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Source: (consider it) Thread: A Truth Universally Acknowledged...
ken
Ship's Roundhead
# 2460

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quote:
Originally posted by Hazey*Jane:
Do guys really consider it a put down if you happen to express a greater knowledge of a topic than they have?

No. Well not all. Not me anyway. Exact opposite. I get very strongly attracted to obviously clever women. That's not necessarily an entirely unworldly thing, there might be a bit of the intellectual showoff in it - I like hanging out with academics and writers and so on, maybe at least partly because if those clever folk seem to like me that makes me feel better about myself.


quote:
Originally posted by Ariston:
I know that if I go out for a beer or something, I may tell myself that it's "to meet someone,"...

Hmmmm.....

I very often "go out for a beer or something". And its very easy to meet people and talk to them, that's why I do it. More fun than staying at home watching TV. But the people tend to be other men, rather than women. The easiest places to meet people - pubs, and well, pubs. And sports events (which I only started attending in middle age) And some kinds of community or political events and so on - tend to be dominated by men. And when there are women they are nearly always either with one of the other blokes or else so much younger than me it fails the xkcd test (which being a bloke I don't really mind of course, but I'm sure they would) Easy to meet someone, but not easy to meet Someone. Same's true of church, which at least has lots of attractive single women in it, but they are mostly thirty or more years younger than me.

quote:
Originally posted by Firenze:

Then come kiss me, sweet and twenty,
Youth’s a stuff will not endure


It's nothing personal: it's an evolutionary thing - at the optimal mating age, provided the potential partner has a pulse, it's attractive. So priketh hem Nature in hir corages. It will pass soon enough.

Ah but the opportunity passes decades before the desire!


"Thanne longen folk to goon on pilgrimages..."

... and to goon on lots of other things as well. Maybe I shoudl stop listening to all these Robert Burns songs...

[ 07. December 2012, 18:28: Message edited by: ken ]

--------------------
Ken

L’amor che move il sole e l’altre stelle.

Posts: 39579 | From: London | Registered: Mar 2002  |  IP: Logged
moonlitdoor
Shipmate
# 11707

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Certainly they're not all married Hazey Jane. I have always liked intelligent talkative funny women but none of them has wanted to marry me, and I'm sure there are plenty more in my situation. At least I hope I'm sure.

What Ariston said made me think of how it seems that arranged marriage societies manage to find partners for a higher proportion than find your own systems. I am not sure why. But people I have met from that background have taken it for granted that they will be able to marry if they want to, and found the idea of involuntary singleness quite strange.

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We've evolved to being strange monkeys, but in the next life he'll help us be something more worthwhile - Gwai

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Penny S
Shipmate
# 14768

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Hazey Jane, one of the two men I have converted to "brother" told me that he considered the brain to be a major erogenous zone (as well as the usual). He can't be the only one. It wasn't that which did it - I suspect the menopause and associated loss of pheromones. (And other things nothing to do with me.)
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Pomona
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# 17175

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quote:
Originally posted by Ariston:
quote:
Originally posted by Hazey*Jane:
Now about these "men who genuinely find smart, graciously opinionated women very attractive indeed" - where can I find them? [Big Grin] Or are they all married off by now? [Roll Eyes]

And I keep wondering that about the women who meet that description—well, sometimes minus the "gracious" bit. I realize that part of my problems may just be because I find a bit of genuine, honest-to-God Bitch to be oh-so-attractive.

I sometimes wonder if all the right people are hiding from one another, writing novels, making art, going to concerts, taking long bike rides, working late at the office, and otherwise making a worthwhile life, then going home and sighing because another night has arrived without anyone to share it with. I know that if I go out for a beer or something, I may tell myself that it's "to meet someone," but really, I'll pay more attention to what I'm drinking and to the general vibe than anything else. Plus, everyone seems to be in a couple—and do you really want to approach the large groups of people who aren't? Naaaaa.

I doubt I'm the only person of any gender who does this.

Haha - this sounds very familiar. Part of the problem is that I'm very comfortable with my own company but I feel like someone out with friends looks more attractive somehow.

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Consider the work of God: Who is able to straighten what he has bent? [Ecclesiastes 7:13]

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comet

Snowball in Hell
# 10353

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quote:
Originally posted by Ariston:
I realize that part of my problems may just be because I find a bit of genuine, honest-to-God Bitch to be oh-so-attractive.

heeeeey baby! [Biased]
quote:

I sometimes wonder if all the right people are hiding from one another, writing novels, making art, going to concerts, taking long bike rides, working late at the office, and otherwise making a worthwhile life, then going home and sighing because another night has arrived without anyone to share it with.
[...]
I doubt I'm the only person of any gender who does this.

definitely not the only one.

