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Source: (consider it) Thread: Hell: Myers-Briggs
Rossweisse

High Church Valkyrie
# 2349

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quote:
Originally posted by RooK:
...Nightlamp's assertion that the proper place for joyfully comparing neuroses is Heaven makes sense to me. When I check back tomorrow, if some other Hell-host hasn't already killed or punted this thread, I will.

Will it help keep it sufficiently Hellish if I break one of my personal rules (the one about bad language) and declare that Myers-Briggs is a pile of shit designed and used by fascist-minded jerks to manipulate and keep others in line?

(I'm not saying I believe that totally, mind you, but it's close enough to the truth and I'm terribly uncomfortable in the fluffy regions.)

Rossweisse // [Two face] [Two face] [Two face]

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I'm not dead yet.

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JimT

Ship'th Mythtic
# 142

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Why is it always about you? Look at me:

quote:
ENTPs are usually verbally as well as cerebrally quick, and generally love to argue--both for its own sake, and to show off their often-impressive skills. They tend to have a perverse sense of humor as well, and enjoy playing devil's advocate. They sometimes confuse, even inadvertently hurt, those who don't understand or accept the concept of argument as a sport.
Surely what little you have seen of me, even on this thread alone, show me as an archetypical ENTP. "Cerebrally quick,"; "often-impressive skills"; these characteristics are the very definition of my personality. I defy anyone to come up with a more apt description of me. If they can, it only goes to show how good I am at confusing them. Again, my point is proven.

Alas, the INFPs who do not recognize themselves as such must bear this in mind:

quote:
The INFP may turn to inferior extraverted Thinking for help in focusing on externals and for closure...Single impersonal facts may loom large or attain higher priority than more salient principles which are all but overlooked.
Indeed. The Truth stares at them in the face but inferior Thinking clouds their troubled minds. I would not wish to control or manipulate them, but would instead adjure them to accept the label given them by Higher Authority. As we are free to celebrate our individuality beneath the light and easy yoke of Christ, so should they feel free to celebrate their individuality beneath the modest label that is so rightly affixed to their lapels in more enlightened congregations.
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Rossweisse

High Church Valkyrie
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quote:
Originally posted by JimT:
ENTPs are usually verbally as well as cerebrally quick, and generally love to argue--both for its own sake, and to show off their often-impressive skills. They tend to have a perverse sense of humor as well...

Surely what little you have seen of me, even on this thread alone, show me as an archetypical ENTP. "Cerebrally quick,"; "often-impressive skills"; these characteristics are the very definition of my personality.... Alas, the INFPs who do not recognize themselves as such must bear this in mind...(blah blah hyperphony blah)

Actually, the ENTP is a pretty good description of ME -- but that's one type to which the parlor game has never accused me of belonging! In this it is very much indeed like astrology, where reading through the alleged types. Ooooh, the descriptions are so, like, totally, awesomely interchangeable!

No, when I've played through this joke, it accuses me of being an INTJ. And you, Mr. Expert, blew it totally on two occasions.

I see no substantive difference between those who write off others saying, "What do you expect? She's an INTJ!" and those who write them off saying, "What do you expect? She's a Capricorn!"

Rossweisse // happy birthday to me

[The senility brought on by your advanced age seems to have caused you to forget to Preview post.]

[ 17. January 2003, 04:03: Message edited by: RooK ]

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Raspberry Rabbit

Will preach for food
# 3080

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I am another ENTP. I found the test results quite instructive - the profiles fit me to a tee but, as in most things which provoke epiphanies - it wasn't terribly useful. So what, I thought, and still think.

Raspberry Rabbit
ENTP
Montreal, QC

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Raspberry Rabbit

Will preach for food
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And I might add - all the women in my life (mother, ex-wife, daughter and current girlfriends) are all J's. Not a P amongst them.

RR
Mtl

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JimT

Ship'th Mythtic
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Rasberry, I've always admired the way you smacked me down in argument. What was the recent one? Oh yes, the Tassaday hoax. Gave me a hard time on unemployment, too, talking about the inadvisability of Canadian nest eggs. BTW, my wife is ISTJ and both my parents are ESTJ. Given my tendency to lapse into ENFP mode, I've had lots of time to practice my ENTP arguing.

