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Source: (consider it)
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Thread: Purgatory: U.S. Presidential Election 2016
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Doublethink.
Ship's Foolwise Unperson
# 1984
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by romanlion:
quote:
Originally posted by Doublethink.:
quote:
Originally posted by irish_lord99:
Now Trump is issuing approval of beating up a Black Lives Matter protester at his rally. Washington Post article here.
Truly a fascist, can't allow any dissenting opinions or beliefs.
I don't understand why his opponents aren't making more of his previous massive debt problems. Given people's worries about federal economic management.
I mean seriously what individual gets 1 billion dollars into debt ?. The corporate bankruptcies are also pretty massive.
How could debt problems possibly be a dis-qualifier for a candidate?
It's more like a prerequisite, and good luck to the eventual winner if they hope to outdo their predecessor on debt.
He wasn't in debt because of his campaign expenses, but because he drastically mismanaged personal and business finances.
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All political thinking for years past has been vitiated in the same way. People can foresee the future only when it coincides with their own wishes, and the most grossly obvious facts can be ignored when they are unwelcome. George Orwell
Posts: 19219 | From: Erehwon | Registered: Aug 2005
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Brenda Clough
Shipmate
# 18061
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Posted
Love it, Croesos!
And mismanagement of personal finances is an even worse augury than mismanagement of the campaign finances. Those at least are arcane in regulation, and you can always blame your campaign manager. If you get into personal debt you have only yourself.
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Science fiction and fantasy writer with a Patreon page
Posts: 6378 | From: Washington DC | Registered: Mar 2014
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irish_lord99
Shipmate
# 16250
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Posted
I'm pretty sure Roman Lion was referring to national debt.
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"There are three kinds of lies: lies, damned lies, and statistics." - Mark Twain
Posts: 1169 | From: Maine, US | Registered: Feb 2011
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cliffdweller
Shipmate
# 13338
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Posted
Interestingly,John Kasich goes full-on Godwin in addressing Trump. There's no denying it's a "Godwin" but can anyone also deny that it's spot on?
quote:
"I would like anyone who is listening to consider some thoughts that I've paraphrased from the words of German Pastor Martin Niemoller.
You might not care if Donald Trump says Muslims must register with the government because you're not one. And you might not care if Donald Trump says he's going to round up all the Hispanic immigrants because you're not one. And you might not care if Donald Trump says it's OK to rough up black protesters because you're not one. And you might not care that Donald Trump wants to suppress journalist because you're not one. But think about this, if he keeps going and he actually becomes President, he might just get around to you and you better hope that's there someone left to help you."
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"Here is the world. Beautiful and terrible things will happen. Don't be afraid." -Frederick Buechner
Posts: 11242 | From: a small canyon overlooking the city | Registered: Jan 2008
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fausto
Shipmate
# 13737
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by cliffdweller:
Interestingly,John Kasich goes full-on Godwin in addressing Trump. There's no denying it's a "Godwin" but can anyone also deny that it's spot on?
quote:
"I would like anyone who is listening to consider some thoughts that I've paraphrased from the words of German Pastor Martin Niemoller.
You might not care if Donald Trump says Muslims must register with the government because you're not one. And you might not care if Donald Trump says he's going to round up all the Hispanic immigrants because you're not one. And you might not care if Donald Trump says it's OK to rough up black protesters because you're not one. And you might not care that Donald Trump wants to suppress journalist because you're not one. But think about this, if he keeps going and he actually becomes President, he might just get around to you and you better hope that's there someone left to help you."
I think it's valid to carve out a Niemöller exception to Godwin's Law.
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"Truth did not come into the world naked, but it came in types and images. The world will not receive truth in any other way." Gospel of Philip, Logion 72
Posts: 407 | From: Boston, Mass. | Registered: May 2008
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Enoch
Shipmate
# 14322
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by fausto:
I think it's valid to carve out a Niemöller exception to Godwin's Law.
Fausto, please can you explain exactly what you mean by that, to a foreigner who finds Trump a very frightening nightmare, but as a foreigner does not get either reference?
