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Source: (consider it) Thread: Purgatory: The political junkie POTUS prediction thread
New Yorker
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He doesn't need prison time. How does one punish juvenille stupidity? Maybe he should have to man a McCain - Palin booth on campus in Knoxville and hand out fliers? Maybe he should have to volunteer stuffing envelopes?
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Hiro's Leap

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quote:
Originally posted by RuthW:
There really is no solid reason at this point to believe that the people who don't want a black man to be president are shy about saying so.

A lot of people over here (especially Labour voters) are wary of polls because they've not forgotten how badly wrong predictions of the 1992 elections were. Voters were embarrassed to reveal their genuine preferences, creating the Shy Tory Factor.
Posts: 3418 | From: UK, OK | Registered: Mar 2007  |  IP: Logged
ken
Ship's Roundhead
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quote:
Originally posted by New Yorker:
The worst thing for me was McCain's answer to the first question. Obama went first and alleged that the current economic mess are the result of eight years of Bush and that McCain would just be another four years of the same. McCain did not respond to that. He should have pointed out that if anyone is to blame for this mess it's the Democrats who sacrificed economic regulation and oversight on the altar of making loans to those who could not afford them.

Bollocks. That is utterly dwarfed by the infationary effect of loosening the capital-adequacy ratios. Which the Republicans did because lobbyists for the banks asked them.

Now who was the chief spokescritter for Goldman Sachs at that time?

His name is on the tip of my tongue... somethgn like Harry, Henry, Hank... Paulsen, Poulson, Poulsen... something like that. A nice young man and very kind to animals. Now whatever happened to him?

quote:
Originally posted by RuthW:
And the remainder of the American electorate, those who don't vote in Democratic primaries, is more likely to be honest with pollsters about not wanting to vote for a black man. There really is no solid reason at this point to believe that the people who don't want a black man to be president are shy about saying so. There's even a way for them to state it without coming out and saying, "I'm a racist" -- they say "the country is not ready for a black man to be president."

But they don't say that. they say "He's not like us" or "We don't know where he's coming from" or they say they think he is a Muslim. Especially they say they think he is a Muslim. (Which some polls claim 10-15% of Americans say) Some racists are nice people. They don't want to be bigots. They don't like to think that they are bigots. So if they can invent a cover story to justify their own prejudices, they will. Put it this way. Anyone who at this stage in the game still tries to tell people that Obama is a Muslim is two out of four of racist, very stupid, self-deluded, or a blatant liar.

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Ken

L’amor che move il sole e l’altre stelle.

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mousethief

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Has it been mentioned that McCain says he knows how to capture Bin Laden but has neglected to share this information with anyone? "I won't tell unless you elect me, nanner nanner boo boo."

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GoodCatholicLad
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quote:
Originally posted by RuthW:
I'm also worried about Obama's personal security - I just hope that he's got a really good security team protecting him.



New Yorker said:
"While I would not shed a tear if the Good Lord called Obama home soon and very soon through natural causes, I certainly don't want to see him assassainated. No need to make a martyr out of him."


Man that's kinda harsh and not very Christian! He's not by cuppa but if he makes it I wish him the very best as president but if he looses he goes back to the senate and "tomorrow's another day". I am surprised you haven't been called to the firey woodshed. Klatu Varrata Nikto where are you? Your candidate has been dissed.

[ 08. October 2008, 16:10: Message edited by: GoodCatholicLad ]

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All you have is right now.

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RuthW

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quote:
Originally posted by ken:
they say "He's not like us" or "We don't know where he's coming from" or they say they think he is a Muslim. Especially they say they think he is a Muslim.

Yes, but this is irrelevant, because these folks don't tell pollsters they're going to vote for Obama -- they say they'll vote for McCain or leave the top of the ballot blank. So their views are accurately reflected in the current polls, and there's no factual basis for any fear that there will be a huge surprise on Nov. 4 if Obama's numbers stay up between now and then.

