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Source: (consider it) Thread: Purgatory: The political junkie POTUS prediction thread
Choirboy
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quote:
Originally posted by Sioni Sais:
Is it OK for this Brit to say that he's glad Huckabee won't be running for President?

Sure - it's not like folks in the U.S. don't disparage foreign political leaders or candidates. When they've heard of them, that is.

quote:
While he may go for VP, is he too vain for that?
No, I don't think he is. And I think it might be pretty smart for McCain to pick him. Shows a little conservative street cred; but Huckabee is offbeat enough in the conservative world that he and McCain could probably find some common points to work on.

quote:
As far as McCain (or any other candidate is concerned) so long as they are basically honest, intelligent, and aren't too hard-working or have a sense of destiny then I'll be content.

GWB had one of these qualities, anyway.
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Mere Nick
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quote:
Originally posted by Choirboy:
On May 6, North Carolina holds an open primary; they have 134 delegates.

It is open to the party members and the non-affiliated. Registered dems can't vote in the rep primary, and vice versa. Non-affiliateds pick one when we show up. I'll show up and vote for the dem who is second in delegates because I want the dem convention to look like something Vince McMahon would stage.

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PataLeBon
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As far as why Texas has a primary, there were more races than just the Presidental contest. (representatives, constables, judges, tax assesor, for a few)

So either the caucus takes forever in deciding all of those canidates, or one has a primary.

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That's between you and your god. Oh, wait a minute. You are your god. That's a problem. - Jack O'Neill (Stargate SG1)

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ken
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quote:
Originally posted by Gort:
Weird, huh?

Weird? Sounds like democracy in action to me! You should try being an elected trade union official [Smile]

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Ken

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SeraphimSarov
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quote:
Originally posted by Lady Alicia of Scouseland:
Brit question here: Why don't they have a uniform system? why not all Primaries or all Caucuses?

Primaries seem more democratic to me.

Also, does anyone think there will be a revote in Florida and Michigan now? If so will it have much of an effect on the outcome?

probably not a revote but one idea being floated is to divide the delegates according to the Popular vote of the Candidates nationally.

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"For those who like that sort of thing, that is the sort of thing they like"

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Comper's Child
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McCain + Huckabee vs Clinton will leave me unable to vote for either party.
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SeraphimSarov
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quote:
Originally posted by Golden Key:
quote:
Originally posted by Living in Gin:
Some bloggers are citing (unnamed, of course) high-level sources in the Clinton campaign and among Democratic big-wigs that Clinton will be out of the race by the end of the week. The question becomes whether she bows out of the race gracefully, or is pushed out by party elders who see the writing on the wall and are desperate to avoid a bloody fight in Denver. I hope they're right.

She said tonight that she's not quitting. [Smile] I'm guessing that the Texas win was partly due to supporters of former Gov. Ann Richards.

As to a fight in Denver...when I was growing up, the conventions were televised, and could get pretty intense and wild. People really didn't know what a state was going to declare until the delegates announced it. Nothing was a foregone conclusion.

It should be pretty wild! [Smile]

There has not been a convention that went to a second Presidential Nominating ballot since the 1920's.
I don't want to see that happening with McCain laughing from the sidelines frankly.

[ 05. March 2008, 13:42: Message edited by: SeraphimSarov ]

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"For those who like that sort of thing, that is the sort of thing they like"

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SeraphimSarov
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quote:
Originally posted by Comper's Child:
McCain + Huckabee vs Clinton will leave me unable to vote for either party.

I would hold my nose and vote for Clinton but with full knowledge that the Titanic would be sinking soon.

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"For those who like that sort of thing, that is the sort of thing they like"

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Laura
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I'm sorry to sound like a hideous newbie, but I haven't the time to read this whole thread, so I'm just going to jump right in and ask for indulgence if this has already been said. As a political junkie, I've been abstaining for a while from picking a candidate or engaging in debate on the subject, but finally threw my hat into Obama's ring a few weeks ago. I am appalled at the way Hilary is running her campaign. The last straw was her saying, when asked about Obama's faith, (after a little pause) "I take his word that he's a Christian...." Right! But you attended prayer meetings with him, so you KNOW it, jerk. She's pandering to the shocking number of people who seem to think Obama is in fact a Muslim. Now, anyone who thinks so is an idiot (if you think having a Mormon in the race was big news, imagine what kind of news a Muslim would be). Also, after they both agreed not to claim anything at all based on the Michigan and Florida outcomes, she claimed them as victories, and then basically didn't say anything like "way to go" to her opponent when she lost 11 straight primaries. She's a poor sport and a schemer. Plain and simple.

