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Source: (consider it) Thread: Eccles: Confession
chive

Ship's nude
# 208

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I'm preparing to make my first confession so this thread has been very useful thankyou [Big Grin]

Next week I hope to go on retreat for a couple of days to examine my conscience and prepare. Has anyone got any suggestions about ways of doing this so that I can do it properly (including the bits I probably don't want to and would normally rush over in an attempt to pretend they're not a problem)? Are there any ways of structuring this?

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'Edward was the kind of man who thought there was no such thing as a lesbian, just a woman who hadn't done one-to-one Bible study with him.' Catherine Fox, Love to the Lost

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Vaticanchic
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# 13869

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Take your most important objects/memories with you. Try to make a silent retreat. Not too long. Ban yourself from leaving the property. Just suggestions. God bless you at this time.

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"Sink, Burn or Take Her a Prize"

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ChaliceGirl
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# 13656

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As far as examining the conscious, I spend quiet time alone and any wrongs I've done, thought and said recently just pop up, and it is helpful to write them down.
Good luck with your first confession, remember it is nothing to be afraid of.

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The Episcopal Church Welcomed Me.

"Welcome home." ++Katharine Jefferts Schori to me on 29Mar2009.
My KJS fansite & chicksinpointyhats

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Nunc Dimittis
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# 848

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quote:
Originally posted by chive:
I'm preparing to make my first confession so this thread has been very useful thankyou [Big Grin]

Next week I hope to go on retreat for a couple of days to examine my conscience and prepare. Has anyone got any suggestions about ways of doing this so that I can do it properly (including the bits I probably don't want to and would normally rush over in an attempt to pretend they're not a problem)? Are there any ways of structuring this?

When I made my first confession, I was told to go away and examine three areas in which I might have committed sin: against God, against others, against myself.

You could look at the traditional 7 deadly sins, or the fruits of the Spirit, or get your hands on any manual which might give you a structure - I am sure a websearch might bring up some results.

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Ecclesiastical Flip-flop
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# 10745

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As an afterthought, I thought I might add how my first confession went 45 years ago.

I have already highlighted the "normal practice" of stating when one's last confession was, and until this thread arose, I have never known any differently. I got to the church at the advertised time on Holy Saturday, having prepared my written list of sins beforehand. It was face to face and kneeling. I started to read the printed words of the prayer, and at Since my last confession I intentionally left that bit out. The priest interrupted me brusquely and demanded, "When was your last confession?" "This is my first confession." I looked up and he was looking hard at me, then he added, "All right". So it proceeded from there and he gave me friendly advice including to burn the bit of paper.

So I have used the sacrament of reconciliation most years ever since.

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Joyeuses Pâques! Frohe Ostern! Buona Pasqua! ¡Felices Pascuas! Happy Easter!

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aig
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# 429

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'It was face to face and kneeling.' Ecclesiastical Flip-flop

How did that work? I have knelt next to the priest - never facing them when kneeling. I have sat opposite 'face to face' however.

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That's not how we do it here.......

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Knopwood
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# 11596

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When I make my confession in the side chapel of the church (as opposed to in the rector's office) she sits on the celebrant's chair, in profile to me, and I kneel at the altar rail.
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ChaliceGirl
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# 13656

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In my case the priest sits in a chair by the rail and I kneel in front of him, with the rail in between us. And this takes place in a side chapel. Sounds like the same sceanario as LQ.

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The Episcopal Church Welcomed Me.

"Welcome home." ++Katharine Jefferts Schori to me on 29Mar2009.
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Ecclesiastical Flip-flop
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quote:
Originally posted by aig:
'It was face to face and kneeling.' Ecclesiastical Flip-flop

How did that work? I have knelt next to the priest - never facing them when kneeling. I have sat opposite 'face to face' however.

It was openly face-to-face as opposed to anonymously through a grille; that is what I meant. Perhaps my words were ill-chosen. On the occasion in question, it was in a side chapel; the priest-confessor was seated and I knelt at a prie-Dieu. The arrangement was similar to what LQ and ChaliceGirl mention in response to my post.

