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Source: (consider it)
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Thread: Rewriting The Archers
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jacobsen
seeker
# 14998
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Posted
I'm getting increasingly fed up with Rob, not to mention Helen's codependent behaviour. Could we derail that storyline, and maybe some of the others, into more satisfactory directions?
By the way, Jack didn't die - he's in a safe house where THEY can't find him...
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But God, holding a candle, looks for all who wander, all who search. - Shifra Alon
Beauty fades, dumb is forever-Judge Judy
The man who made time, made plenty.
Posts: 8040 | From: Æbleskiver country | Registered: Aug 2009
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Barnabas62
Shipmate
# 9110
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Posted
Have no fear, Tichner is heading for a fall. The brave Kirstie will unmask him soon, despite Helen's codependent and increasingly desperate denial. Rob is by far the nastiest, most menacing, character EVER on the Archers. Hazel's nastiness is mild by comparison and at least she stabs people in the front. Even the 'orrible Clive Horobin was easier to take. After all he was yer typical out and out villain. Whereas Rob ....
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Who is it that you seek? How then shall we live? How shall we sing the Lord's song in a strange land?
Posts: 21397 | From: Norfolk UK | Registered: Feb 2005
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Curiosity killed ...
Ship's Mug
# 11770
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Posted
But Rob Titchner is true to life, as those manipulative controlling people are really like that. It's uncomfortable listening because it's so realistic. And it's true to the Archer's public education remit
He has inveigled himself in so thoroughly that removing him from Helen's life, without him cleaning out her bank account in passing, is going to be challenging. (If you ever get involved with someone whose previous partners have just disappeared in the night, be warned ...)
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Mugs - Keep the Ship afloat
Posts: 13794 | From: outiside the outer ring road | Registered: Aug 2006
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Welease Woderwick
Sister Incubus Nightmare
# 10424
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Posted
I haven't listened for years - is Rob worse that David [The Murderer] Archer and the truly evil Rooth?
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I give thanks for unknown blessings already on their way.
Fancy a break in South India?
Accessible Homestay Guesthouse in Central Kerala, contact me for details
What part of Matt. 7:1 don't you understand?
Posts: 48139 | From: 1st on the right, straight on 'til morning | Registered: Sep 2005
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Piglet
Islander
# 11803
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Posted
It must be even longer since I listened to it - I don't think I was even aware that David and Ruth were evil ...
Actually, we caught an episode or two on our meanderings when we were home in November, and even with our sketchy knowledge of the plot, Rob seems like the scumbag's scumbag. ![[Eek!]](eek.gif)
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I may not be on an island any more, but I'm still an islander.
alto n a soprano who can read music
Posts: 20272 | From: Fredericton, NB, on a rather larger piece of rock | Registered: Sep 2006
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North East Quine
Curious beastie
# 13049
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Posted
Rob is chilling. We need various characters to talk to each other - Tom needs to talk to Tony, Kirsty needs to talk to Ian - for there to be a collective understanding of what's going on. And why isn't Pat more concerned? It's not normal for a pregnant woman to give up driving.
Posts: 6414 | From: North East Scotland | Registered: Oct 2007
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Barnabas62
Shipmate
# 9110
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Posted
The plot thickened tonight. Rob's mother, apparently warm towards Helen, is in on it, whatever "it" is.
But I agree with jacobsen. Listening to the episodes in which Rob plays a major part is reminding me of scary Dr Who episodes, where the temptation to hide behind the sofa became very strong. Or at least reach for the off-switch.
And it is a chilling storyline, about the power of a clever unscrupulous control-freak and his ability to gradually take over. I wonder if he has a "666" birthmark on his scalp .....
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Who is it that you seek? How then shall we live? How shall we sing the Lord's song in a strange land?
