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Source: (consider it) Thread: AS: Job Search Support Thread
Ethne Alba
Shipmate
# 5804

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Hope Wet Kipper is managing the change?

Recieved last weeks pay slip today.
A few hours later I discovered which agency has swiped the jobs I was originally going for with best-choice-agency.
Ha!
Do I join this agency?
It's all a bit tiresome.............. [Ultra confused]

Posts: 3126 | Registered: Apr 2004  |  IP: Logged
Telepath
Ship's Steamer Trunk
# 3534

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EA - yes, join that agency.

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Take emptiness and lying speech far from me, and do not give me poverty or wealth. Give me a living sufficient for me.

Posts: 3509 | From: East Anglia | Registered: Nov 2002  |  IP: Logged
Wet Kipper
Circus Runaway
# 1654

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well, on wedneday night I kinda snuck up on myself and updated my CV and sent it to an angency before I realised what I was doing

I have an interview with them on Friday coming.

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- insert randomly chosen, potentially Deep and Meaningful™ song lyrics here -

Posts: 9841 | From: further up the Hill | Registered: Nov 2001  |  IP: Logged
aj

firewire technophobe
# 1383

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All the best with that WK. I'm starting a new job on Wednesday, after applying for it then getting a call within an hour asking me to go in. I haven't worked in a 9 to 5 job since 2000 so it will be a bit of a change.

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if there's no god, then who turns on the light when you open the fridge?

Posts: 2994 | From: ...on location | Registered: Sep 2001  |  IP: Logged
Janine

The Endless Simmer
# 3337

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I hear that same small-company-owner lady has called at least one of my personal references -- who sold her such a glowing report of me, I am shocked that she did not immediately call me to come in and become her right-hand woman.

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I'm a Fundagelical Evangimentalist. What are you?
Take Me Home * My Heart * An hour with Rich Mullins *

Posts: 13788 | From: Below the Bible Belt | Registered: Sep 2002  |  IP: Logged
Telepath
Ship's Steamer Trunk
# 3534

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My latest antics:

Following Monday's meltdown, I phoned Auntie Telenun who told me I had no alternative but to sit down and think hard about what I have to offer the world.

Erm... um...

All the exercises in "What Color Is Your Parachute" that I've done so far, strongly suggest that I should be working with and systematizing data, visualizing and realizing it to present it to an audience, and getting things done and producing.

In other words, I should be a software engineer. Right. Got it.

Auntie Telenun also told me to sit down for 20 minutes in silence and meditate on Psalm 62 verse 1, and pray for guidance. (She's seen "1408" too.) I didn't really get many ideas the first time, because I had too much going around in my head. A bunch of vague stuff suggested by others, which I could theoretically do, but had no impetus to do.

Someone from my church told me about her experience of struggling for a year and then taking a total change of direction. I contemplated a total change of direction... dunno really. I don't see how. But I applied for a secretarial job, just in case.

So I fiddled around on the Internet, applied for a few jobs. Sigh. Considered the possibility of selling as many of my possessions as I can in case God is mad at me for spending too much money. As a fleece, put the first saleable item I found up on Amazon, with the test condition that if it sold within 24 hours, I would continue in this vein. It didn't. Just as well as I'd have made a loss. (One pee for a Tomb Raider video!)

Before bed, sat down for another 20 minutes and prayed for more guidance.

Did the same as soon as I got up this morning. (Couldn't really think about anything else TBH.)

Got a positive response from one job I'd applied to. They turned out to be an essays-for-sale cheating mill. Withdrew my application.

Got a positive response from another company, asking me to email my CV and then immediately pick up the phone. When I phoned them, they explained that they'd forgotten they already had the CV, and had looked at it in the intervening minute, and I didn't meet an essential condition. Sigh. (Not all bleak because they will see if they can find anything else suitable and get back to me by COB tomorrow.)

Went to sign on. [Waterworks]

Went to sort out the tangled web of my mobile phone contract; shelled out megabucks for a new handset because of blah blah blah. The terrifying thing is I still got off lightly. [Ultra confused]

I was so distressed by this that it seemed like a good idea to buy some discount boots from the Boots R Us Outlet Store. [brick wall] I hope no potential employers find out about this, as it's clear evidence that I'm too dumb to work for them.

Anyhoo. Got home, fiddled around for an hour and a half, banged my head against the wall, contemplated changing my name to I.M. Stupid, that sort of thing.

Phoned a friend for a bout of pessimism. Re-contemplated selling all my possessions (NOT THE BOOTS) and preparing to embrace joblessness as a lifestyle while mechanically sending out applications with a sense of despair. Felt better after a good despair-fest.

Then... There was this noise. It turned out to be the new handset ringing. The old one hasn't been able to ring since I dropped it, right before my Google phone screen in February. So the sound was disorienting, you understand.

It was an agent. He was calling about one of the jobs I applied for in the wee hours. It was for a specialist in the same thing I did my dissertation on!!! [Eek!] The job ad has been up since the 4th. Two of them, both marked URGENT. I am the only applicant. The agent says they couldn't find anybody!

However he doesn't know if they're still recruiting. Maybe they've given up, or looked elsewhere, or something.

But he's going to put me up for it and make the unusual move of insisting they show my CV to everyone there who could possibly be interested in it.

OH, PLEASE GOD, PLEASE.

Apart from anything else, I've got a pocket PC and some discount boots to pay for.

IME these things usually fizzle... NOT THIS ONE, LORD. Please.

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Take emptiness and lying speech far from me, and do not give me poverty or wealth. Give me a living sufficient for me.

Posts: 3509 | From: East Anglia | Registered: Nov 2002  |  IP: Logged
Ethne Alba
Shipmate
# 5804

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Isn't it odd the way that "looking for work" fries our mind half the time?

Today was phoned by best-choice-agency and offered two days work- they need someone with a very current enhanced CRB.

So cycled to work somewhere I've never seen before.
Had a fab time.
Did nothing at all related to anything best-choice-agency originally signed me up for.
Cycled home again.
Was happy.
Am happy.