And I think this is really true. The attention I get tends to be from people who are very unsuited to me. They are the people who don't have other pursuits or interests to occupy them, and who are quite comfortable playing the flirt game because that's what they do. They turn on the charm because I'm cute and gregarious as a motherfucker, but when it comes to conversation, i can intellectually wipe the floor with them. This leads to them running for the hills, or feeling more challenged. (*gruntgrunt* must put smart chick in her place! Where me club?!?*grunt*)

The men I meet who I think are a good fit though- so far anyway, they seem universally interested in chasing women half their age and/or IQ. I've had friends tell me this is because they don't want to be with smarter/stronger women, they want to be the "smart" one. It can be frustrating. I'm never going to play nice or ignorant for a man, though. I'd rather be single.

--------------------
Evil Dragon Lady, Breaker of Men's Constitutions

"It's hard to be religious when certain people are never incinerated by bolts of lightning.” -Calvin

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Pomona
Shipmate
# 17175

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SoF singles' board? [Biased]

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Consider the work of God: Who is able to straighten what he has bent? [Ecclesiastes 7:13]

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Surfing Madness
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# 11087

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I'm still trying to work out if last night someone from church, was indicating that I can't be a grown up because I'm single, or was trying to pair me up with someone! If I work it out i might let you know!

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I now blog about all my crafting! http://inspiredbybroadway.blogspot.co.uk

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Pomona
Shipmate
# 17175

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Last night I dreamt about the guy I had a couple of dates with - in real life he did the 'let's be friends' thing and we really weren't a match anyway, but in the dream we were and ended up together. Dream was nice while it happened but woke up feeling strangely upset - lately I've been feeling like celibacy, even if only short-term, is for me but then when waking up I felt like I wanted what I dreamt about so much. Subconscious, you are unhelpful.

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Consider the work of God: Who is able to straighten what he has bent? [Ecclesiastes 7:13]

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Kelly Alves

Bunny with an axe
# 2522

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Subconcious is honest. [Big Grin]

I can hear you, Jade-- personally I am in a place where I know I am way too much situational mess for anyone to handle, and I certainly wouldn't ask anyone to cope with it, but my libido keeps kicking at the cellar door where I've locked it. I guess I just have to just keep feeding it cookies and promise it wonderful things will happen when the time is right. Like it's a damn 14 year old virgin. [Roll Eyes]

I am kind of in a place where I am counting some blessings, though--- I went through this period, a few months- year or so back when I was pretty much afraid of men-- well, more so the kind of codependent, reduced version of myself that I became when dealing with men.

The other day poking around on Facebook I looked over some of the banter on my page, and I realized-- I have collected, over the years, a nice little core group of male friends who really and truly seem to accept me the way I am. (note to female friends-- you are equally cherished! It just pertains directly to the dating thing.)

Still a mess, still not going to inflict that on anyone, but I think right now I want to just rest on those wonderful examples of male awesomeness, rest on the solidness of their affection for me, convince myself of that, and maybe somewhere down the line I will be ready to use that foundation of support to bolster me when I look for "something more."

So guys, for what it's worth, you might not like hearing "just friends" from a woman, but you never know when that phrase represents climbing Mount Everest to her.

And vice versa, I'm sure.

[ 08. December 2012, 22:18: Message edited by: Kelly Alves ]

--------------------
I cannot expect people to believe “
Jesus loves me, this I know” of they don’t believe “Kelly loves me, this I know.”
Kelly Alves, somewhere around 2003.

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rufiki

Ship's 'shroom
# 11165

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quote:
Originally posted by ken:
And some kinds of community or political events and so on - tend to be dominated by men. And when there are women they are nearly always either with one of the other blokes or else so much younger than me it fails the xkcd test (which being a bloke I don't really mind of course, but I'm sure they would) Easy to meet someone, but not easy to meet Someone. Same's true of church, which at least has lots of attractive single women in it, but they are mostly thirty or more years younger than me.

I know someone who met her second husband (in her 40's) at Salsa class. I understand all kinds of dance groups have a dearth of men. Of course you'd need to have some enthusiasm for the actual dancing too...