Posts: 21397 | From: Norfolk UK | Registered: Feb 2005
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Albertus
Shipmate
# 13356
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Posted
Titchener is true to life, agreed, and the depiction of abuse is a proper piece of public education. But what always has me shouting at the Archers (OK, one of the many things that always has me shouting at the Archers) is the way that nobody, but nobody- and I include Pat, who is supposed to be practical and level headed- has ever consistently said to Helen 'look out, he's a wrong'un'. I mean, it's not as if he didn't have enough publicly known form (the way he left his former wife) or as if she didn't, for that matter (some absolute carcrash relationships and life decisions). I imagine this is necessary for dramatic effect but to me it seems to epitomise the utterly spineless 'whatever you want to do, if you really want to do it, is right and the worst thing anyone can be is judgemental' attitude that pervades the bloody programme. And then of course when this Titchener thing finally ends (assuming it doesn't end with him, Helen, and the ghastly sickly-sweet Henry all going up in flames, which is something devoutly to be wished- I have never, never forgiven Vanessa Witchburnher for killing off Nigel and allowing Helen to live) nobody, but nobody, will learn any lessons from it at all.
[ 20. February 2016, 19:52: Message edited by: Albertus ]
Posts: 6498 | From: Y Sowth | Registered: Jan 2008
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Rev per Minute
Shipmate
# 69
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by North East Quine:
Rob is chilling. We need various characters to talk to each other - Tom needs to talk to Tony, Kirsty needs to talk to Ian - for there to be a collective understanding of what's going on. And why isn't Pat more concerned? It's not normal for a pregnant woman to give up driving.
It's not unknown, either, especially if she is finding driving uncomfortable or is having issues with blood pressure. Many of the things Helen is reporting are normal/ not unusual for pregnant women but not normally all at once. A wish for Rob to fall under a tractor is very strong: it's a pity that the abused cows of his intensive farming experiment aren't around to fall on him one by one... ![[Devil]](graemlins/devil.gif)
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"Allons-y!" "Geronimo!" "Oh, for God's sake!" The Day of the Doctor
At the end of the day, we face our Maker alongside Jesus. RIP ken
Posts: 2696 | From: my desk (if I can find the keyboard under this mess) | Registered: May 2001
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Curiosity killed ...
Ship's Mug
# 11770
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Posted
Albertus - have you ever tried telling your offspring that someone they are in the throes of passion over is a wrong 'un? Did it go well? How well has Brian's parenting style gone down with his children and step-children?
Being forceful or negative to a child about something they are passionate about tends not to maintain good relations with said child, particularly when they are adult. It tends to end up with the child going off and doing it anyway and excluding the parents.
Pat hasn't been positive about Rob Titchener, distinctly lukewarm about the shotgun wedding on holiday: but she's got an obviously sick child, with someone who appears as if he's doing everything to support. She's suggesting that people wait for Helen to have the baby and recover before they do anything drastic, which isn't unrealistic.
I suspect Helen is going to end up with horrendous post-natal depression, dealing with the child she didn't want, the product of a drugged rape when she was avoiding pregnancy. This one could run for a bit.
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Mugs - Keep the Ship afloat
Posts: 13794 | From: outiside the outer ring road | Registered: Aug 2006
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Albertus
Shipmate
# 13356
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Posted
I would hope that if I were in that parent's position I would, because I loved my offspring, offer what i believed was good advice rather than support them to go to hell in a handcart. Anyway, what about Helen's friends? That they don't try to offer better advice is, to me, only more astonishing than the fact that Helen has any friends at all.
Posts: 6498 | From: Y Sowth | Registered: Jan 2008
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North East Quine
Curious beastie
# 13049
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Posted
Originally posted by Rev per Minute
quote:
It's not unknown, either, especially if she is finding driving uncomfortable or is having issues with blood pressure.
It's not unusual to give up driving towards the end of a pregnancy, but Helen was only 12 weeks pregnant or thereabouts. She probably wasn't even visibly pregnant, so unlikely to be "uncomfortable." If she had blood pressure issues at 12 weeks, I would have expected that to be a major concern. I would be worried for any friend / relative whose health was poor enough to have to give up driving at 12 weeks; and yet Pat seems quite blase.
Posts: 6414 | From: North East Scotland | Registered: Oct 2007
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Eirenist
Shipmate
# 13343
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Posted
There's nothing wrong with The Archers that couldn't be put right by Tom, say, running amok with a chain-saw . . .
