Posted                         

quote:

---

Originally posted by Sioni Sais:

quote:

---

Originally posted by Rocinante:


In a vicar it's annoying. In a POTUS it's deeply concerning that he apparently confuses his own interests with those of his country.

(I have to confess that I only have the reporter's summary to go on, I find Trump impossible to understand or even listen to in person.)

---

That's worrying. I can remember Gerald Ford, Dan Quayle, Bush jnr and Donald Rumsfeld. Is he worse than all of those?

---

Worse than all of them put together, raised to the 10th power, shaken together and running over, on steroids.

Don't ever expect him to be within hailing distance of normal or healthy. He's wayyyyyy too broken, dysfunctional, and messed up. He has very rare moments of near normal, but they're *very* rare.

No offense, but anyone who analyzes him as they would a normal or somewhat off-normal president will always be mistaken.


--------------------
Blessed Gator, pray for us!
--"Oh bat bladders, do you have to bring common sense into this?" (Dragon, "Jane & the Dragon")
--"Oh, Peace Train, save this country!" (Yusuf/Cat Stevens, "Peace Train")

Posted                         

quote:

---

Originally posted by Rocinante:
Has any other president talked about "my generals" and "my military"? It's an affectation I personally find particularly offensive. I once knew a vicar who talked about "my churchwardens", "my sidesmen" etc.. He was a self-obsessed knob with bad hair, much like El Presidente, in fact.

In a vicar it's annoying. In a POTUS it's deeply concerning that he apparently confuses his own interests with those of his country.

(I have to confess that I only have the reporter's summary to go on, I find Trump impossible to understand or even listen to in person.)

---

Posted                      

quote:

---

Originally posted by Golden Key:

quote:

---

Originally posted by Sioni Sais:

quote:

---

Originally posted by Rocinante:


In a vicar it's annoying. In a POTUS it's deeply concerning that he apparently confuses his own interests with those of his country.

(I have to confess that I only have the reporter's summary to go on, I find Trump impossible to understand or even listen to in person.)

---

That's worrying. I can remember Gerald Ford, Dan Quayle, Bush jnr and Donald Rumsfeld. Is he worse than all of those?

---

Worse than all of them put together, raised to the 10th power, shaken together and running over, on steroids.

---

Posted                      

quote:

---

Originally posted by cliffdweller:
Just after the 2008 election, there was a facebook group formed called "I love it when I wake up in the morning and Bush isn't president". Earlier this year they posted a meme with a picture of W and the words:

"miss me yet?"
2009: nope
2010: nope
2011: nope
2012: nope
2013: nope
2014: nope
2015: nope
2016: nope
2017: oh sweet baby Jesus yes

---

Posted                      

quote:

---

Originally posted by Crœsos:

quote:

---

Originally posted by cliffdweller:
Just after the 2008 election, there was a facebook group formed called "I love it when I wake up in the morning and Bush isn't president". Earlier this year they posted a meme with a picture of W and the words:

"miss me yet?"
2009: nope
2010: nope
2011: nope
2012: nope
2013: nope
2014: nope
2015: nope
2016: nope
2017: oh sweet baby Jesus yes

---

What's to miss? Incompetent response to devastating hurricane? Love of torture? "Black site" detentions? Mendaciously lying America (and several other nations) into a brutal and counter-productive war? Demonizing gay people for electoral advantage? Economically destructive tax policy and a financial regulatory strategy that crashed the world economy?

Quite honestly if you miss the George W. Bush presidency (and remember it accurately) you should be quite at home with the Donald Trump version.

---

Posted                      

quote:

---

Originally posted by cliffdweller:
I think you're missing the point/irony of the meme. Explaining it would butcher it further.

---

Posted                      

quote:

---

Originally posted by Bishops Finger:

I don't recall much about George W's presidency, but was it so bad?

---

Posted                      

quote:

---

Originally posted by Bishops Finger:
Perhaps the fact that the joke isn't particularly funny is part of the irony, IYSWIM.

I don't recall much about George W's presidency, but was it so bad?

Mind you, it's hard to envisage anyone worse than the Great Pumpkin.....
J
IJ

---

Posted                      

quote:

---

Originally posted by Bishops Finger:
I don't recall much about George W's presidency, but was it so bad?

