Ship of Fools: Release your inner Luddite

Thread: Release your inner Luddite Board: Oblivion / Ship of Fools.

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Posted by EtymologicalEvangelical (# 15091) on :

What new technology do I think is a step backwards?

Answer:

SAT NAV

I prefer brain, which includes map reading ability, memory and sense of direction.

Also, I'm a semi-Luddite when it comes to spell checkers (yeah... "loose" is OK for "not win"!!)

Again, I prefer brain.

Anyone else like to release their inner Luddite?

[ 02. October 2012, 13:41: Message edited by: EtymologicalEvangelical ]

Posted by Boogie (# 13538) on :

For anyone who is dyslexic sat navs and spell checkers are life savers.

I have wasted SO much time in the past, these two things give me great freedom!

My inner luddite hates to drive automatic cars - I like to choose when to vroooom!

Posted by Niminypiminy (# 15489) on :

EE I'm definitely with you on the SatNav.

I don't drive but have endeavoured to make up for this over the years by honing my map reading skills. I can now navigate short cuts through networks of single-track lanes in the West Country and find good routes through unfamiliar towns, and I love doing it! And I hate the robotic way it treats you as a moron and robs you of any chance to learn the topography of the places you are travelling to and through.

Does liking to knit count as luddism? I know I could buy jumpers more cheaply, but I like to make them myself, and again, I like practising a skill it has cost me time and effort to learn.

Posted by Surfing Madness (# 11087) on :

When I'm driving by myself somewhere unfamiliar then a Sat Nav can be a life saver, but I would always rather have a map reader, or be the map reader.

Posted by Karl: Liberal Backslider (# 76) on :

Smartphones. Stupid fiddly things.

I'll start whining about new 5 pees in a minute.

Posted by Darllenwr (# 14520) on :

When failing eyesight (age ... [Frown]

) renders reading a map whilst on the move difficult, a SatNav is a useful piece of kit.

Still don't like them ...

Posted by balaam (# 4543) on :

e-readers, who needs them?

The feel of paper in your hands is better than plastic, but even more important, I read in the bath - the best place to do theology.

However I'm not a total luddite, I find sat-nav on a smart phone the quickest way of finding things whilst on foot.

Posted by Ariel (# 58) on :

I love my sat nav. After I passed my driving test, for the first six months I dutifully did my best to navigate using maps and road signs and had some hair-raising adventures and near crashes in consequence. The sat nav really helped me to make sense of those lane changes in unfamiliar three lane roundabouts when you have barely a split second to make a decision or miss the road markings. It's like having a friend read the map to you, and as a new driver it really helped to give me confidence when driving.

I live quite happily without smartphones and iPods and loathe e-book readers. A book is an experience on more than one level, not just about getting the information from eye to brain. An e-reader takes away the element of craftsmanship - no need for a text design or cover - and strips a book down to just an impersonal utility. It buys into the rat race of constant software upgrades and proprietary formats and all the rest of it.

I don't want my entire collection to be on one. (What if you were burgled and someone took the e-reader with your entire library on it?) I like having books on shelves to look at.

Posted by Sioni Sais (# 5713) on :

I *love* e-book readers! The popularity of these is depressing the price of printed matter. Mrs Sioni doesn't agree because the parts of bookshelves that aren't double-stacked are now stacked three-books deep.

Don't like Satnavs though. If they don't know about accidents and roadworks the hectoring tone is very annoying, and nearby Caerleon is just one place that is regularly gridlocked by some cheapskate trucker using the wrong kind of Satnav.

Posted by lilBuddha (# 14333) on :

Technology is overrated! One should be off the grid self-sufficient. I shall download this book, I've a compass and maps, a survival kit; I am ready for anything.

Posted by Curiosity killed ... (# 11770) on :

Including power failure? Always assuming you're in an area with mobile reception.

Posted by Schroedinger's cat (# 64) on :

In my current assignment, I have been a real luddite. One of my tasks has been smashing old laptops up. I have done some 50 this week alone.

Posted by lilBuddha (# 14333) on :

quote:
Originally posted by Curiosity killed ...:
Including power failure? Always assuming you're in an area with mobile reception.

Really, CK, didn't you see the Booster Brolly in the last link?

Posted by Og, King of Bashan (# 9562) on :

I am enough of a bull headed male to bristle at the thought of a SatNav (I actually do know exactly where I am at all times). But a friend recently pointed out that it can be a life saver for elderly drivers. When his grandmother still wanted to drive but was getting old enough that they were worried that she might lose her way easily, especially after dark, the SatNav was the perfect solution.

Despite the fact that someone figured out long ago that it is much easier to ski down a hill with your ankle firmly attached to the back of your ski, I still insist on free-heeling it. I guess that makes me a bit of a luddite.

Posted by Hedgehog (# 14125) on :

I dislike digital clocks. I carry a lovely mechanical pocket watch (I own several--so the choice of which one I wear depends on the rest of my attire) and my house has multiple mechanical clocks (mantel, wall and tall-case). I can't imagine why people consider it a good idea to have a clock that resets to 88:88 whenever there is a power failure.

Posted by saysay (# 6645) on :

SatNav (and mapquest and google maps) are the only way for me to get so completely and totally lost that I can't even begin to find my way back to wherever I'm going. Smartphones. Cell phones, really, at all.

I think I may be getting to the point where I'd like to simply go live in a tent somewhere and grow and hunt all my own food. I'm sure there's someone in the world who finds this technology intuitive, but for the most part I feel like I push a button on my keychain and a bomb goes off in Berlin - there's no particular relationship between what something looks like it might do and what it actually does.

Posted by Scots lass (# 2699) on :

I much prefer a real book to an e-book (you can lend it! You can spot it on the shelf twenty years later and suddenly remember you loved it!). But the real Luddite tendency is that I prefer to bake in imperial measures.

I was born in the 1980s.

Posted by Porridge (# 15405) on :

I can do without a microwave oven. To misquote scripture, "Can anything good come out of a microwave?"

Posted by Boogie (# 13538) on :

quote:
Originally posted by Porridge:
I can do without a microwave oven. To misquote scripture, "Can anything good come out of a microwave?"

Yes - the only thing I use it for - porridge!

Posted by saysay (# 6645) on :

Hot water?

Posted by Curiosity killed ... (# 11770) on :

quote:
Originally posted by lilBuddha:

quote:
Originally posted by Curiosity killed ...:
Including power failure? Always assuming you're in an area with mobile reception.
Really, CK, didn't you see the Booster Brolly in the last link?