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'I think I think, therefore I think I am'
Posts: 486 | From: Darkest Metroland | Registered: Jan 2008
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Doone
Shipmate
# 18470
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Eirenist:
There's nothing wrong with The Archers that couldn't be put right by Tom, say, running amok with a chain-saw . . .
![[Killing me]](graemlins/killingme.gif)
Posts: 2208 | From: UK | Registered: Sep 2015
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Welease Woderwick
Sister Incubus Nightmare
# 10424
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Posted
I've put that one in the Quotes File!
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I give thanks for unknown blessings already on their way.
Fancy a break in South India?
Accessible Homestay Guesthouse in Central Kerala, contact me for details
What part of Matt. 7:1 don't you understand?
Posts: 48139 | From: 1st on the right, straight on 'til morning | Registered: Sep 2005
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Rev per Minute
Shipmate
# 69
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Doone:
quote:
Originally posted by Eirenist:
There's nothing wrong with The Archers that couldn't be put right by Tom, say, running amok with a chain-saw . . .
I don't think that Jazzer the pig man should be the first target!
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"Allons-y!" "Geronimo!" "Oh, for God's sake!" The Day of the Doctor
At the end of the day, we face our Maker alongside Jesus. RIP ken
Posts: 2696 | From: my desk (if I can find the keyboard under this mess) | Registered: May 2001
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Albertus
Shipmate
# 13356
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Posted
I think it might be more likely to be Jazzer doing the cutting up, actually. I mean, running amok with a chainsaw is a bit too, well, too...interesting... for Tom, isn't it?
My money would be on William going on a shooting spree. All Ambridge gamekeepers end up mad and dangerous, either to themselves or to others.
Posts: 6498 | From: Y Sowth | Registered: Jan 2008
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jacobsen
seeker
# 14998
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Posted
Aren't they already?
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But God, holding a candle, looks for all who wander, all who search. - Shifra Alon
Beauty fades, dumb is forever-Judge Judy
The man who made time, made plenty.
Posts: 8040 | From: Æbleskiver country | Registered: Aug 2009
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Eirenist
Shipmate
# 13343
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Posted
Sorry, I hadn't realised that it was necessary for anything to be likely for it to happen in the Archers.
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'I think I think, therefore I think I am'
Posts: 486 | From: Darkest Metroland | Registered: Jan 2008
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jacobsen
seeker
# 14998
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Posted
Isn't that partly why we are rewriting it?
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But God, holding a candle, looks for all who wander, all who search. - Shifra Alon
Beauty fades, dumb is forever-Judge Judy
The man who made time, made plenty.
Posts: 8040 | From: Æbleskiver country | Registered: Aug 2009
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North East Quine
Curious beastie
# 13049
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Posted
Shula's given up alcohol for Lent and put the money she's saved into the tin in the church.... I wonder how much money is in that tin?
Enough for Kirsty to take out a contract on Rob? Or only enough to tempt Alf?
Posts: 6414 | From: North East Scotland | Registered: Oct 2007
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jacobsen
seeker
# 14998
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Posted
I lost my car radio facility following a battery replacement, but it has now been restored. Can anyone update me on the Helen/Rob situation (I only listen to the radio in the car.)
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But God, holding a candle, looks for all who wander, all who search. - Shifra Alon
Beauty fades, dumb is forever-Judge Judy
The man who made time, made plenty.
Posts: 8040 | From: Æbleskiver country | Registered: Aug 2009
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North East Quine
Curious beastie
# 13049
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Posted
When did you stop listening, jacobsen?
Currently, Rob and his mother have been to visit Rob's old school, where they plan to send Henry. Helen has no idea that Rob plans to send her son to Boarding School and weirdly the school have agreed to send all communications to Rob alone. Also, the school don't want a report from Henry's current school; they're prepared to take a five year old boarder sight unseen. Rob has told Henry, but also told him not to tell Mummy he's going to Boarding School, as it is going to be a "surprise" for Mummy.
Presumably they don't have to make this bit believable as the story will reach a conclusion before poor lisping bed-wetting Henry finds himself packed off.
