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» Ship of Fools   » Community discussion   » Purgatory   » Kellyanne and others. Trouble in the White House Team. (Page 4)

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Source: (consider it) Thread: Kellyanne and others. Trouble in the White House Team.
mr cheesy
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It strikes me that a lot of this can be explained by Trump and co thinking that the information "wouldn't get out" and that he/they would never have to answer questions about them and therefore what nobody knew wouldn't hurt them.

Hence we have the whole phenomena of the presidency attacking intelligent leaks - not because they're untrue, but because they are disloyal.

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arse

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Barnabas62
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quote:
Originally posted by mr cheesy:

Hence we have the whole phenomena of the presidency attacking intelligent leaks - not because they're untrue, but because they are disloyal.

Reminds me of a Nixon quote after the 8-0 verdict by the Supreme Court re executive privilege and tapes(which effectively killed his presidency).

"How could they not vote their consciences. support me?"

Large egos get in the way of common sense.

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Who is it that you seek? How then shall we live? How shall we sing the Lord's song in a strange land?

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Stercus Tauri
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quote:
Originally posted by lilBuddha:
quote:
Originally posted by Stercus Tauri:
I'd characterise them as being extremely logical in their doctrine, generally orthodox in the mainstream protestant sense, but not crazy.

Except for the aversion to medical treatment. I understand not all are fanatical about that, but isn't prayer is better than medicine still a prominent feature?
There seems to be a difference between their theory and their practice on this. The few members of the church that I still know will be praying on their way to the doctor just like everybody else, but perhaps that was what they were supposed to do anyway.

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Thay haif said. Quhat say thay, Lat thame say (George Keith, 5th Earl Marischal)

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Brenda Clough
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quote:
Originally posted by simontoad:

I always thought Christian Scientists were fruit loops, due to an experience my family had in Yosemite NP when I was a young teenager. Have I unfairly generalised this experience to the detriment of Christian Scientists?

Their theology you are on your own with. But their newspaper? It is what the Washington Times tried but failed to be: an independent journalistic voice. So far as I know the church does not try to meddle with the paper's coverage (or if they do they act subtly enough that nobody can see). Unfortunately all print newspapers are on their uppers these days, and the CSM doesn't have a large =web= presence. This is a bad omen; you can't be an opinion shaper if nobody is reading your opinions.

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Brenda Clough
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quote:
Originally posted by mr cheesy:

Hence we have the whole phenomena of the presidency attacking intelligent leaks - not because they're untrue, but because they are disloyal.

So true! Like so many budding despots the PGinC values devotion to his own person and cult far more than any other abstract principle. He has rejected reasonably competent candidates for cabinet or subcabinet positions, because at one time or another they had said something unkind about him. And there was the whole thing about interviewing Mitt Romney to be Secretary of State -- an exercise in humiliation.

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Boogie

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Brilliant comment in the Guardian comments section -

"Trump and Putin are just the bosses of different mafia gangs. All the theatre is just distraction for the Proles, while the bosses and their respective gangs take all the money, made for them by the Proles.

Problem is that the Proles are too stupid to see past the bigotry, racism and lies, which make them feel important and think that their misery is appreciated by their boss.

More misery is coming to the Proles.

And they will still blame the immigrants, single parents and dole-bludgers as the wealth flows to Trump, Putin, May and their gangs.

Ah well.

As Winston said, "The best argument against democracy is a five minute conversation with the average voter."

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Garden. Room. Walk

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sabine
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Ooops!

It appears that Hillary Clinton was not the only one to use private email. Mike Pence did so when he was governor, "at times discussing sensitive matters and homeland security issues."

He was a critic of Clinton. And he will spin this somehow. That's how he rolls.

sabine

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"Hunger looks like the man that hunger is killing." Eduardo Galeano

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mr cheesy
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I have this theory that Trump and chums were projecting everything they said in the campaign and since. They went to town on the emails because they had an issue with emails and so on. It wasn't enough to talk sensibly about the Holocaust, Trump had to go to town on how he wasn't anti-Semitic (whilst at the same time as shutting up a Jewish reporter). It wasn't enough to say that he was listening to the Congressional Black Caucus, he had to be seen to be entertaining the uncomfortable-looking leaders of the Historically Black Colleges and Universities.

