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Source: (consider it)
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Thread: Purgatory: Mormons Trying to Go Legit
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Rossweisse
High Church Valkyrie
# 2349
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Pheonix:
Ok on another tack.. You mentioned that for the mormons on mission (and I take it you mean those that do 2 years at 19 or so) that they are told it is ok to lie because of the milk before meat ideas that they have...
Do they actually deliberately lie about what they believe or are they genuinely unsure themselves?....
Let me put it this way: I have been lied to by Mormon missionaries on points of doctrine and ritual. Either they did it deliberately, in the spirit of "milk before meat" or, more cynically, "the end justifies the means," or they were sent out to make converts while themselves in a shocking state of ignorance.
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I'm not dead yet.
Posts: 15117 | From: Valhalla | Registered: Feb 2002
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Siegfried
Ship's ferret
# 29
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Rossweisse:
quote:
Originally posted by Pheonix:
Ok on another tack.. You mentioned that for the mormons on mission (and I take it you mean those that do 2 years at 19 or so) that they are told it is ok to lie because of the milk before meat ideas that they have...
Do they actually deliberately lie about what they believe or are they genuinely unsure themselves?....
Let me put it this way: I have been lied to by Mormon missionaries on points of doctrine and ritual. Either they did it deliberately, in the spirit of "milk before meat" or, more cynically, "the end justifies the means," or they were sent out to make converts while themselves in a shocking state of ignorance.
So, you're making broad statements about a very large group based on a person experience with only, what, maybe half a dozen? a dozen at most?
And assuming the worst about them?
Sieg
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Siegfried
Life is just a bowl of cherries!
Posts: 5592 | From: Tallahassee, FL USA | Registered: May 2001
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Rossweisse
High Church Valkyrie
# 2349
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Siegfried:
So, you're making broad statements about a very large group based on a person experience with only, what, maybe half a dozen? a dozen at most? And assuming the worst about them?
No, I used to have quite a lot of discussions with Mormons on an online service, and this was a consistent tendency with them as well as the face-to-face chaps. So I'm making statements based on personal experience with well over 100 Mormons. And I assume they're doing it either out of ignorance or because they truly believe It's For Our Own Good.
![[Angel]](graemlins/angel.gif)
(So, you hear anything from Brunnhilde lately? She doesn't come around the Valkyrie rock much anymore...)
![[Wink]](wink.gif)
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I'm not dead yet.
Posts: 15117 | From: Valhalla | Registered: Feb 2002
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doctor-frog
small and green
# 2860
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Rossweisse:
Either they did it deliberately, in the spirit of "milk before meat" or, more cynically, "the end justifies the means," or they were sent out to make converts while themselves in a shocking state of ignorance.
I'm pretty sure that in the lion's share of cases, it's the last of these options.
Send out 19-year-old kids with very little formal theological background to discuss a fairly focussed "cover-the-skeletal-basics" plan of mission statement, and that's just what you get: an enthusiastic worker who isn't always going to be prepared for the tougher questions.
Often enough I've seen instances of this for orthodox Christian youth on mission trips and projects as well.
Posts: 981 | From: UK | Registered: May 2002
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Sauerkraut
Shipmate
# 3112
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Posted
quote:
Either they did it deliberately, in the spirit of "milk before meat" or, more cynically, "the end justifies the means," or they were sent out to make converts while themselves in a shocking state of ignorance.
I have it on very good authority that it is actually the former. They are taught to lie if it will get the person in the door. (The authority? A high priest in the Mormon church.)
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We want not an amalgam or compromise, but both things at the top of their energy; love and wrath both burning. Christianity got over the difficulty of combining furious opposites, by keeping them both, and keeping them both furious.--G.K. Chesterton
Posts: 196 | From: The middle of the US | Registered: Jul 2002
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Pheonix
Twisted fire starter
# 2782
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Posted
Ok. Also sendign 19 year old men out as missionaries... To be honest at that age we (men) generalyl aren't that mature, and there is tendency to exaggerate or gloss over uncomfortable points, that they themselves may not believe or understand. Also I wonder how many of them go out not really wanting to do it, but are scared of being chucked out of church or more if they don't...
If it is that 'the end justifies the means' then I feel pity for a church that can't let the facts stand for themselves and has to resort to lies and manipulation. If they were sure what they believed made sense then why lie????