GoodCatholicLad, that quote about concern for Obama's safety was not from me.

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eeGAD

Wandering Stowaway
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quote:
Originally posted by ken:
Put it this way. Anyone who at this stage in the game still tries to tell people that Obama is a Muslim is two out of four of racist, very stupid, self-deluded, or a blatant liar.

I walked into a political discussion just now in our lunchroom. One man was explaining how he's decided to vote for Obama after being undecided for all these months. A very verbose woman asked him why, and he gave a very informed and thoughtful answer. To which the woman responded, "No way am I voting for a Black Muslim to lead my country!"

And then time stopped....


.... and everyone quietly snuck out of the lunchroom. We've always thought this woman was 4 for 4 from ken's list, and yet her comment still managed to stun me.

eeG

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You don't fix faith. It fixes you. - Shepherd Book

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Barnabas62
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Like RuthW indicated, the racist mind will always find a self-justifying form of words.

But we can all challenge it when it happens. The initial stunned silence is understandable, but that doesn't mean we have to leave it there.

eeGAD, it still seems possible to challenge her - and then challenge her some more. Sometimes the penny drops.

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IconiumBound
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Has no one else noted and commented on the appearance of the two candidates? It seemed to me that McCain moved around the stage in a jerky, somewhat bowlegged manner like an old man. Obama moved surely and smoothly, like a young man.

Will this be noticed among the younger voters?

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RuthW

liberal "peace first" hankie squeezer
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It'll be noticed among all voters. My mother called last night after the debate, and when I asked her what she and Dad thought, her main comment was about how stiff McCain looked. They're both the exact same age as McCain, but that's not causing them to cut him any slack.

It seems kind of unfair to me, though -- he's 72 years ago, and he had the crap beaten out of him on a regular basis the first couple of years that he was a POW. Both his arms were broken when he was captured, and his fractures weren't set properly. So of course he's stiff; he hasn't been able to lift his arms over his head since he was held captive.

But what I care about is whether his mind is sharp and whether it would remain sharp for at least four years, things I have a lot of doubts about.

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New Yorker
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quote:
Originally posted by GoodCatholicLad:
quote:
Originally posted by RuthW:
I'm also worried about Obama's personal security - I just hope that he's got a really good security team protecting him.



New Yorker said:
"While I would not shed a tear if the Good Lord called Obama home soon and very soon through natural causes, I certainly don't want to see him assassainated. No need to make a martyr out of him."


Man that's kinda harsh and not very Christian! He's not by cuppa but if he makes it I wish him the very best as president but if he looses he goes back to the senate and "tomorrow's another day". I am surprised you haven't been called to the firey woodshed. Klatu Varrata Nikto where are you? Your candidate has been dissed.

You're right. It is harsh and not very Christian. I apologize and retract the statement. Mea culpa.
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IconiumBound
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In regard to McCain's appearance, I wonder whether we'll soon have "tottering" added to "erratic" in Democrat opinion talking points?
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comet

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here's an awsome op-ed that expresses my feelings on the Palin campaign very well. McCain Camp Occupies Alaska

I'm hearing very similar sentiment from all over the state.

it's so sad to see when someone who claims the high ethical ground will sell their soul for political glory.

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Evil Dragon Lady, Breaker of Men's Constitutions

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Pigwidgeon

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Was it my imagination, or -- in his effort to be personal and call people by name -- did he call one of the question-askers by the wrong name? I think the questioner was Oliver, but he called him Alan, who was the previous person? If you can't remember people's names, don't attempt to use them.

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CorgiGreta
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It seemed to me that in his pacing the floor, Sen. McCain resembled an enraged caged animal ready to attack anyone who dared come near the bars of the cage.

Also, there may have been a "senior moment" or two. Before the first question had even been asked, Sen. McCain was madly writing notes. Was he afraid he would forget somethiing he had been told moments earlier?