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Joyeuses Pâques! Frohe Ostern! Buona Pasqua! ¡Felices Pascuas! Happy Easter!

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ChaliceGirl
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# 13656

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I'm curious- what is the sacrament of Reconciliation of a Pentinent like in the 1928 BCP?

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The Episcopal Church Welcomed Me.

"Welcome home." ++Katharine Jefferts Schori to me on 29Mar2009.
My KJS fansite & chicksinpointyhats

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Ecclesiastical Flip-flop
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# 10745

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quote:
Originally posted by ChaliceGirl:
I'm curious- what is the sacrament of Reconciliation of a Pentinent like in the 1928 BCP?

What is the 1928 BCP as you know it? Here in England, it is the deposited book which did not get through both Houses of Parliament in that year. So 1662 BCP remained extant and until liturgical reform in the 1970s, the proposed BCP 1928 was used unofficially in many places. But that is another topic entirely.

I would have to see a copy of the book to which you refer to be able to look up the text for the sacrament of reconciliation as contained therein.

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Joyeuses Pâques! Frohe Ostern! Buona Pasqua! ¡Felices Pascuas! Happy Easter!

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dj_ordinaire
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In the United States, the 1928 was the authorised prayer-book until until its replacement in the 1970s.

If you want to look up the form of Confession it provides, Chalice Girl, it should be in here somewhere...

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Flinging wide the gates...

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Extol
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# 11865

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ChaliceGirl, if you are referring to the US 1928, as far as I know there isn't a form for private reconciliation of a penitent. I imagine Catholic parishes in PECUSA used forms found in Fr. Belton's Manual for Confessors, the Holy Cross edition of St. Augustine's Prayer Book, or some other form. I believe that S. Clement's Philadelphia uses the form found in the English Ritual.
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dj_ordinaire
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Double-posting to say - doesn't seem to be there! The Visitation of the Sick is included, and includes a rubric stating that a person may make a confession of any particular sin and be assured of God's forgiveness, but no liturgy is provided for this.

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Flinging wide the gates...

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Extol
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DJ_O, my understanding is that private auricular confession was a little too "advanced" or "extreme" for PECUSA to have included in the '28. It was certainly a hotly disputed practice during the eras of the Tractarians and the early Ritualists. Hence the use of extramural texts for the practice until the '79.
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dj_ordinaire
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Yes, that would make sense. As, of course, Anglicans in the Church of England do now.

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Flinging wide the gates...

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leo
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BCP 1662 Visitation of the Sick has:

Here shall the sick person be moved to make a special confession of his sins, if he feel his conscience troubled with any weighty matter. After which confession, the Priest shall absolve him (if he humbly and heartily desire it) after this sort.

OUR Lord Jesus Christ, who hath left power to his Church to absolve all sinners who truly repent and believe in him, of his great mercy forgive thee thine offences: And by his authority committed to me, I absolve thee from all thy sins, In the Name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost. Amen.

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aig
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As, of course, Anglicans in the Church of England do now.
dj_ordinaire

Common Worship now has a couple of Rites of Reconciliation, one of which is available in a handy booklet form. You can find them in the CW Rites of Initiation book.
Not all priests in the Church of England have discovered this yet and you may be given a copy of their preferred version (usually with the words 'you don't need to use this if you don't want to' as they pass it over.)

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That's not how we do it here.......

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Mother Julian

Ship's librarian
# 11978

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In the English Book of Common Prayer proposed in 1928, but never legally sanctioned by the Houses of Parliament, the wording is identical to that given above by Leo from the BCP 1662 Visitation of the sick - I think this is the wording on the card given to penitents in my shack.

Chive asked for help in structuring one's examination of conscience - I found the following three links helpful when I prepared for my first confession, and for subsequent confessions:
Anglican
Orthodox
a shorter Orthodox self-examination

I'm sure there are plenty more that others have used and could recommend.

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The corn was orient and immortal wheat which never should be reaped, nor was ever sown.

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leo
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The Anglican one was published in 1947!
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Mother Julian

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Leo wrote:
quote:
The Anglican one was published in 1947!
Yeah, I know, it's a bit modern for my tastes too, but at least it's not infected with the taint of modernism ...