Pheo
Posts: 2384 | From: on the move. | Registered: May 2002
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Barmint
Shipmate
# 3174
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Posted
quote:
Rossweise wrote:
Emma is also famed for having picked up and moved the famous wooden box containing the famous "golden tablets" from which Smith allegedly "translated" the Book of Mormon. Given the weight of gold, it's been noted that Emma must have had a physique to make Schwartzenegger look wimpy; the box would have had to weigh hundreds of pounds!
I haven't been able to verify your account of Emma and the plates (do your histories provide a citation?), but I did find this:
quote:
In an interview with her sons a few months before she died, Emma bore testimony: "My belief is that the Book of Mormon is of divine authenticity. I have not the slightest doubt of it. … Though I was an active participant in the scenes that transpired, and was present during the translation of the plates … and had cognizance of things as they transpired, it is marvelous to me, ‘a marvel and a wonder,’ as much as to anyone else."
Describing her experience, she said: "The plates often lay on the table without any attempt at concealment, wrapped in a small linen tablecloth which I had given him [Joseph] to fold them in. I once felt the plates as they lay on the table, tracing their outline and shape. They seemed to be pliable like thick paper, and would rustle with a metallic sound when the edges were moved by the thumb, as one does sometimes thumb the edges of a book."
quote:
texas.veggie wrote:
are you sure that Emma herself was involved [with the RLDS church]? I don't know about whether she joined the Methodists; but my understanding was that she did remain strangely quiet about the LDS after his death, and apparently wanted to put the whole thing behind her.
quote:
I know Mormonism to be the truth; and believe the church to have been established by divine direction. - Emma Smith Bidamon, 1879
Both quotes are from an interesting article I found, originally published in an LDS church magazine and now available online. It's a biographical sketch of Emma by one of her descendants:
http://library.lds.org/library/lpext.dll/ArchMagazines/Ensign/1992.htm/ensign%20august%201992%20.htm/my%20greatgreatgrandmother%20emma%20hale%20smith.htm
That article in turn is quoting from a document: Emma Smith’s Last Testimony, Feb. 1879, Community of Christ (former RLDS) church archives.
Hope this was helpful. ![[Smile]](smile.gif)
Posts: 78 | From: New York | Registered: Aug 2002
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Barmint
Shipmate
# 3174
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Posted
quote:
Pheonix wrote:
I feel pity for a church that can't let the facts stand for themselves and has to resort to lies and manipulation.
I do, too - glad I don't belong to a church like that!
I can tell you from my personal experience, I never lied to anyone when I was a missionary, nor did anyone ever ask me to lie. I just taught the gospel of Jesus Christ to the best of my ability, and God took care of the rest.
Posts: 78 | From: New York | Registered: Aug 2002
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Rossweisse
High Church Valkyrie
# 2349
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Barmint:
I can tell you from my personal experience, I never lied to anyone when I was a missionary, nor did anyone ever ask me to lie. I just taught the gospel of Jesus Christ to the best of my ability, and God took care of the rest.
Right. "We're Christians, just like you!" (Lie #1, and a monstrous one it is.)
Both histories mention the lifting-and-dusting routine with the box of "golden tablets."
For a woman who suffered so much from her husband's blatant philandering and countless other sins, Emma remained loyal to him, as abused women often do even today. I don't understand why women put up with such wickedness, but there you are.
I've already said, more than once, that she supported her boys in the RLDS when the goatish Brigham decided he'd like the perks of a prophet and broke Smith's will. I don't think you can say with any certainty that she actually believed that stuff, since she did definitely return to Christianity after his death. But if it makes you feel better, go ahead!
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I'm not dead yet.
Posts: 15117 | From: Valhalla | Registered: Feb 2002
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Nightlamp
Shipmate
# 266
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Posted
I have had a swift glance at the websites about emma and they seem to divide into two camps yes she did become a methodist and no she remained a Mormon (or RLDS). One rather unconvincing last will and testamant of Emma smith (it seems to contradict well known historical events but I ain't an expert) appeared on a number of web sites.
The most objective one (sorry i didn't keep the url and I can't be bothered to look through them all again)said she attended the Methodist after marrying Bidamon but whether she became a formal member is uncertain.
