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Source: (consider it) Thread: Purgatory: U.S. Presidential Election 2016
Brenda Clough
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Post columnist E. J. Dionne discusses the Christianity professed by the candidates.

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romanlion
editorial comment
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Isn't it odd that a 68 year old woman, known to have pneumonia, who has already ignored a doctor's advice and who collapses in mild weather is not taken directly to the hospital but instead taken to visit her daughter and young grandchildren?

For that matter that she would attend a large public gathering at all? Never mind for her own health, but for the health of others?

Strange behavior for such a bright, competent and capable adult with a potentially contagious illness.

Of course if her malady is known not to be contagious at all it makes a little more sense I suppose...

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"You can't get rich in politics unless you're a crook" - Harry S. Truman

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sabine
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Saw a cartoon where a woman answering a poster says "I was going to vote for her, but now that I know she's dehydrated and has pneumonia, I'll have to vote for the racist, sexist, xenophobic one."

sabine

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"Hunger looks like the man that hunger is killing." Eduardo Galeano

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Amanda B. Reckondwythe

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I've said it before and I'll say it again: Hillary continues to give us reasons not to vote for her. Clearly there is something about her health that she's not being completely straightforward about. I'm tired of the evasive answers.

Not that there's any other viable candidate, mind you. I'll still vote for her, reasons not to and all. The alternative is unthinkable.

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"I take prayer too seriously to use it as an excuse for avoiding work and responsibility." -- The Revd Martin Luther King Jr.

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sabine
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quote:
Originally posted by Amanda B. Reckondwythe:

I've said it before and I'll say it again: Hillary continues to give us reasons not to vote for her. Clearly there is something about her health that she's not being completely straightforward about. I'm tired of the evasive answers.

Not that there's any other viable candidate, mind you. I'll still vote for her, reasons not to and all. The alternative is unthinkable.

Yes, it's an election year that doesn't whip up much enthusiasm.

sabine

[ 13. September 2016, 03:40: Message edited by: sabine ]

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"Hunger looks like the man that hunger is killing." Eduardo Galeano

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Golden Key
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romanlion--

80F is not a mild weather temperature. Many people aren't comfortable past 70F. Even without pneumonia, dehydration, and a rugged schedule.

As I said before, imagine the uproar if she'd missed the 9/11 commemoration. She would've been labeled a supporter of terrorism. Of course, she's already been labeled that.

IIRC, you plan not to vote for either Trump or Hillary, in order to stand on your principles. That's one way to go. But some of us are more pragmatic: we know that *someone* is going to be president; and that person will affect our lives, the country, and the world in all sorts of ways. So we feel we have to pick the one who can do the best job, hopefully in line with our principles.

For me, that's Hillary. I've watched her change and grow; seen her make mistakes; been angry with and disappointed in her; sympathized with her; been proud of her when she didn't kill her husband when he embarrassed her in front of the world--which, I think, shows a level of self-restraint that would be very handy for a president; was happy that she became Secretary of State, and think she did a good job; seen her *earn* her chance, this time around. And she's the best chance to finally have a woman president.

As a Green, I wrote her in on the 2008 primary ballot. Write-ins don't always get counted. So, this time, I switched to the Democratic party. This is that important to me.

romanlion, if you could only vote for Trump or Hillary, on the pragmatic basis of choosing which would do the best job and avoiding the one who would be most dangerous, who would you pick? Thx.


sabine--

LOL. Do you happen to have a link? Or at least remember where you saw it? Thx.

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--"Oh bat bladders, do you have to bring common sense into this?" (Dragon, "Jane & the Dragon")
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mousethief

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# 953

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Oh noes! Hillary got pneumonia. Normal people never get pneumonia, only people with lifelong degenerative diseases. What's she hiding? Why won't she tell us?

My God it sounds like a cross between Fox News and an infomercial for Airborne™.

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This is the last sig I'll ever write for you...

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romanlion
editorial comment
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quote:
Originally posted by Golden Key:


romanlion, if you could only vote for Trump or Hillary, on the pragmatic basis of choosing which would do the best job and avoiding the one who would be most dangerous, who would you pick? Thx.

Unless I were compelled by the law to cast a vote, I would abstain.

