Ship of Fools: How to make small talk at an event

Thread: How to make small talk at an event Board: Oblivion / Ship of Fools.

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Posted by Ramarius (# 16551) on :

Here's some tips . Do you have any stock questions you use to help you work a room?

Posted by Doublethink (# 1984) on :

No, and those are incredibly boring questions.

If I am really stuck I would go with read any good books lately (or seen movies etc). So you have content to talk about rather than diving into the deep and meaningful, which tends to scare people off.

But Ramarius perhaps you could expand your OP so we have more to talk about.

Posted by chive (# 208) on :

I'm crap at small talk, can't do it at all. The problem is that I then over compensate and get all exciteable and talk random nonsense. The people I know expect this but new people find it all a bit odd. But then I don't like new people.

If I have to make small talk with a woman I look at her shoes - shoes are always a good topic of conversation particularly if they're in any way interesting.

The other thing I do is say something ridiculous very loudly in the hope it breaks the ice and other people join in. If it doesn't work I go and hide in the loo for the rest of the event.

Posted by Ariel (# 58) on :

"What’s your connection to the event?"

I'm here to serve the sandwiches. We have cheese, egg, smoked salmon and some sort of unidentifiable meat. Would you like one? Are you sure?

"What’s keeping you busy when you’re not at events like this or at work?"

A large dog called Bonzo. He's incredibly destructive of the furniture if he doesn't get enough exercise, so I have to take him for a five mile run every night and wear him out. Believe me, you don't want to be bounced on in the morning by Bonzo.

"Are you getting away this summer?"

No.

"Are you working on any charity initiatives?"

Er, no, why?

"How did you come to be in your line of work?"

Ever since I was a child I've always had this thing about sandwiches. It started when I was six years old and made my first crisp butty, then as time progressed I got into baked-bean sandwiches and by the time I was a teenager I would regularly make cheese and pickle. Since then I've applied several times to be a contestant on Masterchef, with my signature sandwich of aged Greek goat's cheese and Japanese Mizuna lettuce on sundried tomato and spinach plaited bread, but so far I haven't got in. Are you sure you wouldn't like one of these egg ones? I can cut the crust off if that helps.

Posted by hilaryg (# 11690) on :

I aim a smile and a comment along the lines of "I feel so awkward at these things" at someone looking like I feel. It usually breaks the ice. It's then relatively easy to progress to introductions and being British chatting about the weather or the journey/transport to the event will cover enough time before you have to move on.

Posted by Loquacious beachcomber (# 8783) on :

It helps if the person is wearing a tie; walk up to them, take hold of the tie in your hand, comment on how very much you like it, then drop it directly into their cup of coffee. That should spark some conversation!
Or ask boring things such as,
"Did you grow up in this city?"
"What do you do for a living?"
"Do you enjoy oral sex?"
etc.

Posted by Loquacious beachcomber (# 8783) on :

Or you could ask,
"Did you catch that amazing sunset over the lake tonight?"
"Have you been following the New York Yankees this month?"
"Is that an IPhone you were just using? Do you like it better than a Blackberry?"

Posted by jedijudy (# 333) on :

quote:
Originally posted by Loquacious beachcomber:
It helps if the person is wearing a tie...

And it's downhill from there.

Loquacious beachcomber, play nice.

jedijudy
Heavenly Host giving L b the 'Mom Look'
Seriously.

Posted by leo (# 1458) on :

I don't bother with small talk.

I do not feel insecure at events where small talk is the norm - I simply don't bother with them. Life is too short.

Posted by Boogie (# 13538) on :

There is no such thing as small talk imo. It's all conversation.

You are either interested in other people or you are not.

If you are then you'll have endless questions to ask them.

[Smile]

Posted by Tortuf (# 3784) on :

"Hi, my name is . This seems like a nice (name of whatever)."

If the person feels like talking with you, the person will. If the person doesn't, the person won't. Life will go on either way.

Trying to start a conversation with a contrived line is the easiest way I know to come off sounding nervous, fake, or like an idiot.

Talk about the event you are at. Complement the person about something: smile, tie, dress, shoes, etc. Ask them what they liked the most, or least.

Posted by lilBuddha (# 14333) on :

Sorry Ramarius, that article seems full of the BS, size people up to see if they are worth networking with rubbish.
I hate those parties, but they aren't difficult as you know the general motivations.
Real, friendly parties are more difficult. I start with " Hello, I am lilBuddha*" along with a friendly smile.
Ask their connection to the host, talk about the food, the music, whatever. I start with the inconsequential as it is unlikely to kill a conversation immediately. Sometimes works, sometimes not.

* real name usually used.

ETA: get out of my head, Tortuf! Especially when you say my thought better than I do.

[ 25. August 2012, 16:51: Message edited by: lilBuddha ]

Posted by Ramarius (# 16551) on :

@LilBuddah: looks like you've come up with another great conversation starter "What's the daftest article you've read recently?"
[Smile]

Posted by drnick (# 16065) on :

The question 'what's your favourite cheese?' never fails to get a conversation going. Everybody has an opinion on cheese - they will either go into a rhapsody about ones they like ("well, I do enjoy a nice pungent roquefort", tell you about ones they hate ("bloody halloumi, call that a cheese, it doesn't even melt"), or tell you they are lactose intolerant and can't eat it at all. Everybody wins.

Posted by leo (# 1458) on :

quote:
Originally posted by Boogie:
There is no such thing as small talk imo. It's all conversation.

You are either interested in other people or you are not.

No. Small talk is there as a way to avoid real conversation with people one is not interested in.

Posted by Ariel (# 58) on :

quote:
Originally posted by leo:
No. Small talk is there as a way to avoid real conversation with people one is not interested in.

No, it's a way of breaking the ice and establishing whether there is any basis for deeper conversation, common interest, compatibility, etc. It's not considered the done thing to plunge into deep and meaningful topics with a complete stranger, and politeness and social conventions being what they are, you might not get genuine responses anyway at that stage as people don't want to be seen to be disagreeable if they don't agree with you.

How do you know there's no potential for finding them interesting, anyway, if you don't know anything about them?

