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Source: (consider it)
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Thread: What's the worst stole you've ever seen
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regulator reverend
Apprentice
# 16890
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Posted
I'm being deaconed on July 1st, and waiting to see if any stoles with Olympic rings turn up! ![[Roll Eyes]](rolleyes.gif)
Posts: 9 | From: Hampshire | Registered: Jan 2012
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PD
Shipmate
# 12436
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Posted
I think the interlocking multicoloured crosses within a green border is still one of the worst I have ever seen. It was an early example c.1979 of the dreadful stole phenomomen. That said, one has to go a long way to beat the 'children of the world' stole retailed by your local Catholic tat shop!
PD
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Zach82
Shipmate
# 3208
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Posted
Besides the cutesey children's handprints stoles manufactured by Sunday Schools everywhere, I greatly dislike those effnick woven wool stoles.
Another one.
They're everywhere.
[ 01. June 2012, 17:41: Message edited by: Zach82 ]
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Don't give up yet, no, don't ever quit/ There's always a chance of a critical hit. Ghost Mice
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sebby
Shipmate
# 15147
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by regulator reverend:
I'm being deaconed on July 1st, and waiting to see if any stoles with Olympic rings turn up!
Many congratulations. I hope you wear a fairly traditional one in either white or red according to the celebration. Watts so some very dignified ones.
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sebhyatt
Posts: 1340 | From: yorks | Registered: Sep 2009
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Pigwidgeon
Ship's Owl
# 10192
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Zach82:
Besides the cutesey children's handprints stoles manufactured by Sunday Schools everywhere, I greatly dislike those effnick woven wool stoles.
Cotton, actually.
![[Razz]](tongue.gif)
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"...that is generally a matter for Pigwidgeon, several other consenting adults, a bottle of cheap Gin and the odd giraffe."
~Tortuf
Posts: 9835 | From: Hogwarts | Registered: Aug 2005
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churchgeek
Have candles, will pray
# 5557
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Posted
I have a strong distaste for any vestments that are all about the person wearing them. Might as well save money and not wear vestments at all.
I don't get the reason for different stoles (and other vestments) for children's liturgies.
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I reserve the right to change my mind.
My article on the Virgin of Vladimir
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WearyPilgrim
Shipmate
# 14593
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by churchgeek:
I have a strong distaste for any vestments that are all about the person wearing them. Might as well save money and not wear vestments at all.
YES!!
![[Overused]](graemlins/notworthy.gif)
Check out badvestments.blogspot.com
I wear a Geneva gown, a collar, and for special occasions, preaching bands. Period.
[fixed code]
[ 01. June 2012, 21:46: Message edited by: seasick ]
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Episcoterian
Shipmate
# 13185
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Posted
I'm all for the Geneva robe with bands. Or even the British open-fronted gown with cassock and bands.
But I'll also wear a stole. A plain, satin one in the liturgical colour, with a conservative symbol machine-embroidered close to the ends and a nice fringe. Maybe a brocade one for high feasts.
Nothing fancy, nothing ethnic (for our faith transcends all ethnies).
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"We cannot let individualism make corporate worship impossible!" (iMonk)
I'm on Facebook too!
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balaam
Making an ass of myself
# 4543
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by churchgeek:
I have a strong distaste for any vestments that are all about the person wearing them. Might as well save money and not wear vestments at all.
We've done that, which isn't a big move for our church which is so far down the candle as to be subterranean.
However a previous vicar had a plain black stole with 70s style Smile Jesus Loves You patches at the ends. And this was in the early 2000s. The reality was even worse than it sounds.
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Posts: 9049 | From: Hen Ogledd | Registered: May 2003
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Gee D
Shipmate
# 13815
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Posted
School - originally Presbyterian but now Uniting - uses the Macpherson tartan. The previous chaplain had a stole in this tartan, which he used at most chapel services. OTOH, he did introduce the custom of lighting a candle at the commencement of a service.
