Posted                      

quote:

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Originally posted by Kelly Alves:
Change "This community" to "a few loudmouths" and I would totally agree with the above quote. I think the bulk of us could give two shits who bows out of a hell call or drops an issue when others keep it going.

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I'm sure you mean 'couldn't give two shits'?



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Garden. Room. Walk

Posted                          

quote:

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Originally posted by passer:
MODS! MODS! Boogie is trying to start a pond-war!

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Posted                      

quote:

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Originally posted by no prophet's flag is set so...:
How many are required on various continents?

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Posted                          

quote:

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Originally posted by Boogie:

quote:

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Originally posted by no prophet's flag is set so...:
How many are required on various continents?

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How many shits to give?

Plenty, I would have thought ...

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Posted                      

quote:

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Originally posted by passer:
MODS! MODS! Boogie is trying to start a pond-war!

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Posted                          

quote:

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Originally posted by Doc Tor:
Veneration of the Turd

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Posted                      

quote:

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Originally posted by Kelly Alves:
( calmly makes a Manhatten on the rocks, adds cherry, and tosses it in Boogie's face. Smiles cooly, takes a puff from a cigarette holder, and begins humming "Put the Blame on Mame" while James Cagney stealthily approaches with a grapefruit half. )

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Posted                       

quote:

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Originally posted by orfeo:
You really want to do this? Really?

Okay then.

What you ACTUALLY did with your apology was, after I'd said "I don't want to talk about this any more", start sending me private messages indicating how surprised you were that I had had enough.

I hadn't talked about this before because it was private messages, but we're talking about it now.

Was I gracious about it? No, not very. I wasn't HELLISH about it because one isn't allowed to be Hellish in private messages. But you did not choose your moment at all well.

1. You followed me into private message land straight after I'd blown my top and said I'd had enough. You gave me no opportunity to cool down. So basically what ended up happening was that the conversation I'd said I didn't want to continue, continued, because I was still in the mode of expressing my frustrations with what you'd said. I did it a little more politely, but honestly it was difficult not to just shout "WHY ARE YOU DRAGGING ME BACK INTO THIS CONVERSATION?"

2. The general tone of "OMG I didn't know" did not help my mood any because in my head I was basically thinking "you should have known, it was obvious to everyone else". And that also leaked into my PM response to you.

You talk about real life a lot. In real life, if someone storms off, do you immediately pursue them to apologise? Or do you actually let them storm off as desired?

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Way to misrepresent the conversation.

My PM to you:-

quote:

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Just wanted to add a personal apology for going at it in your thread.

Reading the effect it had, I sincerely regret not stopping much earlier, or raising it to begin with. I argue hard, I know, but don't want anyone to feel like that as a result. I should've seen what I was doing, and I apologize unreservedly.

Please PM me if I ever come close in future, and I'm outa there, no questions asked. Once again, so sorry for wasting your time. Appreciate all the time you volunteer, and don't ever want to squander or burden it.

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quote:

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No one should have to PM you to make you consider whether the possible reason that a whole lot of people are lining up on the opposite side of the argument is because they have a point

And no one should have to PM you to say that the reason you're not changing anyone else's mind is because we can all easily see where you are wrong.

First and foremost, you picked a phantom battle. You chose definitions that no one else uses (especially not me, the person you chose to criticise in the first place) and you defended them in the face of direct demonstration that people off-Ship don't use them the way you claim. You invoked Supreme Court authority and ignored that other commentators invoking the same authorities don't come to the same conclusion. Not ONCE did you provide evidence that your interpretation was shared. Not ONCE did you provide a source that said freedom of speech is absolute.

Why do you need a PM to grasp that this would piss people off?

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quote:

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And look what's happened since. You first popped up in that thread on January 8. It is now February 17. In the interim, you've continued the line of conversation in the original thread, then started two other threads in Purg that were basically designed to continue the same conversation so that you can reassure yourself that other people are on your side and it's that meany orfeo who is wrong.