Please, please Lord I would like this sort of thing once a week for the next two years.
(please)

Posts: 3126 | Registered: Apr 2004  |  IP: Logged
Janine

The Endless Simmer
# 3337

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At this point, I have the basic, unfrilly, no-contact-numbers resume that generally gets sloshed about all over the place.

And I also have the three-page one, with full details -- the whole 2nd page of it devoted to just the one longish job I've had in the past 5 years, the receptionist one -- And on the end of the last page, after my education info, there are four personal reference contacts.

That way I can easily alter the thing to leave out the references if I need to -- or I can cut down the detailed list of duties on that second page and condense the refs up a bit, so it's only a two-page resume.

Today I went out to the temp/staffing agency where I used to send people, when I was working. Signed up -- they were shocked to hear I'd been laid off, they thought it had been only a few days since I'd communicated with them from my workplace, about their candidates for my workplace.

I sort of walked a tightrope, telling them some things they sort of had a right to know about why I waslaid off -- because they were a prospective employer themselves, and I wanted them to have a context within which they might interpret whatever weird thing my former boss might say when they call him.

It was odd, though, walking that tightrope -- because part of the work on the last two jobs has been handling volumes of data, info about my employers, with discretion.

So, like, how the heck are you supposed to give them the complete "picture" they need, without blathering stuff that makes you look as if you have no discretion?

Anyway -- they told me they might have a spot for me with a communications company. Doing what I do. Would be nice. I wonder if I'll hear something soon?

And the lady who was so fascinated by my resume and who called my reference guy has not issued a peep at me since. True, her office had just entered their wildly busy two-week cycle... but I think I will stop in and say hello anyway. At least to see if they hired someone else.

Tomorrow I go to the Registrar of Voters office, to be qualified as an election commissioner. Not hard work, to be sure -- a couple times a year, you go in at maybe 7 a.m. to your assigned polling place, and you sty there until the polls close (maybe 8 p.m. here).

The old pay rate was $150 for a day of "commissionering", but they've raised it since.

And since, sappy sentimental patriot that I am, I take the elections -- or at least the right to participate -- very seriously, it will be like getting paid a not-too-shabby day's wages to do what is my civic duty anyway.

[ 13. September 2007, 08:24: Message edited by: Janine ]

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I'm a Fundagelical Evangimentalist. What are you?
Take Me Home * My Heart * An hour with Rich Mullins *

Posts: 13788 | From: Below the Bible Belt | Registered: Sep 2002  |  IP: Logged
Janine

The Endless Simmer
# 3337

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quote:
... a couple times a year, you go in at maybe 7 a.m. to your assigned polling place, and you sty there until the polls close (maybe 8 p.m. here)...
Or I might stay there. Wouldn't want to hog the place.

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I'm a Fundagelical Evangimentalist. What are you?
Take Me Home * My Heart * An hour with Rich Mullins *

Posts: 13788 | From: Below the Bible Belt | Registered: Sep 2002  |  IP: Logged
FreeJack
Shipmate
# 10612

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quote:
Originally posted by Janine:
quote:
... a couple times a year, you go in at maybe 7 a.m. to your assigned polling place, and you sty there until the polls close (maybe 8 p.m. here)...
Or I might stay there. Wouldn't want to hog the place.
[Overused] [Killing me] [Big Grin]
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Smudgie

Ship's Barnacle
# 2716

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Anyone got any bright ideas for alternative jobs for a teacher who loves actually teaching but can't stick being asked to go against her ethics any longer? I'm finding myself in that unenviable position where if I work the way I'm being asked (asked? told!) to work I'm going against what I believe in and once I step onto that slippery slope I know I'll quickly become even more disillusioned and be in it for the money rather than for the children - then I'll no longer be good at what I do or get any job satisfaction. But what on earth is there which will continue to pay the mortgage (and the cost of my extension and my son's school fees) and which doesn't require relocating? Where do I begin contemplating a career change after 18 years?

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Miss you, Erin.

Posts: 14382 | From: Under the duvet | Registered: Apr 2002  |  IP: Logged
Josephine

Orthodox Belle
# 3899

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Things I know of that would use your knowledge and experience:
  • Private tutor. They might call that something else on your side of the pond, though -- this would be someone that parents hire to teach their kids, because the kids are struggling to learn at school.)
  • Nanny for child with special needs. Wouldn't pay as much as teaching, maybe, but here it pays about 50% more than a regular nanny.
  • Special education advocate. These may not exist on your side of the pond (of course, I didn't know they existed on this side of the pond until a few years ago, when we ended up needing one). These are people who work with the parents of kids with special needs to help them understand the laws and rules and processes surrounding special education, and who help the parents work with the schools to help them get what their kids need from the school. A lot of special education advocates seem to be former teachers.

Good luck, Smudgie!

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I've written a book! Catherine's Pascha: A celebration of Easter in the Orthodox Church. It's a lovely book for children. Take a look!

Posts: 10273 | From: Pacific Northwest, USA | Registered: Jan 2003  |  IP: Logged
Telepath
Ship's Steamer Trunk
# 3534

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Smudgie, do you teach at a state school or an independent school? Would a change of sector be helpful?

Or maybe you could start up an independent or homeschool in a small way of business?

EA, praying for you.

Janine, good luck!

Anyhoo. Somebody recommended this agent to me, and with a heavy heart I sent her my CV earlier this week. Went trundling off to Cambridge to see her today.

A couple of days ago she sent me a job spec, which, apart from being geographically inaccessible, looked deadly dull. Still, I said it looked lovely but I wouldn't be able to commute there.

So, you understand, I went in with the frame of mind that no-one else had been able to help me, so she wouldn't be able to help me either.

In I went. The office was a beautiful room with a lot of PAPER résumés in evidence, but no sign of a computer.

She has a computer of course, but she said she preferred to look at the paper copy and make notes on it. What this means is that she doesn't feed them into an automated system which reduces you to a set of buzzwords and number of years' experience. Crikey.

She said my CV looked great, and what did I really like doing, and all that.

