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» Ship of Fools   » Ship's business   » The Styx   » Have the ship boards had their day? (Page 1)

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Source: (consider it) Thread: Have the ship boards had their day?
Schroedinger's cat

Ship's cool cat
# 64

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I know this is a terrible and outragous thing to say, but that is why I am saying it. Is it time to close the boards?

Let me just make a couple of important points:

1. There is nothing less unrestful that keepign something going just because we like it and it has always been there.

2. I would like the boards to continue because I like them and they have been there.

What I am trying to do is get some better reason for the boards to continue than the fact that we like them. I have noticed, over the last year or so, that new shipmates seem to have somewhat dried up, and that discussions are much less buzzing than they used to be. Far too much agreement/avoidance.

And this goes with the fact that discussion boards are not the thing in social media any more. This is not the way that people discuss stuff. Facebook groups are more likely to be the places.

So maybe the boards should be reimagined as Yammer groups or suchlike? It is not that I am not interested in the issues raised, just that I am not sure the boards as they are serve the purpose any longer.

The truth is, I don't want the boards to close. I want htings to carry on as they are. But I find I am coming here to discuss things less and less. This may just be me, but the activity level indicates that many people take their discussions elsewhere. It would seem appropriate if we also took our discussions elsewhere, where others are discussing.

I know this is unthinkable. I have been a member of these boards for 17 years or so. This is NOT SOMETHING I am suggesting lightly. It would break my heart to lose this place. But that is not a good enough reason for maintaining it (especially given the shipmate-power required to do so).

I am aware that I am off to Greenbelt tomorrow, so please forgive me if I don't respond to any thoughts here quickly. In truth, I needed to get this off my chest before I went away.

--------------------
Blog
Music for your enjoyment
Lord may all my hard times be healing times
take out this broken heart and renew my mind.

Posts: 18537 | From: At the bottom of a deep dark well. | Registered: May 2001  |  IP: Logged
Uncle Pete

Loyaute me lie
# 10422

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Well, here is one who agrees. The boards have been part of my life for 12 years, and I have made many good friends here. Most I see on Facebook, including some forcibly removed.

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Even more so than I was before

Posts: 20398 | From: No longer where I was | Registered: Sep 2005  |  IP: Logged
agingjb
Shipmate
# 16555

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While many responses are immediately crushed by the unanswerable ITTWACW, then those of us on the fringes, but likely to take things too seriously, may begin to doubt.

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Refraction Villanelles

Posts: 453 | From: Southern England | Registered: Jul 2011  |  IP: Logged
no prophet's flag is set so...

Proceed to see sea
# 15560

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Everything in its season. I was very active in several newsgroups when usenet and text was the way of interacting (1980s into the 90s). They dried up with the advent of a visual internet, and the dropping of newsgroups by most ISPs.

From there to stopping with commercial operating systems and moving to Linux, I was a moderator (host) on a Linux forum which had a very good community feel, and much discussion of non-computer issues. When it ceased development I was an admin on the forum. It had dwindled. I joined this ship forum after it quit. (I've also seen two churches close, found another.)

Posts: 10900 | From: Treaty 6 territory in the nonexistant Province of Buffalo, Canada ↄ⃝' | Registered: Mar 2010  |  IP: Logged
Alan Cresswell

Mad Scientist 先生
# 31

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The first question I would ask, is whether there is a need for serious discussion of things of faith and the world from a faith perspective?

I would say that that need is possibly even more important than it was 20 years ago. In a world of tweets and soundbites, of celebrity preachers and authors producing theology shallower than a duck pond at the end of a drought, a world where the idea of facts and truth and expertise are replaced by alt-news and Trump and Brexit ... serious, robust, intelligent discussion of issues is more important than ever before.

Some people may be lucky enough to have access to such discussion space in their own churches, or local debating societies or wherever. I expect for the majority of people they will only ever get that online.

So, the question is where online can you have that sort of debate? Twitter isn't a place for more than short notes. You can put your ideas into a blog, but usually blogs don't accomodate much scope for discussion. Facebook is a great place for sharing stuff, but awful for discussion¹. Which leaves places running software designed for running discussions, with the infrastructure (ie: people) to support that. So, I think we still need something like the Ships discussion boards. The question is one of how to maintain the infrastructure, to keep people here and interested, and to get new people with new insights to bring to the discussion? Which brings us to the question of how to achieve that?