Posted by Firenze (# 619) on :

You can go from 0 to 60 quite quickly. On the bus the other week, between Forrest Rd and Mayfield Kirk, went from sympathetic noise at difficulty of getting large canvas on bus, to learning woman's major life events as they bore on her struggles to be an artist plus reciprocating with a few of my own, to agreement on the necessity of continuing creativity as the validation of existence in the face of mortality, parting with the mutual encouragement of shared experience, never, I dare say, to meet again. Not bad for 10 minutes.

There is no 'small' talk, only small views of other people.

Posted by Twilight (# 2832) on :

I love parties and I rarely have a problem feeling shy or awkward, but if I see someone else who seems to be standing alone looking miserable (or standing alone looking handsome) I'll usually sidle up to them and say something inane like, "Have you tried Ariel's crisp butty? It's to die for!" That's usually all it takes to get things started, well, unless you're at a stuffy party in England and the person looks horrified and says, "And you are?" I hate that

Posted by Eleanor Jane (# 13102) on :

Somehow I'm brilliant at small talk but I don't much enjoy it in a work context 'cos it's generally with folks 30 years older than me who I wouldn't chose to spend time with.

I think of small talk as basic politeness. If you're stuck sitting beside someone at an event or manning a stall together or whatever then to sit there in silence would usually be awkward.

I don't mind small talk in a social context 'cos it's how you get to big talk... as mentioned above, it's how you start to find out about people, let them find out a bit about you and see whether you could be friends.

Posted by leo (# 1458) on :

quote:
Originally posted by Ariel:
No, it's a way of breaking the ice and establishing whether there is any basis for deeper conversation, common interest, compatibility, etc. It's not considered the done thing to plunge into deep and meaningful topics with a complete stranger, and politeness and social conventions being what they are, you might not get genuine responses anyway

Well, my rule of thumb at my dinner parties is this: Convention is not to talk politics, sex or religion. But my take, those subjects are the only ones I am interested in.

Posted by justlooking (# 12079) on :

quote:
Originally posted by leo:
Well, my rule of thumb at my dinner parties is this: Convention is not to talk politics, sex or religion. But my take, those subjects are the only ones I am interested in.

I think the idea is to find out what other people are interested in.

Posted by Zappa (# 8433) on :

I am a serious off the scale "I". Forget it. I go home.

Posted by leo (# 1458) on :

quote:
Originally posted by justlooking:

quote:
Originally posted by leo:
Well, my rule of thumb at my dinner parties is this: Convention is not to talk politics, sex or religion. But my take, those subjects are the only ones I am interested in.
I think the idea is to find out what other people are interested in.

Why talk to people who don't share any interests?

Posted by leo (# 1458) on :

I'll clarify that a bit - after a working day spent entirely in conversation with people on their terms, supposedly meeting their 'needs', why should an introvert like me deplete his energy yet further meeting loads of people with nothing in common rather than spending quality time with a few close friends?

Posted by jedijudy (# 333) on :

Well, leo, because the OP is asking for suggestions doing that very thing! I think most of us have some things we don't like to do, and choose not to when it's discretionary. But that's not what this is about!

Personally, I have severe Foot in Mouth disease. When I have to be at functions where I don't really know anyone, I tend to keep my mouth shut and listen. If I do ask a question, especially if there is another quiet person like me, it is usually to inquire if they are from here (as this is a vacation spot.) That will frequently get a conversation going.

Posted by Og, King of Bashan (# 9562) on :

quote:
Originally posted by Twilight:
"Have you tried Ariel's crisp butty? It's to die for!" That's usually all it takes to get things started, well, unless you're at a stuffy party in England and the person looks horrified and says, "And you are?" I hate that

The Queen of Bashan is the master of small talk. I use her as a crutch at parties. One of her tricks is to encourage people to try whatever she brought to the party. It sounds presumptuous, but it works.

Her other trick is complementing another woman for something that she did with her appearance- hair, jewelry, shoes, dress, etc. In general, she believes that women appreciate having a girlfriend at the party, so if you talk to them on those terms, you will set them at ease. (It is particularly interesting to see that theory in action with the rector of our church, who has the tone of a wise sage, and who is consequently treated as such by most people. When the Q of B busts up and genuinely tells her that she likes her shoes, you can see that she appreciates the girl time.)

Posted by Dal Segno (# 14673) on :

Mrs DS has a long list of questions to draw people out, including such obvious ones as: "where are you from?", "what do you do?", "do you have any brothers or sisters?", "what do they do?". Basically, she tries to get people talking about the thing that they find most interesting: their own life.

Her questions have only backfired once in my many years of going to events with her. On this memorable equation, she was trying to engage with a new, young physics professor. "What do you do?" - "You wouldn't understand."(*) "Do you have any brothers or sisters?" - "My CV is online if you want to know about me." Fortunately he left the event shortly after this conversation-killing comment and, had he but known it, he had permanently blotted his copybook with everyone in our group.

-DS

(*) "If you can't explain your physics to a barmaid it is probably not very good physics" - Ernest Rutherford

Posted by churchgeek (# 5557) on :

quote:
Originally posted by drnick:
The question 'what's your favourite cheese?' never fails to get a conversation going. Everybody has an opinion on cheese - they will either go into a rhapsody about ones they like ("well, I do enjoy a nice pungent roquefort", tell you about ones they hate ("bloody halloumi, call that a cheese, it doesn't even melt"), or tell you they are lactose intolerant and can't eat it at all. Everybody wins.

I'm allergic to cheese, but I get self-conscious saying things like that. There's still a stigma that associates lactose intolerance and allergies with people who are "nerdy," inept, socially awkward, etc. Which of course isn't true, but it's still a stereotype. I don't want people to think I'm about to launch into complaints about my physical ailments or anything!

That doesn't mean it's not a good question, just that the asker should be ready to change the conversation. That's true for any question, really. It helps with small talk or any conversation to try to read your interlocutor's comfort levels.

Posted by ken (# 2460) on :

Article in OP looks pretty ropey to me. But I suppose its aimed at a very specific target market - middle-aged, middle-class Americans at a boring business do - that most of us aren't part of.

quote:
Originally posted by Tortuf:
Complement the person about something: smile, tie, dress, shoes, etc.

That's very culture-specific. In Britain it really only works between women - either from or to a man it sounds weird to most of us. And from a man to a woman if you aren't careful it will sound like a chat-up line.

quote:
Originally posted by leo:
Why talk to people who don't share any interests?