Rufiki (who took up an exciting male-dominated hobby last year looking for community and found a little more)

[ 09. December 2012, 08:08: Message edited by: rufiki ]

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Pomona
Shipmate
# 17175

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Last night's dream reminded me that it's not hugs with men I miss, it's hugs with A Man in particular. We were friends when I was at uni in Chichester but obviously Northampton is a while away from there! I fell for him pretty quickly but he had just come out of a long-term relationship which ended badly so I didn't make a move because he clearly needed some time to be single. He's still single (this is about two years ago now). I've been stuck at home all day thanks to a horrid cold so have unfortunately had time to think about it [Roll Eyes]

--------------------
Consider the work of God: Who is able to straighten what he has bent? [Ecclesiastes 7:13]

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Surfing Madness
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# 11087

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Jade, is there any possibility that something may happen despite the distance, or is that door definitely closed?

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I now blog about all my crafting! http://inspiredbybroadway.blogspot.co.uk

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Pomona
Shipmate
# 17175

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Oh distance is the only thing really in the way, apart from him being busy (he works with asylum seekers and also studies for his postgraduate qualification in counselling part time). There's certainly nothing to say that it wouldn't happen - I only never made a move because of his circumstances and not because he wasn't interested. But my natural caution along with not wanting to burden him with a relationship with me and not wanting to ruin a friendship is stopping me from saying anything - and I have no idea how to say anything in the first place.

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Consider the work of God: Who is able to straighten what he has bent? [Ecclesiastes 7:13]

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Mad Cat
Shipmate
# 9104

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Can you arrange a visit, you to him or he to you?

So, I was at my friend's party last night, and this guy was there who I'd met at a dinner party and then had texted and he never got back to me. I'd wondered if he ever got the text, and so was interested to see him again to see if the tiny spark I thought might be there was in evidence again.

Well, not a flicker. No recognition, and he talked to the elderly neighbours all evening. I mentioned this to S, my other buddy who was there at the dinner. "I think he liked the other girl..." says S. So now I totally doubt myself.

I was disappointed for about 3 minutes at the party. Then the guy laughed. He has a really annoying laugh. I don't think it would work out being with someone like that. Can you imagine after ten years or so? I'd end up turning to him and saying: "If you ever laugh again I will surely kill you."

I kid on that I've got some amazingly effective boy-repellant, but really, it's the depression and the medication that screw things up for me. I can't imagine inflicting myself on anyone, and when there is a spark I can't believe it's real.

--------------------
Weird and sweary.

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ken
Ship's Roundhead
# 2460

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rufiki, even if I thought dancing was more fun than watching paint dry, I'm fat, arthritic, asthmatic, clumsy, and I smoke. So no.

jade, tell him what you told us.

--------------------
Ken

L’amor che move il sole e l’altre stelle.

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Zoey

Broken idealist
# 11152

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quote:
Originally posted by Mad Cat:
I kid on that I've got some amazingly effective boy-repellant, but really, it's the depression and the medication that screw things up for me. I can't imagine inflicting myself on anyone, and when there is a spark I can't believe it's real.

This is a great shame. I'm not a boy, but from your Ship posts I've always gained the impression that you are a wonderful, sensitive, talented, kind person, who also has difficulties with depression. If only you could see yourself that way.

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Pay no mind, I'm doing fine, I'm breathing on my own.

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Pomona
Shipmate
# 17175

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quote:
Originally posted by ken:
rufiki, even if I thought dancing was more fun than watching paint dry, I'm fat, arthritic, asthmatic, clumsy, and I smoke. So no.

jade, tell him what you told us.

I find contacting him quite difficult - have been trying to arrange a catch-up for a while but he is so busy with his job (which in fairness has quite unsociable hours) that I just rarely get a response. I realise boys aren't the best at replying to things but....

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Consider the work of God: Who is able to straighten what he has bent? [Ecclesiastes 7:13]

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Pomona
Shipmate
# 17175

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quote:
Originally posted by Mad Cat:
Can you arrange a visit, you to him or he to you?

So, I was at my friend's party last night, and this guy was there who I'd met at a dinner party and then had texted and he never got back to me. I'd wondered if he ever got the text, and so was interested to see him again to see if the tiny spark I thought might be there was in evidence again.

Well, not a flicker. No recognition, and he talked to the elderly neighbours all evening. I mentioned this to S, my other buddy who was there at the dinner. "I think he liked the other girl..." says S. So now I totally doubt myself.

I was disappointed for about 3 minutes at the party. Then the guy laughed. He has a really annoying laugh. I don't think it would work out being with someone like that. Can you imagine after ten years or so? I'd end up turning to him and saying: "If you ever laugh again I will surely kill you."

