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Source: (consider it) Thread: Prince Harry
shamwari
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# 15556

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Prince Harry letting off steam?

He was last (on a very short and safe posting) to Afghanistan many moons ago.

Since then he has officiated at the London Olympics closing ceremony which was, no doubt, a very stressful job.

And now a holiday on Richard Branson's island plus Las Vegas. Stressful in the extreme.

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Alogon
Cabin boy emeritus
# 5513

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quote:
Originally posted by Twilight:
Remember that scandal in Columbia a short while back where some U.S. Secret Service men had hired some (legal) prostitutes?

The Secret service involves, you know, secrecy. The danger of consorting with prostitutes on the part of custodians of state secrets-- spies and the like-- is that they can easily be enemy agents themselves and, in the course of intimacies, glean some of the secrets. They can also blackmail a target with threats to their marriages and families if not their careers. These dangers to the state do not apply so much to army men except in the highest ranks.

Of course, military folk have always been as highly disciplined as possible, and steeled to endure hardships, but I've never gathered that they are forbidden to relax and enjoy themselves, perhaps rather riotously, when off duty. This wouldn't be because generals are as morally lax as privates, but because experience has shown what makes for the best soldiers. I don't know about you, but I'd tend to trust their judgment as to what it takes.

Early scenes in the film Das Boot, acclaimed for realism, portrayed a really shocking bacchanal on the part of a U-boat crew on shore leave and soon to set sail. Perhaps this partly reflected an underlying desperation and fatalism on the part of fighting men who sensed that the war was beginning to go against them. But we all know that once underway, they were fearsome adversaries.

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Patriarchy (n.): A belief in original sin unaccompanied by a belief in God.

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sebby
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# 15147

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Unfortunately not. It has little to do with Officers Behaving Badly (what a good name for a novel or especially a film) but 'morality' does occur a few times here, and 'slippery slope' when invoked usually prefixes a specious argument. Try harder.

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sebhyatt

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sebby
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quote:
Originally posted by Twilight:
[QUOTE]Originally posted by sebby:
[qb]


What I actually do see is lots of people who want to be the voice of modern, forward thinking, open mindedness -- trying to make a big stand against the badly dressed prudes of their imagination. Sadly for you and Left-at-the Altar that ship sailed in 1967.

See above: an example of moralising under a thin veneer of hauteur.

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sebhyatt

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rolyn
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quote:
Originally posted by sebby:
... but all he did was take his clothes off and get pissed.

Got a feeling the getting pissed bit came first .

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Change is the only certainty of existence

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sebby
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Haha probably.

Interestingly on FB was a message : 'didn't think much of you before but Harry, you're a real legend'.

There were scores of 'likes'

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sebhyatt

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Kelly Alves

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( uncomfortable grunt.)

Just for the record, I have not seen the video, nor do I intend to. The whole point to me is that what happens on it is precisely none of my damn business. Just because someone posted a video does not mean I have to hit "Play."

Having said that, Sine, your various points about Harry needing to learn to protect himself are very wise.

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I cannot expect people to believe “
Jesus loves me, this I know” of they don’t believe “Kelly loves me, this I know.”
Kelly Alves, somewhere around 2003.

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beatmenace
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On the plus side - it might generate new interest in the sport of Billiards which previously had a bit of a low profile compared to Snooker.

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"I'm the village idiot , aspiring to great things." (The Icicle Works)

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daisymay

St Elmo's Fire
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quote:
Originally posted by Baptist Trainfan:
Daisy May, do you quite mean what you actually said ... that it should be forbidden to take photos of people who are not wearing no clothes?

The mind boggles! I can certainly think of many politicians and celebs who I would far rather see clothed, thank you very much.

Oops, I meant not wearing any clothes, having the picture of someone did it, of just the body... not in safety because it's difficult to let everyone see that of us...

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London
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Doublethink.
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Could have been worse, they could have being playing nutball - not safe for most people's work.

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All political thinking for years past has been vitiated in the same way. People can foresee the future only when it coincides with their own wishes, and the most grossly obvious facts can be ignored when they are unwelcome. George Orwell

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Left at the Altar

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quote:
Originally posted by Lietuvos Sv. Kazimieras:
quote:
Originally posted by Left at the Altar:
His family?