Rossweisse, OK OK. I need to keep in mind that some T's when provoked can become irrational and that J's can be changeable and moody. Especially younger female ones. I'll have to remember that a young female INTJ looks like a mature male INFP.

But I am holding firm on "N." The only "S" I saw was ptarmigan in one of his moods. Where are all the "S"s? I actually expected a few SJ's, who carry on tradition and such. Where are they? I did not expect any SP's who are the "eat drink and be merry" types and to my knowledge no one is an SP. So what gives? No one here has blood type "A"? No one here is a Cancer?

Bullshit! Something real is going on! Logician where the Hell are you? (I'm changing my guess to INFJ for you, too, given some new information on other threads I've read. I agonized over the T and F for you, but now I've got it nailed. Your strong J made me think you were a T along with being too hard on yourself sometimes. But no. F is it.)

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MrSponge2U

Ship’s scrub
# 3076

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quote:
Originally posted by JimT:

Where are all the "S"s? I actually expected a few SJ's, who carry on tradition and such. Where are they? I did not expect any SP's who are the "eat drink and be merry" types and to my knowledge no one is an SP. So what gives? No one here has blood type "A"? No one here is a Cancer?

Well, I'm an SP. ISTP actually. And blood type A. But not a Cancer, though.

I'll just dance the "SP" fluffy-bunny dance. [Snigger]

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JimT

Ship'th Mythtic
# 142

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I forgot about Charismatics and Heaven. The fun, the feeling, the ecstacy. It's right there in your profile: charismatic Heaven-poster.

Well over 90% of your recent posts are in Heaven, which is a bunch of fluffy SP fun, and none are in Purgatory which is NT/NF debateland, where I live. That takes real work, joy boy. No place for a charismatic, fun-loving, Heaven-posting, bunny-dancing "SP."

Anyone else? Logician, comments?

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KenWritez
Shipmate
# 3238

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ROFLMAO....

JimT! [Not worthy!] JimT! [Not worthy!] JimT! [Not worthy!]

I can't wait for Logician to show up.

Ya know, I'm just gonna bring out the lawn chair and put my feet up, watch this lil' brouhaha, pop some peanuts and sip a nice glass of wine.

This is better than the Rose Parade.

(As I revel in my NF/NT-ness. About 75% E, almost totally P.)

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"The truth is you're the weak. And I'm the tyranny of evil men. But I'm tryin', Ringo. I'm tryin' real hard to be a shepherd." --Quentin Tarantino, Pulp Fiction

My blog: http://oxygenofgrace.blogspot.com

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Arrietty

Ship's borrower
# 45

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I cannot understand why Christians take Myers Briggs seriously.

I was cajoled into going on (and paying for) a MBTI training course by a Christian counselling centre I worked in, surprise surprise at the end of the day we were introduced to the idea of our MBTI 'shadow'. As I recall, the 'shadow' is the opposite of the types in your profile, any or all of which might also mysteriously show up in your personality. Of course you need another course to understand your own and other people's shadows and when they might appear. And probably another after that to understand why bits of the types that are not yours or your shadow's might also show up in certain circumstances.

Having been heavily involved in astrology at one point, I would say MBTI fills exactly the same need to make you believe you can understand yourself other people without going to all the effort of getting to know them. MBTI and astrology both seem to downplay the possibility of personal transformation.

Any 'test' which asks you to give a subjective account of yourself (as the MBTI test does) will of course tell you exactly what you expected to hear about yourself.

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i-church

Online Mission and Ministry

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Raspberry Rabbit

Will preach for food
# 3080

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Arrietty writes:

quote:
MBTI and astrology both seem to downplay the possibility of personal transformation.


Well, in a word, umm .... no. In the Diocese of Moosonee (in my youthful Junior Woodchuck days) we had a Myers Briggs Seminar and while the Diocese of Moosonee's seminars are in no way to be seen as being the authoritative last word on any subject we were told that a 25 year old's scores would be very different than his 50 year old scores - that one's absent bits would, in a healthy, curious and open individual, become areas of fruitful development as one grew older. I took the test twice - with about a decade between the tests and found precisely that easing of certain pronounced tendencies (or preferences).

And - given the whole Jungian premise behind the exercise - one wouldn't expect to see people's personalities or preferences cast in stone.

