Ship of Fools: Is this a first in the RCC in England?

Thread: Is this a first in the RCC in England? Board: Oblivion / Ship of Fools.

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Posted by Edith (# 16978) on :

A five minute standing ovation for a visiting Salesian priest preaching for 20 (!) minutes.

He began by quoting Pope Francis: if you want peace, stop the arms trade'.

And then with clarity and passion and huge moral authority he laid out the imperative to stop this pernicious trade.

In my 68 years I've never heard a sermon applauded let alone for so long and with such enthusiasm.

Is of the first time since the heady days of V2 I sense a real change in the church. But - is this isolated and untypical? I hope not.

Posted by trouty (# 13497) on :

quote:
Originally posted by Edith:
A five minute standing ovation for a visiting Salesian priest preaching for 20 (!) minutes.

He began by quoting Pope Francis: if you want peace, stop the arms trade'.

And then with clarity and passion and huge moral authority he laid out the imperative to stop this pernicious trade.

In my 68 years I've never heard a sermon applauded let alone for so long and with such enthusiasm.

Is of the first time since the heady days of V2 I sense a real change in the church. But - is this isolated and untypical? I hope not.

Because of course it is only access to powerful weapons produced by wicked western arms manufacturers that leads people to kill others, isn't it? I mean, without automatic firepower they would just use their spears to hang out the washing. It's not the weapons that kill, it's the people using them. If they want to commit vioence then they will, whether it's with an armalite or with an axe.

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[ 25. May 2014, 20:13: Message edited by: Eutychus ]

Posted by Invictus_88 (# 15352) on :

Sound mega. Is there a recording anywhere?

Posted by Jay-Emm (# 11411) on :

True but spear makers aren't a significant part of any economy.

Posted by Edith (# 16978) on :

quote:
Originally posted by Invictus_88:
Sound mega. Is there a recording anywhere?

Sadly, no. I didn't know it was coming. [Frown]

Posted by Ad Orientem (# 17574) on :

The arms trade is indeed dodgy to say the least. I don't see what it has to do with V2 though.

Posted by Martin PC not & Ship's Biohazard (# 368) on :

My village will have teenagers as mad as that kid in California. I was one. But growing up mad as a biscuit in Royal Leamington Spa, I couldn't get an AK.

Thank God. Whose Kingdom will have come in fullness when America outlaws guns.

Posted by Stetson (# 9597) on :

Heh. Cold War ends, commies safely vanguished, RCC suddenly recognizes the evils of the arms-trade. Were blind, but now they see.

Posted by no prophet (# 15560) on :

quote:
Originally posted by Jay-Emm:
True but spear makers aren't a significant part of any economy.

Drones don't drop many spears from the sky do they?

It's one reason some of us wondered about John Paul II and his negativity about Latin America liberation theology. Not saying all aspects were good, but some certainly were.

[ 26. May 2014, 20:05: Message edited by: no prophet ]

Posted by Alogon (# 5513) on :

The military-industrial complex is certainly a very large fly to swat in the swarm. As No Prophet points out, technology keeps enlarging the possibilities of slaughter by proxy, insulating humans who must merely push a button miles away from the moral horrors of what they do.

But there remains the swarm. One is hard-put to find a major corporation whose hands aren't dirty in some way or other, whether in what they produce, how they produce it, or the marketing.

Posted by Honest Ron Bacardi (# 38) on :

quote:
Originally posted by Stetson:
Heh. Cold War ends, commies safely vanguished, RCC suddenly recognizes the evils of the arms-trade. Were blind, but now they see.

I seem to recall an encyclical several years before the collapse of the eastern bloc denouncing the arms trade. And even fuzzier memory suggests that there has been earlier pronouncements though I can't remember what. I suppose I should Google for it first, but certainly the first sticks in my memory for some reason.

Posted by Honest Ron Bacardi (# 38) on :

OK - so I just looked it up. It's Sollicitudo rei socialis (1987)

quote:
If arms production is a serious disorder in the present world with regard to true human needs and the employment of the means capable of satisfying those needs, the arms trade is equally to blame. Indeed, with reference to the latter it must be added that the moral judgment is even more severe.

Earlier stuff condemns the expenditure on arms and the arms race.

Posted by moonlitdoor (# 11707) on :

An encyclical or other document addressed to a general audience seems to me a better place than a normal sermon for such teaching.

A sermon which generates five minutes applause somehow seems to me to have been addressed to the wrong audience, as I see the purpose of a sermon being to teach, encourage, or challenge us, rather than to stroke us.

Of course if it were a congregation of arms dealers, the sermon would be quite apposite, but from the lengthy applause I am guessing that wasn't the case.

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