Ship of Fools: Should professionals be afraid of their cients?

Thread: Should professionals be afraid of their cients? Board: Oblivion / Ship of Fools.

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Posted by no prophet (# 15560) on :

Are we a more complaint driven society? Do people feel more entitled to complain today? Our statistics suggest more complaints to professional regulatory authorities where I live, due to changes in the regulations and legal acts, which make complaints ever easier to lay.

Having had nearly 20 years of practice myself without complaint and then 6 complaints in 8 years, I really wonder what's going on. My office now systematically rates risk from clients and refuses services based on our perceived risk. The rating includes gut assessment of personality and whether they are involved in or ever have been in any form of litigation.

I will say that as a professional, complaints are the most stressful thing possible. They are like being criminally charged with something, and even if they are resolved in your favour like mine all have been, they cause a form of post-trauma stress syndrome. My data base is myself and a half dozen others who've also had complaints.

I'd be interested in knowing if professionals are afraid of the clients, and also from those who've complained about professional services.

Posted by iamchristianhearmeroar (# 15483) on :

Should professionals be afraid of their clients - no. Are they - often.

I'm in professional (legal) services, and I'm not afraid of my clients, but then I'm not an equity partner. I'm more apprehensive of the equity partner for whom I work, who is himself probably afraid of some of our clients.

That having been said, I've encountered very few complaints about quality of work. Complaints have almost always been about billing, and usually from clients who waste our time (and end up paying for it).

That is the one thing I will say for my experience working in legal services - it is absolutely money obsessed. The partners are obsessed with making it, and making more of it (for them), and the clients are obsessed with spending as little of it as possible.

Posted by CL (# 16145) on :

In a just world, no. In the world we have, absolutely.

Posted by would love to belong (# 16747) on :

quote:
Originally posted by iamchristianhearmeroar:
That is the one thing I will say for my experience working in legal services - it is absolutely money obsessed. The partners are obsessed with making it, and making more of it (for them), and the clients are obsessed with spending as little of it as possible.

That's why I no longer work in legal services.

Posted by ExclamationMark (# 14715) on :

Not afraid, simply respectful. It's a consumer society - some wanted it, we've all got it. It means the focus (for many) is on me and my needs. The result? If delivery doesn't match expectation then people will complain: they won't be fobbed off any longer by "professionals" who try to hide behind position and title.

Whether the complaint is just depends on circumstances.

The thing I find amazing is not that there are professionals who are being sued, but that it took so long to kick off. Not so much a question of why so much now but of why so little before? I've seen some horrendous stuff done in various sectors, yet no one batted an eyelid - because so few really cared about the people they dealt with.

Posted by Gwalchmai (# 17802) on :

The trick is to try and spot the potential complainers at the outset and decline to take on their business. More often than not they are the people who knock you down on price and then complain they are not getting champagne when they have only paid for beer. Unfortunately in the legal profession in England our regulator expects us to provide a champagne service for beer prices. To preserve my sanity I keep a compliments file next to my complaints file - and the compliments file is much the bigger file.

It would be interesting to know if any of the clergy feel the same way about some of their parishoiners.

Posted by ExclamationMark (# 14715) on :

quote:
Originally posted by Gwalchmai:
It would be interesting to know if any of the clergy feel the same way about some of their parishoiners.

It isn't always easy to spot the people in church who are likely to create waves. Often, they've done it for years and are adept at covering their tracks: they often use others to fire a gun where they load the bullets.

The thing I bear in mind is that I can't expect any support from the denomination: they run for the hills when these things happen and arguably they should do so in cases where they (denomination) place people in known trouble spots without warning. That's why it's vital to be in a union - you have at least got access to legal advice if necessary. Denominational structures and support are woeful - the hierarchy have split loyalties in any event, to congregations and to ministers.

It's important though to keep a perspective on things. Is the complaint about practice, preference or principles? Very rarely the latter, usually the 1st time and usually over changes. It's also entirely possible that we aren't entirely innocent either - so bear that in mind too. It does help to clarify things up front - that's why lawyers use terms of engagement - but we ministers don't have that opportunity as such.