Mind you, it's hard to envisage anyone worse than the Great Pumpkin.....

---

Posted                      

quote:

---

Originally posted by Nicolemr:
I'm waiting with bated breath for Monday!

---

Posted                      

quote:

---

Originally posted by Brenda Clough:
Charges filed in federal court by the Mueller investigation.
CNN reports,
"A federal grand jury in Washington, DC, on Friday approved the first charges in the investigation led by special counsel Robert Mueller, according to sources briefed on the matter.

---

Posted                      

quote:

---

Originally posted by Ian Climacus:
On the Chinese President, Xi Jinping:

"People say we have the best relationship of any president-president, because he's called president also. Now some people might call him the king of China. But he's called president."

Every programme I have watched has had someone say Trump is the only one who thought he was a king.

---

Posted                       

quote:

---

Originally posted by Crœsos:

It was pretty bad. More to the point, this kind of post facto rehabilitation of Republican malefactors is pretty much how someone like Trump becomes president*.

---

Posted                      

quote:

---

Originally posted by chris stiles:

quote:

---

Originally posted by Crœsos:
It was pretty bad. More to the point, this kind of post facto rehabilitation of Republican malefactors is pretty much how someone like Trump becomes president*.

---

and further to your point, I'd say that this also applies to the rehabilitation of all the never-Trump Republicans who have spent the last few decades ratcheting up the political temperature.

---

Posted                      

quote:

---

Originally posted by Brenda Clough:
This is a free click, from the Atlantic: Robert Jeffress, pastor of the First Baptist in Dallas, TX, explains why Trump is a man of God. I particularly admire how he can prove that he's in the center of God's will because he has such an expensive church building.

---

quote:

---

I think [Trump]’s a great role model for doing what he’s been called to do, and that is being president of the United States. He is doing a fantastic job in that way. I think he is showing strong leadership.

...

[Jeffress followed up in an email to say: “I do think President Trump is a positive role model for children. Specifically, I would be happy for my children (and now, my coming grandchildren) to emulate his work ethic, leadership skills, and patriotism.”]

---

Posted                         

quote:

---

Originally posted by Crœsos:

quote:

---

Originally posted by cliffdweller:
I think you're missing the point/irony of the meme. Explaining it would butcher it further.

---

I get the joke. I just don't think it's particularly funny, given that there is an actual well-organized and determined attempt to rehabilitate the public image of George W. Bush (and, more importantly, his political priorities).

---

Posted                         

quote:

---

Originally posted by Ian Climacus:
The mind truly boggles. Do these people hate "the Left" so much they are blind to anyone on the right's faults? Tweeting nasty things is being a role model? Getting no legislation through is evidence of work ethic and leadership??? Oh my.

I really didn't realise you had non politicians or lobbyists sprouting this.

---

Posted                      

quote:

---

Originally posted by Brenda Clough:
What this says to me (and it's proven by the guest preachers he's bringing in, from Fox News!!!) is that he and his entire congregation h/a/v/e t/h/e/i/r h/e/a/d/s u/p t/h/e/i/r a/s/s/e/s are deep in the right wing media bubble. There is no way for reality to get into that bubble, it's impermeable.

---

Posted                       

quote:

---

Originally posted by Bishops Finger:
....and breaking on BBC News as well:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-41804740

I daresay the Twittersphere will be absolutely saturated with Trumptweets within the next hour or two (if it isn't already).

Can't someone please block the Twitter account of Putin's Orange Pup?



IJ

---

Putin's Orange Pup!


I like it! But let's be honest, he's enough to give anyone the pip isn't he.....

--------------------
Best Wishes
Stephen

'Be still,then, and know that I am God: I will be exalted among the nations and I will be exalted in the earth' Ps46 v10

Posted                      

• conspiracy against the United States
• conspiracy to launder money
• unregistered agent of a foreign principal
• false and misleading US Foreign Agents Registration Act (FARA) statements
• false statements in other contexts
• failure to file reports of foreign bank and financial accounts (7 counts)

Posted                      

quote:

---

Originally posted by Crœsos:
So according to the updated version of the CNN story, the charges against Manafort are:

• conspiracy against the United States
• conspiracy to launder money
• unregistered agent of a foreign principal
• false and misleading US Foreign Agents Registration Act (FARA) statements
• false statements in other contexts
• failure to file reports of foreign bank and financial accounts (7 counts)

The conspiracy charges are the most interesting, since they imply co-conspirators.