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I don't know what you are talking about so it couldn't have been that important- Nightlamp
Posts: 8442 | From: Midlands | Registered: May 2001
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duchess
Ship's Blue Blooded Lady
# 2764
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Posted
"In bearing testimony of Jesus Christ, President Hinckley spoke of those outside the Church who say Latter-day Saints 'do not believe in the traditional Christ.' 'No, I don't. The traditional Christ of whom they speak is not the Christ of whom I speak. For the Christ of whom I speak has been revealed in this the Dispensation of the Fullness of Times. He together with His Father, appeared to the boy Joseph Smith in the year 1820, and when Joseph left the grove that day, he knew more of the nature of God than all the learned ministers of the gospel of the ages.'" (LDS Church News Week ending June 20, 1998, p.7 )
To me, he is saying you believe in different Christ than everyone else outside the Mormon faith and that Joseph Smith knew more about God than anybody else who is a "Man of the Cloth". What do you think Hinkley is saying here, Barmit...your thoughts?
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♬♭ We're setting sail to the place on the map from which nobody has ever returned ♫♪♮
Ship of Fools-World Party
Posts: 11197 | From: Do you know the way? | Registered: May 2002
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duchess
Ship's Blue Blooded Lady
# 2764
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Posted
Every website out there for ex-Mormons has this quote..I am assuming it is true, albeit I can verify it for myself without paying for a subscription to the LDS News. Perhaps you could also please verify if this quote is true, Barmit? Thanks.
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♬♭ We're setting sail to the place on the map from which nobody has ever returned ♫♪♮
Ship of Fools-World Party
Posts: 11197 | From: Do you know the way? | Registered: May 2002
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Rossweisse
High Church Valkyrie
# 2349
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by duchess:
"In bearing testimony of Jesus Christ, President Hinckley spoke of those outside the Church who say Latter-day Saints 'do not believe in the traditional Christ.' 'No, I don't. The traditional Christ of whom they speak is not the Christ of whom I speak...." To me, he is saying you believe in different Christ than everyone else outside the Mormon faith and that Joseph Smith knew more about God than anybody else who is a "Man of the Cloth". What do you think Hinkley is saying here, Barmit...your thoughts?
Betcha Barmy says it's "just Hinckley's personal opinion"!
![[Devil]](graemlins/devil.gif)
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I'm not dead yet.
Posts: 15117 | From: Valhalla | Registered: Feb 2002
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Augustine the Aleut
Shipmate
# 1472
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Posted
I fear that I must confess that I was most mischievous with my last encounter with two young Mormon missionaries from the southwestern US.
I had somewhere (I wish I had kept the reference) that there was a teaching that the US Constitution was divinely inspired, or partook of inspiration. They admitted that there was a teaching to this effect and I kept them there for an hour trying to lead them to the conclusion tha this was an error, and that it was the Canadian Constitution which was superior, on the grounds that we had a sacramentally-anointed head of state while the US President benefitted by no such rite. We spent much time searching through First Samuel on this: they must have had an interesting report to the Mission supervisor.... they never did come back.
Posts: 6236 | From: Ottawa, Canada | Registered: Oct 2001
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Rossweisse
High Church Valkyrie
# 2349
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Augustine the Aleut:
I fear that I must confess that I was most mischievous with my last encounter with two young Mormon missionaries from the southwestern US... they must have had an interesting report to the Mission supervisor.... they never did come back.
<heh heh!>
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I'm not dead yet.
Posts: 15117 | From: Valhalla | Registered: Feb 2002
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ChastMastr
Shipmate
# 716
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Posted
Can we wrench this back to the important stuff, like underwear? Whether Tomb's or someone else's, I'd far prefer to discuss that... ![[Razz]](tongue.gif)
I've checked on eBay from time to time for Mormon underwear, but unfortunately have never been able to find it, which is a pity as I'm fond of one-piece suits (sometimes called "all-in-ones" in the UK).
How, exactly, do Mormons go swimming in those things?
David
would like to find fundoshi, too, but so far has not
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My essays on comics continuity: http://chastmastr.tumblr.com/tagged/continuity
Posts: 14068 | From: Clearwater, Florida | Registered: Jul 2001
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Rossweisse
High Church Valkyrie
# 2349
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by ChastMastr:
Can we wrench this back to the important stuff, like underwear?... I've checked on eBay from time to time for Mormon underwear, but unfortunately have never been able to find it...
On your next visit to Mecca....er, Salt Lake City... go to the department store (I want to say it's called the Beehive? something like that) at Temple Square and tell the nice lady behind the counter what size you take, decide whether it's cash or charge, and stroll off with your package.
However, I would suggest divesting yourself of any earrings or other such Decidedly Non-Mormon Accoutrements first. I'm pretty sure that "temple recommends" are not forthcoming to those who wear them, even if they DO show the bishop their income tax returns with 10% going off the top to the Proper Authorities.