 

¹ Just because it will come up. Why I don't think Facebook is ideal
  1. The format of Facebook doesn't lend itself to responsive discussion - the options for quoting others, for example, are clunky at best. There is a strange mid-ground between nested responses (a reply being placed under the post you're replying too) and single strand discussion (as we have here with all posts in order of posting) - it's a strange mid ground because there is only one level of nesting, making replies to replies not work right. And, even though I know it, my posts always get broken because it won't let me just use the return key to insert breaks between paragraphs and it interprets that as me wanting to post what I'm part way through writing (yes, I need to ctrl-return, I know, it just irritates me).
  2. Facebook mostly uses real names, with links through to profiles with personal information. Many people simply don't want that when they're posting here - they may not want to be seen as "heretics" by their church, for example. Personally, it's not an issue (I've never hidden my real life identity), but it will be for some people. I suppose you can set up a second FB profile without the personal information ... but, that seems very clunky.
  3. Facebook has a "like" button.
On the otherhand, Facebook is a great place for community building (for those willing to share their personal information). A great place to share photos from meets, to share prayer news and requests, to wish people a happy birthday or anniversary, etc. It has strengths, serious discussion isn't one of them.

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Don't Brexit if you haven't a scooby how to fix it.

Posts: 32001 | From: East Kilbride (Scotland) or 福島 | Registered: May 2001  |  IP: Logged
lilBuddha
Shipmate
# 14333

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As Alan mentioned Facebook and Twitter, they fucking suck bloody, pustulent* balls for real discussions.
They have, however, managed to dominate the way people communicate.
Reddit is for trolls.
Face to face discussion is fun, but less considered and less elegant.
I think places like SOF are more vital rather than less. As far as not gaining as many new members, I think it a combination of fewer religious people, the above mentioned trinity of evil and the rather, erm, quaint style of the website.


*Intentional neologism.

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So goodnight moon, I want the sun
If it's not here soon, I might be done
No it won't be too soon 'til I say goodnight moon

- A. N. Parsley, D. Mcvinni

Posts: 16705 | From: the round earth's imagined corners | Registered: Dec 2008  |  IP: Logged
Schroedinger's cat

Ship's cool cat
# 64

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Just to be clear, I think there is a place for quality, inteligent theological discussion. That is not the issue. Whether the structure of the boards is right is part of this.

And yes, Facebook and twitter are not right, which is why I mentioend Yammer as a possible option, but I am not saying "we should move to x" - that would need further exploration.

It is trying to start a discussion, not suggest a clear solution. It is about asking if there is another style and format for the important discussions that we have, that is also more up to date in style and format (that is not just the software, it is the environment).

--------------------
Blog
Music for your enjoyment
Lord may all my hard times be healing times
take out this broken heart and renew my mind.

Posts: 18537 | From: At the bottom of a deep dark well. | Registered: May 2001  |  IP: Logged
RooK

1 of 6
# 1852

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The Marshall McLuhan philosophy about "the medium is the message" still rings true for me. While our apparent heyday was when every conceivable social interaction was foisted awkwardly onto discussion boards, I think our steady-state future and real purpose is the ongoing desire for series text-format discussion. It is a unique medium for exploring ideas with the capability for as-available engagement. Similarly, the ability to have moderated discussion with user-generated topics is a quality standard not generally possible for simple comment-threads on other content.

No, it's not exciting. Worse, the potential revenue stream is non-existent, which makes support hard to justify. But I find it valuable enough to volunteer to keep afloat. And as long as there are others who wish to avail themselves to it, I'll keep bailing.

Posts: 15108 | From: Portland, Oregon, USA, Earth | Registered: Nov 2001  |  IP: Logged
lilBuddha
Shipmate
# 14333

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quote:
Originally posted by Schroedinger's cat:
that is also more up to date in style and format (that is not just the software, it is the environment).

Unfortunately, the up to date style of interaction isn't reasoned discussion. Again, all the more reason to keep that here.

--------------------
So goodnight moon, I want the sun
If it's not here soon, I might be done
No it won't be too soon 'til I say goodnight moon

- A. N. Parsley, D. Mcvinni

Posts: 16705 | From: the round earth's imagined corners | Registered: Dec 2008  |  IP: Logged
Wesley J

Silly Shipmate
# 6075

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quote:
Originally posted by lilBuddha:
[...] I think places like SOF are more vital rather than less. [...]

Agreed.

When SoF offspring Church of Fools moved over to FB, they lost me. FB et al are purely commercial. SoF isn't. You have reasonable privacy here, divulge as much as you want, or not, are not pestered by spam mails offering, for shedloads of cash, to enlarge and broaden just about anything you might desire, with the notable exception of the mind. Which is what SoF caters for.