Later, he had Mr. Brokow repeat three simple words and then had to qickly scribble them down.

That said, I highly commend him for pretty much avoiding the gutter politics so favored by his V.P. choice.

Greta

[ 08. October 2008, 18:20: Message edited by: CorgiGreta ]

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Comper's Child
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McCain looked nervous as all get out, and Obama cool as a cucumber. I wasn't impressed by the answers either of them gave, frankly, though I will vote for Obama whose general policies I prefer..
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RuthW

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More on how racists will vote: this is purely anecdotal, but one canvasser and one person doing phone calls (see the comments) say they're running into people who unashamedly call Obama a nigger but are still undecided about who to vote for because of the economy. Who knows what they'll do in the privacy of the voting booth?
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tclune
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quote:
Originally posted by RuthW:
More on how racists will vote: this is purely anecdotal, but one canvasser and one person doing phone calls (see the comments) say they're running into people who unashamedly call Obama a nigger but are still undecided about who to vote for because of the economy. Who knows what they'll do in the privacy of the voting booth?

Kind of calls to mind the relationship between the sheriff and the townfolk in Blazing Saddles, doesn't it?

--Tom Clune

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A Feminine Force
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quote:
Originally posted by New Yorker:

The worst thing for me was McCain's answer to the first question. Obama went first and alleged that the current economic mess are the result of eight years of Bush and that McCain would just be another four years of the same. McCain did not respond to that. He should have pointed out that if anyone is to blame for this mess it's the Democrats who sacrificed economic regulation and oversight on the altar of making loans to those who could not afford them. Now many will disagree with this view, but it's the Republican argument and McCain should have made it.


To quote Daniel Gross "Let me get this straight. Investment banks and insurance companies run by centimillionaires blow up, and it's the fault of Jimmy Carter, Bill Clinton, and poor minorities?"

Yeah right. Complex problems have simple causes.

For another take on the Republican position, there's a very interesting article in Newsweek

If McCain wants to give a sound-bite answer to a complex problem, then he should stick to the one offered at the end of the article:

"Lending money to poor people doesn't make you poor. Lending money poorly to rich people does."

And if you need any more proof of this axiom, then just check out the top brass of AIG: not 10 days after the American little guy bailed them out to the tune of $85,000,000,000.00 they rewarded themselves with a $500,000 trip to a California spa.

Seriously, these guys are like your alcoholic brother in law whose family continues to enable them.

Personally I think it's time for the American people to stage a little intervention with their policymakers, and with their corporate overlords. Seems to me that 230 years ago y'all were hucking tea in the harbor for offenses a lot less egregious than what we are seeing right now. Unfortunately, I sincerely doubt the next man at the helm of America Inc. will be able to conduct business any differently than his predecessor.

LAFF

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C2C - The Cure for What Ails Ya?

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Alogon
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LAFF: [Overused]

This short article, published almost exactly five years ago, was a prophetic eye-opener for me.

The Malling of America, by Andy Serwer

Gist: the regnant doctrine is that you're never rich enough. You don't deserve what you have unless you always live dangerously, leveraging everything you own, ever expanding, even if you can't think of a sensible thing to do with all the money you've managed to borrow.

[ 08. October 2008, 21:58: Message edited by: Alogon ]

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Patriarchy (n.): A belief in original sin unaccompanied by a belief in God.

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Josephine

Orthodox Belle
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quote:
Originally posted by A Feminine Force:
And if you need any more proof of this axiom, then just check out the top brass of AIG: not 10 days after the American little guy bailed them out to the tune of $85,000,000,000.00 they rewarded themselves with a $500,000 trip to a California spa.



This just in: AIG is getting another $37,800,000,000 from The Fed, on top of the $85,000,000,000 we've already given them.

No, this isn't on The Onion. It isn't on SNL. This is real. [Waterworks]

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I've written a book! Catherine's Pascha: A celebration of Easter in the Orthodox Church. It's a lovely book for children. Take a look!