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The corn was orient and immortal wheat which never should be reaped, nor was ever sown.

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Edgeman
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# 12867

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quote:
Originally posted by Mother Julian:
Leo wrote:
quote:
The Anglican one was published in 1947!
Yeah, I know, it's a bit modern for my tastes too, but at least it's not infected with the taint of modernism ...
Prudery-
That's a new word for me.
I learned some other new words from that too.
I'll remember them next time I make my confession.

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The Scrumpmeister
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# 5638

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quote:
Originally posted by Doublethink:
I always had the impression, mainly gained through the movies, that if you went to confession you did so once a week or you couldn't receive communion. Which shows the depth and scale of my ignorance I suppose.

That sounds about right to me. Some priests, if they don't know you, will ask. IME, if you haven't confessed, you will either have your confession heard then and there by that priest who will "pause" communion for you, or, if there is another priets present, you may be directed to one of them. This is what my bishop does. Also, I have seen this done at the Pokrov parish in Manchester.

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If Christ is not fully human, humankind is not fully saved. - St John of Saint-Denis

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Mama Thomas
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Here's a wonderful Examination of Conscience to copy and save based on the Seven Deadly Sins:

quote:
PRIDE
Putting yourself as the centre and objective of your life in place of God, or putting God in some compartment of your life. It is the refusal to recognise your status as a creature, dependent on God for your existence, and placed by God in a specific relationship to the rest of creation.

Irreverence
Making a choice of not going to the worship of God every Sunday in his church, or choosing amusements that keep you up late on Saturday night, or not paying attention to the service. Not thinking other Holy Days or of additional opportunities for giving God honour are important. Failure to thank God or to express your thanks to him adequately. Disrespect for God or holy things by treating them, in thought, word or deed, in a disrespectful, scornful or over-familiar manner. Use of holy things for personal advantage, or the attempt to bribe or appease God by religious practices or promises.

Sentimentality
Being satisfied with emotional ‘high’, or participating in religious activities with the hope of emotional ecstasy or admiring beautiful ceremonies without striving to obey God’s will.

Presumption
Depending on yourself rather than on God, therefore neglecting of the means of grace---sacraments and prayer. Dispensing yourself from ordinary duties on the grounds that you imagine you are superior to other people. Being self-satisfied or conceited over your spiritual achievements. Refusal to avoid, when possible, occasions of temptation. Always preferring your own ideas, customs, schemes or techniques. Foolish optimism. Failure to recognise your job as a divine vocation, or to offer your work to God. Unwillingness to surrender to abide in Christ, to let him act in and through you. Failure to offer God regularly in intercession the persons or causes that you should support.

Distrust
Refusing to recognise God’s wisdom, providence and love. Worry, anxiety, misgivings, scrupulosity, or perfectionism. Attempts to discern or control the future by magic, using spirits or ‘angels’, astrology, fortunetelling or the like. Magic or superstition. Taking offence at being slighted by others. Expecting that others will dislike, reject, or mistreat you; over-readiness so to interpret their attitude, or quickness to take offence. Unfounded suspicions. Being timid about accepting responsibility, or cowardly in the face of difficulty or suffering. Surrender to feelings of depression, gloom, pessimism, discouragement, self-pity, or fear of death, instead of fighting to be brave, cheerful and hopeful.

Disobedience
Rejecting God’s known will in favour of your own interests or pleasures. Disobeying the legitimate laws, regulations, rules or authority of the church, state, parents, teachers, etc.; or slow and reluctant obedience. Failure when in authority to fulfil responsibilities or consider the best interests of those under you. Refusal to learn God’s nature or will as revealed in scripture, expounded in instructions or expert advice, or discernible through prayer, meditation or the reading of religious books. Being absorbed in your own affairs, leaving little time, energy or interest for the things of God. Violation of confidence. Breaking of legitimate promises or contracts. Irresponsibility. Betrayal of another’s trust. Unnecessary disappointment of another, or the causing of shame or anxiety to those in your sphere of life.

