Ship of Fools: Can someone lend me some pliers?

Thread: Can someone lend me some pliers? Board: Oblivion / Ship of Fools.

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Posted by chive (# 208) on :

I have toothache. Not slightly irritating toothache, not a wee nagging pain. Toothache from the bowels of hell that has now kept me awake since Thursday.

I've had this toothache since August. The tooth needs to come out. Because of my madness this needs to be done under sedation. The current waiting list for this to be done on the NHS is six fucking months. Oh sorry no, that's not the waiting list for my tooth to be removed, that's the waiting list to discuss removing it. After that I go on a waiting list for it to actually happen. That waiting list is of unknown length.

Today I've been to the emergency dentist yet again and I'm now on my fifth course of antibiotics since August. I'm entirely sure they will make everything better because the other four courses worked so damn well. I thought the use of antibiotics was meant to be being reduced but no, just hand them out and she might go away without us having to do anything bloody useful that might make her actually better. And antibiotics give me the fucking skitters.

I contacted a private dentist who did sedation. They said it would cost £500. I thought that was a shit load of money but compared with the shit load of pain I'm in, I'd happily pay for it. But no, because of the tablets I'm on for the mental they can't do it. And they charged me £28 to tell me that.

The toothache is literally driving me insane. Months and months of waking up every night in pain, that is the nights I actually get to sleep in the first place. Months of having to be careful what I eat. Months of being a stroppy cow because I hurt so fucking much.

I still don't even have a date to discuss the sedation let alone to get my tooth out. I need to get rid of this fucker which is destroying my life. I need someone to pop round, twat me on the head with a hammer, and get out the pliers. I can't wait God knows how many more months before I get rid of it.

I love the NHS. They are entirely a good thing but NHS dentistry can fuck themselves backwards with a trombone for their fucking uselessness.

Posted by Arethosemyfeet (# 17047) on :

The main problem with NHS dentistry is that it's not NHS enough. We need publically employed dentists and national planning of dentist numbers, same as we do doctors. I'm glad to be north of the border, the situation is slightly better here.

Posted by QLib (# 43) on :

When my children were still children, our dentist went private. We got a charming letter stating that they would see children whatever the decision but implying that the children of people who joined the relevant dental health insurance scheme might be seen more promptly.

At the time, I had quite a few colleagues who were going through apparent agonies on the NHS scheme which they were still having to pay for and pay quite a lot. I totted up what colleagues were paying for NHS treatment and compared it with the cost of the private plan. The private plan came out as well worth it, perhaps because I have relatively good teeth. So I paid up.

But this isn't privatisation by the back door, it's privatisation by the trashy cod neo-classical front door, complete with doric columns and a twee carriage light. And the same now with Opticians. I fucking hate what successive governments have done to the NHS - it sickens me. [Mad]

Posted by quetzalcoatl (# 16740) on :

Yes, my dentist went private, and I have good teeth, so I haven't been too much under the cosh. But the NHS dentists in my area seem quite good, by all accounts.

But last time I broke a tooth - £800 for a crown!

Wow, Chive, this sounds a terrible situation. I'm trying to think of a solution.

Posted by North East Quine (# 13049) on :

I'm north of the border, and have a friend in a similar situation. Ideally, she'd like a full anesthetic, but there's a two year waiting list for that.

They can't extract the tooth while it's infected, so they have to co-ordinate the anti-biotics to clear up the infection with the available slots for sedation. She's currently on her fourth lot of anti-biotics since the start of September. She has an appointment this week, but if there's any infection they can't extract it (though she also needs fillings, and they will be able to do those under sedation.) Anyway, she has three different appointments booked, in the hope that one will co-ordinate with her tooth being infection free.

She thought the nine week wait for the appointment to discuss sedation, then three weeks till the first of her three appointments was bad enough, but six months just to discuss it?

My kids (aged 19 and 17, both in full time education) are free on the NHS. I'm £24 for my six monthly check up, and was £210 all told for three appointments which included anti-biotics and root canal. I love my dentist.

(My dentist Lisa [Axe murder]

)

Posted by no prophet (# 15560) on :

Did not realize the NHS includes dentistry. In Canada, dentists are all private, with the lucky people those whose work-based insurance pays it or part of it. If I recall correctly it was close to $4,000 for one of my kid's difficult wisdom teeth with the sleepy time. So sympathy for the pain, but none for the costs.

Posted by Not (# 2166) on :

Chive, do you live anywhere near a dental school? They can often offer quicker, and free treatment from students who are very well supervised by expert dental surgeons. I know the thought of putting yourself in the hands of a student is daunting but because of the level of supervision the standards are actually very high. Worth a thought.

Much sympathy. Cx

Posted by Lyda*Rose (# 4544) on :

quote:
Originally posted by no prophet:
Did not realize the NHS includes dentistry. In Canada, dentists are all private, with the lucky people those whose work-based insurance pays it or part of it. If I recall correctly it was close to $4,000 for one of my kid's difficult wisdom teeth with the sleepy time. So sympathy for the pain, but none for the costs.

Just because you are in same boat payment-wise, you can't find sympathy for her predicament? [Disappointed]

Very, very sorry, Chive. I couldn't imagine months of such pain. Weeks of it was hard enough for me. [Votive]

Posted by LeRoc (# 3216) on :

I don't know how the system works, but couldn't you cross a border somewhere? Scotland has already been mentioned, there's Ireland and there must be private clincs in countries like Belgium or the Netherlands where people speak English.

Posted by Alicïa (# 7668) on :

Seems to me you should have a word with your doctor, Chive. The NHS has a duty of care towards you and it's not entirely unheard of to have a tooth removed in a hospital. (I have done so myself on one occasion)

Alternatively they may be able to change your medication if that is the thing that is reducing your options.

I feel for you though, toothache is horribly debilitating and that's why I think a doctor should know about this, especially if the dentist route is becoming problematic as it is.