And anyone who thinks a woman has to vote for Hillary, as I've heard more than once from people I know who ought to know better, is being sexist.

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Love is the only sane and satisfactory answer to the problem of human existence. - Erich Fromm

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Laura
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Oh, and I don't care what anyone says, she's the weaker candidate in the general election. It would be just like the sad-case drunken always-coming-back-but falling-off-the-wagon boyfriend the Democratic Party has been to me to snatch defeat from the jaws of victory yet again, but going with her is the way to do it if that's what we want.

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Love is the only sane and satisfactory answer to the problem of human existence. - Erich Fromm

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SeraphimSarov
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quote:
Originally posted by Laura:
Oh, and I don't care what anyone says, she's the weaker candidate in the general election. It would be just like the sad-case drunken always-coming-back-but falling-off-the-wagon boyfriend the Democratic Party has been to me to snatch defeat from the jaws of victory yet again, but going with her is the way to do it if that's what we want.

Preach it!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! [Overused]

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"For those who like that sort of thing, that is the sort of thing they like"

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mousethief

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quote:
Originally posted by PataLeBon:
As far as why Texas has a primary, there were more races than just the Presidental contest. (representatives, constables, judges, tax assesor, for a few)

So either the caucus takes forever in deciding all of those canidates, or one has a primary.

I don't see why. Have caucuses to determine the presidential candidate, and an election to determine everything else. It's not written in stone that you can't have both. Washington does.

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mousethief

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Sorry to double-post. I see in yahoo news that Bush is set to endorse McCain this afternoon, now that McCain has sewn up the nomination. By golly, endorsing the Republican in the general election. Who'd 'a' thunk?

What a coward. Bush, not McCain.

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Choirboy
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McCain is obviously brave (or something) to accept Bush's endorsement.
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Golden Key
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quote:
Originally posted by Laura:
I am appalled at the way Hilary is running her campaign. The last straw was her saying, when asked about Obama's faith, (after a little pause) "I take his word that he's a Christian...." Right! But you attended prayer meetings with him, so you KNOW it, jerk. She's pandering to the shocking number of people who seem to think Obama is in fact a Muslim.

She can be very negative; but I saw a clip of when she said this, and I thought that she really meant that she really takes his word and believes him. FWIW.

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--"Oh, Peace Train, save this country!" (Yusuf/Cat Stevens, "Peace Train")

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Golden Key
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quote:
Originally posted by Sioni Sais:
As far as McCain (or any other candidate is concerned) so long as they are basically honest, intelligent, and aren't too hard-working or have a sense of destiny then I'll be content.

Sense of destiny??? After the current office-holder??? No, thank you very much. Other than realizing that they're breaking glass ceilings, they just need to dig in and do the work.

[Paranoid] [Votive]

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Blessed Gator, pray for us!
--"Oh bat bladders, do you have to bring common sense into this?" (Dragon, "Jane & the Dragon")
--"Oh, Peace Train, save this country!" (Yusuf/Cat Stevens, "Peace Train")

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Choirboy
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I think he meant " not (too hard working or having a sense of destiny)", i.e. you are in agreement.
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Laura
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quote:
Originally posted by Choirboy:
McCain is obviously brave (or something) to accept Bush's endorsement.

It's very "courageous", in the sense that Sir Humphrey would have meant when using it to the P.M., i.e. "deadly to your political future."

("And a very courageous decision that would be, Prime Minister")

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Love is the only sane and satisfactory answer to the problem of human existence. - Erich Fromm

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Laura
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quote:
Originally posted by SeraphimSarov:
quote:
Originally posted by Laura:
Oh, and I don't care what anyone says, she's the weaker candidate in the general election. It would be just like the sad-case drunken always-coming-back-but falling-off-the-wagon boyfriend the Democratic Party has been to me to snatch defeat from the jaws of victory yet again, but going with her is the way to do it if that's what we want.

Preach it!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! [Overused]
And if that no-good-nik disappoints me again (meaning the aforementioned sad-case drunken always-coming-back-but falling-off-the-wagon boyfriend that is the Democratic Party) I won't have him back, absolutely not, under any circumstances. And this time I mean it.
[Big Grin]

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Love is the only sane and satisfactory answer to the problem of human existence. - Erich Fromm

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ken
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quote:
Originally posted by Laura:
It's very "courageous", in the sense that Sir Humphrey would have meant

You might think that. I couldn't possibly comment...