Raspberry Rabbit
Montreal, QC

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Raspberry Rabbit

Will preach for food
# 3080

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Although - having said this I'd love to dialogue with the other ENTPs on the ship to see what we have in common which is, I suspect, rather a lot though I'm pretty sure I don't like them much.

Raspberry Rabbit
ENTP

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Inanna

Ship's redhead
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OK, I'm intrigued...

JimT, what do you peg me as?

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All shall be well
And all shall be well
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Arrietty

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The way it is used popularly seems to be that the categorisation says something meaningful about who you essentially are. I am not sure if you are saying above that someone's category will change as they change. If that is the case then how often do you need it checked? Does it change suddenly or gradually? Suppose I was one thing last time I was assessed and tell people that but in fact I am another? How does that help them to relate to me?

If we do not need to know how people were assessed in a MBTI test because we can discern whether the category they tell us they belong to still fits, why do we need to take MBTI tests?

In the light of what yu have said about change, what does MB typology tell me except 'Fred is different from me, or at least he was the last time we both took MBTI tests'?

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i-church

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MrSponge2U

Ship’s scrub
# 3076

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quote:
Originally posted by JimT:
I forgot about Charismatics and Heaven. The fun, the feeling, the ecstacy. It's right there in your profile: charismatic Heaven-poster.

Well over 90% of your recent posts are in Heaven, which is a bunch of fluffy SP fun, and none are in Purgatory which is NT/NF debateland, where I live. That takes real work, joy boy. No place for a charismatic, fun-loving, Heaven-posting, bunny-dancing "SP."

I would say LOL, but that would be my "S"-ness showing. [Wink]

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Raspberry Rabbit

Will preach for food
# 3080

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Also Spracht Arrietty

quote:
The way it is used popularly seems to be that the categorisation says something meaningful about who you essentially are.
Key word there is 'popularly' and the popular use *is* probably intended to declare who people 'essentially' are and, therefore, to avoid the labour of getting to know them. The popular use of such a tool would, as well, be defeated by the recognition that people change over time.

I mean, why would we even attempt to say who we 'essentially' are? I wouldn't mind know who you 'essentially' are if I have to make a snap decision about you and really don't care much about the'who' you essentially are. I'd hate to have someone tell me who I 'essentially' am. It would be time to have the Office read over me and my Requiem planned since the dice has obviously been thrown, my faults are set in stone and all my achievements and personal development have now been accomplished.

My point is that the tool is not a half bad way of measuring change and this in no way defeats its purpose.

Raspberry Rabbit
ENTP for now but who knows?
Montreal, QC

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Nightlamp
Shipmate
# 266

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Well currently it is a way of boring the shit out of me. I mean who takes it seriously?

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I don't know what you are talking about so it couldn't have been that important- Nightlamp

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Raspberry Rabbit

Will preach for food
# 3080

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There used to be a good website where you could take the Personality Sorter online - the full gamut of questions. It has, in the last couple of years, disappeared. I guess they realized that people were taking the test for free instead of paying trained people to administer it.

Hmmm. Everything's a racket!

Raspberry Rabbit
Montreal, QC

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Raspberry Rabbit

Will preach for food
# 3080

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Nightlamp that's such a typical FUPS thing to say. I should have known you'd say something like that.

RR
Mtl

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Eanswyth

Ship's raven
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quote:
Originally posted by ThatsMrJuice2U:
I would say LOL, but that would be my "S"-ness showing. [Wink]

That's better than your "P"-ness showing. childish snigger

[I wonder which part of MBti might be connected to what should be a relatively simple process of clicking one damn button to check UBB.]

[ 18. January 2003, 02:58: Message edited by: RooK ]

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Rossweisse

High Church Valkyrie
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quote:
Originally posted by JimT:
...Rossweisse, OK OK. I need to keep in mind that some T's when provoked can become irrational and that J's can be changeable and moody. Especially younger female ones. I'll have to remember that a young female INTJ looks like a mature male INFP....

Oh, oink off, you wannabe bully. What rot, all the way around. I have said nothing "irrational" in this thread -- even my decision to use a barnyard epithet was a fully rational decision to attempt to keep this topic in Hell where it belongs. You haven't answered (probably because you can't answer) my point about some of these silly descriptions being interchangeable.

So tell us, do you impose Myers-Briggs testing or test results on others for a living? What's your interest in pushing this garbage? Surely you can't be that, well, irrational. Can you?