Which reminds me, I need to donate again to the Floating Fund.

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Be it as it may: Wesley J will stay. --- Euthanasia, that sounds good. An alpine neutral neighbourhood. Then back to Britain, all dressed in wood. Things were gonna get worse. (John Cooper Clarke)

Posts: 7232 | From: The Isles of Silly | Registered: May 2004  |  IP: Logged
Nicolemr
Shipmate
# 28

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I think it's fairly obvious that the boards are dwindling, but I think there's still a lot of life left in them, and there's no need to be talking about euthanizing them yet. While there's life there's hope, and who know's things may pick up at some turning in the zeitgeist of the net.

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On pilgrimage in the endless realms of Cyberia, currently traveling by ship. Now with live journal!

Posts: 11629 | From: New York City "The City Carries On" | Registered: May 2001  |  IP: Logged
leo
Shipmate
# 1458

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I'd have an extra 45 minutes per day - but I'd lose contact with people and ideas I'd not normally encounter.

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My Jewish-positive lectionary blog is at http://recognisingjewishrootsinthelectionary.wordpress.com/
My reviews at http://layreadersbookreviews.wordpress.com

Posts: 23033 | From: Bristol | Registered: Oct 2001  |  IP: Logged
Golden Key
Shipmate
# 1468

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I'm not sure we're dwindling, per se. The Ship has lots of ups and downs--long stretches of intense, tooth-and-claw discussion; running jokes; mourning; making sense of news; sorting out personal theological angst together, etc. Maybe the Ship seems quiet simply because there isn't a lot of yelling going on right now?

If we need a nudge or jump-start, though, maybe an H/A day? Or some kind of project? Find a cousin to Sven the Moose (stuffed critter), and send it around again? (Whether literally, or maybe a pic that we can forward to each other, and paste it into scenic pics for a virtual journey.)

Please, please do not close the boards.

Thanks to Simon, all the H/As, backstage folks, etc., for your wonderful work. This place *matters*.

[Overused]

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Blessed Gator, pray for us!
--"Oh bat bladders, do you have to bring common sense into this?"--Dragon, "Jane & the Dragon"
--"I'm not giving up--and neither should you." --SNL

Posts: 17715 | From: Chilling out in an undisclosed, sincere pumpkin patch. | Registered: Oct 2001  |  IP: Logged
MrsBeaky
Shipmate
# 17663

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Oh my word!
I started reading and my heart lurched....
As a relative newcomer I would be really,really sad if the boards closed. Perhaps it is because this is still new and fresh for me or perhaps it is because this forum really fits well with the point I have reached in my faith journey....the Ship has become such a source of fruitful reflection for me and I would hazard a guess that I am not alone.
We may not often post but reading what the rest of you have to say is really important to the more reticent members of the Ship's company.

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"It is better to be kind than right."

http://davidandlizacooke.wordpress.com

Posts: 658 | From: UK/ Kenya | Registered: Apr 2013  |  IP: Logged
Doone
Shipmate
# 18470

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quote:
Originally posted by MrsBeaky:
Oh my word!
I started reading and my heart lurched....
As a relative newcomer I would be really,really sad if the boards closed. Perhaps it is because this is still new and fresh for me or perhaps it is because this forum really fits well with the point I have reached in my faith journey....the Ship has become such a source of fruitful reflection for me and I would hazard a guess that I am not alone.
We may not often post but reading what the rest of you have to say is really important to the more reticent members of the Ship's company.

Oh, I very much agree! I have learnt and honed/developed my ideas so much.
Posts: 2196 | From: UK | Registered: Sep 2015  |  IP: Logged
BabyWombat
Shipmate
# 18552

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As a relative newcomer I would miss the boards terribly. I learn so much from those in other church and national settings, and from those more educated and wise (and oft times more lightsome) than I am. Locally I have colleagues, but they are not always helpful, nor, in a small diocese, can discussion always stay confidential. The Boards offer the confidentiality that allows for questions or ideas to be phrased more honestly.

I must admit sometimes the discussion gets a bit arcane, and the snarkiness that often appears one to the other is off putting. At times like that I fast from checking the boards a bit, to let the energy and fumes clear. One is never sure of the tone of voice that others use : is it sarcastic? Then why? Is it truly nasty? Again, then why? As a newcomer, I find that concerning. It seems at times as if a group of children had grown tired of playing a game and have decided to throw the bits about instead. [Sorry -- that in itself is snarky! -- mea culpa!] Maybe some are tired of the game: and some may simply need a break or a sabbatical from reading or posting.