(For reference: the Illustrated Guide to Law's section on conspiracy)

---

Posted                      

quote:

---

Originally posted by Brenda Clough:
What worries me now is the thought that Crooked Don will resort to pre-emptive pardons. He doesn't even have to do it more than once or twice. If enough of these rats know that Lyin' Don will get them off the hook, they'll hang together, Mafiosi-style and keep quiet.

---

quote:

---

[T]he conservative line is that while Manafort may have been involved in shady dealings, and while Trump’s family and campaign may have met with Russians promising to deliver dirt on his opponent, Trump himself was not complicit with Russia to interfere in the election.

This is almost assuredly untrue, because there was no reason to hire Manafort in the first place except to collude with Russia.

It’s hard to remember sometimes given the insanity that has occurred since, but eyebrows were raised across the spectrum when Manafort was initially hired as Trump’s campaign manager back in 2016. Manafort was an ancillary player in Republican politics and already clearly compromised. My colleague Martin Longman noted earlier this year that Manafort was closely connected to Roger Stone, himself a disgraced crackpot with his own insalubrious ties and connection to likely Russian hacker Guccifer 2.0.

Manafort was a terrible choice for campaign manager, both in terms of competence and optics. It was neither a pick designed to buoy his populist credentials, nor was it a sop to the GOP establishment that Trump desperately needed at the time. The only thing Manafort had in his favor was his close ties to Putin, and there is no conceivable reason to have hired him except to leverage those ties.

If Manafort is indeed the primary target of Mueller’s probe, it’s a guarantee that the Trump campaign absolutely intended to collude closely with Russia as a longshot path to a difficult election.

Which means that one of two things is true: either Donald Trump was not closely involved in hiring his campaign manager or the rationale for it, or he directly intended to use Russian interference to win.

---

Posted                      

quote:

---

Originally posted by no prophet's flag is set so...:
So the position of presidente is sort of like a king re pardons?

---

quote:

---

The President . . . shall have Power to grant Reprieves and Pardons for Offences against the United States, except in Cases of Impeachment

---

Posted                      

quote:

---

Originally posted by Bishops Finger:
But, if the Orange Pip does go for pre-emptive pardons, doesn't that just make them all look even more guilty? Including the Chief Pip?

As in 'the [gentleman] doth protest too much, methinks'.

IJ

---

Posted                      

quote:

---

Originally posted by Bishops Finger:
Putin's Pup really isn't sitting in a sincere pumpkin patch, is he?

---

Posted                      

quote:

---

Originally posted by Bishops Finger:
Meanwhile, the plot thickens (though 'it has nothing to do with the president'):

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-41808227

---

• What Papadopoulos [plead guity to / was convicted of] is lying to the FBI
  -
• What he lied about was the Russian government contacting him and offering him "dirt" on Hillary Clinton in the form of hacked e-mails
  -
• The plea deal was reached on October 5 but only unsealed today, not coincidentally the day Manafort and Gates are indicted
  -
• The lower bound for the recommended sentence agreed upon in the deal is zero years

quote:

---

He [Papadopoulos] was arrested on July 27. Papadopoulos indicated that he was willing to cooperate with Mueller's team, and his case was sealed after his arrest to give him time to do that. According to papers filed by his lawyer, Papadopoulos participated in multiple meetings with investigators and voluntarily turned over materials.

"Public disclosure of the defendant's initial appearance, however, would significantly undermine his ability to serve as a proactive cooperator," prosecutors wrote in the motion to seal. "In addition, public disclosure of defendant's arrest and the accompanying criminal charges may alert other subjects to the direction and status of the investigation."

---

Posted                      

quote:

---

Originally posted by Crœsos:
I’m going to guess that "proactive cooperator" is lawyer-speak for "wearing a wire". I suspect others will reach the same conclusion and start trying to remember the details of every meeting they had with George Papadopoulos from July 27 through today.

---