Not sure that this is going to amuse you as much as it did me, but I went to look to check the booster brolly I got a broken message for the link!

That booster brolly isn't actually on the market yet - and it doesn't solve the areas with no reception (and I've got some locally - most of the Forest for starters)

Posted by Og, King of Bashan (# 9562) on :

quote:
Originally posted by Scots lass:
I much prefer a real book to an e-book (you can lend it! You can spot it on the shelf twenty years later and suddenly remember you loved it!). But the real Luddite tendency is that I prefer to bake in imperial measures.

I was born in the 1980s.

I live in the States and I do my baking and brewing by grams. The imperial measurement system is good for estimating, but when you get into an activity that is essentially home bio-chem, I want something that I can do easy calculations with.

In all other non-scientific aspects of life (which is the majority of my life), you will not find a stronger proponent of imperial measurements than me.

Posted by Hedgehog (# 14125) on :

quote:
Originally posted by saysay:
Hot water?

No. A microwave oven is horrible for hot water, at least if you are a tea drinker. The tea comes out tasting very flat.

Posted by saysay (# 6645) on :

I was thinking more for the creation of hot water bottles.

But now I've learned that some people measure things when they bake.

Posted by Sober Preacher's Kid (# 12699) on :

I [Axe murder]

my GPS navigator. I've often had to go to unfamiliar places three or four hours drive away, with lots of road turns too. I got so lost once I swore I'd buy a GPS. I did and haven't regretted it since.

I prefer real books though. I don't own an e-reader. Probably because I still have 20/20 vision.

Posted by Zappa (# 8433) on :

All of the above: hate e-books, hate satnav - though I am using it to map my running (but whoever said I wasn't a hypocrite*), hate automatic cars, hate microwaves, prefer records to CDs, and still, though I now for work have to have a mobile phone (and have a smart phone, hence the run-mapping, but it's really to enhance Ship access), would prefer not to have one. In fact I prefer dials to buttons. Ring Ring.

It's funny how many people have their phones set to the old fashioned ring. Mine quacks. Except when Kuruman rings then it barks.

*okay, I'm converting slowly on that one ... [Tear]

Posted by Zach82 (# 3208) on :

I am mostly a Luddite, but YOU try navigating Boston without a GPS!

Posted by Zappa (# 8433) on :

... sort of ... I only use the iphone, not one of those talky things (though the map-my-run app talks to me every mile)

Posted by Zappa (# 8433) on :

quote:
Originally posted by Zach82:
I am mostly a Luddite, but YOU try navigating Boston without a GPS!

I did ... but I did have Kuruman [Biased]

Posted by Psmith (# 15311) on :

I've never driven a car with sat-nav. I took a taxi from the airport to my apartment a few weeks ago that was so equipped, and it kept giving foolish and contradictory directions (which the driver ignored). My phone has gps, and I've used that for its map (when in non-roaming data range) to find places in the first place, and for its estimate of travel time, but not to navigate under way.

I have no microwave, and am of the camp that they are useless. No electric kitchen tools at all apart from the range, fridge, dishwasher and a scale, as I can kneed bread and use a whisk.

The dishwasher I am very fond of, which is not very Luddite of me.

I don't have an e-reader, but can see the appeal when traveling and to acquire many classics for free. With the price of e-books being close to the real thing, I don't see the point otherwise, unless very pressed for space. Even if it were cheaper, I'd still prefer a real book, even if I might then settle for the lesser option at times.

Posted by Bob Two-Owls (# 9680) on :

I hate most things invented after the steam engine but most of all - cars. These I hate with avengeance, I can remember what my village used to be like in the 70s when there was no road and hence no cars. Now I never see my neighbours and traffic zooms past at 60mph slaughtering deer, cyclists and badgers on a regular basis. If I could get away with caltrops and piano-wire I bloody would, but I have a feeling that the archfiends of the motocalypse, the Police, might have a word if I did so I shall restrain myself.

Posted by Ariel (# 58) on :

quote:
Originally posted by Scots lass:
But the real Luddite tendency is that I prefer to bake in imperial measures.

I've never stopped, and I always ask for things in shops by the ounce or pound. Temperatures are still in Fahrenheit for me too.

Posted by Karl: Liberal Backslider (# 76) on :

Pounds and ounces are fine; Fahrenheit is completely fucktarded; any scheme under which water freezes at 32 and boils at 212 can only have been devised by a loony on mushrooms. 0 and 100 make perfect sense. Even 273K and 373K have logic behind them, but 32 and 212? Utter bollocks (yes I know there is actually a scientific basis to Fahrenheit but it's a fucktarded one)

Posted by Curiosity killed ... (# 11770) on :

It was a totally egocentric view that created the Fahrenheit scale - fine for Mr Daniel Gabriel Fahrenheit, not for anyone else.

Posted by Ariel (# 58) on :

It's what I grew up with and what I'm used to. I don't care if water freezes at 32 degrees, and don't see why the defining point of zero degrees has to be that of the freezing point of water. Fahrenheit is more precise, as well; the intervals between degrees in Centigrade are longer.

When it's cold, it never sounds as bad in F as it does in C. When it's hot, I know immediately where I am when it's going to be 80 or so. It means something to me and I can visualize it. I'm not interested in learning a new system, the existing one still works perfectly well.

Posted by Niminypiminy (# 15489) on :

quote:
Originally posted by Ariel:

quote:
Originally posted by Scots lass:
But the real Luddite tendency is that I prefer to bake in imperial measures.
I've never stopped, and I always ask for things in shops by the ounce or pound. Temperatures are still in Fahrenheit for me too.

Some recipes that are so easy and memorable in imperial get all complicated in metric.

Jam is the perfect example. 1lb of fruit (or 1 pint of juice) to 1lb of sugar works perfectly. I've tried 1 kilo to 1 kilo, and it doesn't. You have to measure odd amounts.

Victoria sponge is another (2 eggs: 4 oz butter, sugar and flour). Simple and memorable.

Posted by Karl: Liberal Backslider (# 76) on :

quote:
Originally posted by Ariel:
It's what I grew up with and what I'm used to. I don't care if water freezes at 32 degrees, and don't see why the defining point of zero degrees has to be that of the freezing point of water.

Everything. If it's going to be 0 or less, it's going to be icy. Useful to know. And I know exactly how icy by how big the number after the - is.

It doesn't have to be the freezing point of water but it's very convenient that it is.

quote:
Fahrenheit is more precise, as well; the intervals between degrees in Centigrade are longer.

