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Source: (consider it)
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Thread: HEAVEN: All Things Breadish
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Karl: Liberal Backslider
Shipmate
# 76
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Drifting Star:
I don't know anything about the gluten issue, but the Chorleywood method is also thought* to be responsible for a big increase in numbers of people suffering with IBS and acid reflux in recent years (and a number of other things that escape me at the moment because they don't have a personal impact).
*Disputed by the industry, but the repeated experience of someone close to me supports the idea.
Thought by whom I wonder - my acid reflux started after we got a breadmaker and mostly stopped eating Chorleywood process commercially produced bread.
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Might as well ask the bloody cat.
Posts: 17938 | From: Chesterfield | Registered: May 2001
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quetzalcoatl
Shipmate
# 16740
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Posted
I had to stop eating home-made bread, as it messed up my guts, but the shop stuff is OK, I assume because everything is pulverized to extinction in the process.
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I can't talk to you today; I talked to two people yesterday.
Posts: 9878 | From: UK | Registered: Oct 2011
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Firenze
Ordinary decent pagan
# 619
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Posted
Dough hooks. Not something I'd thought about before this morning, when I bought a new hand-held mixer (something I do approximately every 40 years). Besides the beaters, it came with these two other things - but instructions not to run them for more than 3 minutes, which doesn't seem very long.
Anyone deployed hand mixer/hooks in making bread?
Posts: 17302 | From: Edinburgh | Registered: Jun 2001
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Sober Preacher's Kid
Presbymethegationalist
# 12699
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Posted
"Shortening" is a kind of cooking fat, similar to lard.
See Wiki
Crisco, the common one I use is solidified canola and palm oil extracts.
Fried Chicken is often baked in melted shortening.
Posts: 7646 | From: Peterborough, Upper Canada | Registered: Jun 2007
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no prophet's flag is set so...
Proceed to see sea
# 15560
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Posted
I have uploaded some bread photos to photobucket. Here's some links to them. Probably the most interesting folder is the pictures of finished baked-up loaves so I linked to that.
Pictures of loaves. (There is one of perogis in there as well, they are a Polish-Ukrainian sort of pasta-like thing.)
In the folder list, you will see also that there are a couple of pictures of dutch oven-open fire, pitas, with the 'large whole wheat' folder showing a sequence of steps.
I did put labels on the files as I exported from the photo program but I don't know how to get them to show up.
[ 14. October 2014, 17:34: Message edited by: no prophet's flag is set so... ]
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Out of this nettle, danger, we pluck this flower, safety.
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Posts: 11498 | From: Treaty 6 territory in the nonexistant Province of Buffalo, Canada ↄ⃝' | Registered: Mar 2010
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Drifting Star
Drifting against the wind
# 12799
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Karl: Liberal Backslider:
Thought by whom I wonder - my acid reflux started after we got a breadmaker and mostly stopped eating Chorleywood process commercially produced bread.
Googling turns up a vast number of articles in newspapers (Guardian, Telegraph, Independent), all quoting different people. This article from the Telegraph says that research is not being done because there is no-one to fund it. The only interested party with the necessary money is the baking industry, and they really don't want to.
However, looking at the basics, the Chorleywood Process involves 3 or 4 times as much yeast as traditionally made bread, and yeast is known to be a cause of IBS. It also denies the bread fermentation time, which is necessary for the wheat to become more digestible. Indigestible fibre is also a known cause of IBS.
Anecdotally (well, based on personal experience, but that makes an anecdote for you), Starman's IBS symptoms come on specifically and ferociously when he eats bread which has been made by the Chorleywood Process, but he has no problem whatsoever with other bread containing the same ingredients. We have no doubt at all as to the cause.
Less has been written about the connection with acid reflux, but it can be similarly susceptible to yeast. I occasionally have acid reflux after eating bread, but I think it is much harder to pin down.
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The soul is dyed the color of its thoughts. Heraclitus
Posts: 3126 | From: A thin place. | Registered: Jul 2007
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Sioni Sais
Shipmate
# 5713
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Doublethink.:
First batch goes in the oven in 15 min ....