I think that's one of the snootiest most egotistical things I've ever seen written here. Did you really mean it like it sounds?

Posted by Latchkey Kid (# 12444) on :

This thread reminds me of Joni Mitchell's People's Parties

Posted by ken (# 2460) on :

quote:
Originally posted by chive:

The other thing I do is say something ridiculous very loudly in the hope it breaks the ice and other people join in.

I was at an sf con in the Glasgow Central Hotel once, and sitting on my own at a table having a drink with some others also on their own (if that makes sense). No one was talking much. Then a man on the other side of the table said, very loudly, in a foreign accent, something like:

"This is a very interesting building. You could go up to the roof and jump off, or you could go doen to the platform and jump in front of a train! My name is Jussi! I am Finnish! We have no social skills!"

And of course we all started laughing and talking and it went on for hours.

And Jussi's comment on social skills was disproved by uttering it.

Posted by leo (# 1458) on :

quote:
Originally posted by ken:

quote:
Originally posted by leo:
Why talk to people who don't share any interests?
I think that's one of the snootiest most egotistical things I've ever seen written here. Did you really mean it like it sounds?

I just don't do social events. i don't see the point of them, like most introverts. i prefer a small circle of friends with shared interests.

Otherwise, it is like work. My working day involved loads of people. We need time out. It is draining to fill it with yet more people unless there is a real reason for it. Talking about house prices isn't a compelling enough reason to get even more exhausted than one already is

Posted by kingsfold (# 1726) on :

quote:
posted by leo:
I just don't do social events. i don't see the point of them, like most introverts. i prefer a small circle of friends with shared interests.

As an introvert myself, I totally understand the need for time out and preference for the small circle of friends. Thing is, how do you find a small circle of friends with shared interests without having to do the social thing and making small talk? This is meant as a genuine question, not a snark, as it's something I've found difficult since I moved 400miles a few years ago.

Posted by Chorister (# 473) on :

You find these groups by looking out for adverts (if there are no informative notice boards, the library will often have information). I've learnt over the years that quiet places like libraries and churches often have information about the sort of quieter special interest groups that I like to join.

In larger groups, I find it too difficult to decide if people are really interested or if they are just being polite. So try to avoid these if possible.

Posted by leo (# 1458) on :

quote:
Originally posted by kingsfold:

quote:
posted by leo:
I just don't do social events. i don't see the point of them, like most introverts. i prefer a small circle of friends with shared interests.
As an introvert myself, I totally understand the need for time out and preference for the small circle of friends. Thing is, how do you find a small circle of friends with shared interests without having to do the social thing and making small talk? This is meant as a genuine question, not a snark, as it's something I've found difficult since I moved 400miles a few years ago.

Granted. Maybe that is why i have stayed in the same place for over 30 years.

My initial 'circle' came from the church i joined - I did not have to cook a Sunday lunch for about 2 months, such was the hospitality.

Then from colleagues who were new at the same time as me.

Then from the local Labour party.

Also from a group who held season tickets for the theatre.

It grew from there, really.

[ 29. August 2012, 16:21: Message edited by: leo ]

Posted by ExclamationMark (# 14715) on :

If you go with the attitude of "working a room ...." that's rather different from the encouragement of being able to learn new things from others.

Posted by leo (# 1458) on :

It would seem that I haven't explained my reasons sufficiently for extroverts so I will use the words of someone else who explains how I and most introverts feel

quote:
To begin with, it is exactly the same every time. Anywhere. If you are engaging me in small talk, it means you are treating me in the precise same manner when you approach me as you did the last stranger you approached. And depending on the venue, I may have just seen you approach the person right before me and heard you ask the same asinine questions of them……..-It is irrelevant. If an introvert has decided to leave home and bring himself to a place full of people he doesn't know, chances are there was a very good reason for it. …….He'd like to get on with the specific reason he attended this function. …..Small talk is inauthentic. if they are honest even extroverts will admit that it is just a tool. That even they are not the least bit interested in how difficult it was for me to drive to this building, or if I ran into any traffic on the way. They know that they don't really care, and I certainly know they don't care. It is a rouse to start talking to someone new. But I would rather be approached cold with an authentic question, then be warmed up by the small talk. It's a waste of resources. Mindless small talk requires little brain power. Introverts spend most of their time thinking. Processing ideas. Finding themselves engaged in small talk slams on the brakes of their active brain. The subjects are so empty, there is no need to form an opinion and/or argument that they can then share with those around them. Like renting the biggest self-storage unit in the city and storing nothing in it but a roll of paper towels. It is space and money wasted. Small talk is like that roll sitting in the vast expanse of the mind to an introvert. It's a waste of resources…..It lacks creativity. Many introverts are creative types, and few things are as bereft of creativity as small talk.

Posted by RuthW (# 13) on :

quote:
Originally posted by Firenze:
You can go from 0 to 60 quite quickly. On the bus the other week, between Forrest Rd and Mayfield Kirk, went from sympathetic noise at difficulty of getting large canvas on bus, to learning woman's major life events as they bore on her struggles to be an artist plus reciprocating with a few of my own, to agreement on the necessity of continuing creativity as the validation of existence in the face of mortality, parting with the mutual encouragement of shared experience, never, I dare say, to meet again. Not bad for 10 minutes.

There is no 'small' talk, only small views of other people.

This is one of the best things I've read all week. Easily.

leo, what are you going to do if you outlive most of the members of your social circle or if you are separated from them as they or you are confined by immobility, disability or the general ravages of age?

Posted by (S)pike couchant (# 17199) on :

Because of my job, I have to move frequently, sometimes very great distances. If I were unwilling to engage in small talk, I would never meet anybody, and all of my friends would be people I knew in school or university, which — given that these people are spread over multiple countries on four or five continents — would mean that all of my friendships would be mostly online. That doesn't sound very agreeable. So, while I may not always enjoy talking about the weather, I accept it as a fact of life. It's better than being alone all the time.

