Ship of Fools: Films that should be listed as Great

Thread: Films that should be listed as Great Board: Oblivion / Ship of Fools.

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Posted by lilBuddha (# 14333) on :

Alright, film nerds, dig 'em out. What I am looking for, though is not the quirky, narrow range flicks that cinema geeks love to trot out, but films that fit enough into the mainstream but still maintain a high level of writing, acting and directing to please the critics. Films that have either fallen of the radar or never quite managed to register.
Like Alice Doesn't Live Here Anymore, The Iron Giant and The King of Comedy.

Posted by Sipech (# 16870) on :

Am a big fan of Danny Boyle's films yet Sunshine is often unfairly put down when it is a fine film.

One of Alfred Hitchcock's early films doesn't often register in the "canon" of his greats but is a fine work of suspense looking at Nietzschian philosophy. I speak, of course, of Rope .

Posted by Adeodatus (# 4992) on :

quote:
Originally posted by Sipech:
One of Alfred Hitchcock's early films doesn't often register in the "canon" of his greats but is a fine work of suspense looking at Nietzschian philosophy. I speak, of course, of Rope .

Absolutely! I think it may be my favourite Hitchcock (along with, perhaps, Rebecca).

My own addition to the list would be Grand Hotel. It won the best picture Oscar in 1932. It's got Greta Garbo (uttering her immortal "I want to be alone"), Joan Crawford, Lionel Barrymore and John Barrymore. The direction is gorgeous and the great stars are just doing what they did best - i.e. being great stars.

Posted by Firenze (# 619) on :

Vastly under-appreciated, Terry Gilliam's The Adventures of Baron Munchausen.

Posted by Kelly Alves (# 2522) on :

quote:
Originally posted by Sipech:
Am a big fan of Danny Boyle's films yet Sunshine is often unfairly put down when it is a fine film.

One of Alfred Hitchcock's early films doesn't often register in the "canon" of his greats but is a fine work of suspense looking at Nietzschian philosophy. I speak, of course, of Rope .

Yes, and Yes.
I think this might be what you are after-- The Descendants got a lot of critical praise, but not a lot of box office It is one of the finer examples I can think of of how cinematic storytelling can have powerful impact on a viewer. Acting, script, cinematography, score-- everything just quietly flows together to make an indeliable memory.

Posted by Kelly Alves (# 2522) on :

OO, just saw another potential on tonight's schedule-- the film version of Six Degrees of Separation. Starring the always brilliant Donald Sutherland, my long time crush and hero Stockard Channing, and a very young and surprisingly spellbinding Will Smith.

No, he's good, Really, really good.

[ 15. December 2014, 01:28: Message edited by: Kelly Alves ]

Posted by Palimpsest (# 16772) on :

Since there's been some Coen brothers bashing, I'll mention their remake of "True Grit". Lovely cinematography and a sensitivity to the language.

Groundhog day continues to grow on me. A friend said it was a gender disparate film. Men like it, Women don't.

Posted by Kelly Alves (# 2522) on :

? I liked Groundhog Day.

Posted by Stetson (# 9597) on :

Palimpsest wrote:

quote:
Groundhog day continues to grow on me. A friend said it was a gender disparate film. Men like it, Women don't.

Hm. I wonder why that would be.

To the extent that we can talk aboout there being "men's films" and "women's films", I woulda thought that Groundhog Day has ample qualification the latter category. Romantic comedy, promoting long-term commitments and a nurturing approach to life.

I guess it does rely a bit on the sorta low-brow slapstick that is traditionally associated with "guy comedies", but it manages to avoid the frat-house excesses that other endeavours by the old National Lampoon/SNL axis occassionally lowered themselves into.

Speaking of gender dichotomies...

For Hitchcock I am going to nominate Frenzy, a serial-killer flick from 1972, and(I do not think it hyperbole to say) a searing meditation on misogynistic violence and gender animosity, peppered with shocking black humour.

Granted, the view of early 70s London makes it look like the 1950s are still happening, but that, along with the pop-Freudianism, is all part of the(possibly unintentional) charm, imho.

Posted by Stetson (# 9597) on :

quote:
Originally posted by Sipech:
Am a big fan of Danny Boyle's films yet Sunshine is often unfairly put down when it is a fine film.

One of Alfred Hitchcock's early films doesn't often register in the "canon" of his greats but is a fine work of suspense looking at Nietzschian philosophy. I speak, of course, of Rope .

I agree about Rope, though I do think that it's presentation of Nietzschean philosophy is rather literalist. Arguably, a genuine ubermensch would realize that there is no point in performing blatantly evil(by Christians standards) actions in order to show himself superior to Christian morality, since that just keeps him framed in the Christian dichotmoy.

And I wonder to what extent the popular view of Leopold and Loeb was influenced by the fact that Clarence Darrow was desperate to save them from the gallows, and so stooped into arguing "How can we blame them for commiting murder? They had read Nietzsche at university!"

