Ship of Fools: prayer beads

Thread: prayer beads Board: Oblivion / Ship of Fools.

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Posted by St Deird (# 7631) on :

Does anyone here use prayer beads?

I've recently started using a set of Anglican prayer beads (four large beads - the "cruciforms" - and sets of seven beads - "weeks"), and was wondering if anyone else has found them helpful. What prayers do you tend to say when using them?

Posted by Fineline (# 12143) on :

I have rosary beads that some Carmelite nuns gave me when I went to visit them - I am discerning becoming a nun. I'm not Catholic, so I am not familiar with the prayers one is supposed to say with the rosary, other than Our Father, so I've been trying to find online resources and iPad apps to help me do it.

In theory, the concept of prayer beads really appeals to me - having something tangible to help you focus, to represent what you are praying for. So far, in practice, I haven't got very far with them. I don't like repeating the same prayer again and again, and then I get confused which bead I'm up to. And all the beads are the same size, whereas on the websites I find, different beads are apparently supposed to be different sizes.

But I find youtube videos of other people doing it and listen to them - and I find it quite peaceful to listen to. I think once I learn the prayers, I will find it a helpful way to pray - to put the beads in my pocket during the day, so I can be reminded of God and reminded to pray throughout the day. I like having tangible things to represent my prayers. Once on a retreat we had little coloured glass pebbles to represent our prayers, and I really liked that.

Posted by venbede (# 16669) on :

I use the rosary a lot. When I was in hospital and unable to say the office or other forms of prayer, it was lovely to be able to recite the rosary in bed morning and night. Or just to touch them.

Mary has come to play a very important part in my prayer life so I am delighted to use the traditional form. That will not be the case for everyone.

Orthodox repeat the Jesus Prayer using a prayer rope, with knots for each prayer.

Posted by crunt (# 1321) on :

quote:
Originally posted by St Deird:
What prayers do you tend to say when using them?

I have the same style of beads as St Deird.

My big one (the one I repeat most of all) is Julian of Norwich's "All shall be well" etc. I love the cadence and repetition of the words; I also love the hope that all shall indeed be well, but I am especially trying to be mindful that my idea of "WELL" is likely to differ from the universe's idea of "WELL", so I am trying to anticipate practising acceptance when I repeat this prayer.

I also repeat the Lord's Prayer, because I know it all the way through and because it is reputably the teaching of Jesus himself. I've tried including the prayer my mother (and the Sunday school teachers) called the doxology: "God be in my head, and in my understanding ..." etc., but it has never really gelled for me; maybe because I didn't know it "off by heart" before I brought it to the beads.

Another favourite rosary prayer of mine is the chorus from the Nick Cave song There is a Kingdom ("There is a kingdom / There is a king / And he lives without / And he lives within")

Posted by fletcher christian (# 13919) on :

I use the Jesus Prayer and find it good. I find the knotted prayer rope quite difficult to use as the knots tend to be quite small, so I use a chotki instead. I'd read a few good books on it before starting to use it regularly.

Posted by Indifferently (# 17517) on :

I certainly don't.

Posted by Indifferently (# 17517) on :

The Rosary is intended for people who cannot read. Even the monks pray the psalms instead. I have seen no rubrics in the Prayer Book directing the use of beads.

Posted by Angloid (# 159) on :

I'm indifferent about such matters.

Posted by Ariel (# 58) on :

I was given a set of small white rosary beads as a First Communion present, which were suitable for a child's fingers and which I liked very much, until the beads broke. Years later I bought another rosary at the gift shop of Westminster Cathedral. It's made of plain, unpolished wood by a monastic order in Jerusalem, using local wood.

You can get rosary bracelets as well. These have five, or 10 small beads and one large one, and originate from the days when Catholicism was banned and anyone retaining the True Faith™ needed to be careful. These days the bracelets have a little more to them, like a tiny crucifix, but originally all they had was just the beads and looked like, as it might be, just a nice pearl bracelet.

quote:
From Fineline: I'm not Catholic, so I am not familiar with the prayers one is supposed to say with the rosary, other than Our Father, so I've been trying to find online resources and iPad apps to help me do it.