Now, you're gonna tell me those other threads weren't about me. Well let me tell you sunshine, it was BLOODY hard not to conclude they were all about me. In the first one you simply would not shut up about an Australian law - of which you demonstrated a serious lack of understanding - from the moment I arrived. And the second one about point scoring most definitely seemed triggered by me as well.

And you're still just being a horrendous amateur lawyer. I've told you already that the Racial Discrimination Act does not criminalise anything. Do you listen AT ALL? This is just an incontrovertible fact.

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quote:

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And yes, I support a law that says some kinds of insults, of a very specific kind with a wealth of exceptions (which you repeatedly misunderstood) designed to protect honest debate, are more of a problem than others. If it's okay for the law to distinguish between different kinds of violence and label some as "hate crimes", it beggars belief that it's apparently too subtle for you to distinguish between different kinds of insults and say that some are more of a problem than others because they are "hate insults". Even though the principle is identical.

It's precisely because it clearly IS too subtle for you that I gave up - explicitly, again - and on that second thread, because I decided it wasn't worth spending 5 hours of my life trying to explain it to you, knowing full well that you would hold onto your own interpretations no matter what.

Just drop it. I know I'm REALLY bad at dropping things, and it's one of the foibles that Shipmates point out to me, but Dear God I look like a picture of serenity compared to a guy who starts 2 new threads.

And now I'm feeling grumpy because I look really poor next to Ariston.

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Posted                          

quote:

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Originally posted by Kelly Alves:
( calmly makes a Manhatten on the rocks, adds cherry, and tosses it in Boogie's face. Smiles cooly, takes a puff from a cigarette holder, and begins humming "Put the Blame on Mame" while James Cagney stealthily approaches with a grapefruit half. )

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Posted                       

quote:

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Originally posted by saysay:
[..] Now, listen up: people have a right to a certain amount of autonomy. This includes physical autonomy (the right to not have people touch them much less hit them if they don’t want them too). This also includes mental and emotional autonomy (the right to determine how they think and feel for themselves). Others may have a right to comment on that (you’re coming across as angry; I don’t think you’re communicating your thoughts clearly). But the fact that you seem to think that you have some right to determine for others how they think and feel makes you a loathsome toad worthy of all the contempt that anyone can ever heap on your head. In real life, I’ve been literally beaten because people like you think it’s acceptable to use others in their stupid formal games like that, because those kinds of misrepresentations and lies have consequences. And they aren't always just emotional consequences for your victims.

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quote:

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And Orfeo, I can't tell you how appalling I find it that he followed you into private message land. I know you and I have the occasional clash, but you don't deserve that. Since I know he's not going to apologize, I will. I'm sorry you had to go through that.

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Posted                       

quote:

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Originally posted by Kelly Alves:
( calmly makes a Manhatten on the rocks, adds cherry, and tosses it in Boogie's face. Smiles cooly, takes a puff from a cigarette holder, and begins humming "Put the Blame on Mame" while James Cagney stealthily approaches with a grapefruit half. )

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Posted                          

quote:

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Originally posted by Byron:
If I'm replying to a bunch of people throwing insults, it's reasonable for me to assume that they've consented to a response in kind, that they're prepared for it, and that doing so won't hurt their feelings.

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Posted                      

quote:

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Originally posted by Beeswax Altar:

quote:

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Originally posted by Kelly Alves:
( calmly makes a Manhatten on the rocks, adds cherry, and tosses it in Boogie's face. Smiles cooly, takes a puff from a cigarette holder, and begins humming "Put the Blame on Mame" while James Cagney stealthily approaches with a grapefruit half. )

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I hope you used cheap bourbon.

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Posted                       

quote:

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Originally posted by Ariston:
I don't buy your argument that one form of silencing or another—the hemlock cup, the auto-da-fé, the Cross—is the price exacted by civilization.

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quote:

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Originally posted by Ariston:
The removal of bonds, the liberation of humanity, the freedom from all forms of bodily, mental, and spiritual oppression—must we return to a mythical state of nature to find this, or would that not be a good aim for civilization to seek?