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CorgiGreta
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A friend of mine worked for SunAmerica for about ten years prior to 2001. The company did very well. She loved her job, and she greatly admired the company's founder and CEO, Eli Broad.

In 2000, SunAmerica was acquired by AIG, and everything changed. She quickly decided that the company had been turned in the wrong direction, and it took all her effort to drag herself into work each day,

Within six months she found another job, and she is certainly glad today that she did so.

Unfortunately, she didn't roll over her 401(k) stock, which was converted quite favorably into AIG stock. In spite of her observations at work, she was beguiled by the glowing predictions on the part of AIG brass. She compounded her error by holding on to the stock as it cascaded downward and is now essentially worthless.

I'm sure she feels that the AIG executives deserved a nice little break as a reward for all their hard work and brilliant decisions over the years.

Greta

[ 08. October 2008, 22:59: Message edited by: CorgiGreta ]

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Zorro
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IconiumBound

quote:
Has no one else noted and commented on the appearance of the two candidates? It seemed to me that McCain moved around the stage in a jerky, somewhat bowlegged manner like an old man. Obama moved surely and smoothly, like a young man.

Will this be noticed among the younger voters?

Not a voter in this election, but a younger person who watched the debate. Yes, I noticed, but in all honesty I wasn't that surprised by the pace of motion (this is ultimately someone of my Grandfather's generation against someone of my Father's) whereas the sheer lack of presence on the part of McCain was oddly engrossing I felt. It's nothing to do with age, it's about personal confidence, and I reckon an innate ability to make your presence felt. Obama did that masterfully-"I'm here, but I'm not a bully" where McCain seemed more "I'm totally ill at ease here and I wish this was over." I honestly didn't think McCain was engaged much at all with anything he said last night.


Zorro.

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It is so hard to believe, because it is so hard to obey. Soren Kierkegaard
Well, churches really should be like sluts; take everyone no matter who they are or whether they can pay. Spiffy da wondersheep

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Myrrh
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Maybe this has already been answered here, but has the electronic voting system been sorted out?

Myrrh

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and thanks for all the fish

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mousethief

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To whose satisfaction?

ETA: Actually there isn't one voting system. Each state is in charge of polling its own residents. And any given state may have multiple voting systems within it, I believe, depending upon the laws of individual states. The whole system wouldn't pass muster in a third world country if inspected by some independent international elections fraud watchdog group. Frightening.

[ 09. October 2008, 00:21: Message edited by: mousethief ]

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Myrrh
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It was allegedly sorted in 2004 to the satisfaction of the present incumbent and if the teething problems have now been dealt with will anyone know if it continues to be to their satisfaction? I can't see the Democrats ignoring this, they must have done something about it.

Myrrh

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and thanks for all the fish

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GoodCatholicLad
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quote:
Originally posted by RuthW:
You can read the details there, but the fact is that Obama did better in the polling booths in the primaries than he did in the opinion polls almost everywhere in the country, especially the south.

The worry is that the self-selected ten percent or so of the population who vote in Democrat primaries probably doesn't have a big overlaps with the unknown proportion so of the population who might think twice before voting for a black President. Crudely, they are almost certanly likely to be both more interested in politics and more liberal than Americans who don't vote in Dem primaries.
quote:
Also from RuthW:
All very true. And the remainder of the American electorate, those who don't vote in Democratic primaries, is more likely to be honest with pollsters about not wanting to vote for a black man. There really is no solid reason at this point to believe that the people who don't want a black man to be president are shy about saying so. There's even a way for them to state it without coming out and saying, "I'm a racist" -- they say "the country is not ready for a black man to be president."