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Brexit wrexit - Sir Graham Watson
Posts: 7610 | From: Bristol UK(was European Green Capital 2015, now Ljubljana) | Registered: Nov 2008
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mousethief
Ship's Thieving Rodent
# 953
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Posted
The trouble with Godwinphobia is that some people may actually start heading down a very Nazi road, and if we're not allowed to say anything about it for fear of violating some artificial law, then we won't say anything about it till it's too late.
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This is the last sig I'll ever write for you...
Posts: 63536 | From: Washington | Registered: Jul 2001
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Pigwidgeon
Ship's Owl
# 10192
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Enoch:
quote:
Originally posted by fausto:
I think it's valid to carve out a Niemöller exception to Godwin's Law.
Fausto, please can you explain exactly what you mean by that, to a foreigner who finds Trump a very frightening nightmare, but as a foreigner does not get either reference?
I'm not Fausto, but I assume he was referring to this famous quote from Niemöller.
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"...that is generally a matter for Pigwidgeon, several other consenting adults, a bottle of cheap Gin and the odd giraffe."
~Tortuf
Posts: 9835 | From: Hogwarts | Registered: Aug 2005
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fausto
Shipmate
# 13737
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Enoch:
quote:
Originally posted by fausto:
I think it's valid to carve out a Niemöller exception to Godwin's Law.
Fausto, please can you explain exactly what you mean by that, to a foreigner who finds Trump a very frightening nightmare, but as a foreigner does not get either reference?
"Godwin's Law" has been expressed various ways, but it's usually some variant on the proposition that the first debater to resort to comparing his/her opponent to Hitler loses. I am suggesting that invoking Niemöller's "First they came..." quotation isn't quite the same thing and can therefore be deemed an exception which keeps Kasich's comments within the realm of acceptability, even though indeed Niemöller originally was talking about the Nazis. If you want to get all formal and logical about it, I would call it an appeal to moral authority and a call to moral vigilance rather than a direct ad hominem attack.
For some background on Niemöller and his quotation: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/First_they_came_...
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"Truth did not come into the world naked, but it came in types and images. The world will not receive truth in any other way." Gospel of Philip, Logion 72
Posts: 407 | From: Boston, Mass. | Registered: May 2008
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cliffdweller
Shipmate
# 13338
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by fausto:
quote:
Originally posted by Enoch:
quote:
Originally posted by fausto:
I think it's valid to carve out a Niemöller exception to Godwin's Law.
Fausto, please can you explain exactly what you mean by that, to a foreigner who finds Trump a very frightening nightmare, but as a foreigner does not get either reference?
"Godwin's Law" has been expressed various ways, but it's usually some variant on the proposition that the first debater to resort to comparing his/her opponent to Hitler loses. I am suggesting that invoking Niemöller's "First they came..." quotation isn't quite the same thing and can therefore be deemed an exception which keeps Kasich's comments within the realm of acceptability, even though indeed Niemöller originally was talking about the Nazis. If you want to get all formal and logical about it, I would call it an appeal to moral authority and a call to moral vigilance rather than a direct ad hominem attack.
For some background on Niemöller and his quotation: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/First_they_came_...
Yes, exactly that.
And, to piggyback on Mousethief's comment-- the problem with "Godwinism" is that overindulgence in Nazi-comparisons becomes so tiresome that it makes it all that much harder to point out when someone really IS seeming to head down that path. And honestly, as Kasich is pointing out, it really does seem like Trump is troding some all-too-familiar territory.
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"Here is the world. Beautiful and terrible things will happen. Don't be afraid." -Frederick Buechner
Posts: 11242 | From: a small canyon overlooking the city | Registered: Jan 2008
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orfeo
Ship's Musical Counterpoint
# 13878
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Posted
Any "law" is a problem if people apply it mindlessly without understanding what its purpose is.
(See also: the Bechdel test, which was never supposed to be proof that you'd made a good movie, and was rather an indictment of just how few movies fulfil even the most basic gender equality requirements.)
Posts: 18173 | From: Under | Registered: Jul 2008
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Palimpsest
Shipmate
# 16772
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Posted
The NY Times has a fun article Wary of Donald Trump, G.O.P. Leaders Are Caught in a Standoff
They are beginning to fear that Trump may get the Republican Nomination by sweeping the first 3 primaries. The establishment thinks that if that happens, not only will they lose the Presidencty, but the wave may swamp congressional and state republican candidates; possibly even losing them the control of the Senate.