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Not every Anglican in Sydney is Sydney Anglican
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Amos
Shipmate
# 44
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Posted
Anything with 'personal' symbols on it.
I once knew a clergyman whose stole for Ordinary Time was emblazoned with pink triangles, which, he told the congregation, were 'symbols of the Trinity.' There was also a pink pussycat appliqué on the back of the neck for him to kiss when he put it on. Ick.
Anything with barbed wire attached to it.
Same clergyman during Lent.
Anything made for by a devout friend or relation who can't sew particularly well.
On the other side of the coin: At the induction of the new vicar of Little St Mary's last week, there were some absolutely eye-popping pizza-shovel numbers, not all of which were particularly edifying. Especially the one with semi-precious stones (or possibly glass pieces) approximately the size of golf balls.
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At the end of the day we face our Maker alongside Jesus--ken
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Angloid
Shipmate
# 159
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Episcoterian:
Nothing fancy, nothing ethnic (for our faith transcends all ethnies).
Well quite. But a stole in itself is 'ethnic' in that it originates in a certain historic western culture. You can try to express the timelessness, the universality, of the faith by the simplicity of vesture but you can't escape it altogether. It's like using Latin as a 'universal' language: it might be less culture-bound than Scouse or Oxford English but it is not culture-free. And if it were possible to be so, wouldn't it deny the incarnation?
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Posts: 12927 | From: The Pool of Life | Registered: May 2001
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sebby
Shipmate
# 15147
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Balaam:
quote:
Originally posted by churchgeek:
I have a strong distaste for any vestments that are all about the person wearing them. Might as well save money and not wear vestments at all.
We've done that, which isn't a big move for our church which is so far down the candle as to be subterranean.
However a previous vicar had a plain black stole with 70s style Smile Jesus Loves You patches at the ends. And this was in the early 2000s. The reality was even worse than it sounds.
How did the churchwardens cope with people throwing up all the time?
Presumably something must be worn for weddings and funerals? If not I'd want my executors to ask for their money back. A plain scarf (official badges if a military chaplain of course) over a surplice would suffice.
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sebhyatt
Posts: 1340 | From: yorks | Registered: Sep 2009
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Angloid
Shipmate
# 159
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by sebby:
A plain scarf (official badges if a military chaplain of course)
Why 'of course'? The scarf/stole expresses the ministerial role; any badge is an irrelevant personal or institutional status symbol.
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Brian: You're all individuals!
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sebby
Shipmate
# 15147
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Posted
Because it is required of military chaplains as part of Queen's Regulations.
Silly little 'Jesus Loves You' slogans are just vomitacious slogans.
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sebhyatt
Posts: 1340 | From: yorks | Registered: Sep 2009
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balaam
Making an ass of myself
# 4543
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Posted
The stole got worse, when said vicar (name omitted to protect the guilty) was made a cathedral canon the Smile patches were replaced by official cathedral crests.
Not to be outdone the smile patches were sown on to the reverse of the stole, behind the cathedral crests. Even the suffragan bishop was overheard saying it was "Naff".
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Posts: 9049 | From: Hen Ogledd | Registered: May 2003
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sebby
Shipmate
# 15147
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Posted
Name and shame!
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sebhyatt
Posts: 1340 | From: yorks | Registered: Sep 2009
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balaam
Making an ass of myself
# 4543
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Posted
Sorry, that will remain my secret. I have nothing but admiration for this man, other than his taste in vestments.
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Posts: 9049 | From: Hen Ogledd | Registered: May 2003
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dj_ordinaire
Host
# 4643
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by sebby:
Because it is required of military chaplains as part of Queen's Regulations.
Really? It is actually mandated that these daft things be put on the tippet/scarf? I've never heard that one before!
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Flinging wide the gates...
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venbede
Shipmate
# 16669
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Angloid:
quote:
Originally posted by sebby:
A plain scarf (official badges if a military chaplain of course)
Why 'of course'? The scarf/stole expresses the ministerial role; any badge is an irrelevant personal or institutional status symbol.