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Let us, with a gladsome mind…..

Posts: 89 | From: US | Registered: Feb 2016  |  IP: Logged
Schroedinger's cat

Ship's cool cat
# 64

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For clarification, I am absolutely for the discussions and content on these boards. I am also absolutely for the fact that there are discussions and explorations that are unique.

The question is about what the most appropriate way of continuing these important conversations is, in ways that are possibly more accessible.

I absolutely and totally support the work that the H&As do. If anything, I am only asking if this effort could have a greater impact. If the work being done is properly focussed.

I don't want to be the bad guy. I love these boards. But because I love them, because I think that the quality of the debates and discussions can be so good, I want to ask if we - all of us - are doing the best.

I see it like being in a church that is losing numbers. The questions of whether it should close need to be asked - these are horrible questions, and so often, the same points are raised "The vicar and wardens do so much good work", and "But there is nowhere else like this. We need it to continue".

I think it is negligent to not ask them - either publically or privately. And hopefully, the answers find new life, new expression. This comes from asking. To be unrestful means asking, means being prepared to say "this is finished", or "this needs to change". Or "We could do this", and revitalise the place.

Every so often, we ask if we are being unrestful enough. This is the same question. We are sometimes too comfortable, even here, and we need to ask difficult questions. And sometimes, we need to find difficult answers.

So please don't hate me! Please treat this as a serious question and a serious challenge. Because it needs to be said sometimes.

--------------------
Blog
Music for your enjoyment
Lord may all my hard times be healing times
take out this broken heart and renew my mind.

Posts: 18537 | From: At the bottom of a deep dark well. | Registered: May 2001  |  IP: Logged
Chorister

Completely Frocked
# 473

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I believe the boards should continue as long as there are people who are willing to moderate them. That's not me any more, but I'm glad some people are still willing to do so.

I wasn't there right at the beginning, although am part of the second tranche. It gladdens my heart that there are still people on here contributing who have been doing so for more than 15 years, plus newcomers. Yes, some subjects have come around again and again and again. But isn't that true of theology over the centuries?

While the ship is still afloat I shall keep boarding it from time to time, and joining in with whatever is going on. Ahoy there, Shipmates! (Shitmates, if Pyx_e is following....)

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Retired, sitting back and watching others for a change.

Posts: 34563 | From: Cream Tealand | Registered: Jun 2001  |  IP: Logged
Rossweisse

High Church Valkyrie
# 2349

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I'm in agreement with Alan Creswell. I took a long break after some heavy usage years, and these days I tend to float in and out - but it is reassuring to have the boards and the community here, whether it's to ask or offer prayer, to have a serious discussion, or to snark.

I would be willing to put in time to help out in some capacity, and I have just made a contribution to the Floating Fund.

I think the boards serve a purpose, and should be maintained.

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I'm not dead yet.

Posts: 14651 | From: Valhalla | Registered: Feb 2002  |  IP: Logged
Rossweisse

High Church Valkyrie
# 2349

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(Posting to apologize for misspelling the name of Alan Cresswell. I hate it when I do that.)

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I'm not dead yet.

Posts: 14651 | From: Valhalla | Registered: Feb 2002  |  IP: Logged
Roman Cataholic
Apprentice
# 18736

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A SoF Haiku

If the Forums cease,
Will the website still exist?
I fear it will not.

Posts: 26 | Registered: Feb 2017  |  IP: Logged
mousethief

Ship's Thieving Rodent
# 953

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quote:
Originally posted by Schroedinger's cat:
What I am trying to do is get some better reason for the boards to continue than the fact that we like them.

Why isn't that good enough? You seem to be saying, "I'm losing interest, so shut it down." Clearly other people aren't losing interest. Maybe it's just time to say goodbye gracefully.

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God has shown me that I should not call any man impure or unclean. --Acts 10:28

Posts: 62986 | From: Ecotopia | Registered: Jul 2001  |  IP: Logged
Schroedinger's cat

Ship's cool cat
# 64

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quote:
Originally posted by mousethief:
quote:
Originally posted by Schroedinger's cat:
What I am trying to do is get some better reason for the boards to continue than the fact that we like them.

Why isn't that good enough? You seem to be saying, "I'm losing interest, so shut it down." Clearly other people aren't losing interest. Maybe it's just time to say goodbye gracefully.
I am not losing interest. Not totally at least. I have taken a time out before. I engage less than I used to in some areas.

If it was just that I was bored, I would go. I wondered if there was something else I was seeing. The first couple of responses I think were indicating that others detected this malaise too.