His father wished he was a tampon.

Wished he were a tampon. Please use the proper subjunctive form.
Yes, yes, I did realise that. But too late. The time to edit were over.

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Still pretty Amazing, but no longer Mavis.

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Left at the Altar

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quote:
Originally posted by Sine Nomine:
quote:
Originally posted by Left at the Altar:
2. Why should he not be able to get his kit off without fear of it being on the front page of a rag the next day?

That's disingenuous, LATA. There are plenty of ways he could get his kit off without fear of it being on the front page of a rag the next day. This wasn't one of them however and he was foolish to think it was.

(I know 'irregardless' isn't a proper word, but it should be.)

((Nice to see you!))

Well, yes, it was a bit disingenuous. I'm like that.
But getting his kit off at home with with the family wouldn't be half as much fun.


quote:
Originally posted by Twilight:
quote:
Originally posted by Left at the Altar:
1. Irregardless isn't a word. At least, not a proper word.

Now I see why you can't bring yourself to admit that Harry did a silly thing. You've saved all your judgmentalism for people who use incorrect words.
Well, only you so far. It was a bit mean. Sorry. But I never said he wasn't silly. He is silly. But I don't think it's anyone's business that he's silly. My son is silly. My husband used to be silly. I was as silly as they get. Why is anyone surprised or outraged that he's silly?

....

quote:
4. Even if you were famous, no one would want to take snaps of you in the nuddy. Me neither. So we are hardly qualified to judge.
I already said as much, no need to rub it in, although I don't see how no one wanting to take our pictures makes us less qualified to judge. You sound as though you think Harry posed willingly in exchange for money. Are you confusing him with this month's Playmate?

Whoa! Where did I sound like he posed for payment? I thought I was running the argument that he should be able to get his kit off and not be shown butt naked on the front of The Sun.

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Still pretty Amazing, but no longer Mavis.

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orfeo

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# 13878

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quote:
Originally posted by ExclamationMark:
Time was when an officer and a chap caught like this would have been led to an empty room with a loaded revolver and a bottle of whiskey. He'd know what to do.

Pointed the loaded revolver at the door so the next fool with a camera wouldn't get away with it.

Oh, and as far as I can tell, whatever time you're talking about was probably when paparazzi had to be armed with an easel and a paintbrush.

[ 25. August 2012, 00:10: Message edited by: orfeo ]

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Technology has brought us all closer together. Turns out a lot of the people you meet as a result are complete idiots.

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George Spigot

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quote:
Originally posted by Sine Nomine:
No. I was talking about snappy rejoinders that sound great but really aren't.

Ah my mistake. Still not having your life dictated to you by the tabloids didn't sound like a snappy rejoinder. It sounded perfectly reasonable to me.

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C.S. Lewis's Head is just a tool for the Devil. (And you can quote me on that.) ~
Philip Purser Hallard
http://www.thoughtplay.com/infinitarian/gbsfatb.html

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Cod
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quote:
Originally posted by Horseman Bree:
ISTM that Harry is doing exactly what royal second sons have done for centuries: fill up the non-official time with entertainment

Agree. God's in his heaven, junior royals are out on the razz, all's right with the world.

quote:
For instance, that was the job that the man who became Henry VIII had until his older brother died.
Buff Prince Hal. [Snigger]
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Trudy Scrumptious

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quote:
Originally posted by Cod:
Buff Prince Hal. [Snigger]

Has nobody used that as a headline yet?

[ 25. August 2012, 10:50: Message edited by: Trudy Scrumptious ]

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Books and things.

I lied. There are no things. Just books.

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pete173
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I think that you'll find that the literary allusion might be lost on devotees of the gutter press (and would require a level of erudition not known among Daily Mail and Sun journalists).

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Pete

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Twilight

Puddleglum's sister
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quote:
Originally posted by Horseman Bree:
ISTM that Harry is doing exactly what royal second sons have done for centuries: fill up the non-official time with entertainment

For instance, that was the job that the man who became Henry VIII had until his older brother died.



In that case I'm a little worried for the young women who've been taking his picture. [Eek!]