Rossweisse // who is pretty sure that God doesn't care about our undies
Posts: 15117 | From: Valhalla | Registered: Feb 2002
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duchess
Ship's Blue Blooded Lady
# 2764
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Posted
Is Barmit ignoring my post? Perhaps he needs time to search through the archieves for that issue to verify it. I was very serious in wanting to verify that statement. If it is taken totally out of context, he could verify that as well. I may disagree but I am a stickler for trying always get to the nitty-gritty of things.
Please...no more underwear in here. ![[Waterworks]](graemlins/bawling.gif)
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♬♭ We're setting sail to the place on the map from which nobody has ever returned ♫♪♮
Ship of Fools-World Party
Posts: 11197 | From: Do you know the way? | Registered: May 2002
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mousethief
Ship's Thieving Rodent
# 953
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Posted
Duchess, are you saying we should remove our underwear before posting in here?
Reader Alexis
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This is the last sig I'll ever write for you...
Posts: 63536 | From: Washington | Registered: Jul 2001
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Clyde
Shipmate
# 752
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Posted
The removal of underwear on a public bulletin board is not allowed.
( No sex please we're Brtish)
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I've not been on the ship for a long time. I'm very old now and don't like it when the sea gets rough.
Posts: 1279 | From: England. | Registered: Jul 2001
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Clyde
Shipmate
# 752
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Posted
Should have read 'British'
(Typing mistake due to the excitement)
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I've not been on the ship for a long time. I'm very old now and don't like it when the sea gets rough.
Posts: 1279 | From: England. | Registered: Jul 2001
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tomb
Shipmate
# 174
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Posted
Oh, good. For a moment there, I read it as "Brutish."
Posts: 5039 | From: Denver, Colorado | Registered: May 2001
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RuthW
liberal "peace first" hankie squeezer
# 13
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Posted
Okay, hands up - who's going commando?
Posts: 24453 | From: La La Land | Registered: Apr 2001
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mousethief
Ship's Thieving Rodent
# 953
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by RuthW:
Okay, hands up - who's going commando?
Certainly not any Mormons.
Reader Alexis
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This is the last sig I'll ever write for you...
Posts: 63536 | From: Washington | Registered: Jul 2001
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duchess
Ship's Blue Blooded Lady
# 2764
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Posted
![[Help]](graemlins/help.gif)
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♬♭ We're setting sail to the place on the map from which nobody has ever returned ♫♪♮
Ship of Fools-World Party
Posts: 11197 | From: Do you know the way? | Registered: May 2002
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Laura
General nuisance
# 10
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Mousethief:
quote:
Originally posted by RuthW:
Okay, hands up - who's going commando?
Certainly not any Mormons.
Reader Alexis
Commando?
I have a friend who dated an ex-Mormon, who had to leave the church after he came out as gay. He had the underwear. And had been through the whole exaltation thing. Great story.
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Love is the only sane and satisfactory answer to the problem of human existence. - Erich Fromm
Posts: 16883 | From: East Coast, USA | Registered: Apr 2001
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Rossweisse
High Church Valkyrie
# 2349
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by duchess:
Is Barmit ignoring my post?...
I think poor Barmy is getting overheated with the whole discussion; he's becoming decidedly snippy in his responses on the Purgatory board. I fear that, any moment now, I shall once again find myself condemned to the fiery lake for eternity for having the temerity to (a) find this stuff risible, and (b) actually laugh at it.
Ross // oh, well!
Posts: 15117 | From: Valhalla | Registered: Feb 2002
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ChastMastr
Shipmate
# 716
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Posted
I'm feeling better now, thanks to some prayer by some kind people. More on that another time, perhaps. Where were we? Ah yes, commando. Bleah. Trés dull. I've never found that a turn-on. I actually do find the concept of holy (not holey) underwear kind of cool, though I don't agree with the whole (not hole) Mormon take on it. But a short-sleeved one-piece bodysuit works for me!