That's exactly what I thought of when posters were criticising personalised vestments. S/he is there as a priest, not as an army officer.
I've known a priest and a reader wear red AIDS ribbons on scarfs and stoles, and though I'm sympathetic to the intention, it's not much better. (At least it doesn't advertise status.)
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sebby
Shipmate
# 15147
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by leo:
Better correct that slightly - he would say he holds to 'traditional teaching on sexual morality.'
He sounds particularly disgusting, both in his taste and in his prejudice.
Who is it?
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sebhyatt
Posts: 1340 | From: yorks | Registered: Sep 2009
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sebby
Shipmate
# 15147
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by venbede:
quote:
Originally posted by Angloid:
quote:
Originally posted by sebby:
A plain scarf (official badges if a military chaplain of course)
Why 'of course'? The scarf/stole expresses the ministerial role; any badge is an irrelevant personal or institutional status symbol.
That's exactly what I thought of when posters were criticising personalised vestments. S/he is there as a priest, not as an army officer.
I've known a priest and a reader wear red AIDS ribbons on scarfs and stoles, and though I'm sympathetic to the intention, it's not much better. (At least it doesn't advertise status.)
Historically a scarf is a vesture of dignity, not of ministerial status. It is not a stole.
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sebhyatt
Posts: 1340 | From: yorks | Registered: Sep 2009
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Angloid
Shipmate
# 159
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Posted
Agreed. But it functions as such when worn by the minister presiding at a eucharist or any other liturgical function. It is inappropriate that his/her representative role should be confused with status, secular employment, academic qualifications etc by such personal insignia as badges or hoods. It's slightly different if the minister concerned is simply 'in choir' along with others.
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Brian: You're all individuals!
Crowd: We're all individuals!
Lone voice: I'm not!
Posts: 12927 | From: The Pool of Life | Registered: May 2001
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Spiffy
Ship's WonderSheep
# 5267
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Posted
Back to the OP.... the one with the plastic daisies hotglued all over it.
And that was a deacon, so, dearest OP... DON'T.
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Posts: 10281 | From: Beervana | Registered: Dec 2003
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dj_ordinaire
Host
# 4643
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Posted
leo and sebby - I don't think is the right place for idle gossip, Dead Horses or anything of the like.
Thanks.
dj_ordinaire, Eccles host
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Flinging wide the gates...
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Zacchaeus
Shipmate
# 14454
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Posted
I have seen several preaching scarves, that individuals have felt the need to personalise with decorations, in the same way they have their stoles.
Bright rainbows and all sorts. NO NO NO scarves are black and unadorned, even the one with the pattern of mutliple crosses doesn't look right..
Posts: 1905 | From: the back of beyond | Registered: Jan 2009
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PD
Shipmate
# 12436
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Posted
It seems that my old rule about never wearing a vestment that draws too much attention to itself ain't a bad rule of thumb after all.
I think the most garish vestment I possess is a rather tall gold mitre with red orpreys that I wear on really important feasts. Otherwise towering mitres are not my sort of a thing. Actually under normal circumstances mitres are not my thing unless I am performing specifically Episcopal function - a visitation, a confirmation, or ordination. On home turf it is confined to Christmas, Epiphany, etc..
My stoles are all of a tasteful/bland description. They are of the 2-3" brocade bands with three crosses, one at the neck and one at each end description.
Tippets should be utterly plain. If cathedral chapters want to wear something they should invest themselves with almuces. In the form suggested by the Blessed Percy they should be grey silk with rounded ends lined with black (IIRC). Tippet badges always seem a little naff to me.
PD
[ 03. June 2012, 04:27: Message edited by: PD ]
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sebby
Shipmate
# 15147
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Angloid:
Agreed. But it functions as such when worn by the minister presiding at a eucharist or any other liturgical function. It is inappropriate that his/her representative role should be confused with status, secular employment, academic qualifications etc by such personal insignia as badges or hoods. It's slightly different if the minister concerned is simply 'in choir' along with others.