Have you taken it out yet? How was it?
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"He isn't Doctor Who, he's The Doctor"
(Paul Sinha, BBC)
Posts: 24276 | From: Newport, Wales | Registered: Apr 2004
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Doublethink.
Ship's Foolwise Unperson
# 1984
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Posted
Twas good ![[Big Grin]](biggrin.gif)
Now I must make chocolate bread ...
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All political thinking for years past has been vitiated in the same way. People can foresee the future only when it coincides with their own wishes, and the most grossly obvious facts can be ignored when they are unwelcome. George Orwell
Posts: 19219 | From: Erehwon | Registered: Aug 2005
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Doublethink.
Ship's Foolwise Unperson
# 1984
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Posted
Apparently just substituting cocoa for flour makes dough verrrry sloppy. And should mix dough with a spoon, not fingers ...
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All political thinking for years past has been vitiated in the same way. People can foresee the future only when it coincides with their own wishes, and the most grossly obvious facts can be ignored when they are unwelcome. George Orwell
Posts: 19219 | From: Erehwon | Registered: Aug 2005
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Jane R
Shipmate
# 331
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Posted
Keep adding flour until the dough is the right consistency. It should still work.
(Chocolate bread?! Eww...)
Posts: 3958 | From: Jorvik | Registered: May 2001
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Gee D
Shipmate
# 13815
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Posted
I don't understand how a slow rising could somehow affect the gluten content of the bread. After all, it's the manner in which the gluten traps the gases that enables the dough to rise.
As for the Chorleywood method causing IBS, and all other ailments, I think I'd like to see some properly tested evidence. It does not produce a flavoursome loaf with good texture, but that does not mean that it causes the common cold. It may - but where's the evidence?
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Not every Anglican in Sydney is Sydney Anglican
Posts: 7028 | From: Warrawee NSW Australia | Registered: Jun 2008
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Doublethink.
Ship's Foolwise Unperson
# 1984
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Jane R:
Keep adding flour until the dough is the right consistency. It should still work.
(Chocolate bread?! Eww...)
I did, I did - ended up being a cup ful !
Possibly substituting golden syrup for sugar, nut butter for butter and adding cinnamon and freeze dried coffee may have also effected things. First rise, rose though ![[Smile]](smile.gif)
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All political thinking for years past has been vitiated in the same way. People can foresee the future only when it coincides with their own wishes, and the most grossly obvious facts can be ignored when they are unwelcome. George Orwell
Posts: 19219 | From: Erehwon | Registered: Aug 2005
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no prophet's flag is set so...
Proceed to see sea
# 15560
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Posted
Gluten can be developed into long or short strands, and, the crumb (texture) of the bread is affected by the proportion of water:flour. Chains of gluten develop from a chemical reaction in the loaf unrelated to yeast, but affected by how long the flour and water are together, and at what temperature.
If you stir equal amounts of flour and water together with not very much yeast (100% hydration), and then put in a cool place like the fridge, you give the gluten/protein in the flour a chance to react with the water. If you have thoroughly kneaded the flour and then allow it to rise in a warm place versus a fridge, the product will have developed the gluten, but in short chains. Hence different crumb.
Have a look at the "bread porn" pictures I posted above in this thread. These were all started on a Friday, usually in the morning, as a preferment/sponge/biga/poolish (words used depend on baker, country, proportion of water to flour), left for 12-24 hours in the kitchen, mixed with additional flour and generally put into the fridge for 24 hours. Then out, briefly kneaded, shaped and baked. The loaves in my pictures don't look a lot like store bought do they?
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Out of this nettle, danger, we pluck this flower, safety.
\_(ツ)_/
Posts: 11498 | From: Treaty 6 territory in the nonexistant Province of Buffalo, Canada ↄ⃝' | Registered: Mar 2010
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Doublethink.