Mind you, most of theirs are probably not made of silver-grey spandex with black mesh panels in ... interesting places. A pity, really. (Come to think of it, those panels probably count as holes, only lots and lots of very small ones. I suppose this would be the whole holy holey underwear thing.)
eBay. Germany. Olaf Benz. Works for me! ![[Big Grin]](biggrin.gif)
David
thinks he is back to his old silly kinky self again, rather than brimming over with needless angst, and appreciates the prayers from concerned parties
(On the other hand, if he'd been wearing more than Y-fronts when he was cooking the other day, he probably wouldn't have gotten burned so badly with hot cooking oil, but at Siegfried's suggestion, has bought an apron, a nice blue and white stripey one, from Ikea)
(... which, admittedly, could be considered a sort of sign -- "Thou shalt wear short-sleeved bodysuits only, O foolish one." Except it wasn't his *breast* he felt burning in ... though happily -- perhaps due to the Y-fronts -- it wasn't as far down as it could have been. ![[Eek!]](eek.gif) )
(But, yeah, the prayers probably helped with the stress. Blessings upon everyone who prayed...)
(So, where were we? Oh right, Mormon underwear... the bits about Masonic symbols I think. Can I make a pun about mesons and quantum physics here? Can I? Can I can I can I? I know, I make too many puns, it's one of my little quarks. Er, quirks. )
(Oh my God! I can't stop the parenthetical italic postscripts! meee...)
David
very, VERY silly orthodox (but kinky!) guy
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My essays on comics continuity: http://chastmastr.tumblr.com/tagged/continuity
Posts: 14068 | From: Clearwater, Florida | Registered: Jul 2001
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Rossweisse
High Church Valkyrie
# 2349
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Posted
Sure, David! Go for the puns, the cleverer the better.
Underwear jokes are also acceptable, if you feel so, er, moved.
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I'm not dead yet.
Posts: 15117 | From: Valhalla | Registered: Feb 2002
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Siegfried
Ship's ferret
# 29
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Rossweisse:
quote:
Originally posted by duchess:
Is Barmit ignoring my post?...
I think poor Barmy is getting overheated with the whole discussion; he's becoming decidedly snippy in his responses on the Purgatory board. I fear that, any moment now, I shall once again find myself condemned to the fiery lake for eternity for having the temerity to (a) find this stuff risible, and (b) actually laugh at it.
Ross // oh, well!
Well, posting only as a Shipmate (not a host on this board)--
Referring to Barmint as Barmy is a bit rude, as most folks have a right to be called the name they choose for themselves. Other than that, the only other thing I would think a bit beyond the pale is referring to Joseph Smith as 'goatish'. But, other than that...
Sieg
Posts: 5592 | From: Tallahassee, FL USA | Registered: May 2001
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Pheonix
Twisted fire starter
# 2782
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Posted
Do we have to talk about mormon underwear? The thought of having religious underwear is vaguely nauseating...
Posts: 2384 | From: on the move. | Registered: May 2002
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ChastMastr
Shipmate
# 716
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Pheonix:
The thought of having religious underwear is vaguely nauseating...
Top ten bad jokes I could make here:
- 1. Why? It's clean!
- 2. But -- this is Hell. Isn't that where we put nauseating things?
- 3. Underwear should be free to be religious -- if I don't wash mine often enough it's able to walk to church under its own power
- 4. The *thought* is -- but is the *reality*?
- 5. Only vaguely?
- 6. Ah, you prefer skyclad then?
- 7. Erm, I can't think of any more. (It's a quarter to seven and I just woke up, late, without even my morning tea yet)
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My essays on comics continuity: http://chastmastr.tumblr.com/tagged/continuity
Posts: 14068 | From: Clearwater, Florida | Registered: Jul 2001
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Rossweisse
High Church Valkyrie
# 2349
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Siegfried:
...Referring to Barmint as Barmy is a bit rude, as most folks have a right to be called the name they choose for themselves. Other than that, the only other thing I would think a bit beyond the pale is referring to Joseph Smith as 'goatish'. But, other than that...
That wasn't Joe; it was Brigham. And that was the note in which, as I immediately noted and apologized, I got confused about which thread I was on. (I thought I was here, not there...and I can see that this might lead to interesting metaphysical byways, so I'll stop right now.)
As for nicknames -- on other boards, I'm accustomed to same. For example, my screen name is regularly shortened to Ross: nobody knows who she is, 99 out of 100 can't pronounce the name, few people can spell it, and fewer still want to bother with that many keystrokes. I'm Officially Fine with it (and even with Ro, to which I was recently shortened), and I'm surprised, I guess that other people might not be. (Does this mean I can't call you Sieggy? Even though Rossweisse is Siegfried's aunt?)
Okay, no more friendly nicknames. We're Strictly Business around here. Any other holes into which I can step today?
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I'm not dead yet.