Impenitence
Refusing to search out and face up to your sins, or to confess them or admit them before God. Disregard of your sins or pretending that you are better than you are. Self-justification or discounting your sins as insignificant, natural or inevitable. Self-righteous comparison of yourself with others. Refusal to accept just punishment or to make due reparation or compensation when possible. Deceit or lying to escape the consequences of your sins, or allowing another to take the blame for your faults. Overcompensation or attempts at self-reform or self-vengeance, to avoid surrender to God in humble penitence. Shame (hurt pride), sorrow for yourself because your sins make you less respectable than you like to think you are, or because you fear punishment or injury to your reputation, rather than sorrow for what sin is in the eyes of God. Refusal to admit that you were in the wrong or to apologise. Refusal to accept forgiveness from God or others. Doubt that God can forgive your sins, or being too proud to use the means of getting assurance of his forgiveness when you need it, that is making sacramental confession before a priest. Failure to examine one’s conscience regularly. Unwillingness to forgive yourself.

Vanity
Taking credit for yourself rather than for God your talents, abilities, insights, accomplishments, good works. Refusal to admit indebtedness to and dependence on others, or not adequately expressing thanks for their help. Hypocrisy. Pretending to have virtues you do not possess. False humility. Harsh judgment on others for faults you excuse in yourselves. Boasting, exaggeration, drawing attention to yourself by talking too much, by claiming ability, wisdom, experience, or influence you do not have, or by eccentric or ostentatious behaviour. Undue concern over, or expenditure of time, money, or energy on looks, dress, surroundings, etc., in order to impress others; or deliberate slovenliness for the same purpose. Seeking, desiring and believing flattery or compliments.

Arrogance
Insisting that others conform to your wishes, recognise your leadership, accept your own estimate of your worth as superior or inferior. Being overbearing, argumentative, opinionated, or obstinate.

Snobbery
Pride over race, family, origins, position, class, personality, education, skill, achievements or possessions.

ANGER
Open rebellion against God or your fellow creatures. Its purpose and desire is to eliminate any obstacle to your self-seeking, to get even against any threat to your security, to avenge insult or injury to your person.

Resentment
Refusal to discern, accept or fulfil God’s vocation. Not being satisfied with the talents, abilities, or opportunities God has given you. Unwillingness to face up to difficulties or sacrifices. Unjustified rebellion or complaint at the circumstances of your life. Escape from reality or the attempt to force your will upon it. Transferring to God, to your parents, to society, or to other individuals of the blame for your problems and lack of adjustment; hatred of God, and antisocial behaviour. Feeling and showing contempt for anyone for whom Christ die.. Being annoyed at the awkwardness of life and work; profanity, grumbling and murmuring.

Pugnacity
Attack upon another in anger. Murder in deed or desire. Combativeness or nursing of grudges. Injury to another by striking, cursing or insulting him; or by damaging his reputation or property. Quarrelsomeness.

Retaliation
Vengeance for wrongs real or imagined, or the plotting or harbouring revenge. Harsh or excessive punishment. Hostility, being petulant, or rashly judging a situation. Refusal to forgive, or to offer or accept reconciliation. Unwillingness to love, to do good to, or to pray for enemies. Boycotting or ostracizing another for selfish reasons. Spoiling others. Pleasure by uncooperativeness or disdain, because you have not got your way, or because you feel out of sorts or superior.

ENVY
Being dissatisfied with your place in God’s order of creation, manifested in resenting his gifts and vocations to others.

Jealousy
Offence at the talents, success or good fortune of others. Selfish or unnecessary rivalry or competition. Pleasure at others difficulties or distress. Belittling others.

Malice
Ill-will, false accusations, slander, backbiting. Reading false motives into others behaviour. Starting, collecting or repeating gossip. Arousing, fostering or organising antagonism against others. Unnecessary criticism, even when true. Deliberately annoying others, teasing or bullying.

Contempt
Scorn of another’s virtue, ability, shortcomings, or failings. Prejudice against those you consider inferior, or who consider us inferior, or who seem to threaten your security or position. Ridicule of persons, institutions or ideals.

COVETOUSNESS
The refusal to respect the integrity of other creatures, expressed in the inordinate accumulation of material things; in the use of other persons for your personal advantage; or in the quest for status, power or security at their expense.

