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Source: (consider it)
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Thread: Purgatory: The political junkie POTUS prediction thread
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RuthW
liberal "peace first" hankie squeezer
# 13
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by SeraphimSarov:
with many more GOP open seats and vulnerable incumbants, this is a definite Democratic year for the Senate.
We can hope. Yesterday the Dems took a House seat in what's supposed to be a safe Republican district in Mississippi.
Posts: 24453 | From: La La Land | Registered: Apr 2001
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Eutychus
From the edge
# 3081
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by the_raptor:
You should be hoping for a third party to win if you want significant change.
What, you mean one fronted by Hillary?
quote:
if Clinton does not win the Democratic Party nomination, 29% of Democrats say she should run an Independent campaign for the White House.
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Let's remember that we are to build the Kingdom of God, not drive people away - pastor Frank Pomeroy
Posts: 17944 | From: 528491 | Registered: Jul 2002
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Mad Geo
Ship's navel gazer
# 2939
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by RuthW:
quote:
Originally posted by SeraphimSarov:
with many more GOP open seats and vulnerable incumbants, this is a definite Democratic year for the Senate.
We can hope. Yesterday the Dems took a House seat in what's supposed to be a safe Republican district in Mississippi.
Wow!
Edwards just endorsed Obie as well. This is shaping up to be a Waterloo election for the Repuglicans. Okay, maybe I hyperbole a little, but maybe not.
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Diax's Rake - "Never believe a thing simply because you want it to be true"
Posts: 11730 | From: People's Republic of SoCal | Registered: Jun 2002
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Living in Gin
Liturgical Pyromaniac
# 2572
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Posted
According to one of the comments on Daily Kos, Edwards still has about 19 convention delegates in his pocket. Assuming they all go for Obama (and they almost certainly will), that's approximately double Hillary's net gain of West Virginia delegates from yesterday. ![[Yipee]](graemlins/spin.gif)
By this time next week, Obama will have an absolute majority of the pledged delegates, and he'll very likely have a large margin of superdelegates. Whether Hillary wants to admit it or not, this nomination battle is over next week.
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It's all fun and games until somebody gets burned at the stake.
Posts: 1893 | From: Cincinnati, USA | Registered: Apr 2002
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jlg
What is this place?
Why am I here?
# 98
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Posted
Have any of you junkies come across meaningful speculation about whether the two New Hampshire House seats which miraculously went Democrat two years ago are expected to revert to Republican this fall?
Posts: 17391 | From: Just a Town, New Hampshire, USA | Registered: May 2001
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wombat
Shipmate
# 5180
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by IconiumBound:
Let's assume that Hillary drops out and Obama does not choose her as VP. Further that Obama wins the election. What does the Congress look like? I'll bet it still almost a fifty fifty split but perhaps with the Dems holding a slim majoity.
The democrats have gained 33 seats since the last election due to Republicans just from special elections for interim seat holders in the House. Far more Republican incumbents are under the gun in the Senate than Democrats and the public mood is heavily against the Republicans. I think it's going to be a chainsaw massacre in the House for the Republicans with the Democrats seizing a large majority.
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John Walter Biles
Historian in Training
Posts: 363 | From: Maryland | Registered: Nov 2003
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Scot
Deck hand
# 2095
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Posted
You all should be careful what you wish for. I plan to merrily vote anything-but-Republican for president, but the prospect of an all-Democrat combo pack might make me reconsider. I'm probably not alone.
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“Here, we are not afraid to follow truth wherever it may lead, nor tolerate any error so long as reason is left free to combat it.” - Thomas Jefferson
Posts: 9515 | From: Southern California | Registered: Jan 2002
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Choirboy
Shipmate
# 9659
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by jlg:
Have any of you junkies come across meaningful speculation about whether the two New Hampshire House seats which miraculously went Democrat two years ago are expected to revert to Republican this fall?
No. It's not necessarily a good surrogate, but this page tracks polling in the NH Senate race between Shaheen and Sununu. It's not the most current, nor without reversals of fortunes, but it suggests a trend toward a Democratic Senator this fall. This recent poll agrees. Of course, this is a different race.