Hillary is every bit the arrogant, self-serving, elitist piece of shit that Trump is, only without the odd knack for mass appeal he has. She has been after this job since before her husband won, and has had her chance IMO. Thank you ma'am, but please sit down...before you fall...

Should she win, she will be dragged to the finish just like she was dragged into that van, under the power of others and completely off her feet.

Seeing her crumple on the street I actually felt worse for her detail than I did for her.

Were it required by law that I cast a vote, a simple coin toss would suffice.

quote:
Originally posted by Golden Key:


sabine--

LOL. Do you happen to have a link? Or at least remember where you saw it? Thx.

You wanna see something
funny?

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"You can't get rich in politics unless you're a crook" - Harry S. Truman

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mdijon
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quote:
Originally posted by romanlion:
Strange behavior for such a bright, competent and capable adult with a potentially contagious illness.

It wouldn't take much googling to find out that pneumonia doesn't generally require isolation. Less time than speculating on what it would say about Clinton if isolation was required. I guess that would be less fun though.

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Teekeey Misha
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quote:
Originally posted by romanlion:
Isn't it odd that a 68 year old woman, known to have pneumonia, who has already ignored a doctor's advice and who collapses in mild weather is not taken directly to the hospital but instead taken to visit her daughter and young grandchildren?

For that matter that she would attend a large public gathering at all? Never mind for her own health, but for the health of others?

Strange behavior for such a bright, competent and capable adult with a potentially contagious illness.

Of course if her malady is known not to be contagious at all it makes a little more sense I suppose...

Wow. And I thought we Brits were suckers for a conspiracy theory!

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Misha
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Callan
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Is it me, or does this election make Mitt Romney versus Obama look like Bertrand Russell vs. Father Copleston debating the existence of God? Back in the days that we were all comparatively sane, the news that an election candidate was poorly would be greeted by his or her opponent with sympathy and good wishes for a speedy recovery, not accusations of some kind of conspiracy to deceive the electorate.

Not only is this lunacy a debasement of our intellects and human sympathy, not only does this lunacy mean that we don't get proper policies, any more. It also means that we get really crap conspiracy theories. At least the idea that Hilary Clinton was a time travelling reptile, posing as a human being was vaguely interesting, albeit probably not interesting enough to make the cut for a "Doctor Who: Missing Adventures" novel. But Hilary Clinton's got pneumonia? Hilary Clinton was a bit careless about her e-mails? BEHOLD THE CONSPIRACY! It's not exactly Bernstein and Woodward territory, is it? At this rate someone is going to have to resign from high office for standing in the 10 items or less queue at the supermarket with eleven items in their basket, or leaving their car on a double yellow line with their hazard lights on whilst they post a letter and we will all look back nostalgically to the days when it was deemed vaguely newsworthy that the Leader of the Opposition looked a bit odd eating a bacon sandwich.

Politics increasingly gives the impression that we've all decided that our problems are basically insuperable, so we are all going to get worked up about trivia, whilst the world burns around us.

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Crœsos
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quote:
Originally posted by romanlion:
Should she win, she will be dragged to the finish just like she was dragged into that van, under the power of others and completely off her feet.

Isn't that the entire premise of democratic elections?

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Humani nil a me alienum puto

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Teekeey Misha
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quote:
Originally posted by Callan:
At this rate someone is going to have to resign from high office for standing in the 10 items or less queue at the supermarket with eleven items in their basket.

*Ten items or fewer, but I entirely agree with your point!

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Misha
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Callan
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quote:
Originally posted by Teekeey Misha:
quote:
Originally posted by Callan:
At this rate someone is going to have to resign from high office for standing in the 10 items or less queue at the supermarket with eleven items in their basket.

*Ten items or fewer, but I entirely agree with your point!
I have let down my constituents and my country, and my primary school teacher Miss Bryant and I resign immediately!

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Marvin the Martian

Interplanetary
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quote:
Originally posted by romanlion:
quote:
Originally posted by rolyn:
Clinton has stated that half of Trump's support comes from a "Basket of Deplorables". Something of a risky strategy to dismiss nearly a quarter of the American Electorate in one sentence

It isn't a strategy, which is why it's so damaging. It is a sincerely held view of tens of millions of Americans from everybody else in the world.
Fixed that for you.