Yeah, but that's what fractions are for.

quote:
When it's cold, it never sounds as bad in F as it does in C. When it's hot, I know immediately where I am when it's going to be 80 or so. It means something to me and I can visualize it. I'm not interested in learning a new system, the existing one still works perfectly well.

Not for me. If they said 20F I would have to convert it to Celsius to know how cold that is. -7C and I instantly know it's seven below zero - fecking cold.

So there [Razz]

[ 03. October 2012, 15:09: Message edited by: Karl: Liberal Backslider ]

Posted by Og, King of Bashan (# 9562) on :

quote:
Originally posted by Karl: Liberal Backslider:
0 and 100 make perfect sense.

Unless you live where I do, where water boils at 95 c. Whenever I go to sea level and eat beans, I marvel at the fact that they get cooked all the way through.

Once again, each system has its use. I always think of the Fahrenheit system as being useful for measuring air temperature in most climates. Yes, it gets below 0 or above 100 in lots of places, but it covers the range of temperatures where I am willing to step outside. Anything above 100 or below 0, I am going to be inside my house with the AC or heat on.

Posted by leo (# 1458) on :

quote:
Originally posted by Porridge:
I can do without a microwave oven. To misquote scripture, "Can anything good come out of a microwave?"

Yes - all the vitamins BEFORE you start to eat.

Posted by Og, King of Bashan (# 9562) on :

Microwaves actually probably leave more vitamins in your food than conventional cooking methods.

Posted by Ariel (# 58) on :

quote:
Originally posted by Karl: Liberal Backslider:
So there

Whatever. You have the choice, that's what you chose and if you're happy with it, that's fine by me. I didn't choose it or grow up with it, and I don't want it imposed on me.

I don't like decimal currency either. If we do ever get a referendum I will be voting for the return of imperial measurements and coinage. Bring back the groat!

Posted by lilBuddha (# 14333) on :

quote:
Originally posted by Og, King of Bashan:
Microwaves actually probably leave more vitamins in your food than conventional cooking methods.

Perhaps, but still does not taste as good as proper cooking.

Posted by Schroedinger's cat (# 64) on :

As a whole, I am not a luddite. I do like technology, and would count as an Early Adopter, and sometimes an Innovator. I have succumbed to GPS, and love it for getting places I don't know, although I do also check where I am going on a map.

Having said that, poor quality technology makes me fume, so that covers all sorts of things. Crap technology should never get to the public.

However, I still substantially prefer books to e-readers, and have not bought a kindle, despite the fact that it would seem to make sense. However, I love books, not just reading, but the things themselves. A plastic thing is not the same.

Posted by saysay (# 6645) on :

Can I admit amazement that there are in fact people in this world for whom SAT NAV/GPS works? I thought that was a myth, something they were simply telling me in order to further confuse me, seeing as how when I put in an address, there is basically no chance of me winding up where I wanted to go.

Posted by Kelly Alves (# 2522) on :

OK, I have one. Dishwashers. Hate' em.

First of all, there is a certain Zen soothingness to hand washing dishes in warm, sudsy water, and I exercise that option often. I don't get machine washing. You have to rinse and scrub a dish until there is practically nothing on it, then you blast it with scalding water, and half the time stuff comes out stuck-on anyway. And you have to re-wash it. How does this save water?

Suds. Siiighh.

Posted by Firenze (# 619) on :

quote:
Originally posted by Og, King of Bashan:
Microwaves actually probably leave more vitamins in your food than conventional cooking methods.

Og, your link is missing the actual URL.

Anyway, microwaves are fine. They do a specific kind of cooking (steaming) very well. Christmas pudding - 4 hours in an old sock, or 3 minutes in the microwave? They are excellent for vegetable and for softening onions (a process core to innumerable dishes).

The mistake is to expect them to do something which can only be accomplished with an oven or a grill or a red-hot poker.

Posted by Kelly Alves (# 2522) on :

quote:
Originally posted by Zappa:

It's funny how many people have their phones set to the old fashioned ring. Mine quacks. Except when Kuruman rings then it barks.

I set my phone to the old-fashined ring thinking I was making such a statement, then I found myself diving for my pocket as 2 or 3 other phones in the supermarket went off, on more than one occasion.

I switched the tone to the Darryl Hanna Whistling in the Hall tune from "Kill Bill Vol. 1" Which is reasonably unique, but the first week I had it, I went diving for the phone when a waitress at a dirt water little town I hang out in walked by my table whistling the damn tune!

Posted by Og, King of Bashan (# 9562) on :

quote:
Originally posted by Firenze:

quote:
Originally posted by Og, King of Bashan:
Microwaves actually probably leave more vitamins in your food than conventional cooking methods.
Og, your link is missing the actual URL.

Anyway, microwaves are fine. They do a specific kind of cooking (steaming) very well. Christmas pudding - 4 hours in an old sock, or 3 minutes in the microwave? They are excellent for vegetable and for softening onions (a process core to innumerable dishes).

The mistake is to expect them to do something which can only be accomplished with an oven or a grill or a red-hot poker.

Maybe this will work.

I absolutely agree that microwaves cannot replace certain forms of cooking. I don't know why anyone would cook bacon in the microwave, for instance. I actually pop my popcorn on the stove top, which probably qualifies me for luddite status. And I have finally proven to the Queen of Bashan that you cannot get a sweet potato properly baked in the microwave (the ultimate tool for that is the toaster oven). That said, I have lived without one, and while I got by fine, I wouldn't do it again, given the choice.

Dishwashers too. I recently had to sublease an apartment. Trust me, having a dishwasher was a huge selling point.

Posted by Moo (# 107) on :

Aside from the fact that I hate handwashing dishes, one advantage is that they come out of the dishwasher with far fewer germs. (I set my dishwasher to wash at high temperatures.)

Since I live alone now, this is less important than when I had children at home.

Moo

Posted by Kelly Alves (# 2522) on :

Complete air drying takes care of most of the germs-- as for the rest, "That's what the immune system is for!" as Jamie on Mythbusters would say.

YMMV-- in fact, I'm sure it will vary all over the board, I just love me some suds. Maybe I just have Lady MacBeth complex.

Posted by piglet (# 11803) on :

quote:
Originally posted by Karl: Liberal Backslider:
... Fahrenheit is completely fucktarded ...

Like many Brits over the age of 30, I used to (generally) think in Fahrenheit in the summer (bigger numbers) and Centigrade in the winter (0° sounds so much colder than 32°). Having lived in Canada for nine years, I very rarely think in Fahrenheit at all, as all the weather here comes in Centigrade.

I've never used either sat-nav or an e-book; and a couple of months ago at the not-so-tender age of 50 I got my first mobile phone.