Posts: 2994 | From: Minneapolis, Minnesota USA | Registered: Jun 2005
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agrgurich
Shipmate
# 5724
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by wombat:
quote:
Originally posted by IconiumBound:
Let's assume that Hillary drops out and Obama does not choose her as VP. Further that Obama wins the election. What does the Congress look like? I'll bet it still almost a fifty fifty split but perhaps with the Dems holding a slim majoity.
The democrats have gained 33 seats since the last election due to Republicans just from special elections for interim seat holders in the House. Far more Republican incumbents are under the gun in the Senate than Democrats and the public mood is heavily against the Republicans. I think it's going to be a chainsaw massacre in the House for the Republicans with the Democrats seizing a large majority.
There haven't been 33 special elections in the House in the last 2 years. Closer to 10 or 12 & the Democrats haven't won all of them.
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Life is a comedy to those who think & a tragedy to those who feel.-Horace Walpole
AJG
Posts: 4478 | From: Michigan's Copper Country | Registered: Apr 2004
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Alfred E. Neuman
What? Me worry?
# 6855
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Posted
Anyone with access to MSNBC cable and who would appreciate releasing by proxy their pent up frustration over Bush and the war in Iraq should not miss Keith Olbermann's "Special Comment" on Countdown tonight. The main subject drawing Olbermann's spittle-spraying ire is a Bush interview in which our illustrious President explains why he gave up golf in support of families grieving over war dead. Damn. I'd hate to have Keith angry at me. He looked like he was ready to come through the screen and rip someones head off.
US West coasters: repeated at 7:00PM and 11:00PM. Don't miss it.
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--Formerly: Gort--
Posts: 12954 | Registered: May 2004
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SeraphimSarov
Shipmate
# 4335
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Posted
Now that Mr John Edwards had endorsed, will the flood of superdelegates follow? and will Edward's working class base take his recommendation of Obama?
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"For those who like that sort of thing, that is the sort of thing they like"
Posts: 2247 | From: Sacramento, California | Registered: Apr 2003
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Alfred E. Neuman
What? Me worry?
# 6855
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Posted
No, the SDs will continue to dribble into the Obama camp until June 3 when the flood will begin and Obama will reach the 2025 required for nomination.
Edwards will definitely help with blue collar support - especially if he's chosen a VP running mate. Edwards received 7% of the West Virginia vote in spite of his withdrawal from the race. WV is overwhelmingly white and blue collar.
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--Formerly: Gort--
Posts: 12954 | Registered: May 2004
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comet
Snowball in Hell
# 10353
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Gort:
Anyone with access to MSNBC cable and who would appreciate releasing by proxy their pent up frustration over Bush and the war in Iraq should not miss Keith Olbermann's "Special Comment" on Countdown tonight.
part one and part two.
dang. they could use that video to teach med students what high blood pressure looks like.
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Evil Dragon Lady, Breaker of Men's Constitutions
"It's hard to be religious when certain people are never incinerated by bolts of lightning.” -Calvin
Posts: 17024 | From: halfway between Seduction and Peril | Registered: Sep 2005
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comet
Snowball in Hell
# 10353
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Posted
crap,sorry. I meant this part two.
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Evil Dragon Lady, Breaker of Men's Constitutions
"It's hard to be religious when certain people are never incinerated by bolts of lightning.” -Calvin
Posts: 17024 | From: halfway between Seduction and Peril | Registered: Sep 2005
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Swish
Shipmate
# 8566
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Posted
I know he has officially rejected the VP slot, but can anyone think of a better candidate for it? In one move, he reaffirms his claim to a message of change, while simultaneously broadening his appeal to the white, working class which he has supposedly lost. Can anyone think of away to get him on board?
Also, the BBC have been mentioning race as a factor more and more. Justin Webb's blog has a piece on it and its cropped up elsewhere. Is it because racism is becoming more of a factor? Or is it just that Obama is now the presumptive nominee? And will it play a role at all in November?