Posts: 6414 | From: North East Scotland | Registered: Oct 2007
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jacobsen
seeker
# 14998
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Posted
Last time I listened. Helen was in hospital following her collapse, being assured by Rob in the most gluey, ominous tones, that he was going to be her best help. with her all the time, not leaving her side...
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But God, holding a candle, looks for all who wander, all who search. - Shifra Alon
Beauty fades, dumb is forever-Judge Judy
The man who made time, made plenty.
Posts: 8040 | From: Æbleskiver country | Registered: Aug 2009
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North East Quine
Curious beastie
# 13049
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Posted
Since then he brought his mother up to "help." She has consistently undermined Helen. Basically, she has been Rob mark II. She (his mother) has decided that Helen will have a home birth, despite the fact that she had a high-risk birth last time. Oddly enough, the hospital seem to be ok about this. Pat is bewildered by the home birth plan, but Rob told Pat it was all Helen's idea. And Pat believed that.
It was Rob's Mum's idea that Henry should be packed off to Boarding School; she will pay. Rob and his Mum have agreed that they should present the Boarding School as a fait accompli to Helen, so they've been to the school and sorted everything out.
Posts: 6414 | From: North East Scotland | Registered: Oct 2007
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Barnabas62
Shipmate
# 9110
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Posted
Helen is (finally) waking up, realising she's married a monstrous control freak. Tonight she phoned an abuse counsellor. Kirstie provided the number earlier this week. Helen was initially furious with her for even suggesting Rob was abusive, but the moves behind Helen's back to send Henry to a boarding school seem to have stripped the scales from her eyes.
But it ain't all over just yet. My guess is the scriptwriters will produce further crises.
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Who is it that you seek? How then shall we live? How shall we sing the Lord's song in a strange land?
Posts: 21397 | From: Norfolk UK | Registered: Feb 2005
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Jemima the 9th
Shipmate
# 15106
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Posted
Hoorah for Kirsty. I have been on listening strike for the past few weeks and only listened again on iplayer last night once it seemed safe to do so, from the Facebook Archers page!
A truly mammoth taking-down-of-Rob is now called for. Ideally featuring Tony, Kirsty, Tom & Pat, who hopefully will have recovered her brain by then. What have the scriptwriters done to Pat?
Posts: 801 | From: UK | Registered: Sep 2009
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Albertus
Shipmate
# 13356
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Posted
But why would it take this to make people realise what sort of person Rob is? There's been abundant evidence that he's a stinker, if not necessarily a wife-abuser, almost ever since he turned up. I agree that Pat, who used to be portrayed as sensible and if anything a bit pedantic, seems to have had both brain and backbone removed. Still, you'd think that Lilian, at least, who's knocked about the world a bit and may be drawn to the odd ratbag but never has any illusions about them (e.g. Matt), would have seen through him, but no. But then the golden rules of Archers scriptwriting seem to be that nobody ever learns from experience and if someone really wants to do something, that makes it all right. It really is a frighteningly amoral world down there in Borsetshire.
[ 26. March 2016, 13:56: Message edited by: Albertus ]
Posts: 6498 | From: Y Sowth | Registered: Jan 2008
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Jemima the 9th
Shipmate
# 15106
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Posted
I agree entirely about people never learning from mistakes. There are other people who are good at sniffing out wrong 'uns too. Lynda springs to mind - she worked out that Owen had attacked Kathy. One of the other Golden Rules of Ambridge is that actual proper 18 carat scandals are rarely mentioned after the fuss has died down - the business with Emma & Ed & Will, for example. Although I suppose chief gossip Susan might wish to keep that quiet....
I think the SWs are trying to give a realistic portrayal of a very clever & manipulative abuser and to that end Rob has had to fool everybody. But he's fooled them rather too well for my liking. Mind you, I've never been involved in a relationship like that, so perhaps it is realistic.
Posts: 801 | From: UK | Registered: Sep 2009
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Penny S
Shipmate
# 14768
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Posted
The various characters know less than the audience, I assume. And real people can be slow to pick up on evidence, because "people don't behave like that". (I have been aware of a case where the manipulation was much more overt, and people still didn't believe it.)