Well, this morning, on my way out the door, I remarked to the Telemum that my wardrobe was one of the tools of my trade. Entirely without sarcasm, the Telemum agreed. Perhaps that is why she doesn't get mad at the money-wastage... if wasted it is. I'm beginning to think it really isn't, and that this isn't just an excuse. [Paranoid]

But, you know, if I'm going to say stuff like "my wardrobe is one of the tools of my trade," I'd better take some action to back it up. Whenever I've mentioned the fashion industry to agents in the past, they've just said, "yeah, no, I don't have anything like that". And of course, fashion industry job ads don't tend to intersect with my skills.

But I thought I'd better mention it anyway.

She immediately said that she knew somebody who had been involved in the manufacture of biologically-sensitive, "smart" clothing, and that he would surely have contacts. And that there's a company that has an automated stylist much like the one I had been trying to build. [Eek!]

She also agreed that it was a great idea to pursue jobs using my specialized/rarefied technical skills, so that when it becomes mainstream, I will have loads of experience. [Eek!] Notice that she didn't just say "never heard of it" like everybody else.

She also said it was clear that I am a very creative person, so obviously the job spec she sent me earlier in the week, while within my abilities [Eek!] , would just bore me to death, so she'd look for more exciting things. [Eek!]

She also said I had "a certain star quality" and wondered why I didn't pursue a career on the stage [Big Grin] . Well, it was a nice thing to say, that's for sure.

Then she talked about the salary I was looking for. I thought "here it comes".

She said she was surprised I was asking for so little [Eek!] because on reading my CV, she would have placed me more in the range of (AMOUNT_I_WANTED_AT_START_OF_JOBHUNT_AND_THEN_SOME).

[faints dead away]

Perhaps that's why I've been having so much trouble breaking out of room 1408.

Maybe it isn't that I've been asking for bread and not getting stones, but not getting bread either.

Maybe I've been asking for stones. And God wants me to have bread, and He won't let me settle this time.

I think if anybody can help me, this woman can. She said if she reached a point where she didn't think she could help me, she'd tell me. But I hope it doesn't come to that.

This is the first time in a long, long while that I've been treated like a human being with a lot to get and a lot to give. [Tear] I could just cry.

Please, please, let this be real hope. Don't let it be false hope. Let this be the breakthrough, Lord.

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Take emptiness and lying speech far from me, and do not give me poverty or wealth. Give me a living sufficient for me.

Posts: 3509 | From: East Anglia | Registered: Nov 2002  |  IP: Logged
Zoey

Broken idealist
# 11152

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Telepath has beaten me to this (great minds think alike [Big Grin] ), but what I was wondering last night in response to your post, Smudgie, is whether there are any independent schools on the island (independent schools focussing on special educational needs, or just general independent schools) where you could see yourself fitting in and where you might be able to get a job.

It might be a non-starter for various reasons, but seemed worth mentioning as a thought.

I've got the impression in the past (might be an inaccurate impression and please do ignore or correct me if that's the case!) that what you're most disillusioned with about your current post are things like National Curriculum / headteacher's rigidity about exactly how you should be going about teaching, + excessive focus on getting children to jump through the right hoops for SATs, etc etc. Independent schools, generally being fee-paying and/or having a somewhat alternative focus to state schools, might give you more freedom and might appreciate you for how good a teacher you are and how well your approach works for the children in your care, without being bothered that your approach doesn't quite fit guideline 27b(iii) and so on.

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Pay no mind, I'm doing fine, I'm breathing on my own.

Posts: 3095 | From: the penultimate stop? | Registered: Mar 2006  |  IP: Logged
Smudgie

Ship's Barnacle
# 2716

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mountainsnowtiger, you're spot on with your assessment of what my difficulty is with my job these days. There is increasing pressure to conform to the "teaching children to jump through hoops" and "learning is about hitting targets" and "a good school is one that focuses the majority of its resources and teaching styles on getting the average children through level four so that the school moves up in the league table" and "these children need to know just how weak they are" approach to teaching and I am getting fed up with fighting battles every day of the week, even though I know the kids I teach need an advocate.

My Island location is a bad starting point in looking for other work. The idea of independant school is one I am unsure of - it was inconceivable to me for a long time and I am not sure whether it is exactly what I agree with - kids at the local one seem to be under a lot of pressure too. Tutoring would be perfect, except I am wary of doing something freelance when a steady income is a necessity rather than a luxury. I know I'm well off in many respects, but I really don't want my income to drop any lower than it is right now.

I suppose the best approach is to start touting for some after-school tutoring and see where that takes me, once my extension is built and I've somewhere to toot. (I can't go to them because of childcare for my ten-year-old). I've also asked the head of services for children with learning dificulties to keep my details on file, likewise the EAL services. The difficult thing is continuing to work with integrity in a system that's driving me bonkers (and in a school I'd be heartbroken to leave).

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Miss you, Erin.

Posts: 14382 | From: Under the duvet | Registered: Apr 2002  |  IP: Logged
Janine

The Endless Simmer
# 3337

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It seems things are bubbling along for you guys. Somewhere there's a back burner devoted to your own particular soup. May it simmer until it's done and take you by surprise by how good it is.

Interview in 90 minutes' time, few miles up Bayou Terrebonne in the little community where I grew up. Receptionist position -- which will almost definitely be too much under my pay range for me to accept, if by "receptionist" they mean "a girl who sits there, files her nails, answers the occasional phone".

They've seen the massive reams of experience in my three-page full-detail resume... surely they're calling me in because they want the Administrative Specialist, rather than Bra-Strap-Bubble-Gum Phone Babe? Yes? I hope.

Excited phone call from one of the staffing agencies yesterday, they're trying to get me an interview with a company down the other bayou -- pay at least where I have been, if not more, and with a company the agency seems excited about.

Yesterday was offered a job at what I had been making, very small company, working with the owner -- a woman in a very man-centered field -- seems like a great position, I think I'd enjoy it -- this is the lady who pulled my resume from the herd because she liked what I said about having a spotty job history because I'd been raising my family.

But she needs me because her beloved employee, to whom she owes much of her success, wants to leave the post to get out there in the world and find something else to do "before she gets too old".