Posted by leo (# 1458) on :

quote:
Originally posted by RuthW:

quote:
Originally posted by Firenze:
You can go from 0 to 60 quite quickly. On the bus the other week, between Forrest Rd and Mayfield Kirk, went from sympathetic noise at difficulty of getting large canvas on bus, to learning woman's major life events as they bore on her struggles to be an artist plus reciprocating with a few of my own, to agreement on the necessity of continuing creativity as the validation of existence in the face of mortality, parting with the mutual encouragement of shared experience, never, I dare say, to meet again. Not bad for 10 minutes.

There is no 'small' talk, only small views of other people.
This is one of the best things I've read all week. Easily.

leo, what are you going to do if you outlive most of the members of your social circle or if you are separated from them as they or you are confined by immobility, disability or the general ravages of age?

That is the fear nearly everyone has, especially those of us with no family.

If I could afford it, which I can't, I'd love to live in the anglo-catholic 'retirement village' aka nursing home which is part of my 'ministry' because the people are mostly the sort i get on with well and who probably minister more to me than I to them.

I have observed that introverts need even less people than hitherto when infirmity shuts them away. They cope with several days without seeing anyone (that is what they say and i know some of them well enough to know whether they are telling the truth or not - it seems to be a maturity which I wouldn't dare to think i could ever reach.

Posted by Firenze (# 619) on :

I am still honestly puzzled by how leo - or anyone - can come by a select coterie of close friends without having, at some point, begun a trivial conversation with them.

How do you know what the outcome will be? Sometimes you have an instant and vivid connection, but circumstances dictate that you never meet again*. Mostly you find topics of common interest which sustain the relationship until circumstances change (no fault in that; it's what makes workplaces tolerable). Sometimes you seem to have no dramatic agreement, but over time you find that you have a history of shared experience and common perceptions and interests that add up to a friendship.

I can't conceive of ever stopping, of saying Right, that's it, I have my quota of friends. Once they die, that's it over. That's as much as to say I too have stopped living as of now.

*It may well be that is precisely the condition for such frankness.

Posted by ken (# 2460) on :

I like people. I like hearing what they have to say. Even if its about people I don't know or subjects I'm not interested in. I'm doing it now as I type this on my phone in the pub. Listening to conversation around me and occasionally joining in. Its life. Its knowledge. Its stuff and thingy. Its better than being on my own.

Posted by cliffdweller (# 13338) on :

quote:
Originally posted by ken:

quote:
Originally posted by chive:

The other thing I do is say something ridiculous very loudly in the hope it breaks the ice and other people join in.
I was at an sf con in the Glasgow Central Hotel once, and sitting on my own at a table having a drink with some others also on their own (if that makes sense). No one was talking much. Then a man on the other side of the table said, very loudly, in a foreign accent, something like:

"This is a very interesting building. You could go up to the roof and jump off, or you could go doen to the platform and jump in front of a train! My name is Jussi! I am Finnish! We have no social skills!"

And of course we all started laughing and talking and it went on for hours.

And Jussi's comment on social skills was disproved by uttering it.

do you think Jussi will mind if I steal this? Including the name, and, I'm guessing, a Finnish accent?

Posted by Twilight (# 2832) on :

quote:
Originally posted by leo:
It would seem that I haven't explained my reasons sufficiently for extroverts so I will use the words of someone else who explains how I and most introverts feel
quote:
To begin with, it is exactly the same every time. Anywhere. If you are engaging me in small talk, it means you are treating me in the precise same manner when you approach me as you did the last stranger you approached. And depending on the venue, I may have just seen you approach the person right before me and heard you ask the same asinine questions of them……..-It is irrelevant. If an introvert has decided to leave home and bring himself to a place full of people he doesn't know, chances are there was a very good reason for it. …….He'd like to get on with the specific reason he attended this function. …..Small talk is inauthentic. if they are honest even extroverts will admit that it is just a tool. That even they are not the least bit interested in how difficult it was for me to drive to this building, or if I ran into any traffic on the way. They know that they don't really care, and I certainly know they don't care. It is a rouse to start talking to someone new. But I would rather be approached cold with an authentic question, then be warmed up by the small talk. It's a waste of resources. Mindless small talk requires little brain power. Introverts spend most of their time thinking. Processing ideas. Finding themselves engaged in small talk slams on the brakes of their active brain. The subjects are so empty, there is no need to form an opinion and/or argument that they can then share with those around them. Like renting the biggest self-storage unit in the city and storing nothing in it but a roll of paper towels. It is space and money wasted. Small talk is like that roll sitting in the vast expanse of the mind to an introvert. It's a waste of resources…..It lacks creativity. Many introverts are creative types, and few things are as bereft of creativity as small talk.

She/he reminds me of the old saying that bored people are boring.

Posted by Lamb Chopped (# 5528) on :

Look, saying "Good morning" is inauthentic. It is about as devoid of creativity, new content, deep meaningful insights, or what have you, as you can get. And yet everybody not unbearably antisocial says it. Why? Because it is a pro-social ritual--it breaks the preceding silence in such a way that a meaningful conversation may (or may not) ensue--because it says "you are a human being worthy of notice, and I am noticing you." Which is actually a very meaningful, authentic thing to communicate.

Small talk, properly used, is just an extended version of "good morning." It exists for the sake of what (hopefully) comes after.

As such, it is not to be scorned.

Posted by Boogie (# 13538) on :

quote:
Originally posted by leo:
It would seem that I haven't explained my reasons sufficiently for extroverts so I will use the words of someone else who explains how I and most introverts feel
quote:
<snip> It is space and money wasted. Small talk is like that roll sitting in the vast expanse of the mind to an introvert. It's a waste of resources…..It lacks creativity. Many introverts are creative types, and few things are as bereft of creativity as small talk.

This is nonsense. Creative people are
interested people. They are fascinated in the new and the different. Creative people are keen to learn, find out, experiment and play.

Small talk is simply a way in to conversation - and conversation feeds creativity. This writer doesn't sound creative at all to me, as Twilight pointed out - a bore (and an arrogant one at that)

[Snore]

Posted by Ariel (# 58) on :

Everybody has something interesting about them. The differences are what make us interesting.

If you go through life looking for people who are just the same as you, you’re going to end up with a quite narrow circle of friends, and no real stimulus, just reinforcement.

Some people can make an interesting subject boring, others can infuse a topic you previously regarded as dull with life.

