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Source: (consider it)
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Thread: What is the point of emulating Jadis?
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Penny S
Shipmate
# 14768
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Posted
Which is what I thought when hearing that the ex-dentist will fight on until he controls his country again. Standing there in Damascus amid ruins and a deserted country empty of all except the dead who could not flee.
Posts: 5833 | Registered: May 2009
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Golden Key
Shipmate
# 1468
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Posted
He's insane? He's claustrophobic? He's a sadistic creep? Having absolute power is his whole definition of himself?
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Blessed Gator, pray for us!
--"Oh bat bladders, do you have to bring common sense into this?" (Dragon, "Jane & the Dragon")
--"Oh, Peace Train, save this country!" (Yusuf/Cat Stevens, "Peace Train")
Posts: 18601 | From: Chilling out in an undisclosed, sincere pumpkin patch. | Registered: Oct 2001
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Doc Tor
Deepest Red
# 9748
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Posted
Because, like Jadis, he sees power as an end in itself. To say, this is mine and you cannot have it, is victory.
Look upon my works, ye mighty, and despair.
[ 14. February 2016, 19:14: Message edited by: Doc Tor ]
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Forward the New Republic
Posts: 9131 | From: Ultima Thule | Registered: Jul 2005
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Pigwidgeon
Ship's Owl
# 10192
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Posted
Are you talking about Bashar al-Assad? Wasn't he an eye doctor? Or am I totally off-track here (which wouldn't be unusual)?
![[Confused]](confused.gif)
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"...that is generally a matter for Pigwidgeon, several other consenting adults, a bottle of cheap Gin and the odd giraffe."
~Tortuf
Posts: 9835 | From: Hogwarts | Registered: Aug 2005
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Penny S
Shipmate
# 14768
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Posted
Oh yes. I got it wrong, not you. I can think why, but it isn't something to share. And I did think Ozymandias, as well. But he wasn't responsible for the devastation.
[ 14. February 2016, 19:31: Message edited by: Penny S ]
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Nenya
Shipmate
# 16427
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Posted
I thought this was a thread about "The Magician's Nephew" ...
![[Hot and Hormonal]](icon_redface.gif)
*Creeps away*
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They told me I was delusional. I nearly fell off my unicorn.
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quetzalcoatl
Shipmate
# 16740
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Posted
I think normally Assad would have been overthrown, but Russia has seen Syria as their gateway to the Middle East. And since the West has basically opted out of doing very much, Putin is having an easy time, bombing the shit out of everyone, and pretending that it's anti-terrorist.
Pretty crude power politics, I suppose, but no-one can stop it now.
One ironic thing in relation to British politics, is that the 'moderate groups' whom Cameron was extolling a while ago, are probably now mostly flattened by Russian bombing.
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I can't talk to you today; I talked to two people yesterday.
Posts: 9878 | From: UK | Registered: Oct 2011
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passer
Indigo
# 13329
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Posted
Russia is poor, with all its state assets given away to Putin's oligarch friends, and all income therefrom being sent abroad, with no investment in its crumbling infrastructure. Life expectancy has plummeted, and the rule of law has evaporated.
It's a country in decline whose only way of distracting its own population from realising this is to indulge in foreign wars and paint itself as a Crusading state led by that chap on the white charger with the shaved chest and the dead eyes. Russia's economy has gone negative, so plunder is its only strategy.
Syria is being lined up to be plundered, with the chinless giraffe-necked optometrist holding the door open, until he realises that Russia has no interest in stability in the region, and he ends up travelling the Gaddafi road to oblivion.
Posts: 1289 | From: Sheffield | Registered: Jan 2008
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mdijon
Shipmate
# 8520
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by quetzalcoatl:
And since the West has basically opted out of doing very much
I'm not sure what I think about this. I had the mis-judgement to supported the airstrike intervention in Libya when Gadaffi's troops were poised to massacre the rebels and civilians in Benghazi. It hasn't gone very well since.