I kid on that I've got some amazingly effective boy-repellant, but really, it's the depression and the medication that screw things up for me. I can't imagine inflicting myself on anyone, and when there is a spark I can't believe it's real.

Oh I have totally been there before, regarding the party situation! I am hopeless at reading signals of interest or anything like that - if I'm not somewhere on the autistic spectrum I do a great impersonation of someone who is. And yeah, depression and medication don't help me either, especially not when they make me gain so much weight [Eek!]

It's such a terrible feeling, not understand what you're doing wrong or what is it about you that leaves you single when all your other friends are getting paired up!

--------------------
Consider the work of God: Who is able to straighten what he has bent? [Ecclesiastes 7:13]

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Mad Cat
Shipmate
# 9104

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Zoey, thank you. That means a lot.

I talk to a lovely spiritual adviser who asks me to try to see myslef as God sees me. That's what I need to work on!

--------------------
Weird and sweary.

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moonlitdoor
Shipmate
# 11707

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I've always thought Mad Cat sounded great too, though I feel a bit sorry for the guy at the party ( a wonderful, sensitive, talented, kind person, who also has difficulties with laughing ? )

quote:
originally posted by Jade Constable
It's such a terrible feeling, not understand what you're doing wrong or what is it about you that leaves you single when all your other friends are getting paired up!

I remember how annoyed I was reading a few years ago about a guy who had just been convicted for being a serial killer, and according to the article he had children with 5 different mothers. Why I thought, have 5 women chosen to have a family with a serial killer but none has with me ?

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We've evolved to being strange monkeys, but in the next life he'll help us be something more worthwhile - Gwai

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Mad Cat
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# 9104

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Not so much a laugh as a whinny.

--------------------
Weird and sweary.

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Mad Cat
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# 9104

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Umm, as a PS, I don't generally have difficulties with laughing (or whinnying for that matter). It was more the consolation for the guy preferring to talk to the elderly neighbours than to your truly in the new frock with the righteous accessories and everything.

Note to self: recalibrate sarcasm filter for use online.

--------------------
Weird and sweary.

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moonlitdoor
Shipmate
# 11707

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So it would have been Mad Cat and Crazy Horse ? I shouldn't worry about the filter, I was trying for a touch of levity in case agreeing with Zoey sounded too earnest.

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We've evolved to being strange monkeys, but in the next life he'll help us be something more worthwhile - Gwai

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moonlitdoor
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# 11707

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oops sorry to double post but just realised the mistake. It is I who should learn a lesson for the internet to be more explicit in phrasing. I meant that he was the wonderful sensitive kind person who had difficulties with laughter, but I can see how it sounded like I meant you which would make it rather rude. Sorry.

[ 12. December 2012, 07:45: Message edited by: moonlitdoor ]

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We've evolved to being strange monkeys, but in the next life he'll help us be something more worthwhile - Gwai

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Doublethink.
Ship's Foolwise Unperson
# 1984

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If you tend to get into repeated problematic patterns with relationships, I suggest this book is well worth using.

(P.S. Have yo uconsidered non-responding men may be anxious ?)

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ken
Ship's Roundhead
# 2460

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quote:
Originally posted by Doublethink:
If you tend to get into repeated problematic patterns with relationships

Does continual lack count as a repeated pattern?

Almost a philosphical question. Does a blank sheet of paper have a very simple pattern on it?

--------------------
Ken

L’amor che move il sole e l’altre stelle.

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Mad Cat
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# 9104

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quote:
Originally posted by moonlitdoor:
oops sorry to double post but just realised the mistake. It is I who should learn a lesson for the internet to be more explicit in phrasing. I meant that he was the wonderful sensitive kind person who had difficulties with laughter, but I can see how it sounded like I meant you which would make it rather rude. Sorry.

[Biased]

--------------------
Weird and sweary.

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Doublethink.
Ship's Foolwise Unperson
# 1984

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quote:
Originally posted by ken:
quote:
Originally posted by Doublethink:
If you tend to get into repeated problematic patterns with relationships

Does continual lack count as a repeated pattern?

Almost a philosphical question. Does a blank sheet of paper have a very simple pattern on it?

Assuming you have social contact with women in some setting, and wish to find a woman with whom you can pursue an intimate relationship, it would seem likely there is a hiccup in the process by which you either select who to ask out; or move through the progression of stages of closeness in the relationship.