[ 01. December 2013, 16:08: Message edited by: Alicïa ]

Posted by chive (# 208) on :

I now need to add to the joy I'm experiencing. Started taking antibiotic then oh fuck, breathing problems, itchiness etc etc. Spent the last couple hours at the local hospital where it appears that, due to the large amounts of penicillin I have consumed over the last wee while, I have now developed a quite serious allergy to it. So now no antibiotics but shit loads of antihistamines and steroids.

So now I have horrible pain, no sleep, breathing shitty (although better than it was) and I itch like I've been squatted by an extended family of fleas. And I still have no date to get my fucking teeth out.

I swear it would be cheaper for them to just fucking do it as opposed to having to sort out the fucking shite they've failed to do so far.

I'm going to Scotland on holiday next month and I'm already googling dentists to see if I can find one that will work things out.

I blame the tories, and labour, and frankly everyone in the fucking world because I am now officially in a BAD MOOD.

Posted by Anglican't (# 15292) on :

quote:
Originally posted by Arethosemyfeet:
The main problem with NHS dentistry is that it's not NHS enough. We need publically employed dentists and national planning of dentist numbers.

What would nationally-planned dentistry look like? When you've finished your check up would the dentist hand you a vase so you can rinse your mouth out?

Hope the pain clears up soon, Chive.

[ 01. December 2013, 17:07: Message edited by: Anglican't ]

Posted by comet (# 10353) on :

Remember, Hellions - no giving out (and no taking) medical advice from or to Shipmates.

Fuck that shit, Chive. hang in there, girl. I hope they figure it out quick. tooth pain is the worst.

comet
Hellhost

Posted by mdijon (# 8520) on :

quote:
Originally posted by no prophet:
So sympathy for the pain, but none for the costs.

You have very weird sympathy circuits. They seem unimaginative and rather narcissistic. Not that there's anything wrong with the latter in hell, although working up a bit of insight would pay off in the long run.

Posted by Anglo Catholic Relict (# 17213) on :

quote:
Originally posted by chive:
I now need to add to the joy I'm experiencing. Started taking antibiotic then oh fuck, breathing problems, itchiness etc etc. Spent the last couple hours at the local hospital where it appears that, due to the large amounts of penicillin I have consumed over the last wee while, I have now developed a quite serious allergy to it. So now no antibiotics but shit loads of antihistamines and steroids.

So now I have horrible pain, no sleep, breathing shitty (although better than it was) and I itch like I've been squatted by an extended family of fleas. And I still have no date to get my fucking teeth out.

I swear it would be cheaper for them to just fucking do it as opposed to having to sort out the fucking shite they've failed to do so far.

I'm going to Scotland on holiday next month and I'm already googling dentists to see if I can find one that will work things out.

I blame the tories, and labour, and frankly everyone in the fucking world because I am now officially in a BAD MOOD.

I am really, really sorry to hear of all your suffering, Chive. I really wish I could help.

Would it be worth asking your friends who they use; maybe there will be a local dentist who is particularly good, and who you could trust to do the extraction without full sedation? There may be some medication that could help enough, for the few minutes it would take.

I know that is probably useless advice, but I don't know what else to suggest, really.

[Frown]

Posted by Lamb Chopped (# 5528) on :

[Frown]

Chive, if I send you the Rusty Farm Implement, do you think you could use it on the tooth? Failing that, on the NHS authories...

Posted by no prophet (# 15560) on :

quote:
Originally posted by Lyda*Rose:

quote:
Originally posted by no prophet:
Did not realize the NHS includes dentistry. In Canada, dentists are all private, with the lucky people those whose work-based insurance pays it or part of it. If I recall correctly it was close to $4,000 for one of my kid's difficult wisdom teeth with the sleepy time. So sympathy for the pain, but none for the costs.
Just because you are in same boat payment-wise, you can't find sympathy for her predicament?

I do, for the tooth pain.

Posted by Firenze (# 619) on :

I live with someone who is a martyr to Teeth. There's a reason for the expression 'down in the mouth' - it really is one attention-monopolising bugger.

I can't recommend anything beyond what you're doing already. Hunting down every medical/dental resource on the planet until you find one that will Do Something.

Posted by Boogie (# 13538) on :

My specialist dentist is in Shepherd's Bush (I live near Manchester) [Roll Eyes]

I had a lot of work done, including two implants, six crowns and several porcelain inlays - for a quarter of the cost my normal dentist quoted.

They come over from Hungary and take over a private surgery for the weekend once a fortnight. They are called Perfect Smile. We got a new dentist recently, he was really impressed with the work I'd had done. If you google Perfect Smile Shepherd's Bush you will find them.

[Smile]

[ 01. December 2013, 18:15: Message edited by: Boogie ]

Posted by Beeswax Altar (# 11644) on :

quote:
Originally posted by LeRoc:
I don't know how the system works, but couldn't you cross a border somewhere? Scotland has already been mentioned, there's Ireland and there must be private clincs in countries like Belgium or the Netherlands where people speak English.

Yes, where could one go to find a ton of English speaking dentists in private practice? [Biased]

Posted by Arethosemyfeet (# 17047) on :

quote:
Originally posted by Anglican't:

quote:
Originally posted by Arethosemyfeet:
The main problem with NHS dentistry is that it's not NHS enough. We need publically employed dentists and national planning of dentist numbers.
What would nationally-planned dentistry look like? When you've finished your check up would the dentist hand you a vase so you can rinse your mouth out?

Eh? I can get all the treatment for any part of my body except eyes and teeth via my GP at zero cost beyond taxes. I can see my GP 6 days a week, and on call during evenings and weekends in an emergency. In dire emergency the local NHS staff will have me stabilised and on a plane to Glasgow inside an hour. I'd just like dentistry to be included in NHS provision. At least up here the check ups are free.

Posted by Schroedinger's cat (# 64) on :

Chive - that sucks. Tooth pain (and I have had a lot of teeth problems) are really unpleasant. To have had it for so long sucks.