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Sine Nomine

Ship's backstabbing bastard
# 66

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quote:
Originally posted by George Spigot:
quote:
Originally posted by Sine Nomine:
No. I was talking about snappy rejoinders that sound great but really aren't.

Ah my mistake. Still not having your life dictated to you by the tabloids didn't sound like a snappy rejoinder. It sounded perfectly reasonable to me.
If he thinks the fallout is worth his one night of "pleasure" then I suppose you are right.

I wouldn't think it would be though.

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Precious, Precious, Sweet, Sweet Daddy...

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George Spigot

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quote:
Originally posted by Sine Nomine:
quote:
Originally posted by George Spigot:
quote:
Originally posted by Sine Nomine:
No. I was talking about snappy rejoinders that sound great but really aren't.

Ah my mistake. Still not having your life dictated to you by the tabloids didn't sound like a snappy rejoinder. It sounded perfectly reasonable to me.
If he thinks the fallout is worth his one night of "pleasure" then I suppose you are right.

I wouldn't think it would be though.

Well let's be clear it's the photographer and the newspaper that are in the wrong here.

--------------------
C.S. Lewis's Head is just a tool for the Devil. (And you can quote me on that.) ~
Philip Purser Hallard
http://www.thoughtplay.com/infinitarian/gbsfatb.html

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Sine Nomine

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# 66

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Absolutely. But that doesn't mean he shouldn't of known there was a good chance of that happening.

Getting naked in a hotel room with strangers present. Good idea? Not so good idea?

Turns out the answer is "B".

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Precious, Precious, Sweet, Sweet Daddy...

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George Spigot

Outcast
# 253

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So people should live their lives to fit in with people who are in the wrong?

--------------------
C.S. Lewis's Head is just a tool for the Devil. (And you can quote me on that.) ~
Philip Purser Hallard
http://www.thoughtplay.com/infinitarian/gbsfatb.html

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Horseman Bree
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Sounds like Jesus to me.

He certainly hed no trouble with people who "lost" their clothes on at least two occasions

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It's Not That Simple

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orfeo

Ship's Musical Counterpoint
# 13878

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quote:
Originally posted by George Spigot:
So people should live their lives to fit in with people who are in the wrong?

Bingo. This encapsulates perfectly what I have found so bothersome about the 'he should have known' crowd.

Even if he DOES know, he has - amazingly enough - the same right to live his ordinary life away from the spotlight that everybody else does. If I was in his position I would be intensely upset at the suggestion that I forfeit the right to be treated like a normal human being in private just because of my public position.

And the same goes, frankly, for all 'public figures' whether they be musicians or movie stars. Can we all stop treating these people as if they are performing seals whose sole role in life is to provide "real people" with entertainment and titillation?

[ 25. August 2012, 13:45: Message edited by: orfeo ]

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Technology has brought us all closer together. Turns out a lot of the people you meet as a result are complete idiots.

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Sine Nomine

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# 66

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quote:
Originally posted by George Spigot:
So people should live their lives to fit in with people who are in the wrong?

What does "fit in" have to do with it? It's about protecting oneself and one's reputation.

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Precious, Precious, Sweet, Sweet Daddy...

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leo
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# 1458

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quote:
Originally posted by Horseman Bree:
Sounds like Jesus to me.

He certainly hed no trouble with people who "lost" their clothes on at least two occasions

The Lord Krishna had a track record on this one too.

--------------------
My Jewish-positive lectionary blog is at http://recognisingjewishrootsinthelectionary.wordpress.com/
My reviews at http://layreadersbookreviews.wordpress.com

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George Spigot

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quote:
Originally posted by Sine Nomine:
quote:
Originally posted by George Spigot:
So people should live their lives to fit in with people who are in the wrong?

What does "fit in" have to do with it? It's about protecting oneself and one's reputation.
It seems such a defeatist attitude to take. Just rolling over and letting the bad guys dictate how you live.

--------------------
C.S. Lewis's Head is just a tool for the Devil. (And you can quote me on that.) ~
Philip Purser Hallard
http://www.thoughtplay.com/infinitarian/gbsfatb.html

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Sine Nomine

Ship's backstabbing bastard
# 66

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I'm not sure how you got from "reasonable caution" to "letting the bad guys dictate how you live" but I think it's a pretty big jump.