If you meet a stranger (and this may be a cultural difference), you try to put them first, and make them feel at ease. It's not all about you.

You can't write off people you've never met on the grounds that they don't share your interests. You don't know that they don't. They might secretly harbour an enthusiasm for it.

Lots of us are introverts. I'm one, though less so these days than I used to be – people aren't as scary as I used to find them. That quote of Leo's isn't a picture of anyone I recognize.

Posted by la vie en rouge (# 10688) on :

Trying to keep this heavenly, but leo, I… err… strongly disagree with you [Biased]

I am also an introvert (96% if you run one of those Myers-Briggs things on me) but I can still appreciate the usefulness of small talk.

In fact a thread like this one (practical ideas on how to do small talk) seems to me particularly useful to those of us who have strongly introverted personalities because we frequently aren't naturally very good at it, which makes it a learned skill rather than an innate behaviour. And there are certain unavoidable social situations where one is required to do small talk (work thing, wedding where you don't know anyone except the happy couple…) and picking up some skills makes them less anxiety-inducing.

Small talk is also about making other people feel at ease. For example, a new person at church standing about nursing their coffee on their own. Yes, I would much rather just keep chatting to my regular friends, but it's unwelcoming and rude, and life isn't all about me. Sometimes we need to do things we don't like very much for other people's benefit. Yes, as a very introverted person, I find other people more tiring than energising, but I should still make the effort sometimes. And while I may be naturally crap at small talk, I can learn to be passably ok at it.

(FWIW, I think the secret is to touch on various topics until you find something the person is very interested in. Then get them to talk about that. They do most of the talking, you smile and nod, and they think you are a very nice and interesting person. [Smile]

)

Posted by Tortuf (# 3784) on :

A few observations; for what they are worth.

If you try to categorize what kind of talk you are making, you are not helping yourself. If you think the talk is "small" it probably means you don't think it is worthwhile and you will therefore suck at it.

Talk is just a part of getting to know someone. All of us look for other signals. We look at eyes, gestures, at body posture. If your body posture says you are uncomfortable, or indifferent, the exact nature of the words you say is going to get lost; hidden behind your posture.

Not a damn one of you is less worthy than anyone else on the face of the earth. If you keep that in mind, you might find it easier to meet and greet. Easier said than done, I know. Still worth remembering.

What, in my experience, people find most fascinating is themselves. Don't try to be the life of the party, or say something witty all the time. As has been suggested before, ask them about themselves. Don't try to counter each of their stories with one of your own. Just listen. You might find you are considered a wonderful conversationalist on just the basis of listening and looking interested.

Force yourself to talk to one person you don't know at every social occasion. You might try greeting the other person in the room who looks uncomfortable first. Later, move on up to someone who looks comfortable.

Get with someone you know who is with a group you do not know, and use your acquaintance to "lever" you into their conversation.

Very importantly, if someone rejects you, or appears to reject you; fuck'em. So what, move on. If they reject you without knowing you, they are idiots and not worth knowing anyway.

Posted by Angloid (# 159) on :

Another introvert checking in. I'm also physically lazy (and therefore unfit); sometimes find cooking a chore; don't read as much (or the right sort of things) as I should....

I would love not to have to indulge in small talk. But if I didn't I would never get to know new people. Not necessarily future lifelong friends, but just interesting and pleasant people whom to meet and engage with, however briefly, is a delight.

I gave up going to the gym because I found it boring, but I'm noticing the difference and need to do more exercise to keep body and mind energised. If I didn't take my turn at cooking, either it would provoke domestic war or I'd go hungry. If I read more, and trained my mind to become more disciplined, I know I would feel the benefit.

As much as all these can be unwelcome chores, the benefits of having done them much outweigh the negatives.

Posted by Chorister (# 473) on :

quote:
Originally posted by leo:
If I could afford it, which I can't, I'd love to live in the anglo-catholic 'retirement village' aka nursing home which is part of my 'ministry' because the people are mostly the sort i get on with well and who probably minister more to me than I to them.

But what happens if, having chosen your select little group of people to be friends with, they decide that they don't want to be friends with you? Then you're seriously screwed.

Much better to be open and friendly to everyone, even if you are an introvert, then you will always have some people you can turn to in a general way, as well as one or two close friends if you are fortunate enough to find them.

Posted by Belle Ringer (# 13379) on :

I'm really bad at small talk. I didn't understand the point of it until an article recently explained, so I'm trying to pretend interest in the weather" ("It's been raining all week!" As if we don't all know that?), and other inane topics.

I have learned that if someone asks a yes or no question like "are you going somewhere this summer?" I'm supposed to say more than just yes or no, use it as a springboard to further conversation, "no, but last year I went to X, have you been there?" or "No, instead I'm going to stay home and work on the house, do you have any tips for painting a room?"

I have also learned that when asked "how was your trip?" they want to hear one sentence, at most two: "I saw a small herd of buffalo cross the road ten feet in front of my car!" The question is small talk, not genuine interest in all that you did and saw and learned and wish you could have done.

Drives me buggy when a whole meal gathering consists of nothing but small talk, so I guess some people enjoy it, or really do care in detail about what the latest issue of People magazine said.

Posted by BessHiggs (# 15176) on :

Small talk is a large part of my bread and butter and I have had to learn how to do it well, without seeming like I'm reading from a mental script. Yes, fifteen mini-conversations a day about the weather, or the Cardnals pitching staff, or whatever can be a bit trying at times, but IMO, it's part of the social contract.

And just because I can chatter on with folks inanely about fluff doesn't mean I don't hear the deeper stuff as well. Small talk is like the the opening pitch in a ball game. In the long run, it doesn't matter if it's a strike, a ball or a home-run, without that first pitch, you can't have a game.

FWIW...

Posted by jacobsen (# 14998) on :

Another small-talk clutz checking in. A large part of my life has been spent learning how to chat! I attribute my shortcomings in this area to my mother, who was severely practically minded, often too tired to communicate, and whose first language was not English. Tiredness can make it very difficult to chat in a foreign language, however well you may speak it normally.

I try to observe how other people do it, and steal their gambits for later use. After all, if I can't be bothered with the effort to make contact, why should anyone else? And as has been said earlier on this thread, our first and longest standing friends may not always be around. It's as well to have seedling acquaintances with growth potential. This I learned from my mother, as mobility problems left her increasingly isolated. I'm like her in many ways, some good, but some to be guarded against.