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Ken

L’amor che move il sole e l’altre stelle.

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tclune
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quote:
Originally posted by Golden Key:
quote:
Originally posted by Laura:
I am appalled at the way Hilary is running her campaign. The last straw was her saying, when asked about Obama's faith, (after a little pause) "I take his word that he's a Christian...." Right! But you attended prayer meetings with him, so you KNOW it, jerk. She's pandering to the shocking number of people who seem to think Obama is in fact a Muslim.

She can be very negative; but I saw a clip of when she said this, and I thought that she really meant that she really takes his word and believes him. FWIW.
That must have been an extraordinary clip. Did she also honestly take his word that he had stopped beating his wife?

--Tom Clune

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Laura
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That's exactly what I mean, tclune -- there's no earthly reason for her to say that except to cast doubt on the matter. She doesn't have to "take his word" -- he isn't and she knows it.

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Love is the only sane and satisfactory answer to the problem of human existence. - Erich Fromm

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Littlelady
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In this article on the BBC site there is a quote from someone in Texas who claims that Clinton won the 'crossover' vote: those who voted against McCain rather than for Clinton because they believed McCain would have a better chance of beating Clinton than of beating Obama. Do people here agree that this kind of tactical voting is happening?

On Clinton generally, the impression I've gained of her campaign from watching it over this side of the Pond is that she has grown progressively negative and while Obama has responded - I guess he has to - he's been pretty gracious by comparison. I was pretty neutral when this all started out but I've grown to dislike Clinton's image, in part because of her tactics - I don't like negative campaigning - but also in part because of her style. I'm not sure exactly how much difference there is on policy between the two candidates as I haven't analysed the differences, but in terms of approach, attitude and relating to the world at large, Obama strikes me as winning hands down.

I think Clinton's play on Obama's Muslim heritage is somewhat pathetic, though I can imagine it pandering to the fears/racism of the more fickle among the electorate. That he does have such a background could be a double-edged sword for Obama should he make the nomination, especially if he's ultimately elected. On the one hand he has an arsenal of understanding that he could dip into to smooth the waters abroad; on the other hand he could become a target by the nutters among those same people for 'abandoning' the faith of his birth. Of course that's aside from the differing views among the American people.

Given Obama's skillful oratory and his ability to interact with people (or so it seems), he could be a really positive ambassador for the US abroad and not only in Muslim countries. However, I don't know just how crucial that role is to Americans when they turn up to vote?

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tclune
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quote:
Originally posted by Littlelady:
In this article on the BBC site there is a quote from someone in Texas who claims that Clinton won the 'crossover' vote: those who voted against McCain rather than for Clinton because they believed McCain would have a better chance of beating Clinton than of beating Obama. Do people here agree that this kind of tactical voting is happening?

I'm sure that happens to some degree, but my guess is that it is not very common. I know a lot of people who joke about it, but I've never met anyone who actually acknowledged doing it -- not that there's anything wrong with it... It is relatively common in primaries for people to decide to vote for the least objectionable person who they believe can be elected in the main election, even if that person is not their first choice. But that's about as much "strategic" voting as I routinely encounter.

In the vast majority of elections, the clear majority of elegible voters don't vote. So our real problem is not with people who vote strategically, but those who don't vote at all.

--Tom Clune

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RuthW

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quote:
Originally posted by tclune:
quote:
Originally posted by Golden Key:
quote:
Originally posted by Laura:
I am appalled at the way Hilary is running her campaign. The last straw was her saying, when asked about Obama's faith, (after a little pause) "I take his word that he's a Christian...." Right! But you attended prayer meetings with him, so you KNOW it, jerk. She's pandering to the shocking number of people who seem to think Obama is in fact a Muslim.

She can be very negative; but I saw a clip of when she said this, and I thought that she really meant that she really takes his word and believes him. FWIW.
That must have been an extraordinary clip. Did she also honestly take his word that he had stopped beating his wife?

--Tom Clune

See it for yourself here.
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Choirboy
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quote:
Originally posted by Littlelady:
In this article on the BBC site there is a quote from someone in Texas who claims that Clinton won the 'crossover' vote: those who voted against McCain rather than for Clinton because they believed McCain would have a better chance of beating Clinton than of beating Obama. Do people here agree that this kind of tactical voting is happening?