That may be desirable, but not entirely in accordance with the Canons of 1603.
The idea that the hood should be removed at the celebration of HC is a pious myth. For generations the hood was worn with the surplice at liturgical services, eucharistic or not.
A print of a celebration of the eucharist at the Margaret Street chapel (its original name) in the 19thC shows all three ministers wearing the hood over their surplices in the sanctuary during a eucharistic celebration. None are wearing the scarf.
The scarf was worn by canons, chaplains etc.
The correct vesture today for chaplains to HM the Queen is scarlet cassock, surplice, hood, scarf with INSIGNIA and bands. Bands interestingly are compulsory. Those not so dressed at an official function would be required to go back and change.
A couple of years ago some Scottish royal chaplains appeared merely in suits to an occasion (non-liturgical) when tradtionally cassock and bands are required. The Queen expressed her disapproval through the correct channels, and this has never happened again.
Similarly the insignia on military chaplains' scarves are REQUIRED. This is in Queen's Regs and enforced, regardless of denomination.
I saw recently the joining instructions for a new RAF chaplain. These were stated very plainly with an illustration of the scarf, where it was to be purchased, and an instruction that it was to be brought by the candidate on his very first day at RAF Cranwell.
One might prefer it otherwise, or regard it as less pretty, or not historically accurate for the role of the scarf, or whatever. However for certain clergy insignia is compulsory. This includes the Speaker's Chaplain who follows the dress regulations to the letter.
Purchasing such a scarf for a relative, I was amused to hear the assistant in Wippells remarking at how scruffy the clergy appeared these days - and adding a little obsequiesly 'but not in the Armed Services though sir'
However all three assistants in the shop spoke of their amazement at having to provide illutrations for the Forces new entrant chaplains as to what such basic items are.
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sebhyatt
Posts: 1340 | From: yorks | Registered: Sep 2009
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Angloid
Shipmate
# 159
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by sebby:
Similarly the insignia on military chaplains' scarves are REQUIRED. This is in Queen's Regs and enforced, regardless of denomination.
Including the RCs?
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sebby
Shipmate
# 15147
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Posted
Most certainly.
In the army RC chaplains wear a purple scarf, identical to the more usual black scarf apart from the colour. At each end there is the RAChD (Royal Army Chaplains' Department) badge.
I have seen this worn over a cotta, or even in some cases a cassock alb.
It has been seen on the TV at the Albert Hall for the Festival of Remembrance and other public occasions.
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sebhyatt
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sebby
Shipmate
# 15147
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Angloid:
quote:
Originally posted by sebby:
Similarly the insignia on military chaplains' scarves are REQUIRED. This is in Queen's Regs and enforced, regardless of denomination.
Including the RCs?
Additionally all chaplains are required to wear the medal ribbons to which they are entitled on the left side of the scarf (RC chaplains included), Each scarf has tiny loops above the ribbons (black for most, purple for RCs) in order to affix medals on stipulated occasions.
Only this very day I noticed a chaplain wear the Jubilee medal with her others on her scarf. The Queen's regs stated that it could not be worn until the 3rd June. For that date, entitled chaplains were to have had the ribbon added. Those not having done so would have been regarded as improperly dressed.
Queen's Regs for chaplains also require them to follow the intregity of their particular denomination. Thus Anglicans are quite at liberty to wear eucharistic vestments, as are RCs. Free Church clergy wear cassock and black gown.
The scarf is worn at all non-eucharistic services (or eucharistic for the low church). It is also worn over combats for services in theatres of war, repatriations etc. It is customary to fold the collar of the uniform over the yoke of the scarf. All chaplains of most denominations look the same (apart from RCs as theirs is purple - but worn the same way and on similar occasions)
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sebhyatt
Posts: 1340 | From: yorks | Registered: Sep 2009
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Enoch
Shipmate
# 14322
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Posted
Sebby, the military stuff is intriguing, as it's the sort of thing most of us never have any cause to know anything about.