Today I took my father to his trade union retirees meeting, the first thing that was on the agenda was that it was very important that Obama gets elected, the man at the podium says "He might be a black man but he's a union man!" I nearly coughed up my doughnut. Now this is the San Francisco Bay Area mind you. No one objected to this statement. Afterwards at the fellowship I mentioned it in a humorous way and everyone looked at me blankly with this "so what's your point"? They simply didn't get it. I know the average age was 76 but still! Incredible. I mentioned it to my 90 year old father about how would he like it if someone replaced Black with Mexican and he agreed but my brother said I was being too sensitive consider their age and generation.

[Coding of quotes corrected]

[ 09. October 2008, 08:07: Message edited by: Barnabas62 ]

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All you have is right now.

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mousethief

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quote:
Originally posted by Myrrh:
It was allegedly sorted in 2004 to the satisfaction of the present incumbent and if the teething problems have now been dealt with will anyone know if it continues to be to their satisfaction? I can't see the Democrats ignoring this, they must have done something about it. (Italics mine)

Your faith is touching. The satisfaction of the present incumbent doesn't do much for me, seeing what he's done to the country for the last 8 years. His idea of fair and balanced would make Fox News blush.

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Myrrh
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quote:
Originally posted by mousethief:
quote:
Originally posted by Myrrh:
It was allegedly sorted in 2004 to the satisfaction of the present incumbent and if the teething problems have now been dealt with will anyone know if it continues to be to their satisfaction? I can't see the Democrats ignoring this, they must have done something about it. (Italics mine)

Your faith is touching. The satisfaction of the present incumbent doesn't do much for me, seeing what he's done to the country for the last 8 years. His idea of fair and balanced would make Fox News blush.
Doubt it with O'Reilly as his greatest fan. I'm still shocked to remember O'R saying Bush should be allowed to torture anyone he wants to protect national security and for the same reason he shouldn't have to account to anyone for wire tapping.


Myrrh

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and thanks for all the fish

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mousethief

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quote:
Originally posted by Myrrh:
Doubt it with O'Reilly as his greatest fan. I'm still shocked to remember O'R saying Bush should be allowed to torture anyone he wants to protect national security and for the same reason he shouldn't have to account to anyone for wire tapping.

This coincides with your "14 points on the road to Fascism" link on that other thread....

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Myrrh
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Frightening. I've been planning to move back to England but these moves to making it a police state are making me think again.

I remembered that McCain had pulled out of Pennsylvania 'because he couldn't win there' and look what I found when I tagged that to electronic voting - that it's a swing state so one he should be concentrating on I'd have thought and, is this a slip of the tongue?:

(George Snuffleupagus* said that the McCain campaign would try and "steal Pennsylvania" from Senator Obama)


Myrrh

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and thanks for all the fish

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Orb

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quote:
Originally posted by eeGAD:
.... and everyone quietly snuck out of the lunchroom. We've always thought this woman was 4 for 4 from ken's list, and yet her comment still managed to stun me.

If I had a spare ten years, I'd go find this woman and watch what she does with her days for the whole duration and write a paper on it. Fascinating.

For the whole debate, I was crying out for them to talk about abortion. "ABORTION! PLEASE! ABORTION!". I think I am bored of politics. It's been a long campaign.

McCain shouldn't be in this race. He's too old. Am I ageist? I wouldn't try and run for President at the age of 72. Might campaign to make the minimum age of the President younger though.

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“You cannot buy the revolution. You cannot make the revolution. You can only be the revolution. It is in your spirit, or it is nowhere.” Ursula K. Le Guin, The Dispossessed

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Og: Thread Killer
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As the questions were supposedly from undecideds, the chances of a question about Abortion coming up were slim to none.

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I wish I was seeking justice loving mercy and walking humbly but... "Cease to lament for that thou canst not help, And study help for that which thou lament'st."

Posts: 5025 | From: Toronto | Registered: Aug 2002  |  IP: Logged
Orb

Eye eye Cap'n!
# 3256

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True. But anything a bit more light-hearted like that would have sufficed.
Posts: 5032 | From: Easton, Bristol | Registered: Aug 2002  |  IP: Logged
mousethief

Ship's Thieving Rodent
# 953

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Abortion is light-hearted?