Posted by Karl: Liberal Backslider (# 76) on :

quote:
Originally posted by piglet:

quote:
Originally posted by Karl: Liberal Backslider:
... Fahrenheit is completely fucktarded ...
Like many Brits over the age of 30, I used to (generally) think in Fahrenheit in the summer (bigger numbers) and Centigrade in the winter (0° sounds so much colder than 32°). Having lived in Canada for nine years, I very rarely think in Fahrenheit at all, as all the weather here comes in Centigrade.

I've never used either sat-nav or an e-book; and a couple of months ago at the not-so-tender age of 50 I got my first mobile phone.

Joshing Ariel aside, I tended to until quite recently. Winter lows were like -4C; summer highs like 85F.

I just find the reference points for F surreal.

Posted by leo (# 1458) on :

quote:
Originally posted by lilBuddha:

quote:
Originally posted by Og, King of Bashan:
Microwaves actually probably leave more vitamins in your food than conventional cooking methods.
Perhaps, but still does not taste as good as proper cooking.

Og's link doesn't work.

Re- taste - isn't that something to do with the smell as it is cooking in an oven?

Posted by Sir Kevin (# 3492) on :

quote:
Originally posted by balaam:
e-readers, who needs them?

When I read a free book on the e-reader, I look forward to the day our bookshelves will be relieved of too many real books: we have 9 rooms of furniture in a 7-room house! The Mrs. got an e-reader with the cash she received from her father upon the completion of her M.A. in education. We now have the Barnes and Noble Nook as well as the Amazon Kindle application for our Apple computer and I am slowly learning how to use the latter. However my favourite book is still my 19th-century 1st edition of Three Men in a Boat by Jerome K. Jerome.

Posted by Emendator Liturgia (# 17245) on :

As someone who has travelled to Europe and the US quite a bit, and driven over almost all of the UK (Sorry to be insulting, but RAC etc maps over there are HORRENDOUS, let alone the signs that got pulled down during WWII and were never put up again), a Sat-Nav is an essential tool.

When you are used to driving 50 miles just to go to lunch (we're a much more mobile lot down here, probably due to the distances involved), then you rely on good directions and referneces. I remember trying to use an RAC map to get into Manchester - the inner city map did not line up with the approach map; every street corner was not signposted until you were right on it; and don't start me on St Alban's or Bristol!

As far as other modern-day conveniences: I use the microwave most days, and it can do a superb roast chicken i.e. its not just there to reheat. Have to confess to liking bacon from the microwave - it comes out crispy, just the way I like it.

Computers: notice no one has mentioned being a Luddite about those - probably a bit hards given that this is an online forum and hence requires new fangled technology.

I can say that I agree with other shipmates re books versus e-readers. As the moaning removalists attest to each time, my library is extensive and will continue to be so for quite a while yet - too many theological books haven't made it over. Mind you, a tablet will be good for my next trip - books, shows, music loaded and ready!

Posted by Drifting Star (# 12799) on :

quote:
Originally posted by Emendator Liturgia:
As someone who has travelled to Europe and the US quite a bit, and driven over almost all of the UK (Sorry to be insulting, but RAC etc maps over there are HORRENDOUS, let alone the signs that got pulled down during WWII and were never put up again), a Sat-Nav is an essential tool.

Really? I've heard a lot of well-travelled (and many US) people say that our Ordnance Survey maps are the best in the world. I certainly think they're fantastic.

ETA Don't think I've ever come across RAC maps, don't know what 'etc maps' are, but Ordnance Survey are the most widely available anyway.

[ 04. October 2012, 13:19: Message edited by: Drifting Star ]

Posted by Karl: Liberal Backslider (# 76) on :

Indeed. I've walked in Iceland (mapping 1:100000) and Italy (mapping 1:50000 but like a rough sketchmap by comparison, with 100m contour interval) and they don't even come close to the OS mapping at 1:25000 covering the entire country.

Posted by Jane R (# 331) on :

quote:
YOU try navigating Boston without a GPS!

I have. We'd just arrived in the US so we were contending with jetlag as well as the Bostonian one-way system. The main problem was recognising the correct turn-offs, because being British we are used to big road-signs in conspicuous places well before the junction (to give you plenty of time to prepare for the turn-off, unless said sign has been obscured by a tree or similar) and you had these discreet little green signs planted just in front of the turning... in the three seconds for deciphering the sign and working out which turning it applied to we'd gone past!

I hate satnavs too. They don't give you the really important information: they just say 'take the next right turn' instead of 'At the next junction you need to turn right, so start thinking about getting into the lane now' or 'Just before you get to the green bus stop, turn right; if you get as far as the big factory chimney you've gone past the turning', or 'ignore that entrance there, it only leads to a farm; I meant the next road off to the right'.

And sometimes they're just plain wrong. My Other Half was once coming home from the airport in a taxi and the taxi-driver's satnav started giving very strange instructions. After it had ignored two turnings for our village and sent the taxi away on a wild-goose chase to the wrong side of the city they turned it off and Other Half gave directions instead.

Ordnance Survey maps are pretty good, but most motoring maps are too large-scale to show minor roads properly. So we have a motoring map for the whole of the mainland UK and a couple of OS Landranger maps for areas we visit regularly.

[ 04. October 2012, 13:36: Message edited by: Jane R ]

Posted by Og, King of Bashan (# 9562) on :

quote:
Originally posted by leo:

quote:
Originally posted by lilBuddha:

quote:
Originally posted by Og, King of Bashan:
Microwaves actually probably leave more vitamins in your food than conventional cooking methods.
Perhaps, but still does not taste as good as proper cooking.
Og's link doesn't work.

Re- taste - isn't that something to do with the smell as it is cooking in an oven?

I corrected it a few posts back.

Posted by lilBuddha (# 14333) on :

quote:
Originally posted by Kelly Alves:
OK, I have one. Dishwashers. Hate' em.

First of all, there is a certain Zen soothingness to hand washing dishes in warm, sudsy water, and I exercise that option often. I don't get machine washing. You have to rinse and scrub a dish until there is practically nothing on it, then you blast it with scalding water, and half the time stuff comes out stuck-on anyway. And you have to re-wash it. How does this save water?

Suds. Siiighh.

I'm with you on the suds, but I do not waste them on dishes.

Posted by leo (# 1458) on :

quote:
Originally posted by Og, King of Bashan:

quote:
Originally posted by leo:

quote:
Originally posted by lilBuddha:

quote:
Originally posted by Og, King of Bashan:
Microwaves actually probably leave more vitamins in your food than conventional cooking methods.
Perhaps, but still does not taste as good as proper cooking.
Og's link doesn't work.