So... when said employee finds the world a cold cruel place and wants to come back to the fold, will there be room for the two of us? Or will I be back out on my butt just as I was in my previous position, very similar circumstance?

So much to wrestle with... And I am blessed to be able to wrestle, since the FG has an income, and rumors of a $3 raise soon, and he's just gotten us back on his company's insurance plan (see prayer thread for my friends who are trying to manage without insurance).

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I'm a Fundagelical Evangimentalist. What are you?
Take Me Home * My Heart * An hour with Rich Mullins *

Posts: 13788 | From: Below the Bible Belt | Registered: Sep 2002  |  IP: Logged
Dormouse

Glis glis – Ship's rodent
# 5954

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Smudgie - my situation is different to yours, but having been disillusioned with teaching, for the same reasons as you, I left to work in local government. Fairly mind numbing. We then moved to France, and I have started teaching English as a foreign language. I love it - even though I'm not completely enamoured by the methods of the company, the students are great and I'm really able to use my teaching skils.

I trained as a TEFL teacher over 6 months costing just under 1,000 quid. Quite expensive, but it gave me the extra nouce, I think. Here in France the company are taking on untrained people - usually trained teachers, but not TEFL trained (although they have taken on one guy whose only qualification is that he speaks English - of a sort, he's a Kiwi [Biased] )
It may be different where you are. Certainly the south coast seemed to have a lot of language schools when I was looking, but I don't know about the IoW in particular.

It's just a thought - and the pay isn't brilliant. So it may not suit...Good luck.

And fingers crossed for all you job seekers. I think of you daily. [Votive]

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What are you doing for Lent?
40 days, 40 reflections, 40 acts of generosity. Join the #40acts challenge for #Lent and let's start a movement. www.40acts.org.uk

Posts: 3042 | From: 'twixt les Bois Noirs & Les Monts de la Madeleine | Registered: May 2004  |  IP: Logged
Curiosity killed ...

Ship's Mug
# 11770

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I am very much in the same situation as Smudgie, fed up with being part of the sausage making industry that is now the UK education system. I have already handed in my notice as SENCo as it is a paperwork and admin job and I like being hands on, but have been asked to stay on to support the new SENCo into post (complicated situation to do with another school closing due to lack of numbers). Because I know I don't have to go back into education I have already said I want to go at half term, but can see that having to be rearranged - school notice is measured in terms or halfterms, ordinary jobs notice is often a month. The problem is that around some social life, a child going off to uni next weekend and a post that I worked 60-70 hour weeks on last year I haven't had much time to job hunt. Teaching someone else the post actually adds to the workload, not reduces it.

The school would willing have me stay, go back into Science teaching (secondary) and end up as a full time teacher, but that really is the sausage making machine. My role for the past 10 years has been working with those kids being spat out by the machine and I hated having to do the classroom control bit for the kids I normally work with trying to support them in mainstream. Did it, and am still talking to most of them, but it's not something I want to be part of.

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Mugs - Keep the Ship afloat

Posts: 13794 | From: outiside the outer ring road | Registered: Aug 2006  |  IP: Logged
Carys

Ship's Celticist
# 78

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Didn't get the job for which I was interviewed last week and didn't even making it to the testing stage of the jobs I really want. I actually felt vaguely positive after the party conference but getting back to those three letters really got me down. I just can't see myself ever getting a better job than my current one (which is 50-75% tedious admin)

Carys

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O Lord, you have searched me and know me
You know when I sit and when I rise

Posts: 6896 | From: Bryste mwy na thebyg | Registered: May 2001  |  IP: Logged
Telepath
Ship's Steamer Trunk
# 3534

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Carys, I'm so sorry. I pray that a way will open for you.

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Take emptiness and lying speech far from me, and do not give me poverty or wealth. Give me a living sufficient for me.

Posts: 3509 | From: East Anglia | Registered: Nov 2002  |  IP: Logged
Janine

The Endless Simmer
# 3337

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Just got a call from Small Business Owner Lady Who Likes My Family-First Attitude. (Or at least what she perceived that way due to the work-gaps explanation I put in my resume).

She has one other potential candidate besides me, who needs a decision so she can make a move, or not, on one of her other prospects.

Well, well, well. Not that she's trying to pressure me or anything.

Checked around, and the other possibilities I have "cooking" have either resolved by this morning in favor of other candidates, or else it's still too soon for anything to have come out of the pipeline.

I'm not sure why I'm so hesitant. It should be a great position... It's just that factor that I would be there replacing a good friend and longtime employee who saved Owner-Boss in a bad transitional time a few years ago. Owner-Boss will miss the friend, I am not the friend, and the friend may want to come back.

Now where have I heard that scenario before?

*Sigh*

If I take the job right now, there are a couple others that might suit me even better and pay a little more, still "cooking". If I accept one of them, in another week or two, I then leave Ms. Boss-Owner in the lurch -- or at least, while her friend-employee is still there, she won't be in the lurch yet -- but it still makes me look bad.

If I take the job, stay with it, and a year from now the friend-employee is tired of working "out there in the world" and wants to come back -- who says there'll be room for me, then?

I ain't gonna starve either way. This rough decision is solely so rough at this time because I want to preserve my job-related reputation. I hate the idea of making a commitment to this employer, then having three offers, a plea and a demand drop in my lap from other employers as soon as I accept (and you know it's always that way).

Then I'd be put in the position of loyally sticking to my fresh commitment to LadyBossOwner, despite the higher pay/better perks with someone else -- or running off to the someone else, becoming a sucky deal-breaker in the BossLady's eyes.

Grrr.

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I'm a Fundagelical Evangimentalist. What are you?
Take Me Home * My Heart * An hour with Rich Mullins *

Posts: 13788 | From: Below the Bible Belt | Registered: Sep 2002  |  IP: Logged
Beautiful Dreamer
Shipmate
# 10880

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It has been brought to my attention that my mental health may be compromised, and that I should not search for a job as aggressively in favor of spending the time 'working on getting better'. I will admit that the rejection is really getting to me, but no more than rejection coming from other areas in life. In October I have an appointment with another psychiatrist, and at that time I will ask for that doctor's stance on government disability benefits (my current shrink will not support me for disability benefits, even though my condition is considered a disability by the government). I think I am in an okay position to work right now, but that can and often will change at any time. So I will continue to look, but not as aggressively, and will hope and pray that my new doctor is more inclined to support me for benefits.