That doesn't appear to be the case in Texas. Clinton won self-identified Democrats by a +9 margin according to exit polls. If she also won a significant cross-over vote, then I would have expected her overall margin of victory to be higher than it is.

It seems from the exit polls that Clinton did very well among women and Hispanics, and so squeaks by in Texas. There is no 'change in momentum' here- it is simply that we elect by state and this state has more favorable demographics for Clinton than Obama. This will turn again when we move to Mississippi and North Carolina where African Americans make up a larger proportion of the electorate, favoring Obama. Clinton is favored in Pennsylvania for the same reasons she was favored in Ohio; she does better with older white working class voters than Obama, and these are more prevalent in Pennsylvania.

It seems pretty likely that no candidate will be able to deliver even a symbolic 'knock-out' punch without the super delegates weighing in in great numbers. This one is probably going to convention, or near enough.

Exit poll news here:
How Clinton won TX and Ohio - RealClearPolitics.com

Exit polls: Why Clinton won Texas - The Politico.com

[ 05. March 2008, 17:25: Message edited by: Choirboy ]

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ken
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quote:
Originally posted by SeraphimSarov:
There has not been a convention that went to a second Presidential Nominating ballot since the 1920's.
I don't want to see that happening with McCain laughing from the sidelines frankly.

No publicity is bad publicity. While the issue is open you are on TV and getting attention. Clinton and Obama remain news, McCain ceases to be news tomorrow and will not become news again until October, unless he has a heart attack or someone discovers where he buried the bodies.

Let it go to the Convention. Let it go to the third day of the Convention. Let delegates vote against their ticket, let there be write-in candidates, the surprise emergence and equally dramatic disappearance of a plausible third contender, let their be betrayals, conspiracies, sudden reversals, dodgy deals, and carved votes. Let the full armamenariutum of the smoke-filled-room be deployed. Let the pork barrels flow and let the tubs be thumped. Let fat men in suits sit up late at night in dingy hotels arguing with angry farmers and icy trade-union leaders about trading-off federal barbed-wire subsidy clawbacks for ranchers above the treeline in Montana against the appointment of Fijian-American senior nurse-practicioners by the Veterans Administration.

Let it be decided on the thirteenth ballot in the samll hours of the morning after midnight of the day the Convention was due to be closed. Let the acceptance speeches go out live on breakfast TV and drive-time radio, delivered in a hoarse voice by a candidate who has had more double bourbons than hours of sleep.

It'll be on TV. More people will vote Democrat.

[ 05. March 2008, 17:48: Message edited by: ken ]

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Ken

L’amor che move il sole e l’altre stelle.

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Choirboy
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Sorry - just noticed the answer in the second link I posted. About 65% of the primary voters in TX were self-identified Democrats. But Obama won a majority of the 35% that were not self-identified Democrats - Clinton just did that much better among the 65%.

If there is tactical voting going on, it seems to be in pretty small numbers, or it is supporting Obama rather than Clinton.

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Choirboy
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Ken:

[Overused] [Overused] [Overused] [Overused] [Overused]

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Littlelady
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quote:
Originally posted by tclune:
In the vast majority of elections, the clear majority of elegible voters don't vote. So our real problem is not with people who vote strategically, but those who don't vote at all.

That seems to be a problem in many countries. It certainly is in my own. One of the points made during this campaign is that apparently there has been a significant rise in voter turnout among Democrats than has been seen since, well, who knows when. If that really is the case then I suppose it shows that when there is a real fight between viable candidates who are obviously offering a choice of some kind then politics can actually be engaging.

quote:
Originally posted by Choirboy:
It seems from the exit polls that Clinton did very well among women and Hispanics, and so squeaks by in Texas.

Was her win there considered a 'squeak'? It looked fairly convincing to my English eyes. In terms of votes, I mean, rather than impact on the overall delegate count.