Every time they deny something - or go to town on what someone else has done, it is an exact cover for something that they've done.

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arse

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quetzalcoatl
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Yes, and obviously with fake news, of which Trump is the master, but projects onto others.

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the main fear that flat-earthers face is sphere itself.

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Pigwidgeon

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Sarah Palin was the first government official I remember getting into trouble for this sort of thing -- using a Yahoo account. She was hacked because she used the name of her high school (which could be found in any biographical information on her) as a security question.

[Disappointed]

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Don't keep calm. Go change the world.

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Barnabas62
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You could not make it up!

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Who is it that you seek? How then shall we live? How shall we sing the Lord's song in a strange land?

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mousethief

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quote:
Originally posted by Barnabas62:
You could not make it up!

Accuse your opponents of doing what you're doing. Republicans have excelled at this for decades. I'm sure it works with the base. A lie, once told into a willing ear, never comes out.

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“Religion doesn't fuck up people, people fuck up religion.”—lilBuddha

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Brenda Clough
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As with all of the PGinC's tweets, even when they are superficially moonbat lunatic they usually have a dim distant connection to the real world, usually via Fox News. This may be what he thinks he's talking about, although I would not swear to it. This is a free click and summarizes the actions the previous administration took (or was alleged to take) when they saw the intelligence.

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Science fiction and fantasy writer with a Patreon page

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Penny S
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Surely, if an administration became aware that someone was covertly communicating with a foreign power who might not be considered to be friendly, they would be negligent if they did not do what they could to check out what was going on.
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mousethief

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quote:
Originally posted by Penny S:
Surely, if an administration became aware that someone was covertly communicating with a foreign power who might not be considered to be friendly, they would be negligent if they did not do what they could to check out what was going on.

Unless of course that administration was at the very highest levels complicit in the exact same kind of covert communications.

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“Religion doesn't fuck up people, people fuck up religion.”—lilBuddha

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sabine
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Sigh. . . .Trump's tweets. It's like the advice against drunk-tweeting your ex. Just don't do it. Don't sleep-deprived-tweet the nation.

But, alas. his supporters (unlike the hapless ex) actually seem to like his tweets. I saw an interview with one women who opened a Twitter account so she could receive them. She said it was thrilling to wake up in the morning and see the latest tweet from him on her feed. [Ultra confused]

sabine

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"Hunger looks like the man that hunger is killing." Eduardo Galeano

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Brenda Clough
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If you cast your mind back to December/January, you will recall that the PGinC was ubiquitous. Any revelations would have been denounced as partisan sore-losering. Furthermore, they are but clues. More investigation must be done, to lay the true corruption bare. (The tax returns are key; I believe that the Russians have Lyin' Don by the balls through loans and money. They are using rubber gloves, of course, for sanitary purposes, and sugar tongs, because they're wee.)
Warned, the incoming administration could either concoct an airtight cover story, or simply destroy the evidence. The only hope was to hide what evidence there was, so that when the fecal matter hit the propeller unit the data could be found.

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Science fiction and fantasy writer with a Patreon page

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lilBuddha
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quote:
Originally posted by mousethief:
quote:
Originally posted by Penny S:
Surely, if an administration became aware that someone was covertly communicating with a foreign power who might not be considered to be friendly, they would be negligent if they did not do what they could to check out what was going on.

Unless of course that administration was at the very highest levels complicit in the exact same kind of covert communications.
And cheeto only cares that what happens is beneficial to him.

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So goodnight moon, I want the sun
If it's not here soon, I might be done
No it won't be too soon 'til I say goodnight moon

- A. N. Parsley, D. Mcvinni

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Soror Magna
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Public servant / private email: when a woman does it, it's bad. When it turns out a bunch of old white guys do it too, it's suddenly no big deal.

And Pence still uses AOL? [Killing me] I thought we all tossed those damned discs.