I was against the ground war and the bombing in Iraq. That hasn't gone very well.
Syria doesn't seem to be going very well without either intervention but I'm not sure that's a reason to do anything. It is horrific to watch but I think it might be rational to say that while the mess Western intervention has made of the Middle-East might imply a moral imperative to act - at some point one has to stop this insane "double or quits" attempt to make it better.
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mdijon nojidm uoɿıqɯ ɯqıɿou
ɯqıɿou uoɿıqɯ nojidm mdijon
Posts: 12277 | From: UK | Registered: Sep 2004
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RooK
1 of 6
# 1852
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Posted
Perhaps Russia's involvement in Syria was largely about demonstrating the capabilities of their various war machines - which Iran is now able to purchase. The cynic in me suspects that ever since Iran started negotiating in earnest, Russia has been picking candidates to show live-fire demonstrations of their assets.
It certainly is a better explanation of their circus of combatants engaging in Syria than any actual battle plan against some militants with decrepit rifles. I mean, who sends an air-superiority fighter wing to handle irregular troops in sandy foxholes?
Posts: 15274 | From: Portland, Oregon, USA, Earth | Registered: Nov 2001
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quetzalcoatl
Shipmate
# 16740
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by mdijon:
quote:
Originally posted by quetzalcoatl:
And since the West has basically opted out of doing very much
I'm not sure what I think about this. I had the mis-judgement to supported the airstrike intervention in Libya when Gadaffi's troops were poised to massacre the rebels and civilians in Benghazi. It hasn't gone very well since.
I was against the ground war and the bombing in Iraq. That hasn't gone very well.
Syria doesn't seem to be going very well without either intervention but I'm not sure that's a reason to do anything. It is horrific to watch but I think it might be rational to say that while the mess Western intervention has made of the Middle-East might imply a moral imperative to act - at some point one has to stop this insane "double or quits" attempt to make it better.
Well, I agree. I wasn't suggesting that the West should have gone in with troops. I'm not convinced that the bombing is of any use.
Russia's bombing works, because it is followed up by the Syrian army, who are making gains.
I think Western intervention would have been politically impossible.
I should think Putin thinks he is really showing the West a thing or two, well maybe. It could still all backfire on him yet, but he is probably gaining political clout in the Middle East, which after all, used to be a Western 'area of influence'.
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I can't talk to you today; I talked to two people yesterday.
Posts: 9878 | From: UK | Registered: Oct 2011
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Penny S
Shipmate
# 14768
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Posted
I keep thinking of Guernica.
Three hospitals now.
I heard on the radio that the reason Putin is bombing the moderate opposition is because they are the ones near the Mediterranean port he needs. It's an old business, isn't it? Russia seeking ports which do not freeze.
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passer
Indigo
# 13329
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by RooK:
Perhaps Russia's involvement in Syria was largely about demonstrating the capabilities of their various war machines....
Yes, and to pick up on Penny's observation, it's a Guernica, somewhere to try stuff out without any chance of an air opposition. And as quetzalcoatl says, "Putin thinks he is really showing the West a thing or two".
At some point soon, Turkey will erupt also. When that happens, the best thing the West can do is to pull out completely and let them sort out all their regional differences for the next twenty years or whatever, whilst making sympathetic noises from stage left. Then, when it's resolved itself, acknowledge the new borders and establish working relationships with whatever countries have survived or emerged.
It isn't our quarrel - we will have to adapt to the mass migration currently taking place, as the least bad option, and wait for them all to slug it out, whilst not getting sucked in.
Posts: 1289 | From: Sheffield | Registered: Jan 2008
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quetzalcoatl
Shipmate
# 16740
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Posted
(Reply to point about ports). That's a good point, but Russia is also clearing the ground for Assad's troops to occupy. Whether they want a kind of cordon sanitaire, or a much wider area, I don't know. But all the Russian talk of bombing terrorists seems strictly for the birds.