Ship's Foolwise Unperson
# 1984
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Posted
They look incredible
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All political thinking for years past has been vitiated in the same way. People can foresee the future only when it coincides with their own wishes, and the most grossly obvious facts can be ignored when they are unwelcome. George Orwell
Posts: 19219 | From: Erehwon | Registered: Aug 2005
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Lothlorien
Ship's Grandma
# 4927
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Posted
quote:
I don't understand how a slow rising could somehow affect the gluten content of the bread. After all, it's the manner in which the gluten traps the gases that enables the dough to rise.
Very patchy net access here after last night's storm, but I have seen articles on this and know that granddaughter is fine with very slow rise bread. Some years ago, she was hospitalised several times before coeliac disease was suspected. I am not saying the quick rise causes stomach problems. They are an entirely different matter whether it's IBS or coeliac problems.
Hope this goes through. Access drops out frequently.
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Buy a bale. Help our Aussie rural communities and farmers. Another great cause needing support The High Country Patrol.
Posts: 9745 | From: girt by sea | Registered: Aug 2003
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no prophet's flag is set so...
Proceed to see sea
# 15560
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Lothlorien:
Very patchy net access here after last night's storm, but I have seen articles on this and know that granddaughter is fine with very slow rise bread. Some years ago, she was hospitalised several times before coeliac disease was suspected. I am not saying the quick rise causes stomach problems. They are an entirely different matter whether it's IBS or coeliac problems.
Hope this goes through. Access drops out frequently.
Hope your storm situation settles! One of my adult children was diagnosed with Coeliac/Celiac Disease after a GI infection, there are several different reactions and they test for response to different molecules. I suspect in your grandchild, she reacts to one/some and not the others. And the slow rise nonreactivity means she digests the long molecules okay but not the shorter ones. Some would call her 'gluten sensitive' versus coeliac. We were pretty upset with the diagnosis with my child, particularly because baking together has always been a father-child activity. We're merely moving on though, mostly to things that don't look like loaves. (If you can imagine cooking together over skype, while she is in England and I'm on the Canadian prairies)
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Out of this nettle, danger, we pluck this flower, safety.
\_(ツ)_/
Posts: 11498 | From: Treaty 6 territory in the nonexistant Province of Buffalo, Canada ↄ⃝' | Registered: Mar 2010
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Enoch
Shipmate
# 14322
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Sober Preacher's Kid:
... Crisco, the common one I use is solidified canola and palm oil extracts. ...
Sorry, canola is another of these mystery words. Is it what we call oil seed rape? Or is it something different that we don't have?
Palm oil is rather controversial here at the moment.
It sounds, by the way, as though shortening is a sort of vegetarian lard, rather in the way one can get vegetarian suet. Is that right?
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Brexit wrexit - Sir Graham Watson
Posts: 7610 | From: Bristol UK(was European Green Capital 2015, now Ljubljana) | Registered: Nov 2008
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no prophet's flag is set so...
Proceed to see sea
# 15560
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Doublethink.:
They look incredible
Please take and post some photos of your bread! Being a baking voyeur, photos please!!
quote:
Originally posted by Enoch:
quote:
Originally posted by Sober Preacher's Kid:
... Crisco, the common one I use is solidified canola and palm oil extracts. ...
Sorry, canola is another of these mystery words. Is it what we call oil seed rape? Or is it something different that we don't have?
Palm oil is rather controversial here at the moment.
It sounds, by the way, as though shortening is a sort of vegetarian lard, rather in the way one can get vegetarian suet. Is that right?
Canola is a created word from Canada and oil, because the oil from canola plants is rather different from ancestral rape seed plants due to conventional breeding ("rape" comes from rapine, which means related rivers). The main issues are disease resistance as the plants grow, and lowering of the eurcic acid. Erucic acid is linked to some suggested health problems with cancers and the heart. The name change was also stimulated by the word "rape" in the name, a false friend but identical word. Canola and rape seed are relatives of mustard. Canola is a good frying oil, doesn't smoke at high temps.
We assume that 100% of canola oil contains GMOs, due to Monsanto's 'Round-up Ready' seed dominating the market. They can spray to kill all other plants. Consequently, even though we live in an area where canola is a major crop and canola oil is by far the cheapest, we don't use it all. I don't generally add any fat to bread, just a little grape seed oil to oil the dough for the second rise.