While I was listening to the radio yesterday morning, two interviews were played with people in Texas. Both were Hispanic and both said pretty much the same thing: they believed that Obama would favour black people if he was nominated while they remembered Bill Clinton as doing 'lots for minorities' (their words) and considered that Hilary was of the same mind on the subject. I think it's a bit of a shame that simply because Obama happens to be black that some think he will favour black people. And is it wise to base Hilary's approach on Bill's? Is that electing Hilary or re-electing Bill?

quote:
There is no 'change in momentum' here- it is simply that we elect by state and this state has more favorable demographics for Clinton than Obama.
This is the message that's being relayed over here. Even so, after so many consecutive wins, it must feel a little bit strange for the Obama camp to be facing a few defeats. Mind you, they won in Vermont. What kind of demographic is Vermont? I always think of white people huddled in very warm clothes when I think of Vermont ...

quote:
Originally posted by ken:
Let it go to the Convention. Let it go to the third day of the Convention. Let delegates vote against their ticket, let there be write-in candidates, the surprise emergence and equally dramatic disappearance of a plausible third contender, let their be betrayals, conspiracies, sudden reversals, dodgy deals, and carved votes. Let the full armamenariutum of the smoke-filled-room be deployed. Let the pork barrels flow and let the tubs be thumped. Let fat men in suits sit up late at night in dingy hotels arguing with angry farmers and icy trade-union leaders about trading-off federal barbed-wire subsidy clawbacks for ranchers above the treeline in Montana against the appointment of Fijian-American senior nurse-practicioners by the Veterans Administration.

Eh-up ken! [Overused]

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'When ideas fail, words come in very handy' ~ Goethe

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TheEzrahite17
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quote:
Originally posted by ken:
quote:
Originally posted by SeraphimSarov:
There has not been a convention that went to a second Presidential Nominating ballot since the 1920's.
I don't want to see that happening with McCain laughing from the sidelines frankly.

No publicity is bad publicity. While the issue is open you are on TV and getting attention. Clinton and Obama remain news, McCain ceases to be news tomorrow and will not become news again until October, unless he has a heart attack or someone discovers where he buried the bodies.

Let it go to the Convention. Let it go to the third day of the Convention. Let delegates vote against their ticket, let there be write-in candidates, the surprise emergence and equally dramatic disappearance of a plausible third contender, let their be betrayals, conspiracies, sudden reversals, dodgy deals, and carved votes. Let the full armamenariutum of the smoke-filled-room be deployed. Let the pork barrels flow and let the tubs be thumped. Let fat men in suits sit up late at night in dingy hotels arguing with angry farmers and icy trade-union leaders about trading-off federal barbed-wire subsidy clawbacks for ranchers above the treeline in Montana against the appointment of Fijian-American senior nurse-practicioners by the Veterans Administration.

Let it be decided on the thirteenth ballot in the samll hours of the morning after midnight of the day the Convention was due to be closed. Let the acceptance speeches go out live on breakfast TV and drive-time radio, delivered in a hoarse voice by a candidate who has had more double bourbons than hours of sleep.

It'll be on TV. More people will vote Democrat.

Though an entertaining post, I really don't think any publicity is good publicity for the democrats. The longer it goes, the uglier it will get - so all we'll be hearing until October will be negative attacks on Clinton and Obama.

Meanwhile, McCain will do the grandfatherly statesman stick and continue to call everyone his friend.

Posts: 35 | From: MA, USA | Registered: Oct 2005  |  IP: Logged
Living in Gin

Liturgical Pyromaniac
# 2572

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Jeffrey Feldman in today's Huffington Post pretty much echoes Ken's comments: Close Contest Is Jackpot For Dems

Going too negative is the risk, though, and Clinton has demonstrated that she'll sink to any low. I suspect that, if she can't win the nomination cleanly, she'd even be willing to undermine the party and let McCain win this year if it means she gets a better shot at the White House in 2012.

I think Obama needs to be more proactive about going on the offense against Clinton, but without sacrificing the high road. It would be a very fine line to walk, but his advantage is that the Clintons have left nothing but scandals in their wake their entire careers. Obama has plenty of factual ammunition to throw at her without having to resort to Karl Rove-style smears and distortions.

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It's all fun and games until somebody gets burned at the stake.

Posts: 1893 | From: Cincinnati, USA | Registered: Apr 2002  |  IP: Logged
RuthW

liberal "peace first" hankie squeezer
# 13

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The other problem with having Clinton and Obama duke it out till the convention is that any attack leveled by the eventual loser on the eventual winner becomes fodder for the Republicans, and the longer it goes on, the more fodder there could be. Slate has a good article today on it being not that strange for the Democratic decision to be delayed till June, but I'm hoping it won't drag out all summer long. Let all the voters do their thing, then let the super-delegates line up behind that, and let's be done with it.
Posts: 24453 | From: La La Land | Registered: Apr 2001  |  IP: Logged
Og: Thread Killer
Ship's token CN Mennonite
# 3200

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The whole NAFTA gate thing bugs me.