Some queries:-
1. Do CofE military chaplains wear scarves or stoles to preside at Communion Services - assuming the main difference between them is that a scarf is always black, whereas a stole is something similar that changes colour according to the seasons?
2. If they elect to wear stoles, do the stoles also have to have insignia and medals on them?
3. Am I right in thinking the insignia is a regimental badge? If so, is it the same badge for all chaplains, the regimental badge for the unit with which they are posted, or three badges, one for each service?
4. Less so now, but one used quite often to see ordinary civilian clergy who had served in the Second World War, who carried on wearing military insignia on their scarves. Was this proper or not? Is it a bit like people who insist on calling themselves 'Major' or 'Commander' in civilian life?
5. In that respect is there a difference between clergy who were former chaplains, and clergy who were ordained after leaving the services, and who have their regimental badges, the name of their ship or their flight sewn onto their vestments?
6. Is the reason why the RC military scarf is a different colour because they will expect to hear confessions in the field?
7. Are there TA chaplains, and if so what rules cover them when they are doing TA?
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Enoch
Shipmate
# 14322
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Posted
7. Sorry, last question, I meant when they aren't doing TA, i.e. they are doing their day jobs as incumbent or whatever.
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sebby
Shipmate
# 15147
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Enoch:
Sebby, the military stuff is intriguing, as it's the sort of thing most of us never have any cause to know anything about.
Some queries:-
1. Do CofE military chaplains wear scarves or stoles to preside at Communion Services - assuming the main difference between them is that a scarf is always black, whereas a stole is something similar that changes colour according to the seasons?
2. If they elect to wear stoles, do the stoles also have to have insignia and medals on them?
3. Am I right in thinking the insignia is a regimental badge? If so, is it the same badge for all chaplains, the regimental badge for the unit with which they are posted, or three badges, one for each service?
4. Less so now, but one used quite often to see ordinary civilian clergy who had served in the Second World War, who carried on wearing military insignia on their scarves. Was this proper or not? Is it a bit like people who insist on calling themselves 'Major' or 'Commander' in civilian life?
5. In that respect is there a difference between clergy who were former chaplains, and clergy who were ordained after leaving the services, and who have their regimental badges, the name of their ship or their flight sewn onto their vestments?
6. Is the reason why the RC military scarf is a different colour because they will expect to hear confessions in the field?
7. Are there TA chaplains, and if so what rules cover them when they are doing TA?
1. Military chaplains may wear either a scarf or a stole or the full eucharistic vestments. A stole is not a coloured scarf, but a different item with 'sacerdotal' and sacramental significance. Some would wear this for the celebration of sacraments and never with medals or ribbons.
2. The badge is the RAChD badge and in the army the same for all chaplains. They do not wear the insignia of the regiment or battalion to which they are attached. They are strongly encouraged not to 'go green'. They are clergy first, and second..then army.
3. It is quite in order for a cleric to wear their medal ribbons on their scarf. If it has a badge at the bottom then they are/were serving chaplains. I remember seeing a WW2 Australian Air Force chaplain wearing his black scarf with ribbons and badges well into the early 1990s when he died. Similarly, I remember a local vicar wearing his MC (Military Cross) which he gained at the Somme. Medals (and their ribbons) are for life. It is personal choice for someone to wear them after serving; for serving military chaplains it is compulsory. A non-military cleric who has served as a (say) soldier may wear the ribbons and medals but not the badges.
4. Again, flight names or whatever (these are never used) are NEVER sewn onto vestments - only the SCARF, which is not technically a 'vestment'.
5. The RC cleric would (possibly) wear a stole to hear confessions in the field. The purple colour is just that chosen at some stage by the Principal RC Chaplain to the Forces and ratified by the Chaplain-General and the MoD.
