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Source: (consider it)
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Thread: Weight loss, obesity, fat shaming, health, size etc ...
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Karl: Liberal Backslider
Shipmate
# 76
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Posted
And the problem with modifying your diet permanently is it means being hungry and eating food you don't like much for ever. Sure, I can swap my chips for a salad at the restaurant, but if I do that I'll feel sick with hunger and sit there seething because other people have chips. I like chips.
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Might as well ask the bloody cat.
Posts: 17938 | From: Chesterfield | Registered: May 2001
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Bishops Finger
Shipmate
# 5430
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Posted
Perhaps if you had salad and chips?
Either way, sitting there feeling sick with hunger, and seething with jealousy, is likely to do you far more harm than eating chips!
IJ
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Our words are giants when they do us an injury, and dwarfs when they do us a service. (Wilkie Collins)
Posts: 10151 | From: Behind The Wheel Again! | Registered: Jan 2004
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lilBuddha
Shipmate
# 14333
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Karl: Liberal Backslider:
And the problem with modifying your diet permanently is it means being hungry and eating food you don't like much for ever. Sure, I can swap my chips for a salad at the restaurant, but if I do that I'll feel sick with hunger and sit there seething because other people have chips. I like chips.
You don't have to give up any particular food. You just don't eat it every meal. The problem is that people think they must eat rabbit food instead of "real" food. There are more foods in Heaven and Earth, than are dreamt of in your philosophy.
It is about finding foods that fill and comfort and aren't high in calories. And splurging From time to time.
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I put on my rockin' shoes in the morning
Hallellou, hallellou
Posts: 17627 | From: the round earth's imagined corners | Registered: Dec 2008
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Lamb Chopped
Ship's kebab
# 5528
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Posted
Except that some of us can't do that (find a livable diet from the choices that will, er, allow us to stay alive ![[Biased]](wink.gif) ). Carbs seem to have an addictive property for me, rather like alcohol for an alcoholic. Moderation does not appear to be possible (saith 30 years of experience) and a splurge is likely to mean derailing permanently.
Or so it seems. I'm hoping you'll turn out to be right. But I've got that bio-scream going in my ears right now ("Give me C-A-R-R-R-R-R-Bs!") and it's making me cranky.
And I just ate a good-sized lunch!
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Er, this is what I've been up to (book).
Oh, that you would rend the heavens and come down!
Posts: 20059 | From: off in left field somewhere | Registered: Feb 2004
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Leorning Cniht
Shipmate
# 17564
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Karl: Liberal Backslider:
I like chips.
This. I like chips too, and more to the point, I reliably like chips. I can order steak and chips in a restaurant, and I know I will like it. Salads are far more of a mixed bag. I make and eat salads from time to time, but I will never order one in a restaurant in preference to chips or potatoes, because there are reasonable odds that someone will put something I don't much care for in it.
Posts: 5026 | From: USA | Registered: Feb 2013
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Lamb Chopped
Ship's kebab
# 5528
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Posted
And ain't that the truth. As I'm rediscovering. Is there much more disgusting than a Caesar salad with cold grilled chicken strips way past their prime?
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Er, this is what I've been up to (book).
Oh, that you would rend the heavens and come down!
Posts: 20059 | From: off in left field somewhere | Registered: Feb 2004
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Boogie
Boogie on down!
# 13538
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by lilBuddha:
quote:
Originally posted by Karl: Liberal Backslider:
And the problem with modifying your diet permanently is it means being hungry and eating food you don't like much for ever. Sure, I can swap my chips for a salad at the restaurant, but if I do that I'll feel sick with hunger and sit there seething because other people have chips. I like chips.
You don't have to give up any particular food. You just don't eat it every meal. The problem is that people think they must eat rabbit food instead of "real" food. There are more foods in Heaven and Earth, than are dreamt of in your philosophy.
It is about finding foods that fill and comfort and aren't high in calories. And splurging From time to time.
This is exactly what I do.
I never eat salad but have many recipes for high protein, low carb food - all cooked meals. I eat huge cooked lunches with (e.g.) bacon and chicken. With my evening meal I will have a few chips or a baked potato. Last night we had trout, chips, broccoli and mange tout. The chips were home made and oven baked and I didn't have a huge pile. Pudding was quark and raspberries, if you keep the raspberries frozen and stir then in it's really tasty and like I've cream.