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"You come with me to room 1013 over at the hospital, I'll show you America. Terminal, crazy and mean." -- Tony Kushner, "Angels in America"

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molopata

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Frankly, I don't think it's a gender thing. At least not this time.

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... The Respectable

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lilBuddha
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quote:
Originally posted by molopata:
Frankly, I don't think it's a gender thing. At least not this time.

I agree partially. The intensity of the focus on Clinton was in part because misogyny. However, the dismissal on the part of Team Trumpelstiltskin is more of the irregular verb type.

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So goodnight moon, I want the sun
If it's not here soon, I might be done
No it won't be too soon 'til I say goodnight moon

- A. N. Parsley, D. Mcvinni

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Brenda Clough
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I would attribute it to the pervasive and consistent 'For me, not you' mindset of this entire administration. Everything good or positive is for me; everything bad is for you. I am a victim, you are a budding criminal and need many, many Congressional hearings. When I discriminate it is crime-fighting and defending the American people; when you do it you should be denounced. I get draft deferments, you go and die in wars. It's endless.

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Science fiction and fantasy writer with a Patreon page

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Barnabas62
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Whose facts are alternative?

"The Deflector-in-Chief is at it again."

The level of rage only goes to confirm my agreement with Croesos (on the other thread).

Here.

And now Sessions is in trouble with Trump for recusing himself. An act of disloyalty? Or a realisation that a part of his defensive wall has just collapsed?

The Russian connection will run and run.

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Who is it that you seek? How then shall we live? How shall we sing the Lord's song in a strange land?

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cliffdweller
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quote:
Originally posted by Brenda Clough:
I would attribute it to the pervasive and consistent 'For me, not you' mindset of this entire administration. Everything good or positive is for me; everything bad is for you. I am a victim, you are a budding criminal and need many, many Congressional hearings. When I discriminate it is crime-fighting and defending the American people; when you do it you should be denounced. I get draft deferments, you go and die in wars. It's endless.

I think it goes even further to projection. When Trump makes some wildly hyperbolic accusation or fixates compulsively on someone's infraction, you're pretty much assured that's precisely what he's been about. It's his tell. He's like a comic book villain who can't stop himself from leaving clues at the scene of the crime

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"Here is the world. Beautiful and terrible things will happen. Don't be afraid." -Frederick Buechner

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mousethief

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quote:
Originally posted by Brenda Clough:
I would attribute it to the pervasive and consistent 'For me, not you' mindset of this entire administration. Everything good or positive is for me; everything bad is for you. I am a victim, you are a budding criminal and need many, many Congressional hearings. When I discriminate it is crime-fighting and defending the American people; when you do it you should be denounced. I get draft deferments, you go and die in wars. It's endless.

This isn't just this administration. This is the theme song for the Republican Party.

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“Religion doesn't fuck up people, people fuck up religion.”—lilBuddha

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Barnabas62
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I saw Mark Levin's so called evidence of Obama's wiretapping authorisations. The bottom line is that the Obama administration will have known that there were ongoing enquiries into Trump-Russian links. That's a far cry from authorising or even setting them in motion. It seems as though Trump's source was a Breitbart report on a Levin broadcast. In other words, far fetched BS.

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Who is it that you seek? How then shall we live? How shall we sing the Lord's song in a strange land?

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Jane R
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mousethief:
quote:
This isn't just this administration. This is the theme song for the Republican Party.
You want the new theme song for the Republican Party? Here you go. [NSFW unless you have earphones on]

[ 06. March 2017, 11:35: Message edited by: Jane R ]

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lilBuddha
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quote:
Originally posted by Barnabas62:
It seems as though Trump's source was a Breitbart report on a Levin broadcast. In other words, far fetched BS.

They cannot have failed to notice President Short Attention Span considers them his "intelligence" briefing. How much of their excrement is direcrly intended for his ears, I wonder.

--------------------
So goodnight moon, I want the sun
If it's not here soon, I might be done
No it won't be too soon 'til I say goodnight moon

- A. N. Parsley, D. Mcvinni

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Barnabas62
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Sure. Trump himself must be one of the main causes of trouble in the White House Team. It really does look like the Court of the Mad King.