I have had teeth out under sedation, for a cost of £150 or so - it might be more like £200 these days, although it was probably 5 years or so since the last time. Incidentally, I would always go for sedation if possible - I am much more relaxed, and there is no problems with post-anaesthetic nausea.

I would suggest going to your doctor and talking about it, because this seems like a medical issue - because your meds are giving problems, and you need the sedation and the treatment. And soon. You might be able to get something done at the London Dentistry School, I think at the side of the London Hospital, which is where I have had some out when I was nearer there.

Teeth are a bad idea, on balance.

Posted by Firenze (# 619) on :

The bummer is, extraction is no big deal. My chap's attitude is - You still have a couple of dozen teeth, this one's rubbish, just hold still a minute...

T's a lot less painful than a filling and way better than an abscess.

Posted by Ahleal V (# 8404) on :

I've gone to the same private dentist my entire life. I didn't think this was strange til I started hearing about other people's experiences with the NHS.

To put this into context, I've lived on sugary things, coffee, tea and wine - and I didn't have my first filling til my mid twenties. That's how much care the guy took care of my teeth.

(Though in my defence, when I was unemployed I had a wisdom tooth removed by the NHS in 48hrs, and they were amazing.)

x

AV

[ 01. December 2013, 21:36: Message edited by: Ahleal V ]

Posted by Martin PC not & Ship's Biohazard (# 368) on :

chive I'm appalled that we - a two trillion pound economy - can do NOTHING for you. That you cannot get justice. A sane, integrated, responsible response. You must go to your MP. And demand JUSTICE.

Go to your local CofE vicar and demand the same, that he raises it with YOUR bishop.

Posted by orfeo (# 13878) on :

Kidnap a London banker to pay for it.

Posted by LeRoc (# 3216) on :

quote:
Ahleal V: I had a wisdom tooth removed by the NHS in 48hrs

Did it take so long to pull it out? Ouch!

Posted by Golden Key (# 1468) on :

{{{{{{{Chive}}}}}}}

I've had a lot of dental problems, had to fight to get care, and haven't always been able to get it. And had some awful dentists, and been traumatized by abusive treatment and anesthesia problems..

FYI about dental schools: around here (San Francisco, CA), there are several levels of clinics at dental schools: students, residents, faculty, etc. The student-level clinic, while cheaper, can be emotionally excruciating to deal with. They're only allowed to do a small amount of work at each appointment, and wait for the attending dentist to come around and check. It can take a long time to get the attending. So a treatment/procedure that normally could be done all in one appointment is split up into several. Even for something like teeth cleaning. This makes it especially hard for patients who are terrified.

The resident clinics, IME, are generally much better. They can do more stuff in one appointment, though they may still split up a procedure. The level of supervision varies according to the attending, IME. The residents tend to be more confident and competent, though some haven't learned much empathy for patients' anxiety yet. (OTOH, I had once had a private dentist who, while generally very good, honestly didn't understand why people are scared of dentists! I explained it to the dentist, who was surprised.)

Dental schools sometimes have specialty clinics, like General Hospital Dentistry and Oral-Facial Pain, where they can give some special attention to people with special needs. E.g., people who MUST have full sedation.

I don't know what's right for you. But if you do go to a dental school, you might find it works best to go to a resident or faculty clinic, and see if they've got anything like General Hospital Dentistry and Oral-Facial Pain.

Oh, and I've heard of dentists (and even dental schools) using *acupuncture* to help patients during procedures. If you can find that, maybe it could get you around the anesthesia/medication problem?

FWIW. YMMV.

Posted by Doublethink (# 1984) on :

Talking to your mp might work, though a psychiatrist might be able to prescribe the relevant sedation meds - rather than waiting for a prescribing dentist.

Posted by Kelly Alves (# 2522) on :

(Wow, comet, you are so right about people avoiding offering specific medical advice. Gee, did everybody read that fantastic post? If not, read it now! [Yipee]

You'll love it!)

I can actually say this with confidence-- I love my dentist, and he loves me.

No, not that way. Our love is transcendent and pure. He just discovered I am a science geek who finds lurid descriptions of dental extractions fascinating. And he has the magic touch. As far as extractions. Bunch of pervs, get your minds out of the gutter. Our love is transcendent and pure.

Moment of Dentist Lurve- I swear to God this happened:

Dr.A. (Elbow deep in my mouth) "I had to fix the toilet lid in my house the other day."

Me: (listening face)"Ungh?"

Dr.A "Yeah, and getting the screws off the old lid was harder than putting the new one on. I kept thinking about tools I have here in the office that would have helped me with that job. So I wound up going down to my basement and looking for tools that reminded me of dental tools.

Me(Helpless giggling, with a suction tube and a pair of pliers in my mouth)

Dr. A. (removing pliers and poking a wad of gauze in my back molar) "I'm sorry, was that oversharing?"

Me (fairly coherently-- the novocaine wasn't affecting the front of my mouth)"Not at all, not at all. Actually that'sh short of reassuring. Obvioshly you are really dedicate to you job."

Dr.A(giving me a shy, boyish smile-- he's hella young. And married, before y'all start.) "Gee, Kelly, I can't imagine telling that story to any of my other patients. I knew you would understand."

I figure that this recap of my dental experience is Hellish in that the " [Razz]

HA, HA! MY DENTIST ROCKS AND YOURS SUCKS!" factor is high.

Posted by comet (# 10353) on :

Well, if we're going to be THAT kind of Hellish - I can proudly say I fell asleep during my wisdom teeth removal, under only local anesthetic. Yoga breathing and meditation is a wonderful thing.

I did drool, though.

Posted by Patdys (# 9397) on :

Anyone else picturing Steve Martin from little shop of horrors?

