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Source: (consider it) Thread: Names and their meaning
Angloid
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# 159

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I don't mean literal or etymological meaning, just what sort of impression they convey. Boogie posted on a thread in Purgatory
quote:
It'll return, as will Margaret (my given name but I've been Mags since I was four - Dad's fault)

My friend's new grandchild is called Elsie - a name I never thought would return!

Maybe because of its association with the Terror of Downing Street, I tend to be wary of people called Margaret. (Though nothing personal intended, Boogie, and I quite like Mags). Elsie on the other hand suggests a warm and friendly middle-aged or elderly lady who is the heart and soul of a church congregation or local community... I'm sure an Auntie Elsie would be very generous to her family at Christmas.

Most Angelas I know are brusque, efficient, and tend to be prickly, but if you are on the right side of them they are worth their weight in gold. But a woman called Barbara (and this is not really reflected in the Barbaras I know) is likely to be disorganised, unpunctual and a prime candidate for a makeover from Gok Wan.

As for men, Alans are reliable, well-presented and the sort you want on your side; Stanley (not many of them around these days) is solid, salt-of-the-earth, but rather unimaginative. Brian is studious, quiet but a supportive friend.

All of those names reflect a certain era ... post WW2... and of course British. Fashions are changing and as Boogie suggests the old names are beginning to return. US and Aussie culture will provide a different selection (you don't get many Nancys or Bruces in the UK).

Any other names associated with different generations that conjure up images?

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Brian: You're all individuals!
Crowd: We're all individuals!
Lone voice: I'm not!

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Firenze

Ordinary decent pagan
# 619

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I have not, since my schooldays, met many Audreys, Yvonnes, Hesters, Muriels, Lilas or Priscillas. There were always a lot of Margarets and shed loads of Lizes of course. The boys were mainly called Trevor.
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Mechtilde
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# 12563

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A checker at my local supermarket - a young woman - is named "Mabel." Never thought I'd see that. Conjures up a 90-something, tough but with a soft spot for kids. Of course, if you're 90-something, nearly everyone is a kid.

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North East Quine

Curious beastie
# 13049

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Originally posted by Angloid:
quote:
Elsie on the other hand suggests a warm and friendly middle-aged or elderly lady who is the heart and soul of a church congregation or local community..
I knew an elderly Elsie, very sweet and an indefatigable knitter and talented crocheter, who in her youth had spent a couple of years in America, where she sang and played guitar in an illegal drinking den during Prohibition. Elsie was the local fount of knowledge on sex. My mother returned [Eek!] from coffee with her after Elsie had explained oral sex; I was home from University on holiday and therefore old enough for Mum to share her disquiet!

[ 07. January 2013, 06:28: Message edited by: North East Quine ]

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Smudgie

Ship's Barnacle
# 2716

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Our family had a saying that everyone ought to have a "Margaret". Of the three sisters, two of us had a friend called Margaret, and in both cases they were strong women, fairly brusque and efficient and reliable, but the most unconditionally loving, generous (with their time) and helpful friend, without whom life would run so much less smoothly. My third sister didn't have one and would complain about it!

When I was adopting, I was asked if there were any names I wouldn't consider. No hesitation - ridiculous as it sounded, I couldn't have had a son called Wayne. They're brattish, attention-seeking clowns. (Sorry, if you're a Wayne, I take it all back. There must be exceptions and I'm sure you're a really nice fellow!)

I know a little girl called Elsie. It suits her.

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Sparrow
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# 2458

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quote:
Originally posted by North East Quine:
Originally posted by Angloid:
quote:
Elsie on the other hand suggests a warm and friendly middle-aged or elderly lady who is the heart and soul of a church congregation or local community..
I knew an elderly Elsie, very sweet and an indefatigable knitter and talented crocheter, who in her youth had spent a couple of years in America, where she sang and played guitar in an illegal drinking den during Prohibition. Elsie was the local fount of knowledge on sex. My mother returned [Eek!] from coffee with her after Elsie had explained oral sex; I was home from University on holiday and therefore old enough for Mum to share her disquiet!
Sounds like the Elsie in the song from "Cabaret"!

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For I am persuaded that neither death, nor life,nor angels, nor principalities, nor things present nor things to come, nor height, nor depth, nor any other creature, will be able to separate us from the love of God, which is in Christ Jesus our Lord.

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Boogie

Boogie on down!
# 13538

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Neils and Peters are always naughty!

