Thread: Would you rather exist or not exist? Board: Oblivion / Ship of Fools.
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Posted by starbelly (# 25) on
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In another thread Evensong posed the question
quote:
Would you rather exist or not exist?
Which is a question I love, and have thought about a lot.
Of course I love existing, it literally is my everything, but at the same time, if I didn't exist then I would never even be able to ponder the question at all, and nothing is lost.
So in answer to the question Would you rather exist or not exist? To me it does not matter.
Does anyone have any existential, philosophical or theological thoughts on this?
Neil
Posted by mr cheesy (# 3330) on
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It is hard for me to reply to this topic without sounding depressed.*
But let's just say that some of us find it hard at times to see how existence is better than non-existence.
Given that, I'm not sure it is an answerable question, and maybe not even one which can profitably be discussed here.
*I am not depressed. At the moment.
Posted by Anyuta (# 14692) on
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I can think of some existences that would be worse than non existence. But my current existence is not one of them. The question is impossible to answer generically, as not all existences are the same.
Posted by LeRoc (# 3216) on
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Maybe you should ask this question to non-existent me also, to hear both sides of the story?
Posted by starbelly (# 25) on
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quote:
Originally posted by LeRoc:
Maybe you should ask this question to non-existent me also, to hear both sides of the story?
I just did, and got no reply ![[Frown]](frown.gif)
Posted by Brenda Clough (# 18061) on
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I had a character ask this once. (Sf novel about multiplicity of time lines, so it actually had plot relevance.) She asked the Pope, who happened to be there at the time. The Pope said that yes, it is good for there to be existence. God said so, in Genesis 1.
Posted by Belle Ringer (# 13379) on
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quote:
Originally posted by starbelly:
quote:
Originally posted by LeRoc:
Maybe you should ask this question to non-existent me also, to hear both sides of the story?
I just did, and got no reply
Or you got a reply so outside your limited capabilities of awareness in this mortal state you weren't aware of the vibrant reply?
As to the OP, depends on circumstances, physical and/or emotional. Many cling to life no matter how brutal. But when babies are left to just lie there between feedings, some die of "failure to thrive." And some adults find this life so emotionally or physically painful they want out.
Posted by no prophet's flag is set so... (# 15560) on
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Not sure about getting a reply, I suspect I'm not worthy of getting such an epiphany, even though my thoughts make me think that I'm at the centre of something.
I'm reminded of the riddle: Why is a duck?
Answer: One foot is both the same.
Posted by A Feminine Force (# 7812) on
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Well OK, I'll bite.
I'm coming from a purely personal point of view where I can remember past incarnations, and some states in between, so this informs my preference.
I have to say that I prefer to exist though I haven't got a clue as to why, because it is, and has been, for the most part excruciating.
I guess I'm hoping to trade existence for life at some point. I feel like for the most part I am waiting for something to begin, and while I am waiting, I am trying my level best to get rid of the parts of me that are preventing me from feeling life.
They say that life isn't a dress rehearsal, but I'm inclined to think otherwise at this point.
However, I have faith in the goodness of my existence. And this is enough to keep me coming back for more.
AFF
Posted by Martin60 (# 368) on
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As all will be well, it's as well to be.
Posted by Kitten (# 1179) on
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At the moment I am ok with existing but there have been times in my life when I longed not to exist
Posted by Firenze (# 619) on
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We'll all be getting a go at the non-existence in due course, so we can compare the two then....
Posted by Albertus (# 13356) on
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quote:
Originally posted by mr cheesy:
It is hard for me to reply to this topic without sounding depressed.*
But let's just say that some of us find it hard at times to see how existence is better than non-existence.
...
*I am not depressed. At the moment.
I second all of this. Glad to know that someone else shares my experience- thank you.
Posted by Schroedinger's cat (# 64) on
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I think non-existence is preferable.
The reasoning is that existence has pain and suffering. OK, it has positives too, but it has negatives. I tend to think that non-existence would be preferable, because you miss the negatives.
And I think it is hard to say that the positives outweigh the negatives. There is a lot of evidence that we (as a species) tend to be negative, so it takes a whole lot more positives to counted more minor negatives.
Posted by Macrina (# 8807) on
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Everytime I get bored or frustrated I try to remind myself that the odds of my existing at all were infinitesimally small so I am improbable to start with. I also lucked out immensely in living in the Western world and being bright enough to be able to have a pretty internal locus of control (for now - such things are fragile) . I feel very small and lucky when I think about the privilege I have to be conscious at a time when we can see distant galaxies and have a good working theory about the nature of the universe. I am glad to exist even with the not nice bits.