Posted by Oscar the Grouch (# 1916) on :

Alexandra MacKendrick directed some cracking films, such as "The Ladykillers" and "Whisky Galore". Both of these count as "great" in my book.

But I would also like to nominate two of his lesser known films.

The Maggie is a delightful romp through the Scottish islands with a thoroughly disreputable skipper of a small "puffer boat". If you haven't seen it, you've missed a real treat.

Sammy Going South is the story of a small lad who is orphaned in Port Said during the Suez Crisis, who tries to make his way 5000 miles across Africa to his aunt in Durban. Quite apart from the touching (yet at times quite dark) story, the filming captures Africa just as Colonial life in the British Empire was collapsing. It also has Edward G Robinson and Harry H Corbett (for once not playing it for laughs).

Both of these films are ones I have come to love as much as "Whisky Galore" (which, for me, is high praise).

Posted by Lyda*Rose (# 4544) on :

I need to let go of the concept that I have any idea what is "great" and just go with my preferences. For comedies I choose Some Like It Hot, Ruthless People, and, yes, this girl loves Groundhog Day. All are incredibly amusing and engaging.

Now I'll think about other categories...

Posted by Jane R (# 331) on :

Stetson:

quote:
To the extent that we can talk aboout there being "men's films" and "women's films", I woulda thought that Groundhog Day has ample qualification the latter category. Romantic comedy, promoting long-term commitments and a nurturing approach to life.

Yebbut. The main character is a man, and the film is all about him reforming his jerkishness in order to be worthy of the woman he loves. None of the other characters is really developed properly; they're all just background for him. Heck, the universe stops time and keeps replaying the same day until he gets it right!

I thought it was a mildly amusing film, but I wouldn't go out of my way to watch it again. The underlying message is 'the world revolves around this guy' and I don't find it particularly appealing.

Posted by Enoch (# 14322) on :

I'm a bloke, and I thought Ground Hog Day was just about OK for a wet Saturday afternoon in January but not that great.

Maggie though is good entertainment. As a tangent, how many shipmates know that the Vital Spark was probably called after a very popular funeral hymn from the past. There was a time when you couldn't really be buried without it.

Two films which I like, but you may not think they're far enough down the scale to be completely unlisted as Great, are Cabaret and Educating Rita. The latter strikes me as expressing what at one time, before Thatcher and Blair changed everything, we used to think education was about.

Posted by Niminypiminy (# 15489) on :

Baz Luhrmann's Strictly Ballroom which is such a wonderful piece of popular film-making. I watched it again recently and was so struck by its brilliant uses of colour and sound, the patterning of the cuts between two concurrent scenes. And the way the film loves all its characters (even the unlikeable ones), and its brilliantly loving pastiche of the (then) deeply unfashionable world of competitive ballroom dancing.

Posted by Twilight (# 2832) on :

Ah now, I love Groundhog Day, Of course, it does center on the main character, who happens to be a man, but it fulfills a fantasy we all have of getting a chance to have do overs on our mistakes. He goes through a jerky faze of using the opportunity to get women and money, but ultimately he learns that he would rather spend the time helping others and being kind.

I'll add one of my favorites to the Greats list, Howards End. It's also about being kind but demonstrates how complicated it can be to get that right.

Posted by Mr Clingford (# 7961) on :

I'm a man and I like Groundhog Day.

Not only is it funny but it is a great story of theosis, of transformation, of the man from being selfish to selfless.

Posted by Brenda Clough (# 18061) on :

Galaxy Quest. The perfect SF movie.

Posted by Oscar the Grouch (# 1916) on :

quote:
Originally posted by Brenda Clough:
Galaxy Quest. The perfect SF movie.

Agreed. There are so many great things about it, not least Sigourney Weaver and Alan Rickman sending themselves up wonderfully.

Talking of Alan Rickman reminds me of Truly, Deeply, Madly - a film that tended to get ignored because it came out around the same time as "Ghost" and both had the same basic theme. Ghost got all the attention - Truly, Deeply, Madly was far better.

Posted by Lyda*Rose (# 4544) on :

Great animation films:

Lilo and Stitch- has the best little child character in movies in young Lilo. It helps that they did not have to coax a performance out of a real four year old. And I loved how the story was set in what seems to be an accurate version of modern Hawaii.
Up!- other end of the spectrum, a great elderly character. It is a story about life's expectations and regrets, and unexpected fulfillment.
Recently seen- The Book of Life. The story is okay, but the animation is AMAZING! The whole thing is based on the Mexican and Central American culture of Dia de Los Muertos. Yay! A new fantasy setting and No Princesses!

Posted by Enoch (# 14322) on :

quote:
Originally posted by Oscar the Grouch:
... Talking of Alan Rickman reminds me of Truly, Deeply, Madly - a film that tended to get ignored because it came out around the same time as "Ghost" and both had the same basic theme. Ghost got all the attention - Truly, Deeply, Madly was far better.

Definitely agree there.

Posted by Ariel (# 58) on :

quote:
Originally posted by Palimpsest:
Groundhog day continues to grow on me. A friend said it was a gender disparate film. Men like it, Women don't.