Re- taste - isn't that something to do with the smell as it is cooking in an oven?
I corrected it a few posts back.

Oh yes - thanks and sorry - will read it tomorrow when i have more time.

Posted by Kelly Alves (# 2522) on :

quote:
Originally posted by lilBuddha:
I'm with you on the suds, but I do not waste them on dishes.

Girl! I stand corrected!

Posted by mark_in_manchester (# 15978) on :

This thread on another forum ( [Disappointed]

) I frequent, provides an interesting insight into the mind of the electro-Luddite.

I also find its studied irrationality moves me in the same kind of way that acts of great heroism or nobility do, towards a state of mind which views the reality of God (real uber-irrationality) as really rather probable.

Posted by jedijudy (# 333) on :

Apparently I look like a Luddite. Today, after a meal out, the very nice waitress told me that if I fill out the on-line survey, we would get a bloomin' onion for free on our next visit. Then she asked if I knew how to do that on a computer. I pulled out my iPhone and told her I could probably access the form there.

Could it be my graying-hair-in-a-bun???

Posted by Kelly Alves (# 2522) on :

quote:
Originally posted by mark_in_manchester:
This thread on another forum ( ) I frequent, provides an interesting insight into the mind of the electro-Luddite.

I also find its studied irrationality moves me in the same kind of way that acts of great heroism or nobility do, towards a state of mind which views the reality of God (real uber-irrationality) as really rather probable.

Ohh My GOD, low-tech porn! [Yipee]

Preschool teachers love low tech.

Posted by HenryT (# 3722) on :

Let me defend Mr. Farenheit, or at least explain his method.

He planned to make body temperature 100; however, he had a mild case of TB (consumption) and an elevated body temperature. He also was egocentric enough to make himself the sole test subject.

He also planned 0 to be the "coldest temperature ever"; and used the coldest you can get with ice and salt.

He wasn't barking mad, just a little eccentric and sloppy.

I typically use F inside and C outside, which comes from living in Canada.

However, I'm a techie, I like GPS (but don't trust it too far), I live on the Internet.

OTOH, I can make beer, bread, fire, and cook (seven courses for twenty people) on an open fire. I also hold a qualification in Celestial Navigation.

The Celestial Nav course was interesting. I became convinced that only the instructor and I believed that he was talking about real phenomena. The rest of the class, sailors all, needed the course to get a master's ticket. They planned to rely entirely on their GPS/SatNav. God help them if they are ever shipwrecked; by straightedge and compass, I could construct some of the classic navigational tools.

BTW, most of the SatNav issues are with the map database, and not the GPS system. GPS will tell you where you are. It does so in a particular coordinate system; your maps often come from somewhat different coordinate systems. The details are messy; consult a professional geographer, ideally one with great math skills. So the map database is prepared by taking an extant map or six, scanning, applying coordinate transformations, and going with the best guess.

Add in non-standard and non-uniform naming and numbering systems, ambiguous database lookups, and the like, and you can get weird results (I remember someone got a "shortest route" from someplace in the US to someplace in Canada that went via Iceland!) I had lots of fun in an area where the road naming pattern was "Muskoka Road 16", "Muskoka Road 20" rather than the standard Canadian/US pattern of "Highway 16". One device's map database turned out to have truncated and coalesced every road into one "Muskoka Rd". Which resulted in ridiculous directions.

The GPS system does essentially what the sextant method does, using artificial beacons rather than natural ones. Solving multiple hyperbolic triangles gives you a position (and uncertainty). Turning that into a location and a route, that's another issue entirely.

Posted by Jane R (# 331) on :

Thanks, HenryT - that does explain how people end up in swamps and driving off cliffs by following the instructions from their satnavs... I will be sticking with maps for the foreseeable future.

Posted by Karl: Liberal Backslider (# 76) on :

Interestingly, Bing maps currently thinks Sheffield is in Cornwall.

Try it.

Posted by Curiosity killed ... (# 11770) on :

I believe in celestial navigation - I've been shown how to do it, but not taken any courses in it. Really useful knowledge working out the right direction to walk home when out too late or having lost all sense of direction in a forest. In fact, the analogue watch as compass is another really good reason for wearing an analogue watch.

Posted by Zappa (# 8433) on :

quote:
Originally posted by HenryT:
GPS will tell you where you are. It does so in a particular coordinate system; your maps often come from somewhat different coordinate systems.

... almost the only thing I remember from five years exclusive fee paying secondary school is "you gotta put it across her before you put it up her". Is that relevant?

(It was an army instructor teaching us how to use 1:63360 scale topographical maps)

Posted by Surfing Madness (# 11087) on :

quote:
Originally posted by Karl: Liberal Backslider:
Interestingly, Bing maps currently thinks Sheffield is in Cornwall.

Try it.

It's put it in the right place, but just labeled it wrong!

Posted by Karl: Liberal Backslider (# 76) on :

quote:
Originally posted by Surfing Madness:

quote:
Originally posted by Karl: Liberal Backslider:
Interestingly, Bing maps currently thinks Sheffield is in Cornwall.

Try it.
It's put it in the right place, but just labeled it wrong!

well yes, but it's amusing "just". Penzance is about 300 miles away.

Posted by balaam (# 4543) on :

quote:
Originally posted by Curiosity killed ...:
Really useful knowledge working out the right direction to walk home when out too late or having lost all sense of direction in a forest

Forest. Yeah, right.

If you were me it would be the pub.

Posted by Ariel (# 58) on :

quote:
Originally posted by Karl: Liberal Backslider:
Interestingly, Bing maps currently thinks Sheffield is in Cornwall.

It is in Cornwall. A lot of people think it's up north but this misinformation has been around for generations, ever since they redrew the county boundaries back in the year dot and forgot to publicize the change.

Posted by Drifting Star (# 12799) on :

quote:
Originally posted by Ariel:

quote:
Originally posted by Karl: Liberal Backslider:
Interestingly, Bing maps currently thinks Sheffield is in Cornwall.
It is in Cornwall. A lot of people think it's up north but this misinformation has been around for generations, ever since they redrew the county boundaries back in the year dot and forgot to publicize the change.

It really is.

Posted by Twilight (# 2832) on :

I'm a post 2000 Luddite.

I've never had a mobile phone. I barely answer the line phone in the kitchen, I just check it for messages once or twice a day. It's hard for me to imagine why people would want to be pestered by a ringing phone while out shopping or driving.