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quote:

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Originally posted by Ariston:
Partly, I realize the only reason it's not my name at the top of this Hellcall is because I'm just quieter, get bored too easily, and have a tendency to delete half of what I write. I'm at least as much of an emotionless, prideful asshole as anyone else here; I just hide it better.

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quote:

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Originally posted by RuthW:
IngoB, I don't know if you're feeling public-spirited at the moment, but you'd be doing the denizens a huge favor if you'd draw an argumentative bead on Byron. Plus it's your thread -- don't let him usurp it!

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quote:

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Originally posted by Firenze:
What a good idea. Bourbon I mean, not cheap bourbon. Maker's Mark, here I come.

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Posted                       

quote:

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Originally posted by orfeo:
Dear Byron,

You missed the timing point, which was the critical one, completely. You wanted to know why your apology wasn't accepted. THAT WAS WHY.

Looks like you also missed the part where I acknowledged my own lack of grace.

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quote:

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I scrolled past the rest. Apparently I've read it before. Also, I've gone back into the not caring mode again because let's face it, it's possible to predict the next 2 or 3 steps in this conversation without breaking a sweat.

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quote:

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Originally posted by orfeo:
Oh God, I couldn't help notice another bit. A tort that looks exactly like a crime.



You know just enough about the law to make a complete fool of yourself every time you talk about it.

ALL torts look exactly like crimes.

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quote:

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Originally posted by RooK:
Dear misinterpreting fuckface,

Nobody is even remotely upset by your insults. They're amusingly clumsy, but we understand that such skills take a while to cultivate.

What many people are feeling - justifiably - frustrated with, is your liberal alterations of what you claim other people are saying. This is further self-scuttled by the conjecture you present for their reasoning or assertions about what feelings they did, or should, have.

You have yet to actually engage with anybody, even once, with an even marginally accurate conceptualization of their stance. THAT is why you are reviled. Asshole.

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Posted                          

quote:

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Originally posted by Byron:
What "stance"?

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quote:

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This thread...

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Posted                      

quote:

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Originally posted by Byron:
In the sense of two parties in an adversarial proceeding, sure. In the sense of the weight of the state bearing down on an individual, not so much.

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Posted                          

quote:

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Originally posted by Byron:
There's a world of difference between Barfly Jim pursuing Ye Olde Whisky Store for giving him the wrong brand of bourbon, and the full might of the state censoring the expression of an opinion, with threat of contempt proceedings if it's disobeyed.

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Posted                       

quote:

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Originally posted by RooK:

quote:

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Originally posted by Byron:
What "stance"?

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You know, those things that people post? They have meaning. Sometimes.

quote:

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This thread...

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...had fuck-all to do with you.
Then you started mis-representing their stances, like you seem to invariably do.
Then they started pointing out that this is a pattern with you, and would you please fuck off and die?

And here we are. Watching shit come out of an asshole.

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Posted                      

quote:

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Originally posted by Yorick:
.... Mousethief Cooler!


(A la Mornington Crescent, but for Hell threads that need to fucking die already)

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This is the last sig I'll ever write for you...

Posted                      

quote:

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Originally posted by no prophet's flag is set so...:

quote:

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Originally posted by Doc Tor:
Veneration of the Turd

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St. IgnoB of Shit gets a feast day.

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Posted                         

quote:

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Originally posted by Doc Tor:
Neither the proposed Veneration of the Turd, nor the faux transatlantic posturing is sufficient to disturb my hostly slumbers... yet.

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Posted                      

quote:

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Originally posted by Pyx_e:
Mummy make the thread stop.

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Posted                      

quote:

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Originally posted by Pyx_e:
Mummy make the thread stop.

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Posted                      

quote:

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Originally posted by Pyx_e:
Star Wars redux

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Posted                       

quote:

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Originally posted by Pyx_e:
Star Wars redux

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Posted                       

quote:

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Originally posted by Pyx_e:
Star Wars redux

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Posted                          

quote:

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Originally posted by orfeo:
There are links, and then there are links.

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