This doesn't stop the carb cravings but it does mean I'm never hungry. That's the problem with sugar/carb addiction, you will eat it long after you are full. In fact your 'full' signs are eventually switched off. I just have to remind my body that these feelings are sugar cravings not hunger.
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Garden. Room. Walk
Posts: 13030 | From: Boogie Wonderland | Registered: Mar 2008
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Jane R
Shipmate
# 331
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Posted
lilbuddha: quote:
This is why modifying your diet instead of dieting and reverting is a better tactic. It isn't that the body wants to remain at its fattest, but to remain at whatever has been normalised.
Yes, modifying your diet permanently works for most people under 40. However that still leaves all the people with underlying conditions that make it hard for them to lose weight, post-menopausal women, people who can't afford to live on salad and lean meat or fish...
And if you've been overweight or on yo-yo diets for most of your adult life, then as far as your body's concerned being fat IS normal. Better not to put the weight on to begin with, but that's not a helpful thing to say to someone who's trying to lose weight because it is TOO LATE FOR THEM to take advantage of that particular piece of advice. Even if it does give you [generic you] a nice self-righteous glow when you say it. "I thank you, God, that I am not like that woman over there..."
Posts: 3958 | From: Jorvik | Registered: May 2001
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mdijon
Shipmate
# 8520
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Boogie:
Ice cream ![[Roll Eyes]](rolleyes.gif)
Perfect response to the OP.
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mdijon nojidm uoɿıqɯ ɯqıɿou
ɯqıɿou uoɿıqɯ nojidm mdijon
Posts: 12277 | From: UK | Registered: Sep 2004
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Karl: Liberal Backslider
Shipmate
# 76
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Leorning Cniht:
quote:
Originally posted by Karl: Liberal Backslider:
I like chips.
This. I like chips too, and more to the point, I reliably like chips. I can order steak and chips in a restaurant, and I know I will like it. Salads are far more of a mixed bag. I make and eat salads from time to time, but I will never order one in a restaurant in preference to chips or potatoes, because there are reasonable odds that someone will put something I don't much care for in it.
For me, it's more like I'm going to be hungry if I have the salad, and therefore likely to raid the cheese box when I get home. So I'll end up in the same place.
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Might as well ask the bloody cat.
Posts: 17938 | From: Chesterfield | Registered: May 2001
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Karl: Liberal Backslider
Shipmate
# 76
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by lilBuddha:
quote:
Originally posted by Karl: Liberal Backslider:
And the problem with modifying your diet permanently is it means being hungry and eating food you don't like much for ever. Sure, I can swap my chips for a salad at the restaurant, but if I do that I'll feel sick with hunger and sit there seething because other people have chips. I like chips.
You don't have to give up any particular food. You just don't eat it every meal. The problem is that people think they must eat rabbit food instead of "real" food. There are more foods in Heaven and Earth, than are dreamt of in your philosophy.
It is about finding foods that fill and comfort and aren't high in calories. And splurging From time to time.
As it happens, there's plenty of stuff I like that's low in calories. I'm not a salad dodger, I can eat piles of it. And that's the problem. I can eat piles of it, yes, it's nice, enjoyed that, but I'm hungry. It doesn't fill.
Now, if someone can invent some things that can "fill and comfort and aren't high in calories", I'd be very interested, because I've struggled to find them.
I'm not badly overweight - most people struggle to believe I'm overweight at all - but I have a spare stone or two.
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Might as well ask the bloody cat.
Posts: 17938 | From: Chesterfield | Registered: May 2001
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Twilight
Puddleglum's sister
# 2832
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Posted
Diet definition: a special course of food to which one restricts oneself, either to lose weight or for medical reasons.
If you're modifying your diet permanently, or making a lifestyle change, or cutting out sugar or doing the three week Hollywood Persimmon Juice Cleanse -- you're still dieting. It's all the same.
For years Oprah used to literally scream at her audience that "DIETS DONT WORK!" and then proceed to tell us we should cut out white foods, don't eat after seven, never eat processed foods, watch portions, eat every four hours, cut out fat, watch carbs, eat, drink 4 ounces of wine with dinner, and any other miracle cure of the moment. That's a diet!
As far as I'm concerned, if I'm not eating whatever sounds tasty I'm on a diet and I refuse to lie to myself and call it anything else.
What works best for me is to give up sugar, partly because left unattended, I eat lots of sugar calories, and because it's a very simple diet and only has one rule, but it can still be very hard socially when everywhere you go someone has brought cake or cookies and acts all hurt feelings if you don't have "just one."