Another odd consequence is that Iran and Hezbollah are also empowered by this. And of course, the West enfeebled.
[ 15. February 2016, 17:23: Message edited by: quetzalcoatl ]
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I can't talk to you today; I talked to two people yesterday.
Posts: 9878 | From: UK | Registered: Oct 2011
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Ariel
Shipmate
# 58
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Posted
It's partly Putin doing a show of strength and partly the expansionist aim. Russia would like to recoup lost territories (hence Crimea and Ukraine) and expand some more. The thing with the fighter jets over the British coastlines is a bit more sabre-rattling. He needs to maintain popularity at home to maintain support for incursions.
Also, the bombing raids on Syria have the effect of destabilizing Syria even further and by extension the West, as even more refugees try to enter Europe, and in the midst of all the chaos, an unknown number of jihadis slipping quietly in. Turkey, Lebanon and Jordan are already at bursting point but from Syria's point of view that wouldn't be a problem: destabilizing the region would be a means of regaining territory lost about a century ago.
Bombing three hospitals with international staff is a really cynical move, whoever did it. That's two fingers up at the Western world. "I'm going to do what I want and you can't stop me." And the tragedy of it is probably nobody will. They'll rumble about sanctions and glare hard in Russia's direction and Assad's, and meanwhile, the news broadcasts will continue to feature "misdirected" bombing raids.
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quetzalcoatl
Shipmate
# 16740
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Posted
I don't think the West can stop Russia. I mean, in political terms. Obviously, they could shoot down Russian aircraft - impossible though.
Or they could supply the rebel groups with stingers, or whatever they're called today. But of course, IS would end up with some, and shoot down Western airliners.
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I can't talk to you today; I talked to two people yesterday.
Posts: 9878 | From: UK | Registered: Oct 2011
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Ariel
Shipmate
# 58
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Posted
Four hospitals now. Rot in hell, you bastards.
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quetzalcoatl
Shipmate
# 16740
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Posted
It's interesting that Putin has an arm-lock on the West. There is nothing that they can do, except tut-tut. It's rather weird that this has happened, and I suppose various right-wingers are now frothing at the mouth, saying that Obama is weak, or the EU is weak, and we should ... well, what should we do?
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I can't talk to you today; I talked to two people yesterday.
Posts: 9878 | From: UK | Registered: Oct 2011
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Penny S
Shipmate
# 14768
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Posted
We can't though - he's got nuclear bombs, and we think he might throw MAD out of the window and use them.
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Ricardus
Shipmate
# 8757
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Penny S:
I heard on the radio that the reason Putin is bombing the moderate opposition is because they are the ones near the Mediterranean port he needs. It's an old business, isn't it? Russia seeking ports which do not freeze.
I've heard it suggested more straightforwardly that if Assad can defeat the moderates, the war becomes a straight fight between him and Islamic State, in which case the West will have no choice but to support him.
[ 15. February 2016, 22:14: Message edited by: Ricardus ]
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Then the dog ran before, and coming as if he had brought the news, shewed his joy by his fawning and wagging his tail. -- Tobit 11:9 (Douai-Rheims)
Posts: 7247 | From: Liverpool, UK | Registered: Nov 2004
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mdijon
Shipmate
# 8520
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by quetzalcoatl:
And of course, the West enfeebled.
What good did our apparent previous strength and influence in the Middle-East do? I don't see either the benefits for tax payers back home or for the altruistic happiness of humankind.
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mdijon nojidm uoɿıqɯ ɯqıɿou
ɯqıɿou uoɿıqɯ nojidm mdijon
Posts: 12277 | From: UK | Registered: Sep 2004
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mousethief
Ship's Thieving Rodent
# 953
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by quetzalcoatl:
It's interesting that Putin has an arm-lock on the West. There is nothing that they can do, except tut-tut. It's rather weird that this has happened, and I suppose various right-wingers are now frothing at the mouth, saying that Obama is weak, or the EU is weak, and we should ... well, what should we do?