Posted by art dunce (# 9258) on :

We could only see the free dentist who opened his practice once every two months to welfare cases. He was a big guy, a muscle bound body builder with strangely small, soft, feminine hands. For wisdom teeth the gave you noviciane, a little nitrous oxide and then pulled them out with one pull for each tooth. Later, in college, when I heard people had actual anesthesia ( a Valium drip?) for theirs I couldn't believe it!

Posted by Kelly Alves (# 2522) on :

quote:
Originally posted by Patdys:
Anyone else picturing Steve Martin from little shop of horrors?

CANDY BAR! CANDY BAR! CANDY BAR!

Posted by lilBuddha (# 14333) on :

Wisdom teeth removed, that answers loads of questions I'd had.

Posted by Barefoot Friar (# 13100) on :

I'll just leave this little link right here...

Posted by Liopleurodon (# 4836) on :

There's the recurring character of the oversharing dentist on the Armstrong and Miller show, but I cba to link it. I'm a bit stunned at this. I've had no problems getting prompt, good, reasonably priced NHS dental treatment, including having a tooth out. I guess it really is a question of where you live.

Posted by chive (# 208) on :

Lovely GP has now given me some morphine so I slept last night for a few hours which was lovely. But it is completely ridiculous that it has got so bad. Going to my dentist today and I'm going to sit there and cry til he sorts something out. Please let this work.

Posted by Kelly Alves (# 2522) on :

Yikes.

Accio dens.

Posted by mdijon (# 8520) on :

It just cannot be right that someone is getting 5 courses of antibiotics and now morphine when a tooth extraction would solve the problem. There may be concerns about interactions between sedation and other medications, but the idea that you instead don't worry about interactions and/or side effects from a list of antibiotics, painkillers and morphine is bonkers.

Chive, you have been very badly let down, although I expect you know that. You should find an appropriate avenue for complaints once this is all over.

Posted by Francophile (# 17838) on :

I developed severe pain in a lower molar (the one in front of the wisdom tooth, dont know the technical term) on Sunday 10 November. Saw my fantastic NHS dentist Zaq on morning of Tuesday 12 November. After xray, he diagnosed an abscess and recommended immediate extraction (dont understand the comment upthread that a tooth cannot be taken out with infection present, but I may have misunderstood the comment). Three injections later, Zaq tells me that the extraction "may not be straightforward". Too late for me to run out of the surgery. As it turned out, it wasn't too difficult and I felt nothing but a little pressure on the gum during the procedure. I thought Id be offered antibiotics afterwards but wasn't. Went home, was lucky that I could take the day off, and took paracetamol as the local anaesthetic wore off. I would describe the aftermath as moderate discomfort, as oppose to pain. By the Fridsy I was feeling more or less normal. I am SO grateful to NHS dentistry and to wonderful Zaq. Cost to me was only £33.48.

Chive, I am so sorry that you are undergoing such excruciating pain. Toothache, from my recent experience, is utterly awful. I hope you get something sorted out today.

Posted by Boogie (# 13538) on :

[Votive]

chive

Posted by Schroedinger's cat (# 64) on :

Chive - still thinking about you. How's it going?

Someone deserves a kicking for this. Your treatment has been appalling - the fact that your medication may be an issue just means someone needs to get their arse in gear and find a solution for you.

Posted by chive (# 208) on :

An hour at the dentist this morning. Eight fucking injections. Tooth still bloody there cos infection too bad to take it out. Prescription for more antibiotics that I'm too scared to take and another appointment in January.

And I bit my lip cos it was numbed and I look like a boxer. Morphine is my only friend.

I cannot explain how at the end of my tether I am.

Posted by Doublethink (# 1984) on :

Too scared to take ?

If you don't have something at least controlling the infection a bit, you will get worse. Camp in your GPs again. Actually, just looked at the time - go to A&E an refuse to leave till you get meaningful help.

(& Hosts, this is not medical advice - it is how to get access to medical advice advice.)

[ 03. December 2013, 18:45: Message edited by: Doublethink ]

Posted by Francophile (# 17838) on :

This situation is appalling. Chive, I agree that you should go to A and E, explaining that the pain is unbearable and ask to see the on call maxillofacial specialist as a matter of urgency.

Posted by Kelly Alves (# 2522) on :

It really bugs the piss out of me that whatever quack you drew out of the pile thinks toying around with morphine is preferable to an extraction.

[Mad]

Sort out my girl chive,you dicks!

Posted by Sioni Sais (# 5713) on :

Hostly Bowler On

With the best will in the world I think we've given chive all the practical advice we can. Prayer for and fellowship with her, plus Hellishness for sundry clinicians who are no doubt operating under "guidelines" drawn up by those who can't tell a mole from a molar, would seem to be the order of the day.

Ta Muchly

Hostly Bowler Off

Sioni Sais
Hellhost

btw, if chive wants to bollock me for the above, I'll be cutting her some slack. I'll put it down to toothache.

Posted by chive (# 208) on :

I don't need practical advice, I've got morphine which I've decided solves all the worlds problems. And no I'm not going to become addicted.

I've also got a massive lump on my jaw that makes me look like a chipmunk with mumps. Most attractive. So today I'm going to spend a useful day lying on the sofa, staring into space and moaning occasionally.

Posted by Francophile (# 17838) on :

Chive, prayers are with you, so sorry that things are so awful for you at the moment.

Posted by Boogie (# 13538) on :

quote:
Originally posted by chive:
I don't need practical advice, I've got morphine which I've decided solves all the worlds problems. And no I'm not going to become addicted.

I've also got a massive lump on my jaw that makes me look like a chipmunk with mumps. Most attractive. So today I'm going to spend a useful day lying on the sofa, staring into space and moaning occasionally.

Have you got a time/date/place for getting the tooth out - or are they waiting for the infection to go down first?

More [Votive]

for you, it must be simply awful [Frown]

Posted by Firenze (# 619) on :

quote:
Originally posted by chive:

I've also got a massive lump on my jaw that makes me look like a chipmunk with mumps.

It surprised me when my husband had the same, that it does actually produce this gobstopper look, and it wasn't just an invention of people who drew The Beano.