You want the Apostles Creed, followed by one Our Father, three Hail Marys and a Glory Be. You then do the Mysteries of the day, which each have one Our Father, ten Hail Marys, a Glory Be, and finish off with the Hail Holy Queen. I haven't got round to including the Fatima Prayer myself.

quote:
From Indifferently:
The Rosary is intended for people who cannot read. Even the monks pray the psalms instead.

Not true on either count, actually. Though I suppose some people have memorized the Mysteries that go with them. And I have seen priests, monks and friars using the Rosary. Also there are set times in one of the local churches when you can go to say it, in company with others, led by a priest. The Mysteries are beautiful and food for thought; I'd recommend them as a focus for contemplation.

Posted by Hezekiah (# 17157) on :

My rosary was given to me by a monk in a monastery in the Westcountry. I like to use it when walking the dog, with the rosary in my coat pocket. Funnily enough, when walking through the fields I quite often pass an old lady doing just the same!

I find it a very 'easy' way to give otherwise wasted time to prayer.

Posted by leo (# 1458) on :

quote:
Originally posted by Indifferently:
The Rosary is intended for people who cannot read.

And those of us who don't want to read while we are meditating. We want to clear our heads of words, not have more words.

Posted by Fineline (# 12143) on :

quote:
Originally posted by Ariel:

quote:
From Fineline: I'm not Catholic, so I am not familiar with the prayers one is supposed to say with the rosary, other than Our Father, so I've been trying to find online resources and iPad apps to help me do it.
You want the Apostles Creed, followed by one Our Father, three Hail Marys and a Glory Be. You then do the Mysteries of the day, which each have one Our Father, ten Hail Marys, a Glory Be, and finish off with the Hail Holy Queen. I haven't got round to including the Fatima Prayer myself.

Ah yes, the websites tell me to do that too. My difficulty is more that I don't have any of these prayers memorised, other than 'Our Father', so it feels fiddly to be reading the prayers, and then reading what I have to do next. I just have to memorise the different prayers, so that it becomes more natural, rather than me looking up what I have to pray. Listening to them on youtube helps. And I need to do it more often - I've only done it a couple of times so far. I think I will find it very helpful once I am familiar with it - I like using different senses to pray, rather than just shutting my eyes and praying words in my head. Another way I pray is to write down my prayers - well, I type them on my laptop. This helps me formulate my prayers and focus on them.

Posted by ElaineC (# 12244) on :

This is the site where I first came across Anglican prayer beads. There are lots of suggestions for prayers to use with them.

I haven't got on with them although I've tried a couple of times. I don't have the patience or persistence.

Posted by Graven Image (# 8755) on :

I say the traditional rosary. I learned it at an Episcopal church that I attended that had a rosary group made up of Episcopal and Roman Catholic women who met once a week. I am no longer living near that church but I continue to say the rosary. I find it quiets my mind and prepares me to listen to what God may be trying to tell me.

Posted by Jengie Jon (# 273) on :

I do use prayer beads but in a huge variety of ways. The most common one is I use them to "count" the Jesus prayer. I am using quotation marks as I would have no idea at the end how many I had done but I move a bead through my fingers each time I say a prayer and for some reason that helps me to keep going. The beads are part of a bracelet bought from Marks and Spencers.

I also use it for a nine bead meditation creed although I do three Jesus Prayers each side of it. The beads are:

God the creator
God the incarnate
God the source of faith
God the sustainer of Creation
God the saviour
God the sustainer of faith
God the Judge of all creation
God the risen and ascended Lord
God the advocate for humanity

I suspect if I had the time I might be able to work into 12 rather than 9 but 9 suits the time I have to pray it.

Finally I have a loop with 144 beads on it and a path in. This goes with a set of readings and verses and there are three rounds. One takes you through the OT, one through the Gospels and one through the epistles. I suspect the main advantage to me was in creating it as I have never got more than once round.

Jengie

Posted by Enoch (# 14322) on :

Prayer beads or a rope aren't an end in themselves. They are a way of settling your heart and mind, centring, so that you can pray more regularly. They give you something to pray that isn't dependent on you.

As they are Anglican prayer beads, and sound like the ones on the website that ElaineC has provided a link to, a good starting point has to be, to submit to and follow one of the disciplines on the site.

Nevertheless, I would regard it as almost impossible to say how valuable I have found The Way of the Pilgrim and The pilgrim continues on his way. I think they are wonderful books.