And we had to have this discussion before I could know whether others also experienced this. I want the boards to continue. In terms of the church analogy above, is meeting in the same building the best thing? Or is there soemwhere else that we could be more effective at what we do? Becasue what we do at its best is brilliant.

ETA - you know why I struggle to stay in a church now, don't you? I really am a PITA.

[ 25. August 2017, 09:11: Message edited by: Schroedinger's cat ]

--------------------
Blog
Music for your enjoyment
Lord may all my hard times be healing times
take out this broken heart and renew my mind.

Posts: 18537 | From: At the bottom of a deep dark well. | Registered: May 2001  |  IP: Logged
Amanda B. Reckondwythe

Dressed for Church
# 5521

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Sail on, sail on in majesty.

I can't imagine life without the Ship.

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"We're not in Wonderland anymore, Alice." – Charles Manson

Posts: 10234 | From: The Great Southwest | Registered: Feb 2004  |  IP: Logged
Celtic Knotweed
Shipmate
# 13008

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quote:
Originally posted by Schroedinger's cat:
And yes, Facebook and twitter are not right, which is why I mentioend Yammer as a possible option, but I am not saying "we should move to x" - that would need further exploration.

My workplace has a Yammer set-up. I have a login for it, but it's pretty poor for any sort of discussion. Fine for disseminating info and people passing comment on it, but it keeps on hiding earlier replies (even when you haven't read them yet!), and it's very hard to find something you were reading yesterday due to no titles or any sort of index.

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When I get a little money I buy books; and if any is left I buy food and clothes.
Erasmus of Rotterdam

Posts: 651 | From: between keyboard and chair | Registered: Sep 2007  |  IP: Logged
mousethief

Ship's Thieving Rodent
# 953

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One of the things I appreciate about the boards here is how clean they are. So many discussion sites allow so much crap in each person's response that two or three one-line posts can fill a whole screen. It is very wearisome to follow a conversation in such an environment.

Now if we could just get people here to stop quoting a 100 line post to make a one-line response.

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God has shown me that I should not call any man impure or unclean. --Acts 10:28

Posts: 62986 | From: Ecotopia | Registered: Jul 2001  |  IP: Logged
balaam

Making an ass of myself
# 4543

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quote:
Originally posted by mousethief:
One of the things I appreciate about the boards here is how clean they are. So many discussion sites allow so much crap in each person's response that two or three one-line posts can fill a whole screen. It is very wearisome to follow a conversation in such an environment.

Now if we could just get people here to stop quoting a 100 line post to make a one-line response.

OK. I'll stop

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Fearfully and wonderfully mad

ن
blog

Posts: 8694 | From: Somewhere else | Registered: May 2003  |  IP: Logged
balaam

Making an ass of myself
# 4543

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quote:
Originally posted by balaam:
quote:
Originally posted by mousethief:
One of the things I appreciate about the boards here is how clean they are. So many discussion sites allow so much crap in each person's response that two or three one-line posts can fill a whole screen. It is very wearisome to follow a conversation in such an environment.

Now if we could just get people here to stop quoting a 100 line post to make a one-line response.

OK. I'll stop
Someone was bound to do this.

--------------------
Fearfully and wonderfully mad

ن
blog

Posts: 8694 | From: Somewhere else | Registered: May 2003  |  IP: Logged
Wesley J

Silly Shipmate
# 6075

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quote:
Originally posted by balaam:
quote:
Originally posted by balaam:
quote:
Originally posted by mousethief:
One of the things I appreciate about the boards here is how clean they are. So many discussion sites allow so much crap in each person's response that two or three one-line posts can fill a whole screen. It is very wearisome to follow a conversation in such an environment.

Now if we could just get people here to stop quoting a 100 line post to make a one-line response.

OK. I'll stop
Someone was bound to do this.
They were.

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Be it as it may: Wesley J will stay. --- Euthanasia, that sounds good. An alpine neutral neighbourhood. Then back to Britain, all dressed in wood. Things were gonna get worse. (John Cooper Clarke)

Posts: 7232 | From: The Isles of Silly | Registered: May 2004  |  IP: Logged
Ian Climacus

Liturgical Slattern
# 944

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An interesting question...

I too come and go. Probably because 2001 and the years following were a time of great questioning for me. Discovering the Ship was a lifeline to sanity, and a voyage that rocked, battered and overcame my faith, then brought it to a safe harbour. Unrest indeed. Issues which were intense and fiercely debated now seem to be Dead Horses now (rightly, to me).