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Hail Gallaxhar

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romanlion
editorial comment
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quote:
Originally posted by Marvin the Martian:
quote:
Originally posted by romanlion:
quote:
Originally posted by rolyn:
Clinton has stated that half of Trump's support comes from a "Basket of Deplorables". Something of a risky strategy to dismiss nearly a quarter of the American Electorate in one sentence

It isn't a strategy, which is why it's so damaging. It is a sincerely held view of tens of millions of Americans from everybody else in the world.
Fixed that for you.
Obviously erroneous, but that's okay.

Veracity has never been a high priority for the Illary set.

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"You can't get rich in politics unless you're a crook" - Harry S. Truman

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Marvin the Martian

Interplanetary
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quote:
Originally posted by romanlion:
Hillary is every bit the arrogant, self-serving, elitist piece of shit that Trump is, only without the odd knack for mass appeal he has.

It's almost like you don't think what they'd actually do once in power matters at all.

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Hail Gallaxhar

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Brenda Clough
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I don't see that the rest of us can emulate you, romanlion. We cannot all abstain. What was stated upthread is true -- somebody has to be president. It is not sin to pick the lesser of two evils. To abstain is simply to hand the choice off to other people and if that's what you want we'll be happy to do it for you.

And the vast conspiracy theories about Hillary's health would make Erich von Daniken proud. The incomparable Alexandra Petri (over at the WaPost, but this is worth a click) summarizes the current state of play, with links! It's hysterical.

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Enoch
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quote:
Originally posted by rolyn:
Clinton has stated that half of Trump's support comes from a "Basket of Deplorables". Something of a risky strategy to dismiss nearly a quarter of the American Electorate in one sentence, (even if she wins in November). ...

I can see that it's reasonable to discuss whether and when it is more ethical to speak one's mind truthfully, or to be tactful. But in the aftermath of our referendum vote, that criticism of people who intend to vote for Trump does strike me as an entirely fair assessment, something that a person is entitled to say, and something that many people should be saying, even if Mrs Clinton might have been more discreet perhaps not quite so openly to be one of them.

I am not saying, by the way, that all those that voted to leave are 'Deplorables'. I can accept that a small proportion of them voted for honourable reasons, even if misguided and politically naïve. But it does strike me that the only people who have an ethical justification for voting for Mr Trump are those who are his close personal relatives so that they may feel they are tied to him by duties of loyalty.

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Brexit wrexit - Sir Graham Watson

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Teekeey Misha
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quote:
Originally posted by Brenda Clough:
It is not sin to pick the lesser of two evils.

Maybe it is a sin? Perhaps the prospect of selecting from two evils is God's way of saying, "Hey Brenda! We've got a multitude of evils standing here and I need y'all to get on in there and be the third way... MY way."

(Except of course, God would never say "y'all" because God is English, as eny fule kno.)

Go for it. Brenda for President. "Vote Brenda because God says 'It is Good'."

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Misha
Don't assume I don't care; sometimes I just can't be bothered to put you right.

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Enoch
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Second post

I agree with Brenda Clough. Those who ostentatiously abstain or boycott elections end up both carrying guilt for the result and forfeiting any right to complain about it or criticise the government for the next four or however many years.

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Brexit wrexit - Sir Graham Watson

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Marvin the Martian

Interplanetary
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quote:
Originally posted by romanlion:
Obviously erroneous

If it is, then it's because the estimate is on the low side.

Trump is espousing racist, sexist, xenophobic and just generally bigoted opinion and policy at every turn. That is deplorable. Anybody who supports him does so either because they agree with it - which is deplorable - or because they don't care about it because it won't affect them, which is if anything even more deplorable.

I might add that anyone who spends all their time attacking Clinton while saying nothing about Trump is a de facto supporter of the latter, given that it's a two-horse race.

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Hail Gallaxhar

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sabine
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quote:
Originally posted by Brenda Clough:
I don't see that the rest of us can emulate you, romanlion. We cannot all abstain. What was stated upthread is true -- somebody has to be president. It is not sin to pick the lesser of two evils. To abstain is simply to hand the choice off to other people and if that's what you want we'll be happy to do it for you.

And the vast conspiracy theories about Hillary's health would make Erich von Daniken proud. The incomparable Alexandra Petri (over at the WaPost, but this is worth a click) summarizes the current state of play, with links! It's hysterical.