Two years in a row, I gave up sugar on New Year's Eve and stuck to it without a slip until the following Christmas when a certain woman who volunteers with my husband would give him a gigantic tin of homemade walnut fudge. Both years he brought it home, opened it, and showed it to me, with a grin. I would groan and ask him to take it to church or throw it out or something and he said, "No. I might have some." and left it on the counter, untouched, for the season until finally, after a few weeks of thinking about it constantly, I gave in and broke my year long vow. After which I'm like an alcoholic with an open fifth of rum.
Posts: 6817 | Registered: May 2002
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Doc Tor
Deepest Red
# 9748
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Posted
I run so I can eat crap. A 10k run, in an hour, at my weight, gets through nearly a 1000 calories.
And a 1000 calories is a lot, on top of the 2500 recommended intake. So I lose fat and gain muscle, and I feel better, physically and mentally (it's the only time I stop thinking).
It's literally the only way I get to keep my weight down. What happens when my body (I'm over 50) tells me it can't do it any more is anyone's guess. I suppose I'll just get fat.
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Forward the New Republic
Posts: 9131 | From: Ultima Thule | Registered: Jul 2005
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Jane R
Shipmate
# 331
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Posted
I tried running. It caused serious problems with my neck and spine, such that I was unable to exercise properly for months. Back to square one.
Weight training and low-impact CV is the way to go for me.
NO, SWIMMING IS NOT THE ANSWER. If you have any kind of neck problem it puts too much strain on your neck. And I don't want to spend the rest of the day with hair that smells like a loo brush, thanks very much all the same.
[ 17. July 2017, 12:06: Message edited by: Jane R ]
Posts: 3958 | From: Jorvik | Registered: May 2001
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mark_in_manchester
not waving, but...
# 15978
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Posted
quote:
Two years in a row, I gave up sugar on New Year's Eve and stuck to it without a slip until the following Christmas when a certain woman who volunteers with my husband would give him a gigantic tin of homemade walnut fudge. Both years he brought it home, opened it, and showed it to me, with a grin. I would groan and ask him to take it to church or throw it out or something and he said, "No. I might have some." and left it on the counter, untouched, for the season until finally, after a few weeks of thinking about it constantly, I gave in and broke my year long vow. After which I'm like an alcoholic with an open fifth of rum.
Aye, that's me too. Sometimes I can persuade the family to hide the gear, and sometimes I can persuade myself not to go looking for it.
On the upside - there have been times where I've kicked sugar for a month (well, Lent, actually) and all that good-for-you stuff has actually started to taste of something good - you know, apples, lettuce, tomato etc - once my burned-out taste buds have re-calibrated.
OK, here goes again, 17 July. Past experience suggests I won't last a week, and I won't feel any benefit or feel like carrying on until I make 3. I'll come back here (or maybe the one in all saints) to fess up.
[ 17. July 2017, 13:23: Message edited by: mark_in_manchester ]
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"We are punished by our sins, not for them" - Elbert Hubbard
(so good, I wanted to see it after my posts and not only after those of shipmate JBohn from whom I stole it)
Posts: 1596 | Registered: Oct 2010
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Hilda of Whitby
Shipmate
# 7341
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Doc Tor:
I run so I can eat crap. A 10k run, in an hour, at my weight, gets through nearly a 1000 calories.
And a 1000 calories is a lot, on top of the 2500 recommended intake. So I lose fat and gain muscle, and I feel better, physically and mentally (it's the only time I stop thinking).
It's literally the only way I get to keep my weight down. What happens when my body (I'm over 50) tells me it can't do it any more is anyone's guess. I suppose I'll just get fat.
DH was a hard-core, serious runner for decades. He is naturally thin and didn't do it for weight loss. Because of his high metabolism and his long distance running, he thought he could eat whatever he wanted, and did--lots of meat, cheese, and other high-fat foods.
He had two stents put in in 2007 because he developed unstable angina.
In 2014 he had a hip replaced.
All this before age 60.
The two takeaways--you really can't outrun a bad diet, and running can wreak havoc with your joints. DH still exercises a lot, and even does short runs (nothing longer than 5K), but he also made some serious dietary changes.
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"Born with the gift of laughter and a sense that the world is mad."
Posts: 412 | From: Nickel City | Registered: Jun 2004
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Hilda of Whitby
Shipmate
# 7341
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Posted
Sorry for the double post.