Posted by Kelly Alves (# 2522) on :

quote:
Originally posted by chive:
I don't need practical advice, I've got morphine which I've decided solves all the worlds problems. And no I'm not going to become addicted.

Fair warning-- if you do, I will consider it my calling in life to bug you with
Cab Calloway songs.

[Big Grin]

(Take it easy and get better!)

Posted by The5thMary (# 12953) on :

I am just now laying eyes on this topic and I can completely sympathize with you!

I have several teeth that are driving me to distraction. I am on Medicare and for those in the U.S., who know of such things, Medicare does NOT cover any dental issues. Ohhh, hell, do I have issues! Let me issue forth: At least four root canals are recommended and two extractions, plus crowns a'plenty and probably more. The one dentist I went to quoted me the outrageous price of $14,555.00 and that's WITH dental insurance!! I can't afford that at all and when I told the dentist this, she looked at me sweetly and told me of a payment plan... which costs $800 a month for that $14k! I'm not working and my monthly income is $800! How's that gonna work, then?

I'm looking at pliers and some fishing line to tie to a doorknob... [Waterworks]

Posted by The5thMary (# 12953) on :

Here's something I discovered last night and it works, for a time, anyway...

Take four or five aspirins and dissolve them in a cup with about an inch of warm/hot water. Swirl the mess around. Drain some of the water if you want but take a big blob of the mess and smear it on your aching teeth. In my case, one front tooth has a growing spot where the enamel is completely gone--showing the exposed... owww... root. Anyway, I smeared that aspirin mess on my teeth and let the saliva mix with it... and waited. and waited. It burned! But I held on for five minutes and spit everything out and then did it again. I repeated this once more and then rinsed my mouth out several times... and half an hour later, ALL the pain vanished! And that was over 24 hours ago. I MUCH prefer morphine or codeine but my the last grinch of a dentist I went to only prescribed Tylenol and that didn't do sh*t.

Posted by Kelly Alves (# 2522) on :

This might help, too:
Write these words on a piece of paper: Agerin, Nagerin, Vagerin, Jagerin, Ipagerin, Sipia. You should write these words with a new pen.

Then cut it into 3 pieces. Chive should place the first piece on the bad tooth in the evening, and in the morning they should quietly spit the paper into a fire. (got a hibachi?) Do the same morning and night with the other pieces.

Y'all? Can it with the medical advice.

Posted by The5thMary (# 12953) on :

DAMN. Bunny laid me OUT!

Seriously, though, apologies all around.

Posted by chive (# 208) on :

quote:
Originally posted by Kelly Alves:
This might help, too:
Write these words on a piece of paper: Agerin, Nagerin, Vagerin, Jagerin, Ipagerin, Sipia. You should write these words with a new pen.

Then cut it into 3 pieces. Chive should place the first piece on the bad tooth in the evening, and in the morning they should quietly spit the paper into a fire. (got a hibachi?) Do the same morning and night with the other pieces.

How do you know what my dentist suggested?

Posted by Martin PC not & Ship's Biohazard (# 368) on :

chive, you CANNOT maintain a sense of humour in all this unrelenting suffering.

In response to The5thMary

Tylenol = acetominophen = paracetamol

Not surprised the aspirin worked, it's more powerful than morphine.

Posted by Kelly Alves (# 2522) on :

quote:
Originally posted by chive:

quote:
Originally posted by Kelly Alves:
This might help, too:
Write these words on a piece of paper: Agerin, Nagerin, Vagerin, Jagerin, Ipagerin, Sipia. You should write these words with a new pen.

Then cut it into 3 pieces. Chive should place the first piece on the bad tooth in the evening, and in the morning they should quietly spit the paper into a fire. (got a hibachi?) Do the same morning and night with the other pieces.

How do you know what my dentist suggested?

Personally, I am resentful that my "Accio Dens" didn't work. Flippin' Hogwarts distance learning system.

Posted by Penny S (# 14768) on :

That'll be because you did not have clearly defined in your head which tooth* in which jaw was intended. It's a jolly good thing it didn't work on the nearest dens available.

*Remember that mantra the dentist intones to his assistant as he works round the jaws?

Posted by Pigwidgeon (# 10192) on :

quote:
Originally posted by Kelly Alves:
Personally, I am resentful that my "Accio Dens" didn't work. Flippin' Hogwarts distance learning system.

Next time use a mail owl.
[Biased]

Posted by Lamb Chopped (# 5528) on :

My old professor spent years in Papua New Guinea and got his pliers borrowed all the time. Then one man would lie down on the ground and open his mouth, the other would put a foot on his chest, and, well... it was considered a great improvement over whatever they had before.

Posted by Kelly Alves (# 2522) on :

I did a mission trip to this little town outside of Ensenada. They had just gotten a full time dentist. Before that, people were allowing teeth to rot in their mouths so that they would be easier to pick out piece by piece.

Posted by Boogie (# 13538) on :

quote:
Originally posted by Kelly Alves:
I did a mission trip to this little town outside of Ensenada. They had just gotten a full time dentist. Before that, people were allowing teeth to rot in their mouths so that they would be easier to pick out piece by piece.

I will be there in February! Bella Vista, up on the hill - overlooking all the big cruise ships.

(I'll be working with street kids, this is my fifth visit)

Posted by The5thMary (# 12953) on :

Yesterday I came extremely close to throwing my cellphone across the room--I had an extremely disagreeable conversation with a numb skull at a low-income dental clinic in Atlanta, GA. I have tried and tried and tried to get appointments at these places to get my teeth worked on but no one wants to help me--or they can't because there's 500 lower-income folks than me trying to get dental help!

Anyway, I have decided to hang out at the nearest public health department this coming Monday. No, I'm not over 60. No, I am not an infant or a child. No, I am not pregnant. I don't care! This is an emergency and these bozos are going to see me or do something for me and I'm not leaving their offices until they do. I have had it! I have SIX teeth that need help, four of them immediately. I am going to make a stink because I am in excruciating pain!