Rossweisse // I say it's spinach, and I say the hell with it

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I'm not dead yet.

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JimT

Ship'th Mythtic
# 142

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OK, I've had my fun playing around. I had absolutely no idea what Rossweisse was and was just having fun. But I do think that the descriptions are not completely arbitrary and that they are of some use in looking at interpersonal relationships. I also think that they could be better explained to people. Having said all that, I am open to the idea that all my years of privately playing around with it, speculating about it, and informally using it in my systems consulting business were years spent just learning about people in general and rationalizing what I had learned into some kind of structure. I never gave the test nor did I run workshops; I am a database analyst. But I was also a project manager and that's where I used it. I would say that I used it successfully.

Logician, stop laughing your ass off. I'm serious and I really would be curious as to your reaction.

I found M-B to be useful in seeing how people made individual and group decisions, and how they argued with each other. I put in new computer systems and noticed right away that there were two camps: those that believed 100% in the new system and those who did not want the change or were skeptical about it. This is one of the signs of N vs. S split, the most important split.

Now, within the "N" camp, you would see a split between that folks were concerned about forming groups and committees and getting all points of view represented vs. folks concerned with training, developing expertise, getting experience, and testing for accuracy. This is the classic "F" vs. "T" split. The "NF" folks dealt with the human side of the equation and the "NT" with the technical side. The pure NFs would scream at the pure NTs about which was more important. The N side would usually be the NT computer department folks and the NF/NT department heads.

Within the "S" camp, the split was on a different basis. Some would just talk about how the new system (if those eggheads can ever get it working) would give more options for selling and supporting new products, would be more fun to use because it was in color or used a mouse, or would be easier on the eys. They wanted to use it as soon as possible and just dive in and play around. Others would scoff at these speculations and demand to see a rigorous schedule with several milestones passed before they would even entertain the notion that it might have a prayer of working. This is the P vs. J split that most effectively splits the S crowd into SP vs. SJ. The pure SPs would scream that the pure SJs were the dull drudges that were going to block the system from achieving the ends to which the new system could be put and the SJs would roll their eyes that the SPs swallowed the crap from the Ns that there was any hope at all. Especially without a schedule and successfully completed milestones. But both camps were agreed that the Ns had to get their shit together first. The "S" side tended to be the end users or marketing types.

We have so far:

NT (Technical Leaders)
NF (Organizational Leaders)

SP (End Users Wanting Fun)
SJ (End Users Wanting Work)

I'll give one SOF example of interaction between groups: yesterday I saw Milkman (pure NF) telling Erin (pure NT I assume) that the "validity" of Bush's election was more a matter of group consensus than logic. Erin stuck to her guns that logic is all that matters and you can't vote what is logical.

To complete the picture, we have to do the splits within the four groups. I've already droned on, so I'll just hit the high points. The J/P axis is what splits the NT and NF camps. You can see this for example when NTPs like me argue with Father Gregory, who I am quite sure is NTJ. We go along fine until he says "Chalcedon IS DECIDED" and we say "NOTHING IS DECIDED in the realm of religion." The T/F axis splits the SP and SJ camps. I simply don't see that here because I spend time in Purgatory where any SP or SJ is going to think a lot of theoretical horseshit is being shovelled all over the place for no good reason. An example I have seen is that my SJT wife is more likely to minister to people's physical needs than her SJF sister who gives emotional support.

This gives us

NTJ
NTP
NFJ
NFP

SPT
SPF
SJT
SJF

The least most important axis is I/E. I’ve dragged on so long I’ll just say that I see it as a preference for the internal or external. It’s hardly worth mentioning in terms of types, so I’ll just skip it. But you permute I/E into the above 8 groups and you get all 16.

NTJI
NTJE
NTPI
NTPE

NFJI
NFJE
NFPI
NFPE

SPTI
SPTE
SPFI
SPFE

SJTI
SJTE
SJFI
SJFE

Again, some people show no strong preference or tendency on any axis, so they come out differently. But I don’t think a pure N comes out a pure S on two different days. A very weak N might come out a very weak S on two different days.

Problems I recognize are overlaps in the axes; N likes new things for innovation and cleverness; P likes new things for variety and new utility. In my mind, I work more at this atomic level than the coarse level of N or P. But when someone is looking for something new, I ask myself if they are more interested in innovation or new capability. Or both.