If you need a solid fat, my tendency is to recommend unsalted butter versus any manipulated oils or fats.
[ 14. October 2014, 22:45: Message edited by: no prophet's flag is set so... ]
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Out of this nettle, danger, we pluck this flower, safety.
\_(ツ)_/
Posts: 11498 | From: Treaty 6 territory in the nonexistant Province of Buffalo, Canada ↄ⃝' | Registered: Mar 2010
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lilBuddha
Shipmate
# 14333
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Doublethink.:
Twas good
Now I must make chocolate bread ...
Add coarse flakes of sea salt to the bread just before baking. It will enhance the chocolate flavour.
[ 14. October 2014, 22:53: Message edited by: lilBuddha ]
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I put on my rockin' shoes in the morning
Hallellou, hallellou
Posts: 17627 | From: the round earth's imagined corners | Registered: Dec 2008
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Doublethink.
Ship's Foolwise Unperson
# 1984
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Posted
That would probably have helped - it has come out mainly cinnamony.
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All political thinking for years past has been vitiated in the same way. People can foresee the future only when it coincides with their own wishes, and the most grossly obvious facts can be ignored when they are unwelcome. George Orwell
Posts: 19219 | From: Erehwon | Registered: Aug 2005
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Lothlorien
Ship's Grandma
# 4927
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Enoch:
quote:
Originally posted by Sober Preacher's Kid:
... Crisco, the common one I use is solidified canola and palm oil extracts. ...
Sorry, canola is another of these mystery words. Is it what we call oil seed rape? Or is it something different that we don't have?
Palm oil is rather controversial here at the moment.
It sounds, by the way, as though shortening is a sort of vegetarian lard, rather in the way one can get vegetarian suet. Is that right?
Not downunder. It's not a new term by any means in baking. Not just for bread, but biscuits etc. I can remember reading it when I first started cooking and that was a long time ago. Here it was some form of fat, butter, lard, dripping etc. It gave flavour and increased keeping quality of baked goods. Very few people used margarine when I was young. There was social disapproval of it as being lower class and it tasted even worse than it does now.
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Buy a bale. Help our Aussie rural communities and farmers. Another great cause needing support The High Country Patrol.
Posts: 9745 | From: girt by sea | Registered: Aug 2003
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Piglet
Islander
# 11803
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Posted
No Prophet, those loaves look wonderful. Bread porn indeed!
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I may not be on an island any more, but I'm still an islander.
alto n a soprano who can read music
Posts: 20272 | From: Fredericton, NB, on a rather larger piece of rock | Registered: Sep 2006
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Gee D
Shipmate
# 13815
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Posted
Shortening is a general reference to a fat which is solid through a wide range of room temperatures - butter, lard, suet and so forth are natural ones; margarine is manufactured. Shortbread biscuits are biscuits (US cookies) with a lot of shortening in them. If you sue butter, the result can be delicious, less so with margarine. Lard or suet would be useful in savoury biscuits, not sure how they would go in sweet. If you use a very high proportion of shortening, the dough can become difficult to work with unless you rest it in the fridge from time to time. Easier to do with plain (US general purpose) flour than with self-raising.
The naughty little puppy of the eponymous book was denied strawberry shortcakes for his tea. They would have been cakes with a very high butter content.
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Not every Anglican in Sydney is Sydney Anglican
Posts: 7028 | From: Warrawee NSW Australia | Registered: Jun 2008
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Enoch
Shipmate
# 14322
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Posted
Sort of tangent alert - except it isn't a tangent - wait and see
Something I've started to get a bit irritated by recently has been when one orders food in a pub or a restaurant, and it arrives with everything, and especially any mushrooms, tasting of nuts. i.e. the spread of varieties of nut oil where rather a strong flavour of ground nuts seems to be regarded as a point in its favour, something that actually makes the food taste better. IMHO it doesn't.
Anyway, what I'm suggesting is that unless you really like the flavour of nuts with everything, and want your bread to taste of it, don't choose to add an oil with a strong nutty flavour.