We are a more complaining society. I'm torn about this - having worked 30 + years ago in the finance world there were a lot of abuses that went unchecked and a lot of impact on customers/clients that sometimes came from arrogance of "professionals." In those days, complaints against solicitors were often rejected out of hand, even answered in some circumstances with a writ (shades of Maxwell). No one wants to go back to those days when no one dared complain yet somehow we all want to move away from the whinge at all costs mentality today. Mind you it is annoying when people promise to do things then don't do them -- and that would always be grounds for complaint in my book.

Posted by The Midge (# 2398) on :

Lawyers must share the blame for the ambulance chasing culture. They created it.

Posted by bib (# 13074) on :

I had a very upsetting incident with one of my patients who didn't like the advice he was given. He threatened me with a fist in my face a said 'I know where you live'. For some months after this he stalked me and I would find him appearing in the supermarket and in the front row at church etc. I was very alarmed, but my policeman son in law advised me not to take out an AVO as his experience was that such action can inflame the situation. The hospital blackbanned him from our department unless security was present. He actually lodged a complaint about me to the medical complaints tribunal but thankfully he wasn't successful. I found the whole incident very confronting a frightening a have always worn a duress alarm since in case of repeats. I think i had reason to be afraid of this person.

Posted by Plique-à-jour (# 17717) on :

The complaint culture has flourished because it's the only way left for many people to make their voices heard. Socialism has gone, and no electable party represents their interests, so resentment rises.

Posted by Mere Nick (# 11827) on :

I imagine this guy gets scared on a regular basis, especially if Walter White shows up for a meeting.

Posted by mertide (# 4500) on :

There's the two types of patients you need to be wary of, the ones who hate you and the ones who love you too much.

Posted by Squirrel (# 3040) on :

I'm a social worker here in New York, and was advised by a seasoned pro that most malpractice complaints filed against our profession are for ethical violations, not for stuff we did "wrong." The two major causes of complaints he knew about were:

a. Hanky-panky with clients
b. Breeches of confidentiality.

Of course, any vindictive person can dream up a complaint for just about everything, but most of these get thrown out by regulatory agencies and the courts.

Posted by ken (# 2460) on :

What's the difference between an "ethical violation" and "stuff you do wrong"?

Surely ethical violations are by definition wrong?

Posted by Honest Ron Bacardi (# 38) on :

quote:
The two major causes of complaints he knew about were:

a. Hanky-panky with clients
b. Breeches of confidentiality.

The Breeches of Confidentiality could be useful to anyone taking the Suppository of Wisdom.

Posted by Pottage (# 9529) on :

I interpreted the distinction as between the professional (a) doing the work badly or not at all, and (b) doing the job to an acceptable standard but breaching the standards of ethical conduct applicable.

The distinction applies in my context also (commercial legal services). I think that more lawyers get into dispute with their clients and their professional regulators for failing to keep the client up to speed or not being open and transparent on costs than for giving fundamentally wrong advice or making some glaring procedural mistake.

Posted by Heavenly Anarchist (# 13313) on :

In nursing most complaints made are caused by lack of communication; an honest apology goes a long way to resolving conflict and regular updates (and cups of tea) make an outpatients department run far more smoothly. I did my mock exam on communication in nursing (20 odd years ago!) and the statistics were something like 90 per cent of hospital complaints related to lack of communication. That's not to say more serious ones didn't occur, my first client as a shop steward was a nurse accused of sexually assaulting a patient. Patients do complain about care but usually what they want is an apology not a payout.
I've been out of nursing for about 6 years but I don't think I noticed much difference in complaints then.

Posted by Heavenly Anarchist (# 13313) on :

quote:
Originally posted by bib:
I had a very upsetting incident with one of my patients who didn't like the advice he was given. He threatened me with a fist in my face a said 'I know where you live'. For some months after this he stalked me and I would find him appearing in the supermarket and in the front row at church etc. I was very alarmed, but my policeman son in law advised me not to take out an AVO as his experience was that such action can inflame the situation. The hospital blackbanned him from our department unless security was present. He actually lodged a complaint about me to the medical complaints tribunal but thankfully he wasn't successful. I found the whole incident very confronting a frightening a have always worn a duress alarm since in case of repeats. I think i had reason to be afraid of this person.

That must have been terrifying for you. I was lucky to work in a field where assaults and threats are few (I've only been manhandled twice and threatened once, though I've dealt with many aggressive patients in clinic) but have friends in mental health who experienced several assaults. One patient was struck of the list by the consultant for being aggressive towards me though.

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