My newest (post 2000) oven has the usual requirements of pushing "bake," and then setting the temperature, but unlike all my past ovens, it also needs one to push a start button. This enables one to have the option of telling the stove not to turn on until hours later. I can't imagine a gamey roast setting in the oven, building bacteria for hours before stating to cook in it's watery mess. That last little "start" which I never had to push before has caused a few cold roasts at dinner time for me.

I think there are a lot of new features added to products that are there for the salesman to talk about rather than for the convenience of the consumer.

My new "water saver" clothes washer fills only about six inches to rinse a full load of clothes. It leaves them soapy and stiff so I have to rinse twice and spend more time with the machine.

My newest MAGNAVOX DVD/VHS player/recorder is absolutely impossible to record with. I've spent days with the manual open in my lap, trying. My brother and my husband have spent nights trying (they both have computer science degrees.) Research on the internet consumer review sites reveal that no one can make it work. OTOH my old, pre 2000, one, set to another TV works fine.

We can't hear our new gigantic flat screen TV's. If we really want to hear we go to my son's bedroom and watch his little, old 10 inch TV.

OTOH my new microwave has a "done," buzzer so loud I drop dishes when it goes off. I used to know it had stopped when its fan stopped but now I have the blast followed by irritating reminder buzzes every few seconds until I get my hands out of the dish water and go tend to its demands. If I'm still at a loss as to what's going on it has a print scroll crawling across the screen saying "Your food is ready." No kidding.

They're bossy! All my appliances boss me around all day! Then I go to the store and the self-serve lane has that same British woman inside the computer who resides in my bank's ATM, not only telling me to "Put. The. Item. In. The. Bag." in a bossy tone but sounding far, far more educated than me and my fellow mid-westerners.

Thank goodness my car is a 1998 model with no bossy woman in the dash board telling me where to turn or I would have hammered it with my tire iron.

Posted by Sioni Sais (# 5713) on :

quote:
Originally posted by Karl: Liberal Backslider:
Indeed. I've walked in Iceland (mapping 1:100000) and Italy (mapping 1:50000 but like a rough sketchmap by comparison, with 100m contour interval) and they don't even come close to the OS mapping at 1:25000 covering the entire country.

The French IGN do a 1:25000 series that is almost as good. Part of the joy of the parts of France we visit is in getting a bit lost (which is fine so long as you're not in a hurry to catch a ferry).

Posted by L'organist (# 17338) on :

My partner uses celestial navigation all the time and its especially useful when there is congestion or some lunatic (using SAT/NAV) clogs up our country lanes by going head-on into a tractor. All the partner then does is to go into the nearest field and then work out the route back to where we need to be.
Only been caught out once: then the EA had carried out some "improvements" near an ancient ford and hacked back the bank so there was a 3 foot drop into the water. Vehicle was fine but my back remembered the jarring for weeks after.

Posted by Sober Preacher's Kid (# 12699) on :

Henry's post explains why my GPS receiver works so well: I purchased the map upgrade. The upgraded map is accredited to the Queen's Printer for Ontario and has since been rolled into a Canada-wide Topgraphic map.

With a postal code reference, I'm good to go.

Posted by Ariel (# 58) on :

quote:
Originally posted by Twilight:
OTOH my new microwave has a "done," buzzer so loud I drop dishes when it goes off. I used to know it had stopped when its fan stopped but now I have the blast followed by irritating reminder buzzes every few seconds until I get my hands out of the dish water and go tend to its demands. If I'm still at a loss as to what's going on it has a print scroll crawling across the screen saying "Your food is ready." No kidding.

I used to work somewhere where there was a food vending machine in the cafeteria which would give you numbered instructions on how to insert coins, open panel and remove meal, ending with "5. Enjoy meal." It always made me feel like snarling "I don't want to enjoy my meal."

Posted by Jengie Jon (# 273) on :

My doctor's receptionist are becoming slightly baffled by me. I visit them to make an appointment. I DO NOT trust their phone system, the last time (and only time) I used it, it made an appointment at the wrong surgery! I managed to catch the start of day switch over and got routed to the wrong surgery. I do not like phones anyway, I feel they put me on the spot. Now if they had an email system I might use it to make appointments

Jengie

Posted by Kelly Alves (# 2522) on :

quote:
Originally posted by Ariel:
It always made me feel like snarling "I don't want to enjoy my meal."

You're all right, Ariel.

I hate voice recognition call menus so much. I used to hate touchtone menus; then they started the voice recognition crap, and I started becoming a touchtone fan.

Posted by Jante (# 9163) on :

The self service checkouts in supermarkets. I like to deal with a person- and keep them in a job!

Posted by Sioni Sais (# 5713) on :

quote:
Originally posted by Jante:
The self service checkouts in supermarkets. I like to deal with a person- and keep them in a job!

It's worse than Luddism. The damn things are hopeless. I'll use them when I can buy a loaf, some veg and a bottle of booze without a shrill 'unexpected object in bagging area' or the need to get staff to authorise age-related transactions.

Posted by Starbug (# 15917) on :

I can't stand touchscreen smartphones. I used to have an iPhone and hated it. I'm slightly deaf and the ringtone wasn't loud enough, so I kept missing calls. And as for the onscreen keyboard... I gave up and bought a Blackberry, which has a proper keyboard.

On the other hand, I love the satnav! Until we bought one, Mr S and I had SO many arguments, due to my total inability to map-read (at the time, I couldn't drive, so it was always my job). Now, we just tell Mrs Tomtom (as I call her) where we want to go and she tells us the way. I also have to drive a lot on my own, so she is invaluable.

Posted by RuthW (# 13) on :

quote:
Originally posted by Twilight:
Then I go to the store and the self-serve lane has that same British woman inside the computer who resides in my bank's ATM, not only telling me to "Put. The. Item. In. The. Bag." in a bossy tone but sounding far, far more educated than me and my fellow mid-westerners.

I never get through the self-service checkout without snarling at that voice (it's all generic American here, though). Particularly annoying is the parting "Thank you for shopping with us" at Von's -- last time my response was "Yeah, bite me" and the attendant nearly hurt herself trying not to laugh.

Posted by Porridge (# 15405) on :

And God help you if you've brought a reduced-for-quick-sale item to the self-checkout at the supermarket.

I wuz robbed.

Posted by Moo (# 107) on :

quote:
Originally posted by Porridge:
And God help you if you've brought a reduced-for-quick-sale item to the self-checkout at the supermarket.

I wuz robbed.

The supermarkets around here cover up the old barcode with a new one when they reduce the price.