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Brexit wrexit - Sir Graham Watson
Posts: 7610 | From: Bristol UK(was European Green Capital 2015, now Ljubljana) | Registered: Nov 2008
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Gee D
Shipmate
# 13815
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Posted
Olive oil is marvellous in bread - good flavour and the crust is excellent in flavour, crustiness* and colour.
*Why, oh why, is bread on a menu and so forth always described as crusty when almost invariably it is not? An easy way to get steam into the oven and thus a good crust is to place a shallow pan of boiling water on a lower shelf just as you put the loaves in.
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Not every Anglican in Sydney is Sydney Anglican
Posts: 7028 | From: Warrawee NSW Australia | Registered: Jun 2008
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no prophet's flag is set so...
Proceed to see sea
# 15560
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Gee D:
Olive oil is marvellous in bread - good flavour and the crust is excellent in flavour, crustiness* and colour.
*Why, oh why, is bread on a menu and so forth always described as crusty when almost invariably it is not? An easy way to get steam into the oven and thus a good crust is to place a shallow pan of boiling water on a lower shelf just as you put the loaves in.
Yes, and use hotter temperatures. I bake most loaves and buns for half the time at about 450°F (230°C, gas mark 8) depending on the oven. Pitas, which go directly on to an oven rack start at 575°F (about 300°C or as hot as the oven will go, gas mark 9.
A convection oven (heats with a fan) is good for this, as it circulates the heat well. People talk of steaming the oven, meaning spraying the sides with water, but you lose the steam when opening, whilst a pan of water keeps steaming. A pan of water is essential if baking bread on a gas barbeque. They are hard to control temp with, and the water prevents scorching.
We could discuss ovens as a tangent. We bought a Kitchen Aid convection oven about 12 years ago. Expensive, but worth every penny. Convection cooks 25 to 50°F lower than conventional. --funny how I use °F for cooking. Nowhere else.
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Out of this nettle, danger, we pluck this flower, safety.
\_(ツ)_/
Posts: 11498 | From: Treaty 6 territory in the nonexistant Province of Buffalo, Canada ↄ⃝' | Registered: Mar 2010
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Piglet
Islander
# 11803
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Posted
I had my first attempt at making a braided loaf this afternoon - I used the French stick recipe in the bread machine, divided it in three and plaited it - and it really doesn't look bad for a first go.
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I may not be on an island any more, but I'm still an islander.
alto n a soprano who can read music
Posts: 20272 | From: Fredericton, NB, on a rather larger piece of rock | Registered: Sep 2006
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no prophet's flag is set so...
Proceed to see sea
# 15560
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Posted
Pictures please people!! The pornobread cannot be just my exhibtionism! Voyeurs want to look. Want to taste too but thats more difficult.
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Out of this nettle, danger, we pluck this flower, safety.
\_(ツ)_/
Posts: 11498 | From: Treaty 6 territory in the nonexistant Province of Buffalo, Canada ↄ⃝' | Registered: Mar 2010
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Gee D
Shipmate
# 13815
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Posted
We have a double oven stove, both ovens being convection. They distribute heat and steam beautifully. I talked about a steaming pan in my long post on page 1.
As a variation and if it fits her particular timetable for the day, Madame sometimes makes bread according to a recipe distributed by Lothlorien's brother. In that, the proven dough is formed into its loaf, rested for 10 minutes and then put into a cold oven, turned very high. Madame will fill half of a rectangular unglazed terracotta dish* with water before she goes out, and forms the loaf in the drained dish. That's safe to put into a cold oven - I suspect it might crack if put into a hot - and gives a good supply of steam all around the loaf while baking.
* In fact she uses half the Römertopf (hope that's not advertising, there are other makes on the market here).
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Not every Anglican in Sydney is Sydney Anglican
Posts: 7028 | From: Warrawee NSW Australia | Registered: Jun 2008
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itsarumdo
Shipmate
# 18174
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Posted
The traditional monastic wine and bread consisted of nettle and mugwort infused wine and bread baked containing the "herb of grace" - Rue. An efficient binary mind altering combination, with the bread releasing alkaloids from the rue. Only small quantities recommended (the quantities were very strictly prescribed).