No way this chaos can last for 4 years.

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Who is it that you seek? How then shall we live? How shall we sing the Lord's song in a strange land?

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quetzalcoatl
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I'm actually surprised by how mad it seems. I thought that Trump would buckle down and try to be normal, or something. I guess he can't.

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the main fear that flat-earthers face is sphere itself.

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Brenda Clough
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quote:
Originally posted by mousethief:
This isn't just this administration. This is the theme song for the Republican Party.

This is demonstrated on a daily basis. I get Supreme Court nominees, you don't. When I hold a gun it is my proper Second Amendment rights, when you hold one the cops will properly shoot you because you deserve it. I get health care and insurance, you are not a maker but a taker. And, of course, promises do not apply to me even if I made them on camera, but you should be held to your lightest utterance.

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Science fiction and fantasy writer with a Patreon page

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lilBuddha
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quote:
Originally posted by quetzalcoatl:
I'm actually surprised by how mad it seems. I thought that Trump would buckle down and try to be normal, or something. I guess he can't.

He thinks he is normal. Even without questioning his mental stability, he is a narcissist who lived in an echo chamber his entire adult life. Likely before to an extent.

--------------------
So goodnight moon, I want the sun
If it's not here soon, I might be done
No it won't be too soon 'til I say goodnight moon

- A. N. Parsley, D. Mcvinni

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mr cheesy
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quote:
Originally posted by lilBuddha:
He thinks he is normal. Even without questioning his mental stability, he is a narcissist who lived in an echo chamber his entire adult life. Likely before to an extent.

Personally I don't really think the amateur mental health analysis is necessary. We probably can't tell if he is mentally ill from a distance; but we can clearly tell that he's an arse.

Where you see the effect of living in an echo-chamber, I see more a deliberate, considered effort to deflect and downplay accusations by repeating them back. I suspect that he's been advised that the accusations lose their power if he reduces them to common-currency knock-about political language. Saying something has happened which is reminiscent of Watergate sounds serious until everyone is using the same language and (as it may well seem) everyone is pointing at everyone else and calling each other Nazis.

I think it is quite a clever way to extinguish attacks.

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arse

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Crœsos
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quote:
Originally posted by Barnabas62:
I saw Mark Levin's so called evidence of Obama's wiretapping authorisations. The bottom line is that the Obama administration will have known that there were ongoing enquiries into Trump-Russian links. That's a far cry from authorising or even setting them in motion. It seems as though Trump's source was a Breitbart report on a Levin broadcast. In other words, far fetched BS.

Trump seems to be completely ignorant about how the U.S. government actually works and has a personality-oriented understanding of the world. Thus when he says "Obama" did something, he seems to equate "Obama" with "everyone in the U.S. government who isn't me".

On the other hand at least one U.S. Senator is claiming that transcripts exist of conversations between Russian officials and members of the Trump campaign. Senator Coons claims to not have seen these transcripts and expresses frustration at the fact. This interview took place less than 24 hours before Trump's Twitter meltdown about wire taps.

It's conceivable that the possibility that such transcripts exist is terrifying to the White House and this is a ham-fisted attempt to 'flip the script' by getting the public and the press to be (preemptively) more interested in how such transcripts (if they exist) were obtained than what is actually in them. Which is a lot of chutzpah for someone who publicly begged Russia to hack his opponent's e-mail.

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Humani nil a me alienum puto

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Barnabas62
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quote:
Originally posted by Crœsos:

Trump seems to be completely ignorant about how the U.S. government actually works and has a personality-oriented understanding of the world. Thus when he says "Obama" did something, he seems to equate "Obama" with "everyone in the U.S. government who isn't me".

That seems very plausible to me, certainly about actions by government agencies prior to Trump becoming President.

He must be a nightmare to work with. He gets plaudits for a much more statesmanlike approach in his address to Congress, then a couple of days later he pisses all over himself again.

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Who is it that you seek? How then shall we live? How shall we sing the Lord's song in a strange land?