Posts: 15117 | From: Valhalla | Registered: Feb 2002
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ChastMastr
Shipmate
# 716
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Posted
I don't suppose it might be, not because it was shortened, but because barmy [I] means quote:
informal or slang terms for mentally irregular [syn: balmy, bats, batty, bonkers, buggy, cracked, crackers, daft, dotty, fruity, haywire, kooky, kookie, loco, loony, loopy, nuts, nutty, wacky]
... [I]Naaahhhh... ![[Snore]](graemlins/snore.gif)
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My essays on comics continuity: http://chastmastr.tumblr.com/tagged/continuity
Posts: 14068 | From: Clearwater, Florida | Registered: Jul 2001
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Siegfried
Ship's ferret
# 29
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Rossweisse:
(Does this mean I can't call you Sieggy? Even though Rossweisse is Siegfried's aunt?
No, you may not. As you may notice, I sign myself as either Sieg or Siegfried. Those are what I prefer to be called. An obvious abbreviation (for me, SF would be one, S possibly even) is one thing. A dimminutive form (Barmy, Sieggy) is quite another.
Sieg
[Hosts should get there UBB code sorted out]
[ 21 August 2002, 23:28: Message edited by: Nightlamp ]
Posts: 5592 | From: Tallahassee, FL USA | Registered: May 2001
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Pyx_e
Quixotic Tilter
# 57
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Posted
Ok I’ve read the whole thread (it took me an hour and a half) and whilst at many times on the ship I have been forced to look at things in a new light nothing said here has made me think any more highly of Mormonism. And yes I also bet they are weeping tonight in Salt Lake City at that news.
Barmint seems like a good chap, but he does toe the party line and knows it very well. My main problem is with any religion which displays cultish tendencies and IMHO Mormonism does. I acknowledge that some more mainstream Christian denominations can at times seem cultish but in the broad are not. Whereas in my opinion Mormonism seems to be more cultish and less “freeing.”
And this is the crux of my meager point. In my opinion Christianity should free us. I have had direct personal dealings with ex-Mormons. They have (everyone of them) had to leave for various reasons and have been badgered to return to the fold, then had huge psychological and emotional pressure put on them and finally shunned even by their own family. This does not seem Christian to me and as St Forest would have said “Christian is as Christian does.”
I can have sympathy for those who at a particular stage in their life need the ultra protectionism of such a binding religions. I can even understand the way in which people can live that life for all their lives, unable and therefore in denial of the real world and the inconsistencies that places on their faith system. But that does not make me happy about it.
Secondly just as all the major organized religions have created huge self sustaining bureaucracies so with all its money and political ambition will the Mormons. They have recognized that the more “peculiar” aspects of their past are a real hindrance to growth. They are in the uncomfortable position of being caught between a rock and a hard place. The rock is their faithful believers and the hard place is that Mormonism will never become a force when it has so much from its past that is bordering on the risible.
Lastly at one level I am not surprised that Mormons are after those who already have faith as we have so many of their ex-members in our churches. It does however pain me greatly (and this is where heresy damns) that the little (or big) lies told by heretical sects make them seem attractive but in fact only serve to make the fall more severe.
So whilst we have ex-Mormons and ex- all sorts in our congregation many who never darken the door of any church again have been so abused of the notion of God’s love as to live in a spiritual wasteland made by the indoctrination of churches with cultish tendencies. Forever condemned to live in fear. Makes me weep. At least in the C of E people leave because they are bored!
P
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It is better to be Kind than right.
Posts: 9778 | From: The Dark Tower | Registered: May 2001
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Rossweisse
High Church Valkyrie
# 2349
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by ChastMastr:
I don't suppose it might be, not because it was shortened, but because barmy means quote:
informal or slang terms for mentally irregular...
... Naaahhhh...
Nope, that wasn't my thought -- believe it or not, as you see fit. I believe that the gentleman has no problem with sliding around the facts for religious purposes (For Our Own Good, natch), but he strikes me as being quite rational despite the industrial-strength firewalls he seems to have set up in his brain to allow his belief in so many impossible things at one time...IMO, of course.
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I'm not dead yet.
Posts: 15117 | From: Valhalla | Registered: Feb 2002
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Rossweisse
High Church Valkyrie
# 2349
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Siegfried:
quote:
Originally posted by Rossweisse:
(Does this mean I can't call you Sieggy? Even though Rossweisse is Siegfried's aunt?