Normally my condition is not very severe, but lately it has really flared up, enough to cause major problems in my relationships. I can look back on my life thus far and see that it has caused problems with work as well. It is normally manageable, but the very nature of bipolar disorder indicates that medicine and treatment can only do so much. I just know I would feel so much better about myself if I had a job. I am sure I am not alone in this.

[ 18. September 2007, 00:56: Message edited by: Beautiful_Dreamer ]

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More where that came from
Now go away, or I shall taunt you a second time!

Posts: 6028 | From: Outside Atlanta, GA | Registered: Jan 2006  |  IP: Logged
Janine

The Endless Simmer
# 3337

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I would feel better about you if you had a job, too. [Biased]

Heh. Seriously, though, whose mental health-outlook-function is not improved by capturing a job and working it well?

I accepted the job I was offered. I go in to the state-run office that helps people find work. (I posted about that a little while back... the place where I knew how to run the computer and the employee there did not -- the place where they handed me a lovely folder with a sheet of suggestions to help me get a job. You know, like washing my hair and brushing my teeth.)

There, I will prove I am an American citizen, and that my driver's license photo really is me, and that I have an Authentic Social Security number. Then, they will list me in some special program, having been Out Of Work, and my new employer will be given $1500 to train me.

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I'm a Fundagelical Evangimentalist. What are you?
Take Me Home * My Heart * An hour with Rich Mullins *

Posts: 13788 | From: Below the Bible Belt | Registered: Sep 2002  |  IP: Logged
Geneviève

Mother-Hatting Cat Lover
# 9098

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From your avatar, Janine, you are an absolute expert at hair styling! [Razz]

And sometimes the government's absurdities make me want to laugh and cry at the same time. Nice to know that training you will help someone make money, right?!

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"Ineffable" defined: "I cannot and will not be effed with." (Courtesy of CCTooSweet in Running the Books)

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Carys

Ship's Celticist
# 78

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quote:
Originally posted by Beautiful_Dreamer:
It has been brought to my attention that my mental health may be compromised, and that I should not search for a job as aggressively in favor of spending the time 'working on getting better'. I will admit that the rejection is really getting to me, but no more than rejection coming from other areas in life.

Job-seeking is not conducive to good mental health and bad mental health does not aid job-seeking. Being depressed makes it hard to sell oneself (which is essential for getting jobs) and not getting jobs is as you say rejection and thus fuels ones already poor self image. If you're out of work, then that can be depressing in and of itself.

Carys (who has just started on anti-depressants)

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O Lord, you have searched me and know me
You know when I sit and when I rise

Posts: 6896 | From: Bryste mwy na thebyg | Registered: May 2001  |  IP: Logged
Off Centre View
Shipmate
# 4254

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Applied for another job recently (heck, been applying for a tonne of them). One application was for a researcher position for a group in Bloomsbury in London.

After sending them my CV, they said that they wanted to interview me, suggesting two days that were good. I emailed them back, suggesting the afternoon on the first day and then asked what the best route to the interview place was by public transport, which is a perfectly sensible question (other interviews I've been asked to have been happy to give me directions).

Today, I got an incredibly snotty email reply saying basically that they were doubting my abilities as a researcher if I couldn't find my way to their office myself through various online search maps like streetmap.com and similar sites (after this strange tirade, they then told me the nearest tube station). The tone of the email was incredibly rude, and left me in doubt as to how they treated their employees if that was how they treated prospective workers there (their website even described their offices as not just a place of work but also a "home"). For now, I sent them a pleasant email reply that ended with "Kind regards, " as I would not lower myself to such an obnoxious level.

I am now in two minds as to whether I want a job with that company, but I may use the interview as good experience. My plan is to begin the interview by bringing a copy of the incredibly rude email and asking them if that's how they treat all of their prospective employees.

What do others hear think? Is that a good decision? Maybe I should start a hell thread on this.

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Looking for Authenticity in the Corporate Abyss? Change Your Self, Change Your Workplace, Change Your World: www.corporateabyss.com

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Gill H

Shipmate
# 68

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Ooh yes! Do it and tell us how it went.

How incredibly rude of them. I work in an office in central London and we convene panels of visitors from all over the country. I always try to remember that many are visiting London for the first time, and give them as much info as possible on how to get to us. I know they are intelligent adults and perfectly capable of using the internet - but surely it's common courtesy to make your visitors feel comfortable?

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*sigh* We can’t all be Alan Cresswell.

- Lyda Rose

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Carys

Ship's Celticist
# 78

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Asking the company seems a perfectly sensible way of finding out the information. Online transport thingies are ok but IME they're not brilliant with busses and so asking people who might know is probably a better approach to the problem. Even with trains there can be little bits of knowledge that journey planners don't tell you. For example if you're travelling on the central line and want to get to Paddington, it actually makes sense to change at Lancaster Gate and walk rather than continue to Notting Hill Gate and go back up the Circle/District line. But I'm not sure online thingies would give that result.

Carys

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O Lord, you have searched me and know me
You know when I sit and when I rise

Posts: 6896 | From: Bryste mwy na thebyg | Registered: May 2001  |  IP: Logged
Jahlove
Tied to the mast
# 10290

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Hello all, I've not posted on this thread before (though have followed some of it) but I've recently graduated (mature student) and I'm now looking for work (have over 20 years work experience). I have applied for several positions and had interviews but no luck so far with being offered anything. My most recent application is for a lowly position in the Civil Service, for which I have a *selection test*, i.e. numeracy and literacy, coming up next Tuesday.

They sent an *example* of these tests in their letter confirming the date and time and to be quite honest, they would be an insult to the intelligence of a 10 year-old. However, that is not my plea. Rather, should this, or any other interview go further, has anyone got good ideas for answers to the questions that seem always to be asked these days, viz.