Debates seem much more political, but I may be misremembering. Agreement seems more pronounced here now too; or maybe I just liked the disagreeable threads in the past. It seems the lefty liberal and highly educated poster (guilty) is common. Maybe I did not notice it before.

But I still see unrest here. And long may we be unrestful. And I think long form discussion is something that has its place as was more eloquently expressed above. Fresh and new expressions may be needed, cf St Pixels, but as was said above Yammer, which I've used in 2 work places, does not seem to be answer. Maybe there are other options out there.

An interesting question. A good debate to have. The Ship has been wonderful to me, and I hope many others can find the benefits I did.

Posts: 7393 | From: Albury, Australia | Registered: Jul 2001  |  IP: Logged
Garasu
Shipmate
# 17152

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I'm not sure that it's a matter of the boards not being fit for purpose. For my part I'd say that it's the devices on which I'm accessing them which are not fit for purpose.

In other words, I'm far more likely to be browsing on tablet or phone rather than a PC than I was in the past, which is fine for reading but a right pain if I want to contribute...

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"Could I believe in the doctrine without believing in the deity?". - Modesitt, L. E., Jr., 1943- Imager.

Posts: 886 | From: Surrey Heath (England) | Registered: Jun 2012  |  IP: Logged
Marvin the Martian

Interplanetary
# 4360

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One thing I've noticed is that there are significantly fewer shipmeets now than there used to be. I'm sure that's just a product of the core membership growing up and getting jobs and families, but it must be having an impact on our community.

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Hail Gallaxhar

Posts: 29859 | From: Adrift on a sea of surreality | Registered: Apr 2003  |  IP: Logged
mdijon
Shipmate
# 8520

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quote:
Originally posted by Schroedinger's cat:
Or is there soemwhere else that we could be more effective at what we do?

I'm probably unimaginative, but like what?

It seems to me the boards are very effective for what the type of discussions we have here. Different discussions can be had on twitter or facebook. If people don't generally like the board-type of discussion, then I don't know what can be done to reverse that.

There is more competition now from other social media platforms and habits are changing. Personally I like the boards-style and would be happy to carry on with it, but if people change then I guess I'll eventually have to decide whether to change with them or do something else.

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mdijon nojidm uoɿıqɯ ɯqıɿou
ɯqıɿou uoɿıqɯ nojidm mdijon

Posts: 12277 | From: UK | Registered: Sep 2004  |  IP: Logged
Alan Cresswell

Mad Scientist 先生
# 31

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quote:
Originally posted by Ian Climacus:
Debates seem much more political, but I may be misremembering.

I don't think you're misremembering. I'd put it down to the influence of Trump and Brexit bringing politics much more to the fore. Though there may be other factors.

But, ultimately, such changes in what sort of subjects are more common here is a reflection of what people want to talk about. We can't force people to engage in discussions that don't really interest them.

quote:
But I still see unrest here. And long may we be unrestful. And I think long form discussion is something that has its place as was more eloquently expressed above. Fresh and new expressions may be needed.
There are technical issues with the current software in accessing the boards on mobile platforms. Addressing those issues would involve a software change, and provide an opportunity to renew and freshen things. We're always willing to get ideas on how things might be freshened up.

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Don't Brexit if you haven't a scooby how to fix it.

Posts: 32001 | From: East Kilbride (Scotland) or 福島 | Registered: May 2001  |  IP: Logged
anoesis
Shipmate
# 14189

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quote:
Originally posted by lilBuddha:
As Alan mentioned Facebook and Twitter, they fucking suck bloody, pustulent* balls for real discussions.
They have, however, managed to dominate the way people communicate.
Reddit is for trolls.
Face to face discussion is fun, but less considered and less elegant.
I think places like SOF are more vital rather than less. As far as not gaining as many new members, I think it a combination of fewer religious people, the above mentioned trinity of evil and the rather, erm, quaint style of the website.


*Intentional neologism.

I totally , totally agree with the substantive content of your post. But [pedantry] - pustulent - been around for a while, actually.

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The history of humanity give one little hope that strength left to its own devices won't be abused. Indeed, it gives one little ground to think that strength would continue to exist if it were not abused. -- Dafyd --

Posts: 971 | From: New Zealand | Registered: Oct 2008  |  IP: Logged
anoesis
Shipmate
# 14189

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quote:
Originally posted by Wesley J:
quote:
Originally posted by lilBuddha:
[...] I think places like SOF are more vital rather than less. [...]

Agreed.

When SoF offspring Church of Fools moved over to FB, they lost me. FB et al are purely commercial. SoF isn't. You have reasonable privacy here, divulge as much as you want, or not, are not pestered by spam mails offering [snip] [/URL].