Take a look at the No S Diet . It was developed by Reinhard Engels. Reinhard is a librarian/computer programmer who realized he was packing it on and came up with this nifty plan, which got him to his goal weight pretty painlessly.
It's simple: No Snacks, No Sweets, No Seconds except for Saturday, Sunday, and Special Days. Monday through Friday you eat 3 square meals a day of *whatever you want*--it could be a burger and fries--except you can't have snacks, sweets, or seconds and it has to fit on one plate (and not one of those enormous trencher-size plates). On Saturday, Sunday, and Special Days (birthday, anniversary, Easter, etc.) you eat whatever the hell you want, however much you want.
Reinhard has kept off 40 pounds for something like 15 years following the system, and adding walking and very moderate weight training for exercise. But really, the weight loss came from his eating plan.
The No S website has all you need to get going. The No S book is good, but you don't absolutely have to have it. There is a No S forum, and what I find interesting is that the people on it are doing their damnedest to make No S into something way more complicated that it needs to be. No S is basically systematic portion control, that's all ... yet people keep wanting to complicate it, come up with exceptions, and so on.
I adopted this system years ago and it is pretty much how I eat all the time, but I tighten up on it anytime I feel weight creeping on (like after the Christmas holidays). It works really well FOR ME because this is how we ate when I was growing up in the 1960s.
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"Born with the gift of laughter and a sense that the world is mad."
Posts: 412 | From: Nickel City | Registered: Jun 2004
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Amanda B. Reckondwythe
Dressed for Church
# 5521
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Jane R:
NO, SWIMMING IS NOT THE ANSWER. <<snip>> I don't want to spend the rest of the day with hair that smells like a loo brush, thanks very much all the same.
Lawk a'mercy! Where do you go swimming, my dear? ![[Eek!]](eek.gif)
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"I take prayer too seriously to use it as an excuse for avoiding work and responsibility." -- The Revd Martin Luther King Jr.
Posts: 10542 | From: The Great Southwest | Registered: Feb 2004
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Doc Tor
Deepest Red
# 9748
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Hilda of Whitby:
Because of his high metabolism and his long distance running, he thought he could eat whatever he wanted, and did--lots of meat, cheese, and other high-fat foods.
Well, he *could* eat whatever he wanted. And as eating cheese is one of (my) life's greatest pleasures, that I can run, and eat good cheese, drink good ale and decent whisky, contributes greatly to my mental well-being.
There are worse things than living to your 60s and then keeling over. Like denying myself cheese, ale and whisky. I'm not wearing a hair shirt over this.
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Forward the New Republic
Posts: 9131 | From: Ultima Thule | Registered: Jul 2005
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Amanda B. Reckondwythe
Dressed for Church
# 5521
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Posted
When people ask me if I exercise, I tell them I get all the exercise I need attending funerals of people who exercised.
All my life I have had to lose 30 pounds. Like others, I've gone through cycles of losing it and gaining it back again. Right now I have to lose it again. But at my age . . . .
I don't think that being 30 pounds overweight is going to kill me. And if it does . . . I might as well go having enjoyed my favorite foods than having deprived myself of them.
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"I take prayer too seriously to use it as an excuse for avoiding work and responsibility." -- The Revd Martin Luther King Jr.
Posts: 10542 | From: The Great Southwest | Registered: Feb 2004
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Hilda of Whitby
Shipmate
# 7341
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Doc Tor:
Well, he *could* eat whatever he wanted. And as eating cheese is one of (my) life's greatest pleasures, that I can run, and eat good cheese, drink good ale and decent whisky, contributes greatly to my mental well-being.
There are worse things than living to your 60s and then keeling over. Like denying myself cheese, ale and whisky. I'm not wearing a hair shirt over this.
Yeah, there sure are worse things. Odds are, you won't just keel over, but linger for years.
I have real strong feelings about this because both of my parents refused to make sane changes in diet and lifestyle, after hearing several doctors strongly advise them to do so. We aren't talking going vegan and taking up marathon running, either. They both got quite ill. My father's illnesses specifically were diet and lifestyle related. We kids were responsible for taking care of them. Towards the end, when it was getting really bad, my older brother and I were the last ones standing so we ended up with the brunt of it (the oldest two siblings ran for their lives, quite understandably). Perhaps fortunately, my parents were only 66 when they died; my brother was 32 and I was 28 before we could really start living our own lives.
