• If I want something to "wash over" me, then an Orthodox service will do fine, especially with a good choir.
• A thoughtful Taize service
• An "ordinary" Parish Holy Communion during Advent (as long as we get to sing "O Come, O Come, Emmanuel")
• A sunrise Easter service on the beach

 

---

Posted by Magersfontein Lugg (# 18240) on :
 
I am sure that it varies depending where we are in life.

I remember a few years back going to a House Church praise service when life was hard for me and I found the experience deeply upsetting. It seemed so full of false heartiness - just what I didn't want. I say 'seemed,' because I think it was more about where I was. At that time quiet Compline would be best.

Sometimes in worship I find the spiritual more in the horizontal - among others, over fellowship, in 'doing it' together. (I guess the imminent God )

But then for my soul at other times the transcendent is what feeds. Then I often find stillness and quiet, with others, good - and yes, say, Evensong or Benediction.

And yes why is the silence, the beauty, the richness of image and word, getting more difficult to find in the dear old C of E!
 

---

Posted by Zappa (# 8433) on :
 
For three decades now nothing for me has surpassed Eucharist, sung, said, or mimed. Not that I've ever attended a mimed liturgy but it would move me equally. To recall the saving acts of God and then experience their incarnation in the elements (whether I am presiding or participating in other ways) is beyond-words-sacred and there is for me no near match.
 

---

Posted by Magersfontein Lugg (# 18240) on :
 
I too find sacramental worship very important.

And yet too Quaker meeting for worship too.

Ethos / preparation before it all begins is helpful to me too. I hate a noisy church that then crashes into worship
 

---

Posted by womanspeak (# 15394) on :
 
In my old age I feel really fed by lively worship singing. I spent a week this year at a Bush Church Aid retreat with fellow missionaries from all over Australia.
And while the whole week was heavenly for a couple who usually travel and minister apart from out home church for most of the year, it was the worship band and the whole hearted praise of 100 faithful Christian families that fed the spirit.

A fiddler and pianist from SA, an Aboriginal singer from NSW, plus bass, percussion, drums and lead guitar and singer in a moving feast of musicians each morning for morning prayer fed my very soul.

As one who usually experiences very ordinary musicianship in church,( the dreaded 90 yr old slowing down organist) the enthusiasm and inclusiveness of lively modern music was almost too much.
 

---

Posted by Gamaliel (# 812) on :
 
Interesting ... it makes a change to hear some more positive and appreciative reactions towards contemporary worship styles ... they are usually criticised on these boards.

I think it reinforces the view I'm coming to that it's all a matter of 'context' ...

If you're out in the bush or on the mission field or something then the kind of high-octane worship-songs/chorus format is going to give you a boost.

What I found, though, when I was involved with churches whose main worship diet consisted of that sort of approach, was that it soon cloyed and became 'the norm' - I was desperate to get to a traditional 1662 service or similar for some respite ...



A lot of it depends on what's going on around us and what the context is ...

Personally, I wouldn't lose any sleep if I never attended a service such as Womanspeak describes ever, ever again ...

I wouldn't have a visceral reaction against it, nor would I dismiss its value or importance for those who are participating in it ... but it wouldn't be where I was 'at' ...

Equally, where I'm now 'at' isn't where other people are 'at' and they'd struggle with I'd go for just as I'd struggle with their 'thang'.
 

---

Posted by Jengie jon (# 273) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by Magersfontein Lugg:
Ethos / preparation before it all begins is helpful to me too. I hate a noisy church that then crashes into worship

---

I have worked close enough with charismatic worship leaders (I worked the OHP) to know that what you experience as random noise is anything but. There is a slight difference. The planning looks far more like an emergency planning session than a military manoeuvre. It has a lot of "If this then that... ". This is so as make it responsive to Holy Spirit/worshipping congregation. This includes repetitions and such.

Actually my impression is a lot more care is put into selecting what is sung by the congregation in your average Charismatic Service than is your average Anglican family communion.

Yes I know how it sounds (I have hyperacussis, and loud means to me cacophonic. I avoid opera for much the same reason. However, the volume, the music style and such responsive planning do not add up to a lack of planning. Yes some people like to know exactly what is coming next but others like to feel that worship responds to them.