Are these the same right-wingers who think Putin is so manly and decisive where Obama is so weak and ineffectual?
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This is the last sig I'll ever write for you...
Posts: 63536 | From: Washington | Registered: Jul 2001
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Marvin the Martian
Interplanetary
# 4360
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by mousethief:
Are these the same right-wingers who think Putin is so manly and decisive where Obama is so weak and ineffectual?
That's not necessarily an inconsistent position to take. It's perfectly possible to admire someone's leadership abilities while considering them an enemy.
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Hail Gallaxhar
Posts: 30100 | From: Adrift on a sea of surreality | Registered: Apr 2003
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Ricardus
Shipmate
# 8757
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Posted
My impression of Putin is that he has a talent for reacting to events with an inscrutable expression that makes him look as though he had planned them all along.
E.g. I honestly think he would prefer people to believe he murdered Litvinenko or Politkovskaya or Nemtsov, than for them to think that some of his supporters are out of control.
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Then the dog ran before, and coming as if he had brought the news, shewed his joy by his fawning and wagging his tail. -- Tobit 11:9 (Douai-Rheims)
Posts: 7247 | From: Liverpool, UK | Registered: Nov 2004
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LeRoc
Famous Dutch pirate
# 3216
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Posted
quote:
Golden Key: He's insane? He's claustrophobic? He's a sadistic creep? Having absolute power is his whole definition of himself?
I have long argued for compulsory testosterone tests for heads of state.
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I know why God made the rhinoceros, it's because He couldn't see the rhinoceros, so He made the rhinoceros to be able to see it. (Clarice Lispector)
Posts: 9474 | From: Brazil / Africa | Registered: Aug 2002
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Rev per Minute
Shipmate
# 69
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Penny S:
We can't though - he's got nuclear bombs, and we think he might throw MAD out of the window and use them.
Not so much the nukes, as much as the oil and gas Russia supplies to the West, without which us Europeans might freeze. Plus the likely collapse of the London property market if the Russians are bankrupted!
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"Allons-y!" "Geronimo!" "Oh, for God's sake!" The Day of the Doctor
At the end of the day, we face our Maker alongside Jesus. RIP ken
Posts: 2696 | From: my desk (if I can find the keyboard under this mess) | Registered: May 2001
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Penny S
Shipmate
# 14768
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Posted
The last of those might not be a bad thing. Not so sure about the papers and the football clubs.
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mousethief
Ship's Thieving Rodent
# 953
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by LeRoc:
quote:
Golden Key: He's insane? He's claustrophobic? He's a sadistic creep? Having absolute power is his whole definition of himself?
I have long argued for compulsory testosterone tests for heads of state.
If you think testosterone is necessary to do great evil, I can introduce you to many many female heads of state in relatively recent history who disprove your little theory.
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This is the last sig I'll ever write for you...
Posts: 63536 | From: Washington | Registered: Jul 2001
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Eutychus
From the edge
# 3081
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Penny S:
We can't though - he's got nuclear bombs, and we think he might throw MAD out of the window and use them.
The deplorable word, eh?
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Let's remember that we are to build the Kingdom of God, not drive people away - pastor Frank Pomeroy
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LeRoc
Famous Dutch pirate
# 3216
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Posted
quote:
mousethief: If you think testosterone is necessary to do great evil, I can introduce you to many many female heads of state in relatively recent history who disprove your little theory.
My testosterone thing was a joke of course (although I would be interested in a measurement of testosterone levels of people like Putin, Assad and Erdoğan). But I'm interested to know who you'd consider to be evil female heads of state. I reckon that you count Margaret Thatcher among them? Who else?
(PS from a logical point of view, my joking post implies that high testosterone may be a sufficient condition for being an evil head of state, not a necessary one.)