It's one thing if someone wants to eat, drink, and smoke as they please and go against the advice of health professionals--it's their life. BUT it's quite another to drag family members down with them. Because of what I went through, I vowed I would make whatever dietary and lifestyle changes it took so as not to end up like my parents. I've been successful. I don't feel deprived because while I do like really good food, my definition of what that means has changed considerably in the past 30+ years.
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"Born with the gift of laughter and a sense that the world is mad."
Posts: 412 | From: Nickel City | Registered: Jun 2004
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Doc Tor
Deepest Red
# 9748
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Posted
My dad died aged 83 (of cancer, having beaten the thrombosis and the flappy heart valve). My mum's still going at 81. I appear to have genetics on my side, as long as I keep reasonably active.
Obviously, my choice isn't everyone's choice, but dammit, if I've got ten years left, there's going to be cheese and beer in at least moderate quantities.
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Forward the New Republic
Posts: 9131 | From: Ultima Thule | Registered: Jul 2005
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Jane R
Shipmate
# 331
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Posted
Amanda B. Reckondwythe: quote:
Lawk a'mercy! Where do you go swimming, my dear?
Somewhere where they put lots of chlorine in the pool. Well, *I* think it smells like loo cleaner...
Posts: 3958 | From: Jorvik | Registered: May 2001
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lilBuddha
Shipmate
# 14333
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Posted
- We did not evolve for the lifestyle we have.
- Food, especially cheap and packaged food, is higher in fat, sugar and other calories than it needs to be.
- Humans evolved to crave those fats and sugars because they were more scarce and important during that evolution.
This is why people are fatter. Is it fair? If you have the financial and logistical resource to eat better and move around more, than "fair" isn't a reasonable part of the equation. Life isn't perfect: deal.
If you are poor or in a circumstance in which changing this is extremely difficult, than life is exceedingly unfair and this is yet another bus under which you have been thrown.
As to the shaming part of this: Fuck the shammers. Not their business, not their problem if it is indeed a problem.
One last: Moderation in portions and choices isn't the end of the fucking world, nor is a moderate amount of activity. That might not make one a model, but it will make a person healthier and feel better for a longer portion of whatever lifespan one has.
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I put on my rockin' shoes in the morning
Hallellou, hallellou
Posts: 17627 | From: the round earth's imagined corners | Registered: Dec 2008
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Boogie
Boogie on down!
# 13538
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Amanda B. Reckondwythe:
When people ask me if I exercise, I tell them I get all the exercise I need attending funerals of people who exercised.
All my life I have had to lose 30 pounds. Like others, I've gone through cycles of losing it and gaining it back again. Right now I have to lose it again. But at my age . . . .
I don't think that being 30 pounds overweight is going to kill me. And if it does . . . I might as well go having enjoyed my favorite foods than having deprived myself of them.
My Dad always said 'we all need and extra half a stone in case of serious illness.'
Bless him, he had a lot of sayings. He was a very healthy man who was fit as a fiddle when he went into hospital for a minor op on his hand, contacted ecoli there and was dead within a fortnight, aged 86. Ho hum.
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Garden. Room. Walk
Posts: 13030 | From: Boogie Wonderland | Registered: Mar 2008
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Twilight
Puddleglum's sister
# 2832
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by mark_in_manchester:
OK, here goes again, 17 July. Past experience suggests I won't last a week, and I won't feel any benefit or feel like carrying on until I make 3. I'll come back here (or maybe the one in all saints) to fess up.
You go, Mark! I may join you after a doctor's visit I have coming up in a two weeks.
LilBuddha I agree with you (and Jesus) that moderation is a great thing, but for some of us, with certain substances, we have to go by, "What you cannot moderate, you must eliminate."
Posts: 6817 | Registered: May 2002
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rolyn
Shipmate
# 16840
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Posted
As someone said of alcohol -- it makes a good servant but a poor master.
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Change is the only certainty of existence
Posts: 3206 | From: U.K. | Registered: Dec 2011
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cliffdweller
Shipmate
# 13338
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Twilight:
LilBuddha I agree with you (and Jesus) that moderation is a great thing
*tangent* when exactly did Jesus say that???
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"Here is the world. Beautiful and terrible things will happen. Don't be afraid." -Frederick Buechner
Posts: 11242 | From: a small canyon overlooking the city | Registered: Jan 2008
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anoesis
Shipmate
# 14189
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Boogie:
My Dad always, very bluntly, said 'no one came out of Belsen fat'.