And in the grand scheme of things, has anyone else noticed the similarity between Edwards and Eric Baker (West Wing)? Both run for VP because of their wives health problems and both rejected the VP because of it.
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Sorry Ted. I was concentrating too hard on looking holy.
Posts: 114 | From: Sheffield | Registered: Sep 2004
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Astro
Shipmate
# 84
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Posted
What about the support Rod Parsley is giving John Cain article here
is this just a typical cif piece agiast the "religious right" or has it registered elsewhere?
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if you look around the world today – whether you're an atheist or a believer – and think that the greatest problem facing us is other people's theologies, you are yourself part of the problem. - Andrew Brown (The Guardian)
Posts: 2723 | From: Chiltern Hills | Registered: May 2001
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moron
Shipmate
# 206
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Choirboy:
As to third parties, for good or for ill, it's more practical to put your hopes in the parousia ahead of the Bull Moose. We had a third party governor here in Minnesota. He couldn't do jack without allied members of the legislature and was basically a non-entity for four years.
Unfortunately this is accurate in the short term but I can't see any other way to work toward ending the stranglehold the two parties currently have so I figure it's not a complete waste.
And remember Perot garnered 19% of the popular vote in 1992 so the 'right' candidate can have an impact (not that he was but he still got more than respectable traction).
On a positive note for many shipmates some suggest Barr's candidacy will strengthen the Democrat's chances by siphoning votes from McCain.
Posts: 4236 | From: Bentonville | Registered: May 2001
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tclune
Shipmate
# 7959
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by mjg:
quote:
Originally posted by Choirboy:
As to third parties, for good or for ill, it's more practical to put your hopes in the parousia ahead of the Bull Moose. We had a third party governor here in Minnesota. He couldn't do jack without allied members of the legislature and was basically a non-entity for four years.
Unfortunately this is accurate in the short term but I can't see any other way to work toward ending the stranglehold the two parties currently have so I figure it's not a complete waste.
...
On a positive note for many shipmates some suggest Barr's candidacy will strengthen the Democrat's chances by siphoning votes from McCain.
These two points seem to me to be at odds with each other. The second point seems to say that, when you vote for a third-party candidate, it increases the likelihood that the person you least like will get elected. How does that further the cause of reforming the two-party system? By hastening the revolution?
--Tom Clune
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This space left blank intentionally.
Posts: 8013 | From: Western MA | Registered: Jul 2004
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Bullfrog.
Prophetic Amphibian
# 11014
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Scot:
You all should be careful what you wish for. I plan to merrily vote anything-but-Republican for president, but the prospect of an all-Democrat combo pack might make me reconsider. I'm probably not alone.
You're not.
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Some say that man is the root of all evil
Others say God's a drunkard for pain
Me, I believe that the Garden of Eden
Was burned to make way for a train. --Josh Ritter, Harrisburg
Posts: 7522 | From: Chicago | Registered: Feb 2006
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moron
Shipmate
# 206
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by tclune:
These two points seem to me to be at odds with each other. The second point seems to say that, when you vote for a third-party candidate, it increases the likelihood that the person you least like will get elected. How does that further the cause of reforming the two-party system? By hastening the revolution?
Am I the only one who believes some revolutionary thinking is in order these days? How many Democrats voted to invade Iraq?
Anyway, for someone like me who remains skeptical any mainstream candidate is going to have a significant impact on 'Washington politics' my preference is to do what I can to weaken the current oligopoly.
And BTW: I recognize libertarianism is as flawed a concept as any other political philosophy and that it will never get much popular support. I just think leaning that way is necessary at this point in time to slow what is IMO an apparently inevitable creep toward inordinate 'state' control.
Posts: 4236 | From: Bentonville | Registered: May 2001
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Littlelady
Shipmate
# 9616
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Posted
I wonder what people think about this exchange of views? Was Bush taking a sideswipe at Obama or has Obama become a little too self-absorbed or overly sensitive (not that I'm blaming him for that)? If Bush was having a dig, would that harm Obama's chances or is there a weariness in the US yet over fighting talk?