The other problem is that people’s results are not qualified with a magnitude, nor are the scores given in the correct order left to right. I would give people a 1-3 for each trait, and give them left to right in order of importance as I’ve shown above.

I would be:

1N 1T 3P 2E (NTPE)

Tomorrow I might score

1N 1F 3P 2E (NFPE)

But I’m damn sure never gonna score

3S 3F 3J 3I (ISFJ)

So there you have it. Call it elaborate rationalization, call it imagined relationships. I’m laying it all out because I really did come up with this junk in my spare time, used it with what I thought was some success and wonder what a pro like Logician thinks.

And everyone else.

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tomb
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# 174

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Well, actually, the MBTI is a little bit more nuanced than the way y'all are describing it. Where is really shines is giving a person insights into his own behavior--not in finding a partner via a jungian "what's your sign" approach.

And it shouldn't be confused with the truncated Keirsey-Bates "MBTI-lite" test that is found on the Internet. Hell, I used to have that on a Hypercard stack on an old Mac.

I suppose if I wanted to know the exact reasons why I am so attracted to the possibility of murdering stupid people who annoy me and burying their corpses in the woods, I would take a more "legitimate" test such as the MMPI-II. But really, I already know why I want to murder stupid people and bury them in the woods--it's because they annoy me.

However, the MBTI gave me refreshing insights into why I was bored at cocktail parties, why I could so easily disrupt a Vestry meeting back when I was a churchwarden, and why missing a deadline--even by a day--sent me so close to the edge. This was good information for me.

And, if truth be told, I don't give a damn if the reason other people don't meet my deadlines is because they are a "P" instead of a "J". It doesn't make me feel more understanding--let alone compassionate--toward them. They still annoy me and I want to murder them and bury their corpse in the woods.

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Presleyterian
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# 1915

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I had to take the MMPI some years back and am pretty sure that one of the questions was "Do you occasionally fantasize about murdering Episcopalians and burying their corpses in the woods?"

I'll let you guess how I answered it.

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Arrietty

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# 45

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quote:
Originally posted by Raspberry Rabbit:
I mean, why would we even attempt to say who we 'essentially' are? I wouldn't mind know who you 'essentially' are if I have to make a snap decision about you and really don't care much about the'who' you essentially are. I'd hate to have someone tell me who I 'essentially' am.

If it was used in recruitment (or indeed for any purpose other than idle curiosity) that is exactly what it would be being used for. To cut through the image you present and get at the truth to see if the 'real' you will fit in to whatever it is you want to do.

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i-church

Online Mission and Ministry

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JimT

Ship'th Mythtic
# 142

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quote:
Tomb: Where is really shines is giving a person insights into his own behavior
Seriously, what is your type and what insights has it given you, tomb?
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Raspberry Rabbit

Will preach for food
# 3080

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Arrietty

It *s* used in recruitment and that's a shame.

Raspberry Rabbit
Montreal, QC

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...naked pirates not respecting boundaries...
(((BLOG)))

Posts: 2215 | From: In the middle of France | Registered: Jul 2002  |  IP: Logged
tomb
Shipmate
# 174

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Presley, a little known fact about Episcopalians is that, when Presbyterians or Elvis fetishists sneak up on them, they are prone to fight back.

It's really very easy. The best way to take out a Presbyterian is during the Sermon. They're already in a stupor from it, and they hardly notice when they make that blessed transition from Boredom to Death.

Similarly, anybody listening to "Blue Hawaii" has at some point wished, "Oh, just kill me now and let it be over with."

Episcopalians are happy to oblige.

And Presley, I, too, took the MMPI years ago. Well I remember the question, "Do you ever want to smash things?" I fear I answered "NO" a little too vigorously as I dug my number 2 pencil all the way through the paper of that little circle and damaged the desktop underneath.

But I didn't go outside the lines, mind you.

And JimT, I could answer your question about my MBTI type, but then I'd have to kill you. Suffice it to say that there aren't many of me out there and we recognize each other when we meet. If you have to ask, you aren't one of us.