(re: Margaret - I never associated my name as being the same as Margaret Thatcher's until I read the OP of this thread. Honestly! I am now thoroughly traumatised!!, must have been in some sort of denial.)

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Ariel
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# 58

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Anyone by the name of Jean is likely to have a strong practical streak and a lot of common-sense, coupled with organizational ability. They tend to be overlooked a lot as they don't usually push themselves forward.

If you need something fixed or assembled, any Frank will sort it out for you. They seem to like making things and have some kind of affinity with wood. Peter is another, though he tends to be more into gardening than carpentry.

Vivien is one of the people you notice first in any social group. Talks a lot, but can't handle pressure well.

Olivias are always very confident. They know what they want from life, and usually get it.

And hair is likely to be a big thing for any female Pat. It may be styled weekly at the hairdressers, it may be dyed/bleached to within an inch of its life, it may be uncontrollable or hideously stringy, but one thing's for sure, it'll be what you notice first about her.

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Uncle Pete

Loyaute me lie
# 10422

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You've never met my sister, Ariel. With that description of her, you don't want to meet her.

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Even more so than I was before

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Uncle Pete

Loyaute me lie
# 10422

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quote:
Originally posted by Boogie:
Neils and Peters are always naughty!


Hey! [Angel] Wait til I tell my nephew too!

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Even more so than I was before

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Lucia

Looking for light
# 15201

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quote:
Originally posted by Angloid:

But a woman called Barbara (and this is not really reflected in the Barbaras I know) is likely to be disorganised, unpunctual and a prime candidate for a makeover from Gok Wan.


This made me laugh! I used to work with a Barbara who gave rise to the phrase at work "It's looking a bit Barbara in here" meaning things were looking quite a mess! I remember trying to enter her room in the nurse's accommodation and only being able to open the door far enough to squeeze around it due to all the other stuff all over the floor!
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Chorister

Completely Frocked
# 473

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I used to groan inwardly whenever I looked at the class list and saw I'd have to teach a Wayne, Lee or Darren. Whilst my gloomy prediction was often correct, however, I used to be delighted on occasion when proved wrong!

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Angloid
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# 159

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I know what you mean, Chorister. But the three Waynes that I am conscious of having met are all quiet, polite, self-effacing types.

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Brian: You're all individuals!
Crowd: We're all individuals!
Lone voice: I'm not!

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blackbeard
Ship's Pirate
# 10848

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At one time in my life, it seemed that nearly all girls were called Brenda. I am not able to explain this, but I can assure all Brendae that I have nothing against them.

I suspect that PeteC might be deeply suspicious of anyone called Stanley. To me, it means someone dependable and reliable who can do a good job (from the tool-making company).

I used to puzzle over the Roman habit of calling girls Barbara. As in, female barbarian (have I got this right?), but apparently these northern women were known for their beauty. Ursula I cannot explain - can anyone? With apologies to all Ursulae.

[ 07. January 2013, 17:02: Message edited by: blackbeard ]

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Carex
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# 9643

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quote:
Originally posted by Angloid:
I know what you mean, Chorister. But the three Waynes that I am conscious of having met are all quiet, polite, self-effacing types.

It is those with the middle name of Wayne that you have to watch out for.
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Uncle Pete

Loyaute me lie
# 10422

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Barbara refers to red hair. Vikings and other Northish raiders often had red hair -hence Barbarian. But the origin of the name is inoffensive.

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Heavenly Anarchist
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# 13313

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quote:
Originally posted by blackbeard:


I used to puzzle over the Roman habit of calling girls Barbara. As in, female barbarian (have I got this right?), but apparently these northern women were known for their beauty. Ursula I cannot explain - can anyone? With apologies to all Ursulae.

Barbara is a female barbarian but barbarian originally meant any foreigner (not just someone uncouth). Or so a recent BBC history programme told me.

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Pomona
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# 17175

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PeteC, interesting about Barbara and red hair! Barbara makes me instantly think of Barbara Gordon, aka Batgirl/Oracle/now Batgirl again - who does indeed have red hair. Barbara Gordon is one of my favourite comic book characters (and my pseudonym elsewhere on the internet) so for me Barbara has positive connotations. I don't know any personally though.

Amy was one of the most common girls' names in my secondary school and along with Amy March from Little Women, means I associate it with blonde hair and a silly, slightly stuck-up personality.