You're right. This is really funny!

sabine

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sabine
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quote:
Originally posted by Teekeey Misha:
"

(Except of course, God would never say "y'all" because God is English, as eny fule kno.)[/i]"

Of course not, because anyone from south of the Ohio River knows the correct term is All of y'all [Smile]

sabine (learned this is South Carolina)

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"Hunger looks like the man that hunger is killing." Eduardo Galeano

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Teekeey Misha
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quote:
Originally posted by sabine:
Of course not, because anyone from south of the Ohio River knows the correct term is All of y'all

[Overused]

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Misha
Don't assume I don't care; sometimes I just can't be bothered to put you right.

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Brenda Clough
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As to the 'basket of deplorables',
Chait in NY Magazine argues that half is probably a low estimate. This should be a free click.
Over at the POST (paywall!) Dana Milbank says likewise.
A Salon article arguing likewise.
Of course it makes the Repubs unhappy to confront it, but it does seem to be fact.

[deleted double post etc.]

[ 13. September 2016, 15:03: Message edited by: Eutychus ]

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Twilight

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Yes, I thought she was being very kind and diplomatic with the "half," word. The whole point of the statement was to say, "Not all of y'all are evil, come to the light."

I keep wondering why Trump's camp keeps wanting to talk about Hillary's age and health when he's older and a man.

Some online calculator I just used says a 68 year-old woman can expect to live 17 more years, while a 70 year-old man only has 13 years left. On average.

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romanlion
editorial comment
# 10325

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quote:
Originally posted by Marvin the Martian:
...anyone who spends all their time attacking Clinton while saying nothing about Trump is a de facto supporter of the latter...

Then the title of this thread should be changed to F-Trump, to more accurately reflect it's purpose.

Mine is a lonely effort, but someone has to do it.

quote:
Originally posted by Brenda Clough:
I don't see that the rest of us can emulate you, romanlion. We cannot all abstain.

I have no intention to abstain. Last check there will be no less than 5 options on the ticket in my state, and of course you can all emulate and pick someone else. Options from the left are admittedly more limited, and also nuttier, but there are options.

Was it you or someone else that commented about sports fans who can only feel good about their lives if their team wins?

This is the unfortunate circumstance for a majority of voters in the US, but they have been conditioned to believe that only two teams matter. A very high percentage of D's would not vote R if Jesus himself was the candidate, and vice-versa. All the while those "two" teams play in the same stadium, in the same town, and bow to the same owners.

The tickets and concessions go up every year, while the quality of the product and condition of the building go down. And everyone is convinced that the existence of the game itself depends on them continuing to buy their teams passes and merchandise.

Imagine Major League Baseball with only the Red Sox and Yankees. You'll find me at the rec watching the Kiwanis kids play.

quote:
Originally posted by Marvin the Martian:
It's almost like you don't think what they'd actually do once in power matters at all.

They will do what they have always done, regardless of their associated consonant. Serve themselves, spend like their very lives depend on it, and do each others dirty work. The illusion that they are 2 separate parties with unique values and priorities is one of the greatest scams that ever was.

quote:
Originally posted by Twilight:

Some online calculator I just used says a 68 year-old woman can expect to live 17 more years, while a 70 year-old man only has 13 years left. On average.

Did it factor in the woman's 3 DVT's and Warfarin prescription?

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"You can't get rich in politics unless you're a crook" - Harry S. Truman

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mdijon
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# 8520

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The risk of serious complications on warfarin is less than 1% and its quite likely to prevent further DVTs. Not really a game changer.

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mdijon nojidm uoɿıqɯ ɯqıɿou
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romanlion
editorial comment
# 10325

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quote:
Originally posted by mdijon:
The risk of serious complications on warfarin is less than 1% and its quite likely to prevent further DVTs. Not really a game changer.

So an otherwise healthy 68 year old woman and one with a history of DVT's who takes blood thinners have the same life expectancy?

That's great news!

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"You can't get rich in politics unless you're a crook" - Harry S. Truman

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Crœsos
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# 238

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quote:
Originally posted by romanlion:
quote:
Originally posted by Marvin the Martian:
...anyone who spends all their time attacking Clinton while saying nothing about Trump is a de facto supporter of the latter...

Then the title of this thread should be changed to F-Trump, to more accurately reflect it's purpose.

Mine is a lonely [lack of] effort, but someone has to [not] do it.