If you are not meeting any women socially, then the first thing you need to do is find some activity you can do regularly in which you will come into social contact with women regularly. This needs to be an activity where the women will be in your most likely age range - within 5 to 10 years of your own age - and likely to be unthreatened by you making casual conversation. (Being the only man in a Legs, Bums n Tums aerobics class will likely be seen as evidence you are gay or creepy.) Ideally, it should be an activity you like, as then you are more likely to have shared interests/value base with people you meet.

IRRC you are a gourmet, so some kind of cooking society / club might be a good place to start.

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All political thinking for years past has been vitiated in the same way. People can foresee the future only when it coincides with their own wishes, and the most grossly obvious facts can be ignored when they are unwelcome. George Orwell

Posts: 19219 | From: Erehwon | Registered: Aug 2005  |  IP: Logged
ken
Ship's Roundhead
# 2460

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quote:
Originally posted by Doublethink:

If you are not meeting any women socially, then the first thing you need to do is find some activity you can do regularly in which you will come into social contact with women regularly.

Er, I go to church. I even preach in church. And I work in an adult eduction college. The two classic places to meet women! There are lots of women. Lots of lovely women. All not very interested in me as far as I can tell.

--------------------
Ken

L’amor che move il sole e l’altre stelle.

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Doublethink.
Ship's Foolwise Unperson
# 1984

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Neither of those are leisure activities - and I wouldn't have thought either of them are good settings in which to meet women, especially not if you are an authority figure in both.

It effects how the women there will see you.

[ 13. December 2012, 20:50: Message edited by: Doublethink ]

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All political thinking for years past has been vitiated in the same way. People can foresee the future only when it coincides with their own wishes, and the most grossly obvious facts can be ignored when they are unwelcome. George Orwell

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Mad Cat
Shipmate
# 9104

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I joined a hillwalking club in Glasgow with a view to meeting nice outdoors-y chaps. The first walk consisted of a group of about ten of us single gals, and precisely no nice outdoors-y chaps. We had a rare old time and decided to set up Date-Trek, a match-making walking club.

Funnily enough, I walked up Ben Vorlich on my own one day, and was chatted up on the summit by a lone walking and perfectly eligible nice outdoors-y man. I was too nervous about being on my own to talk back properly, or I could have been in there. Another bloody chance I let slip by!! [Roll Eyes]

I think I'm going to start going to the rugby.

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Weird and sweary.

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Doublethink.
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# 1984

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Try to get on a mixed rugby team if you do that.

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All political thinking for years past has been vitiated in the same way. People can foresee the future only when it coincides with their own wishes, and the most grossly obvious facts can be ignored when they are unwelcome. George Orwell

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Hazey*Jane

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# 8754

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quote:
Originally posted by rufiki:
quote:
Originally posted by ken:
And some kinds of community or political events and so on - tend to be dominated by men. And when there are women they are nearly always either with one of the other blokes or else so much younger than me it fails the xkcd test (which being a bloke I don't really mind of course, but I'm sure they would) Easy to meet someone, but not easy to meet Someone. Same's true of church, which at least has lots of attractive single women in it, but they are mostly thirty or more years younger than me.

I know someone who met her second husband (in her 40's) at Salsa class. I understand all kinds of dance groups have a dearth of men. Of course you'd need to have some enthusiasm for the actual dancing too...

Speaking of which, just had a nice date with someone from my dance class. Guys, if you have any sense of rhythm and enjoyment of dance, do get yourself along to a class. It's a lot of fun and there's a very reasonable chance the women will outnumber the men.

I would also issue the additional advice that if you do give it a try, potentially with a view to widening your social circle, then fresh breath, deodorant and dry hands go a long way to helping you with that aim!

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Pomona
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Lovely Hazey*Jane! My problem is that my interests are either very female, not very sociable or if they attract men in a social setting, it's all men older than my parents.

How do people meet love interests NOT through interest/social groups?? My church being liberal Anglo-Catholic is therefore not exactly a hotbed of eligible young men. There are single young men at my uni Christian Union but there are ahem, issues there which means a successful match with one would be highly unlikely.

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Consider the work of God: Who is able to straighten what he has bent? [Ecclesiastes 7:13]

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Doublethink.
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# 1984

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Through work/study - anyone eligible on your course ?

Though the obvious other tactic is to develop some co-ed interests. What are your current major hobbies ?

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All political thinking for years past has been vitiated in the same way. People can foresee the future only when it coincides with their own wishes, and the most grossly obvious facts can be ignored when they are unwelcome. George Orwell

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Pomona
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quote:
Originally posted by Doublethink:
Through work/study - anyone eligible on your course ?

Though the obvious other tactic is to develop some co-ed interests. What are your current major hobbies ?