6. There are many TA chaplains who fulfil a most needed ministry. The very name 'TA' is about to be abolished in favour of 'Reserve Forces' and, after their Sandhurst training, a civilian vicar (say) who is TA can be interchangeable in an army role as they would have had exactly the same training as an army padre. This would involve a generous absence from the parish to attend Amport followed by Sandhurst. The training has to be rigorous.
7. There are a number of TA chaplains serving at the moment in Afghanistan (as they did in Iraq) with great gallantry and in the most terrible conditions quite unknown to the British public. It is usual for the lead chaplain at the hospital at Camp Bastion to be TA. The role is so stressful that they do a half tour (three months) instead of the usual six or seven. It is also usual for the Bastion hospital chaplain to attend all operations at all hours of the day and night. If the patient dies, the medical staff stand aside and the chaplain comes forward. About 16 months ago there were so many casulties that the corridors of the hospital were full of wounded soldiers of all nationalities. The TA chaplain mininsters to them all, regardless of denomination or religion, or nationality, or which 'side' they were on. After the tour of duty and 'decompression' the TA chaplain would return to his parish.
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sebhyatt
Posts: 1340 | From: yorks | Registered: Sep 2009
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Enoch
Shipmate
# 14322
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Posted
Thank you Sebby. That was really helpful and interesting.
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Spike
Mostly Harmless
# 36
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Posted
The second part of Enoch's question was regarding what TA chaplains do in the context of their "day job". Would s/he be expected to wear military insignia on the scarf at normal (i.e non-military) church services?
[ 03. June 2012, 22:59: Message edited by: Spike ]
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"May you get to heaven before the devil knows you're dead" - Irish blessing
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+Chad
Staffordshire Lad
# 5645
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by dj_ordinaire:
quote:
Originally posted by sebby:
Because it is required of military chaplains as part of Queen's Regulations.
Really? It is actually mandated that these daft things be put on the tippet/scarf? I've never heard that one before!
Neither have I.
I was told that I should buy the regulation tippet to wear with choir dress when I joined the Department, but don't recall being told it was mandated in QRs.
Do you have a citation for that?
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Chad (The + is silent)
Where there is tea there is hope.
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Albertus
Shipmate
# 13356
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Posted
What about Chaplains RN, then, who are not AIUI technically required to wear uniform (or at least, have the privilege of wearing a clerical suit instead of a uniform)? Do they have to have 'uniform' additions to their robes?
And- going back to the OP- stoles with Olympic rings? Don't tell LOCOG or they'll send someone round with a pair of scissors to cut them off! (Could always have Visa / Coke logos instead: I don't think they'd have any objection to that.)
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Enoch
Shipmate
# 14322
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Albertus:
And- going back to the OP- stoles with Olympic rings? Don't tell LOCOG or they'll send someone round with a pair of scissors to cut them off! (Could always have Visa / Coke logos instead: I don't think they'd have any objection to that.)
If it would mean inspectors from LOCOG or Coca Cola being sent out to attend services to check this was not happening, one feels tempted to spread the rumour, that all over the country clergy are sticking these things on.
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Brexit wrexit - Sir Graham Watson
Posts: 7610 | From: Bristol UK(was European Green Capital 2015, now Ljubljana) | Registered: Nov 2008
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regulator reverend
Apprentice
# 16890
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Posted
Thanks for all of the replies. My stole for deacon ordination is very simple - plain white with crosses at either end and a neck cross. Although I have to say the thread has given me some ideas - smiley faces, pink triangles, visa symbols.....Maybe not, I'm not sure what our new bishop would make of any of those! ![[Big Grin]](biggrin.gif)
Posts: 9 | From: Hampshire | Registered: Jan 2012
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venbede
Shipmate
# 16669
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Posted
All the very best, rr.
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Man was made for joy and woe;
And when this we rightly know,
Thro' the world we safely go.