But yes, I suppose it would restrict one's ability to play strip pool with strangers in a hotel room. If that's more important to one then one's reputation as a prince of the United Kingdom, then I say go for it and let the chips fall where they may.

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Precious, Precious, Sweet, Sweet Daddy...

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Twilight

Puddleglum's sister
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quote:
Originally posted by orfeo:


And the same goes, frankly, for all 'public figures' whether they be musicians or movie stars. Can we all stop treating these people as if they are performing seals whose sole role in life is to provide "real people" with entertainment and titillation?

You do realize don't you that if we all started treating these people the same as everyone else they would be paid union scale and not the millions per picture that goes with being a "star?" Part of being a star, of screen, sports, or stage is that the people who think you're worth the huge ticket prices are the same ones who find you so fascinating they will buy tabloids and magazines just because your picture is on the cover.

These celebrities are all free to retire from their roles that have caused such a furor and take up teaching in a village by the sea. There are many stars who have done just that sort of thing.

I don't think the photographers and journalists are the most admirable people in the world but they are just trying to earn a living and making a pittance compared to what their "victims" are earning so I'm not ready to send them to the lowest level of Hell quite yet. Princess Diana could have pulled the curtains in her limo and ordered the driver to slow down.

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leo
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# 1458

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Ginger nuts - nice biscuits.

--------------------
My Jewish-positive lectionary blog is at http://recognisingjewishrootsinthelectionary.wordpress.com/
My reviews at http://layreadersbookreviews.wordpress.com

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Sioni Sais
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# 5713

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quote:
Originally posted by orfeo:


And the same goes, frankly, for all 'public figures' whether they be musicians or movie stars. Can we all stop treating these people as if they are performing seals whose sole role in life is to provide "real people" with entertainment and titillation?

If they are in 'showbiz' then they are 'performing seals. I have little sympathy for other celebrities either as they all depend on publicity for their wealth and income, and they could use some of it to buy some bit of privacy, that those who aren't of public curiosity can afford.

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"He isn't Doctor Who, he's The Doctor"

(Paul Sinha, BBC)

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orfeo

Ship's Musical Counterpoint
# 13878

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quote:
Originally posted by Sioni Sais:
If they are in 'showbiz' then they are 'performing seals.

Not 24 hours a day they're not. I get to clock off from my job (although not this weekend, I had to bring some of the damn stuff home). The notion that people in 'showbiz' aren't allowed to get any downtime is simply preposterous. When they are working, they are working. When they're not, they're not.

Otherwise you're turning the viewing public into the equivalent of the boss who thinks he can ring you at any time of the night or in the middle of the weekend to do his bidding.

Frankly, the only reason it's like this is because other people have a constant supply of magazine pages and websites to fill. We all get so terribly BORED if the seals aren't performing today.

--------------------
Technology has brought us all closer together. Turns out a lot of the people you meet as a result are complete idiots.

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orfeo

Ship's Musical Counterpoint
# 13878

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quote:
Originally posted by Twilight:

I don't think the photographers and journalists are the most admirable people in the world but they are just trying to earn a living and making a pittance compared to what their "victims" are earning so I'm not ready to send them to the lowest level of Hell quite yet.

Among other people trying to earn a living are low level drug pushers, and the people in India who have taken jobs ringing up Westerners and trying to con them into giving remote access to their computers by claiming to be from a Microsoft service centre.

I suppose the journalists and photographers are at least sticking to the bounds of the law, but that's about the most some of them have going for them.

I wonder, does anyone actually grow up with an interest in journalism and photography thinking "yeah, I really want to make it big in vacuous celebrity gossip"? That's how I'm going to make my mark on the world, by showing people that Posh has gained weight or lost weight or had a row with Becks (well, not really but it made a dramatic headline)?

Yes. It's all fine so long as you make less money than the people whose lives you're stuffing around with. I do NOT think.

[ 25. August 2012, 18:50: Message edited by: orfeo ]

--------------------
Technology has brought us all closer together. Turns out a lot of the people you meet as a result are complete idiots.