Many are horrified at the thought but don't want to try to challenge Trump in public.
Posts: 2990 | From: Seattle WA. US | Registered: Nov 2011
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Twilight
Puddleglum's sister
# 2832
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Posted
A few weeks ago Trump received a question he didn't like from a reporter with a disability -- one of those common disabilities that caused his hands to permanently bend at the wrist. Trump, talking to the crowd from the podium, proceeded to mock the man, bending his own wrists and flapping his arms. It was shocking behavior and I was sure his chances were finally over. Nope. He still gets cheering crowds. Now, it's those crowds I'm most worried about. Can we get the G-men to come for them?
Posts: 6817 | Registered: May 2002
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Brenda Clough
Shipmate
# 18061
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Posted
The GOP system is set up as a coronation. The idea is that somebody emerges as the strong candidate and is crowned in a series of triumphant primaries, giving him (it is always a man) that winner look as he heads into the general election. Compare and contrast with the Democratic setup, which is ordinarily more contentious -- analogies of the circular firing squad are often evoked.
This has always worked fine when some guy does move out in front early. This year it has bitten the GOP in the butt. Meanwhile, Hillary seems to have gone the coronation route. At this moment I would say she is unstoppable.
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Science fiction and fantasy writer with a Patreon page
Posts: 6378 | From: Washington DC | Registered: Mar 2014
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Barnabas62
Shipmate
# 9110
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Posted
The problem with the GOP choosing Trump - if they do - is not the high probability that he would be demolished in the election. It is the low probability that something incredibly damaging emerges re Hillary Clinton which provokes a backlash.
To misquote a famous quote from a previous presidential election. Even if Hillary Clinton turns out to be a louse, Donald Trump is already a proven double-louse. In the interests of the entire globe, even a very small risk of a double-louse getting into the White House gives me the shivers.
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Who is it that you seek? How then shall we live? How shall we sing the Lord's song in a strange land?
Posts: 21397 | From: Norfolk UK | Registered: Feb 2005
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Crœsos
Shipmate
# 238
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Brenda Clough:
The GOP system is set up as a coronation. The idea is that somebody emerges as the strong candidate and is crowned in a series of triumphant primaries, giving him (it is always a man) that winner look as he heads into the general election. Compare and contrast with the Democratic setup, which is ordinarily more contentious -- analogies of the circular firing squad are often evoked.
There was a hint of this in the last Republican primary, with each candidate in turn serving as the not-Romney of the moment, someone to focus the hopes of all Republicans who just didn't like Mitt Romney. Then Romney won the nomination. There seems to be a much stronger desire this time around for a non-Trump, and a lot of the Republican primaries that were winner-take-all in 2012 have switched over to proportional awarding of delegates, so some of the factors that led to the Romney coronation have been mitigated this time around.
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Humani nil a me alienum puto
Posts: 10706 | From: Sardis, Lydia | Registered: May 2001
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Brenda Clough
Shipmate
# 18061
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Posted
I think it is fair to say that Trump would be a complete calamity as president. He had to be an entrepreneur and make his own fortune, because nobody in their right mind would ever hire him. (Would you?)
To contemplate what would happen if a President Trump came toe to toe against a member of the reality-based community (like say Vladimir Putin) is just too fearful to contemplate.
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Science fiction and fantasy writer with a Patreon page
Posts: 6378 | From: Washington DC | Registered: Mar 2014
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Amanda B. Reckondwythe
Dressed for Church
# 5521
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Brenda Clough:
To contemplate what would happen if a President Trump came toe to toe against a member of the reality-based community (like say Vladimir Putin) is just too fearful to contemplate.
Well, considering Vladimir Putin to be a member of the reality-based community is pretty fearful in and of itself. ![[Eek!]](eek.gif)
One can only hope that Congress, who, after all, runs the country -- the President is essentially powerless -- would stop their internal bickering long enough to actually begin governing.
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"I take prayer too seriously to use it as an excuse for avoiding work and responsibility." -- The Revd Martin Luther King Jr.
Posts: 10542 | From: The Great Southwest | Registered: Feb 2004
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Barnabas62
Shipmate
# 9110
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Posted
@ lowlands boy
Congress, and particularly the House of Representatives, has exercised control over what its members saw as a lefty radical socialist un-American President. A proportion of its membership has struck me as pretty much 'ugly American'.