[ 15. May 2008, 19:46: Message edited by: Littlelady ]
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'When ideas fail, words come in very handy' ~ Goethe
Posts: 3737 | From: home of the best Rugby League team in the universe | Registered: Jun 2005
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Bullfrog.
Prophetic Amphibian
# 11014
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Littlelady:
I wonder what people think about this exchange of views? Was Bush taking a sideswipe at Obama or has Obama become a little too self-absorbed or overly sensitive (not that I'm blaming him for that)? If Bush was having a dig, would that harm Obama's chances or is there a weariness in the US yet over fighting talk?
I think it'll mostly entrench people into the positions they're already in. It's hard to imagine someone who still supports the Iraq occupation supporting Obama right now, just as it's hard to imagine someone opposing the Iraq occupation supporting Bush. People who already defend Obama will continue to do so, and people who defend Bush (are there any left anymore?) will continue to do so as well.
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Some say that man is the root of all evil
Others say God's a drunkard for pain
Me, I believe that the Garden of Eden
Was burned to make way for a train. --Josh Ritter, Harrisburg
Posts: 7522 | From: Chicago | Registered: Feb 2006
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Choirboy
Shipmate
# 9659
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by mjg:
And remember Perot garnered 19% of the popular vote in 1992 so the 'right' candidate can have an impact (not that he was but he still got more than respectable traction).
Our third party governor actually won the election - not just 19% of the vote. He was still a non-entity, and his "party" has effectively vanished. A candidate will not break the 2-party stranglehold. It will take organizing a party from the ground up, probably starting with local offices.
Posts: 2994 | From: Minneapolis, Minnesota USA | Registered: Jun 2005
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Choirboy
Shipmate
# 9659
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Bullfrog.:
quote:
Originally posted by Littlelady:
If Bush was having a dig, would that harm Obama's chances or is there a weariness in the US yet over fighting talk?
I think it'll mostly entrench people into the positions they're already in. It's hard to imagine someone who still supports the Iraq occupation supporting Obama right now, just as it's hard to imagine someone opposing the Iraq occupation supporting Bush. People who already defend Obama will continue to do so, and people who defend Bush (are there any left anymore?) will continue to do so as well.
At this point, Bush taking a dig at someone could only increase their chances of winning.
About 15% of the electorate still supports Bush. They make up about 40% of the Republican Party.
Posts: 2994 | From: Minneapolis, Minnesota USA | Registered: Jun 2005
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moron
Shipmate
# 206
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Choirboy:
A candidate will not break the 2-party stranglehold. It will take organizing a party from the ground up, probably starting with local offices.
I tend to agree but I'm not sure Perot's 19% in a presidential election is a fair comparison to Ventura winning the governorship in MN, and some case could be made a top down approach would help generate more grass roots interest.
Bloomberg concluded he didn't have a decent chance at winning this year but he took a long hard look at it before reaching that decision.
Posts: 4236 | From: Bentonville | Registered: May 2001
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Choirboy
Shipmate
# 9659
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by mjg:
I tend to agree but I'm not sure Perot's 19% in a presidential election is a fair comparison to Ventura winning the governorship in MN, and some case could be made a top down approach would help generate more grass roots interest.
Yeah, it worked so well with Nader for the Greens.
quote:
Bloomberg concluded he didn't have a decent chance at winning this year but he took a long hard look at it before reaching that decision.
And made the right decision based on the evidence. This will not change in the future without more work being done at lower levels. The dream candidate will not waltz on stage, win the Presidency, and usher in a new era of multiparty democracy. That is the stuff of Neverland.
Posts: 2994 | From: Minneapolis, Minnesota USA | Registered: Jun 2005
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Mere Nick
Shipmate
# 11827
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Choirboy:
About 15% of the electorate still supports Bush. They make up about 40% of the Republican Party. [/QB]
I just looked at RealClearPolitics and Bush's approval rating is averaging 30.6%.
Congressional job approval is 18.7%.