Posts: 5039 | From: Denver, Colorado | Registered: May 2001  |  IP: Logged
Nightlamp
Shipmate
# 266

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*Yawn*

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I don't know what you are talking about so it couldn't have been that important- Nightlamp

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Obnoxious Snob

Arch-Deacon
# 982

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I'm sorry but the longer I read this thread, the more confused I have become: a bit like a seeker after truth encountering liturgical language for the first time. Despite appearing very cynical, a lot of you then gaily use terms like INFP, INTJ, ENT, ISP, BNF, ABCDEFG, etc, etc, with no hint of elucidation. This post should really be consigned to the Things I would Consign to Hell Thread because I hate abbreviations that assume we all know the language we are speaking to each other. Well, I don't, having studiously and succesfully avoided Myers-Briggs even during its halcyon days. So if you are describing a personality type which, ha ha, you don't take seriously but has enough truth for you to talk about endlessly, please, please explain to the uninitiated. [Mad] [Mad] [Mad]

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'The best thing we can do is to make wherever we're lost in Look as much like home as we can'

Christopher Fry

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JimT

Ship'th Mythtic
# 142

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Arch, here are the abbreviations, with links explaining them:

Extraversion or Introversion (E/I)
Sensation or Intuition (S/N)
Thinking or Feeling (T/F)
Judgment or Perception (J/P)

Each of the items above are to be imagined like a number line, and you get a score for each one depending on which side of the middle you land. For example, imagine Extroversion all the way to the left and Introversion all the way to the right. Your score will put you somewhere between the extremes. If you are exactly in the middle, you are an "X" meaning indeterminate. Otherwise you will be "extroverted" or "introverted" to some degree.

While there are 16 possible combinations, they are looked at as four groups of four each. The first four are:

RATIONAL NTs
IDEALIST NFs
ARTISAN SPs
GUARDIAN SJs

If you follow the links, you will see the four detailed groupings that are inside the four broad groupings. Each detailed grouping has a link that gives a full explanation.

Posts: 2619 | From: Now On | Registered: May 2001  |  IP: Logged
Eanswyth

Ship's raven
# 3363

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Here are specialized prayers for all MB types...

ISTJ - Lord help me to relax about insignificant details, beginning tomorrow at 11:41 a.m. EST.

ISTP - God help me to consider people's feelings, even if most of them ARE hypersensitive.

ESTP - God help me to take responsibility for my own actions, even though they are usually NOT my fault.

ESTJ - God help me to not try to RUN everything. But if You need some help, just ask.

ISFJ - Lord help me to be more laid back, and help me to do it EXACTLY right.

ISFP - Lord help me to stand up for my rights, (if you don't mind my asking).

ESFP - God help me to take things more seriously, especially parties and dancing.

ESFJ - God give me patience, and I mean right now!

INFJ - Lord help me not to be a perfectionist (did I spell that correctly?)

INFP - God, help me to finish everything I sta

ENFP - God help me to keep my mind on one th -- Look a bird! -- ing at a time.

ENFJ - God help me to do only what I can and trust you for the rest. Do you mind putting that in writing?

INTJ - Lord keep me open to others' ideas, WRONG though they may be.

INTP - Lord help me to be less independent, but let me do it my way.

ENTP - Lord help me follow established procedures today. On second thought, I'll settle for a few minutes.

ENTJ - Lord help me slow down andnotrushthroughwhatIdo.

AMEN

Posts: 1323 | From: San Diego | Registered: Sep 2002  |  IP: Logged
Presleyterian
Shipmate
# 1915

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tomb Wayne Former-Hellhost wrote:
quote:
Presley, a little known fact about Episcopalians is that, when Presbyterians or Elvis fetishists sneak up on them, they are prone to fight back.
But how, tomb? I assume they must create a diversion by throwing a perfectly shaken martini in the victim's face and then go in for the death blow with a hand-forged seven iron.

And don't discount "Blue Hawaii." The movie starred Angela Lansbury as Elvis' clingy, rich bitch Southern mother who married an ineffectual pineapple plantation owner after the death of Elvis' father and barely contained her incestuous lust for The Pompadoured One. She gave quite a performance, if you're into that Tennessee-Williams-Meets-Hush-Hush-Sweet-Charlotte Southern Gothic thing -- as I'll bet a Goo Goo Cluster, an RC Co' Cola, and a heapin' helpin' of Chili Frito Pie that you are.