Three big reasons:


Our right of Atilla Tories do this sort of thing all the time...leak to hurt people. It smells like the leak came from the PMO.

North America's manufacturing sectors are dying because of China, not NAFTA.

Does anybody seriously believe the US is going to get rid of any trade agreements? Clinton and Obama are both pandering to idiots here.

Taking this "I didn't mean it." thing from Obama's camp seriously is stupid.

Clinton is slowly losing any support around the rest of the world. Only Bush looks less principaled in comparison.

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I wish I was seeking justice loving mercy and walking humbly but... "Cease to lament for that thou canst not help, And study help for that which thou lament'st."

Posts: 5025 | From: Toronto | Registered: Aug 2002  |  IP: Logged
Choirboy
Shipmate
# 9659

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quote:
Originally posted by Littlelady:
quote:
Originally posted by Choirboy:
It seems from the exit polls that Clinton did very well among women and Hispanics, and so squeaks by in Texas.

Was her win there considered a 'squeak'? It looked fairly convincing to my English eyes. In terms of votes, I mean, rather than impact on the overall delegate count.
There were a little over 2.8 million Democratic primary ballots in Texas. The difference between the two principal candidates was just under 100,000 votes. So it is a lot of people, but a small percentage of the vote: 50.7% to 47.4%. The balance of the vote went to a collection of candidates who had dropped out of the race.

So it is barely a majority, although perhaps it is more convincing than I portrayed in the sense that it is a 3 point difference. Still, when polls had shown her ahead by 8-10 points some weeks ago, it does have the feeling of a disappointing result for Clinton, at least to me.

quote:
quote:
There is no 'change in momentum' here- it is simply that we elect by state and this state has more favorable demographics for Clinton than Obama.
This is the message that's being relayed over here. Even so, after so many consecutive wins, it must feel a little bit strange for the Obama camp to be facing a few defeats. Mind you, they won in Vermont. What kind of demographic is Vermont? I always think of white people huddled in very warm clothes when I think of Vermont ...
I suspect you are largely right about Vermont. But generally they are among the few true leftists in the U.S.

I imagine the Obama campaign saw exactly these results coming some weeks ago, except possibly in Texas where they really had a shot. Still, as the front runner in delegates, Obama just has to do well enough in the remaining states to stay in the lead - 52%-48% losses in a few states for the Obama campaign would still spell going in to convention with the most delegates.

What Clinton won was breathing space, not the lead. She also may finally have a plausible and practical strategy for beating Obama, at least in states that reflect her constituencies.

RealClearPolitics brought up another interesting point. Because Obama wins so many of his delegates from caucuses, which have fewer participants, it is entirely possible that going in to Convention, Clinton may not have as many delegates but may have the edge in the popular vote. Or, perhaps more realistically, she may have the edge in the popular vote including Michigan and/or Florida. Depending on how much of an edge she may have, if any, it may give reason to the super delegates to support Clinton over Obama. Having the super delegates support Clinton over Obama has been viewed as overturning the 'vote of the people' - but that is the vote through counting delegates, not the popular vote.

Obviously the argument would be more convincing if she led in the popular vote without resorting to either Michigan or Florida, which isn't likely to happen but remains numerically possible.

Posts: 2994 | From: Minneapolis, Minnesota USA | Registered: Jun 2005  |  IP: Logged
Joyeux

Ship's Lady of Laughter
# 3851

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quote:
Originally posted by Comper's Child:
McCain + Huckabee vs Clinton will leave me unable to vote for either party.

...leaving you with Ralph Nader. Yikes!

I've started assembling a list of people to use as write-in candidates. Feel free to borrow / copy as desired.
  • Mickey Mouse
  • Bugs Bunny
  • Howie Mandel (I don't know anything about his opinion on anything - I'd like to see a bald man unashamed to wear jewelry in the White House!)
  • Mr T
  • Miss Manners

Alternately, you could arrive to vote and turn in a blank ballot, indicating that you don't support, and won't choose, any of the options presented. I always wonder what would happen if no candidate got 50+% because people did that.

--------------------
Float?...Do science too

Posts: 4318 | From: over th... no, there! | Registered: Dec 2002  |  IP: Logged
Choirboy
Shipmate
# 9659

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In our system, it is 'first past the post'. There is no need to win >50% of ballots cast to win the electoral college delegates for a state.
Posts: 2994 | From: Minneapolis, Minnesota USA | Registered: Jun 2005  |  IP: Logged
Autenrieth Road

Shipmate
# 10509

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quote:
Originally posted by PataLeBon:
As far as why Texas has a primary, there were more races than just the Presidental contest. (representatives, constables, judges, tax assesor, for a few)

So either the caucus takes forever in deciding all of those canidates, or one has a primary.