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This is the last sig I'll ever write for you...

Posts: 63536 | From: Washington | Registered: Jul 2001  |  IP: Logged
Orb

Eye eye Cap'n!
# 3256

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My tongue was in my cheek.

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“You cannot buy the revolution. You cannot make the revolution. You can only be the revolution. It is in your spirit, or it is nowhere.” Ursula K. Le Guin, The Dispossessed

Posts: 5032 | From: Easton, Bristol | Registered: Aug 2002  |  IP: Logged
duchess

Ship's Blue Blooded Lady
# 2764

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quote:
Originally posted by Orb:

McCain shouldn't be in this race. He's too old. Am I ageist? I wouldn't try and run for President at the age of 72. Might campaign to make the minimum age of the President younger though.

Well he's got a nice young thing to balance out his oldness. Their combined ages divided in half make a good average age for prez.

I am encouraged that a man of color is running for prez and a woman for VP...no matter who wins the race.

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♬♭ We're setting sail to the place on the map from which nobody has ever returned ♫♪♮
Ship of Fools-World Party

Posts: 11197 | From: Do you know the way? | Registered: May 2002  |  IP: Logged
Orb

Eye eye Cap'n!
# 3256

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Yeah, both tickets have about a 56/57/58 average age (about the same as the nation), but the Democrats are closer together, aren't they? Obama is 47 and Biden is 65 (turning 66 in November). Palin is 44 and McCain is 72.

I'd like it a lot more if the woman was somebody who was competent.

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“You cannot buy the revolution. You cannot make the revolution. You can only be the revolution. It is in your spirit, or it is nowhere.” Ursula K. Le Guin, The Dispossessed

Posts: 5032 | From: Easton, Bristol | Registered: Aug 2002  |  IP: Logged
mousethief

Ship's Thieving Rodent
# 953

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quote:
Originally posted by Orb:
I'd like it a lot more if the woman was somebody who was competent.

Competent at what? I understand she's a hell of a shot with a .3006.

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This is the last sig I'll ever write for you...

Posts: 63536 | From: Washington | Registered: Jul 2001  |  IP: Logged
Golden Key
Shipmate
# 1468

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{Possible "Saturday Night Live" sketch and/or alternate reality...}

McCain is out of the running, for some reason.

Obama is out of the running, for some reason.

Congressfolk and newspeople gather outside the White House gate, heads in hands, wondering what to do.

Suddenly, there's a whooshing sound, a sparkling light, and a Xena yell.

Hillary, dressed in a power suit and cashmere cape, floats down from the sky. "Did someone call for a presidential candidate?"


or

Same circumstances; but Nancy Pelosi--next in line of succession--takes the presidency.

[Two face]

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Blessed Gator, pray for us!
--"Oh bat bladders, do you have to bring common sense into this?" (Dragon, "Jane & the Dragon")
--"Oh, Peace Train, save this country!" (Yusuf/Cat Stevens, "Peace Train")

Posts: 18601 | From: Chilling out in an undisclosed, sincere pumpkin patch. | Registered: Oct 2001  |  IP: Logged
Zorro
Shipmate
# 9156

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Duchess
quote:
I am encouraged that a man of color is running for prez and a woman for VP...no matter who wins the race.
Really? Is the Palin thing that great a step? Apart from anything else, she's not the first, and she seems only to have been chosen as an almost trophy VP figure rather than any ability-political or otherwise, that she's displayed. Maybe I'm wrong about that but it's all I've been able to think since she was nominated.


Zorro.

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It is so hard to believe, because it is so hard to obey. Soren Kierkegaard
Well, churches really should be like sluts; take everyone no matter who they are or whether they can pay. Spiffy da wondersheep

Posts: 2568 | From: Baja California (actually the UK but that's where my fans know me from) | Registered: Mar 2005  |  IP: Logged
New Yorker
Shipmate
# 9898

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quote:
Originally posted by Golden Key:

Hillary, dressed in a power suit and cashmere cape, floats down from the sky. "Did someone call for a presidential candidate?