Inordinate Ambition
Seeking status, power, influence, reputation, or possessions at the expense of the moral law, of other obligations, or of the rights of others. Ruthless or unfair competition. Putting self or family first. Conformity to standards you recognise as wrong or inadequate in order to get ahead. Intrigue or conspiracy for self-advancement.

Domination
Seeking to use or possess others. Over-protection of children; refusal to correct or punish lest you lose their affection; insistence that they conform to your ideal for them contrary to their own vocation. Imposing your will on others by force, guile, whining, or refusal to cooperate. Over-readiness to advise or command; abuse of authority. Patronising, pauperising, putting others under a debt of gratitude, or considering yourself ill-used when others. Selling your affection or compliance. Respect of persons, favouritism, partiality, flattery, fawning, or bribery to win support or affection. Refusing to uphold the truth to fulfil duties, to perform good acts, or to defend those wrongfully attacked, because you fear criticism or ridicule, or because you seek to gain the favour or approval of others. Leading, tempting or encouraging another to sin.

Avarice
Inordinate pursuit of wealth or material things. Theft, dishonesty, misrepresentation, or sharing in stolen goods. Cheating in business, taxes, school or games. Making worldly success the goal of your life or the standard for judging others.

Prodigality
Waste of natural resources or personal possessions. Extravagance or living beyond your income, to impress others or to maintain status. Failure to pay debts. Gambling more than you can afford to lose, or to win unearned profits. Unnecessary borrowing or carelessness with others. money. Spending on yourself of what is needed for the welfare of others.

Pretending to be poorer than you are
Undue protection of wealth or security. Selfish insistence on vested interests or on claimed rights. Refusal to support or help those who have a claim on us. Sponging on others. Stinginess. Failure to give due proportion of your income to Church and charity, or of your time and energy to good works. Failure to pay pledges promised to the Church or charities, when able to do so.

GLUTTONY
The overindulgence of natural appetites for food and drink, and by extension the excessive quest for pleasure or comfort.

Intemperance
Overindulgence in food, drink, smoking, or other physical pleasures. Fastidiousness, fussiness, demanding excessively high standards, or dilettantism. Condemnation of some material things or pleasures as evil in themselves, attempting to prohibit their use rather than their abuse.

Lack of Discipline
Negligence in keeping the days of fasting or abstinence, or failure to use other needed means of self-discipline. Neglect of bodily health. Not getting sufficient rest, recreation, exercise or wholesome nourishment. Failure to use or to cooperate with available medical care when ill. Use of sickness as a means of escape from responsibilities.

LUST
The misuse of sex for personal gratification, debasing it from the holy purpose for which God has given it to us.

Unchastity
Violation of the Church’s marriage laws. Lack of consideration for one’s partner in the use of the marital relationship. Refusal to fulfil the purpose of Holy Matrimony in the bringing forth and giving adequate care to children, or to take your full share in the responsibilities or work involved. Unfaithfulness to one’s spouse. Sexual indulgence outside matrimony, in thought or act, alone or with others.

Immodesty
Stimulation of sexual desire in others by word, dress,
or actions; or in one’s self by reading, pictures, or fantasies. Collecting or recounting dirty stories.

Prudery
Fear of sex or condemnation of it as evil in itself. Refusal to seek adequate sexual instruction or the attempt to prevent others from obtaining it. Stimulation of excessive and harmful curiosity by undue secrecy. Repression of sex.

Cruelty
Deliberate infliction of pain, mental or physical. Tormenting of animals.

SLOTH
The refusal to respond to your opportunities for growth, service or sacrifice.

Laziness
Indolence in performing spiritual, mental or physical duties, or neglect of family, business or social obligations or courtesies. Procrastination of disliked tasks. Busyness or triviality to avoid more important commitments. Devotion of excessive time to rest, recreation, amusement, television, or the like. Waste of employer’s time, or shoddy or inadequate work.