Do I see Congress controlling a hypothetical President Trump? Not really. In the unlikely scenario that Trump wins because of a Clinton backlash, the H of R might even become more 'ugly American'. Not so sure about the Senate but if it retained a GOP majority as well, there would be scope for a dystopian perfect storm.
Maybe I'm getting paranoid in my old age? More risk averse? Could be.
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Who is it that you seek? How then shall we live? How shall we sing the Lord's song in a strange land?
Posts: 21397 | From: Norfolk UK | Registered: Feb 2005
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Barnabas62
Shipmate
# 9110
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Barnabas62:
Maybe I'm getting paranoid in my old age?
This didn't help any of my paranoid tendencies.
Trump has tapped into some really dark aspects of the "Zeitgeist" (def: the defining spirit or mood of a particular period of history as shown by the ideas and beliefs of the time.)
It's a remarkable and chilling analysis of the power of charismatic demagoguery. I'm not surprised the NY Times has decided to take him on. He's dangerous.
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Who is it that you seek? How then shall we live? How shall we sing the Lord's song in a strange land?
Posts: 21397 | From: Norfolk UK | Registered: Feb 2005
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Soror Magna
Shipmate
# 9881
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Posted
Donald Trump doesn't necessarily hold all the standard hyper-conservative positions - wasn't he pro-choice at one time? - but it doesn't seem to matter. I heard one commentator say, "He likes eminent domain", but the overwhelming majority of his supporters couldn't tell you what eminent domain is even after the new freeway wiped out their front lawn. He's not a clever entrepreneur - I mean, how stupid do you have to be to lose money in the casino business? He's already stated that Latinos should be rounded up and deported and Muslims should have to register with the government and be placed under surveillance. Those aren't conservative policies, they're Nazi policies. He is a demagogue, but a demagogue with no values or scruples, and apparently nobody cares. I can understand (sort of) being fascinated by a personality candidate; I can't understand being fascinated to the point of overlooking ignorance, immaturity, incompetence and inexperience. And while I firmly believe that people with mental illnesses can be good citizens, a bat-shit-and-outhouse-rat-crazy narcissist with borderline personality disorder should be kept as far away from that red button as possible. The primaries are coming. Caveat voter.
(Caveat emptor = buyer beware)
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"You come with me to room 1013 over at the hospital, I'll show you America. Terminal, crazy and mean." -- Tony Kushner, "Angels in America"
Posts: 5430 | From: Caprica City | Registered: Jul 2005
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Barnabas62
Shipmate
# 9110
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Soror Magna:
... a bat-shit-and-outhouse-rat-crazy narcissist with borderline personality disorder should be kept as far away from that red button as possible.
Preach it, sister. From this side of the pond, that looks a pretty good summary. Apparently though, 'you can still fool some of the people all of the time'. The centre of gravity of the GOP appears to be going ' bat-shit-and-outhouse-rat-crazy' as well. And I thought Sarah Palin would be the nadir. What the hell do I know ...
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Who is it that you seek? How then shall we live? How shall we sing the Lord's song in a strange land?
Posts: 21397 | From: Norfolk UK | Registered: Feb 2005
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lilBuddha
Shipmate
# 14333
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Posted
I clicked here to reference that very article. And what SM touches on is where the NYT feared to reference; Hitler. And, no, it is not Godwin.
Hitler used fear and a focus on the "other" to win support. Hitler was charismatic and used the same tactics. Fear, hate and entertainment. Aiming at the insecurities, eschewing reason.
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I put on my rockin' shoes in the morning
Hallellou, hallellou
Posts: 17627 | From: the round earth's imagined corners | Registered: Dec 2008
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itsarumdo
Shipmate
# 18174
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Barnabas62:
The problem with the GOP choosing Trump - if they do - is not the high probability that he would be demolished in the election. It is the low probability that something incredibly damaging emerges re Hillary Clinton which provokes a backlash.
To misquote a famous quote from a previous presidential election. Even if Hillary Clinton turns out to be a louse, Donald Trump is already a proven double-louse. In the interests of the entire globe, even a very small risk of a double-louse getting into the White House gives me the shivers.