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Aravis
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# 13824

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All except one of the Ruths I've known have been exceptionally tall (one of them was 6 foot 3 [Eek!] ).
And all except one of the Neils I've known have been gay.

(Cue for all short Ruths and straight Neils to start posting! [Biased] )

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ArachnidinElmet
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# 17346

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I have a friend named Pauline after pope JP II who was visiting the UK in the year she was born (1982), unfortunately also the year that Eastenders was first aired. She gets grief both from people assuming she is 30 years older than she is (telesales and the like) and those that think she was named for Pauline Fowler. Needless to say she's never quite forgiven her mother.

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'If a pleasant, straight-forward life is not possible then one must try to wriggle through by subtle manoeuvres' - Kafka

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RuthW

liberal "peace first" hankie squeezer
# 13

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Not short, but not tall: 5'5". My friends say my name suits me.
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jedijudy

Organist of the Jedi Temple
# 333

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quote:
Originally posted by Aravis:
All except one of the Ruths I've known have been exceptionally tall (one of them was 6 foot 3 [Eek!] ).

quote:
Originally posted by Carex:
It is those with the middle name of Wayne that you have to watch out for.

Well, now you're talking about my grandparents! However, my grandma Ruth was about 4'10. I guess you didn't know her, Aravis! And she was definitely not married to a killer. Mahlon Wayne was only dangerous to fish. Hmmm, a bit Biblical, don't you think? Ruth and Mahlon.

I think all the Daves I know are musical. Perhaps they get that from King David?

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Ariel
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# 58

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quote:
Originally posted by PeteC:
Barbara refers to red hair. Vikings and other Northish raiders often had red hair -hence Barbarian. But the origin of the name is inoffensive.

Barbara comes from the ancient Greek; it was an onomatopeic word, because the ancient Greeks thought that when barbarians spoke their language sounded more like "ba ba ro" than anything. If you want names that specifically refer to red hair you'll be looking at Rory or Ross.

I've sometimes wondered whether it has anything to do with "barba", which means beard, i.e. those hairy foreigners who don't shave. Either way, by Roman times it had broadened enough in scope to lose its less pleasant associations and actually become a personal name.

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Uncle Pete

Loyaute me lie
# 10422

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You are right, Ariel, and I realise now that I was thinking of Barbarossa, an early middle ages Germanic king.

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Even more so than I was before

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ChaliceGirl
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# 13656

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Every Jennifer I've known has been chatty.

I know a Barbara- and she's exactly how you described: disorganized and always late!

Every Joe I've known is talkative as well, and very down to earth. Seems like every family has at least one Joe in it.

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Galilit
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# 16470

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quote:
Originally posted by Boogie:

re: Margaret - I never associated my name as being the same as Margaret Thatcher's until I read the OP of this thread. Honestly! I am now thoroughly traumatised!!, must have been in some sort of denial.

"Thatcher" is my nickname among Arab men of my age and older. They hear the "Margaret" and from then on call me "Thatcher".

Of course in The Old Country there was always another Margaret in the class.

Wouldn't change it for the world. It is a really international name - having started in "Persia" and migrated to all points of the compass with varied spellings.

[ 11. January 2013, 05:33: Message edited by: Galilit ]

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She who does Her Son's will in all things can rely on me to do Hers.

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Edith
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# 16978

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My husband complains that half my friends are called Mary and the other half are called Anne. I blame it on being a Catholic.

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Edith

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sophs

Sardonic Angel
# 2296

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quote:
Originally posted by Smudgie:
When I was adopting, I was asked if there were any names I wouldn't consider. No hesitation - ridiculous as it sounded, I couldn't have had a son called Wayne. They're brattish, attention-seeking clowns. (Sorry, if you're a Wayne, I take it all back. There must be exceptions and I'm sure you're a really nice fellow!)

I have a Wayne, but his nickname is Jeeves, he lets himself into my house and always starts helping, when my back was *really* bad he arrived every day to do odd jobs like putting the washing on, and moving shopping and getting me drinks. He gained his nickname by helping the wargamers set up their terrain and then watching as they played and helping them return the room to it's normal state.
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Edith
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# 16978

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It is said, amongst teachers, that names beginning with a K or a C are to be watched carefully as they indicate possible trouble. Kieron, Callum, Connor, Kayden, Kayleigh, Kelly, Kaycie, Kerry and so on. And I've had a few Jaydens, Jordens and Shaynees who have been difficult too.