Oh, and Martin? The aspirin did wonders...except it dried my mouth out something horrible.

Posted by Patdys (# 9397) on :

quote:
Originally posted by Martin PC not & Ship's Biohazard:
Not surprised the aspirin worked, it's more powerful than morphine.

Only because aspirin wears its underpants on the outside.

*Top 5 conditions in which aspirin is more powerful than morphine.

5: At making coke fizz.

4: At hiding amongst peppermints.

3: At hiding in the bottom of handbags.

2: At being called in alphabetical order.

1: At making Martin write a simple sentence in plain English and actually make much less sense than his more enjoyable poetic offerings. [Razz]

I have read all the medical advice on this thread and have come to the conclusion it is neither medical nor advice. [Big Grin]

Posted by Kelly Alves (# 2522) on :

quote:
Originally posted by Patdys:

I have read all the medical advice on this thread and have come to the conclusion it is neither medical nor advice.

(Pins medal on Pissy.)

Posted by Martin PC not & Ship's Biohazard (# 368) on :

OKayyyyy, my source was (Dr.) Michael Crichton (deceased) in State (why didn't he call it Climate?) of Fear, and it turns out that the analgesic effect of morphine is higher than aspirin (an morphine's can be massively amplified by molecular tweaking), but aspirin's antipyretic and anticoagulant effects through COX (cyclooxygenase) inhibition make it - subjectively? - 'more powerful'.

Posted by Kelly Alves (# 2522) on :

Somewhere in Heaven Erin is whopping herself over the head with a copy of the Mayo Connection

Michael freaking Crichton as a medical resource? Can I list Jurassic Park among my "works cited" for a paper about prehistoric ferns, too?

And Boogie-- you slay me, you really do. How did my gruesome story about people pulling slivers of tooth out of their mouths turn into a happy fluffy bonding moment? That was magic.

Posted by The5thMary (# 12953) on :

Boogie is so sweet and so..so... "out there", sometimes. I feel as though she was saying to some of us, "Well, yes, times are tough and your teeth are in bad shape but if you want to know who REALLY has bad teeth, why come with me as I take a trip to...". To which I say, "Yeah, but it's MY teeth that are hurting at the moment! Can't people pay attention to ME?!" Oh, and whoever started this thread! [Killing me]

Posted by Kelly Alves (# 2522) on :

I think I just fell down a rabbit hole. Did you-- YOU, sister-- refer to Boogie as "out there"?

I'm getting the giggles now. I need to wander off this thread before I start hallucinating pink elephants or Sioni stomps on my head, whichever comes first.

Posted by Sioni Sais (# 5713) on :

Hmmm. Has this thread run its course? What a combo of inappropriate posting, smilies, upper case usage and general inanity. A whole pack of wolves have been called. Oh, and some 'look at me-ism' that Jerry Springer and Jeremy Kyle would regard as excessive.

Head stomping? No, can't be arsed.

[ 08. December 2013, 15:03: Message edited by: Sioni Sais ]

Posted by Anglo Catholic Relict (# 17213) on :

For all suffering at present with their teeth; you have my sympathy.

[Votive]

Posted by Boogie (# 13538) on :

The5thMary - all I can reply is "it wasn't me" waaaaaaaaah! :'(

Posted by Thyme (# 12360) on :

( [Votive]

for people in pain)

BUT

[Killing me]

for the last few posts here. I think I have joined Kelly down the rabbit hole.

[Killing me]

Posted by Martin PC not & Ship's Biohazard (# 368) on :

Kelly Alves, he can do no wrong because of The Andromeda Strain. And being dead helps.

Posted by comet (# 10353) on :

I hate all of you sucktastic weirdos.

Except Pissy. my massive hard-on for his brain continues.

Posted by Kelly Alves (# 2522) on :

Good. "Universal Hatred" is pretty much written on your job description.

quote:
Originally posted by Sioni Sais:
Hmmm. Has this thread run its course? What a combo of inappropriate posting, smilies, upper case usage and general inanity. A whole pack of wolves have been called. Oh, and some 'look at me-ism' that Jerry Springer and Jeremy Kyle would regard as excessive.

Head stomping? No, can't be arsed.

This isn't a host post,right? So it's OK to discuss it, right?

First of all, this is kind of a glorified AS thread to begin with, so it probably has run its course. (no offense, chive, but unless people started being douchey enough to actively call you a crybaby or something, or had more people used it to tell NHS horror stories of their own, this thread didn't stand much of a chance of getting heated.) Second of all,Sioni, since your last line seemed to be in response to me, and therefore since you seem to have very publically lumped me in with "inappropriate posts", can you please point out where I have said something that is inappropriate for Hell?

So, following a variety of discussions we've had, I try to stoke the fires by sneering at home remedies, mocking Boogie and Mary, and actively try to help by reminding people to can the medical dialogue. I made one flip remark about Hogwarts, but I have seen all three of the Hellhosts get a lot sillier when the mood strikes them. So, basically, why are you pissing on an ally?

I mean, I guess if I wanted to go the extra mile I could have started picking on chive, but I couldn't bring myself to do that. But then, neither could anyone else.

[ 08. December 2013, 19:34: Message edited by: Kelly Alves ]

Posted by orfeo (# 13878) on :

Oh, the pain! the pain!!

Posted by Sioni Sais (# 5713) on :

quote:
Originally posted by Kelly Alves:
Good. "Universal Hatred" is pretty much written on your job description.

quote:
Originally posted by Sioni Sais:
Hmmm. Has this thread run its course? What a combo of inappropriate posting, smilies, upper case usage and general inanity. A whole pack of wolves have been called. Oh, and some 'look at me-ism' that Jerry Springer and Jeremy Kyle would regard as excessive.

Head stomping? No, can't be arsed.
This isn't a host post,right? So it's OK to discuss it, right?