Main hobbies - politics/current affairs/social justice (from a leftwing/socialist and feminist perspective), history (pretty much all kinds apart from military history), birdwatching, reading (detective novels, early sci-fi, higher-quality fantasy, lots of non-fiction), sci-fi, DC comics, hiking/walking in the countryside, theology and church history, trying to like poetry. I am 23. None of this is particularly attractive to any Christian man under 30 that I know - and the few that I've found, I've been on dates with and it's a no.

My main problem is that the young Christian men I know are usually politically more conservative than me (and more often than not opposed to women's ordination), and go for women with more 'feminine' interests. The men I've had most in common with on dating sites tend to be atheists, which for someone hoping to enter ordained ministry, is not really appropriate. I do think it's important that the person I share my life with shares my faith, that's really non-negotiable.

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Consider the work of God: Who is able to straighten what he has bent? [Ecclesiastes 7:13]

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comet

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Jade - perhaps you're thinking too big. stop thinking "share my life with" for now and just starting thinking "share dinner with".

You're young and people's beliefs and philosophies change over time. if your drop-dead rule is Christianity, you're going to get the ones you've been finding. Because there's a lot of men out there (especially in early 20s) who's faith doesn't make their list. not yet. it's background. as they age it will shift around in their priorities.

But geez I look at that list and think, I know a ton of guys (including my son! but he's too young for you...) who match you interest for interest. My son calls himself an atheist right now also. a year ago, he was toying with buddhism. in another year, it will be something else. and eventually, he'll settle for what he really believes.

But damn, girl, get your butt to a comic shop! There are some wonderful, amazing, nerdy guys just hoping to meet you. sort out the religion piece if and when "forever" comes onto the table. right now, find someone who you can talk history and politics with and just enjoy their company.

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Evil Dragon Lady, Breaker of Men's Constitutions

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Pomona
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# 17175

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But that's sort of my point - I'm not sure matching interests is the most important thing. I'm interested in people with similar viewpoints on life as me - including Christianity - not necessarily similar interests. Sharing an interest in comics is a bit irrelevant if we don't share a love of the Creator of the universe. There actually are young Christian men I know that I do share interests with - the problem is their theological conservatism which means they're not interested in a heathen liberal like me, or if not that then they want a girlfriend who doesn't share their interests and is 'more feminine'. Being seen as 'one of the guys' is part of the problem for me.

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Consider the work of God: Who is able to straighten what he has bent? [Ecclesiastes 7:13]

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Doublethink.
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# 1984

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How are you defining Christian for this purpose ?

FWIW I know for a fact that our regular group of magic players at the games shop has at least one evangelical Christian (there may be more, but it doesn't tend to come up in conversation).

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All political thinking for years past has been vitiated in the same way. People can foresee the future only when it coincides with their own wishes, and the most grossly obvious facts can be ignored when they are unwelcome. George Orwell

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Pomona
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# 17175

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Christian as far as I'm concerned is being in agreement with the Nicene Creed. Filioque phrase optional [Biased] Not attending church for whatever reason is fine, been there myself. But I would want an active Christian faith to be there (even if it's actively despairing) even if not attending church.

This probably sounds harsh but it's not indicative of my friendships - I am friends with plenty of non-Christians, but I do put different standards on my romantic relationships.

I will try the local comic store - I actually get most of my comics via the library because of cost but will see if there's any kind of comics club going. Unfortunately any romantic experience with men with similar interests to me has all gone the same way - initial interest, then ditched for the first Good Submissive Christian Girl available. Marxist-Feminist Anglo-Catholics in Dr Martens don't get a look in, even if the young men in question are sympathetic to those values themselves. They're taught to look for the 'right' girls who are 'right' according the the culture of the church, not what's right for them.

I don't blame men, I blame the insidious gender divisions in evangelicalism, and evangelical megachurches for poaching all the young men.

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Consider the work of God: Who is able to straighten what he has bent? [Ecclesiastes 7:13]

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Ariel
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# 58

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quote:
Originally posted by Jade Constable:
But that's sort of my point - I'm not sure matching interests is the most important thing. I'm interested in people with similar viewpoints on life as me - including Christianity - not necessarily similar interests.

Yes. As I discovered, just because both of you find (for example) the same TV programme funny it doesn't mean you have the same sense of humour. It's entirely possible for two people to like the same thing for completely different reasons - sometimes those reasons might not even be compatible.