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Edith

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deano
princess
# 12063

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My daughter, 14, has many, many friends at school, all seemingly called "Beth"! There is small Beth, big Beth, Bus Beth and so on.

My wife knows them but I just nod and make noises at the appropriate times when they are discussing them. Sorry.

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deano
princess
# 12063

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quote:
Originally posted by Edith:
It is said, amongst teachers, that names beginning with a K or a C are to be watched carefully as they indicate possible trouble. Kieron, Callum, Connor, Kayden, Kayleigh, Kelly, Kaycie, Kerry and so on. And I've had a few Jaydens, Jordens and Shaynees who have been difficult too.

Sorry for the double post, but it seems to be children with "modern" names that are responsible for the trouble.

I have to agree with the sentiment from my own experiences as a parent of children. Kieran, Jordan, Jake et al, all trouble causers.

It cannot be the name, it must be the family background and the attitude issues go along with the desire to name children with modern, popululist names.

But that's a bit Purgy or even Hellish, so apologies in advance.

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"The moral high ground is slowly being bombed to oblivion. " - Supermatelot

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bib
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# 13074

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I must be an exception to other Barbaras - I'm highly organized and never late for anything. In fact my friends and family describe me as being OCD.
My friend has a son with a most unfortunate name. He was born with a cleft palate and she decided she like the name Cameron. A few years later she was most distressed to find that Cameron means crooked nose!

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"My Lord, my Life, my Way, my End, accept the praise I bring"

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Chorister

Completely Frocked
# 473

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quote:
Originally posted by Aravis:
all except one of the Neils I've known have been gay.


And there was me thinking they were all called Lawrence - that's the common link around here.

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Retired, sitting back and watching others for a change.

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Ariel
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# 58

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quote:
Originally posted by Edith:
It is said, amongst teachers, that names beginning with a K or a C are to be watched carefully as they indicate possible trouble. Kieron, Callum, Connor, Kayden, Kayleigh, Kelly, Kaycie, Kerry and so on. And I've had a few Jaydens, Jordens and Shaynees who have been difficult too.

Lots of Katherines or Catherines around - they tend to be quite intelligent, hardworking and don't suffer fools gladly. Oddly enough, they're either blonde, or have long flowing brown hair.

I think there probably is some truth in the idea that a child with a distinctive first name is probably going to have a more distinctive character than one with a very mainstream name, if only because they'll stand out as different amongst their peers right from the start.

Also, many people do give a child a particular name with an association with a particular person, so possibly they're predisposed to look for some of that person's qualities in the child.

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Curious
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# 93

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I'd always thought of Lucys as being rather lovely. Then I met one in her 90s. Very happy to point out that if I wasn't around she'd be interested in my partner,and very ready to explore her potential lesbian relationship (whilst also wondering what it was that 'gays' did).

I think being older has a lot of advantages!!!

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Erin - you are missed more than you could know. Rest in peace and rise in glory - to provide unrest in the heavenly realms.

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Kelly Alves

Bunny with an axe
# 2522

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quote:
Originally posted by Edith:
It is said, amongst teachers, that names beginning with a K or a C are to be watched carefully as they indicate possible trouble. Kieron, Callum, Connor, Kayden, Kayleigh, Kelly, Kaycie, Kerry and so on. And I've had a few Jaydens, Jordens and Shaynees who have been difficult too.

I Kouldn't possible Komment.

Note from 9th grade Spanish teacher to my mom: 'Half the boys in my class wind up getting sent to the office once a week, and it's due to Kelly's constant provocations."

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I cannot expect people to believe “
Jesus loves me, this I know” of they don’t believe “Kelly loves me, this I know.”
Kelly Alves, somewhere around 2003.

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poileplume
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# 16438

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Why can’t we have old fashioned descriptive names like Eric Bloodaxe or Thorfinn Skull-Splitter? Now imagine going into a negation with them in your team. You would have won before you began.

Spotting potential trouble makers in class.

Bringing home to meet parents.

I mean you know where you stand, much simply than modern names.

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Please note I am quite severely dyslexic

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Dormouse

Glis glis – Ship's rodent
# 5954

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quote:
Originally posted by Edith:
It is said, amongst teachers, that names beginning with a K or a C are to be watched carefully as they indicate possible trouble. Kieron, Callum, Connor, Kayden, Kayleigh, Kelly, Kaycie, Kerry and so on. And I've had a few Jaydens, Jordens and Shaynees who have been difficult too.