It's one of my favourite films. The unspoken premise behind it's always intrigued me - who or what is forcing Phil to relive the same day over and over again? Also, eventually he does succeed in moving on into the next day, but only when he becomes a genuinely nicer person and has had time to slow down and develop some impressive skills, instead of someone coolly and determinedly trying a whole bunch of different tactics just to get off with Rita.

It's quite a moral sort of story but in a modern setting, amusing but also food for thought at the same time.

Posted by Prester John (# 5502) on :

Mike Judge's Office Space . A classic that captures the ridiculousness of American corporate life.

Posted by lilBuddha (# 14333) on :

quote:
Originally posted by Lyda*Rose:
Recently seen- The Book of Life. The story is okay, but the animation is AMAZING! The whole thing is based on the Mexican and Central American culture of Dia de Los Muertos. Yay! A new fantasy setting and No Princesses!

Loved The Book of Life. And, though the criticism of 'The story is okay' is accurate in itself, I think it misses the mark a little.
In the original Star Wars, the story (and some of the writing) is not exactly stellar. But the sum of the parts is more than the whole. I think this defines many "great" films.

Posted by no prophet's flag is set so... (# 15560) on :

Can't watch Up!. Too close to the time when my mother died and has all the sentimental associations. It's too good for me to ever try to watch again.

I nominate The Sorcerer, a 1977 film about a bunch of criminals each from a different country and place who all end up fleeing to a South American country and work together to put out an oil well fire. Vastly underrated.

I also nominate the 1980 movie The Stuntman which is about a guy who escapes from prison and hides within an on-location movie production being directed by Peter O'Toole's character.

Posted by Pancho (# 13533) on :

I can't think of many times or places besides this thread where I've seen Groundhog Day described as a men's or women's picture but it is a great movie.

I love Hitchcock so I like Rope a lot but I don't think it's his most underrated film.

(I also wouldn't call it one of his early films. It was made in 1948 after he'd already made Rebecca, Spellbound, and Notorious. It's more like mid-era Hitchcock. I think of early Hitchcock as movies he made before he came to Hollywood and made Rebecca.)

The Hitchcock movie I think is really under appreciated is Shadow of a Doubt from 1943. It's got an intelligent, plucky, teenage heroine. It's got small-town Americana. It's got a little gentle black humor. It's got great character actors. It's got Teresa Wright and Joseph Cotten. They say it was Hitchcock's personal favorite. It's an all-around great movie.

Posted by QLib (# 43) on :

I love Groundhog day and I also like Jumanji. I'm not sure that I'm a good judge of film, though - I suspect the impact a film has on me may depend on a variety of random factors. I remember being very taken with The Ruling Class when I was a student and then not being at all immersed when I saw it again in later life.

Other greats, for my money, include Harvey, To Kill a Mockingbird and The Amazon Queen.

Posted by Firenze (# 619) on :

Another vote for Truly, Madly, Deeply.

And Topsy Turvey by Mike Leigh.

Posted by Brenda Clough (# 18061) on :

The Incredibles. Far and away the best super-hero movie ever made. I notice that the movies that I like are never in the center of their genre, but commenting upon it, over to one side. Another grand super-hero movie is Unbreakable.

Posted by Oscar the Grouch (# 1916) on :

quote:
Originally posted by no prophet's flag is set so...:
Can't watch Up!. Too close to the time when my mother died and has all the sentimental associations. It's too good for me to ever try to watch again.

Mrs Grouch has a similar problem. Carl reminds her of her late father so much that she breaks down into tears every time she sees the film.

Some films are just too painful to watch, no matter how good they are.

Posted by Eutychus (# 3081) on :

As reported on the "films that make you cry" thread, I can't get past the prologue of Up! and indeed daren't watch it ever again.

I will happily watch Groundhog Day many times though, which is a bit recursive. For all the reasons Mr Clingford and Ariel give.

And I would again like to nominate The Apostle as a film a lot more people should watch.

Finally, The Shawshank Redemption must surely count as one of the most under-rated films on release.

Posted by Hedgehog (# 14125) on :

I agree with a lot of the ones that have been mentioned, like Rope and Groundhog Day and Galaxy Quest. I can buy into Grand Hotel although I think I prefer the similar Dinner at Eight.

But my nomination would be the original Miracle on 34th Street, if only because the casting is uniformly brilliant for virtually ever role in the film, even the bit parts. Edmund Gwenn as Kris Kringle is the very embodiment of a right jolly old elf, and Natalie Wood's Susan is remarkable for a child being played as a child and not as a cynical adult in a little body. Her excited bobbing and whispering "It worked!" to Fred when their plan to get him invited to dinner worked is pure child! But it is the bit parts where you have to tip your hat to whoever did the casting. Again, in the child ranks, the little Dutch girl, when she turns to look with pure love towards her foster mother brilliant conveys what she is thinking even if you don't understand a word that she is saying. The Judge's granddaughter gives possibly the best "Hmph!" in film history. And the casting of the Judge, the Judge's political adviser, the toy store department head, his intoxicated wife, etc. etc. are all spot on. Even the weary post office employees sick of sorting letters to Santa! Really, whoever did the casting for this movie should have received an Academy Award.