Fixed that for you. Not doing something isn't really an "effort".

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Humani nil a me alienum puto

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mdijon
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# 8520

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quote:
Originally posted by mdijon:
The risk of serious complications on warfarin is less than 1% and its quite likely to prevent further DVTs. Not really a game changer.

quote:
Originally posted by romanlion:
So an otherwise healthy 68 year old woman and one with a history of DVT's who takes blood thinners have the same life expectancy?

That's great news!

So "not a game changer" means "no difference"? Even greater news!

[ 13. September 2016, 18:45: Message edited by: mdijon ]

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mdijon nojidm uoɿıqɯ ɯqıɿou
ɯqıɿou uoɿıqɯ nojidm mdijon

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Hedgehog

Ship's Shortstop
# 14125

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quote:
Originally posted by romanlion:
I have no intention to abstain. Last check there will be no less than 5 options on the ticket in my state, and of course you can all emulate and pick someone else. Options from the left are admittedly more limited, and also nuttier, but there are options.

It does seem to me that this election is giving a decided boost to "other" candidates. I certainly have heard more radio commercials for the Libertarians this year--and some of those are rather persuasive (especially the ones pointing out that the two-party system is not working).

More quantitatively, looking at the projected Delaware ballot, there seems to be a lot more candidates from "other" parties running this year than normal. For President, we have 4 candidates (R, D, Libertarian, Green). We are also electing a Congressional Representative, which has 4 running (R, D, L and G). We are electing a new Governor, and have 4 running (R, D, L and G). For State Senate, there is a Green running in one of the districts. For State Representative, we have 2 Libs, 3 Greens and an Independent running in various districts. For County Council, there is a Green running in one district. In our largest city (Wilmington) there is an Indy running for Mayor, and a Lib and Indy trying for City Council.

I am curious about other states. Is there a trend of more "other" party candidates running in your State than usual? If so, what can we conclude from it? Frustration from the two-party deadlock that has developed? Or is it directly a response to the distasteful choice that the two major parties have given us for President?

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"We must regain the conviction that we need one another, that we have a shared responsibility for others and the world, and that being good and decent are worth it."--Pope Francis, Laudato Si'

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Brenda Clough
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# 18061

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My son was going to vote for Gary Johnson. He even has a magnet, to stick on his car, supporting him. Alas, Johnson has no idea who/where/what Aleppo is, and my sun gave up on him in disgust. He is now thinking of candidates I have never heard of before.
Here is an Atlantic article summarizing Trump's charitable giving. Every time you think he has hit bottom, a new depth is revealed.

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romanlion
editorial comment
# 10325

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quote:
Originally posted by Brenda Clough:
My son was going to vote for Gary Johnson. He even has a magnet, to stick on his car, supporting him. Alas, Johnson has no idea who/where/what Aleppo is, and my sun gave up on him in disgust.

I've moved away from Johnson myself, but not over anything so silly as Aleppo. If Obama had meant what he said years ago with regard to Assad, Aleppo would be a place nobody could identify.

His PC pandering to BLM did him in for me.

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"You can't get rich in politics unless you're a crook" - Harry S. Truman

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Brenda Clough
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# 18061

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Sweet heaven, a guy has written a book Trump Tales of Terror. He has a blog, here, which is very funny!

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Science fiction and fantasy writer with a Patreon page

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mousethief

Ship's Thieving Rodent
# 953

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quote:
Originally posted by Hedgehog:
I am curious about other states. Is there a trend of more "other" party candidates running in your State than usual?

We normally have up to 20 minor-party (or no-party) candidates in a presidential race. Maybe 1/4 of them from various Marxist parties; a chunk from the far right, a few from the far left, a goodly number (maybe 1/3 to 1/2) from the near left or near right, and one or two you just can't categorize.

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This is the last sig I'll ever write for you...

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simontoad
Ship's Amphibian
# 18096

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I disagree with the people who say this election is effectively a policy-free zone. Both candidates for the major parties have published policy statements which are available online.

Trump in particular is running a strong, policy focused campaign. You cannot fault him on that. He clearly says that America should effectively close its borders to immigration for people deemed to fall into threatening categories. He clearly says that he is going to defeat ISIS, and his dance with the devil (Putin) suggests a potential avenue for him to do that. There are a few other policies that he is really pushing too. I believe these policies are awful, but he's upfront about them.