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"Iti sapis potanda tinone" Lycophron
Posts: 994 | From: Planet Zog | Registered: Jul 2014
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Piglet
Islander
# 11803
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by no prophet's flag is set so...:
Pictures please people!!
I took a photograph of it on my mobile, but because I'm a complete technomoron I don't know how to get it from there to the computer - I don't think my charging-cable does anything except charge the batteries. Will look into it.
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I may not be on an island any more, but I'm still an islander.
alto n a soprano who can read music
Posts: 20272 | From: Fredericton, NB, on a rather larger piece of rock | Registered: Sep 2006
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Yangtze
Shipmate
# 4965
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Posted
Email it to yourself?
(Or get a Mac and iPhone and photos mysteriously sync automatically thanks to the wonder that is PhotoStream. But that may be a bit excessive as a solution to a one photo issue.)
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Arthur & Henry Ethical Shirts for Men
organic cotton, fair trade cotton, linen
Sometimes I wonder What's for Afters?
Posts: 2022 | From: the smallest town in England | Registered: Sep 2003
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Hugal
Shipmate
# 2734
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Posted
Shortening is really an American term and not used much here. It is as said white fat but can be used for any fat that is used in cooking.
I am a hands on guy. I will use the mixer to bring the bread together but like to kneed by hand. My mum and dad used to have a bread maker but I really didn't like hole left by the paddle.
Won't get one.
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I have never done this trick in these trousers before.
Posts: 1887 | From: london | Registered: Apr 2002
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Pomona
Shipmate
# 17175
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Posted
There are different types of IBS which may explain the different reactions to Chorleywood bread. Personally I can't handle seeded or wholegrain bread (or pulses) because high fibre content upsets my stomach. White sliced bread is fine as far as I can tell. Btw since I mentioned it on the cooking thread, my coeliac tests came back negative.
For sandwiches, I prefer a wrap for optimum filling-to-bread ratio. Does anyone have a good tortilla recipe? I am happy to be authentic and use lard Edited to add that flour tortillas are preferred, though I'm sure I could hunt cornmeal down - not much of an ethnic population where I live so the supermarket world food aisles are rubbish.
[ 16. October 2014, 16:00: Message edited by: Pomona ]
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Consider the work of God: Who is able to straighten what he has bent? [Ecclesiastes 7:13]
Posts: 5319 | From: UK | Registered: Jun 2012
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Welease Woderwick
Sister Incubus Nightmare
# 10424
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Posted
We make chapatis from atta which is basically a fairly fine wheat meal with a pinch of salt and a little warm water - knead for 10 minutes. Great chapatis and great for a sort of quesadilla. My problem is that I try to stuff too much into the quesadilla, but then I am well known as a little piggy when it comes to food.
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What part of Matt. 7:1 don't you understand?
Posts: 48139 | From: 1st on the right, straight on 'til morning | Registered: Sep 2005
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Gee D
Shipmate
# 13815
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Posted
We can buy atta in supermarkets here, in the same sort of canisters as the 1 kg bread flour. Madame uses it in place of wholemeal flour in all sorts of recipes. Works well.
[ 17. October 2014, 02:41: Message edited by: Gee D ]
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Not every Anglican in Sydney is Sydney Anglican
Posts: 7028 | From: Warrawee NSW Australia | Registered: Jun 2008
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Lothlorien
Ship's Grandma
# 4927
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Gee D:
We can buy atta in supermarkets here, in the same sort of canisters as the 1 kg bread flour. Madame uses it in place of wholemeal flour in all sorts of recipes. Works well.
I sometimes substitute atta as part of flour in flatbread recipes.
As Gee D has said, it's readily available in supermarkets, as are other types of flours. Spelt etc.
I have been making bread type baked goods since I was about ten. I started when mum was out and she returned to fresh hot cross buns. I bought the River Cottage bread book a couple of years ago and found it useful.