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JimT

Ship'th Mythtic
# 142

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OK, I "did my sums" as the Brits like to say. Between this thread and the other one there were 32 people.
  • There were 29 i(N)tuitives and 3 (S)ensitives. We expect 8 N and 24 S.
  • There were 10 (J)udgers and 22 (P)erceivers. We expect 16 each.
  • The (E)xtroverts/(I)ntroverts and (T)hinkers/(F)eelers were 17/15 and 15/17. We expect 16 each.
  • There were NONE of the four most common types in the general population: ESTJ, ESTP, ESFJ, and ESFP. They make up 56% of the general population and ZERO on the Ship.
  • There were FIFTEEN TIMES the number of INFPs and EIGHT TIMES the number of ENFPs relative to the general population.
The "general population" numbers come from my reading ten years ago that in the US and Western Europe, there were 3/4 E, 1/4 I, 3/4 S, 1/4 N, and 1/2 each of the rest. This is not random. It accords with anecdotal evidence from someone who said they were a rare S in a church full of Ns. It is predicted by these two descriptions of the most over-represented types on The Ship: ENFP and INFP. Descriptions are from the links I gave earlier.
quote:
For ENFPs, nothing occurs which does not have some deep ethical significance, and this, coupled with their uncanny sense of the motivations of others, gives them a talent for seeing life as an exciting drama, pregnant with possibilities for both good and evil. This type is found in only about 3 percent of the general population, but they have great influence because of their extraordinary impact on others.
3%. Right. But we have 25%.

quote:
INFPs have a profound sense of idealism derived from a strong personal morality, and they conceive of the world as an ethical, honorable place. Indeed, to understand Healers, we must understand their idealism as almost boundless and selfless, inspiring them to make extraordinary sacrifices for someone or something they believe in. The Healer is the Prince or Princess of fairytale, the King's Champion or Defender of the Faith, like Sir Galahad or Joan of Arc. Healers are found in only 1 percent of the general population, although, at times, their idealism leaves them feeling even more isolated from the rest of humanity.
1%. We have 15%.

What does this mean? It means that most practical people see no reason to go to church now that Hell is out of fashion and you are not ostracized in the community for not going. It means that some practical people in the church are capitalizing on it with McChurch. It means that while a minority of practical people in the church keep things going, the NFPs tell everyone how they should be miraculously transformed and converted in a mystical way while NTJs remind everyone not to forget about logic, systematics, consistency, and truth.

Tell me I'm wrong.

Posts: 2619 | From: Now On | Registered: May 2001  |  IP: Logged
Presleyterian
Shipmate
# 1915

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Or there could be some self-selection bias. Perhaps ESTJs, ESTPs, ESFJs, and ESFPs are just as likely to post on the Ship, but less likely to reveal their MB results publicly: 1) because they're less likely to take the whole thing seriously; or 2) in a general spirit of "noneoyerdambizness."
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Nightlamp
Shipmate
# 266

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*yawn*

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I don't know what you are talking about so it couldn't have been that important- Nightlamp

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JimT

Ship'th Mythtic
# 142

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I want a poll.
Posts: 2619 | From: Now On | Registered: May 2001  |  IP: Logged
Nightlamp
Shipmate
# 266

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Well they can do polls in Heaven so why not go and bore them.

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I don't know what you are talking about so it couldn't have been that important- Nightlamp

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tomb
Shipmate
# 174

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quote:
Originally posted by Presleyterian:
...don't discount "Blue Hawaii." The movie starred Angela Lansbury as Elvis' clingy, rich bitch Southern mother who married an ineffectual pineapple plantation owner after the death of Elvis' father and barely contained her incestuous lust for The Pompadoured One. She gave quite a performance, if you're into that Tennessee-Williams-Meets-Hush-Hush-Sweet-Charlotte Southern Gothic thing -- as I'll bet a Goo Goo Cluster, an RC Co' Cola, and a heapin' helpin' of Chili Frito Pie that you are.

Actually, I'm more of the Faulkner As I Lay Dying sort myself. And I think Flannery O'Connor is a god.

And you can keep your pig-swill over-sweetened diabetic-dog-under-the-porch RC cola to yourself and all your emasculated mullet-flapping friends with their sissy little Toyota trucks with the battle flag on the bumper. My ambition is to rot my liver before my teeth fall out.

We take out Presbyterians through apnea and Elvisites with Percodan.