[ 30. August 2012, 19:00: Message edited by: jacobsen ]

Posted by Tortuf (# 3784) on :

You guys are so over analyzing this stuff.

Posted by BessHiggs (# 15176) on :

quote:
Originally posted by Tortuf:
You guys are so over analyzing this stuff.

Hmmmm...I wonder exactly what you mean by that... [Razz]

Posted by RuthW (# 13) on :

quote:
Originally posted by Belle Ringer:
I have learned that if someone asks a yes or no question like "are you going somewhere this summer?" I'm supposed to say more than just yes or no, use it as a springboard to further conversation, "no, but last year I went to X, have you been there?" or "No, instead I'm going to stay home and work on the house, do you have any tips for painting a room?"

I have also learned that when asked "how was your trip?" they want to hear one sentence, at most two: "I saw a small herd of buffalo cross the road ten feet in front of my car!" The question is small talk, not genuine interest in all that you did and saw and learned and wish you could have done.

The "how was your trip?" question can be a springboard just as easily as the "are you going somewhere this summer?" question. Sometimes it's just a courtesy, acknowledging your absence, but if the person asking finds your response interesting, you can if you want talk further about it. If the original question was more specific -- "how was white-water rafting?" -- it's an indication of a higher level of interest. Your response about the herd of buffalo crossing the river may lead the person to ask more questions or show enough interest for you to tell more.

The first thing is to pay attention to how people respond to what you say. The second to realize that there's a lot of ground in between a courtesy inquiry about your trip and an interest in hearing about all you did/saw/learned/wish you could have done.

Posted by Ariel (# 58) on :

The Royal Family have a habit of purposely not asking people they meet any question that can be answered with a straight yes or no, which works very well in drawing people out.

Posted by kingsfold (# 1726) on :

I can do the opening question, and use the open question that doesn't have a yes/no answer. But I struggle to gauge the right questions to move the conversation forward, especially if the answer I get to the initial question is itself fairly closed. Oh well, maybe one day I'll get the hang of it.

Posted by Yangtze (# 4965) on :

I was in a social situation the other evening where, as happens, groups ebb and flow and at one point I was left alone with a chap. I'm brilliant at talk both small and large/deep. He clearly wasn't. End result, I keep trying to make conversation and get absolutely nothing back.

Now quite possibly he's standing there thinking why on earth is she asking me about the weather, how long I've been coming to this event etc etc what a waste of time.

BUT, and here's the rub, he made absolutely no effort to direct the conversation to a topic that he did want to talk about. He was not proactive in the conversation at all. If I asked him something he would reply with one or two words but he never gave more and he never asked me anything.

Posted by Yangtze (# 4965) on :

Sorry, cut off before the end.

I suppose my point was that the lack of any talk in that social setting made me feel awkward and uncomfortable. (He may have been perfectly comfortable.) I'm pretty OK with people not talking and preferring to listen in group settings but when there's just two of you it does seem rude.

Posted by Lyda*Rose (# 4544) on :

At that point, I think that I would smile and say, "Well, it looks like we've run out of topics. It's been nice," and then wander off to the refreshments.

Posted by Lamb Chopped (# 5528) on :

And hope there ARE refreshments, it's much easier to get through awkward pauses when you can pretend to have your mouth full.

Posted by Boogie (# 13538) on :

Of course, some people are just shy. My son was always fascinated by people and listened to all the conversations in the room. He never joined in.

I think it takes great effort for shy people. When we went camping with friends their son had Aspergers and never stopped talking - they made a perfect pair, Mike listened, Tim talked and neither felt awkward!

But, slowly, very slowly - Mike learned. He now lives in Germany and works as a carer for disabled adults. He has no choice but to meet and speak to new people every day - and loves it. When we visit he does all the talking to strangers as we have no German - what a turn around!

Posted by Kelly Alves (# 2522) on :

quote:
Originally posted by Boogie:
Of course, some people are just shy. My son was always fascinated by people and listened to all the conversations in the room. He never joined in.

That's pretty much how I am by nature-- I think somewhere along the line I realized I could market this trait by becoming "a good listener"-- meaning I could generate conversation by asking questions about what other people were saying.

Posted by Zappa (# 8433) on :

I suspect introverts outweigh extroverts on a site like this ...

Posted by Zappa (# 8433) on :

quote:
Originally posted by Chorister:

quote:
Originally posted by leo:
If I could afford it, which I can't, I'd love to live in the anglo-catholic 'retirement village' aka nursing home which is part of my 'ministry' because the people are mostly the sort i get on with well and who probably minister more to me than I to them.

But what happens if, having chosen your select little group of people to be friends with, they decide that they don't want to be friends with you? Then you're seriously screwed.

Much better to be open and friendly to everyone, even if you are an introvert, then you will always have some people you can turn to in a general way, as well as one or two close friends if you are fortunate enough to find them.

Peronally I'd prefer to retire to a large room containing a big loopy dog and an aspidistra.

Posted by Chorister (# 473) on :

Definitely a cat, not a dog. They have antisocialism off to a fine art.

Posted by venbede (# 16669) on :

Like young leo, I'm an introvert, but now I'm in the Second Half of Life, my extrovert shadow side comes into play.

Posted by sebby (# 15147) on :

quote:
Originally posted by leo:

quote:
Originally posted by Boogie:
There is no such thing as small talk imo. It's all conversation.

You are either interested in other people or you are not.
No. Small talk is there as a way to avoid real conversation with people one is not interested in.

I think the OP is really about that uncomfortable expression 'how to work a room'. One of the really rather important jobs that clergy have to do is precisely that - certainly in the commuity in which I live, which is fairly rural.

Whether it is the Life Boat Coffee Morning, or the village pub, it is almost expected as a given here that the vicar will speak to everyone. This is particuarly the case as the quite extraordinary 90-something year old incumbent could effortlessly arrive in the back bar full of 20 year olds and make them laugh, then move to the lounge bar and go around each table saying something to each group of holidaymakers. It meant that everyone knew him and felt that he was approachable. Quite frequently he would then be asked by randoms 'what time is the sevice on Sunday?'. It was about visibility.