Interesting to read a biog of Kurt G:odel - he only just managed to get citizenship if the US because Einstein shut him up long enough to distract the immigration official. He was describing how (logically) the US could become a dictatorship even under the "land of the free" constitution.
http://morgenstern.jeffreykegler.com
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"Iti sapis potanda tinone" Lycophron
Posts: 994 | From: Planet Zog | Registered: Jul 2014
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Doublethink.
Ship's Foolwise Unperson
# 1984
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Posted
So Trump's just said this - the BBC reporter on the 10 o'clock news said that when they first recieved the press release they thought it was a hoax.
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All political thinking for years past has been vitiated in the same way. People can foresee the future only when it coincides with their own wishes, and the most grossly obvious facts can be ignored when they are unwelcome. George Orwell
Posts: 19219 | From: Erehwon | Registered: Aug 2005
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Brenda Clough
Shipmate
# 18061
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Posted
Every time you think The Donald has hit bottom, he finds a shovel and gets lower. It's amazing.
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Science fiction and fantasy writer with a Patreon page
Posts: 6378 | From: Washington DC | Registered: Mar 2014
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Pigwidgeon
Ship's Owl
# 10192
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Brenda Clough:
Every time you think The Donald has hit bottom, he finds a shovel and gets lower. It's amazing.
And his poll numbers will probably go up.
![[Roll Eyes]](rolleyes.gif)
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"...that is generally a matter for Pigwidgeon, several other consenting adults, a bottle of cheap Gin and the odd giraffe."
~Tortuf
Posts: 9835 | From: Hogwarts | Registered: Aug 2005
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Leorning Cniht
Shipmate
# 17564
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Doublethink.:
So Trump's just said this - the BBC reporter on the 10 o'clock news said that when they first recieved the press release they thought it was a hoax.
When politics is indistinguishable from the Onion...
Posts: 5026 | From: USA | Registered: Feb 2013
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Barnabas62
Shipmate
# 9110
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Soror Magna:
..a bat-shit-and-outhouse-rat-crazy narcissist with borderline personality disorder ..
We can now delete "borderline" and insert "malevolent".
I note that some supporters have reacted favourably. I'm going to put a clothes peg on my nose and sample Fox News.
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Who is it that you seek? How then shall we live? How shall we sing the Lord's song in a strange land?
Posts: 21397 | From: Norfolk UK | Registered: Feb 2005
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Barnabas62
Shipmate
# 9110
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Posted
True. Except that as the article indicates 'borderline' doesn't really cut it. And in any case, Trump is in a class of his own.
So, yes. I accept that it's made up. Time will tell what combination of madness and badness may be legitimately applied.
When I checked the website a couple of hours ago Fox News seemed to be in processing mode. That's unusual.
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Who is it that you seek? How then shall we live? How shall we sing the Lord's song in a strange land?
Posts: 21397 | From: Norfolk UK | Registered: Feb 2005
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Sioni Sais
Shipmate
# 5713
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Crœsos:
quote:
Originally posted by Barnabas62:
quote:
Originally posted by Soror Magna:
...a bat-shit-and-outhouse-rat-crazy narcissist with borderline personality disorder ...
We can now delete "borderline" and insert "malevolent".
Except that borderline personality disorder is an actual, diagnosable mental health condition, whereas "malevolent personality disorder" is just something made up.
OK, will "malevolent personality" do? It isn't a disorder IMHO, just a posture in an attempt to go for the hate vote. Trump's team has seen the FN do well using this in France and they want the same, sure-fire vote winner. If he gets the nomination then the Democrats had better get the Black and Hispanic vote out on their side.
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"He isn't Doctor Who, he's The Doctor"
(Paul Sinha, BBC)
Posts: 24276 | From: Newport, Wales | Registered: Apr 2004
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Eutychus
From the edge
# 3081
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Sioni Sais:
It isn't a disorder IMHO, just a posture in an attempt to go for the hate vote. Trump's team has seen the FN do well using this in France and they want the same, sure-fire vote winner.
Yes, I was just thinking he made Marine Le Pen look halfway respectable.
But I fear enough voters actually do think such positions are respectable.