Moo

Posted by Surfing Madness (# 11087) on :

I have a friend who keeps in touch with me, by a monthly letter in the post, I love getting it. I know we could phone or e-mail, but there is something great about letters in the post.

Posted by Mr Curly (# 5518) on :

Mrs C is awful at map reading, or should I say, at being the designated map reader. Our GPS saved our marriage on our 4 week driving tour of France and Switzerland. "Kate" the gps was not perfect, but at least we had someone else to blame.

Smart phones are a mixed blessing, and a curse in the hands of teenagers who seem unable to organize anything or commit to anything.

Books are nice, ereaders mean I'm published!

mr curly.

Posted by Kelly Alves (# 2522) on :

quote:
Originally posted by RuthW:

quote:
Originally posted by Twilight:
Then I go to the store and the self-serve lane has that same British woman inside the computer who resides in my bank's ATM, not only telling me to "Put. The. Item. In. The. Bag." in a bossy tone but sounding far, far more educated than me and my fellow mid-westerners.
I never get through the self-service checkout without snarling at that voice (it's all generic American here, though). Particularly annoying is the parting "Thank you for shopping with us" at Von's -- last time my response was "Yeah, bite me" and the attendant nearly hurt herself trying not to laugh.

I actually do OK with the self-check outs. I ignore the neurotic little voice. (I will refrain from pointing out the huge amount of practice I get for doing that.)

What gets me is the card scanners at the manned registers in Safeway. If, for instance, you fumble with your card when it's time for you to scan, that second-and a half delay makes the machine go BEEP-BEEP-BEEP!-- this rapid fire trio of beeps that has the kind of impatient, irritated tone of a nun rapping a desk with a ruler. Or someone snapping their fingers at you.

On a car trip to Southern California with family, we amused ourselves and probably prevented ourselves from killing each other ) by mocking the plaintive voice on our GPS. We called her Christine (after the Stephen King novel),and snickered at her tendency to repeat herself at junctions.

She had her revenge on the trip home when she sent us on some long, winding desert route (lovely, but we didn't know where the hell we were) and growing oddly quiet at junctions. Added three hours onto our trip.

Posted by anoesis (# 14189) on :

quote:
Originally posted by Boogie:

quote:
Originally posted by Porridge:
I can do without a microwave oven. To misquote scripture, "Can anything good come out of a microwave?"
Yes - the only thing I use it for - porridge!

A-men! Makes excellent porridge (without needing stirring). I cook frozen peas in mine, also. But that's pretty much all.

Posted by Porridge (# 15405) on :

This discussion is making me nervous about entering kitchens. I don't care for the idea of being microwaved.

Posted by jedijudy (# 333) on :

Run away, Porridge! Run away!

Posted by Sir Kevin (# 3492) on :

In lieu of in-car sat-nav, I refer a pretty girl (such as my wife or daughter) with a map, even if she googled directions on the computer or smart-phone and printed them off!

Posted by EtymologicalEvangelical (# 15091) on :

quote:
Originally posted by Boogie
My inner luddite hates to drive automatic cars - I like to choose when to vroooom!

I had a minor car accident in March this year. Fortunately muggins and the other fellow were unhurt (and he admitted liability), but, due to my car needing repairs, my insurer provided me with a courtesy car, which was an automatic. This was the first time I had driven one of these (apart from a very short go in a friend's car many years ago).

It was easy to get used to, but sometimes I just felt so lazy, and it just didn't feel like I was really driving at all - just sitting there watching the world go by.

Maybe automatic transmission is a genuine technological advance, but I would have thought progress would also involve encouraging the driver to stay awake!

Posted by Ariel (# 58) on :

My automatic car is a godsend. It takes a lot of the stress out of driving and is how I finally managed to pass my test - I hadn't a hope of ever passing in a manual and hated the gear-clutch combo. It's the 21st century. The car should be doing the gear changes as far as I'm concerned.

I know people will say "you get more control" but I never felt I needed it. I didn't want to be constantly fiddling around with silly changes at every point and I had a pretty good line in stalling. My nightmare scenario was doing this either at the approach to a roundabout, or else on a busy high-speed road. Now I don't have to worry. Hill starts are no problem, either.

quote:
Originally posted by EtymologicalEvangelical:
Maybe automatic transmission is a genuine technological advance, but I would have thought progress would also involve encouraging the driver to stay awake!

Well, there's always the possibility of erratic cyclists, children playing in the road, the sudden appearance of pheasants/rabbits, foxes/horses, cats bounding across the street, oncoming cars that suddenly decide to overtake the vehicle in front as you approach, impatient people who overtake you on a roundabout, stupidly parked cars, ambulances desperate to get past, people who cut corners very widely, idiots who step blithely into the road texting... not much chance of falling asleep driving (not round here, anyway)!

Posted by Sioni Sais (# 5713) on :

quote:
Originally posted by EtymologicalEvangelical:

quote:
Originally posted by Boogie
My inner luddite hates to drive automatic cars - I like to choose when to vroooom!
I had a minor car accident in March this year. Fortunately muggins and the other fellow were unhurt (and he admitted liability), but, due to my car needing repairs, my insurer provided me with a courtesy car, which was an automatic. This was the first time I had driven one of these (apart from a very short go in a friend's car many years ago).

It was easy to get used to, but sometimes I just felt so lazy, and it just didn't feel like I was really driving at all - just sitting there watching the world go by.

Maybe automatic transmission is a genuine technological advance, but I would have thought progress would also involve encouraging the driver to stay awake!

I'd say that modern automatic transmission is a Godsend. You can now get decent automatic transmission for small cars, a far cry from the Variomatic system (aka rubber-band drive) on cars like the DAF 66 of the 1960's which made the wrong noises at the wrong times! No chance of dozing off with that.

Posted by EtymologicalEvangelical (# 15091) on :

quote:
Originally posted by Ariel

quote:
Originally posted by EtymologicalEvangelical:
Maybe automatic transmission is a genuine technological advance, but I would have thought progress would also involve encouraging the driver to stay awake!
Well, there's always the possibility of erratic cyclists, children playing in the road, the sudden appearance of pheasants/rabbits, foxes/horses, cats bounding across the street, oncoming cars that suddenly decide to overtake the vehicle in front as you approach, impatient people who overtake you on a roundabout, stupidly parked cars, ambulances desperate to get past, people who cut corners very widely, idiots who step blithely into the road texting... not much chance of falling asleep driving (not round here, anyway)!

I was, of course, being somewhat facetious!