Posts: 5833 | Registered: May 2009
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Albertus
Shipmate
# 13356
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Posted
Yes, of course we have to remember that we have an overview that is denied to any one of the characters. Still, Rob, for example, seems to have been accepted remarkably quickly from a deservedly rather sticky start. It's Jemima's point about the amnesia that seems to affect everyone in Ambridge.
Oh, and on a bit of a tangent, giving that the Will/Ed/Emma thing was mentioned- there's an example of the really poisionous amorality, ior rather perhaps in this case warped morality, of the scriptwriters' world. Whatever you think of Will, your new wife running off with your brother and indeed hoping that her baby would be his rather than yours is something that most people would think it was reasonable to be pissed off about. But Will was consistently portrayed as the stubborn and ungenerous one for continuing to mind about it all.
Posts: 6498 | From: Y Sowth | Registered: Jan 2008
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Jemima the 9th
Shipmate
# 15106
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Posted
Ah, but that's because he's Will, who is a patronising so and so, and intensely irritating, whereas Ed is just a bit lost, but a good guy at heart etc etc etc (Yes I have a soft spot for Ed)
Posts: 801 | From: UK | Registered: Sep 2009
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Albertus
Shipmate
# 13356
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Posted
Will is a grumpy sod, in the grand tradition of Ambridge gamekeepers, but in this case he's got something to be grumpy about and his extended family gave him next to no support.
Posts: 6498 | From: Y Sowth | Registered: Jan 2008
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jacobsen
seeker
# 14998
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Posted
A bit of a problem. trying to support both brothers, the witless Emma and her unfortunate son, who is bound to grow up feeling adopted.
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But God, holding a candle, looks for all who wander, all who search. - Shifra Alon
Beauty fades, dumb is forever-Judge Judy
The man who made time, made plenty.
Posts: 8040 | From: Æbleskiver country | Registered: Aug 2009
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Albertus
Shipmate
# 13356
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Posted
Yes, Emma really is witless, isn't she. Almost impossible to believe that two brothers could have fallen out over her. I can only suppose that she must have charms which are not, ahem, readily apparent to the radio listener.
Posts: 6498 | From: Y Sowth | Registered: Jan 2008
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Jemima the 9th
Shipmate
# 15106
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Posted
She used to be much more interesting & have much more of a personality* than she seems to have now. I first started listening at the time of Ed & Emma's car accident.
*Or was totally lacking in morals, perhaps!
Posts: 801 | From: UK | Registered: Sep 2009
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Martin60
Shipmate
# 368
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Posted
Tichner is a monster but will not fall. That only happens in melodrama, fiction, except opera (Rigoletto). This is REAL. Evil dies content in old age surrounded by adoring brainwashed victims. Helen's only way out is over the edge of madness.
Who was that sinister bastard who intimidated Debbie and even Brian 15-20 years ago?
And I DID hide behind the sofa. My response now, when The Archers gets intense, is to turn it down to the threshold of audibility. I didn't know what to do with myself when Eddie got socially realistic.
As for Nigel. There is no God.
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Love wins
Posts: 17586 | From: Never Dobunni after all. Corieltauvi after all. Just moved to the capital. | Registered: Jun 2001
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Penny S
Shipmate
# 14768
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Posted
Letters in the Guardian
One points out Rob's other faults.
Given that the writers have consulted with appropriate charities, I think Rob will get his come-uppance. The listeners will have to be pointed to a way out, and not to despair.
Posts: 5833 | Registered: May 2009
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Stumbling Pilgrim
Shipmate
# 7637
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Posted
Wasn't he still basking in the glory from his heroics in the flood for a long time? Maybe that's why people are reluctant to think ill of him.
quote:
Originally posted by Penny S:
Given that the writers have consulted with appropriate charities, I think Rob will get his come-uppance. The listeners will have to be pointed to a way out, and not to despair.
I had this discussion with hubby in the car the other night (he's the fan, I only hear it these days when we're going somewhere when it's on). I think this is true,there has to be some kind of come-uppance if only for the sake of the series, I know of people who have stopped listening because this is just too uncomfortable. On the other hand, it's going to be difficult to do realistically because real life just doesn't have tidy conclusions to horrible situations. But as hubby said, it may just be that someone somewhere is listening and thinking 'that sounds like someone I know' - who knows but that it might do some good in the real world? (And yeah, Pat, give yourself a smack on the head and a good talking-to.)