After his time someone arrived who was well meaning enough, but caused offence as he once walked past someone without seeing them. Within days it was around the community that the new vicar was 'stand offish' and 'snobbish' (although actually working class) or 'never speaks' or 'only interested in those who go to church'. It may have been unreasonable, but it was, and is, how things are.

Small talk, however we define it, it a way of making people feel that they are important. Trivial comments frequently lead to full conversations. Although an extreme conparison, the royal family are quite good at it (its partly what they are paid for) and it helps keep their show on the road.

It would be unwise to underestaimate its power.

Posted by venbede (# 16669) on :

That's good, sebby.

I remember the blessed Jim Thompson as Bishop of Stepney at a parish lunch in after a confirmation in Hackney. He went round to every table and had tried to speak (and listen ) to everyone. He was not patronising or trivial from what I witnessed.

Small talk can be trivial and showing off, but not necessarily.

Posted by leo (# 1458) on :

I was reflecting on two social events last night and concluded that unless people make a real effort, people cling to the like-minded.

One was my 50th birthday. I booked a restaurant and invited 50 people - the only time all the different aspects of my life came together - teacher colleagues, church folk, book club people, friends. Each group sat together at separate tables and I was the only one who spoke to everybody - so much so that i never got round to eating a meal myself and had to get a takeaway afterwards.

The second event was last monday - my colleague's 60th birthday. The first hour or so was standing up drinking Pimms. Then everyone went to tables for a meal. Like my previous event, everyone gravitated to their own types. My table was made up of teachers and dinner ladies and i even spoke with the PE teacher i'd normally avoid. Then there was former pupils, present 6th formers, drama luvvies (the birthday boy = Head of Drama)

Posted by jacobsen (# 14998) on :

Happy birthday, Leo. But somehow I thought of you as much older than myself, rather than 11 years younger! [Biased]

Nobbut a lad, indeed. [Big Grin]

[ 31. August 2012, 12:13: Message edited by: jacobsen ]

Posted by venbede (# 16669) on :

Happy Birthday, leo.

Posted by Pigwidgeon (# 10192) on :

There’s always a danger in asking generic questions… I’ve heard this same story about various First Ladies (and it’s probably told of similar people in other countries). A guest at a party sees a woman who looks familiar and he just knows that he should recognize her. So he asks how she is, how’s the family, and what’s her husband doing these days? The First Lady replies, “Oh, he’s still President of the United States.”

Posted by Pigwidgeon (# 10192) on :

quote:
Originally posted by venbede:
Happy Birthday, leo.

Happy birthday, Leo -- but from your profile it appears that the story you told is from just over 11 years ago. (But I hope you had a happy 60th last year!)

Posted by mark_in_manchester (# 15978) on :

I acquired a new hobby this year, the details of which should probably be reserved for the 'hey MiM, just what _was_ that new hobby?' follow-up question which this kind of structured ( [Smile]

) forum rather discourages. More relevant to the OP, the in-the-flesh newby-ness which ensued - club meetings where I knew no-one, silly questions which I knew were silly but which I really had to ask - took me back 33 years to joining the cubs, and to that feeling which has periodically recurred - youth clubs, university halls of residence, new towns and new jobs - of breaking in and starting from scratch. It's quite a while since I last went through it - and a useful thing to remember now I have kids who are, and will be, going through it themselves.

I was surprised how lonely and uncomfortable I still find it - if the interweb had been a third option, alongside going through the pain or watching telly with the parents, I wonder if I would have put myself through it as a teenager. I wonder too if this has anything to do with the vanishing of church (or at least, para-church) youth clubs in my part of the world.

Posted by Sighthound (# 15185) on :

I am really poor at small talk. On the other hand, if someone gets me going, I can easily say more than I ought.

I think it's probably some kind of syndrome. I was much easier in company when I could take a drink or three, but nowadays I just have the odd pint and it isn't enough to relax me.

I think the Jane Austen theory on this is that one should keep practising.

Posted by jacobsen (# 14998) on :

quote:
Originally posted by leo:
I was reflecting on two social events last night ...........

One was my 50th birthday.

A misunderstanding - I should have checked your profile, Leo. Not such a lad after all.
[Frown]

Posted by leo (# 1458) on :

Yes, I was wondering - then again, men never really grow up - we are mostly boys at heart.

Posted by Kelly Alves (# 2522) on :

quote:
Originally posted by Zappa:
Peronally I'd prefer to retire to a large room containing a big loopy dog and an aspidistra.

Hee. I will very often seek out the pets at a party.

Posted by Garasu (# 17152) on :

I'll often seek out the Aspidistra...

Anyone remember the Adventure game?

Posted by Firenze (# 619) on :

As the saying goes: Boys will be boys. And so will a lot of middle-aged men.

Anyway, youse'ns have it easy; I've just come from a social evening with French, Norwegian, Colombian and Afrikaaner company. You get a feel for what jokes work cross-culturally.

Posted by sebby (# 15147) on :

quote:
Originally posted by Kelly Alves:

quote:
Originally posted by Zappa:
Peronally I'd prefer to retire to a large room containing a big loopy dog and an aspidistra.
Hee. I will very often seek out the pets at a party.

Apparently The Queen likes a good chat about pets (dogs) or even horses. It provides a topic for converaation and diverts from anything personal or controversial. It is said she dones't like it if someone bends down and strokes the corgis.

Posted by la vie en rouge (# 10688) on :

quote:
Originally posted by Kelly Alves:

quote:
Originally posted by Zappa:
Peronally I'd prefer to retire to a large room containing a big loopy dog and an aspidistra.
Hee. I will very often seek out the pets at a party.

Small children can also be quite handy in this respect, if anyone's brought any. This has the dual advantage that people also think that you are playing with the children because you are a kind-hearted loving person and not because you are avoiding small talk with the adults.

Posted by Pigwidgeon (# 10192) on :

I find small talk with children much harder than with adults. Dogs are the easiest.

Posted by Garasu (# 17152) on :

Dogs exist purely to give English people the opportunity to talk to one another...

Posted by ken (# 2460) on :

quote:
Originally posted by Pigwidgeon:
I find small talk with children much harder than with adults.

Its easier the younger they are. Babies easiest. You can do it with your eyebrows!