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Twilight

Puddleglum's sister
# 2832

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quote:
Originally posted by orfeo:

Yes. It's all fine so long as you make less money than the people whose lives you're stuffing around with. I do NOT think.

Well you have a good point, Orfeo and I don't really think that exactly either. I really just meant to say that if you're, say, Will Smith and someone is paying you ten million for six months work playing the same character you've been playing since you were 16 and the only downside is having to put-up with photographers whenever you leave your gated, secure mansion, then I'm not going to lose sleep over your plight.

Because it's not true that they never have a moment's privacy. They do in their homes, on their yachts, on their private islands and on their private planes. Meanwhile the rest of us aren't able to live entirely private lives either. Where I live every traffic ticket is reported in the newspaper and the hospital staff gossips all over town. Regular people have to share hospital rooms with other people and live in apartments with paper thin walls. Just because no one wants to publish pictures of us in the nude doesn't mean we might not end up on candid TV making a cake of ourselves.

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anoesis
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# 14189

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quote:
Originally posted by Twilight:
These celebrities are all free to retire from their roles that have caused such a furor and take up teaching in a village by the sea. There are many stars who have done just that sort of thing.

I'm pretty sure that wouldn't work for Prince Harry, even if he could get the family to agree to letting him try it.

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The history of humanity give one little hope that strength left to its own devices won't be abused. Indeed, it gives one little ground to think that strength would continue to exist if it were not abused. -- Dafyd --

Posts: 993 | From: New Zealand | Registered: Oct 2008  |  IP: Logged
Sighthound
Shipmate
# 15185

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This is only an issue because he is part of the 'royal family'. If he was an ordinary rich guy doing the same thing, no one would give a damn.

The 'royal family' concept puts its members in a straitjacket that can often cause personal misery. See for example the experiences of Diana, Princess of Wales. They are, in effect, forced to live two lives, one of public image polished with PR, the other (quite possibly) with dark secrets and frustrations.

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Supporter of Tia Greyhound and Lurcher Rescue.http://tiagreyhounds.org/

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Bean Sidhe
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# 11823

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Nice piece

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How do you know when a politician is lying?
His lips are moving.


Danny DeVito

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orfeo

Ship's Musical Counterpoint
# 13878

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What's nice about it? I can't actually tell what the POINT of it is. Tremendously clever, but completely lacking a punchline.

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Technology has brought us all closer together. Turns out a lot of the people you meet as a result are complete idiots.

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rolyn
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# 16840

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quote:
Originally posted by Trudy Scrumptious:
quote:
Originally posted by Cod:
Buff Prince Hal. [Snigger]

Has nobody used that as a headline yet?
I was thinkin "Flash Harry" .

The Sun think tank has no doubt come up with something far more witty .
For some odd reason I always remembered the Sun's headline re. the Queen's Annus Horriblus ...... "Mum's Bum Year"
[Projectile]

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Change is the only certainty of existence

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Horseman Bree
Shipmate
# 5290

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Sorry, you may have to reread it, orfeo. I got the point the first time through.

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It's Not That Simple

Posts: 5372 | From: more herring choker than bluenose | Registered: Dec 2003  |  IP: Logged
lilBuddha
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# 14333

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quote:
Originally posted by Twilight:
. I really just meant to say that if you're, say, Will Smith and someone is paying you ten million for six months work playing the same character you've been playing since you were 16 and the only downside is having to put-up with photographers whenever you leave your gated, secure mansion, then I'm not going to lose sleep over your plight.

Because it's not true that they never have a moment's privacy. They do in their homes, on their yachts, on their private islands and on their private planes.

Right. Anyone attempting to become an intentional celebrity should understand from the outset that their life is no longer entirely their own. However, the level of intrusion some have to deal with is insane, regardless of the salary.
Private mansion? Private Island? Do you know what small fraction of celebrities can afford this? Most actors are lucky to make a workman's wage. Same for sport, for authors, etc.

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I put on my rockin' shoes in the morning
Hallellou, hallellou

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George Spigot

Outcast
# 253

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quote:
Originally posted by Horseman Bree:
Sorry, you may have to reread it, orfeo. I got the point the first time through.

To be fair I've read it twice now and I'm still a complete loss as to what point the author was trying to make. I mean we get the Hans Christian Anderson reference but what's that got to do with the news story?