It is not hosting, so it's perfectly OK.

quote:

First of all, this is kind of a glorified AS thread to begin with, so it probably has run its course. (no offense, chive, but unless people started being douchey enough to actively call you a crybaby or something, or had more people used it to tell NHS horror stories of their own, this thread didn't stand much of a chance of getting heated.)

Here we differ quite fundamentally. I've never seen this thread as a glorified (or other kind of) AS thread. I've treated it as an expression of anger, pain and frustration from chive. There have been All Saintsy posts from others, and there have been the usual quack remedies which various members of the Crew have stomped on.

quote:

Second of all,Sioni, since your last line seemed to be in response to me, and therefore since you seem to have very publically lumped me in with "inappropriate posts", can you please point out where I have said something that is inappropriate for Hell?

The last line was indeed directed at you, but it was in a paragraph of its own, so I hoped it wouldn't be taken to lump you in with the rest of my post. Clumsy posting on my part, I apologise.

quote:

So, following a variety of discussions we've had, I try to stoke the fires by sneering at home remedies, mocking Boogie and Mary, and actively try to help by reminding people to can the medical dialogue. I made one flip remark about Hogwarts, but I have seen all three of the Hellhosts get a lot sillier when the mood strikes them. So, basically, why are you pissing on an ally?

Like I said, I tried not too but scored an inadvertent hit. I didn't get the Hogwarts allusion as I don't follow Harry Potter.

quote:

I mean, I guess if I wanted to go the extra mile I could have started picking on chive, but I couldn't bring myself to do that. But then, neither could anyone else.

And there hasn't been any, I don't want any and if anyone did then I would expect the Usual Suspects to join together in one unholy dogpile.

Posted by Kelly Alves (# 2522) on :

quote:
Originally posted by Sioni Sais:
The last line was indeed directed at you, but it was in a paragraph of its own, so I hoped it wouldn't be taken to lump you in with the rest of my post. Clumsy posting on my part, I apologise.

Thank you.

Posted by Jane R (# 331) on :

Apologies in Hell?!

(looks nervously out of window for further evidence of the Apocalypse)

[Votive]

for Chive.

Posted by chive (# 208) on :

Personally I don't care if this is an AS type thread or a hell thread. All I care about is that my teeth hurt. Actually they don't hurt so badly now - apparently the excruciating act of injecting antibiotics actually into the tooth is a good thing. So far anyway. But then I still have until 10 January to survive until the Tooth from Hell is removed and based on the last few months I am somewhat cynical.

Also although taking morphine is a lot of fun, I've found it doesn't assist with issues like being able to work so I'm back on less interesting forms of painkillers.

I fucking hate my teeth and a) if I didn't want to spend the rest of my life looking like my face has collapsed in on itself and b) I wasn't shit scared of the dentist, I'd have them all removed now.

Don't dentists realise how traumatic their behaviour is?

Posted by Firenze (# 619) on :

I can't remember any really unsettling dentists since the time I had to have an emergency repair in Swindon. For a start, I got the jag - and then sent back to the waiting room for it to take effect. My own man uses stuff that numbs you up completely in the time it takes him to put the syringe away. Anyway, when I do finally get in the chair, his secretary comes in and they start an argument about this woman who's not paid her bill - and I'm thinking ffs, I'm paying for your attention just now - do your admin sometime you haven't half a drawer of cutlery in my mouth. And it was a lousy filling, and I had to have the tooth out pretty much as soon as I got home.

Posted by Ariel (# 58) on :

When I was a child I got taken for a checkup and the dentist took three teeth out there and then, and put stitches in. I had to go back some days later and have the stitches removed.

All I'm going to say about that is that once I was old enough to make my own decisions I didn't go back to the dentist for about 20 years and then again not until one of my teeth started crumbling earlier this year.

I then found that I'd lost my fear of the dentist and injections weren't as I remembered them. I'm convinced the dentist used to approach with a foot-long syringe which was then inserted through my gums into the other side of my face, but things seem to have improved since then. I'm not saying "fillings are fun" but they weren't as terrifying or anything like as pain-wracking as I remembered them.

[ 09. December 2013, 17:51: Message edited by: Ariel ]

Posted by Pigwidgeon (# 10192) on :

quote:
Originally posted by Ariel:
I'm not saying "fillings are fun" but they weren't as terrifying or anything like as pain-wracking as I remembered them.

When I was a child, my dentist didn't believe in using Novocaine for drilling. I hated him, but my parents were paying, and they insisted we go there.
[Mad]

Posted by Kelly Alves (# 2522) on :

quote:
Originally posted by chive:
Personally I don't care if this is an AS type thread or a hell thread. All I care about is that my teeth hurt.

Understandable.

And understand I personally don't think you personally have done a thing wrong, I just didn't think it was fair for the participants to be growled at for not being hellish enough when this is clearly not a typical Hell thread.

Especially when some of us were actively trying to give you a distraction.

But I think I have said my piece.

OK, to counterbalance my glowing story of my adorable dentist, let me admit that he bit off more than he could chew with my upper wisdom tooth, did what a proper oral surgeon should have been doing, and cracked the tooth in half. Which meant I had to be bundled up and driven across town to a specialist, who had the personality of a dishrag and upcharged me $300.

And his assistant numbed the wrong side of my mouth. Luckily I caught her in time to point her to the right tooth. (See that's the thing about being an American-- you might get swift treatment, but individualized (meaning: non-group or family)dental plans suck, and you wind up paying the full cost minus, like, a two-dollar coupon. Maybe a free toothbrush.)

Posted by Kelly Alves (# 2522) on :

quote:
Originally posted by Pigwidgeon:

quote:
Originally posted by Ariel:
I'm not saying "fillings are fun" but they weren't as terrifying or anything like as pain-wracking as I remembered them.
When I was a child, my dentist didn't believe in using Novocaine for drilling. I hated him, but my parents were paying, and they insisted we go there.