Affinity is an odd thing. You can sometimes fall for someone who pretty definitely doesn't meet whatever criteria you outlined on paper or your picture of The Ideal Man. It's good to have some idea of your priorities and what's important to you, but keeping the list to a minimum and being open-minded is best. And not expecting too much. Basically if he makes you laugh and he's kind and fun to be with, that can go a long way.

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Roseofsharon
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# 9657

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quote:
Originally posted by Jade Constable:
Marxist-Feminist Anglo-Catholics in Dr Martens don't get a look in, even if the young men in question are sympathetic to those values themselves. They're taught to look for the 'right' girls who are 'right' according the the culture of the church,

Maybe you should look for an unchurched man, and make sure he gets the right teaching from the start.
Worked for me!

At twenty-three I shared some of your shopping-list of husband-worthy qualities, and was equally desperate.

At twenty-five I took myself off to an evening of folk music (but feel free to substitute any other non-gender-specific activity) where my obvious enthusiasm for the music attracted the attention of a young man. Initially my response was a little chilly, but eventually I threw caution to the wind and in an uncharacteristic fit of rebellion accepted, over time, a coffee, a lift, a date and a proposal. During that time he accepted from me an invitation to church, and an invitation from God to follow Christ.
It will be our Ruby Wedding next year.

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Talk about books -any books- on our rejuvenatedforum http://www.bookgrouponline.com/index.php?

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Heavenly Anarchist
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# 13313

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quote:
Originally posted by Jade Constable:
Unfortunately any romantic experience with men with similar interests to me has all gone the same way - initial interest, then ditched for the first Good Submissive Christian Girl available. Marxist-Feminist Anglo-Catholics in Dr Martens don't get a look in, even if the young men in question are sympathetic to those values themselves. They're taught to look for the 'right' girls who are 'right' according the the culture of the church, not what's right for them.

Don't discount it entirely, this socialist- feminist evo attracted her mate entirely because she was wearing docs, a circa 1972 Laura Ashley dress, patterned tights and a leather biker jacket whilst sitting amongst a group of middle class con-evos in smart jeans and fleeces. Not everyone likes conformity.

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Sioni Sais
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# 5713

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I suppose this might be more encouragement, although it concerns a woman in her forties. She had been widowed some years before and it was years before she wanted the company of another man, so when she did she stated her preferences and 'practising Christian' was right at the top of the list. She met three or four thoroughly nice, presentable men fitting her preferences but they were, to be honest, pretty boring.

Eventually she met, through mutual friends a divorced man, not a Christian, and not ticking a few other boxes either. While they are different they are both strong characters so there was instant mutual respect, that turned to love, he became a Christian, they married and he is now as involved as anyone with the church and has brought a wealth of talent to it.

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(Paul Sinha, BBC)

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Jane R
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Some more encouragement for Jade, I hope.

When I was 21 I made a list of 'Desirable Qualities in a Husband'. Number 1 was 'must be taller than me'. Yes, I was that shallow.

A couple of years later I met someone who is about an inch shorter than me. I realised he was The One when we stood back to back to see who was taller... and I was deliberately slouching, because I didn't want to be taller than him. After that I decided to forget about The List, because it was all wrong anyway. The most important thing on it should have been 'must share at least some of my interests'; but until I met him I'd never encountered a man who liked reading as much as I do.

We've been married for 23 years.

And I realise that wanting your Other Half to share your faith is more important than wanting someone who will help you conform to social expectations of how a couple should look, but I do know several couples who don't share the same faith and they seem to manage. Don't automatically dismiss men just because they aren't (yet) Christians.

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Belle Ringer
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# 13379

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I'm trying to do a major personality change. I was reared to be goal oriented, so view activities in terms of their goals and is that a goal I value more that other available goals.

For example I ignore cancer fund raising activities because (a) my family don't get cancer, and the diseases we do get need my research dollars, (b) I don't believe chemo is a reasonable way to fight cancer and I don't want to be throwing money a direction I disagree with, and (c) some specific cancer fund raisers billed as for research actually put only about 20% of funds raised into research, the rest is "programs" meaning promoting their fund raising events and paying high salaries.

But friends say they go to fund raising parties for the fun, they don't care where the entry fee money is donated. By not caring, they are getting out more than I am.

I used to go to classes and wondered why I never met anyone when the common advice is to go to class to meet people. Now think I made two mistakes. One was taking lecture classes, of course I didn't meet anyone when you just sit and stare at the front; you meet fellow students in activity classes like pottery or automobile repair.