[ 17. February 2016, 06:04: Message edited by: LeRoc ]
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I know why God made the rhinoceros, it's because He couldn't see the rhinoceros, so He made the rhinoceros to be able to see it. (Clarice Lispector)
Posts: 9474 | From: Brazil / Africa | Registered: Aug 2002
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Penny S
Shipmate
# 14768
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Posted
I wouldn't go for testoterone (though anomalous levels are not restricted to men - it would be interesting to know the levels in the aggressive female leaders), but people who self define as alphas, or who fill in the tick boxes of alpha personality traits themselves.
Because the traits appropriate for dominant chimps are not those fitting for leading humans, and we should be looking for more nuanced characters. And heading off the chest beaters long before they get into power with their bunch of supporters who make it impossible to remove them.
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Garasu
Shipmate
# 17152
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Posted
Wasn't there some research suggesting that our promotion structures favoured people with psychopathic tendencies?
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"Could I believe in the doctrine without believing in the deity?". - Modesitt, L. E., Jr., 1943- Imager.
Posts: 889 | From: Surrey Heath (England) | Registered: Jun 2012
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Callan
Shipmate
# 525
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Doc Tor:
Because, like Jadis, he sees power as an end in itself. To say, this is mine and you cannot have it, is victory.
Look upon my works, ye mighty, and despair.
Google "Saddam Hussein, death" or "Colonel Gadaffi, death".
[ 17. February 2016, 14:38: Message edited by: Callan ]
Posts: 9757 | From: Citizen of the World | Registered: Jun 2001
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lilBuddha
Shipmate
# 14333
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Callan:
quote:
Originally posted by Doc Tor:
Because, like Jadis, he sees power as an end in itself. To say, this is mine and you cannot have it, is victory.
Look upon my works, ye mighty, and despair.
Google "Saddam Hussein, death" or "Colonel Gadaffi, death".
Google how long between siezing power and death for both of those. Google Stalin or Mao or their untimely deaths.
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I put on my rockin' shoes in the morning
Hallellou, hallellou
Posts: 17627 | From: the round earth's imagined corners | Registered: Dec 2008
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Beeswax Altar
Shipmate
# 11644
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Garasu:
Wasn't there some research suggesting that our promotion structures favoured people with psychopathic tendencies?
Wasn't there some research suggesting anything and everything under the sun?
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Losing sleep is something you want to avoid, if possible.
-Og: King of Bashan
Posts: 8411 | From: By a large lake | Registered: Jul 2006
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Beeswax Altar
Shipmate
# 11644
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Posted
Assad's followers are fighting for their very survival and they know it. True, their survival means killing tens and thousands of others. Also true is the fact that the Assads make Boss Tweed look like Mr. Smith. Still, why they fight is not hard to understand.
For true evil in the modern world, one has to look to North Korea. All the other evil characters including ISIS and Boko Harem make sense if you accept their presuppositions. The Kims and their sycophants are just pure evil. Doesn't mean that the Kims are more of a threat than ISIS. Even with nuclear weapons I don't believe the Kim's are more of a threat to the United States or Europe than ISIS. However, North Korea under the Kims is the closest you get in the real modern world to Narnia under Jadis.
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Losing sleep is something you want to avoid, if possible.
-Og: King of Bashan
Posts: 8411 | From: By a large lake | Registered: Jul 2006
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Penny S
Shipmate
# 14768
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Posted
Except that the Narnians didn't regard Jadis as the great salvation of the country and worship her - though she would obviously have loved it if they behaved to her as many N Koreans do to the Kims.
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Beeswax Altar
Shipmate
# 11644
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Penny S:
Except that the Narnians didn't regard Jadis as the great salvation of the country and worship her - though she would obviously have loved it if they behaved to her as many N Koreans do to the Kims.
Some obviously did or Aslan's appearance alone would have been enough to liberate Narnia.
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Losing sleep is something you want to avoid, if possible.