No, you may not. As you may notice, I sign myself as either Sieg or Siegfried. Those are what I prefer to be called. An obvious abbreviation (for me, SF would be one, S possibly even) is one thing. A dimminutive form (Barmy, Sieggy) is quite another.
...despite this, from your profile:
http://home.pacbell.net/sieggy
Very well. Humor-impairment noted; demand will be honored. (Be careful to unpuff just a little bit, or you won't be able to make it through the door.)
Aunt Ross // just part of the far-flung Wotan family
[impaired use of UBB code corrected]
[ 21 August 2002, 23:25: Message edited by: Nightlamp ]
Posts: 15117 | From: Valhalla | Registered: Feb 2002
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Siegfried
Ship's ferret
# 29
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Rossweisse:
...despite this, from your profile:
http://home.pacbell.net/sieggy
Unfortunately, siegfried and most other variants were unavailable to me. So, I settled for that as an ISP login name ONLY.
quote:
Very well. Humor-impairment noted; demand will be honored. (Be careful to unpuff just a little bit, or you won't be able to make it through the door.)
Oh, I have a very good sense of humor. Just ask anyone who actually knows me. And I'll ignore the insult for now.
Sieg
Posts: 5592 | From: Tallahassee, FL USA | Registered: May 2001
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Rossweisse
High Church Valkyrie
# 2349
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Pyx_e:
Ok I’ve read the whole thread (it took me an hour and a half) and whilst at many times on the ship I have been forced to look at things in a new light nothing said here has made me think any more highly of Mormonism.... So whilst we have ex-Mormons and ex- all sorts in our congregation many who never darken the door of any church again have been so abused of the notion of God’s love as to live in a spiritual wasteland made by the indoctrination of churches with cultish tendencies. Forever condemned to live in fear. Makes me weep. At least in the C of E people leave because they are bored!
Bravo, Pyx_e. What a wonderful post! It makes me weep, too. Thank you for putting the matter so beautifully.
Rossweisse // in sincere admiration
Posts: 15117 | From: Valhalla | Registered: Feb 2002
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Rossweisse
High Church Valkyrie
# 2349
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Siegfried:
...And I'll ignore the insult for now.
I'm sorry you feel insulted, and I'm sorry that I had no way of knowing before that the "sieggy" was the result of necessity rather than choice. I'll even stop making Wagnerian references, since they seem to be unappreciated. Sorry, sorry, sorreeee.....
Rossweisse // sheesh!
Posts: 15117 | From: Valhalla | Registered: Feb 2002
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Erin
Meaner than Godzilla
# 2
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Rossweisse:
quote:
Originally posted by Siegfried:
...And I'll ignore the insult for now.
I'm sorry you feel insulted...
Do you always apologize for other people's feelings, Rossweisse? Didn't know you had that power. Must be SUCH a burden for you.
Your post was designed to insult, at least have the cojones to stand up and admit it.
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Commandment number one: shut the hell up.
Posts: 17140 | From: 330 miles north of paradise | Registered: Mar 2001
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Rossweisse
High Church Valkyrie
# 2349
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Erin:
Your post was designed to insult, at least have the cojones to stand up and admit it.
No, it was intended to poke a little friendly fun. I realize now that this concept is unknown to some hereabouts.
And I don't have "cojones." I have ovaries.
Do you always just wander the boards seeking out people to bite?
In any case, this thread has gone severely off-topic.
Rossweisse // double-sheesh
![[Flaming]](graemlins/angryfire.gif)
Posts: 15117 | From: Valhalla | Registered: Feb 2002
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Erin
Meaner than Godzilla
# 2
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Posted
Some people are just BEGGING to be bitten, dearheart. Who am I to deny them?
But I will help you out, since you haven't quite got the hang of things yet: poking friendly fun is reserved for, um, friends.
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Commandment number one: shut the hell up.
Posts: 17140 | From: 330 miles north of paradise | Registered: Mar 2001
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Rossweisse
High Church Valkyrie
# 2349
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Erin:
Some people are just BEGGING to be bitten, dearheart. Who am I to deny them?
You should take care lest they start biting back.
quote:
But I will help you out, since you haven't quite got the hang of things yet: poking friendly fun is reserved for, um, friends.
Most people go on the assumption that friendliness is a positive thing, and give others the benefit of the doubt. When we've read enough of one another's posts (and checked out their profiles and whatnot), we sometimes start feeling as though we know our shipmates, and can converse with them more freely than is perhaps actually the case.