Posted by Brenda Clough (# 18061) on
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But how would you, not existing, benefit from not existing?
Posted by Belle Ringer (# 13379) on
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quote:
Originally posted by Albertus:
quote:
Originally posted by mr cheesy:
some find it hard at times to see how existence is better than non-existence. *I am not depressed. At the moment.
I second all of this. Glad to know that someone else shares my experience- thank you.
Having been suicidal (for months, not years, and not now), I am not shocked when someone else is so overwhelmed with prolonged pain physical or emotional they want out.
If all the professionals and acquaintances around you keep insisting you have no reason to hope for pain relief nor for any pleasure or purpose ever again, well, life is work and there has to be a reason to undertake the work.
To me, after having been there, the wonder is not that some seek an exit but that so many don't even when chained (literally) in lifetime brutal slavery.
Posted by Huia (# 3473) on
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I read Evensong's question and my immediate response was negative. I am not in any danger of harming myself, but I have been on an (unsuccessful) course of antibiotics and they always leave me contemplating the *Meaning of Life* in a very Eeyore-ish way.
Telling myself I am lucky to be living (which I am) doesn't make any difference, but going through a walk in the Botanic Gardens and seeing 3 tiny ducklings (in Christchurch in April!!) and a korimako (bellbird) definitely helped.
Huia
Posted by Beenster (# 242) on
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I'm a non-exist checking in. Probably menopausal but what is the bloody point. No real reason, no cause for alarm but I just find life such a waste of effort and largely unenjoyable.
Posted by Ariel (# 58) on
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There are times when I feel old and stale and utterly disillusioned, there are times when I'm stunned and uplifted by the beauty of the world and surprised and warmed by the kindness still to be found in it. Life has been an uphill struggle at times, but if nothing else I can sometimes try to share the useful things I found in the depths with people also walking the same paths. I'd say on the whole I'm grateful for existence, though if you'd asked me that a few years ago I'd have unequivocally said I wasn't.
Posted by Boogie (# 13538) on
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I think the question is pointless - we do exist, so we may as well get on with life and make the best of it.
Posted by rolyn (# 16840) on
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Interesting question but all the same a non question.
How can someone speculate on non existence if they have come to exist? That would be impossible.
We can speculate as to what non existence might be like when we are dead. The same as before we were born is what we prefer to believe, but how can be the same once we have existed. Again an impossibility as we cannot Unexist as if we never were.
Posted by agingjb (# 16555) on
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One of Milton's Devils (Belial) says:
"For who would lose, Though full of pain, this intellectual being, Those thoughts that wander through eternity, To perish rather, swallow'd up and lost In the wide womb of uncreated night, Devoid of sense and motion?"
If there are human souls fixed in agony, then rather clearly they would happily lose their intellectual being, and quickly.
Sadly, if this is the case, their pain continues to delight God, His angels, and His saints - or so we are assured by many of those who believe, or have believed, this.
Posted by Albertus (# 13356) on
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quote:
Originally posted by Boogie:
I think the question is pointless - we do exist, so we may as well get on with life and make the best of it.
That suggests that either you have never known the feeling that Mr cheesy and Belle and beenster and I and others, to different degrees and at different times, all feel: or you have, and have found a way of overcoming it. Either way, you are fortunate.
[ 19. April 2016, 20:12: Message edited by: Albertus ]
Posted by no prophet's flag is set so... (# 15560) on
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I hadn't thought this was a mental health and suicide thread, rather that the question was philosophical. In that line, just back from a funeral.
The promises of eternal life and resurrection and how happy it is that the deceased is in heaven in the company of those dead previously were stated. I find this argument weak: it tells us that there isn't a non-existence, rather a different one. You can't not exist, God won't let you! (Bastard!)
[ 19. April 2016, 20:25: Message edited by: no prophet's flag is set so... ]
Posted by Eutychus (# 3081) on
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hosting/
quote:
Originally posted by no prophet's flag is set so...:
I hadn't thought this was a mental health and suicide thread, rather that the question was philosophical.
Indeed. Please note in particular the following excerpt from our Purgatory board guidelines: quote:
The Ship is not (...) an appropriate or adequate venue for suicidal ideations. Do not waste precious time by posting here.
We expect that guideline, and the related ones, to be scrupulously observed on this thread. Thank you all for your cooperation.