The other mistake, I focused on the learning instead of on the people around me. I wouldn't notice if someone did wink at me or whatever it is people do to say "hi," I was goal oriented in walking in -- find a good seat, prepare my notebook for note taking -- and goal oriented in walking out -- get home and to bed so I'm not overtired for work tomorrow.

I need to be less interested in goals and more interested in the people. Like in choirs I've rarely made friends because I'm focused on the music and the director while the "bad" choir members are "disrupting" the rehearsal by "not paying attention" because they are exchanging whispers and giggles and walking out not knowing the music but making friends. Maybe their way is better?

MAJOR personality change, but life is about growing and changing! I can do this!

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Belle Ringer
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One problem I wonder how others of you deal with. (Who was it, responding to exclamations about how good she looked at 50, said "women have been lying abut their age for so long we don't know what 50 looks like"?)

Friends who find out my age go into shock, saying I look at least 20 years younger. So for the past year I've stopped dying my hair, to look more like my contemporaries and maybe attract some into conversation or a date.

But just last week -- well, there's a widower at church I've been gently trying to show a tad bit of interest in, but he's been wholly unresponsive. Recently we were on a committee together and in email chatter mentioned our ages, born the same year! He expressed deep surprise, saying he thought I was 20 years younger than he. Ever since, he's be much warmer to me, returns greeting with a happy grin instead of an abstract disinterest. That confirmed to me what I was beginning to suspect, looking too young is interfering with meeting people my age.

A healthy senior probably isn't interested in someone in their 40s. If you look 45, how do you convey that you are 65 or 70, so someone who sees you from across the room knows to come chat, or someone I approach to chat with knows I'm their age not their child's age?

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ken
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quote:
Originally posted by Jade Constable:
... politics/current affairs/social justice (from a leftwing/socialist and feminist perspective), history (pretty much all kinds apart from military history), birdwatching, reading (detective novels, early sci-fi, higher-quality fantasy, lots of non-fiction), sci-fi, DC comics, hiking/walking in the countryside, theology and church history, trying to like poetry.

[Disappointed] "DC comics" [Disappointed] Everyone knows Marvel comics are the best and DC pathetic - at least they were until the British Invasion of the early 80s and the Vertigo spinoffs - but that isn't really mainstream DC (and is also before you were born... )

And military history is fascinating and poetry is arguably the greatest of all artforms.

But apart from that what's not to like?

Semi-seriously, you seem to have been meeting an odd lot of Christians. If none of them can stand all that sort of stuff then there must be some kind of pre-selection going on. Because lots of Christians would have no problem with those things.

quote:

Marxist-Feminist Anglo-Catholics in Dr Martens

In some of her moods that might describe my daughter. Who is I think about the same age as you. And sometimes reads and posts on this website so I dare not say more (other than that she really doesn't go for walking in the countryside, or birdwatching)

quote:
Originally posted by Jade Constable:
I don't blame men, I blame the insidious gender divisions in evangelicalism, and evangelical megachurches for poaching all the young men.

Hmmmm. Not sure about this at all. I don.t think the majority of evangelicals go to megachurches. In fact I'm pretty sure they don't unless there are a lot fewer evangelicals than we thought. There simply aren't enough megachurches - and they aren't that big really. Here in London anyway, things might be different where you are.

Its blatantly true that there are fewer men than women in most ordinary churches, but I don't think that's because the men have gone of a-worshipping somewhwere else. They don't go to church because they don't want to and they never did. And neither did their fathers and grandfathers on the whole.

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Ken

L’amor che move il sole e l’altre stelle.

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Pomona
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The Christians my own age like very mainstream films (rom-coms for girls, action for guys), reality tv, clubbing and the majority don't read for pleasure.

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Consider the work of God: Who is able to straighten what he has bent? [Ecclesiastes 7:13]

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Heavenly Anarchist
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Interesting points about age Belle Ringer, I guess it does influence how people interact with you. I hope the change in approach is fruitful.
Jade, you sound an awful lot like me, we have similar interests except the DC comics [Smile]
I agree about some larger evo churches though, St H in London had an evening congregation of about 400 when I went there and I'm pretty sure there were fairly equal numbers of men and women, possibly even more men, presumably owing to recruitment in the City services on weekdays. I'm not sure that this is representative of all mega churches though. My own large chari church has slightly more women but the numbers are roughly equal in younger singles.
Given your interests, is there not a history society or similar where you might meet like-minded people? Or something like a local Amnesty group? Do you go to Greenbelt in the summer as there will be lots of like-minded people there.

[ 18. December 2012, 19:34: Message edited by: Heavenly Anarchist ]

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