My wife read my something about the Governor of Tennessee suggesting that if Clinton wins, it might be necessary for people to shed blood to take his country back. That seems like a good issue for the squirrel chasers in the media to follow. I'd post a link but this internet is rubbish. Personally, I would arrest the bastard, have a show trial and hang draw and quarter him for treasonous utterances. But all absolutely serious suggestions aside, how is not an intensely interesting and also very scary election?

I think that the portrayal of the election by some sections of the media, and some of our fellow posters, has been shallow. However other media outlets do a great job. Before leaving on this holiday, I got into the habit of watching PBS Newshour on you-tube, and its analysis of policy and politics is simply outstanding. Its analysts are clearly frustrated by Trump, especially the Republicans, but the bias is on display, not attempted to be hidden by some obvious line, like some other networks.

If you feel let down or underwhelmed by issue-of-the-moment reporting, PBS Newshour is a great alternative.

We drove through the Shenandoah today and saw four or five Trump posters. Not good enough, I reckon, in a campaign where surely s/he who gets their vote out gets the biscuit.

Maybe that's it. In Australia you want people to recognise the name of your guy or gal on the ballot paper, so you plaster their picture, the picture of the leader, and the party logo all over the shop. In the US, I dunno. Why the hell don't you put posters all over the shop? You are the people with the silly hats, the balloons and the bunting. Why do you leave it all at the conventions? I don't get it.

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Human

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Lamb Chopped
Ship's kebab
# 5528

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quote:
Originally posted by simontoad:
In the US, I dunno. Why the hell don't you put posters all over the shop? You are the people with the silly hats, the balloons and the bunting. Why do you leave it all at the conventions? I don't get it.

Simples. This election we don't have any candidates that are worth silly hats, balloons and bunting. At least none that are actually in the running.

I'm more inclined to hang crepe and tie up the door knocker in black.

Eight years ago you saw signs everywhere, because there were plenty of people who actually had hope in a candidate. If that blessed state ever recurs, you can bet we'll get the signs and bunting out.

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Er, this is what I've been up to (book).
Oh, that you would rend the heavens and come down!

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simontoad
Ship's Amphibian
# 18096

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really? They leave it to the electors? In Australia, the parties organise it. They even pay people to put their stuff in strategic yards. A few elections ago, it was my sacred duty to look after the Greens posters around our town - put them up and care for them, rubbing off hitler mustaches and the like. It was my duty (voluntarily assumed) as a party member.

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Human

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Palimpsest
Shipmate
# 16772

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In the US it depends where you are. Many states will vote -winner take all- for a predictable party. They don't get a lot of poster budget. The money gets concentrated on the critical states where it can go either way, and these days most of the money is in television commercials.

This election has more battleground states than most, but it's still a minority of states.

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mdijon
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# 8520

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quote:
Originally posted by romanlion:
but not over anything so silly as Aleppo

Aleppo today makes one think about war, terrorism, murdered children, blocked aid and human rights abuses. I can't think of anything that could be called silly.

Aleppo has a prominent place in history as well, featuring in the Ottoman empire, before that in the Crusades, the Mongol invasions and Alexander the great. It's one of the oldest centres of civilization and full of historical buildings, fantastic music and had a developing industrial base in Syria.

Silly?

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mdijon nojidm uoɿıqɯ ɯqıɿou
ɯqıɿou uoɿıqɯ nojidm mdijon

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Marvin the Martian

Interplanetary
# 4360

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quote:
Originally posted by romanlion:
Mine is a lonely effort, but someone has to do it.

Why?

quote:
quote:
Originally posted by Marvin the Martian:
It's almost like you don't think what they'd actually do once in power matters at all.

They will do what they have always done, regardless of their associated consonant. Serve themselves, spend like their very lives depend on it, and do each others dirty work. The illusion that they are 2 separate parties with unique values and priorities is one of the greatest scams that ever was.
One Party proposes policies that are demonstrably racist, xenophobic, islamophobic and sexist, while appearing to idolise Putin and admire his "strong leadership". The other does not. If you think that doesn't add up to a meaningful difference then I'm not sure what you think would.

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Hail Gallaxhar

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Crœsos
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# 238

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quote:
Originally posted by simontoad:
really? They leave it to the electors?