Maine Dems have a caucus for the Presidential contest, and a primary later on (June I think) for all the rest.

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Truth

Posts: 9559 | From: starlight | Registered: Oct 2005  |  IP: Logged
Og: Thread Killer
Ship's token CN Mennonite
# 3200

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Howie Mandell is Canadian born. He is bald because he has some compulsive behaviour issues with staying clean.

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I wish I was seeking justice loving mercy and walking humbly but... "Cease to lament for that thou canst not help, And study help for that which thou lament'st."

Posts: 5025 | From: Toronto | Registered: Aug 2002  |  IP: Logged
iGeek

Number of the Feast
# 777

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quote:
Originally posted by Eutychus:
If I understand the system correctly, caucuses are open to declared party members only, but primaries are a free-for-all...

quote:
Originally posted by Gort:
Anyone can walk into a caucus, declared Democrat or not.

Not in my precinct.

When I did the early voting, I took my voter certification (it's a postcard I get in the mail from the county). I had to declare a party before I could vote. They then sent me to the approriate machine. My card was stamped with my party affiliation.

I had the card with me at my precinct caucus and it was examined (though not really necessary as the caucus secretary is a friend who knew me). Others were required to show their card or ID (TX DL or passport) before they were allowed to sign in. Those not entering a certificate number will have their entries compared against rolls provided by the county to ensure they voted the party they caucused in.

This TX two-step thing was pretty interesting (first time I'd participated as most of the last 25 years I was a resident of Okie-land). Going into it, I thought it was archaic. On reflection, it's a way of connecting party members at the neighborhood level and I quite enjoyed it. In fact, I got elected as an alternate delegate to the district caucus, the next roll-up.

Posts: 2150 | From: West End, Gulfopolis | Registered: Aug 2002  |  IP: Logged
tclune
Shipmate
# 7959

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quote:
Originally posted by Joyeux:
quote:
Originally posted by Comper's Child:
McCain + Huckabee vs Clinton will leave me unable to vote for either party.

...leaving you with Ralph Nader. Yikes!

I've started assembling a list of people to use as write-in candidates. Feel free to borrow / copy as desired.
  • Mickey Mouse
  • Bugs Bunny
  • Howie Mandel (I don't know anything about his opinion on anything - I'd like to see a bald man unashamed to wear jewelry in the White House!)
  • Mr T
  • Miss Manners

I would be very careful doing this -- if Mickey Mouse wins, GW may claim that as a mandate for a third term...

--Tom Clune

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This space left blank intentionally.

Posts: 8013 | From: Western MA | Registered: Jul 2004  |  IP: Logged
iGeek

Number of the Feast
# 777

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quote:
Originally posted by PataLeBon:
As far as why Texas has a primary, there were more races than just the Presidental contest. (representatives, constables, judges, tax assesor, for a few)

So either the caucus takes forever in deciding all of those canidates, or one has a primary.

quote:
Originally posted by MouseThief:
I don't see why. Have caucuses to determine the presidential candidate, and an election to determine everything else. It's not written in stone that you can't have both.

Actually, Texas does. For this very reason. It's the point that Pata was making, I think.
Posts: 2150 | From: West End, Gulfopolis | Registered: Aug 2002  |  IP: Logged
Choirboy
Shipmate
# 9659

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quote:
Originally posted by tclune:
I would be very careful doing this -- if Mickey Mouse wins, GW may claim that as a mandate for a third term...

[Killing me]
Posts: 2994 | From: Minneapolis, Minnesota USA | Registered: Jun 2005  |  IP: Logged
Living in Gin

Liturgical Pyromaniac
# 2572

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Well, I'll certainly sleep better knowing CNN has confirmed that Barack Obama is not the anti-christ. Whew.

--------------------
It's all fun and games until somebody gets burned at the stake.

Posts: 1893 | From: Cincinnati, USA | Registered: Apr 2002  |  IP: Logged
saysay

Ship's Praying Mantis
# 6645

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quote:
Originally posted by Laura:
And anyone who thinks a woman has to vote for Hillary, as I've heard more than once from people I know who ought to know better, is being sexist.