/hosting
Posted by Chorister (# 473) on
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Not just to exist, but to bring two other beings (children) into existence. That's amazing and something I'm glad I've experienced. As is the experience of one of those beings bringing two others (grandchildren) into existence as well.
Whether I continue to exist way into the future, I'm not all that bothered. But 20-30 more years, to see my grandchildren grow up, and bring the next generation into existence, would be good.
Posted by rolyn (# 16840) on
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[
[ 19. April 2016, 21:35: Message edited by: rolyn ]
Posted by Belle Ringer (# 13379) on
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quote:
Originally posted by Boogie:
I think the question is pointless - we do exist, so we may as well get on with life and make the best of it.
Well, Jesus made a comment about "better for him never to have been born" so the concept of not existing has been around for at least 2000 years, even if only hypothetically.
Unless one believes people exist whether or not they have every been in physical form.
Posted by Albertus (# 13356) on
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quote:
Originally posted by Chorister:
Not just to exist, but to bring two other beings (children) into existence. That's amazing and something I'm glad I've experienced. As is the experience of one of those beings bringing two others (grandchildren) into existence as well.
Whether I continue to exist way into the future, I'm not all that bothered. But 20-30 more years, to see my grandchildren grow up, and bring the next generation into existence, would be good.
I can understand that. But in my gloomier moments I would see bringing another person into existence as an enormous presumption: existence as a gift, perhaps, but a gift which lays rather heavy responsibilities on the recipient, by definition without his or her consent.
Posted by mr cheesy (# 3330) on
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quote:
Originally posted by Chorister:
Not just to exist, but to bring two other beings (children) into existence. That's amazing and something I'm glad I've experienced. As is the experience of one of those beings bringing two others (grandchildren) into existence as well.
Whether I continue to exist way into the future, I'm not all that bothered. But 20-30 more years, to see my grandchildren grow up, and bring the next generation into existence, would be good.
Perhaps it sounds odd, but one does not have to be suicidal to contemplate that things might be better if one did not exist. That one's part in the drama of life is forgettable, ignorable, pointless.
If I didn't exist, my child would not. My wife might be doing other things, and so on and so on.
I think you are right to point out that we experience glimpses of great joy and happiness from our children which make all things seem worthwhile. But for me these are sometimes like the Sun peeping around a cloud on a dull day.
If I'm feeling low, I look at the grains of sand on the beach, I read my history books and imagine the multitude of people who lived and died in obscurity without being featured in the pages, I look at the massiveness and complexity of the universe and feel so small. So small and insignificant and pointless and a waste-of-space. Me, someone who achieves very little by my existence.
That's how I experience the waves of existential angst type depression that wash over me.
For me it is the hope of something else, the liturgy of belief and the love of family that drags me out of the funk. I can't imagine how people survive without those things.
Posted by Albertus (# 13356) on
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Again, I second all that entirely. It is good to know that there is someone else on the same wavelength as me on this.
Posted by Boogie (# 13538) on
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mr cheesy - you are still speaking emotionally rather than philosophically.
We all have our down days!
But, to me, it's about point of view, not mood.
My point of view/attitude is that we exist and by far the best way to deal with that is to get on with life and have a go at enjoying it.
As a child I constantly wrestled with existential questions as, I'm sure, a lot of children do.
Now I know that life is incredibly short and there's no point worrying about it. Make it count, in whatever tiny, tiny, miniscule way you can.
Posted by mr cheesy (# 3330) on
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quote:
Originally posted by Boogie:
mr cheesy - you are still speaking emotionally rather than philosophically.
We all have our down days!
But, to me, it's about point of view, not mood.
My point of view/attitude is that we exist and by far the best way to deal with that is to get on with life and have a go at enjoying it.
As a child I constantly wrestled with existential questions as, I'm sure, a lot of children do.
Now I know that life is incredibly short and there's no point worrying about it. Make it count, in whatever tiny, tiny, miniscule way you can.
Well, first I can't see how you can possibly know that given that I can't always tell if it is emotion or logic.
Second, I do get on with life and have learned strategies to avoid the darkest moments. But that doesn't mean that ignoring the problem can always make it go away. Whilst it might be triggered by emotions, it is a deep philosophical angst. It isn't about "worrying about life".
Third "make it count" just doesn't work for me. How do, for example, I tell whether any action I take ends up being a positive or a negative - given that I exist in a state of having very little feedback?
Posted by Nicodemia (# 4756) on
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At this precise moment, non-existence sounds the better bet to me. And then the whole bang-shoot of life can go.