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"Well that's it, boys. I've been redeemed. The preacher's done warshed away all my sins and transgressions. It's the straight and narrow from here on out, and heaven everlasting's my reward."
Delmar O'Donnell
Posts: 2797 | From: West Carolina | Registered: Sep 2006
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Mere Nick
Shipmate
# 11827
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by mjg:
And BTW: I recognize libertarianism is as flawed a concept as any other political philosophy and that it will never get much popular support. I just think leaning that way is necessary at this point in time to slow what is IMO an apparently inevitable creep toward inordinate 'state' control. [/QB]
Libertarianism seems to have had a pretty good deal of influence on the Republican party back in the Reagan era, but now the Republican party just seems to go to wherever the Democrat party is and then takes a baby step to the right. Hanging on to the devil's beltloop, one could say.
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"Well that's it, boys. I've been redeemed. The preacher's done warshed away all my sins and transgressions. It's the straight and narrow from here on out, and heaven everlasting's my reward."
Delmar O'Donnell
Posts: 2797 | From: West Carolina | Registered: Sep 2006
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Choirboy
Shipmate
# 9659
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Posted
I stand corrected.
Congress's approval is so low because they have not delivered on the promise to stop the war and roll back Bush's policies; hence, neither Democrats nor Republicans are giving them any support. Cf. here.
Posts: 2994 | From: Minneapolis, Minnesota USA | Registered: Jun 2005
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Mere Nick
Shipmate
# 11827
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Littlelady:
I wonder what people think about this exchange of views? Was Bush taking a sideswipe at Obama or has Obama become a little too self-absorbed or overly sensitive (not that I'm blaming him for that)? If Bush was having a dig, would that harm Obama's chances or is there a weariness in the US yet over fighting talk?
Obama wasn't named, but it's a kicked dog that yelps. It seems Obama would have done better to simply agree with Bush that appeasement is bad.
I had the news on this morning and it was either live or close after, and I didn't think of Obama but Jimmy Carter when I heard those particular comments.
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"Well that's it, boys. I've been redeemed. The preacher's done warshed away all my sins and transgressions. It's the straight and narrow from here on out, and heaven everlasting's my reward."
Delmar O'Donnell
Posts: 2797 | From: West Carolina | Registered: Sep 2006
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Alfred E. Neuman
What? Me worry?
# 6855
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Posted
Hot Damn! McCain invisions bin Laden captured or killed by 2013! Just in time for the re-election campaign! You have no idea how much more secure I feel knowing our stalwart Republican will bring that bastard to justice, dead or alive. At long last, our national nightmare is over.
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--Formerly: Gort--
Posts: 12954 | Registered: May 2004
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SeraphimSarov
Shipmate
# 4335
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Choirboy:
I stand corrected.
Congress's approval is so low because they have not delivered on the promise to stop the war and roll back Bush's policies; hence, neither Democrats nor Republicans are giving them any support. Cf. here.
well, without a Democrat in the White House, it would have been damn hard for them to do those things. They have to work in Congress with what they have. I suspect that things will be changed for the better come Nov.
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"For those who like that sort of thing, that is the sort of thing they like"
Posts: 2247 | From: Sacramento, California | Registered: Apr 2003
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Mere Nick
Shipmate
# 11827
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Choirboy:
I stand corrected.
Congress's approval is so low because they have not delivered on the promise to stop the war and roll back Bush's policies; hence, neither Democrats nor Republicans are giving them any support. Cf. here.
Well, you weren't really all that off. The polling tells me that the folks figure Bush sucks but congress eats raw excrement.
Many of us who are of the conservative/classical liberal type are beyond fed up with Republicans because of what I've posted elsewhere in this thread, that is, they are virtually indistinguishable from the Democrats when they show up in DC, with the few exceptions being too small in number to really matter.
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"Well that's it, boys. I've been redeemed. The preacher's done warshed away all my sins and transgressions. It's the straight and narrow from here on out, and heaven everlasting's my reward."
Delmar O'Donnell
Posts: 2797 | From: West Carolina | Registered: Sep 2006
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SeraphimSarov
Shipmate
# 4335
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Mere Nick:
quote:
Originally posted by Choirboy:
I stand corrected.