-Og: King of Bashan
Posts: 8411 | From: By a large lake | Registered: Jul 2006
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passer
Indigo
# 13329
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Penny S:
Except that the Narnians didn't regard Jadis as the great salvation of the country and worship her - though she would obviously have loved it if they behaved to her as many N Koreans do to the Kims.
I'm not sure that the DPRK actually has many who actually worship the Kims. They do have plenty of citizens who go along with instructions to laud the dynasty lest the MPS/SSD (just think Stasi) pull them in for questioning, self-criticism sessions, and re-education at a "camp near you".
The belief in the ability to create an isolated inward-looking serf population and lock them within porous borders is a reflection on the delusional aspirations of the would-be deity that is Kim the third. The glorious Korean dynasty he seeks to perpetuate is descended from Kim Il Sung, of course, who was born in Russia,
Posts: 1289 | From: Sheffield | Registered: Jan 2008
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Firenze
Ordinary decent pagan
# 619
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by leo:
Sorry but what is this 'jadis'? Wiki says it is a character from C S Lewis. Do they mean 'jihadis'?
I take it you haven't read the Narnia books? Not intellectual enough for you, I daresay. If you had - and it might do you good if you did - you would know whereof we speak and perceive how the fictional character is reflected in many RL dictators.
Posts: 17302 | From: Edinburgh | Registered: Jun 2001
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Albertus
Shipmate
# 13356
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Posted
I'm no expert, but I'm buggered if I can see any way out of this thing that isn't going to involve a lot more horribleness. If you gave me a time machine to go back five years I'd make sure that we (the west) made it perfectly clear to any Syrian rebels that while we might not actually help Assad directly we sure as hell weren't going to do anything to help those who were tyring ot overthrow him and we might indeed do what we could to hinder them. this on the grounds that Assad might be (OK, is) a bastard but at least he was a bastard who ensured a reasonable degree of stbaility and prosperity. Now, after how the Syrian government has fought this war, it's hard to see how he could be acceptable at all, tho' I still think he might be marginally the least-bad of some very bad alternatives.
I only hope that the West learns the lesson that on the whole effective but less than ideal and undemocratic governments are preferable to most of the alternatives, unless the alternative is very clearly worked out both in terms of how it is going to get power and what it will do to improve things once it gets there.
Posts: 6498 | From: Y Sowth | Registered: Jan 2008
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rolyn
Shipmate
# 16840
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Posted
The West had plenty of time and opportunity to help the moderates defeat the Syrian regime, it chose to do nothing, pressumably fearing it would be another Iraq.
Mind you, let's not forget that a Mid-East without those annoying tin-pot dictators is a dream for Western ambition and progress. One can't help but feel that local unrest doesn't stand in the way of the oil trade quite like jumped-up little stalins did.
The only problem now is that Russia appears to have a, not so much tin- pot, but popular dictator. Even given this, a combined Western alliance is by no means weak against Mr. P. If however China sides in with Russia for WW3 then I think we all know it'll be pretty much chin chin to the whole kit and caboodle.
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Change is the only certainty of existence
Posts: 3206 | From: U.K. | Registered: Dec 2011
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Albertus
Shipmate
# 13356
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Posted
We didn't put boots on the ground or planes in the sky but we did encourage the 'moderates' (yeah, right) and I think we gave them various bits of kit and possibly training and intelligence (not sure about that). But we should have actively discouraged them, not that it's much use saying that now- except in the hope that we'll learn our lesson.
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My beard is a testament to my masculinity and virility, and demonstrates that I am a real man. Trouble is, bits of quiche sometimes get caught in it.
Posts: 6498 | From: Y Sowth | Registered: Jan 2008
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quetzalcoatl
Shipmate
# 16740
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Posted
Saying that Assad gives prosperity and stability is a bit rich. If he wins, his torture chambers and execution fields will be full of thousands of Syrians, who will be shortly dead. The areas where Sunni tribes live, will become a slaughterhouse.