But once above the age of about six to eight they will usually be aware that it's social death to be seen talking to anyone remotely resembling adults and so avoid any attempt to make contact. [Razz]

Though to be fair, stupid adults will keep on asking then what they did at school, or what they want to do when they leave school, or remarking on how much they have grown, or reminding them how little they were when stupid adult first met them. You can understand them not wanting to waste social time on conversations like that...

Posted by Lamb Chopped (# 5528) on :

Ask them if they saw the spider in the front porch. That's usually good for a flurry of "Ewwwww"s and requests to go out and look.

Posted by recklessrat (# 17243) on :

Yes, dogs and other animals make great topics!

The frustrating thing for me is an introvert is that however much I practise small talk, it never seems to get easier...every party/networking event/staff training I go on seems to take a similarly gargantuatan effort to attend. And then there's all the self-analysis afterwards! Yuk.

Posted by Kelly Alves (# 2522) on :

quote:
Originally posted by ken:

quote:
Originally posted by Pigwidgeon:
I find small talk with children much harder than with adults.
Its easier the younger they are. Babies easiest. You can do it with your eyebrows!

But once above the age of about six to eight they will usually be aware that it's social death to be seen talking to anyone remotely resembling adults and so avoid any attempt to make contact.

Though to be fair, stupid adults will keep on asking then what they did at school, or what they want to do when they leave school, or remarking on how much they have grown, or reminding them how little they were when stupid adult first met them. You can understand them not wanting to waste social time on conversations like that...

Talking to kids is actually one of my favorite things in the world to do. Maybe even my favorite thing. It's the adults I have problems with.

And as a tip, I usually let the kid lead-- they start off shy, but once they find you are genuinely responding to them and not just practicing your kid skills on them, they loosen up and start babbling away. And kids always have way more interesting things on their minds than most adults.

Sample adult conversation: I haven't had a good Merlot since 1993, and I fear I never shall again.

Sample kid convo: If you look at a certain clump in the shag rug in the hall, it looks just like Snoopy. Wait, now I see a hermit crab. Wait, I think can make a map out of it...

Guess which conversation I'm gonna get involved in?

So anyway, Yeah, I play with the pets (if they'll have me), I'll talk to the kids, just because it's fun. But as it seems to be OK on this thread to admit to conversational hopelessness, here's the one habit I have at parties that will probably earn me the most exasperated looks-- I will wander around until I find a speaker to sit next to, and just zone out listening to the music.

And I will hum along, if it's a good set.

Worse-- because this might be an excellent conversation starter (I just LOVE Sam and Dave!) but the problem is, if I am in a conversation and a good song comes on, I will totally stop the conversation and say "Hang on, I love this song." Because to me, if it's a really, really good song it's our job as grateful human beings to bask in it.

I bet in my twenties more than one poor guy trying to chat just wandered off in defeat as Elvis Costello won over. And I would look up, blinking and thinking,"Where'd that cute guy go?"

Posted by ExclamationMark (# 14715) on :

quote:
Originally posted by leo:
i even spoke with the PE teacher i'd normally avoid.

What?! Even the PE teacher? What possessed you man, were you in your right mind or had the PIMMS taken its gruesome toll?

Whoever would have thought it ... leo talking to the PE teacher.....

Posted by Sir Kevin (# 3492) on :

Sometimes I just wait for people to come up and talk to me: I used to smoke cigars and a pipe and one time I was a deck carpenter on a production of the show Annie .

TV actress MacKenzie Phillips is the daughter of the late John Phillips and stepdaughter of his widow Michelle. She just came up to me, lit a cigarette and started a conversation. I almost never talk to the talent unless they speak to me first. I was amazed to find out that her stepmother was sixty!

Another time, my best friend (a young lady) just happened to talk to the person in front of her in a cue for the cinema in Beverly Hills. The wait was quite long and the three of us went for ice cream after the film. Our new friend just happened to be the daughter of the late film director George Roy Hill and we spent the weekend with the Hill family. Mr. Hill directed The Sting among other films but he was very unassuming. He was doing the final editing of The Great Waldo Pepper, a small film starring Bob Redford as a barnstormer pilot. By the time it was done, a horrible film called Airport 1976 was cast, produced, edited and released. Mrs. Hill had tried out for a part when we were there which she did not get! I was sad to be left out the following weekend when my friend had dinner on Malibu Beach with the Newmans because I had mid-terms!

You live in LA and you meet interesting and famous people all the time. I'm not shy; I can talk to anybody.

Posted by Lamb Chopped (# 5528) on :

Meh. I used to meet them, but because I can't recognize faces I would say things like "can you tell me the way to the ladies' room"? [Hot and Hormonal]

Posted by leo (# 1458) on :

Did anyone hear Stephen Fry's programme about small talk om Radio 4 the Thursday before last? Philosopher Theodore Zeldin stated that

quote:
A proper conversation gets going only after about an hour: when, we assume, most of the strategies that we have cultivated for social situations are exhausted.

Posted by Firenze (# 619) on :

quote:
Originally posted by leo:
Did anyone hear Stephen Fry's programme about small talk om Radio 4 the Thursday before last? Philosopher Theodore Zeldin stated that
quote:
A proper conversation gets going only after about an hour: when, we assume, most of the strategies that we have cultivated for social situations are exhausted.

Depends. In some circumstances, with some people, you establish an instant rapport. Otherwise, an hour's prelude to baring souls seems only decent.

Posted by Curiosity killed ... (# 11770) on :

It's an interesting one - at the Globe as a groundling on my own this week, I got chatting to the guy in a wheelchair placed next to me right up against the stage - about how booking a wheelchair there worked, other performances this season (we both loved Richard III), other Olympic stuff, other theatres, and quite how rude the lady was who dumped her bag on his platform* and ignored him totally before moving off. And we both got chatting to a very enthusiastic Italian girl in the interval. I started pretty much all of those conversations, other than the ones started by the Italian girl, but he did reciprocate.

* There was a platform butted up against the stage with ramps to get a wheelchair on to it. When he was in place, the assistants moved the ramps out of the way and put a chain across the back. Apparently they'll do the same thing at the back of the yard and there's somewhere in the seating that works too. But he, like me, finds a place near the stage works best.

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