Posted by Albertus (# 13356) on :

Agreed on Truly, Madly, Deeply (and Juliet Stevenson is only ever good on film- on stage she overacts appallingly) and The Apostle- the latter a terrific insight into vocation.

Posted by Twilight (# 2832) on :

The opening scene of The Apostle is something I'll never forget. I agree, it's a great movie. While were on religious themes, I think Elmer Gantry is pretty great. I'm waiting for the day someone makes a good movie about Aimee Semple MacPherson.

Posted by Albertus (# 13356) on :

Yes, now you mention it, why hasn't anyone? Her story has everything!

Posted by Snags (# 15351) on :

For total commercial schlock that is still somehow really re-watchable, I often come back to The Last Boy Scout. It's like the quintessential Bruce Willis film yet somehow slightly to one side and just done well and straight.

Posted by Sparrow (# 2458) on :

quote:
Originally posted by Ariel:

quote:
Originally posted by Palimpsest:
Groundhog day continues to grow on me. A friend said it was a gender disparate film. Men like it, Women don't.
It's one of my favourite films. The unspoken premise behind it's always intrigued me - who or what is forcing Phil to relive the same day over and over again? Also, eventually he does succeed in moving on into the next day, but only when he becomes a genuinely nicer person and has had time to slow down and develop some impressive skills, instead of someone coolly and determinedly trying a whole bunch of different tactics just to get off with Rita.

It's quite a moral sort of story but in a modern setting, amusing but also food for thought at the same time.

I'm female and I love Groundhog Day, it's one of my top ten favourites. It's deeply moral, it's about redemption.

Posted by goperryrevs (# 13504) on :

Another vote here for The Apostle. Robert Duvall is my favourite actor and a fine director.

My all-time favourite film is probably still Buffalo '66, even though Vincent Gallo is a pretentious arse up his own arse, I still love him. Sticking with Duvall, Falling Down is still just awesome. Tree of Life is one of the most breathtaking and moving films I've ever seen - and like no other film I've ever seen. It has unique story-telling, but is also probably a bit too pretentious for some. Eternal sunshine of a spotless mind will always be a favourite. And yeah, anything by the Coen brothers. My favourite is probably O brother, but there are so many brilliant films to choose from. Away from US films, Michael Haneke's Code Unknown blew me away.

I could keep going, but that's probably enough for now. Don't know if any of those are already counted as Great, but they're all near the top of my list of favourite films, and they're not as mainstream as some of the more obvious ones (Godfather anyone?)

Posted by Stetson (# 9597) on :

quote:
Originally posted by Prester John:
Mike Judge's Office Space . A classic that captures the ridiculousness of American corporate life.

I love the way the boss keeps telling the guy "I need you to go ahead and come in on Saturday", as if working on the weekend was something the employee had asked to do.

Posted by Kelly Alves (# 2522) on :

quote:
Originally posted by Pancho:
[QB
The Hitchcock movie I think is really under appreciated is Shadow of a Doubt from 1943. It's got an intelligent, plucky, teenage heroine. It's got small-town Americana. It's got a little gentle black humor. It's got great character actors. It's got Teresa Wright and Joseph Cotten. They say it was Hitchcock's personal favorite. It's an all-around great movie. [/QB]

This is one of my favorite films ever.

I also second the nominations of Truly, Madly, Deeply and Office Space.

Falling Down is kind of like Cherries Garcia ice cream to me-- most of the time I don't think about it, but now and again I get a craving for it.

[ 16. December 2014, 00:44: Message edited by: Kelly Alves ]

Posted by lilBuddha (# 14333) on :

quote:
Originally posted by Brenda Clough:
Another grand super-hero movie is Unbreakable.

Fantastic movie. I thought it highly underrated.

ETA: Falling Down Yes, fantastic!

[ 16. December 2014, 01:12: Message edited by: lilBuddha ]

Posted by Stetson (# 9597) on :

Kelly wrote:

quote:
Falling Down is kind of like Cherries Garcia ice cream to me-- most of the time I don't think about it, but now and again I get a craving for it.

I quite liked that film. But one thing I found a little irksome was the way it couldn't seem to make up its mind about how it wanted to portray the main character. It's one thing to make a character morally ambiguous, but in Falling Down, I got the impression that the writers were trying to appeal to both sides of the spectrum simulataneously, and in a rather awkward, ham-fisted fashion.

Okay, on the one hand, the guy is a violent racist(he tells the Korean to learn English if he wants to live in America), and we know we're supposed to be against that, because Robert Duvall tells him at the end "Yeah, you're the bad guy!", in a pretty authorial tone, as if stating the whole point of the movie.

All well and good, but earlier, we had seen him gun down a neo-nazi shopkeeper, and justify himself by criticizing the nazi's sexist treatment of a female cusotmer. Basically, a LIBERAL revenge fantasy.