Posted by Marvin the Martian (# 4360) on
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quote:
Originally posted by Albertus:
I can understand that. But in my gloomier moments I would see bringing another person into existence as an enormous presumption: existence as a gift, perhaps, but a gift which lays rather heavy responsibilities on the recipient, by definition without his or her consent.
As one of my friends used to say*: "I was given life for a crime I didn't commit" ![[Big Grin]](biggrin.gif)
*= ETA that this means he's stopped saying it, rather than anything else!
[ 20. April 2016, 09:26: Message edited by: Marvin the Martian ]
Posted by Boogie (# 13538) on
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quote:
Originally posted by mr cheesy:
Third "make it count" just doesn't work for me. How do, for example, I tell whether any action I take ends up being a positive or a negative - given that I exist in a state of having very little feedback?
In the short term it's easy. If you made someone else smile today you made a positive difference.
There's no point worrying about the long term. Do your best but don't let it get to you philosophically or emotionally - there really is no point.
Far, far better to say 'no point worrying' than 'no point living'!
Posted by Marvin the Martian (# 4360) on
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quote:
Originally posted by Belle Ringer:
Unless one believes people exist whether or not they have every been in physical form.
I find that an interesting question in and of itself, and one which gets to the very heart of what we mean by "existence".
Does Frodo Baggins exist? If not, how can I even ask the question?
Does Shakespeare exist? Not "did", "does". If not, then how can he influence and inspire so many people?
Of course, this raises the possibility that anything that has ever existed will always exist, even if only as a memory. Thus the OP's question is somewhat pointless - anybody who is capable of answering it is unable to choose non-existence!
Posted by mr cheesy (# 3330) on
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quote:
Originally posted by Boogie:
In the short term it's easy. If you made someone else smile today you made a positive difference.
And how do I weigh that against all the other harmful effects I have in the world? How do you know a smile makes any difference?
quote:
There's no point worrying about the long term. Do your best but don't let it get to you philosophically or emotionally - there really is no point.
I know you think you're helping, but you are really not.
quote:
Far, far better to say 'no point worrying' than 'no point living'!
I disagree. Saying "no point worrying" is completely useless to someone who is struggling with existential angst. The solution is to find something to engage with which makes one feel valued, has a noticeable effect and gives ongoing satisfaction.
It isn't something you can will yourself to snap out of.
Posted by Barnabas62 (# 9110) on
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Like Eutychus above, I've also got some Hostly discomfort about this thread in view of this. Particularly this excerpt.
quote:
Neither is the Ship an appropriate or adequate venue for suicidal ideations. Do not waste precious time by posting here. If you suspect that your feelings of hopelessness or despair are more than just a reaction to a difficult time in your life or normal spiritual angst, or you think about suicide, then you need professional help, immediately, and you can't get that here.
From the section on sharing information about personal circumstances.
I'm inclined to let the thread run, but at the risk of repeating ourselves, please remember this guideline. In particular, avoid too much personal sharing and attempts at reciprocal online counselling. This isn't the place for that.
Barnabas62
Purgatory Host
[ 20. April 2016, 10:40: Message edited by: Barnabas62 ]
Posted by starbelly (# 25) on
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I was really expecting people to take a more philosophical direction than it did! (and some of the responses made me very sad)
Yes, I agree it is a bit on a non-question, but for a non question I have spent a lot of time thinking about it!
I just cannot help but think that to exist (whether tree, human or rock) is better. The list of 'things' that don't exist is infinite, the list of things that do exist is finite, and that makes us quite unique and special.
It also blows my mind to imagine all the time I did not exist, and all the time in the future I also won't exist, and again how precious that makes this short time of existence.
I know these are nor radical or new ideas, but having absorbed them I find them incredibly influential in the way I look at myself and the world.
Neil
Posted by SvitlanaV2 (# 16967) on
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Maybe you should have used a more abstract title (e.g. 'Is existence a good thing?') if you didn't want personalised responses.
Myself, I appreciate the book of Ecclesiastes for recognising the feeling some of us may have occasionally that non-existence might be better. In a couple of places the author states that a stillborn baby is better than someone who has to emerge into the injustice and suffering of the world. There is a big BUT at the end, though: in spite of it all, since we do exist, we must make the most of life. Above all, we must give God the glory, because that's really all that we're here for.
