenda Clough:
Only his own selfishness, distractibility, and immaturity keep Lyin' Don from being a very dangerous man.

Which is why those hoping for an impeachment might be better off not getting what they wish for as Pence is none of those things.

Posted by Schroedinger's cat (# 64) on :

quote:
Originally posted by simontoad:
My mate from Vietnam would piss himself laughing at this thread. A purge? You don't know the meaning of the word.

But the point in the original story was that the "Purge" was always something other than what was happening now. So the argument is that we don't need to worry about what is happening here, because it isn't the same as the purge in Vietnam.

But what we are seeing in the West is the starting of things that can get a whole lot worse. The point being that if we don't stop it now, we will get into the even worse things. And when we dismiss those as being "Not like a Real Purge", things get worse and worse.

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