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Stumbling in the Master's footsteps as best I can.
Posts: 492 | From: England | Registered: Jun 2004
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jacobsen
seeker
# 14998
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Posted
Would it be too much of a coincidence if Rob fell off a roof?
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But God, holding a candle, looks for all who wander, all who search. - Shifra Alon
Beauty fades, dumb is forever-Judge Judy
The man who made time, made plenty.
Posts: 8040 | From: Æbleskiver country | Registered: Aug 2009
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Penny S
Shipmate
# 14768
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Posted
The problem with a sudden demise would be that, while satisfying the listeners who want his perfidy revealed and punished, and Ursula seen off as well, issues which have been raised elsewhere, such as the custody of children, would not be dealt with, and from the point of view of women who might be picking up useful information, this would be unhelpful.
More time consuming, while Ursula backs his claim, in court, that Helen, because of mental health issues, is an unfit mother, before all is revealed and he loses big time. (This is beginning to seem familiar. My mother had to serve as a witness for the mother in such a case, which the toerag and his dam lost.)
Posts: 5833 | Registered: May 2009
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Barnabas62
Shipmate
# 9110
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Posted
Well, former wife Jess has now spilled the beans, entirely believably, about "monster" Rob to an increasingly aware Helen. This Sunday's episode could be 'verrry interrresssting'.
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Who is it that you seek? How then shall we live? How shall we sing the Lord's song in a strange land?
Posts: 21397 | From: Norfolk UK | Registered: Feb 2005
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Barnabas62
Shipmate
# 9110
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Posted
Yikes!
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Who is it that you seek? How then shall we live? How shall we sing the Lord's song in a strange land?
Posts: 21397 | From: Norfolk UK | Registered: Feb 2005
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Curiosity killed ...
Ship's Mug
# 11770
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Posted
Twitter has been responding. My favourite is this one
quote:
"If you are suffering domestic abuse you can ring the radio 4 helpline for a list of knife stockists in your area" #archers
There are some tweets pointing out that this gives out a message that it's too hard to leave. (But it isn't, you just do it by going when they are out to work and leave the place empty, and go somewhere safe.)
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Mugs - Keep the Ship afloat
Posts: 13794 | From: outiside the outer ring road | Registered: Aug 2006
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Albertus
Shipmate
# 13356
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Posted
Missed this- will catch up- but does it mean that with any luck Helen might get banged up for a few years? Getting rid of the two of them in one go would be quite a result, wouldn't it?
Posts: 6498 | From: Y Sowth | Registered: Jan 2008
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Curiosity killed ...
Ship's Mug
# 11770
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Posted
The story line isn't as straightforward as that Albertus. The women's aid groups (this story has been covered extensively across Radio 4 this morning) were saying that women are most at risk when they've decided to go.
(I walked out of a situation like that years ago. I am really, really hoping my parents, which is where I ran and who tried sending me back, are listening and paying attention.)
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Mugs - Keep the Ship afloat
Posts: 13794 | From: outiside the outer ring road | Registered: Aug 2006
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Barnabas62
Shipmate
# 9110
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Posted
I'm not sure he's dead. If he's alive, much more agonising mileage about Helen's alleged instability might lie ahead.
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Who is it that you seek? How then shall we live? How shall we sing the Lord's song in a strange land?
Posts: 21397 | From: Norfolk UK | Registered: Feb 2005
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Barnabas62
Shipmate
# 9110
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Posted
And, with grateful thanks to Pam Ayres, who tweeted thus.
quote:
Gut-wrenching scenes to make you stagger
Helen stabbed him with a dagger
Lying in his bloodstained shirt
Rob got his pie and his dessert
A bit of a tension buster. His pie and his dessert indeed!
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Who is it that you seek? How then shall we live? How shall we sing the Lord's song in a strange land?
Posts: 21397 | From: Norfolk UK | Registered: Feb 2005
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