Me too. I mean, I know I'm no-one in particular, here, but I'm not on Facebook, and I'm never going to be. If SoF moved over there, I'd miss it terribly, but...still no.

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The history of humanity give one little hope that strength left to its own devices won't be abused. Indeed, it gives one little ground to think that strength would continue to exist if it were not abused. -- Dafyd --

Posts: 971 | From: New Zealand | Registered: Oct 2008  |  IP: Logged
Pigwidgeon

Ship's Owl
# 10192

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quote:
Originally posted by anoesis:
I mean, I know I'm no-one in particular, here, but I'm not on Facebook, and I'm never going to be. If SoF moved over there, I'd miss it terribly, but...still no.

Absolutely. For reasons I won't go into, I absolutely refuse to join Facebook -- even for the Ship (which I'd also miss tremendously). I miss many Shipmates who have apparently gone over to the dark side of FB.

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Don't keep calm. Go change the world.

Posts: 9337 | From: Hogwarts | Registered: Aug 2005  |  IP: Logged
SvitlanaV2
Shipmate
# 16967

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I think the visuals here are rather strange. If the site wants to attract a range of people and views it might be a good idea to revamp the general look, since the images and jokes used on some pages seem designed to keep 'the wrong sort' well away.

OTOH if the Ship is happy to provide an 'unrestful' space for a specific kind of Christian, as opposed to dealing with 'Christian unrest' in a very broad sense, then that's fair enough, I suppose.

But I can see ongoing challenges for the Ship in its present form. As has been said, there are fewer Christians in the Western world than before, and there's less interest from non-Christians in Christian matters.

Also, I wonder if there's been a kind of hardening of doctrinal positions as dissatisfied worshippers have either given up on churchgoing or just died. E.g., by now evangelicals have already heard the arguments in favour of SSM. It's possible that those who were going go change their minds have already done so. The rest may feel they have little to gain from debating the matter any more.

Moreover, as congregations struggle with a lack of manpower and resources I imagine that many serious Christians simply have too much to do to get involved in discussions that don't address the very practical kinds of unrest that they have to deal with.

[ 26. August 2017, 13:39: Message edited by: SvitlanaV2 ]

Posts: 6359 | From: UK | Registered: Feb 2012  |  IP: Logged
Simon

Editor
# 1

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quote:
Originally posted by Schroedinger's cat:
To be unrestful means asking, means being prepared to say "this is finished", or "this needs to change". Or "We could do this", and revitalise the place.

Thanks for raising the questions. I think you’re right: they do open up the possibility of change and new life.

And thanks to everyone who’s given to the Floating Fund via this thread. It helps makes revitalising the Ship practically possible.

This thread is really timely, because after several months of planning and preparation, we’re about to begin work in September on a relaunch of Ship of Fools. I’ll post more details about this soon, but just to say at this point that we’ll be moving to new board software, and that the Ship as a whole will be redesigned and restructured, for access via desktop, tablet and phone.

One of the things which won’t change is our commitment to Christian unrest.

I’ll post a separate thread on this in the Styx next week.

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Jumble Sales of the Apocalypse

Posts: 3769 | From: London | Registered: Mar 2001  |  IP: Logged
Boogie

Boogie on down!
# 13538

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quote:
Originally posted by Simon:
quote:
Originally posted by Schroedinger's cat:
To be unrestful means asking, means being prepared to say "this is finished", or "this needs to change". Or "We could do this", and revitalise the place.

Thanks for raising the questions. I think you’re right: they do open up the possibility of change and new life.

And thanks to everyone who’s given to the Floating Fund via this thread. It helps makes revitalising the Ship practically possible.

This thread is really timely, because after several months of planning and preparation, we’re about to begin work in September on a relaunch of Ship of Fools. I’ll post more details about this soon, but just to say at this point that we’ll be moving to new board software, and that the Ship as a whole will be redesigned and restructured, for access via desktop, tablet and phone.

One of the things which won’t change is our commitment to Christian unrest.

I’ll post a separate thread on this in the Styx next week.

Wow!

That's great news Simon [Big Grin]

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Garden. Room. Walk

Posts: 12587 | From: Boogie Wonderland | Registered: Mar 2008  |  IP: Logged
Eutychus
From the edge
# 3081

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quote:
Originally posted by Simon:
One of the things which won’t change is our commitment to Christian unrest.