That's the exact scenario I think Hillary has been working for. And, that's the one think that makes me think Obama might lose: that the Clintons are determined to prevent his election.

quote:
Originally posted by Zorro:
(Palin) seems only to have been chosen as an almost trophy VP figure rather than any ability-political or otherwise, that she's displayed.

Actually, I think she was chosen for two reasons. First to try to win female voters. Second, to secure the conservative base. I think she has definitely accomplished the second goal. Not sure about the first.
Posts: 3193 | From: New York City | Registered: Jul 2005  |  IP: Logged
Sine Nomine

Ship's backstabbing bastard
# 66

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I wonder if Madam Palin knows the origin of "a shining city upon a hill" because it gives me the creeps whenever she trots it out. I'm not really keen to go back to the governing principles of the Massachusetts Bay Colony - although that might in fact be her agenda.

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Precious, Precious, Sweet, Sweet Daddy...

Posts: 16639 | From: lat. 36.24/lon. 86.84 | Registered: Dec 2002  |  IP: Logged
Zorro
Shipmate
# 9156

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New Yorker

quote:
quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Originally posted by Zorro:
(Palin) seems only to have been chosen as an almost trophy VP figure rather than any ability-political or otherwise, that she's displayed.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Actually, I think she was chosen for two reasons. First to try to win female voters. Second, to secure the conservative base. I think she has definitely accomplished the second goal. Not sure about the first.

Uh huh. Maybe I'm missing the bit where you clarified her political ability as opposed to her status as a symbol?


Zorro.

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It is so hard to believe, because it is so hard to obey. Soren Kierkegaard
Well, churches really should be like sluts; take everyone no matter who they are or whether they can pay. Spiffy da wondersheep

Posts: 2568 | From: Baja California (actually the UK but that's where my fans know me from) | Registered: Mar 2005  |  IP: Logged
Josephine

Orthodox Belle
# 3899

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quote:
Originally posted by Zorro:
Duchess
[QUOTE] Is the Palin thing that great a step?

Not a great step, no. But someone once said that women would have achieved equality when an incompetent woman could reach a high position as readily as an incompetent man.

If you accept that reasoning, then Palin's candidacy may be seen, not as a great step in and of itself, but as evidence of just how far we've come.

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I've written a book! Catherine's Pascha: A celebration of Easter in the Orthodox Church. It's a lovely book for children. Take a look!

Posts: 10273 | From: Pacific Northwest, USA | Registered: Jan 2003  |  IP: Logged
Og: Thread Killer
Ship's token CN Mennonite
# 3200

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quote:
Originally posted by Sine Nomine:
I wonder if Madam Palin knows the origin of "a shining city upon a hill" because it gives me the creeps whenever she trots it out. I'm not really keen to go back to the governing principles of the Massachusetts Bay Colony - although that might in fact be her agenda.

Its a Reagan line in most people'e memories. They are trying to get back to the good old days.

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I wish I was seeking justice loving mercy and walking humbly but... "Cease to lament for that thou canst not help, And study help for that which thou lament'st."

Posts: 5025 | From: Toronto | Registered: Aug 2002  |  IP: Logged
Myrrh
Shipmate
# 11483

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She ain't no Maggie Thatcher, whatever other reasons for picking her ease of control shouldn't be excluded. She reminds me of a work situation I was in aeons ago in a department of 7: manager, deputy, five of us, and a secretary and her assistant who did work for all of us. When the deputy left and shortly after the manager also, rather than finding replacements they downgraded the status of the jobs by appointing one of our number as manager - seen by all at the time(*) as a great move for women, but in reality an opportunity taken by other male managers to muscle in and one favourite given the department, and presumably the difference in salary between the old and new manager status.