Everyone to their own. I've been driving a manual car for over 20 years, so I guess my brain is wired accordingly. That's why I felt that the idea of the car doing the gear changes felt like a bit of a cop out.

I remember as a child watching my parents drive, and one question I asked was "how do you know when to change gear?" To which the reply was: "you hear the noise of the engine change." This never really convinced me, and I thought that this was something I would never be able to learn. So before I had my first driving lesson I assumed that this aspect of driving would be the most difficult. Strangely, it took about ten seconds for me to get used to it!

Maybe this is why I love manual cars. Something that I thought was so difficult before I actually did it, turned out to be so delightfully easy. And, of course, there is the feeling of being in control.

Of course, other people's experience is different, and there is nothing wrong with automatics. Just not for me.

Posted by Porridge (# 15405) on :

I've heard this semi-historical rumor that there were once service stations which offered actual service. Instead of you getting out of your vehicle to clean your own windshield, pump your own gas, and check your own oil, there was an attendant who dashed out of a little glass cubicle in rain, sleet, or snow and raced to your side to do all these things for you.

BRING BACK ATTENDANTS. I do not WANT to check my oil while dressed in my best suit.

Posted by Kelly Alves (# 2522) on :

They have a couple of those in San Francisco, but it's advertised like a glorious novelty, and jacks the gas price up another four cents.

Posted by Moo (# 107) on :

Some gas stations have full-service islands as well as self-service. You pay extra, of course.

Moo

Posted by Zappa (# 8433) on :

quote:
Originally posted by Porridge:
I've heard this semi-historical rumor that there were once service stations which offered actual service. Instead of you getting out of your vehicle to clean your own windshield, pump your own gas, and check your own oil, there was an attendant who dashed out of a little glass cubicle in rain, sleet, or snow and raced to your side to do all these things for you.

BRING BACK ATTENDANTS. I do not WANT to check my oil while dressed in my best suit.

I won't buy into that ... but i do remember back in the day when there was no such thing as self-service, but it was a cool thing to do. So I did ... pulled into a servo on my motorbike, filled the tank between my knees, but somehow, God alone knows how, forgot to release the trigger before withdrawing the nozzle ....

quite spekky, really. Fortunately I wasn't smoking.

Posted by jedijudy (# 333) on :

IIRC, when I was in Oregon a few years ago, there was no such thing as self-service at the gas stations. (Could it be illegal there?) And, I think there's another state that is the same.

I'm another one who likes to drive a manual! Changing gears is so automatic (yuk, yuk!!) that I never even think about it, unless it's necessary to downshift to get out of the way of a dangerous situation. (Usually caused by someone who shouldn't be driving.)

I taught D-U to drive a stick. Then, when she took driver's training in high school, the car was an automatic. She had never driven one, and was also nervous about driving with the teacher in the car. During that first drive, on one of the practice stops, she pushed in the clutch, forgetting that the car had none. So, the brake was slammed, and the teacher berated her. When she tearfully told me the sad tale, I told her that the teacher probably had no idea how to drive a stick, and she shouldn't worry about his rant.

Hopefully, I will be a Luddite forever in that regard.

Posted by Latchkey Kid (# 12444) on :

Why have wheels when you can walk [Yipee]

And Ned can do without the bad spin. He was against machines controlling how people work rather than being a support to people working; not against new technology per se.

Posted by blackbeard (# 10848) on :

It's believed by some that Ned Ludd was not the brightest of sparks, intellectually speaking; so when the authorities set out to arrest the brains behind the riot, and were told "it's Ned Ludd", they found that their man was not actually capable of organising anything. So it's said.

On attended service at petrol stations: I remember, many moons ago, at a petrol station in deepest Dorset, the attendant came out and knocked his pipe out on the petrol nozzle. We got ready to run. In fairness, I think the pipe had gone out.

Posted by Jane R (# 331) on :

<automatic vs. manual cars>

I normally drive a car with manual gears, but when we went to America a few years ago we hired an automatic. It was great - it meant we could concentrate on driving on the wrong side of the road (intoning 'Americans Drive On The Right' every time we approached a junction) without having to worry about the gearstick being on the wrong side of the car. Of course we frequently forgot the car was an automatic and reached to the left for the gearstick, but usually by the time our fingers hit the door the car had changed gear by itself...

So automatic transmissions can be useful.

Posted by Molopata The Rebel (# 9933) on :

I hate credit cards. And I dislike debit cards.

We do use them for online payments, because you have to, and to withdraw money at the beginning of the month. But it's good to visually see the money go out which allows you to keep track of expenditure as its quantity dwindles. Credit card companies far rather present the whole bill of overspending to you in a single dollop a month later and frolic when you can't stump it all up in a oner.

Posted by leo (# 1458) on :

In hate cash! The only thing i use it for is bus fares as i pay everything else by plastic and pay off at the end of each month.

As you can only get £20 notes out of cashpoints, it is difficult to have the right change for the bus and i wish they'd start a quasi-Oyster card system here.

The I could do away with cons and notes altogether.

Posted by birdie (# 2173) on :

quote:
Originally posted by leo:

As you can only get £20 notes out of cashpoints

Since when? You get £5s and £10s around here.

Posted by leo (# 1458) on :

quote:
Originally posted by birdie:

quote:
Originally posted by leo:

As you can only get £20 notes out of cashpoints
Since when? You get £5s and £10s around here.

Rarely £10, never £5

Posted by Curiosity killed ... (# 11770) on :

They've started putting £5 notes in cash machines around here too.

Posted by ElaineC (# 12244) on :

And by East Croydon station.

Posted by Heavenly Anarchist (# 13313) on :

I've never owned a mobile phone and my other half (who designs and patents sensory devices for a living) doesn't have one either - he has to borrow one from work when going away on business. I don't drive either, I like to walk and happily use public transport.
But I love my Kindle, I download history books and old classics and read the Guardian whilst on holiday abroad. Still have to get real books for crafts though.
I make porridge in the microwave.

Posted by Ariel (# 58) on :

quote:
Originally posted by leo:
I hate cash!

I rather like it. Can I have yours if you don't want it?

Posted by leo (# 1458) on :

quote:
Originally posted by Curiosity killed ...:
They've started putting £5 notes in cash machines around here too.

Must be poverty caused by austerity measures of this evil government

Posted by Sioni Sais (# 5713) on :

quote:
Originally posted by Curiosity killed ...:
They've started putting £5 notes in cash machines around here too.

I seem to remember that the government asked banks to put fivers in cash machines a few years ago but I've not come across any such machines. What I have found is that if you request £20 you get two tenners, which isn't so bad.

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