I do realize that this is the Hell board, and that pomposity and egregious free-floating hostility are Hellish traits. But we WERE having a discussion of sorts here before it got derailed by all this nonsense.
Rossweisse // under the impression that hosts were supposed to keep things on-topic, not knock them further under the refrigerator
Posts: 15117 | From: Valhalla | Registered: Feb 2002
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Erin
Meaner than Godzilla
# 2
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Rossweisse:
You should take care lest they start biting back.
Sometimes they try. They ALWAYS fail miserably, but they do try. Gotta give 'em points for that.
quote:
I do realize that this is the Hell board, and that pomposity and egregious free-floating hostility are Hellish traits.
And as you've so eloquently demonstrated, so is holier-than-thou condescension.
quote:
But we WERE having a discussion of sorts here before it got derailed by all this nonsense.
Well now, you should have thought about that before YOU (yes you, dear Rossweisse) started it with this exchange quoted here:
quote:
Originally posted by Rossweisse:
quote:
Originally posted by Siegfried:
quote:
Originally posted by Rossweisse:
(Does this mean I can't call you Sieggy? Even though Rossweisse is Siegfried's aunt?
No, you may not. As you may notice, I sign myself as either Sieg or Siegfried. Those are what I prefer to be called. An obvious abbreviation (for me, SF would be one, S possibly even) is one thing. A dimminutive form (Barmy, Sieggy) is quite another.
...despite this, from your profile:
http://home.pacbell.net/sieggy
Very well. Humor-impairment noted; demand will be honored. (Be careful to unpuff just a little bit, or you won't be able to make it through the door.)
Aunt Ross // just part of the far-flung Wotan family
quote:
Rossweisse // under the impression that hosts were supposed to keep things on-topic, not knock them further under the refrigerator
Here's an exercise for you: how about you cite where tomb, Nightlamp or sarkycow "knocked things under the refrigerator".
[edited because half my fuckin' post disappeared, dammit]
[ 22 August 2002, 04:52: Message edited by: Erin ]
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Commandment number one: shut the hell up.
Posts: 17140 | From: 330 miles north of paradise | Registered: Mar 2001
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Siegfried
Ship's ferret
# 29
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Rossweisse:
Rossweisse // under the impression that hosts were supposed to keep things on-topic, not knock them further under the refrigerator
You must have been too busy being impressed by your own cleverness to notice that I clearly stated that I was posting as a shipmate, seeing as I'm not a host on this particular board.
Sieg
Posts: 5592 | From: Tallahassee, FL USA | Registered: May 2001
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tomb
Shipmate
# 174
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Posted
quote:
Rossweisse wrote
Rossweisse // under the impression that hosts were supposed to keep things on-topic, not knock them further under the refrigerator
Neither I nor either of the other two hellhosts have "swept under the refrigerator" even one of your ill-tempered and ill-mannered posts.
Get your facts straight.
Posts: 5039 | From: Denver, Colorado | Registered: May 2001
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ChastMastr
Shipmate
# 716
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Rossweisse:
to allow his belief in so many impossible things at one time
Hey, I can outdo that pretty well, what with the ritual cannibalism, the worshipping of the dead guy nailed to the tree, belief in invisible people who manipulate others without their being aware of it (one of 'em created everything, and another is an ex-employee who got ticked off and tried to take over the company, as it were), etc.
And that's just the theology; it doesn't even get into the gay leather stuff, the Tarot, the longaevi ...
Ah well
David
gradually being reconciled to being weirder-than-thou
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My essays on comics continuity: http://chastmastr.tumblr.com/tagged/continuity
Posts: 14068 | From: Clearwater, Florida | Registered: Jul 2001
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ChastMastr
Shipmate
# 716
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Pyx_e:
I can have sympathy for those who at a particular stage in their life need the ultra protectionism of such a binding religions.
(licks lips) Funky underwear and binding... verily, Pyx_e, you tempt me to become a Mormon right now... or a temporary one for an hour or two...
quote:
Originally posted by Erin:
Some people are just BEGGING to be bitten, dearheart. Who am I to deny them?
(waving hand in the air wildly, in a not-too-bad impression of Arnold Horschack from "Welcome Back, Kotter")
OOOH! OOOOH!! ME!!! PICK ME!!!!
David
We now return you to your regularly-scheduled Hellfest.
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My essays on comics continuity: http://chastmastr.tumblr.com/tagged/continuity
Posts: 14068 | From: Clearwater, Florida | Registered: Jul 2001
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