Posted by Marvin the Martian (# 4360) on
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quote:
Originally posted by starbelly:
The list of 'things' that don't exist is infinite
Quite the opposite - the list of things that don't exist must perforce be empty - as anything that appeared on such a list would therefore exist, even if only as an item on the list!
Unicorns exist. Not as a creature known to biology, perhaps, but as an idea, a concept, a symbol - in these ways they have as much existence as you or I.
Posted by starbelly (# 25) on
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quote:
Originally posted by Marvin the Martian:
quote:
Originally posted by starbelly:
The list of 'things' that don't exist is infinite
Quite the opposite - the list of things that don't exist must perforce be empty - as anything that appeared on such a list would therefore exist, even if only as an item on the list!
Unicorns exist. Not as a creature known to biology, perhaps, but as an idea, a concept, a symbol - in these ways they have as much existence as you or I.
I think we are using the term exist differently!
Posted by Marvin the Martian (# 4360) on
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As I said in my first post, this question gets right to the heart of what we mean by "existence"!
Philosophically speaking, there's a good argument to be made that unicorns do exist. I find that line of thought - and the conclusions it leads to - to be incredibly interesting.
Posted by no prophet's flag is set so... (# 15560) on
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Narwhals and a dinosaur unicorn that's been making the rounds of the 'net aside, I suspect forms of life are probably more than we can imagine.
May tendency today regarding existing is that of "participant observer". With a seat at the edge of the stage, and as I age, trying to be more in the audience than on the stage. I should like to see a few things before I'm done watching from the current seat: a positive plan for the world's environment and climate, something about equality between and within our countries, a Mars landing, and a first contact with some friendly aliens. (The Vulcans would do per Star Trek.)
I'd agree that falling in love, marrying, having children has meant more than all the other things. Loving someone is the best and most important thing, and if we can expand our love to the kindness, caring and charity to all of the world.... (but now I'm in the land of flowers and butterflies, sap that I am).
The best also contains the worst, in that the loving of others means that when they are harmed it tears one apart. Not to the point of not wanting to exist, but an astounding willingness to trade one's life for that of another (I had thought this was something for novels and movies before).
Posted by Albertus (# 13356) on
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quote:
Originally posted by Boogie:
quote:
Originally posted by mr cheesy:
Third "make it count" just doesn't work for me. How do, for example, I tell whether any action I take ends up being a positive or a negative - given that I exist in a state of having very little feedback?
In the short term it's easy. If you made someone else smile today you made a positive difference.
There's no point worrying about the long term. Do your best but don't let it get to you philosophically or emotionally - there really is no point.
Far, far better to say 'no point worrying' than 'no point living'!
Oh dear. I do realise that this is supposed to be a philosophical thread and so I won't pursue this line any further, but what you are saying sounds worryingly like 'get a grip'. And that just doesn't work with people who are depressed. I generally respect your good sense, Boogie, and I had hoped for something a little more understanding from you.
Posted by mousethief (# 953) on
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Re. the OP: Hard to say, as I have never experienced the other option, so I can't really compare.
Posted by mousethief (# 953) on
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Do the non-existent ever question whether it would be better to exist?
Posted by W Hyatt (# 14250) on
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It's true you've never experienced the other option, but only because you weren't there to experience it when that option was the reality.
Posted by mousethief (# 953) on
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quote:
Originally posted by W Hyatt:
It's true you've never experienced the other option, but only because you weren't there to experience it when that option was the reality.
Whatever the reason, doesn't matter. I haven't experienced it, and thus can't compare.
Posted by mr cheesy (# 3330) on
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quote:
Originally posted by mousethief:
Whatever the reason, doesn't matter. I haven't experienced it, and thus can't compare.
That's true, but one doesn't have to experience the lack of something to contemplate it or to wonder whether it might be better.
Posted by Boogie (# 13538) on
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quote:
Originally posted by mr cheesy:
quote:
Originally posted by mousethief:
Whatever the reason, doesn't matter. I haven't experienced it, and thus can't compare.
That's true, but one doesn't have to experience the lack of something to contemplate it or to wonder whether it might be better.
One can contemplate.
I could contemplate how marvellous life would be if I won 33 million pounds. I'd likely find the reality very different from my day dreams - and far less pleasant.
We can never experience non-existence, obviously. And the idea of "better" doesn't compute either. The thing that is "better" has to be experienced to have any value at all.
Posted by mr cheesy (# 3330) on
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quote:
Originally posted by Boogie:
We can never experience non-existence, obviously. And the idea of "better" doesn't compute either. The thing that is "better" has to be experienced to have any value at all.