I realize that people don't always fit the cardboard cut-out ideological categories, and there probably are folks in this world who would yell at immigrants for not learning English, but also consider sexist harassment to be a major moral outrage. But, with that film, I got the impression that the writers had a conversation like this...

-Hey, you know, we might get a lot of flack from liberals about all this right-wing violence. You know how those guys always miss the point.

-Well, let's throw in a scene where he kills a nazi for some politically correct reason. That'll keep 'em happy.

-But, doesn't that contradict the idea that he's the bad guy?

-Yeah, but they probably won't notice.

Posted by betjemaniac (# 17618) on :

A Canterbury Tale - best film ever made. I Know Where I'm Going! -a close second.

But, if you're English, it's impossible to watch ACT and not cry - with joy, loss, and every other emotion under the sun.

Posted by Albertus (# 13356) on :

Very, very true. Additionally so in my case as I grew up around Canterbury at a time when there were plenty of people about who remembered the Baedeker raid of June '42, so I found those long shots of the bombed city especially moving.
Selections from the Powell & Pressburger oeuvre ought to be part fo the training for the citizenship test. When you get to the point where you blub, or can understand why people blub, at them, you are fully integrated. [Smile]

Posted by Lord Jestocost (# 12909) on :

quote:
Originally posted by Albertus:
Selections from the Powell & Pressburger oeuvre ought to be part fo the training for the citizenship test. When you get to the point where you blub, or can understand why people blub, at them, you are fully integrated.

In which case I add A Matter of Life and Death to the list. A stunning fantasy at any time but especially when you consider it was made during WW2, on a shoestring budget and with 1940s special effects. If made nowadays it would be all CGI and probably star Nicolas Cage ...

Which reminds me to add also the original, Cage-free, Edward Woodwardwardward The Wicker Man.

Posted by Paul. (# 37) on :

Wow. Heartening to see so many of my favourite movies already mentioned. Shipmates clearly have good taste!

I will say I never quite got Truly, Madly, Deeply I wanted to. I liked the actors. I'd heard about it but never saw it until I got it on DVD years after release and it was OK but not great. The less said about the hopping scene the better.

A lesser known Anthony Minghella movie I really like is Mr Wonderful. It's about a man who sets up his ex-wife on dates in hopes she'll re-marry and free him up from alimony. It's got some really great performances including the first time I ever saw James Gandolfini.

Speaking of lesser known works by directors known for big epics - Ridley Scott's Matchstick Men is fun. Nicholas Cage as an OCD-suffering con-man whose life is disrupted by someone from his past. It's a really well executed comedy caper film. Sam Rockwell shines as his younger side-kick.

Posted by Sipech (# 16870) on :

Another fan of Truly, Madly, Deeply here. Years later, shortly before his death, Anthony Minghella wrote and directed Breaking and Entering which was pretty much panned by the critics. Yet I found it captivating. As with Truly, Madly, Deeply, Minghella managed to capture beauty in the ordinary.

Posted by Stetson (# 9597) on :

Combining the aforementioned Scott with the aforementioned Gandolfini...

Welcome To The Rileys was an overlooked little film, directed by Ridley's son Jake and starring James as a middle-aged guy who hires a young prostiture to take the place of his dead daughter. Not as sordid as it might sound, as their relationship remains strictly platonic, and the man even convinces his wife to go along with it. Hilarious, heartbreaking, all that stuff.

Cracks, directed by Ridley's daughter Jordan, is another matter. Basically a Miss Jean Brodie story with some salacious innuendo tossed in to keep the dirty old men happy. Mildly amusing, in that cheezy-erotica-trying-to-be-art sorta way.

[ 16. December 2014, 12:29: Message edited by: Stetson ]

Posted by Stetson (# 9597) on :

Sipech wrote:

quote:
Anthony Minghella wrote and directed Breaking and Entering which was pretty much panned by the critics. Yet I found it captivating. As with Truly, Madly, Deeply, Minghella managed to capture beauty in the ordinary.

I think I liked that, though I can barely remember it.

I think(not having seen all his films) that Minghella's masterpiece was probably The Talented Mr. Ripley. I'm not usually very interested in things set in southern Eurpoe, but that one drew me in. Even the weird sexual politics and cultural chauvinism worked for me, given that the film was based on a book written in the 1950s.

Posted by Eigon (# 4917) on :

I'm with Lord Jestocost - A Matter of Life and Death is a brilliant movie.
I love Colonel Blimp as well (that moment when his house has become a lake....)
There's another David Niven film that I was very impressed with when I finally got round to seeing it, and that's Dawn Patrol. Errol Flynn doing some serious acting, Basil Rathbone, and a powerful message about the waste of life in the First World War - just before the Second. Just forget about the fields of France looking just like California.
And in the Second World War, one of my favourites is The Way to the Stars, with John Mills at his best. I love some of the scenes in the hotel near the air base, like the American flyers being introduced to British beer, or the fussy lady complaining about the RAF high spirits when they were off duty.