Granted, realpolitik might impel the West to support such figures. I think some Western politicians supported Pol Pot, and many now cuddle up to the Chinese, and the Saudis.
Support for Assad would probably also help IS; unless there is no-one left to be recruited I suppose.
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I can't talk to you today; I talked to two people yesterday.
Posts: 9878 | From: UK | Registered: Oct 2011
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Marvin the Martian
Interplanetary
# 4360
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by lilBuddha:
quote:
Originally posted by Callan:
quote:
Originally posted by Doc Tor:
Because, like Jadis, he sees power as an end in itself. To say, this is mine and you cannot have it, is victory.
Look upon my works, ye mighty, and despair.
Google "Saddam Hussein, death" or "Colonel Gadaffi, death".
Google how long between siezing power and death for both of those.
I am reminded of some dialogue from a webcomic I follow:
quote:
Tarquin: If someone conquers an empire and rules it with an iron fist for thirty long years, and then some paladin breaks into his throne room and kills him, what do you think he's going to remember as he lays dying?
Elan: That good triumphed over evil?
Tarquin: No, that he got to live like a god for three decades! Sure, the last ten minutes sucked, but you can't have everything. ... As long as I go into this accepting the price I may eventually pay, then I win - no matter what actually happens.
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Hail Gallaxhar
Posts: 30100 | From: Adrift on a sea of surreality | Registered: Apr 2003
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Sioni Sais
Shipmate
# 5713
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Marvin the Martian:
I am reminded of some dialogue from a webcomic I follow:
quote:
Tarquin: If someone conquers an empire and rules it with an iron fist for thirty long years, and then some paladin breaks into his throne room and kills him, what do you think he's going to remember as he lays dying?
Elan: That good triumphed over evil?
Tarquin: No, that he got to live like a god for three decades! Sure, the last ten minutes sucked, but you can't have everything. ... As long as I go into this accepting the price I may eventually pay, then I win - no matter what actually happens.
Vanity, Oh vanity.
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"He isn't Doctor Who, he's The Doctor"
(Paul Sinha, BBC)
Posts: 24276 | From: Newport, Wales | Registered: Apr 2004
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deano
princess
# 12063
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by quetzalcoatl:
Saying that Assad gives prosperity and stability is a bit rich. If he wins, his torture chambers and execution fields will be full of thousands of Syrians, who will be shortly dead. The areas where Sunni tribes live, will become a slaughterhouse.
Granted, realpolitik might impel the West to support such figures. I think some Western politicians supported Pol Pot, and many now cuddle up to the Chinese, and the Saudis.
Support for Assad would probably also help IS; unless there is no-one left to be recruited I suppose.
Why do you make it sound like a bad thing?
Yes. He is a murderous, inasane, power-mad dictator, but at least he's OUR murderous, inasane, power-mad dictator.
We can't kill everyone in IS (or looks like they might know someone who thought IS might be okay) ourselves because people like you and others on here get all hanky-wringy and "think of the children"-ey, so we need a third-party mediator who will mediate with IS without the worry of so-called human rights laws.
Your first paragraph describes the mediation process quite well I think.
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"The moral high ground is slowly being bombed to oblivion. " - Supermatelot
Posts: 2118 | From: Chesterfield | Registered: Nov 2006
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Albertus
Shipmate
# 13356
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by quetzalcoatl:
Saying that Assad gives prosperity and stability is a bit rich. If he wins, his torture chambers and execution fields will be full of thousands of Syrians, who will be shortly dead. The areas where Sunni tribes live, will become a slaughterhouse.
Gave, not gives. But who at the moment looks like a better alternative?
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My beard is a testament to my masculinity and virility, and demonstrates that I am a real man. Trouble is, bits of quiche sometimes get caught in it.
Posts: 6498 | From: Y Sowth | Registered: Jan 2008
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