Congress's approval is so low because they have not delivered on the promise to stop the war and roll back Bush's policies; hence, neither Democrats nor Republicans are giving them any support. Cf. here.
Well, you weren't really all that off. The polling tells me that the folks figure Bush sucks but congress eats raw excrement.
Many of us who are of the conservative/classical liberal type are beyond fed up with Republicans because of what I've posted elsewhere in this thread, that is, they are virtually indistinguishable from the Democrats when they show up in DC, with the few exceptions being too small in number to really matter.
yeah, that they aren't conservative "Enough". It is similar to purist left-wingers who are immediately disillusioned when a center-left government doesn't deliver Jerusalem after 90 days in office. Similar purist delusions from both sides of the political spectrum.
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"For those who like that sort of thing, that is the sort of thing they like"
Posts: 2247 | From: Sacramento, California | Registered: Apr 2003
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Presleyterian
Shipmate
# 1915
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Posted
I've stopped putting much stock in those low congressional approval numbers when I realized that in many of those same polls, when asked "Do you approve or disapprove of the way your own representative to the U.S. House of Representatives in Congress is handling his or her job?" those surveyed give their own pols an approval rating of 69%, the highest in a decade.
Posts: 2450 | From: US | Registered: Dec 2001
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Mere Nick
Shipmate
# 11827
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by SeraphimSarov:
quote:
Originally posted by Mere Nick:
quote:
Originally posted by Choirboy:
I stand corrected.
Congress's approval is so low because they have not delivered on the promise to stop the war and roll back Bush's policies; hence, neither Democrats nor Republicans are giving them any support. Cf. here.
Well, you weren't really all that off. The polling tells me that the folks figure Bush sucks but congress eats raw excrement.
Many of us who are of the conservative/classical liberal type are beyond fed up with Republicans because of what I've posted elsewhere in this thread, that is, they are virtually indistinguishable from the Democrats when they show up in DC, with the few exceptions being too small in number to really matter.
yeah, that they aren't conservative "Enough". It is similar to purist left-wingers who are immediately disillusioned when a center-left government doesn't deliver Jerusalem after 90 days in office. Similar purist delusions from both sides of the political spectrum.
If one side or the other isn't conservative or liberal enough, why go to any great effort to support them? If the auto industry was like DC we would have two choices: Pinto or Vega?
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"Well that's it, boys. I've been redeemed. The preacher's done warshed away all my sins and transgressions. It's the straight and narrow from here on out, and heaven everlasting's my reward."
Delmar O'Donnell
Posts: 2797 | From: West Carolina | Registered: Sep 2006
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Mere Nick
Shipmate
# 11827
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Presleyterian:
I've stopped putting much stock in those low congressional approval numbers when I realized that in many of those same polls, when asked "Do you approve or disapprove of the way your own representative to the U.S. House of Representatives in Congress is handling his or her job?" those surveyed give their own pols an approval rating of 69%, the highest in a decade.
I smell pork.
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"Well that's it, boys. I've been redeemed. The preacher's done warshed away all my sins and transgressions. It's the straight and narrow from here on out, and heaven everlasting's my reward."
Delmar O'Donnell
Posts: 2797 | From: West Carolina | Registered: Sep 2006
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Alfred E. Neuman
What? Me worry?
# 6855
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Mere Nick:
... If the auto industry was like DC we would have two choices: Pinto or Vega?
I smell something that doesn't live in the real world. If the auto industry was like DC, We'd all be driving Escalades and Expeditions and being bailed out on defaulted loans with more printed money.
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--Formerly: Gort--
Posts: 12954 | Registered: May 2004
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Mere Nick
Shipmate
# 11827
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Gort:
quote:
Originally posted by Mere Nick:
... If the auto industry was like DC we would have two choices: Pinto or Vega?
I smell something that doesn't live in the real world. If the auto industry was like DC, We'd all be driving Escalades and Expeditions and being bailed out on defaulted loans with more printed money.