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Let's remember that we are to build the Kingdom of God, not drive people away - pastor Frank Pomeroy
Posts: 17944 | From: 528491 | Registered: Jul 2002
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lilBuddha
Shipmate
# 14333
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Eutychus:
But I fear enough voters actually do think such positions are respectable.
ISTM, fear is the key to why Trump is popular. Hate plays well when people are scared.
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I put on my rockin' shoes in the morning
Hallellou, hallellou
Posts: 17627 | From: the round earth's imagined corners | Registered: Dec 2008
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Barnabas62
Shipmate
# 9110
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Posted
The Fox News website gives prominence to swingeing criticisms from both left and right using Jeb Bush's "unhinged" comment in its headline.
I need brain bleach for some of the rest of the stuff I looked at, but I guess that article is a sign that Trump has gone too far, even for Fox.
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Who is it that you seek? How then shall we live? How shall we sing the Lord's song in a strange land?
Posts: 21397 | From: Norfolk UK | Registered: Feb 2005
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Doublethink.
Ship's Foolwise Unperson
# 1984
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Posted
For no apparent reason I am moved to note, here, criteria 1,2, 5 & 6 of the ICD-10 dissocial personality disorder diagnosis.
[ 08. December 2015, 07:33: Message edited by: Doublethink. ]
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All political thinking for years past has been vitiated in the same way. People can foresee the future only when it coincides with their own wishes, and the most grossly obvious facts can be ignored when they are unwelcome. George Orwell
Posts: 19219 | From: Erehwon | Registered: Aug 2005
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Enoch
Shipmate
# 14322
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Posted
He certainly frightens me.
Even though he's a really nice guy. He must be. He says so. From this BBC site.
quote:
"I'm a really nice guy, believe me, I pride myself on being a nice guy ... "
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Brexit wrexit - Sir Graham Watson
Posts: 7610 | From: Bristol UK(was European Green Capital 2015, now Ljubljana) | Registered: Nov 2008
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Barnabas62
Shipmate
# 9110
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Posted
Some reactions.
"Just when you think he can't stoop lower, he does".
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Who is it that you seek? How then shall we live? How shall we sing the Lord's song in a strange land?
Posts: 21397 | From: Norfolk UK | Registered: Feb 2005
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passer
Indigo
# 13329
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Posted
Surely everybody, including Trump himself, acknowledges that he isn't going to be elected as POTUS. Based on that premise, and his great wealth, and his narcissistic personality, and his realization that he can take advantage of the free speech maxim he so abuses, he's just an everyday sociopath who's having a laugh at everyone's expense, for his own amusement, because there's no-one to stop him. Perhaps he hopes to trigger an uprising or something, without considering that such an event would almost certainly result in the loss of all the manifestations of mammon upon which he rests, and the disappearance of his hangers-on. There's a phrase in a song:
"A piece of the action, pieces of gold, everyone's paid well and does what they're told"
I do wonder who will turn up for his funeral, when that eventually comes to pass. There will be a lot of people quietly making lists of those attendees!
Posts: 1289 | From: Sheffield | Registered: Jan 2008
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Doublethink.
Ship's Foolwise Unperson
# 1984
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Posted
I think Trump probably now thinks he can make it to the white house, even if he didn't at the begining of his campaign.
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All political thinking for years past has been vitiated in the same way. People can foresee the future only when it coincides with their own wishes, and the most grossly obvious facts can be ignored when they are unwelcome. George Orwell
Posts: 19219 | From: Erehwon | Registered: Aug 2005
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Augustine the Aleut
Shipmate
# 1472
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Doublethink.:
I think Trump probably now thinks he can make it to the white house, even if he didn't at the begining of his campaign.
Having once worked closely with a politician who had no real chance of getting to the top, but who campaigned anyway (I note that he was in no way a Donald Trump, being an educated and highly-qualified progressive), we should not underestimate the heroin-like attraction of the footlights, microphone, and attentive media-- like any other addiction, it overrules whatever common sense there may have been to begin with. As one of my younger friends would say, he is in it for the ride and the rush.
Posts: 6236 | From: Ottawa, Canada | Registered: Oct 2001
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Brenda Clough
Shipmate
# 18061
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Posted
And he has nothing to lose. He can make money forever writing venomous books, bloviating on talk shows, and tweeting inflammatory comments. This is the best career move he has ever made. He certainly has no idea of actually doing the work of governance, and will certainly delegate everything difficult to minions of dubious competence.