Posted by mousethief (# 953) on :

FC, what's the difference between a chotki and a knotted prayer rope? I thought a chotki just was a knotted prayer rope?

[Confused]

Posted by fletcher christian (# 13919) on :

Prayer rope
and
Chotki

I'm sure your quite right though. I'm likely using the word incorrectly to describe the wooden version of the prayer rope, but was only going by what the ortho shack said that gave it to me (they called the rope version a kombiskini). I also have a stone one called a ladanka, but I think that word may be referring to the little silver shrine on the end of it rather than to the collection of beads.

[ 24. June 2013, 08:17: Message edited by: fletcher christian ]

Posted by Vade Mecum (# 17688) on :

quote:
Originally posted by Indifferently:
The Rosary is intended for people who cannot read. Even the monks pray the psalms instead. I have seen no rubrics in the Prayer Book directing the use of beads.

Indifferently, there is no reason that there would be a rubric in the BCP (or anywhere else) about rosaries: the BCP delineates (and not wholly any longer) the "Common" prayer of a congregation gathered for worship. Rosaries, being items of private piety, are obviously not included. Nor, for that matter, are many other forms of private devotion, like +Cosin's pious ejaculations, or even use of the paternoster outside of the church. This doesn't mean that they are thus forbidden. The prayer book didn't and doesn't seek to prescribe all aspects of the practice of faith, and it is abomination to attempt to foist that role upon it.

Personally I find the rosary a welcome tool for relaxing an otherwise fraught mind when overwhelmed with things to "think" about: like walking, it allows much of the mind to be occupied with rote tasks, leaving the rest free to dwell (ideally) on the mysteries.

I bought my first rosary when still mildly peturbed by the marian implications, and under horror of the (too often kitsch) sacred heart junction, opted for a S. Benedict medal instead. I use both the ave maria and other prayers, like the Kyrie or the Jesus prayer, and vary the invocatory prayers as appropriate - there are some lovely ones in +Cosin's private devotions.

Posted by Anselmina (# 3032) on :

Not a rosary, but certainly prayer beads.

In some parts of the Church of Ireland the Pearls of Life have become very popular as teaching/gifts for confirmands. For a few years now our Bishop has been using them in his confirmation day preparation with the diocese's young people.

They make an interesting contrast/addition to the current youth trend of bracelets with little images of the saints on them like this .

I bought a little brown saints bracelet the other day to have a look at what the fuss was about. But my dog ate it. Lurchers must be iconoclasts!

Posted by Heavenly Anarchist (# 13313) on :

I am currently exploring ways in which to enrich my prayer time and am looking with interest on this thread. The pearls of life beads appeal to me, as I can see how I can use them as an aid to focus my thoughts and prayers and aid meditation. As I don't have a liturgical background (I attend an NFI church) I have few traditional prayers on which to draw but this thread has prompted me to look further into using prayer beads (and enhance my book collection) so thank you.

Posted by *Leon* (# 3377) on :

When I'm meditating on a repetitive phrase on my own, I find it somehow more satisfactory to time the meditation using beads than using a clock. Obviously this only works if I am on my own and don't care exactly how long it's going to take (e.g. I don't have a train to catch shortly afterwards) since it isn't very precise.

I use a Russian prayer rope; I bought one originally because I was once experimenting with the Jesus prayer. I then lost it and got another one, because I'd got used to knots rather than beads, despite no longer doing a particularly 'Russian' practice.

Posted by mousethief (# 953) on :

quote:
Originally posted by fletcher christian:
Prayer rope
and
Chotki

Interesting. Orthodox Wiki equates the two. This page (an online store) says:

quote:
Ever since Saint Anthony The Great has invented the Orthodox prayer rope it has been in use in Orthodox religion and prayer. Every Orthodox country has its own name for the prayer rope. For instance in Russia and neighboring countries its called a chotki. In Greece people call these prayer rope komboskini or komboloi, the first being the dominant form. Serbia, Montenegro and Macedonia call it brojanica and in Romania its called a matanii.

Posted by fletcher christian (# 13919) on :

I just prefer the bead type for practicality sake. I've found that the rope types have knots too small and too close together for me to use - my fingers are too large to feel each individual knot and becomes more of a distraction than an aid; although I do have one rope that I was able to stretch so I can feel the knots easier.