Posts: 3201 | From: An historic market town nestling in the folds of Surrey's rolling North Downs, | Registered: Sep 2011
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balaam
Making an ass of myself
# 4543
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by regulator reverend:
My stole for deacon ordination is very simple <snip> Although I have to say the thread has given me some ideas - smiley faces, pink triangles, visa symbols...
As you will be wearing it over on shoulder for a year how about the International Rescue symbol from Thunderbirds?
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Last ever sig ...
blog
Posts: 9049 | From: Hen Ogledd | Registered: May 2003
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sebby
Shipmate
# 15147
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by +Chad:
quote:
Originally posted by dj_ordinaire:
quote:
Originally posted by sebby:
Because it is required of military chaplains as part of Queen's Regulations.
Really? It is actually mandated that these daft things be put on the tippet/scarf? I've never heard that one before!
Neither have I.
I was told that I should buy the regulation tippet to wear with choir dress when I joined the Department, but don't recall being told it was mandated in QRs.
Do you have a citation for that?
Those 'daft' things that you so patronisingly (and I imagine quite offensively) dismiss are required as part of the RAChD dress regulations. In so far as dress regs are part of Queen's Reg, then they are.
I might be able to find someone who could find a citation, although whether they are, or are not is quite immaterial to the fact that the RAChD REQUIRES them and they are worn, one imagines, with pride. The dress regs are mandatory and endorced in the final instance by the dress regs committee which submits them finally to the commission appointed by the Crown for such things.
The bravery with which operational chaplains have enacted their faith, which I have witnessed personally, must be one of the jewpelks in the crown of the churches.
They have every reason to take pride in their corps badge.
When were you in Afghansitan +Chad?
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sebhyatt
Posts: 1340 | From: yorks | Registered: Sep 2009
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sebby
Shipmate
# 15147
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Spike:
The second part of Enoch's question was regarding what TA chaplains do in the context of their "day job". Would s/he be expected to wear military insignia on the scarf at normal (i.e non-military) church services?
That would be personal choice. There would one imagines be no requirment for a TA chaplain to wear them in a civilian context unless s/he wanted to.
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sebhyatt
Posts: 1340 | From: yorks | Registered: Sep 2009
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Zacchaeus
Shipmate
# 14454
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Posted
I know this is not a stole, but it is about vestments and to me to be it looked appalling and certainly something that I had never seen before.
The other week I was visiting a church and the celebrant wore a cassock alb which was embroidered around them hem and around the cuff, with a very deep pattern that must have been 6 inches deep. It was very beautifully, done but as I said I have never come across anything like it before.
It just looked so wrong or am I missing something?
Posts: 1905 | From: the back of beyond | Registered: Jan 2009
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The Scrumpmeister
Ship’s Taverner
# 5638
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Posted
This isn't a case of a bad stole but rather of stoles worn badly. In order to keep their stoles in place, many subdeacons make use of a safety pin at the intersection in front. Most of mine have a safety pin pinned into the lining when hanging up so as to have one at hand when needed.
Of necessity, this has to be fastened in place while the wearer is looking down at what he is doing. The problem comes when a subdeacon doesn't take account of this while he is fastening the pin in place so does not allow for the fact that, when he straightens up, the whole thing will pull up, giving him the appearance of wearing a bikini bra.
I've see this in photos and videos in the past but seem unable to find any examples just now.
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If Christ is not fully human, humankind is not fully saved. - St John of Saint-Denis
Posts: 14741 | From: Greater Manchester, UK | Registered: Mar 2004
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Amos
Shipmate
# 44
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Posted
Zaccheus--I've a lot of embroidered albs in Catholic churches in Bosnia and Croatia. Red embroidery. I've assumed it was a local custom. These weren't cass-albs, but I assume the principle is the same. What are your feelings about albs made mostly of lace?
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At the end of the day we face our Maker alongside Jesus--ken
Posts: 7667 | From: Summerisle | Registered: May 2001
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