1. What are your strengths and weaknesses? (particularly re weaknesses that don't sound too bad or which can be interpreted as a *plus* to the employer, e.g. *I'm a workaholic*)

2. Why do you want this job? (um, derrr, apart from the income, something that sounds plausible and not too sucky )

3. Why should we employ you? (um, dunno, show me the other candidates' resumes and I'll tell you - a bit too *bolshie* maybe)

I am so fed up of these stupid *psychometric and interview games* - we are only talking about a desk-jockey, just above minimum wage, job here anyway. Any tips on answers to the above three questions would be most gratefully received.

Having just re-read this post, I do realize I sound pissed-off and cynical - well maybe - but I do believe in the Work-Dignity thing and am well able to behave in a fair, detached, professional manner.

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“Sing like no one's listening, love like you've never been hurt, dance like nobody's watching, and live like its heaven on earth.” - Mark Twain

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Geneviève

Mother-Hatting Cat Lover
# 9098

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For weaknesses (and I hate these questions too), I sometimes say that I am a perfectionist--which is true, and can be a problem, but which employers often think is a good thing. I say it in terms of myself, not others.

for why you'd want a not-very-good job, hmm.
Let's see, how about: this will be a good experience or "I'm just coming back into the workforce and this will be a good experience" (both rather suck-up answers but what do they expect?)

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"Ineffable" defined: "I cannot and will not be effed with." (Courtesy of CCTooSweet in Running the Books)

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Jen.

Godless Liberal
# 3131

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The most important thing in the 'weakness' question is show how you overcome it. Its all about turning your negatives into positives.

as an example, I can be oversensitive but this weakness has helped me (in my current job) to understand the sensitivities of others in stressful situations.

JahLove - as a recent graduate - go see your careers service. they should have a book called 'great answers to tough interview questions'. It covers the mindset of some of the questions listed above.

Jenny

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Was Jenny Ann, but fancied being more minimal.

Posts: 5318 | From: Manchester, England | Registered: Aug 2002  |  IP: Logged
la vie en rouge
Parisienne
# 10688

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Also with your strengths and weaknesses I think it can be worth asking other people who know you well to help you out (only ask your GOOD friends about the weaknesses [Biased] You're asking for help, not a mauling. Asking them to tell you the good things about you can be fun though)

Other people often see things in you that you might not notice. Sometimes you're really good at something, but it hasn't occurred to you that other people aren't, because it's so obvious to you.

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Rent my holiday home in the South of France

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Jengie jon

Semper Reformanda
# 273

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why you want a sucky job story:

In my work we employ a graduate as a receptionist. This is hugely underemployment of said person. However said person is an artist, does not want a stretching job but something that gives them contact with people and entertained while bringing in some money and not stressing or tiring them out. This is so that they can spend time on their art work in evenings and such.

The person had to persuade her interviewers that she was speaking the truth. Receptionist post though fairly menial is one that needs to be learnt and we had failed to keep the previous two appointments.

Jengie

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"To violate a persons ability to distinguish fact from fantasy is the epistemological equivalent of rape." Noretta Koertge

Back to my blog

Posts: 20894 | From: city of steel, butterflies and rainbows | Registered: May 2001  |  IP: Logged
Jahlove
Tied to the mast
# 10290

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Thank you all very much for the responses.

DaisyM - it's a *poor* job in the over-all scheme of things vis-a-vis employment in the country as a whole - it this neck of the woods, it would be considered pretty good - not kidding.

JennyAnn - yes, I shall go and look that up thanks

lady in red - good idea - especially the caveat about Good Friends Only - I remember asking someone about weaknesses once in relation to another kind of exercise and ended up feeling like a tapeworm's poor relation.

Jengie, that's fair enough - however, this particular position, for all it's poorly paid, is actually quite a responsible one - and it's the same story right across our economically depressed county.

Thanks for the ideas and support - I guess we've all been there and it's not easy, is it, to retain your confidence in the face of rejection after rejection.

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“Sing like no one's listening, love like you've never been hurt, dance like nobody's watching, and live like its heaven on earth.” - Mark Twain

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Telepath
Ship's Steamer Trunk
# 3534

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I pray for your healing, Beautiful_Dreamer. Constant rejection will give anybody's morale a bashing. I see that you recognize that the rejection, though it's not doing you any good per se, is part of a process that you think will be good for you when it ends in success, which is why you want to keep going. So I pray for your wisdom and that you'll be enabled to do whatever is best for you right now, even if that means taking a step back for a while.

I pray for you, Carys. You're not having fun.

Off Centre View, I think that if you question your prospective employers about that email, you will probably not get the job. Therefore, I say go for it!

Anyway, why is asking them for directions a less valid form of research than using the internet? Duh. Maybe there's some quirk about their location that the internet won't tell you! So of course you should've asked!

Maybe the author of the snotty email is the person you're being recruited to replace!

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Take emptiness and lying speech far from me, and do not give me poverty or wealth. Give me a living sufficient for me.

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Ethne Alba
Shipmate
# 5804

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Carys....here's hoping something unexpectedly lovely this weekend...
Posts: 3126 | Registered: Apr 2004  |  IP: Logged
Beautiful Dreamer
Shipmate
# 10880

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I have an interview for a job about an hour away on Wednesday. I have come to accept that I am going to have a drive regardless of where I work, since I live about 40 min from the city.

I have been told by some people that I don't need to be working right now in favor of spending the time getting better, but I don't know what else to do. The money is such a big worry and I have worked since I was 15, so not having a job really does weigh on my self-esteem. In the mean time, I will continue to look for a job, but when I go to a new doctor in October I am going to ask him if he will recommend me for disability. I don't like to think of myself as having a disability, but if that is the only way I can have an income, then I will have to live with it.

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More where that came from
Now go away, or I shall taunt you a second time!

Posts: 6028 | From: Outside Atlanta, GA | Registered: Jan 2006  |  IP: Logged
Telepath
Ship's Steamer Trunk
# 3534

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I don't have the same issues as you do, and obviously IANAD... but if you want a job that much, and can put up with being smashed by rejection over and over again as an acceptable cost of looking...