Posted by QLib (# 43) on :

quote:
Originally posted by Sparrow:

quote:
Originally posted by Ariel:

quote:
Originally posted by Palimpsest:
Groundhog day continues to grow on me. A friend said it was a gender disparate film. Men like it, Women don't.
It's one of my favourite films. The unspoken premise behind it's always intrigued me - who or what is forcing Phil to relive the same day over and over again? Also, eventually he does succeed in moving on into the next day, but only when he becomes a genuinely nicer person and has had time to slow down and develop some impressive skills, instead of someone coolly and determinedly trying a whole bunch of different tactics just to get off with Rita.

It's quite a moral sort of story but in a modern setting, amusing but also food for thought at the same time.
I'm female and I love Groundhog Day, it's one of my top ten favourites. It's deeply moral, it's about redemption.

Me too (as above). Furthermore, I don't think I've ever met a woman who didn't like it - not that it crops up in every conversation I have - whereas I have met blokes who don't rate it.

Posted by betjemaniac (# 17618) on :

Yes, The Way to the Stars goes on the list - for Johnny.

Maybe also John Gregson in Angels one Five. Tunes of Glory is another one where you can see Alec Guinness acting everyone else off the screen.

2 David Niven films at least near greatness - The Paper Tiger, and Carrington VC.

Posted by no prophet's flag is set so... (# 15560) on :

If you're considering Groundhog Day, then I must nominate Caddy Shack (both movies have Bill Murray and a ground hog). The bishop golfing in the rain scene. Bill Murray golfing flowers while doing faux commentary. The anecdote about caddying for the Dalai Lama.

Posted by Palimpsest (# 16772) on :

The actor who played Ned the insurance guy described Groundhog Day as a Buddhist parable. I like it because it thoroughly explores the possibilities of what you might do in the circumstances. Usually such premises leave me feeling as though many solutions were unexplored. If you believe in re-incarnation it could be seen as a parable for life.

The same friend who mentioned the gender disparity also told me that Laurence of Arabia was vastly preferred by gay men. It's a film I love for the scenery, the photography, the score and the acting. The politics do leave me queasy. It's not an obscure film.

Besides Up! and The Incredibles. I also am fond of Ratatouille in the Pixar work.

I'm not a huge fan of westerns, but a few stand out. The man who shot Liberty Valance, The Ballad of Cable Hogue.

My favorite Hitchcock is North by Northwest.

From Japan, A Taxing Woman, Tampopo and "The Seven Samurai. My Neighbor Totoro is perfect in its own way.

Posted by Pancho (# 13533) on :

quote:
Originally posted by no prophet's flag is set so...:
If you're considering Groundhog Day, then I must nominate Caddy Shack (both movies have Bill Murray and a ground hog). The bishop golfing in the rain scene. Bill Murray golfing flowers while doing faux commentary. The anecdote about caddying for the Dalai Lama.

The rodent in Caddyshack is a gopher, not a groundhog. Just sayin'....

Seriously, I think Caddyshack is a funny movie but it doesn't have the depth that Groundhog Day has.

quote:
Originally posted by Palimpsest:
The same friend who mentioned the gender disparity also told me that Laurence of Arabia was vastly preferred by gay men. It's a film I love for the scenery, the photography, the score and the acting. The politics do leave me queasy. It's not an obscure film.

At the risk of sounding snarky, I'm beginning to question your friend's judgement. Laurence of Arabia routinely gets included on lists bests movies ever made. While it has something for everybody, I do sometimes see it recommended as a guy's movie (because of its themes of valor, lost causes, camaraderie, etc. and the battle scenes) but I haven't seen a vast preference for it by gay men. I use to sell DVDs for a living so I'd have a good idea if it were so.

I second the nomination for I Know Where I'm Going!, a terrific movie that deserves to be widely seen. I love Wendy Hiller's acting in this. She begins the movie as such a self-assured, confident young woman and then once she gets to Scotland things get in the way. There's a great moment during the dance scene where she is listening to Roger Livesey and you can absolutely see her falling apart inside. Roger Livesey is a awesome too. Plus, it's got bagpipes!

Posted by Cottontail (# 12234) on :

Oh yes - The Man who shot Liberty Valance is one of the best westerns ever. Morally very complex, and a deeply ambiguous ending.

Another film that went straight into my top 5 was Infernal Affairs, the Hong Kong film that was later remade by Scorcese as The Departed. The original is far far better, though, and a hundred times more subtle. It explores a Buddhist cosmology, and it beautifully shot, almost balletic at times. Breathtaking.

Posted by doubtingthomas (# 14498) on :

May I nominate Metropolis?
And indeed, Fritz Lang's achievement more widely...

Further, 2001, as recommended on the "not seen" thread - which I will then have to follow up with the shamefaced admission Groundhog Day constitutes one of the more significant gaps in my education...

...and yes, I second Infernal Affairs!