Posted by mousethief (# 953) on :

quote:
Originally posted by fletcher christian:
I just prefer the bead type for practicality sake. I've found that the rope types have knots too small and too close together for me to use - my fingers are too large to feel each individual knot and becomes more of a distraction than an aid; although I do have one rope that I was able to stretch so I can feel the knots easier.

Yes the knots are usually too close for my fumbling fingers. I once wrote a satire story about an inventor who created the microchotki, in which the knots were so smooth you couldn't feel any of them. He couldn't figure out why it wasn't selling.

Posted by Deputy Verger (# 15876) on :

I'm different (as opposed to indifferent?). I do have a couple of sets of traditional rosary beads, included one delightful wonky purple one with four tens and a nine! I also have a lovely ten-beads-and-a-cross bracelet from the Phillippines. But I rarely have them with me, and I DO pray an abbreviated version of the rosary quite a lot, especially when I am under particular duress. I just use my fingers to count ten Hail Marys and then an Our Father. I only do the Mysteries when I am someplace where it's being led.

FWIW, at the risk of setting the cat amongst the pigeons, I do think Mother Mary has come to my rescue when I had thought things were beyond redemption! [Angel]

Posted by ArachnidinElmet (# 17346) on :

An abbreviated rosary is my go-to emergency prayer, with or without beads, but easier with. I used to carry a set around with me, as a reminder if nothing else.

Posted by Hebdom (# 14685) on :

I use a woollen prayer rope, bought from an Orthodox church shop. I say the Jesus prayer on the small knots and the Trisagion on the large knots. In addition to its use as an aid to prayer, sometimes if I awake during the night I use the rhythm of the prayers to help me fall asleep again. Wikipedia Trisagion page

Posted by angelica37 (# 8478) on :

I had a Rosary for First Communion and we used to say the Rosary in class sometimes at primary school, (I still remember drawing and colouring the pictures) Then I put it away with childish things, went to a non Catholic High school and was inclined to dismiss it as old fashioned and pointless.
I teach Catechism once a week and the Rosary features on occasion and it sort of drifted into my life again, I bought an olive wood Rosary which I keep in my bedroom and I find it helps on those nights when things just go round in your head and stop you sleeping. I use the traditional prayers, Our Father, Hail Mary and Glory Be and usually fall asleep before finishing more than a couple of decades.

Posted by venbede (# 16669) on :

A practical point.

Most rosaries are beads linked together by hooks. I've found the wire comes undone. It is particularly distracting to be saying the rosary and find the next bead is missing, as it is on the end of a line rather in a circle.

I bought a rosary held together with string and knots. That's the one I always use now out of the house.

Posted by venbede (# 16669) on :

quote:
Originally posted by Deputy Verger:
FWIW, at the risk of setting the cat amongst the pigeons, I do think Mother Mary has come to my rescue when I had thought things were beyond redemption!

Posted by Jade Constable (# 17175) on :

My fellow Marian-inclined Anglicans might like this !

BCP? In my rosary? I'm not Indifferent to it [Two face]

Posted by PD (# 12436) on :

I have a Rosary in my overcoat pocket which is a useful stress buster when I need to prayer, but I have brain frizz, and need to focus. On the other hand, it is normally something I would run from, but not screaming.

PD

Posted by Olaf (# 11804) on :

quote:
Originally posted by Jade Constable:
My fellow Marian-inclined Anglicans might like this !

BCP? In my rosary? I'm not Indifferent to it

It's pretty much the Angelus. I'm wondering what the point is. Were I a Marian-inclined Anglican, I'd probably just use the Dominican rosary, like most Catholics do when they pray the rosary.

Posted by Olaf (# 11804) on :

Having reread my post, it comes off more critical than I meant it. I blame the internet. I do like the Marian option for the smaller Anglican prayer beads, and it seems to make logical sense. I'm still wondering what prompted its creation.

Posted by Galilit (# 16470) on :

I have a black woolly knotty bracelet one with a single red bead which I got from a site someone recommended here (chotki-dot-com, iirc).

I stretched it out quite a lot so it can go on my wrist. It has got wet in the shower sometimes by mistake but survives if I wear it till it dries out completely. Its favourite shampoo's are Gliss Moroccan Oil and coconut or the Body Shop Rain-forest one.