What he, and everyone else, forgot to add, was, "And no-one who went in thin, came out at all."
I think we forget just how common lack and starvation have been, until just how recently. And that's me being all first-world and ignoring the parts of the globe where they're still par for the course. When you take this into account, it's eye-wateringly obvious that being of a sturdily-built nature is a very adaptive thing, thats been selected for over a long period of time, and it isn't just going to melt away now that conditions have largely been different for, what, seventy or eighty years? If anything, what's marvellous is that there are any naturally thin people still being born - and I say this as a naturally (relatively) thin person. I'm not quite sure why we haven't all been wiped out...
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The history of humanity give one little hope that strength left to its own devices won't be abused. Indeed, it gives one little ground to think that strength would continue to exist if it were not abused. -- Dafyd --
Posts: 993 | From: New Zealand | Registered: Oct 2008
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lilBuddha
Shipmate
# 14333
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by cliffdweller:
quote:
Originally posted by Twilight:
LilBuddha I agree with you (and Jesus) that moderation is a great thing
*tangent* when exactly did Jesus say that???
Last week. We were talking about the Middle Path and he was like 'Righteous, lilB. That is pretty chill, I dig it.' fist pound
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I put on my rockin' shoes in the morning
Hallellou, hallellou
Posts: 17627 | From: the round earth's imagined corners | Registered: Dec 2008
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Lamb Chopped
Ship's kebab
# 5528
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Posted
I admit, there are times when I could wish to live in one of the cultures where fat women are greatly admired. There the poor naturally thin people are force fed, which is as horrible as fat-shaming is here.
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Er, this is what I've been up to (book).
Oh, that you would rend the heavens and come down!
Posts: 20059 | From: off in left field somewhere | Registered: Feb 2004
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cliffdweller
Shipmate
# 13338
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by lilBuddha:
quote:
Originally posted by cliffdweller:
quote:
Originally posted by Twilight:
LilBuddha I agree with you (and Jesus) that moderation is a great thing
*tangent* when exactly did Jesus say that???
Last week. We were talking about the Middle Path and he was like 'Righteous, lilB. That is pretty chill, I dig it.' fist pound
epic.
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"Here is the world. Beautiful and terrible things will happen. Don't be afraid." -Frederick Buechner
Posts: 11242 | From: a small canyon overlooking the city | Registered: Jan 2008
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MaryLouise
Shipmate
# 18697
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Posted
(LC)
Last week I read interviews with and extracts from Roxane Gay’s book Hunger in which (short précis) she writes about weight, body image and relationships with food. She talks about how she deliberately ate more to give herself a larger, less attractive body because she wanted men to keep away after she had been raped. I don’t think I’m ready to read the book yet but probably will at some point.
When I was adolescent and following on child abuse, I starved myself so that my breasts would not grow and I could stay a small child in appearance. It wasn’t anorexia and it wasn’t will power. It was fear that motivated me. And when I look at the emaciated images of Afrikaner women and children in the British camps in South Africa during the Anglo-Boer war and read the histories there, It wasn’t just the lack of food, it was the fear that they would not get out alive, that the husbands and brothers out fighting in the veld were dead, it was the memory of homes burned to the ground. In a similar way, starvation and terror in Holocaust death camps worked together to accelerate weight loss (Primo Levi writes about this).
Many black women from informal settlements in South Africa look bulky or overweight by Western standards. A more substantial size or build is considered attractive in black culture, but more significantly, the food available and affordable from spaza shops is a nutritional disaster: cheap processed meats, refined white sugar and white bread or maize meal. The incidence of diabetes is rising fast in disadvantaged communities in part because a diet of fresh vegetables, fish, alternatives to sugar etc, is not affordable. And every church or community hall meeting or event features bought cakes and sweets for the children, treats that are irresistible when you don’t have them at home.
When I went to university, I had no particular food preferences, I didn’t think about food at all. Once I’d stopped trying to starve myself in my teens I was mostly compliant at home and boarding school, praised because I ate what was put in front of me. I didn’t snack or crave anything between meals. My senses woke up in my early 20s and I found I liked pizza and olives and salty nuts. Then a promised bursary fell through and I found I could get by on lentils and split pea soups for a couple of year until I qualified and could get a job. The odd thing was that I came to love lentil and pulse dishes and still eat them most weeks. Since I lived in a communal house for a while, I learned to cook vegan and vegetarian food. As a Catholic convert, I undertook fasting with some reluctance but found that my unstrenuous fasts in Lent or on retreat have almost nothing to do with losing weight.
When I pop onto forum threads and post about needing to lose a little weight, this isn’t fraught for me any longer. I have a sedentary writer’s life sitting at my desk all day and a daily walk or session at gym doesn’t do enough to counter my fondness for pasta and Lindt chocolate. When I’m happy, I put on weight and don’t mind it too much.
All the same, I know that if I were to experience some major life crisis or bereavement, the struggle around food and eating would be right back again. When my food intake seems to be the only thing I can control about my life, it becomes an unhealthy issue. When I am frightened by the changes to do with ageing in my life or health problems, eating more or eating less makes me feel I can look and feel better.
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“As regards plots I find real life no help at all. Real life seems to have no plots.”
-- Ivy Compton-Burnett
Posts: 646 | From: Cape Town | Registered: Nov 2016
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Jane R
Shipmate
# 331
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Posted
Lamb Chopped: quote:
I admit, there are times when I could wish to live in one of the cultures where fat women are greatly admired. There the poor naturally thin people are force fed, which is as horrible as fat-shaming is here.
It's one extreme or the other, isn't it... CS Lewis said (in Mere Christianity, IIRC) that if our society's relationship with food were as messed-up as our ideas about sex, it would be possible to make money out of doing shows where a tempting plate of food was slowly revealed... and then the audience went home without eating it. He thought he was joking.
Sixty-odd years later, with wall-to-wall cookery programmes on TV and gastroporn bestsellers in every bookshop, we know he's not...
[ 18. July 2017, 08:10: Message edited by: Jane R ]
Posts: 3958 | From: Jorvik | Registered: May 2001
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Brenda Clough
Shipmate
# 18061
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Posted
It is worth looking back at pictures or paintings of the great beauties of the past. Marilyn Monroe would be deemed chubby today.
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Science fiction and fantasy writer with a Patreon page
Posts: 6378 | From: Washington DC | Registered: Mar 2014
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Jane R
Shipmate
# 331
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Posted
Or you could compare the original version of James T. Kirk with the rebooted one... William Shatner looks decidedly flabby next to Chris Pine, but hypermasculinity was not 'in' in the sixties.
Posts: 3958 | From: Jorvik | Registered: May 2001
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no prophet's flag is set so...
Proceed to see sea
# 15560
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Posted
The "No S" (snacks, sweets, seconds) is a good one. I'd add salt to it, because some of us are salt responders re blood pressure.
Posts: 11498 | From: Treaty 6 territory in the nonexistant Province of Buffalo, Canada ↄ⃝' | Registered: Mar 2010
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Brenda Clough
Shipmate
# 18061
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Jane R:
Or you could compare the original version of James T. Kirk with the rebooted one... William Shatner looks decidedly flabby next to Chris Pine, but hypermasculinity was not 'in' in the sixties.
And do not compare Adam West to any of the later iterations of Batman.
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Science fiction and fantasy writer with a Patreon page
Posts: 6378 | From: Washington DC | Registered: Mar 2014
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lilBuddha
Shipmate
# 14333
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Brenda Clough:
quote:
Originally posted by Jane R:
Or you could compare the original version of James T. Kirk with the rebooted one... William Shatner looks decidedly flabby next to Chris Pine, but hypermasculinity was not 'in' in the sixties.
And do not compare Adam West to any of the later iterations of Batman.
There is only one iteration of Batman and that is Adam West. The rest are silly costume Emo farces.
OK, I so like some of those other films a bit, but AW for LIFE!
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I put on my rockin' shoes in the morning
Hallellou, hallellou
Posts: 17627 | From: the round earth's imagined corners | Registered: Dec 2008
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Jane R
Shipmate
# 331
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Posted
What lilbuddha said. He couldn't act for toffee (or was that just the way he was told to play the role?) but he *was* Batman.
The others take themselves far, far too seriously.
Posts: 3958 | From: Jorvik | Registered: May 2001
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Brenda Clough
Shipmate
# 18061
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Posted
If you google around you can probably still find the TV advert Adam West did for AOL, or Yahoo, or one of those people, about ten years ago. It was very short; it began with AW in tight closeup, saying with fiery focus into the camera, "I use AOL to keep up on the nefarious doings of all my enemies!" And then the camera pulled back a bit, revealing AW wearing a hospital gown, and a burly ward attendant in the back saying, "Mr. West, it's time for your medication." No, he did not take himself seriously!
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Science fiction and fantasy writer with a Patreon page
Posts: 6378 | From: Washington DC | Registered: Mar 2014
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Twilight
Puddleglum's sister
# 2832
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by cliffdweller:
quote:
Originally posted by Twilight:
LilBuddha I agree with you (and Jesus) that moderation is a great thing
*tangent* when exactly did Jesus say that???
Never. I looked it up and found it listed in a group of, "Things people think the Bible says." But then you knew that didn't you?
In any case, I'm very glad to hear he didn't say it because I'd always felt a bit guilty over my inability to moderate things like cigarettes and sugar.
Posts: 6817 | Registered: May 2002
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Lamb Chopped
Ship's kebab
# 5528
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Posted
Jesus isn't particularly moderate in much of his own life. I can't imagine him recommending it as a general principle!
Posts: 20059 | From: off in left field somewhere | Registered: Feb 2004
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Nick Tamen
Ship's Wayfaring Fool
# 15164
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Jane R:
What lilbuddha said. He couldn't act for toffee (or was that just the way he was told to play the role?) but he *was* Batman.
That's exactly how executive producer William Dozier—who was responsible for the pop-camp style of the show, and who provided the voice of the narrator—wanted the role played. West got the part because he could pull it off so perfectly.
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The first thing God says to Moses is, "Take off your shoes." We are on holy ground. Hard to believe, but the truest thing I know. — Anne Lamott
Posts: 2833 | From: On heaven-crammed earth | Registered: Sep 2009
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Jane R
Shipmate
# 331
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Posted
<continuing Batman tangent> My favourite episode is the one where he goes to a dance club and someone asks him if he'd like to dance. "No thank you" he replies (in full superhero costume) "I don't want to look too conspicuous." <\end Batman tangent>
Posts: 3958 | From: Jorvik | Registered: May 2001
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wild haggis
Shipmate
# 15555
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Posted
Interesting stuff here.
If it was as simple as good food in, exercise = slimness. I would be a bean pole! We are humans not machines. There is more going on than fuel in and shape out.
Years ago I was teaching all day, on my feet (running, and I mean running, up and down to the 5th floor all day long), walking to the Tube and back, attending ballet & contemporary dance classes, being very careful with my diet and yet I was still not slimline!
I was told by one of these slimming class leaders that I wasn't eating enough when she saw my food diary!!! So I followed her plan - and put on weight!!!!
I was put on medication by the GP - horrible stuff. It took me 18 months to loose a stone.Anther GP put me on a 1,000 calories a day - not healthy but it was for a limited period. Still did my exercise. In 6 months I lost just over half a stone.
My gran was huge, so maybe it's genetics!
Anyway I'll eat sensibly, exercise with my Water-exercise twice a week (a gym is too dangerous for someone with arthritis - especially with so called trainers who have no idea about physiology), do my housework, walk and my daily physio at home and stay chubby and cuddly.
I have wasted so much of my life worrying about my weight and it hasn't worked.
I hate people who are judgmental comments and "solutions" without knowing someone and what they have been through.
If you live healthily and are a wee bit overweight, what's wrong with that? Skinny isn't necessarily healthy.
People, even Christians, can be very nasty about the shape and weight of folks without knowing their background.
As to shaming......well turn round and make a rude comment to the shammer about their appearance and give them a taste of their own medicine. They are just bullies.
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wild haggis
Posts: 166 | From: Cardiff | Registered: Mar 2010
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Boogie
Boogie on down!
# 13538
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Posted
Well, I have arthritis in hips and knees, fingers and in one toe. It's my main motivation for working so hard on my weight and trying to build some muscle at the gym.
My knees and hips are thanking me for it.
I also find it really, really hard to lose weight on the same food that has all around me slim and fit.
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Garden. Room. Walk
Posts: 13030 | From: Boogie Wonderland | Registered: Mar 2008
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Moo
Ship's tough old bird
# 107
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by wild haggis
My gran was huge, so maybe it's genetics!
One of my great-grandfathers got a medical discharge from the Confederate Army for obesity. There are seven descendants in my generation. Two of us have weight problems. I have a problem,but it's not extreme. One of my cousins has a very serious problem. She managed to lose almost a hundred pounds by running six miles every day. After awhile her knees gave out, and she ended up heavier than ever.
Moo
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Kerygmania host
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See you later, alligator.
Posts: 20365 | From: Alleghany Mountains of Virginia | Registered: May 2001
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