Posted by balaam (# 4543) on :

As films about redemption go, it's hard to beat The Fisher King.

Posted by Palimpsest (# 16772) on :

Infernal Affairs is quite good. Do avoid the sequels.
I'm not a big fan of Hong Kong bullet ballets, but I have a friend who drags me to them. I do have a fondness for Jackie Chan's "Miracles" a remake of "Pocketful of Miracles".

Moving in the other direction; The Japanese original of "Shall We Dance" was better than the Hollywood remake.

Posted by Eigon (# 4917) on :

Thanks, betjemaniac - I'd forgotten Paper Tiger, and the way David Niven's character inspires the child's courage.

Posted by Oscar the Grouch (# 1916) on :

I am nominating a film, not necessarily because it is "great" but because I feel it frequently gets a raw deal from "proper" film critics.

It is Support Your Local Sheriff, staring the sadly departed James Garner.

No matter how often I see it, it still makes me laugh. All the cast perform brilliantly, although James Garner probably just wins out over Walter Brennan, with Bruce Dern not far behind.

It doesn't claim to be ground-breaking, or subversive or anything; it is what it is - a fun film.

Posted by Jemima the 9th (# 15106) on :

I have a big soft spot for Little Miss Sunshine. It's weird and brilliant. Brilliantly weird, perhaps, or weirdly brilliant.

And Shooting Fish. A small film (in a good way) about a couple of con men who live in a gas tower. I loved it in my romantic day-dreamy early 20s. I almost daren't watch it again in case it lets me down.

Posted by Ariel (# 58) on :

quote:
Originally posted by Pancho:

quote:
Originally posted by Palimpsest:
The same friend who mentioned the gender disparity also told me that Laurence of Arabia was vastly preferred by gay men. It's a film I love for the scenery, the photography, the score and the acting. The politics do leave me queasy. It's not an obscure film.
At the risk of sounding snarky, I'm beginning to question your friend's judgement. Laurence of Arabia routinely gets included on lists bests movies ever made. While it has something for everybody, I do sometimes see it recommended as a guy's movie (because of its themes of valor, lost causes, camaraderie, etc. and the battle scenes) but I haven't seen a vast preference for it by gay men. I use to sell DVDs for a living so I'd have a good idea if it were so.

I also like "Lawrence of Arabia". The film takes a few liberties - and of course O'Toole was quite a lot taller than Lawrence - but it's still a good adventure film, and the desert scenery is pretty good. The music does get very repetitive, though.

I may as well add that I've never heard any of my gay friends mention it when discussing films they think are great.

Posted by lilBuddha (# 14333) on :

quote:
Originally posted by Ariel:

I may as well add that I've never heard any of my gay friends mention it when discussing films they think are great.

Possibly because any homosexuality needs to be read into the movie? Nothing says, overtly, that Lawrence is gay. Even the rape scene is implied.

Posted by Adeodatus (# 4992) on :

quote:
Originally posted by doubtingthomas:
May I nominate Metropolis?
And indeed, Fritz Lang's achievement more widely...

You're gosh-darned right you may! The thing is, if you're into science fiction or German expressionism, Metropolis is going to be on your list of Great movies. Outside those genres, possibly not. And that's often the fate of "genre" movies.

For great genre movies that should be included in great movies, full stop, I'd nominate The Innocents - one of the greatest horror movies of all time.

Posted by doubtingthomas (# 14498) on :

quote:
Originally posted by Adeodatus:

quote:
Originally posted by doubtingthomas:
May I nominate Metropolis?
And indeed, Fritz Lang's achievement more widely...
You're gosh-darned right you may! The thing is, if you're into science fiction or German expressionism, Metropolis is going to be on your list of Great movies. Outside those genres, possibly not. And that's often the fate of "genre" movies.

For great genre movies that should be included in great movies, full stop, I'd nominate The Innocents - one of the greatest horror movies of all time.

I'd argue that Metropolis transcends the sci-fi genre, and (more widely) Lang has used a variety of genres and settings in his work. I take your point about the style: expressionism can be a bit of an acquired taste (though spectacularly rewarded once acquired - Cabinet of Dr. Caligari anyone?). I fell for it as a teenager and have never looked back.

I apologize for not being able to comment on your nomination, not having seen it, but will try and seek it out (and check whether I'll be able to cope...).

[ 17. December 2014, 22:37: Message edited by: doubtingthomas ]

Posted by Adeodatus (# 4992) on :

quote:
Originally posted by doubtingthomas:
I'd argue that Metropolis transcends the sci-fi genre, and (more widely) Lang has used a variety of genres and settings in his work. I take your point about the style: expressionism can be a bit of an acquired taste (though spectacularly rewarded once acquired - Cabinet of Dr. Caligari anyone?). I fell for it as a teenager and have never looked back.

I apologize for not being able to comment on your nomination, not having seen it, but will try and seek it out (and check whether I'll be able to cope...).