Jengie
 

---

Posted by Gamaliel (# 812) on :
 
Most self-respecting charismatic churches have gone beyond the OHP these days, Jengie Jon ... but I know what you're getting at and wouldn't disagree when it comes to comparisons with - generally baneful - Anglican 'Family Worship' ...

Indeed, I'd largely suggest that the use of worship-songs and choruses doesn't tend to 'work' so well in less avowedly charismatic settings precisely because they are missing out on the dynamic that you are alluding to.

There is a kind of unwritten 'expectation' within charismatic circles - which doesn't necessarily imply it's false or 'forced' - about what the 'worship set' approach is intended to achieve. Consequently - whether consciously or unconsciously - there's a kind of two-way flow going on between the worship leader/s and the congregation ... which isn't generally the case - or conducted in quite the same way - in more 'traditional' settings.

The danger, I think, is that this two-way interaction can lead to a certain level of dependency and also creates space and opportunity for emotional manipulation. But the mileage varies.
 

---

Posted by Magersfontein Lugg (# 18240) on :
 
I find difficult services that try too much and so are embarrassing or a strain. I went a few months ago to a country church whichj had the old BCP and 5 hymns from ancient and modern (an old edition) and about ten of us there with a not very good organist. It was such a strain and not very spiritual I am sorry to say.

How much better if we'd had warmth (it was cold) - simple gentle recorded music and sat quiet instead of all those hymns and then sang two hymns...
But thats where I was maybe the old lady next to me thought the opposite!
 

---

Posted by womanspeak (# 15394) on :
 
Maggestfontein Lugg I concur.

I have experienced too many badly sung, badly accompanied Sung Eucharists in small country churches with clergy robed to the nines in century breaking temperatures.

I love cathedral worship but the nearest is 700 kms away. And yet some clergy feel that the only true worship is an Oxford Movement influenced Eucharist with bells and smells and sung responses in the wrong context of a small ( less than twenty) congregation with few musical resources.

The result does not feed the spirit but alienates newcomers and regulars alike.

I've moved on to a more responsive denomination whose music is a simple combination of modern worship songs accompanied by guitar and piano accompanied hymns which suits the context of all age worship. Worshippers include a large number of runaway Anglicans like me and manspeak.
 

---

Posted by Gamaliel (# 812) on :
 
I can understand all that, Womanspeak, even though these days my inclination is to flee in the opposite direction from the one you've chosen ...

I don't see why traditional forms of worship need be disengaging and off-putting in and of itself, but sadly they often are because delivery can leave much to be desired.

Mind you, 20 people in a hall somewhere trying to replicate the sound and atmosphere of one of the big evangelical rallies doesn't work any better than attempts to replicate cathedral worship in a tin-hut somewhere with nine people and a dog.
 

---

Posted by Baptist Trainfan (# 15128) on :
 
Depends on the breed of dog ...
 

---

Posted by Gamaliel (# 812) on :
 
Yes, some of them can sing quite well ...
 

---

Posted by Zappa (# 8433) on :
 

 

---

Posted by no prophet's flag is set so... (# 15560) on :
 
To those who are lucky enough to have all these services and settings, I can only be jealous. With the limited resources and sparse churches, ths best service for Anglican, Lutheran or RC is one without country gospel.
 

---

Posted by georgiaboy (# 11294) on :
 
There is a hymn that begins 'Sometimes a light surprises the Christian while he sings.'

I am fortunate to worship in a parish which offers a daily low mass at 8 am; I intend to be there every day and usually get there. The format almost never varies: low mass (in complete vestments) 2 lessons, a brief homily if a saint's day, the so-called 'Gregorian' canon; attendance varies from 2 to 15.

Some days I feel like it's just playing the auto-tape, but this morning 'the light surprised'. I had been pretty much dreading Christmas Eve and was feeling rather cranky about it all, and today's mass just picked me up and wrung me out. (In the best possible sense).

So you never can predict, but just give thanks when it happens.
 

---

Posted by sabine (# 3861) on :
 
Four-part acapella singing at the Mennonite Church I attend. (I am still a Quaker, but I love this congregation--so engaged with the world and all it's needs/issues/brokenness....)

But back to the singing. I cannot read music, and you wouldn't want to hear me sing by myself. But in community, I find my place and it comes together in a lovely sound that makes me want to be a sister to my fellow humans in kinder ways.

sabine
 

---

© Ship of Fools 2016


UBB.classic^TM 6.5.0