Amen [Yipee]

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One has to take part. Scary as it is. - Martin60
Jerusalem is a city without walls

Posts: 17018 | From: 528491 | Registered: Jul 2002  |  IP: Logged
Nenya
Shipmate
# 16427

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Great to catch a glimpse of Simon. [Biased]

I agree with those who say keeping the Ship in message board form is important. Following a serious debate on Facebook is very hard work and we have Yammer at work too - I'm far from impressed.

I was never a massive poster, even less so at the moment, but I am here every day and have learned so much from the discussions here. I think this is a very important space, including for dedicated lurkers. I recently saw a tweet from Vicky Beeching saying that she is a huge fan of SoF. Some of the finest minds and most skilled and succinct debaters I know are here on the Ship.

Nen - having a moment of pride about being one of the six posters who use Preview Post. [Big Grin]

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They told me I was delusional. I nearly fell off my unicorn.

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mousethief

Ship's Thieving Rodent
# 953

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It will be nice to be able to view the ship easily on my phone. The software does very strange things on the phone.

Looking forward to the new thread. To me the most urgent of questions is, will we be able to access the archives from the UBB days? It would be sad (not world-stopping of course) if not.

Think I'll go pull a stop on the organ fund. Also everybody get Simon's new book. Very enjoyable.

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God has shown me that I should not call any man impure or unclean. --Acts 10:28

Posts: 62986 | From: Ecotopia | Registered: Jul 2001  |  IP: Logged
Brenda Clough
Shipmate
# 18061

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I can -read- SoF on my Android, I just can't log in or post. A good thing, you might say.

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Science fiction and fantasy writer with a Patreon page

Posts: 5448 | From: Washington DC | Registered: Mar 2014  |  IP: Logged
Barnabas62
Shipmate
# 9110

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Good news from Simon and I'll be making a contribution to transitional costs.

I was pleased to hear that Vicky Beeching is a huge fan.

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Who is it that you seek? How then shall we live? How shall we sing the Lord's song in a strange land?

Posts: 20858 | From: Norfolk UK | Registered: Feb 2005  |  IP: Logged
Marvin the Martian

Interplanetary
# 4360

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quote:
Originally posted by mousethief:
Looking forward to the new thread. To me the most urgent of questions is, will we be able to access the archives from the UBB days? It would be sad (not world-stopping of course) if not.

I imagine that we could keep these boards as a static archive if/when we get new software.

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Hail Gallaxhar

Posts: 29859 | From: Adrift on a sea of surreality | Registered: Apr 2003  |  IP: Logged
Horseman Bree
Shipmate
# 5290

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Having been very sporadic for the last couple of years (or isi it more?), I came in today to look up an archived thread.

And I found this discussion.

I have to say that some of the discussion seems to be a recycling of ones that went before, but that is to be expected, since many people who are now "in" weren't there the first time around, and my enjoy the topic.

But, generally there is lively discussion. Unfortunately, fewer people want to actually discuss: it seems that shouting at each other is more likely. The take-over of FaceBook by advertising and agenda-followers has meant that there is little civil discussion. Plus, you can't even find a thread of discussion after a very few days, let alone find anyone who is interested once the thread has moved down the ladder into Oblivion.

It is good to see that a technological revamp is in the works. This kind of discussion would work well for me accessing through my phone or the tablet I am about to buy. Donation will be coming once I finish here

Probably the wrong place, but can I put my vote in against "nested" threads? I like having to see all the sides of the argument while reading through to find the specific post about one aspect.

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It's Not That Simple

Posts: 5366 | From: more herring choker than bluenose | Registered: Dec 2003  |  IP: Logged
RuthW

liberal "peace first" hankie squeezer
# 13

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quote:
Originally posted by Horseman Bree:
Probably the wrong place, but can I put my vote in against "nested" threads?

Yes, right alongside mine!
Posts: 24384 | From: La La Land | Registered: Apr 2001  |  IP: Logged
Lamb Chopped
Ship's kebab
# 5528

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And mine.

Funny, but I just recommended against nested thread software at work based on my experience on the Ship.

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Er, this is what I've been up to (book).
Oh, that you would rend the heavens and come down!

Posts: 19962 | From: off in left field somewhere | Registered: Feb 2004  |  IP: Logged
Wesley J

Silly Shipmate
# 6075

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What Lamb Chopped et al say. There's no resting / when a-nesting.

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Be it as it may: Wesley J will stay. --- Euthanasia, that sounds good. An alpine neutral neighbourhood. Then back to Britain, all dressed in wood. Things were gonna get worse. (John Cooper Clarke)

Posts: 7232 | From: The Isles of Silly | Registered: May 2004  |  IP: Logged



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