Pintos and Vegas, but at Escalade and Expedition prices.
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"Well that's it, boys. I've been redeemed. The preacher's done warshed away all my sins and transgressions. It's the straight and narrow from here on out, and heaven everlasting's my reward."
Delmar O'Donnell
Posts: 2797 | From: West Carolina | Registered: Sep 2006
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Choirboy
Shipmate
# 9659
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Mere Nick:
Well, you weren't really all that off. The polling tells me that the folks figure Bush sucks but congress eats raw excrement.
You didn't read the details. Bush's approval rating at 30% means he has the support of a good chunk of his party and few if anyone else. The other 70% all agree on why he sucks, and it covers a broad range of complete failures.
Congressional approval rating is lower, but people dislike them for different reasons. The opinion here is divided on what should be done, with Congress caught in the middle.
Posts: 2994 | From: Minneapolis, Minnesota USA | Registered: Jun 2005
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Choirboy
Shipmate
# 9659
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by SeraphimSarov:
well, without a Democrat in the White House, it would have been damn hard for them to do those things. They have to work in Congress with what they have. I suspect that things will be changed for the better come Nov.
Not that hard. They still have the power of the purse and could cut off the funds at any time.
Posts: 2994 | From: Minneapolis, Minnesota USA | Registered: Jun 2005
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SeraphimSarov
Shipmate
# 4335
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Mere Nick:
quote:
Originally posted by SeraphimSarov:
quote:
Originally posted by Mere Nick:
quote:
Originally posted by Choirboy:
I stand corrected.
Congress's approval is so low because they have not delivered on the promise to stop the war and roll back Bush's policies; hence, neither Democrats nor Republicans are giving them any support. Cf. here.
Well, you weren't really all that off. The polling tells me that the folks figure Bush sucks but congress eats raw excrement.
Many of us who are of the conservative/classical liberal type are beyond fed up with Republicans because of what I've posted elsewhere in this thread, that is, they are virtually indistinguishable from the Democrats when they show up in DC, with the few exceptions being too small in number to really matter.
yeah, that they aren't conservative "Enough". It is similar to purist left-wingers who are immediately disillusioned when a center-left government doesn't deliver Jerusalem after 90 days in office. Similar purist delusions from both sides of the political spectrum.
If one side or the other isn't conservative or liberal enough, why go to any great effort to support them? If the auto industry was like DC we would have two choices: Pinto or Vega?
Because politics is not like the auto sales industry
![[brick wall]](graemlins/brick_wall.gif) ![[Roll Eyes]](rolleyes.gif)
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"For those who like that sort of thing, that is the sort of thing they like"
Posts: 2247 | From: Sacramento, California | Registered: Apr 2003
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Bullfrog.
Prophetic Amphibian
# 11014
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Presleyterian:
I've stopped putting much stock in those low congressional approval numbers when I realized that in many of those same polls, when asked "Do you approve or disapprove of the way your own representative to the U.S. House of Representatives in Congress is handling his or her job?" those surveyed give their own pols an approval rating of 69%, the highest in a decade.
I remember learning this in college. It's generally always true that people, quite logically, never approve of congress as a whole (since most of it doesn't represent them), but tend to be reasonably happy with their particular congressperson. I think there was even a book written on the subject, but sadly I can't remember what it's called.
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Some say that man is the root of all evil
Others say God's a drunkard for pain
Me, I believe that the Garden of Eden
Was burned to make way for a train. --Josh Ritter, Harrisburg
Posts: 7522 | From: Chicago | Registered: Feb 2006
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SeraphimSarov
Shipmate
# 4335
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Choirboy:
quote:
Originally posted by SeraphimSarov:
well, without a Democrat in the White House, it would have been damn hard for them to do those things. They have to work in Congress with what they have. I suspect that things will be changed for the better come Nov.
Not that hard. They still have the power of the purse and could cut off the funds at any time.
not with the slim majorities especially in the Senate
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"For those who like that sort of thing, that is the sort of thing they like"
Posts: 2247 | From: Sacramento, California | Registered: Apr 2003
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Bullfrog.