In your position I would find the prospect of denying my ability to work (especially when I felt capable of working) as unpalatable as the prospect of continuing the jobhunt. I would wonder how giving up the search was supposed to make me any healthier than continuing it.

But of course, I'm not in your position and I don't know all about your situation, and I certainly am not medically qualified, so please don't think I'm trying to give you advice. I'm only saying I think I understand your point of view and that I think it makes sense.

You are the one who knows what you can cope with, and you also know when you are or aren't kidding yourself about what you can cope with. No matter how reasonable and rational I am about it, it still feels like I'm volunteering to get beaten up several times a day. If my mental equilibrium were any more fragile than it is now, I might think more seriously about resisting the temptation to keep trying. YMMV.

Good luck with the decision.

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Take emptiness and lying speech far from me, and do not give me poverty or wealth. Give me a living sufficient for me.

Posts: 3509 | From: East Anglia | Registered: Nov 2002  |  IP: Logged
neandergirl

Opposing the thumb
# 8916

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[Votive] For all those looking, especially for strength in dealing with the feelings of rejection and the wherewithal to 'get back up again'.

OCV, I'd have though going to the best source (the company) for directions showed sound research skills but ... what do I know?

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Never will I leave you; never will I forsake you. Hebrews 13:5 NIV
We come from love, we return to love, and all around is love.
Lord, ease our burdens, give us peace and enable us to do your work. Tree Bee

Posts: 2579 | From: 21218 | Registered: Dec 2004  |  IP: Logged
Off Centre View
Shipmate
# 4254

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I went to an evening church service yesterday, and at that a couple of people prayed for me about my job situation, they knew that I was concerned about that interview on thursday. After they prayed for me, one of the people said that they saw a time of blessing for me soon in the future and I felt a lot of peace over my near future.

Anyway, after I got back from church, I had an email (polite and sent on a sunday afternoon) basically saying that my interview on thursday was cancelled (they had found the "perfect candidate" apparently) but that I could apply for an internship with their organisation (at a much lower wage for three months, about £200 per week in London). Having done a prior internship (working for an MP), I now want a full job and not just a low-paid thing, so I'm not interested in just an internship.

Having had such doubts, I now see the cancellation of that interview as an answer to prayer (in a very strange way). I now have time to work on improving myself and I know that I'll be working for most of my life, so I can now do a lot of things I'd like to try, such as improving my fitness and maybe taking up the guitar. I'm going to continue applying for jobs and I believe that the right one is just around the corner.

I don't know if this is encouraging to anyone, but I now feel that I'm going to get the right job at the right time. I'd still appreciate ongoing prayer and any more guidance that people have to share.

Best wishes,
OCV

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Looking for Authenticity in the Corporate Abyss? Change Your Self, Change Your Workplace, Change Your World: www.corporateabyss.com

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Geneviève

Mother-Hatting Cat Lover
# 9098

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OCV,
I firmly believe that a "door closing" can be an answer to prayer. I have not always recognized that truth when a seemingly attractive door slammed shut, but time has borne it out.
You have--or at the least very definitely are working on--a very positive attitude. Blessings as you continue to search, and meanwhile wisely are allowing yourself some fun.

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"Ineffable" defined: "I cannot and will not be effed with." (Courtesy of CCTooSweet in Running the Books)

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Beautiful Dreamer
Shipmate
# 10880

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I have had it where a door closing was definitely an answer to prayer. I remember once I kept praying for God's will to be done with my job, and I got fired from that job. Looking back, it is a good thing God did not give me the promotion I had previously prayed for because the job took up so much of my time I barely had time for a life. So it was really a blessing that I got fired.

I have two job interviews this week. I also just found out that I have to have my gallbladder out, so it is probably just as well that I do not have a job at the moment.

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More where that came from
Now go away, or I shall taunt you a second time!

Posts: 6028 | From: Outside Atlanta, GA | Registered: Jan 2006  |  IP: Logged
Geneviève

Mother-Hatting Cat Lover
# 9098

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a short follow-up to my thoughts for OCV:
Of course, I should have added that IME, when a slammed door has just flattened me, it has not felt at all encouraging for some "helpful" person to immediately announce to me that closed doors are a sign from God. At that point I wanted to rip the person's throat out.
In other words, I wasn't trying to be patronizing, but sharing from my experience.

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"Ineffable" defined: "I cannot and will not be effed with." (Courtesy of CCTooSweet in Running the Books)

Posts: 4336 | From: Eastern US | Registered: Feb 2005  |  IP: Logged
Telepath
Ship's Steamer Trunk
# 3534

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Just had an interview at a seemingly lovely place where I would get to use all my talents, and they would at least pay the minimum.

However, tomorrow I have a second interview with the place I went to on Monday. They do not pay enough and if I want what I would consider an adequate amount, I will have to negotiate for more than the highest advertised range.

I would appreciate prayers for wisdom as to whether or not I should try to negotiate. They themselves said they've been looking for a long time and are eager to close the deal ASAP. This means I have a realistic chance of being offered the job almost on the spot tomorrow. Therefore, I don't want to blow it, but I also don't want to be stewing with resentment over a few thousand pounds.

Apparently most of the other people they've interviewed have come through agencies, so at worst I could even argue they're saving on fees because I'm representing myself. Well, not only that but the job appears to be quite junior for me and I could offer them a great deal of added value very quickly, over and above what's in the job description.

So I would reiterate my prayers that I get something blissfully great, at a salary I would consider adequate, by close of business on Friday! (Graduation is Saturday.)

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Take emptiness and lying speech far from me, and do not give me poverty or wealth. Give me a living sufficient for me.

Posts: 3509 | From: East Anglia | Registered: Nov 2002  |  IP: Logged
Wet Kipper
Circus Runaway
# 1654

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well, I sent my CV to a second, more local agency yesterday, and they called me back within 2 minutes. They'll be offering my CV to some of their "usual suspects" to see if they've got, or about to have any openings for someone like me.

And to make the process more comfortable, my redundancy pay came in yesterday as well [Yipee]

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- insert randomly chosen, potentially Deep and Meaningful™ song lyrics here -

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Gwai
Shipmate
# 11076

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And think of it this way, Telepath, even if they do end up paying you less than you deserve, it's always easier to get a job when you have a job!