[ 17. October 2014, 06:39: Message edited by: Lothlorien ]
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Posts: 9745 | From: girt by sea | Registered: Aug 2003
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Carex
Shipmate
# 9643
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Posted
We have discovered large wraps / tortillas made of teff (the smallest food grain, used in Ethiopian injera flatbread.) While gluten-free, it is stronger than traditional wheat or corn/maize tortillas and rarely splits.
Conveniently a large wrap fits into our electric toaster (designed for two slices of bread end-to-end) when folded over, and comes out like a large taco shell ready to be stuffed with fish / scrambled eggs / shredded pork / hummus and mint or whatever else strikes our fancy.
But then, we have many types of flours readily available - if it isn't in the store we can head over to Bob's Red Mill and pick it up. And they have recipes, too.
[WARNING] Link may cause irrational urges to bake something. Cook responsibly. [/WARNING]
Side note:
Yes, the smiling Bob shown on the packages is still involved in the day-to-day operation of the Red Mill and the rest of the company. But he no longer owns it - at his 81st birthday party he gave the company to his employees.
[ 17. October 2014, 19:02: Message edited by: Carex ]
Posts: 1425 | Registered: Jun 2005
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no prophet's flag is set so...
Proceed to see sea
# 15560
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Posted
The problem with buying flour is that if it isn't white, unbleached or whole wheat flour, it is sold in very small quantities here, usually 2 kg or if lucky 5, and at rather high prices. The gluten-free flours are 4× the cost
I prefer 20 kg bags of flour (~44 lbs) which are about $12. I have a line on some organic Red Fife and Marquis (a variety of Red Fife) which should be really fun to try, and tasty.
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Out of this nettle, danger, we pluck this flower, safety.
\_(ツ)_/
Posts: 11498 | From: Treaty 6 territory in the nonexistant Province of Buffalo, Canada ↄ⃝' | Registered: Mar 2010
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Enoch
Shipmate
# 14322
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by no prophet's flag is set so...:
The problem with buying flour is that if it isn't white, unbleached or whole wheat flour, it is sold in very small quantities here, usually 2 kg or if lucky 5, and at rather high prices. The gluten-free flours are 4× the cost
I prefer 20 kg bags of flour (~44 lbs) which are about $12. I have a line on some organic Red Fife and Marquis (a variety of Red Fife) which should be really fun to try, and tasty.
Yes, we have this problem. Ordinary shops don't sell flour in decent quantities, rather than the standard 2kg bags.
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Brexit wrexit - Sir Graham Watson
Posts: 7610 | From: Bristol UK(was European Green Capital 2015, now Ljubljana) | Registered: Nov 2008
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Welease Woderwick
Sister Incubus Nightmare
# 10424
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Posted
I think I'm right in saying that we can buy flour loose here, so name the quantity!
We also buy wheat and take it to the mill so we get our own even if it isn't really. At least we know for certain what goes into it.
edited to make sense ![[Roll Eyes]](rolleyes.gif)
[ 18. October 2014, 12:21: Message edited by: Welease Woderwick ]
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I give thanks for unknown blessings already on their way.
Fancy a break in South India?
Accessible Homestay Guesthouse in Central Kerala, contact me for details
What part of Matt. 7:1 don't you understand?
Posts: 48139 | From: 1st on the right, straight on 'til morning | Registered: Sep 2005
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Pomona
Shipmate
# 17175
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Posted
Enoch, you should be able to find big bags of atta (chapati) flour in most UK supermarkets, in the world food aisle with the Indian food.
And yes, I should be able to find atta here, I will have a look.
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Consider the work of God: Who is able to straighten what he has bent? [Ecclesiastes 7:13]
Posts: 5319 | From: UK | Registered: Jun 2012
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Doublethink.
Ship's Foolwise Unperson
# 1984
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by no prophet's flag is set so...:
The problem with buying flour is that if it isn't white, unbleached or whole wheat flour, it is sold in very small quantities here, usually 2 kg or if lucky 5, and at rather high prices. The gluten-free flours are 4× the cost
I prefer 20 kg bags of flour (~44 lbs) which are about $12. I have a line on some organic Red Fife and Marquis (a variety of Red Fife) which should be really fun to try, and tasty.