Yes, I'm tired of being told that I'm betraying my gender if I don't support Hillary.* I'm even more tired of being told that many young women support Obama just because he's hot. Gah.

*I can only conclude that there really are a lot of people yearning for some sort of 2nd wave/ 3rd wave cage match. Which might entertain some people but probably wouldn't be particularly productive.

--------------------
"It's been a long day without you, my friend
I'll tell you all about it when I see you again"
"'Oh sweet baby purple Jesus' - that's a direct quote from a 9 year old - shoutout to purple Jesus."

Posts: 2943 | From: The Wire | Registered: May 2004  |  IP: Logged
Comper's Child
Shipmate
# 10580

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quote:
Originally posted by Joyeux:
quote:
Originally posted by Comper's Child:
McCain + Huckabee vs Clinton will leave me unable to vote for either party.

...leaving you with Ralph Nader. Yikes!

I've started assembling a list of people to use as write-in candidates. Feel free to borrow / copy as desired.
  • Mickey Mouse
  • Bugs Bunny
  • Howie Mandel (I don't know anything about his opinion on anything - I'd like to see a bald man unashamed to wear jewelry in the White House!)
  • Mr T
  • Miss Manners

Alternately, you could arrive to vote and turn in a blank ballot, indicating that you don't support, and won't choose, any of the options presented. I always wonder what would happen if no candidate got 50+% because people did that.

I'll go with Miss Manners, thank you.
Posts: 2509 | From: Penn's Greene Countrie Towne | Registered: Oct 2005  |  IP: Logged
RuthW

liberal "peace first" hankie squeezer
# 13

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quote:
Originally posted by saysay:
quote:
Originally posted by Laura:
And anyone who thinks a woman has to vote for Hillary, as I've heard more than once from people I know who ought to know better, is being sexist.

Yes, I'm tired of being told that I'm betraying my gender if I don't support Hillary.* I'm even more tired of being told that many young women support Obama just because he's hot. Gah.
I'm 45, and I think he's pretty hot, but it's not why I'm supporting him. Though I will admit that some of the reasons I have for being sorry that I didn't meet Barack Obama during the one year he and I were both at Occidental College are somewhat shallow. [Big Grin]

quote:
*I can only conclude that there really are a lot of people yearning for some sort of 2nd wave/ 3rd wave cage match. Which might entertain some people but probably wouldn't be particularly productive.
I think it's because certain older feminists, such as Gloria Steinem, are simply not as much in favor of freedom for women as they would like to think.
Posts: 24453 | From: La La Land | Registered: Apr 2001  |  IP: Logged
Living in Gin

Liturgical Pyromaniac
# 2572

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One bad thing about living in NYC is that, being among the bluest of the blue states, my vote in the general election is essentially worthless.

One nice thing about living in NYC, though, is that we have about a dozen political parties here:

The Democratic Party
The Republican Party
The Conservative Party
The Constitution Party
The Green Party
The Independence Party
The Independent Party (I hope their offices aren't in the same ZIP code as the Independence Party... And neither party is to be confused with "Independent / No Party Affiliation")
The Liberal Party
The Libertarian Party
The Natural Law Party
The Right to Life Party
The Save Jobs Party (Steve Jobs is in trouble?)
The School Choice Party
The Socialist Workers Party
The Working Families Party

(Compare to Chicago, where you're permitted to vote for the Democrat of your choice.)

Most of these parties each manage to have their own candidate on the presidential ballot. This is the way it should be, IMO, but that's another discussion.

If it comes down to McCain vs. Hillary, I'll probably vote for whoever the Greens have on the ballot.

--------------------
It's all fun and games until somebody gets burned at the stake.

Posts: 1893 | From: Cincinnati, USA | Registered: Apr 2002  |  IP: Logged
Amanda B. Reckondwythe

Dressed for Church
# 5521

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quote:
Originally posted by Comper's Child:
I'll go with Miss Manners, thank you.

Who once defined crime, I believe, as behavior sufficiently rude to as to merit laws against it.

--------------------
"I take prayer too seriously to use it as an excuse for avoiding work and responsibility." -- The Revd Martin Luther King Jr.

Posts: 10542 | From: The Great Southwest | Registered: Feb 2004  |  IP: Logged
Alfred E. Neuman

What? Me worry?
# 6855

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If that were the case, I'd be in for several consecutive life terms without the possibility of parole.
Posts: 12954 | Registered: May 2004  |  IP: Logged



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