Tell that to all the migrants who currently think that the life they dream of in Europe (which they've heard about but not directly experienced) is worth so much.
Posted by Boogie (# 13538) on
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quote:
Originally posted by mr cheesy:
quote:
Originally posted by Boogie:
We can never experience non-existence, obviously. And the idea of "better" doesn't compute either. The thing that is "better" has to be experienced to have any value at all.
Tell that to all the migrants who currently think that the life they dream of in Europe (which they've heard about but not directly experienced) is worth so much.
They exist.
The can (somehow, hopefully) find and experience a better life.
Non-existence can't be experienced - ever. So it can't have any value at all. It can't be known in any way, therefore using the word "better" to describe it is meaningless.
Posted by mr cheesy (# 3330) on
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quote:
Originally posted by Boogie:
They exist.
The can (somehow, hopefully) find and experience a better life.
Non-existence can't be experienced - ever. So it can't have any value at all. It can't be known in any way, therefore using the word "better" to describe it is meaningless.
No sorry, you said that the thing could only be analysed if one had experienced it. You and I have not experienced non-existence any more than the migrant has experienced living in Europe or any of us have experienced the afterlife.
Now you're changing the goalposts and are saying that the thing can be experienced at some point in the future so the thing is valid, undermining your original argument.
Posted by Boogie (# 13538) on
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quote:
Originally posted by mr cheesy:
No sorry, you said that the thing could only be analysed if one had experienced it. You and I have not experienced non-existence any more than the migrant has experienced living in Europe or any of us have experienced the afterlife.
Now you're changing the goalposts and are saying that the thing can be experienced at some point in the future so the thing is valid, undermining your original argument.
I was speaking in the context of discussing non-existence.
If you thought I meant it in any context, I didn't.
Non-existence can never be experienced, ever, by anyone. If you didn't exist you would know nothing about it. Of course, I can imagine any number of things and ways of being. But that's in no way the same as having angst about them.
[ 21. April 2016, 09:46: Message edited by: Boogie ]
Posted by mr cheesy (# 3330) on
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quote:
Originally posted by Boogie:
Non-existence can never be experienced, ever, by anyone. If you didn't exist you would know nothing about it. Of course, I can imagine any number of things and ways of being. But that's in no way the same as having angst about them.
Right, but then you're talking about the effect on the individual (would it be better for me not to exist) rather than the wider benefits (would things - in general - be better if I didn't exist).
Posted by Marvin the Martian (# 4360) on
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quote:
Originally posted by mousethief:
Do the non-existent ever question whether it would be better to exist?
Nice koan
Posted by Boogie (# 13538) on
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quote:
Originally posted by mr cheesy:
Right, but then you're talking about the effect on the individual (would it be better for me not to exist) rather than the wider benefits (would things - in general - be better if I didn't exist).
Considering that the population is a collection of individuals, yes. I imagine nature/the planet would be far better off if humans had never existed. I have heard that we have now damaged things irreparably (or changed them irrevocably) due to plastic waste.
But it's entirely up to us, individually and collectively. (I am not talking about depression and the wish to die, which is an entirely different subject) It's up to us to make a positive difference - and up to us to decide what is a positive difference.
My Mum had dementia and couldn't move anything apart from one hand for three years. She still made an enormously positive difference in her tiny corner of the world for all of those three years except the last two weeks.
She'd squeeze the hand of the lady crying next to her. She'd smile as we and the carers did what was needed. She'd make the whole room chuckle (those who still had a little brain left, anyway) with her crazy one-liners.
Posted by Chorister (# 473) on
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I'd take the line of Starbelly - for most of humanity's time on this planet, we didn't and will not exist. But for one brief moment we do. Thus, I'd argue, we do 'experience', and have understanding of, both states - but, of course, not both at once.
As to those above who have compared us to grains of sand, and therefore meaningless, I'd say that some of the most useful lives lived are the 'small people' - no life is meaningless to those immediately around them. We don't all need to be Einsteins or PMs, changing the world.
One of the most moving funeral reports I read in the local paper recently read something like this: 'She devoted her time to her family and her weekly outing to bingo'.
I imagined someone who mattered very much to her family, her friends, those who she regularly met in her small corner of the world. The whole world is made up of people who are like such grains of sand, each individual, in their own time and place, very important indeed.
Posted by mousethief (# 953) on
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Originally posted by Marvin the Martian:
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Originally posted by mousethief:
Do the non-existent ever question whether it would be better to exist?
Nice koan
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