How she'd fare with the controlling interests in the Republican Party or McCain in the short term, (Scroll down to McCAIN'S DESPICABLE VISION OF WOMEN), but from her ability to get her way as she shown in Alaska she could surprise every by turning into a maggie..

(*) This was when it was considered perfectly acceptable to put pictures of naked women up on the message board in mixed offices, the women's objections laughed off. One, male, sales rep said he could get me pictures of male nudes when I griped that's what we needed for a bit of balance when one of my colleagues put up the new female techni-colour nudes from a tabloid. It caused an almighty stink and I was summoned to a supremo manager's office because I wouldn't remove the male nudes from the board.. I continued to refuse to get rid of them unless the female nudes went first - Myrrh 1 Nasty smarmy rugby playing mg driving git who became the backstabbing deputy 0.


Myrrh

Posts: 4467 | Registered: Jun 2006  |  IP: Logged
Sine Nomine

Ship's backstabbing bastard
# 66

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quote:
Originally posted by Og: Thread Killer:
They are trying to get back to the good old days.

Burning witches or trickle-down economics?

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Precious, Precious, Sweet, Sweet Daddy...

Posts: 16639 | From: lat. 36.24/lon. 86.84 | Registered: Dec 2002  |  IP: Logged
ken
Ship's Roundhead
# 2460

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quote:
Originally posted by New Yorker:
And, that's the one think that makes me think Obama might lose: that the Clintons are determined to prevent his election.

[Roll Eyes] [Snore] [Snore] [Roll Eyes]

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Ken

L’amor che move il sole e l’altre stelle.

Posts: 39579 | From: London | Registered: Mar 2002  |  IP: Logged
saysay

Ship's Praying Mantis
# 6645

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quote:
Originally posted by RuthW:
More on how racists will vote: this is purely anecdotal, but one canvasser and one person doing phone calls (see the comments) say they're running into people who unashamedly call Obama a nigger but are still undecided about who to vote for because of the economy. Who knows what they'll do in the privacy of the voting booth?

Not surprisingly, my mixed race (black/white) extended family has spent a lot of time over the past year talking about this election. Especially given that a bunch of them live in West Virginia, where copies of the White Patriot Leader or somesuch blatantly racist publication was distributed throughout town last October. The leader of the local KKK is a member of their church; my (black, male) cousin recently married a white woman and over Christmas we were all assigned specific you-need-to-know-what-you're-getting-into tasks (mine was: you know that there are going to be a lot of black women who are really going to have a problem with you and the fact that you're married to an educated responsible black man, right?).

Back at Christmas, all of the older (over 40) black folks were opposed to Obama's run. They believed that the country was still too racist for him to survive, much less win. The younger folks weren't as worried, but were concerned - we liked Obama, and talked about how we thought he could win in 2012 but thought that 2008 might be too soon both for him and for the country.

By the time my cousin got married in May (when Obama and Clinton were still battling it out), everyone - and I do mean everyone, including those crazy Californian Republicans (btw, I'm still mad at you guys for exporting your nuts and flakes) favored Obama over Hillary and Obama over McCain. I spent a lot of time trying to convince people that even if Hillary got the nomination they should support Clinton over McCain, although I don't think I succeeded in convincing many.

Now, everyone supports Obama. Strongly. My uncle suspects that even the KKK leader is going to vote for Obama because things have gotten so bad for the poor and the lower-middle class and military families that everyone knows there really is no other choice.

Anecdotal, yes. But I'm not really worried about the outcome of this election anymore.

Four is not five. Enough people know that.

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"It's been a long day without you, my friend
I'll tell you all about it when I see you again"
"'Oh sweet baby purple Jesus' - that's a direct quote from a 9 year old - shoutout to purple Jesus."

Posts: 2943 | From: The Wire | Registered: May 2004  |  IP: Logged



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