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Brenda Clough
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Here's a POST article arguing that this is all a deliberate ploy on the PGinC's part that he frequently resorts to, to distract and divert attention from things he wants us to not consider.

As to his hellaciousness as a boss -- is there one woman, one business, one contractor, who can say that working with him went well? One entity who will say, "Yea, I had a relationship with him and it was mutually beneficial, worked out fine"? At the very best you get silence, enforced by prenups or settlements.

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Science fiction and fantasy writer with a Patreon page

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lilBuddha
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Originally posted by mr cheesy:
quote:
I think it is quite a clever way to extinguish attack
Effective, yes. Not too sure about clever.

--------------------
So goodnight moon, I want the sun
If it's not here soon, I might be done
No it won't be too soon 'til I say goodnight moon

- A. N. Parsley, D. Mcvinni

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Amanda B. Reckondwythe

Dressed for Church
# 5521

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quote:
Originally posted by Barnabas62:
He gets plaudits for a much more statesmanlike approach in his address to Congress.

Of which he didn't write one single word. Had he written his own speech, it plus the reaction to it would have been very, very different.

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simontoad
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# 18096

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quote:
Originally posted by Boogie:
Brilliant comment in the Guardian comments section -

"Trump and Putin are just the bosses of different mafia gangs. All the theatre is just distraction for the Proles, while the bosses and their respective gangs take all the money, made for them by the Proles.

Problem is that the Proles are too stupid to see past the bigotry, racism and lies, which make them feel important and think that their misery is appreciated by their boss.

More misery is coming to the Proles.

And they will still blame the immigrants, single parents and dole-bludgers as the wealth flows to Trump, Putin, May and their gangs.

Ah well.

As Winston said, "The best argument against democracy is a five minute conversation with the average voter."

Sorry. I don't get to these pages often enough. But Trump, Putin and THERESA MAY all have gangs? THERESA MAY???????????

This commenting person is putting Theresa May in the same category as those two? It's like saying John Major was a bikie, riding along on his Malvern Star trying to keep up with the Banditos.

Maybe if the writer meant May had a gang like Cliff Richard or Annette Funicello had gangs I could accept it, but a mafia gang? Who's her enforcer? Jeremy Hunt?

I mean really. She's a proper Conservative isn't she, not a Breitbart mouthpiece or an Imperialist like Putin. I mean, putting May in there risks clothing the other two in respectable green tartan pants suits.

[ 06. March 2017, 21:29: Message edited by: simontoad ]

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Barnabas62
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# 9110

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quote:
Originally posted by Amanda B. Reckondwythe:
quote:
Originally posted by Barnabas62:
He gets plaudits for a much more statesmanlike approach in his address to Congress.

Of which he didn't write one single word.
Pretty normal. Presidents have their Sam Seabourns and Toby Zieglers for such major speeches. They just edit a bit - or not at all.

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Who is it that you seek? How then shall we live? How shall we sing the Lord's song in a strange land?

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Dave W.
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# 8765

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quote:
Originally posted by Crœsos:
On the other hand at least one U.S. Senator is claiming that transcripts exist of conversations between Russian officials and members of the Trump campaign. Senator Coons claims to not have seen these transcripts and expresses frustration at the fact. This interview took place less than 24 hours before Trump's Twitter meltdown about wire taps.

The existence of transcripts of contacts with the Russians was reported weeks ago. Is it likely that a mention of transcripts would have set Trump off? If the calls were monitored, they'd be taped; doesn't seem like transcription would make things worse.

Slate has an article suggesting that maybe it was really Sessions' recusal that precipitated the freakout; Trump & Co. may have been relying on Sessions being in place to hamstring potential investigations.

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Barnabas62
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# 9110

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Well, President Trump went invisible today, as his Executive Order Mark 2 re immigration was rolled out.

Keeping a lower profile? Although early in the Presidency, it may be a little late for that.

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Who is it that you seek? How then shall we live? How shall we sing the Lord's song in a strange land?