I vaguely remembered having one of those, but the ADA policies changed pretty quickly after that. He only prepped me with something like Oragel(A very mild topical anesthetic usually used for cold cores and teething babies.). I think the premise was, if you didn't want things to hurt, you shouldn't be bad to your teeth. Which is something every 12 year old should know, the lazy, gum ball-sucking assholes..

Posted by Firenze (# 619) on :

I didn't have the opportunity to develop a childhood fear of dental injections - dentist clamped a mask over your nose and mouth and the next thing you knew, you were coming to with a lot of red spit.

Posted by Kelly Alves (# 2522) on :

See, pain frightens me less than the idea of being put under, for some reason.

Posted by Kelly Alves (# 2522) on :

(and Sioni, in the heat of the moment I started a Styx conversation here, and that was clumsy and ill-mannered of me. I'm sorry.) --K.A.

Posted by Sioni Sais (# 5713) on :

quote:
Originally posted by Kelly Alves:
(and Sioni, in the heat of the moment I started a Styx conversation here, and that was clumsy and ill-mannered of me. I'm sorry.) --K.A.

Kelly,

Apology accepted. No casualties reported.

Sioni

OK, move along everybody, nothing to see

Posted by Lamb Chopped (# 5528) on :

Since we're doing horrible dentist stories--

I've only ever had the two fillings, but those were done with NO anesthetic when I was twelve. A genetic thingy means I need four times as much novocaine as a normal person, and after half that the dentist decided I was a lying asshole of a kid and screamed at me, then went ahead with the drilling and cursed at me when I flinched. I don't think he put a knee in my chest to hold me still, but he came close. An hour in hell. Fortunately my mother believed me and we never went back.

Posted by Kelly Alves (# 2522) on :

quote:
Originally posted by Lamb Chopped:
A genetic thingy means I need four times as much novocaine as a normal person, and after half that the dentist decided I was a lying asshole of a kid and screamed at me, then went ahead with the drilling and cursed at me when I flinched.

I have a gruesomely similar story, but as it involves a GYN, I will keep it to myself.

Except to cosmically send her this-- "Bitch." [Mad]

[ 09. December 2013, 23:56: Message edited by: Kelly Alves ]

Posted by Marvin the Martian (# 4360) on :

quote:
Originally posted by Lamb Chopped:
I've only ever had the two fillings, but those were done with NO anesthetic when I was twelve.

I've only had one filling, and I didn't even consider anesthetic - straight in, tooth drilled and filled, on with life. It's, like, a second or so of pain and then it's done - far better than spending the next hour or so with no sensation in your face.

My dad barely has a tooth in his head that hasn't been filled at least once (some of his teeth have more filler than enamel these days), and he's the same.

Posted by Boogie (# 13538) on :

quote:
Originally posted by Marvin the Martian:
I've only had one filling, and I didn't even consider anesthetic - straight in, tooth drilled and filled, on with life. It's, like, a second or so of pain and then it's done - far better than spending the next hour or so with no sensation in your face.

It depends on the tooth.

I have had plenty of fillings with no anesthetic - but if they are going deep and hit a nerve you are through the ROOF! (Reflex, no self control would stop it)

Root canal fillings are the worst.

Dental implants next - as they drill into bone, the smell is bleugh!!

Posted by Firenze (# 619) on :

quote:
Originally posted by Boogie:

I have had plenty of fillings with no anesthetic - but if they are going deep and hit a nerve you are through the ROOF! (Reflex, no self control would stop it)

Just so. Last thing you want is abrupt movement when someone has a pointy whirry thing in your mouth.

Anyone needing an incentive to be thankful for analgesics, I can recommend Fanny Burney's account of a radical mastectomy without anaesthetic (the bit where the surgeon was scraping the bone was particularly painful).

Posted by chive (# 208) on :

I've had fillings without anaesthetic too and that was fine. The problem is not when it's a simple filling but when Satan the Tooth Demon has taken over your mouth and wants you to fucking suffer. That's a whole different ball game. It's the difference between a paper cut and an arm amputation.

My worst dentist was one I saw as a child who smoked while looking at your teeth. He threw me out when I bit him.

The bizarre thing is I'm not actually dental phobic, it just triggers major episodes of the madness. A lot of dentists don't seem to understand the difference.

Posted by LeRoc (# 3216) on :

quote:
chive: The bizarre thing is I'm not actually dental phobic

I am.

Posted by Marvin the Martian (# 4360) on :

quote:
Originally posted by chive:
A lot of dentists don't seem to understand the difference.

What else do you expect from the people who weren't smart or dedicated enough to do a proper medical degree? [Razz]

Posted by John Holding (# 158) on :

quote:
Originally posted by Marvin the Martian:

quote:
Originally posted by chive:
A lot of dentists don't seem to understand the difference.
What else do you expect from the people who weren't smart or dedicated enough to do a proper medical degree?

Or one might remember that, as with medical doctors, half of them graduated in the bottom half of their class.

John

Posted by Sioni Sais (# 5713) on :

quote:
Originally posted by Marvin the Martian:

quote:
Originally posted by chive:
A lot of dentists don't seem to understand the difference.
What else do you expect from the people who weren't smart or dedicated enough to do a proper medical degree?

In the same way that they all failed to get into vet. school.

Posted by Kelly Alves (# 2522) on :

Y'all are making me pray to baby Jesus that we have some vets or dentists aboard, because that would be exciting.

Come on, you quacks, face up!

Posted by Sioni Sais (# 5713) on :

quote:
Originally posted by Kelly Alves:
Y'all are making me pray to baby Jesus that we have some vets or dentists aboard, because that would be exciting.

Come on, you quacks, face up!

[equine tangent]

Goad! Prick! Crack of whip!

[/equine tangent]

Posted by The5thMary (# 12953) on :

quote:
Originally posted by Boogie:
The5thMary - all I can reply is "it wasn't me" waaaaaaaaah! :'(

Ah, Boogie, I love you! [Big Grin]

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