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C.S. Lewis's Head is just a tool for the Devil. (And you can quote me on that.) ~
Philip Purser Hallard
http://www.thoughtplay.com/infinitarian/gbsfatb.html

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Twilight

Puddleglum's sister
# 2832

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quote:
Originally posted by lilBuddha:
Do you know what small fraction of celebrities can afford this? Most actors are lucky to make a workman's wage. Same for sport, for authors, etc.

Right, and the tabloids aren't paying big bucks for their photoes so they get to lead a quiet life. That's what I said up thread, when I said most actors work for union scale. It's only the "stars," who are followed everywhere by the press and they're the ones who can afford to live in very secure, private places.

In my small town we have a major league baseball player and a well known, retired, actress. No one pays any attention to them in Walmart.

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orfeo

Ship's Musical Counterpoint
# 13878

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quote:
Originally posted by Twilight:
quote:
Originally posted by lilBuddha:
Do you know what small fraction of celebrities can afford this? Most actors are lucky to make a workman's wage. Same for sport, for authors, etc.

Right, and the tabloids aren't paying big bucks for their photoes so they get to lead a quiet life. That's what I said up thread, when I said most actors work for union scale. It's only the "stars," who are followed everywhere by the press and they're the ones who can afford to live in very secure, private places.

No, even many people who are 'known' are not actually making the amount of money that affords you a super-private location.

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Technology has brought us all closer together. Turns out a lot of the people you meet as a result are complete idiots.

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lilBuddha
Shipmate
# 14333

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quote:
Originally posted by Twilight:

In my small town we have a major league baseball player and a well known, retired, actress. No one pays any attention to them in Walmart.

sigh this is not true universally. Believe what you will, I am likely done with this tangent.

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I put on my rockin' shoes in the morning
Hallellou, hallellou

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Niteowl

Hopeless Insomniac
# 15841

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quote:
Originally posted by lilBuddha:
quote:
Originally posted by Twilight:

In my small town we have a major league baseball player and a well known, retired, actress. No one pays any attention to them in Walmart.

sigh this is not true universally. Believe what you will, I am likely done with this tangent.
I have noticed that there are certain celebrities who do lead private lives and are in the press only when they want to be, which means privacy isn't out of reach. Other celebrities seem to be in the press all the time for all the wrong reasons. Sadly, the public demands every salacious detail of the ones who seem to be constant screw ups. I once complained to a friend of mine who works in TV news broadcasting about the amount of news time given them and she informed me that every time they tried to not to cover them their ratings plummeted. Blame the public, not the journalists. I have to add that the worst decision ever made in U.S. TV broadcasting was putting the news divisions under entertainment.

With respect to Harry, on the one hand I feel for him as unlike most celebrities he had no choice with respect to fame and celebrity. He also gets bashed for things that anyone else wouldn't be. On the other hand, he doesn't seem to have picked up wisdom about activities and people who are certain to bring him and his family grief.

[ 27. August 2012, 09:38: Message edited by: Niteowl ]

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"love all, trust few, do wrong to no one"
Wm. Shakespeare

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sebby
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# 15147

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quote:
Originally posted by pete173:
I think that you'll find that the literary allusion might be lost on devotees of the gutter press (and would require a level of erudition not known among Daily Mail and Sun journalists).

It would seem to be the case that journalists - and frequently editorial teams - for these publications are really quite bright, and move from newspaper to newspaper adopting he required style. Many would pick up the reference.


When writing for The Sun, or more especially The Daily Mail the more silly of the two, they know how to manipulate and respond to a stupid readership.

An analysis of The Sun's more snappy headlines shows quite a witty ingenuity, although probably not favouried by those on the Ship. This was certainly believed by one distinguished Professor of Old Testament history, Fellow of Oriel and a translator of the NEB.

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sebhyatt

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rolyn
Shipmate
# 16840

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quote:
Originally posted by sebby:
[QUOTE]
When writing for The Sun, or more especially The Daily Mail the more silly of the two, they know how to manipulate and respond to a stupid readership.

This is quite true . History has proven on more than one occasion that the gutter press is best left to dig it's own grave.

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Change is the only certainty of existence

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