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Jane R
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# 331

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simontoad:
quote:
She's a proper Conservative isn't she, not a Breitbart mouthpiece or an Imperialist like Putin. I mean, putting May in there risks clothing the other two in respectable green tartan pants suits.
If by 'proper Conservative' you mean 'raving neo-Fascist' you could be right. Don't be fooled by the power dressing; she's a control freak (as her record as Home Secretary shows). Since she became Prime Minister the rhetoric coming from Whitehall has become more and more inflammatory (you're going to crush the EU if they don't give you a good deal after leaving, are you, Theresa? You and whose army? You're surely not relying on the Mango Mussolini... oh wait, you are). She is Prime Minister by virtue of being the last senior member of the Government standing after the shambolic referendum campaigns; she actually campaigned (half-heartedly) for Remain but has somehow reinvented herself as the hardest of hard Brexiters. That suggests to me that she doesn't really care what happens to the rest of the country as long as she remains in power... ok, maybe you're right, that is typically Conservative.
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Boogie

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# 13538

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May invited Trump for a state visit only seven days after he became president. Any respect I had for her melted right there and then. She's a right wing and uncaring as the rest of them imo.

I'm glad she doesn't send crazy, infantile tweets in the middle of the night - but her policies will likely be just as damaging as Trump's.


[Frown]

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Garden. Room. Walk

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L'organist
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# 17338

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Mrs May made what seems to be a commitment to a Trump state visit invitation so quickly because (a) she was the first foreign head of state to visit Washington after the election, and (b) it was being screeched by everyone - but especially the REMAIN camp - that the Brexit vote would leave the UK isolated and that we should protect the "special relationship" at all costs. The newspapers were also full of the view that UK trade would need to increase exports to the US after leaving the EU.

There is absolutely no evidence whatsoever that Mrs May shares any of Mr Trump's views, and to suggest otherwise is unfair. Far from being right wing (which you imply is automatically a bad thing) Mrs May has a reputation for being neither of the left nor the right. As for her being "uncaring", again where is your evidence?

The fact is, some people seem to be anti Mrs May simply because she is a conservative: that thinking is as sloppy as it would be for an assumption to be made that anyone who self-described as "left-wing" to have been in sympathy with the likes of George Galloway and Jeremy Corbyn.

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Rara temporum felicitate ubi sentire quae velis et quae sentias dicere licet

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Marvin the Martian

Interplanetary
# 4360

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quote:
Originally posted by Jane R:
[May] actually campaigned (half-heartedly) for Remain but has somehow reinvented herself as the hardest of hard Brexiters. That suggests to me that she doesn't really care what happens to the rest of the country as long as she remains in power...

It suggests to me that she takes the result of the referendum seriously and views it as her duty as PM to carry out the people's stated desire to leave the EU, regardless of her own feelings on the matter.

I'd have far less respect for her as PM if she went into the job with an attitude of "fuck what the people say they want, I'm doing whatever I want to do".

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Hail Gallaxhar

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Barnabas62
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# 9110

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Please take the tangent re Theresa May to the Brexit thread, or, alternatively, open up a new thread if you want to discuss her leadership in more general terms.

Barnabas62
Purgatory Host

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Who is it that you seek? How then shall we live? How shall we sing the Lord's song in a strange land?

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Brenda Clough
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# 18061

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quote:
Originally posted by Barnabas62:
Well, President Trump went invisible today, as his Executive Order Mark 2 re immigration was rolled out.

Keeping a lower profile? Although early in the Presidency, it may be a little late for that.

Even if Ivanka or Bannon are snubbing his leash short, it won't last. He is irrepressible, and they don't seem to have taken away his cell phone. When he takes it with him into the bog that's when the tweets fly.

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Stercus Tauri
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# 16668

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Brenda... The mental image you have implanted with that comment is indescribably dreadful.

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Thay haif said. Quhat say thay, Lat thame say (George Keith, 5th Earl Marischal)

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Enoch
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# 14322

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quote:
Originally posted by Brenda Clough:
... When he takes it with him into the bog that's when the tweets fly.

That must, though, be the only time when the crap comes out of the end it is supposed to come out of.

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Brexit wrexit - Sir Graham Watson

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