The first three names are the names of three of my nephews!!! I don't think they were/are any trouble at school though.

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Posts: 3042 | From: 'twixt les Bois Noirs & Les Monts de la Madeleine | Registered: May 2004  |  IP: Logged
Sir Kevin
Ship's Gaffer
# 3492

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quote:
Originally posted by Ariel:


Olivias are always very confident. They know what they want from life, and usually get it.


Certainly it's true of my almost-16-year-old niece! She has already visited Jet Propulsion Laboratory in Pasadena and wants to be an astrophysicist colonizing Mars!

Todds work too hard, but Kevins know how to have fun.

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If you board the wrong train, it is no use running along the corridor in the other direction Dietrich Bonhoeffer
Writing is currently my hobby, not yet my profession.

Posts: 30517 | From: White Hart Lane | Registered: Oct 2002  |  IP: Logged
no prophet's flag is set so...

Proceed to see sea
# 15560

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Here's a name that I did not understand until recently:

Nevaeh - which is Heaven spelt backwards. This has become common among mostly First Nations people. I guess is means, well, heaven.

All boys names Connor are hyperactive.

No girl here is ever named Agatha, Bertha or Claudia any more here. These names are associated with frumpiness. The male equivalents are things like Edwin and Norbert. They would be automatic nerds or what I understand is "anorak" is UK parlance.

I did know, in youth, both a girl and a boy named Gay, the girl had an "e" on the end. Neither kept using it when this became a term for sexuality in the 1970s. I don't know how the word "gay" was chosen for that.

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Out of this nettle, danger, we pluck this flower, safety.
\_(ツ)_/

Posts: 11498 | From: Treaty 6 territory in the nonexistant Province of Buffalo, Canada ↄ⃝' | Registered: Mar 2010  |  IP: Logged
Heavenly Anarchist
Shipmate
# 13313

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I know an Agatha, there's quite a few small children with old fashioned names round here. It seems that those names have become acceptable again, I guess more so now when unusual names are more common. My own name of Ann is considered frumpy but I am always known as Annie which appears more acceptable, despite it originally being a frumpy old lady name.
Someone once sent me a link to names in the UK and no adult appeared to have my eldest's name - Zadok. The local kids used to ask me if it was from Star Trek or some other sci-fi. He loves having an unusual name and especially having his own music [Smile]

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'I love deadlines. I like the whooshing sound they make as they fly by.' Douglas Adams
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Posts: 2831 | From: Trumpington | Registered: Jan 2008  |  IP: Logged
no prophet's flag is set so...

Proceed to see sea
# 15560

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quote:
Originally posted by Heavenly Anarchist:
My own name of Ann is considered frumpy but I am always known as Annie which appears more acceptable, despite it originally being a frumpy old lady name.

Ann has never been a frumpy name in Canada. Though it is often seen as Anne, "Anne with and 'e'", after Anne Shirley of "Anne of Green Gables". That book may be also why Ann/Anne is positive here?

Never heard of a Zadok. Though for boys, I have met two Garnets which I thought was an unusual name. Zadok sounds very powerful.

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Out of this nettle, danger, we pluck this flower, safety.
\_(ツ)_/

Posts: 11498 | From: Treaty 6 territory in the nonexistant Province of Buffalo, Canada ↄ⃝' | Registered: Mar 2010  |  IP: Logged
The5thMary
Shipmate
# 12953

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As some people are rather keen on astrology, I'm interested in names. For instance, in my own experience, I've noticed that all the Davids in my life are kind, thoughtful, non-chauvanistic, animal lovers, artistic, sometimes musically inclined, hate to be called "Dave". Men named Erik, with the k instead of the c tend to be musicians, artists, have a great sense of humor, believe in friendships and are loyal to friends and family. Guys named Steve can be artisitic but can also be somewhat flaky.

Names of women: Jennifer: Artistic, caring, smart, lots of self-confidence, determined, excited about life.

Kristine or Christine: Intense, great sense of humor, highly intelligent, does not suffer fools gladly, perceptive.

I usually try to stay away from guys named Mark or Marc, and never met a Roger who wasn't weird, in a bad way (although I did have a welding teacher named Roger who was weird in a good way, as he was a metal sculptor, when not teaching welding). A guy named James can be really funny, smart, but also unreliable, in my experience.