I use my chotki daily in the early morning for 20 min = 200 and some repetitions. I get up, drink my lemon-water, do my stretching exercises, take my meds... then pray.

Met. Kallistos Ware has a very nice YouTube lecture on it.

I find it meditative and it clears my Wordy Mind nicely. And if I don't do any more serious praying during the day, well, at least something has been said.

Posted by Oblatus (# 6278) on :

quote:
Originally posted by Olaf:
It's pretty much the Angelus. I'm wondering what the point is. Were I a Marian-inclined Anglican, I'd probably just use the Dominican rosary, like most Catholics do when they pray the rosary.

It's one of the better schemes for using the Anglican Rosary. The ones I don't find attractive are those that depend on a booklet for the whole thing, where the prayers on the cruciform beads are four different texts, and each of the seven "week" beads gets its own verse of something. So unless you take up the chore of memorizing it all (perhaps worthwhile), the beads become rather pointless. Might as well just pray the devotion from the booklet. Nothing wrong with it, but it doesn't seem to "get" the idea that the beads are for counting memorized repeated bits.

Posted by Olaf (# 11804) on :

quote:
Originally posted by Oblatus:

quote:
Originally posted by Olaf:
It's pretty much the Angelus. I'm wondering what the point is. Were I a Marian-inclined Anglican, I'd probably just use the Dominican rosary, like most Catholics do when they pray the rosary.
It's one of the better schemes for using the Anglican Rosary. The ones I don't find attractive are those that depend on a booklet for the whole thing, where the prayers on the cruciform beads are four different texts, and each of the seven "week" beads gets its own verse of something. So unless you take up the chore of memorizing it all (perhaps worthwhile), the beads become rather pointless. Might as well just pray the devotion from the booklet. Nothing wrong with it, but it doesn't seem to "get" the idea that the beads are for counting memorized repeated bits.

Thank you. The issue of memory is something I hadn't really considered. I've been stuck with using pamphlets for Anglican prayer beads, and it does prevent me from using them more often. The Angelus is something I remember from my time in Catholic school. (I tend to be much more open to matters Marian and sanctoral than most of my fellow Lutherans.)

Unfortunately the Dominican chaplet is a bit long for my taste. I'm sure I could increase my stamina with repeated use, but the Anglican beads fit the purpose well. Thus, I take every chance I can to learn more about them.

Posted by PaulBC (# 13712) on :

I use the Anglican rosary at the end of the morning office. I came to use this aid to prayer long after my mkothers heart attack. You ask whats the relation ? Well while she was in surgery I could have used having something to keep focus on while awaiting news. Well after she passed on I decided that it might be a good idea to get a rosary and use it. And I have and I find it useful in focusing my thoughts. blessings PaulBC

Posted by PD (# 12436) on :

I should perhaps add that inspite of using a rosary from time to time to control my overactive brain so I can pray, my usual attitude is along the lines of a little ditty sung to the tune of 'O give me a home where the buffalo roam.' I associate it with "Futba."

O give me a home
Where there's No Pope of Rome,
And no Chapel to spoil the view
Where there's no nuns and priests
And no Rosary beads,
And its always the 12th of July.

Though I lean High Church, I am not noted for liking things too overtly Roman.

PD

Posted by Pearl B4 Swine (# 11451) on :

What's the 12th of July?

Posted by PD (# 12436) on :

The anniversary of the Battle of the Boyne (12/7/1690 O.S.) and therefore the day for Orange Marches in Ulster. Due to the OS-NS Calendar glitch it is also the anniversary of the Battle of Aughrim (1-7-1691 O.S.) which was the final major batte of the Williamite Wars.

Being an Anglican, I rather enjoy the irony of the fact that the news of the great Protestant victory at The Boyne was herald with a solemn Te Deum in the Vatican. However, do not tell Mr Paisley that!

PD

Posted by Pearl B4 Swine (# 11451) on :

Thanks, PD. I bet I wasn't the only one not to know that. The 'little ditty' made me LOL.
Pearlie: Anglo-rosary maker.

Posted by Quam Dilecta (# 12541) on :

By making the task of counting automatic, beads make it easier for me to concentrate on the prayers and meditations. I have also found that fingering the beads, which occupies my sense of touch, somehow makes sights and sounds less distracting.

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