I'm pretty sure you mean "voters", not "electors". In U.S. presidential elections the electors are not the voters in the general electorate but rather the 538 people in the electoral college. Here's the thread from the last go-around on this topic back in 2012, which covers most of the gory details.

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Humani nil a me alienum puto

Posts: 10706 | From: Sardis, Lydia | Registered: May 2001  |  IP: Logged
Brenda Clough
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# 18061

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Gary Johnson is clearly no great reader or student. Nothing to be done about it except not vote for him. He plainly should not have his hands on the reins of power.

And your interesting link of the morning, from Newsweek (which I believe is free?)
a discussion of the Trump Organization and the dangers of a president with so many business ties to foreign entities

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mdijon
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# 8520

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quote:
Originally posted by Marvin the Martian:
If you think that doesn't add up to a meaningful difference then I'm not sure what you think would.

A case of pneumonia no doubt.

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mdijon nojidm uoɿıqɯ ɯqıɿou
ɯqıɿou uoɿıqɯ nojidm mdijon

Posts: 12277 | From: UK | Registered: Sep 2004  |  IP: Logged
romanlion
editorial comment
# 10325

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quote:
Originally posted by Marvin the Martian:
quote:
Originally posted by romanlion:
Mine is a lonely effort, but someone has to do it.

Why?

quote:
quote:
Originally posted by Marvin the Martian:
It's almost like you don't think what they'd actually do once in power matters at all.

They will do what they have always done, regardless of their associated consonant. Serve themselves, spend like their very lives depend on it, and do each others dirty work. The illusion that they are 2 separate parties with unique values and priorities is one of the greatest scams that ever was.
One Party proposes policies that are demonstrably racist, xenophobic, islamophobic and sexist, while appearing to idolise Putin and admire his "strong leadership". The other...
[actually institutes the policies and provides the "leadership" that have given us conditions like we see in Chicago, St. Louis, Baltimore and every other major metropolitan area in the country which they have exclusively controlled for decades. Crime, poverty, unemployment, etc.]
Fixed that for ya.

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"You can't get rich in politics unless you're a crook" - Harry S. Truman

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Enoch
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# 14322

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quote:
Originally posted by Crœsos:
quote:
Originally posted by simontoad:
really? They leave it to the electors?

I'm pretty sure you mean "voters", not "electors". In U.S. presidential elections the electors are not the voters in the general electorate but rather the 538 people in the electoral college. Here's the thread from the last go-around on this topic back in 2012, which covers most of the gory details.
Croesus, that's a linguistic difference, though one of which I was completely unaware until you pointed this out. The Electoral College is a constitutional oddity that as far as I know is restricted to the USA. In other Anglophone countries 'electors' and 'voters' are virtuously synonymous, just perhaps with a difference that electors are those entitled to vote and voters are those electors that actually do.

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Brexit wrexit - Sir Graham Watson

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Crœsos
Shipmate
# 238

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quote:
Originally posted by Enoch:
quote:
Originally posted by Crœsos:
quote:
Originally posted by simontoad:
really? They leave it to the electors?

I'm pretty sure you mean "voters", not "electors". In U.S. presidential elections the electors are not the voters in the general electorate but rather the 538 people in the electoral college. Here's the thread from the last go-around on this topic back in 2012, which covers most of the gory details.
Croesus, that's a linguistic difference, though one of which I was completely unaware until you pointed this out. The Electoral College is a constitutional oddity that as far as I know is restricted to the USA. In other Anglophone countries 'electors' and 'voters' are virtuously synonymous, just perhaps with a difference that electors are those entitled to vote and voters are those electors that actually do.
It's even more restricted than that, as it only applies to the election of the president (and vice-president). In every other American election, the voters and electors are as virtually (and possibly "virtuously") synonymous as in other democratic electoral systems.

[ 14. September 2016, 21:00: Message edited by: Crœsos ]

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Humani nil a me alienum puto

Posts: 10706 | From: Sardis, Lydia | Registered: May 2001  |  IP: Logged
Brenda Clough
Shipmate
# 18061

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Charles Pierce over at the Atlantic is one of the great political curmudgeons of our day, and \ this rant is excellent.

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Science fiction and fantasy writer with a Patreon page

Posts: 6378 | From: Washington DC | Registered: Mar 2014  |  IP: Logged



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