Caligari has to be on the list of great movies. I've been assuming it would already be there - although I suppose with its being a "silent" it tends not to get shown much these days on tv or in cinemas. I think to really appreciate it, you also need to see a good or well-restored print, because the design work is simply awesome. I think there are a couple of copies on a popular video upload site, but I don't know what the quality's like.

The Innocents (1963, I think) is the best movie adaptation of Henry James's The Turn of the Screw, which for my money is one of the first and greatest pieces of psychological horror fiction written.

Posted by Kelly Alves (# 2522) on :

quote:
Originally posted by Jane R:

I thought it was a mildly amusing film, but I wouldn't go out of my way to watch it again. The underlying message is 'the world revolves around this guy' and I don't find it particularly appealing.

Theoretically I agree with you, but Andie McDowell is one of those actresses that defy a scriptwiter's attempts to render her a character without a POV, so It works for me.

Posted by Timothy the Obscure (# 292) on :

Hearing John Cleese interviewed on "Fresh Air" yesterday reminded me that A Fish Called Wanda is one of the smartest and funniest comedies ever (take that, Woody Allen), and deserves to be rated much higher than it seems to be.

Posted by Palimpsest (# 16772) on :

Another underappreciated gem is "Dark Star", a student produced science fiction film by John Carpenter and Dan O'Bannon. It has a budget of about 75 cents but is quite funny.

Posted by Karl: Liberal Backslider (# 76) on :

Excalibur - the only fault is conflating the Sword of the Kings of Britain with Excalibur (in the original legends the latter is given when the former is broken)

The Wicker Man - or perhaps it is listed as Great - who has the list?

Posted by lilBuddha (# 14333) on :

quote:
Originally posted by Karl: Liberal Backslider:
- who has the list?

I do. Just give your nomination and I shall let you know if it is included.

BTW, Excalibur just missed.

[ 19. December 2014, 15:30: Message edited by: lilBuddha ]

Posted by Sir Kevin (# 3492) on :

The World's End by Simon Pegg featuring the voice of Bill Nighy is arguably the world's greatest zombie film. It involves five blokes who were schoolboys together making a pub crawl which ends up in a very strange scene, a real special-effects tour de force!

Posted by Oscar the Grouch (# 1916) on :

quote:
Originally posted by Palimpsest:
Another underappreciated gem is "Dark Star", a student produced science fiction film by John Carpenter and Dan O'Bannon. It has a budget of about 75 cents but is quite funny.

Man! I haven't seen "Dark Star" for years. Woefully underrated film.

Posted by Sparrow (# 2458) on :

So many Bette Davis films - but I'd have to vote for All About Eve.

Posted by Stetson (# 9597) on :

I really like the Nora Ephron comedy Lucky Numbers.

Not sure why, but I just think that some of the scenes are quite well executed. Especially John Travolta's fantasizing about how the insurance scam will turn out, as compared to how it actually goes.

Also, and this is obviously a pretty idiosyncratic taste, but I like films set in cold, wintery climates.

Posted by QLib (# 43) on :

quote:
Originally posted by Sparrow:
So many Bette Davis films - but I'd have to vote for All About Eve.

Seconded.

Posted by Kelly Alves (# 2522) on :

This is probably going to be a controversial one, but I am going to nominate Erin Brokavitch.

First of all, I like a good legal David and Goliath story (see: A Civil Action and Philadelphia). What stands out for me with this one is that, concurrent to the legal stuff, it is the story of an unemployable, un-charming, poverty level, pretty much loser of a woman suddenly finding her niche and becoming vitally necessary to her community.

Aside-- I am finding that now Julia Roberst has moved past the place where people relegate her to cutesy rom com roles, she is becoming an acting phenom. Again I am going to recommend August: Osage County , with the caveat that it is not for the faint of heart. She hit it out of the park.

She also hit it out of the park playing a fictionalized version of Dr. Linda Laubenstein in the HBO movie, The Normal Heart, based on the Larry Kramer play of the same name. Really not for the faint of heart, but Roberts again really shows her chops-- when she is allowed to act beyond that perfect face shot, she really soars.

[ 05. January 2015, 17:28: Message edited by: Kelly Alves ]

Posted by ChaliceGirl (# 13656) on :

quote:
Originally posted by Prester John:
Mike Judge's Office Space . A classic that captures the ridiculousness of American corporate life.

I agree!
We're not alone, it has a huge cult following!

"Did you see the memo?" [Smile]

Posted by Kelly Alves (# 2522) on :

One who has died without seeing Office Space is one who has lived a wasted life.

Posted by Heavenly Anarchist (# 13313) on :

Delicatessen remains my all time favourite, beautifully dark and funny.
Another vote for The Talented Mr Ripley, a gripping film. And I also throw my support behind Metropolis as it was a groundbreaker, truly revolutionary in approach.

Posted by Pancho (# 13533) on :

There's another movie that, while I wouldn't call it "great", I think is very good and deserves to be widely seen. It's I Walked with a Zombie from 1943 directed by Jacques Tourneur. I know, I know, the title is ridiculous and I suppose it isn't all that scary but it's an elegant and poetic movie.

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