Holy crap ! I could *never* eat that much bread. I made two loaves and I am having to do radical things to finish them.
I am trying to upload bread pics to a blog but having some technical difficulties - will link when I have (limited) bread porn available.
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All political thinking for years past has been vitiated in the same way. People can foresee the future only when it coincides with their own wishes, and the most grossly obvious facts can be ignored when they are unwelcome. George Orwell
Posts: 19219 | From: Erehwon | Registered: Aug 2005
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no prophet's flag is set so...
Proceed to see sea
# 15560
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Posted
It's not all bread. There's also pasta, cookies, bread sticks, muffins, crackers, bannock. I'm kind of on a "make it yourself" anarcho-primitivist tack in my boat these days, except the people with that philosophy usually want to eat like they presumed stone-age people did; we're on a non-low fat, much less meat version of a 19th century diet. We just try to have no packaged, pre-made foods, but not overly strict about it. Eat local is also of it. We have grains and pulses that are local in the plant department, and local vegetables for about 2 months except crab and small apples. Not much else. Everything else is transported very long distances.
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Out of this nettle, danger, we pluck this flower, safety.
\_(ツ)_/
Posts: 11498 | From: Treaty 6 territory in the nonexistant Province of Buffalo, Canada ↄ⃝' | Registered: Mar 2010
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Galilit
Shipmate
# 16470
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Gee D:
Olive oil is marvellous in bread - good flavour and the crust is excellent in flavour, crustiness* and colour.
I have started using sesame oil - it is amazingly smooooth and has a beautiful aroma...
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She who does Her Son's will in all things can rely on me to do Hers.
Posts: 624 | From: a Galilee far, far away | Registered: Jun 2011
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Ariel
Shipmate
# 58
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Posted
Here we can buy "tiger bread" which has a crust brushed with sesame oil before baking, which gives the finished loaf something of a stripy, mottled appearance. A good tiger loaf smells wonderful and it's quite hard to limit yourself to "just one more slice".
Posts: 25445 | Registered: May 2001
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Enoch
Shipmate
# 14322
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Pomona:
Enoch, you should be able to find big bags of atta (chapati) flour in most UK supermarkets, in the world food aisle with the Indian food.
Is chapati flour strong or weak? Can you make bread that will rise properly with it?
Something that has puzzled me for a long time. We're often told that local flour isn't good for bread but is excellent for cakes and that strong flour which comes from the Canadian prairies makes better bread, but is no good for cakes and pastries. I've been told it's something to do with the difference between our climate and very cold winters + dry summers. If so, what did people make bread with back when all flour was local? And if so, how is it that the French and Italians can make bread out of their own flours?
I did try once to make some bread with ordinary flour, and the experts are right. It doesn't rise properly.
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Brexit wrexit - Sir Graham Watson
Posts: 7610 | From: Bristol UK(was European Green Capital 2015, now Ljubljana) | Registered: Nov 2008
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Firenze
Ordinary decent pagan
# 619
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Enoch:
If so, what did people make bread with back when all flour was local?
It was bread Jim, but not as we know it... Much of medieval England, for example, subsisted on spelt bread, which seems to have been the consistency of set porridge. Not all bread was leavened, and when it was, yeast was not the only raising agent.
Posts: 17302 | From: Edinburgh | Registered: Jun 2001
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Doublethink.
Ship's Foolwise Unperson
# 1984
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Posted
Given they drank weak beer, I am guessing they may have used beer in it in some way to get rise ?
(Currently, brioche is rising in the breadmaker if I have done it right ![[Yipee]](graemlins/spin.gif) )
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All political thinking for years past has been vitiated in the same way. People can foresee the future only when it coincides with their own wishes, and the most grossly obvious facts can be ignored when they are unwelcome. George Orwell
Posts: 19219 | From: Erehwon | Registered: Aug 2005
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