And Nightlamp, nobody cares a bowl-full of warm dogshit of you're bored.

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Sarkycow
La belle Dame sans merci
# 1012

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quote:
Originally posted by tomb:
And Nightlamp, nobody cares a bowl-full of warm dogshit of you're bored.

Of you're bored? OF you're bored?

My my tomb, don't you wish you could still edit posts?

Did your little mind go a-wandering when you were trying to ahem 'compose' your post?

Viki

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“Just because your voice reaches halfway around the world doesn't mean you are wiser than when it reached only to the end of the bar.”

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Arrietty

Ship's borrower
# 45

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quote:
Originally posted by tomb:
dogshit of you're bored.

Dogshit Of Your Board was Noel Harrison's follow up to his hit record Windmills Of Your Mind, wasn't it?

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i-church

Online Mission and Ministry

Posts: 6634 | From: Coventry, UK | Registered: May 2001  |  IP: Logged
tomb
Shipmate
# 174

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Honeee, when you can write as well as I do when medicated on gin, you can criticize a slip of the finger, so to speak. Got any money out of the Rev. Gerald yet?

I thought not.

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tomb
Shipmate
# 174

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Same to you, Arrietty.
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Arrietty

Ship's borrower
# 45

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Ooh, I'm wounded.*

I will try to soothe my hurt feelings with some mockery.

TOMB MADE A TYPO!!!! TOMB MADE A TYPO!!!!

Now we know your superpowers have gone, we can get our revenge.

MWA-H-HA-HA-HA-HA-HA-A

*Or I would be, if your post made any syntactical sense whatsoever.

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i-church

Online Mission and Ministry

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Sarkycow
La belle Dame sans merci
# 1012

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quote:
Originally posted by tomb:
Honeee, when you can write as well as I do when medicated on gin, you can criticize a slip of the finger, so to speak.

Look petal, you claim you can write so well, but I can't see any evidence of this. All I see is impenetrable screeds of words, which are apparently and allegedly insulting to Pres. Try using English to write your posts.

quote:
Got any money out of the Rev. Gerald yet?

I thought not.

Why waste your time squeezing money out of the pauper, when you can torture him instead? And it's not like anyone cares enough to try and free him.

Viki

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“Just because your voice reaches halfway around the world doesn't mean you are wiser than when it reached only to the end of the bar.”

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tomb
Shipmate
# 174

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Yes, and we all know who got his money, don't we?

Screed, indeed. You know I'm gonna win.

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Sarkycow
La belle Dame sans merci
# 1012

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quote:
Originally posted by tomb:
Yes, and we all know who got his money, don't we?

Screed, indeed. You know I'm gonna win.

Win what poppet?

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“Just because your voice reaches halfway around the world doesn't mean you are wiser than when it reached only to the end of the bar.”

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tomb
Shipmate
# 174

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quote:
Originally posted by Arrietty:
Ooh, I'm wounded.*

I will try to soothe my hurt feelings with some mockery.

TOMB MADE A TYPO!!!! TOMB MADE A TYPO!!!!

Now we know your superpowers have gone, we can get our revenge.

MWA-H-HA-HA-HA-HA-HA-A

*Or I would be, if your post made any syntactical sense whatsoever.

Superpowers, indeed. I have never used my "superpowers" against you. *Edit this post. Delete this redundant post.* Delete umpteen stupid threads.

My superpowers are in my command of language (if not my typing). If my post made no "syntactical sense," this just goes to demonstrate your tenuous command of the language.

Posts: 5039 | From: Denver, Colorado | Registered: May 2001  |  IP: Logged
Sarkycow
La belle Dame sans merci
# 1012

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quote:
Originally posted by tomb:
If my post made no "syntactical sense," this just goes to demonstrate your tenuous command of the language.

Quick grammar lesson poppet:

The comma doesn't belong to the words "syntactical sense", and so should go outside the quote marks.

Hope this helps in your writing.

Viki

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“Just because your voice reaches halfway around the world doesn't mean you are wiser than when it reached only to the end of the bar.”

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tomb
Shipmate
# 174

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In American usage, the punctuation is always placed within the quotation marks. It's a typographical thing, not a linguistic one. Though I suspect you wouldn't understand.
Posts: 5039 | From: Denver, Colorado | Registered: May 2001  |  IP: Logged



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