Prophetic Amphibian
# 11014
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Posted
Oh yeah. That's the book. Congress as Public Enemy. If anyone cares to read a whole study on why folks hate Congress... ![[Big Grin]](biggrin.gif)
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Some say that man is the root of all evil
Others say God's a drunkard for pain
Me, I believe that the Garden of Eden
Was burned to make way for a train. --Josh Ritter, Harrisburg
Posts: 7522 | From: Chicago | Registered: Feb 2006
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Mere Nick
Shipmate
# 11827
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by SeraphimSarov:
Because politics is not like the auto sales industry
Notice I said "if". You're right, though. Even used car dealers are far more respectable than politicians. DC seems more like a Vince McMahon production than something out of Detroit.
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"Well that's it, boys. I've been redeemed. The preacher's done warshed away all my sins and transgressions. It's the straight and narrow from here on out, and heaven everlasting's my reward."
Delmar O'Donnell
Posts: 2797 | From: West Carolina | Registered: Sep 2006
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tclune
Shipmate
# 7959
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Mere Nick:
quote:
Originally posted by Gort:
quote:
Originally posted by Mere Nick:
... If the auto industry was like DC we would have two choices: Pinto or Vega?
I smell something that doesn't live in the real world. If the auto industry was like DC, We'd all be driving Escalades and Expeditions and being bailed out on defaulted loans with more printed money.
Pintos and Vegas, but at Escalade and Expedition prices.
One of the thigs that genuinely mystifies me is why people believe that they are being cheated by their government and catered to by people who are becoming wealthy off them. I worked on our town's advisory board (in some towns, this is called the finance committee), and we would routinely get irate letters from people in town, complainig about the extreme cost of town government.
One letter in particular struck me. It was from a group of five families who were livid that their street took so long to be plowed in the winter. They claimed that, between them, they paid something like $20,000 in town taxes and got "nothing" for all that money.
Now, this group of five families had a total of a dozen kids in the local school. At that time, the per-student cost of education was something like $7000, a figure that was well below the state average in a school system that ranked well above average in standardized test results and percentage of students who continued on to college. So these five families were being subsidized by their neighbors for the excellent services that they were receiving.
I wanted to write them back and explain this to them, but the rest of the advisory board felt that such a letter would be confrontational. Perhaps the reason that people think they are getting so little for their tax dollar is that the government spends very little time and effort advertising what it is doing with our common wealth, while private industry spends vast fortunes convincing people that a brand-name aspirin is vastly more beneficial than a generic one.
--Tom Clune
[ 16. May 2008, 15:48: Message edited by: tclune ]
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Posts: 8013 | From: Western MA | Registered: Jul 2004
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Choirboy
Shipmate
# 9659
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by SeraphimSarov:
quote:
Originally posted by Choirboy:
quote:
Originally posted by SeraphimSarov:
well, without a Democrat in the White House, it would have been damn hard for them to do those things. They have to work in Congress with what they have. I suspect that things will be changed for the better come Nov.
Not that hard. They still have the power of the purse and could cut off the funds at any time.
not with the slim majorities especially in the Senate
You put it in the defense appropriations bill. Either the bill passes, and it's the end, or the bill doesn't pass and the military is defunded. The leadership writes the legislation, so it doesn't matter how slim the majority is.
Posts: 2994 | From: Minneapolis, Minnesota USA | Registered: Jun 2005
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agrgurich
Shipmate
# 5724
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Posted
I think the public might be a wee bit upset if the military was defunded by the Congress. It's not going to happen.
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Life is a comedy to those who think & a tragedy to those who feel.-Horace Walpole
AJG
Posts: 4478 | From: Michigan's Copper Country | Registered: Apr 2004
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jlg
What is this place?
Why am I here?
# 98
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Posted
Then again... Congress might want to do so if only to elicit public discussion.
[ 16. May 2008, 23:12: Message edited by: jlg ]
Posts: 17391 | From: Just a Town, New Hampshire, USA | Registered: May 2001
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