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A master of men was the Goodly Fere,
A mate of the wind and sea.
If they think they ha’ slain our Goodly Fere
They are fools eternally.


Posts: 11914 | From: Chicago | Registered: Feb 2006  |  IP: Logged
Telepath
Ship's Steamer Trunk
# 3534

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I've never found that true. All my major job searches have only succeeded when I was not working full-time. It's extremely difficult to look for work when your current employer is entertaining the reasonable expectation that you'll be doing work for them.

I got my last job on the basis that I'd only be doing it for a short time. I was stuck there for six years, with a consequent devastating effect on my career and finances.

Not to mention the black mark on my work record if I left them before I'd been working there at least a year.

I'm in my late 30s, paid thousands and thousands of pounds for my MSc which I'm still paying off... and have NEVER been able to earn enough money to move out of the family home. So, concerns about my finances are serious.

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Take emptiness and lying speech far from me, and do not give me poverty or wealth. Give me a living sufficient for me.

Posts: 3509 | From: East Anglia | Registered: Nov 2002  |  IP: Logged
Sandemaniac
Shipmate
# 12829

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I guess it's about time I stuck my nose in here... Beware, a long whinge follows, so you are welcome to get bored and read something else before you get to the end! [Snore]

I feel a bit guilty actually, as a lot of people are far worse off than I am. I'm in a job, it pays well (too well, in fact - may get to that later), and I'm secure in it at least until the end of March. And - finally, after years of not seeming very interested - my boss does seem to be taking an interest in what I do, and making me feel part of the group, rather than a little bit of crud hanging off the back.

However I've been in the one job eight and a half years now. There's no prospect of advancement and frankly I feel it's time for something new, and learn new skills.

The problem I have is what to do. I've a degree in Biochemistry, and work in a lab. Thus far so good. But I've reached a point where all the jobs in things I find interesting are way below what I could take and afford to live where I do now. And I mean way below. It seems I'm left with science, which sooner or later will leave me in exactly the same position as I am now - stuck at the top of my payband and, more importantly, unable to get a job that actually interests me.

I've had a number of interviews where I thought I could do the job, and have come to the conclusion that I really must limit myself to jobs I really want, where I can genuinely sound enthusiastic rather than (as last week) having to try to sound interested as I was bored titless by tales of a job even duller than the job description initially suggested.

Herein lies the problem. I have only one idea of what I want to do, and it's a tiny field, very hard to get into and the one place that does it where I live - and I've just got a lease on a new flat - is dying on its backside. Other than that, I've seen three jobs in nearly two years of looking that have made me think "Oooh, I'd like to do that!" I had interviews for two, second in one to someone with more relevant skills and second in the other to someone equally skilled but cheaper...

I'm far too long out of University for my old careers services to be interested in helping me (I've checked) and I'm not eligible for help from careers here because I'm not Contract Research Staff. Everything I have been able to get has revolved around my degree - which points in directions I've become bored and stale with. I've had nothing that interests me from agencies, and I've had university departments pulling the classic trick (supposed to be agency territory) of advertising one job, and telling you it is something entirely different at interview. Funnily enough, it's always something you'd never have applied for if you'd known...
[Help]

On a regular basis, particularly after another crappy interview for a job I'd loathe, I despair of finding a me-shaped hole. I have no idea whether anyone has any ideas where I might get help, or anything like that, but I do feel better for having got that lot off my chest!

And good luck to everyone else who really needs a job! [Votive]

AG

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"It becomes soon pleasantly apparent that change-ringing is by no means merely an excuse for beer" Charles Dickens gets it wrong, 1869

Posts: 3574 | From: The wardrobe of my soul | Registered: Jul 2007  |  IP: Logged
Off Centre View
Shipmate
# 4254

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quote:
Originally posted by DaisyM:
a short follow-up to my thoughts for OCV:
Of course, I should have added that IME, when a slammed door has just flattened me, it has not felt at all encouraging for some "helpful" person to immediately announce to me that closed doors are a sign from God. At that point I wanted to rip the person's throat out.
In other words, I wasn't trying to be patronizing, but sharing from my experience.

Dear DaisyM,

Thank you for your comments, don't worry: I did not think that you were being patronizing, just that you were being honest and open.

The fact that the email cancelling the interview came just after a church service where people had prayed for me was very interesting. One of the biggest things I'm dealing with at the moment is a feeling of powerlessness, and the search for a job is part of this. After chatting with my priest last week, I believe that in times like this I just have to trust in God's power and recognise my own weakness at this time. It's not an easy decision, and far from a glib one, but I just have to keep applying and keep going forward. I know that I could go out and get 'any' job, but I want to get a job I'm aiming for even if it takes time to get there.

Peace to all others applying for jobs, I'm going to keep going.

Off Centre View

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Looking for Authenticity in the Corporate Abyss? Change Your Self, Change Your Workplace, Change Your World: www.corporateabyss.com

Posts: 1685 | From: wherever I may wander | Registered: Mar 2003  |  IP: Logged
Beautiful Dreamer
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# 10880

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I feel like I am hitting a brick wall. I keep doing everything I can think of to get a job, getting interviews, doing well, revamping my resume, etc., and I don't seem to be getting anywhere. I wonder if it is even God's will for me to *have* a job right now. Some people have suggested to me that I hold off looking for a job for now, but I don't really have any other choice. I do have some unresolved health issues, so maybe that should be my focus, but I really cannot afford to not have a job for much longer. I am going to ask my new psychiatrist if I can get disability payments when I see him in three weeks, but even that would take some time.

I struggle with resentment toward other people who seem to have it a lot easier than I do, particularly those I know who do not have degrees (I have one), but still got their job handed to them without much effort on their part. I really should not feel this way. I pray for help with this. It is just hard to focus on things when you have unresolved health issues, but I need to work to be able to resolve some of those issues. I hope this makes sense.

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More where that came from
Now go away, or I shall taunt you a second time!

Posts: 6028 | From: Outside Atlanta, GA | Registered: Jan 2006  |  IP: Logged



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