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Source: (consider it)
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Thread: The Pie Thread
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L'organist
Shipmate
# 17338
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Posted
Firenze
We have root vegetable mash (the children call it Dead Mash, claiming the contents are anything that looks "tired"+ on the vegetable rack.
Anyway, usually potato based: if using celeriac and/or carrot start them cooking first, then add your spud. I usually put in 4-5 cloves of garlic too. Drain very well (especially if using swede) and then mash really well over a low heat with butter and at least half a teaspoon of black pepper.
If you want a really crispy topping top with a dusting of breadcrumbs and parmesan before putting in the oven.
Brilliant for supper parties: its all in the pie, no need for extra veg. All-purpose, works with chicken, Cottage (beef), Shepherd's (lamb) Babe (pork) or Bambi (venison) pies.
For FISH PIE I use straight mash: on top of the fish mixture (which has a few prawns or scallops if entertaining) I put a layer of mashed hard-boiled egg, then a layer of chopped spinach or chard before the potato.
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Posts: 4950 | From: somewhere in England... | Registered: Sep 2012
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no prophet's flag is set so...
Proceed to see sea
# 15560
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Posted
Tart = a hand-held thing and you eat it all. Christmas is tart time, with the tarts among all the other dainties.
Dainty = sweet squares, not cake, like Nanaimo bars, O Henry slice, matrimonial cake (which is not cake), date squares.
Pie = gets cut into pieces and you serve it out. Mostly as the final course of a meal. Rarely not a dessert.
As for pies I like the mostest: Seasonal, as in Xmas: maple sugar pie
Other times of year: does no-one like lemon meringue, banana cream, rhubarb?
Savoury pies? only tortiere. or maybe a quiche.
What about crusts?
Do you folks make your own crusts or do you use, as we say here "store boughten" pie crusts. Me, I make boiling water pastry.
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Posts: 11498 | From: Treaty 6 territory in the nonexistant Province of Buffalo, Canada ↄ⃝' | Registered: Mar 2010
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Firenze
Ordinary decent pagan
# 619
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Posted
Thanks, L'Organist. I'm a great believer in the all-in-one meal: sort of northern lasagna.
Champ is another good topping - potato mashed with milk and butter and chopped scallions.
Posts: 17302 | From: Edinburgh | Registered: Jun 2001
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Pomona
Shipmate
# 17175
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Posted
Supper parties? Do you live in the 70s and/or Sloanesville, L'organist? ![[Razz]](tongue.gif)
Root veg mash is lovely indeed though.
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Consider the work of God: Who is able to straighten what he has bent? [Ecclesiastes 7:13]
Posts: 5319 | From: UK | Registered: Jun 2012
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Penny S
Shipmate
# 14768
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Posted
I have a bit of a problem with the nomenclature of shepherd's pie/cottage pie. I clearly remember my mother creating one of the former, mincing up the left over Sunday joint, which was beef, and explaining that the roughed up left over mashed potato represented the shepherd's hair, while, if in new potato season, the sliced left over potatoes represented tiles, thus cottage pie. (She came from Sussex, but it was Dad's family which had the shepherd in it.)
I have checked in two old recipe books, Beeton and an old Scots one, from which the joke about leaving the eyes in the sheeps head may have been derived, and both apply the name shepherd's pie to pies giving a choice of either using beef or sheepmeat (mutton or lamb). The splitting of the names by source meats appears to be more recent.
It has occurred to me that sheep meat would not normally be available to shepherds any more than to anyone else. They did not usually care for their own property, but someone else's, and having the meat would have been from theft. Unless it was the odd bits that arose at lambing time. Tails and other parts.
However, I sometimes make a variant which Marks and Spencers sold for a while. (They often have lovely products which I will go out of my way to buy, which they then stop selling. Odd that.) The meat part of the pie is lamb with mint, and the mash has fresh or frozen peas mashed in with the potatoes. Lovely.
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Lothlorien
Ship's Grandma
# 4927
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Posted
Shepherd's pie in my family has been lamb only for generations. