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Source: (consider it)
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Thread: The Coward Uncle Pete
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Marvin the Martian
Interplanetary
# 4360
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Doc Tor:
I'm also suggesting that. But 'outweighs the gains' is the important phrase here. First and foremost, it suggests that there were gains, and being a dictator doesn't mean you have to use the aggregated wealth and power just to gold plate your taps.
I've been agreeing with you about cubas healthcare and education systems the whole time. We just give them different weightings when balanced against everything else.
quote:
Yes, Pete was talking out of his arse. I wouldn't have wanted to live in Castro's Cuba. But I would have wanted to live in Pinochet's Chile even less, or suffered the Contra attacks in Nicaragua, because as a leftist, I'd probably have been left alone in Cuba, but not in the other two countries.
I could say the same thing, but with the countries and political opinions reversed.
quote:
Marvin and Pete seem to be two sides of the same coin. Both could do with the application of the clue bat.
For us to be two sides of the same coin I'd have to be in favour of right-wing dictatorships. I am most assuredly not. I am against all forms of dictatorship*, regardless of which wing they're on.
*= with the obvious exception of any dictatorship in which I am the one in charge. That dream is vanishingly unlikely to come true, but it's nice to know that if it ever does come to pass all I'll have to do is hire a few more nurses and teachers and half this thread will flock to my side ![[Big Grin]](biggrin.gif)
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Hail Gallaxhar
Posts: 30100 | From: Adrift on a sea of surreality | Registered: Apr 2003
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lilBuddha
Shipmate
# 14333
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Doc Tor:
Marvin and Pete seem to be two sides of the same coin. Both could do with the application of the clue bat.
You will break the bat before driving in the clue.
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I put on my rockin' shoes in the morning
Hallellou, hallellou
Posts: 17627 | From: the round earth's imagined corners | Registered: Dec 2008
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Gee D
Shipmate
# 13815
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Alan Cresswell:
quote:
Originally posted by Gee D:
Uncle Pete's post yesterday timed at 6.57 goes pretty close to that.
You do realise there is a really handy URL code that links directly to another post? Using that means others don't need to translate from whatever time zone you're in to identify when a post was written, and then to go and find it.
But, if you want to make people work hard to figure out what you're referring to then go ahead. I'll just ignore you, I've better things to do with life than spend time doing that.
Had I done that, you would have had to click on the link - more work to be done.
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Not every Anglican in Sydney is Sydney Anglican
Posts: 7028 | From: Warrawee NSW Australia | Registered: Jun 2008
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Alan Cresswell
Mad Scientist 先生
# 31
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Marvin the Martian:
quote:
Originally posted by Alan Cresswell:
Do you have any examples of my "making excuses for the evils of marxists"?
quote:
Basically, from all the way over here and just some impressionistic anecdotes, Castro displayed enough good qualities for people to admire him and enough bad qualities for people to hate him. But, not enough good qualities to be a saint, and not enough bad to be the devil incarnate. Pretty much the same as most political leaders really.
That sure sounds like you were saying Castro was no worse than any other political leader.
Maybe you could read it that way. I was aiming more at "on the spectrum between good and bad as every other political leader" - and, most would agree Castro was better than many, though worse than most.
But, either way I didn't actually mention any "evils of marxists" (or, specific evils of Castro). I would have thought most people would realise those un-mentioned evils would fit under "enough bad qualities for people to hate him". Something I acknowledged but didn't even attempt to make any excuse for.
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Don't cling to a mistake just because you spent a lot of time making it.
Posts: 32413 | From: East Kilbride (Scotland) or 福島 | Registered: May 2001
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Alan Cresswell
Mad Scientist 先生
# 31
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Gee D:
quote:
Originally posted by Alan Cresswell:
quote:
Originally posted by Gee D:
Uncle Pete's post yesterday timed at 6.57 goes pretty close to that.
You do realise there is a really handy URL code that links directly to another post? Using that means others don't need to translate from whatever time zone you're in to identify when a post was written, and then to go and find it.
But, if you want to make people work hard to figure out what you're referring to then go ahead. I'll just ignore you, I've better things to do with life than spend time doing that.
Had I done that, you would have had to click on the link - more work to be done.
The idea of links is to reduce the amount of work needed to get to somewhere on the internet. I still haven't found the post you referenced, but if you'd posted a link then I'd have gone straight there. Simples.
I guess you must mean that putting in the link would be more work for you.
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Don't cling to a mistake just because you spent a lot of time making it.
Posts: 32413 | From: East Kilbride (Scotland) or 福島 | Registered: May 2001
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Gee D
Shipmate
# 13815
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Posted
I am deliberately saving from you the onerous task of clicking on a link.
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Not every Anglican in Sydney is Sydney Anglican
Posts: 7028 | From: Warrawee NSW Australia | Registered: Jun 2008
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Curiosity killed ...
Ship's Mug
# 11770
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Posted
@GeeD - if you identify a post by time, the time you see is the time posted as in your time zone. The time everyone else sees is the time in their time zone. So 6:37 in Australia is no help to anyone the other side of the world. If you want people to know what you mean, you will have to link the post, because, at the moment, you are expecting everyone outside your time zone to do the calculations to work out which post you are referring to.
Now, in your world clicking on a link may be more onerous than calculating relative time zones, but not in mine, or I suspect most Shipmates.
[ 03. December 2016, 07:33: Message edited by: Curiosity killed ... ]
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Mugs - Keep the Ship afloat
Posts: 13794 | From: outiside the outer ring road | Registered: Aug 2006
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Doc Tor
Deepest Red
# 9748
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Gee D:
I am deliberately saving from you the onerous task of clicking on a link.
You are a dick. Either practice your UBB or GTFO.
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Forward the New Republic
Posts: 9131 | From: Ultima Thule | Registered: Jul 2005
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Alan Cresswell
Mad Scientist 先生
# 31
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Posted
Something onerous. One click and you're there (usually in another tab, so you don't have to find your way back here). So much more onerous than the at least two clicks it would take you to find the UBB practice thread.
Or, are we going to keep facing the onerous task of reading your shit?
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Don't cling to a mistake just because you spent a lot of time making it.
Posts: 32413 | From: East Kilbride (Scotland) or 福島 | Registered: May 2001
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Gee D
Shipmate
# 13815
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Curiosity killed ...:
@GeeD - if you identify a post by time, the time you see is the time posted as in your time zone. The time everyone else sees is the time in their time zone. So 6:37 in Australia is no help to anyone the other side of the world. If you want people to know what you mean, you will have to link the post, because, at the moment, you are expecting everyone outside your time zone to do the calculations to work out which post you are referring to.
Now, in your world clicking on a link may be more onerous than calculating relative time zones, but not in mine, or I suspect most Shipmates.
I thought it was only the Usians who did not do sarcasm and irony.
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Not every Anglican in Sydney is Sydney Anglican
Posts: 7028 | From: Warrawee NSW Australia | Registered: Jun 2008
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Curiosity killed ...
Ship's Mug
# 11770
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Posted
GeeD - if you think you're being sarcastic and ironic by refusing to link to a post that you are identifying a way that no-one else can recognise without having to calculate the difference between your timezone and theirs, you have been sadly misinformed as to what sarcasm and irony are.
You really do not get this do you?
Our profiles set the timezone we live in. The time stamps we see on a post are based on the timezone we live in. So you will see this post, which is posted at 17:25 or thereabouts, GMT, as posted at 04:25 ACT. If you decide to get into a snit about this post and have a go at me about the post I made at 4:25am I will know I wasn't awake at 4:25am but not be able to identify the post unless I go and make the same calculations I just have. The same is true for anyone in any other timezone.
So if you want someone in a different timezone to you to know which post you are referring to you cannot use the time at which it is posted, you have to link to it.
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Mugs - Keep the Ship afloat
Posts: 13794 | From: outiside the outer ring road | Registered: Aug 2006
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Gee D
Shipmate
# 13815
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Posted
I totally understand the timezone issue, always have;'always shall. Grew up with it and shall die with it.
Look at Uncle Pete's posts and see how he's trying hard to avoid what he said.
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Not every Anglican in Sydney is Sydney Anglican
Posts: 7028 | From: Warrawee NSW Australia | Registered: Jun 2008
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Gee D
Shipmate
# 13815
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Posted
At least I'm open and honest. Has anyone seen an apology, public or private from Uncle Pete for his All Saints post?
[ 03. December 2016, 19:51: Message edited by: Gee D ]
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Not every Anglican in Sydney is Sydney Anglican
Posts: 7028 | From: Warrawee NSW Australia | Registered: Jun 2008
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balaam
Making an ass of myself
# 4543
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Posted
Thanking you for being open and honest.
Open and honest about refusing to comply with requests to link to content.
Open and honest about wanting to treat those requests with derision.
Open and honest about not caring what others think.
I openly and honestly think you are trolling.
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Last ever sig ...
blog
Posts: 9049 | From: Hen Ogledd | Registered: May 2003
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Goldfish Stew
Shipmate
# 5512
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Gee D:
Has anyone seen an apology, public or private from Uncle Pete for his All Saints post?
I'll save you from clicking on a link by not linking it.
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Posts: 2405 | From: Aotearoa/New Zealand | Registered: Feb 2004
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Sioni Sais
Shipmate
# 5713
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Gee D:
I totally understand the timezone issue, always have;'always shall. Grew up with it and shall die with it.
When shall that be?
Posts: 24276 | From: Newport, Wales | Registered: Apr 2004
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Golden Key
Shipmate
# 1468
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Gee D:
At least I'm open and honest. Has anyone seen an apology, public or private from Uncle Pete for his All Saints post?
Errr...I don't see that Pete did anything wrong. People frequently start AS memorial threads for famous people. IME, they're generally not used to slice and dice the dead person--though there might be a mention that the person had a complicated life. But AS memorial threads aren't for angrily discussing what a monster a person was.
None of that prevents starting a Purg or Hell thread about the dead person. If you hate Castro, fine. You start a thread in Purg or Hell, and have at it.
Is there a piece I'm missing?
![[Confused]](confused.gif)
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Blessed Gator, pray for us!
--"Oh bat bladders, do you have to bring common sense into this?" (Dragon, "Jane & the Dragon")
--"Oh, Peace Train, save this country!" (Yusuf/Cat Stevens, "Peace Train")
Posts: 18601 | From: Chilling out in an undisclosed, sincere pumpkin patch. | Registered: Oct 2001
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Goldfish Stew
Shipmate
# 5512
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Golden Key:
quote:
Originally posted by Gee D:
At least I'm open and honest. Has anyone seen an apology, public or private from Uncle Pete for his All Saints post?
Errr...I don't see that Pete did anything wrong. People frequently start AS memorial threads for famous people. IME, they're generally not used to slice and dice the dead person--though there might be a mention that the person had a complicated life. But AS memorial threads aren't for angrily discussing what a monster a person was.
None of that prevents starting a Purg or Hell thread about the dead person. If you hate Castro, fine. You start a thread in Purg or Hell, and have at it.
Is there a piece I'm missing?
Aren't we all? So far this thread has taught me:
1. Don't start memorial threads about people whose name rhymes with Quidel Mastro
2. Something about private messages, whether they get read, how they work. Not sure
3. Uncle Pete does not hover at a computer waiting to answer a hell call in 3 minutes or less
4. Always post a link to make life easier. Even if that means someone might have to click the link
I think Gee D is upset about some insinuation in this post here. Or should that be Uncle Pete's post at 8:19 on 27 November (to save Gee D the strain of clicking a link.)
Apparently that was a personal attack on Gee D. God knows why.
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Posts: 2405 | From: Aotearoa/New Zealand | Registered: Feb 2004
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lilBuddha
Shipmate
# 14333
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Posted
Uncle Pete started the AS thread by calling Castro a "great, great man". Which, besides being objectively wrong is deliberate bait to those who will inevitably disagree.
Then posted this junior hosting whinge:
quote:
Private messages don't do any good; but I started this thread in AS for a reason. Take your negative posts elsewhere
The resulting Styx thread lead to this Hell thread.
Though it violates none of the rules, IMO posting a memorial thread for a dictator is in bad taste.
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I put on my rockin' shoes in the morning
Hallellou, hallellou
Posts: 17627 | From: the round earth's imagined corners | Registered: Dec 2008
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Uncle Pete
Loyaute me lie
# 10422
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Posted
I confess to the junior hosting. I also confess to attempting, in charity, to see the good in a flawed man. I did it in a clumsy manner. Sue me.
I also confess to being an adult socialist. I am not a capitalist or any other type of alt.right person. In my country, it is not a shame or against the law to be a socialist or even to hold divergent views.
So while I'm at it, is there any other thing you would like me to confess to? Or are people going to continue a dog-pile and persist in calling me a coward? Because I suspect that I could give many of you lessons in not being a coward.
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Even more so than I was before
Posts: 20466 | From: No longer where I was | Registered: Sep 2005
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lilBuddha
Shipmate
# 14333
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Posted
I didn't call you a coward*.
Praising Castro as you have makes you a tosser in my book.** Repression/oppression/suppression are always wrong. Castro's was a failed experiment.
BTW: I am no capitalist. Democratic socialism is the best, workable system, IMO. Anything further requires too much force.
*This is a strange accusation online. Very difficult to prove bravery in a (relatively) anonymous setting such as this.
**and I hate to say that, because I like Zappa.
[ 04. December 2016, 01:34: Message edited by: lilBuddha ]
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I put on my rockin' shoes in the morning
Hallellou, hallellou
Posts: 17627 | From: the round earth's imagined corners | Registered: Dec 2008
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Gee D
Shipmate
# 13815
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Posted
At last, an apology of sorts, far from full or even half full, but a start.
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Not every Anglican in Sydney is Sydney Anglican
Posts: 7028 | From: Warrawee NSW Australia | Registered: Jun 2008
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Golden Key
Shipmate
# 1468
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Posted
...and, yet, those of you all right and righteous about hating Fidel didn't start a thread calling *him* to Hell. Why's that? Did "coward" Pete somehow muzzle you in Hell?
BTW: Per a 1970s TV interview with Barbara Walters, Fidel didn't believe in Hell. BW asked him, for some reason. He said he couldn't see why a Creator would do that. IIRC, he suggested it would be setting us all up. AIUI, he didn't particularly believe in Heaven, but thought it might be a pleasant surprise.
I'm a universalist, so I choose to stand with the belief that Fidel and *everyone* will get that pleasant surprise, no matter what we've done. I think we'll all need to heal what we've done and what's been done to us.
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Blessed Gator, pray for us!
--"Oh bat bladders, do you have to bring common sense into this?" (Dragon, "Jane & the Dragon")
--"Oh, Peace Train, save this country!" (Yusuf/Cat Stevens, "Peace Train")
Posts: 18601 | From: Chilling out in an undisclosed, sincere pumpkin patch. | Registered: Oct 2001
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RuthW
liberal "peace first" hankie squeezer
# 13
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Uncle Pete:
I also confess to being an adult socialist. I am not a capitalist or any other type of alt.right person.
Oh fer cryin' out loud. Capitalists are a type of the "alt-right"? All of them?
Posts: 24453 | From: La La Land | Registered: Apr 2001
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lilBuddha
Shipmate
# 14333
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Golden Key:
...and, yet, those of you all right and righteous about hating Fidel didn't start a thread calling *him* to Hell. Why's that? Did "coward" Pete somehow muzzle you in Hell?
As for me, I never said I hated Castro. I am not sure anyone has said they hated him.
ISTM, it is Uncle Pete people are annoyed with and someone did indeed begin a Hell thread about him.
I started the Purg thread because I thought there was a discussion about the good v. the bad.
I participate in the Hell thread because I think that Castro does not deserve the praise he was getting in AS.
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I put on my rockin' shoes in the morning
Hallellou, hallellou
Posts: 17627 | From: the round earth's imagined corners | Registered: Dec 2008
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Curiosity killed ...
Ship's Mug
# 11770
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Goldfish Stew:
I think Gee D is upset about some insinuation in this post here. Or should that be Uncle Pete's post at 8:19 on 27 November (to save Gee D the strain of clicking a link.)
For what it's worth, when I click on that link, that post was made at 19:19 on 27 November.
QED
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Mugs - Keep the Ship afloat
Posts: 13794 | From: outiside the outer ring road | Registered: Aug 2006
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Dave W.
Shipmate
# 8765
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Posted
I'm pretty sure it went like this:
Callan asked "Why is it that Castro gets a free pass, whilst the likes of Honecker and Jaruzelski don't?"
Mousethief wanted to know "Who's giving him a free pass? No one on this thread. Non sequitur." (quoted in full, because Mousethief.)
Gee D then nominated Uncle Pete as the passgiver with "Uncle Pete's post yesterday timed at 6.57 goes pretty close to that." (except without the link, obvs.)
and then people got pissy about how hard it is to link to a post/find things on a thread that's only 2 pages long.
You're welcome!
Posts: 2059 | From: the hub of the solar system | Registered: Nov 2004
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no prophet's flag is set so...
Proceed to see sea
# 15560
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Posted
Thanks for that analysis Dave.
Just remember, we are all someone's reason to masturbate.
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Out of this nettle, danger, we pluck this flower, safety.
\_(ツ)_/
Posts: 11498 | From: Treaty 6 territory in the nonexistant Province of Buffalo, Canada ↄ⃝' | Registered: Mar 2010
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rolyn
Shipmate
# 16840
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Posted
No one ever got a distant horny over a Hell Host then.
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Change is the only certainty of existence
Posts: 3206 | From: U.K. | Registered: Dec 2011
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Doc Tor
Deepest Red
# 9748
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Posted
I admit I had a bit of a man-crush on orfeo, but that's as far as it went. And it was his love of Tori Amos that ruined it for me.
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Forward the New Republic
Posts: 9131 | From: Ultima Thule | Registered: Jul 2005
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Kelly Alves
Bunny with an axe
# 2522
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Doc Tor:
And it was his love of Tori Amos that ruined it for me.
![[Disappointed]](graemlins/disappointed.gif)
The knuckle- dragging barbarians you have with you, I guess.
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I cannot expect people to believe “
Jesus loves me, this I know” of they don’t believe “Kelly loves me, this I know.”
Kelly Alves, somewhere around 2003.
Posts: 35076 | From: Pura Californiana | Registered: Mar 2002
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Ariston
Insane Unicorn
# 10894
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by rolyn:
No one ever got a distant horny over a Hell Host then.
UM.
UM.
I just..no. Just No.
Can't even.
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“Therefore, let it be explained that nowhere are the proprieties quite so strictly enforced as in men’s colleges that invite young women guests, especially over-night visitors in the fraternity houses.” Emily Post, 1937.
Posts: 6849 | From: The People's Republic of Balcones | Registered: Jan 2006
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Zappa
Ship's Wake
# 8433
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by RuthW:
Honestly, to me it doesn't even make that much sense. Zappa said Castro was one of his "heroes of justice" -- which makes my brain leak a little bit of goo every time I try to understand it. How on earth a Christian -- a priest! -- can think someone who executed thousands of political opponents was in any way an exemplar of justice ... no. I can't wrap my mind around it.
Oh dear, Real Life™ got in the way of seeing this and Hell's probably not the right place for a reasoned discussion so I shall shall suggest that a left wing revolutionary overthrowing a right wing thug propped up by A Good Christian Nation™ generates less concern for me than a Pinochet regime at which the Reagans of this world can blow kisses leaving it to murder with impugnity (is that how it's spelt, my wiggly red lines aren't working) knowing that it had God On Its Side™ and God alone knows what the beaver wearing Drumpff will wink at and this sentence which parentheically references my avatar is worthy of St Paul and has enough ™-symbols for a life time
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shameless self promotion - because I think it's worth it
and mayhap this too: http://broken-moments.blogspot.co.nz/
Posts: 18917 | From: "Central" is all they call it | Registered: Sep 2004
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Marvin the Martian
Interplanetary
# 4360
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Posted
Yeah, who knew that all you have to do to be a "hero of justice" is murder a slightly smaller bunch of people than at least one fascist dictator.
By that criterion, I must be the fucking Pope. If not the Messiah Himself.
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Hail Gallaxhar
Posts: 30100 | From: Adrift on a sea of surreality | Registered: Apr 2003
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lilBuddha
Shipmate
# 14333
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Posted
Damn, Zappa. Did Uncle Pete and Martin60 collaborate and write that post for you?
I like you and generally respect what you post, but that is asinine and ridiculous.
It doesn't matter the ideology behind it, oppression is wrong. Murdering your oponents is wrong. Locking your citizens inside your borders is wrong.
What you purport to believe is both a logical fallacy and an ethical one.
ETA:There is a (relatively) reasoned discussion going on in Purg.
[ 04. December 2016, 23:08: Message edited by: lilBuddha ]
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I put on my rockin' shoes in the morning
Hallellou, hallellou
Posts: 17627 | From: the round earth's imagined corners | Registered: Dec 2008
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Zappa
Ship's Wake
# 8433
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Me:
quote:
Originally posted by lilBuddha:
Damn, Zappa. Did Uncle Pete and Martin60 collaborate and write that post for you?
Hell, no. They'd be erudite. I'd just sure as hell have a Castro (either) before Evil dressed up as benevolence.
A Poet Laureate of Blessed Memory* alluded to it this way:
quote:
Oliver North married William Secord
And gave birth to a little Tehran
*Lou Reed. "Sick of You". © 1989.
Incidentally it was Reed who got his Secords mixed up, not me.
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shameless self promotion - because I think it's worth it
and mayhap this too: http://broken-moments.blogspot.co.nz/
Posts: 18917 | From: "Central" is all they call it | Registered: Sep 2004
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lilBuddha
Shipmate
# 14333
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Zappa:
I'd just sure as hell have a Castro
Is a stupid statement, Sorry Zappa, but that is the kindest way I can put it. You meerely repeat, but do not address this:
quote:
What you purport to believe is both a logical fallacy and an ethical one.
Your boy Jesus might forgive Castro, but he sure would not support him.
[ 05. December 2016, 00:33: Message edited by: lilBuddha ]
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I put on my rockin' shoes in the morning
Hallellou, hallellou
Posts: 17627 | From: the round earth's imagined corners | Registered: Dec 2008
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Goldfish Stew
Shipmate
# 5512
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Zappa:
I'd just sure as hell have a Castro ...
sounds painful
Posts: 2405 | From: Aotearoa/New Zealand | Registered: Feb 2004
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RuthW
liberal "peace first" hankie squeezer
# 13
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Posted
The horrors of American foreign policy make you see Castro as a hero of justice? All righty then!
Posts: 24453 | From: La La Land | Registered: Apr 2001
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Marvin the Martian
Interplanetary
# 4360
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Posted
It's as if they think America is bad, therefore anyone who opposes America must perforce be good.
So yeah, massive logical fallacy.
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Hail Gallaxhar
Posts: 30100 | From: Adrift on a sea of surreality | Registered: Apr 2003
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Doc Tor
Deepest Red
# 9748
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Posted
Actually, and unsurprisingly, there is more, oh I don't know, more nuance in it than that.
The USA's foreign policy (and the UK's for that matter) is frankly shocking. There's very little that either of them wouldn't support, prop-up, actively encourage, whatever, if it means more dollar/pounds in the bank. Other than that metric, they don't give a shit. And I'm left wondering if that shouldn't change.
And note, that the US initially held out the hand of friendship to the Castro regime, even while it was imprisoning and executing Batista cronies. It was only when Castro had the temerity to nationalise US-owned assets did the drawbridge go up.
So you can fuck right off back to binary world. Castro wasn't your monster.
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Forward the New Republic
Posts: 9131 | From: Ultima Thule | Registered: Jul 2005
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Marvin the Martian
Interplanetary
# 4360
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Doc Tor:
The USA's foreign policy (and the UK's for that matter) is frankly shocking. There's very little that either of them wouldn't support, prop-up, actively encourage, whatever, if it means more dollar/pounds in the bank. Other than that metric, they don't give a shit.
Or to put it another way, "America is bad".
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And I'm left wondering if that shouldn't change.
That doesn't mean any change would be better.
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And note, that the US initially held out the hand of friendship to the Castro regime, even while it was imprisoning and executing Batista cronies. It was only when Castro had the temerity to nationalise US-owned assets did the drawbridge go up.
That's perfectly consistent with your first paragraph. And I can certainly envisage an alternative history where Castro was an ally of the US. But that wouldn't change anything about whether he was worthy of the accolades and adulation some here want to give him.
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So you can fuck right off back to binary world. Castro wasn't your monster.
Are you admitting that he was a monster? I count that as progress
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Hail Gallaxhar
Posts: 30100 | From: Adrift on a sea of surreality | Registered: Apr 2003
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Doc Tor
Deepest Red
# 9748
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Posted
The suggestion that he wasn't your monster is simply that if he had been your monster, you wouldn't have given two shits about what he did.
If someone is fighting against, rather than for, American foreign policy, then they have the fight of their lives on their hands. It doesn't actually matter whether they're trying to usher in an age of peace and prosperity for their people, free of banksters and rentiers, or whether they're going for a full-blown Communist dictatorship complete with gulags and secret police on every corner.
The only thing that seems to matter is if they impede the US's ability to own their stuff and sell them crap. That makes monsters. Castro was weak. He fell. He became an autocrat and a dictator and frankly unhinged.
But there is a context. A very broad context. If Castro had been the West's monster, Prince Charles would have been at the funeral in the same way he was at the Saudi king's funeral. And, mostly, no shits would be given.
Edit:
And adding that I've been very happy over the last few decades that the UK has mainly not been in a position to really prop up murderous dictatorships, something that membership of the EU has, I think, had a hand in. That we sell arms to some very questionable regimes is a source of shame. That we offer banking facilities to them and their stolen billions, rather than sequestering them for the time when we can hand them back to the people they were looted from, likewise. 'Ethical foreign policy' my arse. And I can only see it getting worse now the UK intends to leave the EU.
[ 05. December 2016, 11:52: Message edited by: Doc Tor ]
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Forward the New Republic
Posts: 9131 | From: Ultima Thule | Registered: Jul 2005
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lilBuddha
Shipmate
# 14333
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Posted
Wasting your time Doc. Marvin cannot see but two tones.
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I put on my rockin' shoes in the morning
Hallellou, hallellou
Posts: 17627 | From: the round earth's imagined corners | Registered: Dec 2008
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