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God gave me my face but She let me pick my nose.

Posts: 3451 | From: Tacoma, WA USA | Registered: Aug 2007  |  IP: Logged
ChaliceGirl
Shipmate
# 13656

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quote:
Originally posted by Edith:
It is said, amongst teachers, that names beginning with a K or a C are to be watched carefully as they indicate possible trouble. Kieron, Callum, Connor, Kayden, Kayleigh, Kelly, Kaycie, Kerry and so on. And I've had a few Jaydens, Jordens and Shaynees who have been difficult too.

If the Kardashian family is any indication, I agree!

I have had a boss named Victor, followed by another boss named Victor- that must mean something.

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The Episcopal Church Welcomed Me.

"Welcome home." ++Katharine Jefferts Schori to me on 29Mar2009.
My KJS fansite & chicksinpointyhats

Posts: 710 | From: Philadelphia, PA, USA | Registered: Apr 2008  |  IP: Logged
Jengie jon

Semper Reformanda
# 273

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Edwin

Not a geek, a dapper guy whose mother insisted he went to ball room dancing. Quite possibly wears a bow tie and carries an umbrella. Eccentric yes but quite one for the ladies who believe he is harmless.

Jengie

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"To violate a persons ability to distinguish fact from fantasy is the epistemological equivalent of rape." Noretta Koertge

Back to my blog

Posts: 20894 | From: city of steel, butterflies and rainbows | Registered: May 2001  |  IP: Logged
Edith
Shipmate
# 16978

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I was observing a student teacher yesterday and in her class ware: God's Favour, God's Gift, Zeal, Justice, five children called Abu Bakr, Winner, Gold, Good Luck, Bluebell, and, - heaven help us - Ikea.

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Edith

Posts: 256 | From: UK | Registered: Mar 2012  |  IP: Logged
Starbug
Shipmate
# 15917

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quote:
Originally posted by Jengie Jon:
Edwin

Not a geek, a dapper guy whose mother insisted he went to ball room dancing. Quite possibly wears a bow tie and carries an umbrella. Eccentric yes but quite one for the ladies who believe he is harmless.

Jengie

Oy! My late Dad was an Edwin (although he wasnaleays known as Ted). He never wore a tie, but he did love the ballroom dancing. That's how he met my Mum! [Biased]

Fortunately, my grandmother didn't give in to the elderly interfering relative who insisted he should be called Aubrey.

[ 15. January 2013, 05:58: Message edited by: Starbug ]

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“Oh the pointing again. They're screwdrivers! What are you going to do? Assemble a cabinet at them?” ― The Day of the Doctor

Posts: 1189 | From: West of the New Forest | Registered: Sep 2010  |  IP: Logged
Miffy

Ship's elephant
# 1438

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Behold the mother of a Bruce, a rare breed indeed. His father named him after Bruce Springsteen; I was high on gas and air at the time and was in no position to argue. He's grown up into a fine young man - caring, considerate, articulate, imaginative, go-getting...no, I'm not pushing his CV,really!

Our eldest is a Katharine. Ariel, your description was spot on. Other qualities as for her brother. [Big Grin]

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"I don't feel like smiling." "You're English dear; fake it!" (Colin Firth "Easy Virtue")
Growing Greenpatches

Posts: 4739 | From: The Kitchen | Registered: Oct 2001  |  IP: Logged
Boogie

Boogie on down!
# 13538

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quote:
Originally posted by Jengie Jon:
Edwin

Not a geek, a dapper guy whose mother insisted he went to ball room dancing. Quite possibly wears a bow tie and carries an umbrella. Eccentric yes but quite one for the ladies who believe he is harmless.

I only know one Edwin and you have described him to a T!

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Garden. Room. Walk

Posts: 13030 | From: Boogie Wonderland | Registered: Mar 2008  |  IP: Logged
Thurible
Shipmate
# 3206

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quote:
Originally posted by Chorister:
quote:
Originally posted by Aravis:
all except one of the Neils I've known have been gay.


And there was me thinking they were all called Lawrence - that's the common link around here.
No, no. You're thinking of Simon. I don't think I've ever met a straight one. (Typing that, I realise I've met precisely one straight one.)

Thurible

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"I've been baptised not lobotomised."

Posts: 8049 | Registered: Aug 2002  |  IP: Logged



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