Indifference
Unconcern over injustice to others, especially that caused by currently accepted social standards; or unmindfulness of the suffering of the world. Failure to become adequately informed on both sides of contemporary issues or on the Christian principles involved. Neglect of duties to state or community. Failure to provide adequately for, or to treat justly those in your employ. Ignoring of needy, lonely or unpopular persons in your own or the parish family, or in the neighbourhood; or unwillingness to minister to them. Insufficient attention to the religious and other needs of your family. Failure to fulfil your obligation of Christian missionary witness, or to take a full and informed part to make the church’s unity and holiness a manifest reality on earth.



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All hearts are open, all desires known

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chive

Ship's nude
# 208

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Thank you all for your advice. I made my first confession today. I had the choice of doing it face to face in the priest's study or kneeling next to him as he sat in a chair in the church. I didn't know which to choose so he decided to do it in the church so that his study didn't have any associations with it.

It was very scary and somewhat stressful but I'm so very glad that I've done it.

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'Edward was the kind of man who thought there was no such thing as a lesbian, just a woman who hadn't done one-to-one Bible study with him.' Catherine Fox, Love to the Lost

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ChaliceGirl
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Nice to hear, chive. I am glad you did it. I felt the same way- scared, but glad afterwards.

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leo
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# 1458

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quote:
Originally posted by chive:
Thank you all for your advice. I made my first confession today. I had the choice of doing it face to face in the priest's study or kneeling next to him as he sat in a chair in the church. I didn't know which to choose so he decided to do it in the church so that his study didn't have any associations with it.

It was very scary and somewhat stressful but I'm so very glad that I've done it.

Blessings!

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My Jewish-positive lectionary blog is at http://recognisingjewishrootsinthelectionary.wordpress.com/
My reviews at http://layreadersbookreviews.wordpress.com

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Doublethink.
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# 1984

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Congratulations chive, I am so glad you have found a religious context in which you feel mroe at home.

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All political thinking for years past has been vitiated in the same way. People can foresee the future only when it coincides with their own wishes, and the most grossly obvious facts can be ignored when they are unwelcome. George Orwell

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Ahleal V
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I went to confession for the second time in my life earlier this week - Anglo-Catholic style kneeling before the Reserved Sacrament.

Two things that have partiucuarly remained in my mind since then

1) How different it is to confessing at Mass - during then it all seems so rushed, and even pouring out my soul as I kneel at the rail seems more like a spiritual babble. This was slow and measured - and it all hits home as you get to the point where you actually have to list your sins. I froze for a moment.

2) The liturgy - it's still rather unfamiliar to me, but certain parts of it seemed to resonante as I heard them and have stayed with me since.

The Introit

The Lord be in thy heart and upon thy lips, that so thou mayest worthily confess all thy sins; In the Name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost. Amen.


And the Dismissal

May the Passion of Our Lord Jesus Christ, the merits of the Blessed Virgin Mary and of all the Saints, whatever good thou shalt have done or evil endured, be for thee unto the remission of thy sins, the increase of grace, and the reward of everlasting life. Amen. Go in peace, and pray for me, a sinner.

The words seem to be still echoing around my mind even now.

x

AV

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ChaliceGirl
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Nice thoughts, AV.

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The Episcopal Church Welcomed Me.

"Welcome home." ++Katharine Jefferts Schori to me on 29Mar2009.
My KJS fansite & chicksinpointyhats

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ecumaniac

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# 376

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quote:
Originally posted by chive:
Thank you all for your advice. I made my first confession today.

[Axe murder]

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it's a secret club for people with a knitting addiction, hiding under the cloak of BDSM - Catrine

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ChaliceGirl
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Thought I'd bump this up because it's Lent and therefore... "Confession Season."

I do "confess" that I still have not done a private confession this Lent. (Yes, I know I still have time.)
Should I be feeling guilty?

--------------------
The Episcopal Church Welcomed Me.

"Welcome home." ++Katharine Jefferts Schori to me on 29Mar2009.
My KJS fansite & chicksinpointyhats

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Oblatus
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quote:
Originally posted by ChaliceGirl:
I do "confess" that I still have not done a private confession this Lent. (Yes, I know I still have time.) Should I be feeling guilty?

You and I both. Don't feel guilty; just add it to your list. I haven't made a sacramental Confession in more than 20 years and again hope to do so this Lent.
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