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Science fiction and fantasy writer with a Patreon page
Posts: 6378 | From: Washington DC | Registered: Mar 2014
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LeRoc
Famous Dutch pirate
# 3216
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Posted
quote:
Augustine the Aleut: As one of my younger friends would say, he is in it for the ride and the rush.
I would say the same thing. My theory still is that he doesn't want to become the president. In fact, this would be his biggest fear.
Ego is part of it of course, but at this stage it is more about the game: "what outrageous things can I get away with saying?" Part of him may be hoping that one of these things will get him out of the race.
The problem is, he is stirring up a segment of the population that won't go away, even after he loses.
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I know why God made the rhinoceros, it's because He couldn't see the rhinoceros, so He made the rhinoceros to be able to see it. (Clarice Lispector)
Posts: 9474 | From: Brazil / Africa | Registered: Aug 2002
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Twilight
Puddleglum's sister
# 2832
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Barnabas62:
Some reactions.
From Barnabas's link: quote:
"Trump's overreaction is as dangerous as President Obama's under-reaction."
— Carly Fiorina, former technology executive and GOP candidate for president.
Shudder. This may be how a mean-spirited, war monger like Fiorina gets in the White House. Compared to Trump, she seems reasonable and moderate. Trump and his creepy, cheering crowds are setting off all my paranoid alarms -- such as: Could the 1% be paying Trump to set up their candidate/puppet of choice?
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Posts: 6817 | Registered: May 2002
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no prophet's flag is set so...
Proceed to see sea
# 15560
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Doublethink.:
For no apparent reason I am moved to note, here, criteria 1,2, 5 & 6 of the ICD-10 dissocial personality disorder diagnosis.
quote:
Originally posted by Sioni Sais:
OK, will "malevolent personality" do? It isn't a disorder IMHO, just a posture in an attempt to go for the hate vote. Trump's team has seen the FN do well using this in France and they want the same, sure-fire vote winner. If he gets the nomination then the Democrats had better get the Black and Hispanic vote out on their side.
We're not tied to ICD or DSM when discussing personality I shouldn't think. The malevolent idea corresponds with a different description and taxonomy: Assertive/Sadistic by Theodore Millon. Particularly the phenomenological section.
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Out of this nettle, danger, we pluck this flower, safety.
\_(ツ)_/
Posts: 11498 | From: Treaty 6 territory in the nonexistant Province of Buffalo, Canada ↄ⃝' | Registered: Mar 2010
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Brenda Clough
Shipmate
# 18061
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Posted
Word is, unbelievably, that even Dick Cheney has denounced Trump. If the Dark Lord of the Sith comes out against him, he has gone as low as one can go.
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Science fiction and fantasy writer with a Patreon page
Posts: 6378 | From: Washington DC | Registered: Mar 2014
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passer
Indigo
# 13329
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by LeRoc:
Part of him may be hoping that one of these things will get him out of the race.
I did wonder about this. This ego-trip will cost him more and more the longer it continues.
Posts: 1289 | From: Sheffield | Registered: Jan 2008
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Doublethink.
Ship's Foolwise Unperson
# 1984
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Posted
Trump is now spouting rubbish about London, to which the mayoral candidates have responded thusly:
quote:
Conservative Zac Goldsmith said Mr Trump's position was "repellent", and said he was "an appalling creature... one of the most malignant figures in politics".
Labour's Sadiq Khan said the billionaire "can't just be dismissed as a buffoon - his comments are outrageous, divisive and dangerous
(Goldsmith demonstrating our famous English reserve there.)
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All political thinking for years past has been vitiated in the same way. People can foresee the future only when it coincides with their own wishes, and the most grossly obvious facts can be ignored when they are unwelcome. George Orwell
Posts: 19219 | From: Erehwon | Registered: Aug 2005
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Brenda Clough
Shipmate
# 18061
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Posted
I also hear of a petition to get Trump barred from the UK, as an open racist. I urge the UK to look into his holdings there as well. Get some tax money out of him.
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Science fiction and fantasy writer with a Patreon page
Posts: 6378 | From: Washington DC | Registered: Mar 2014
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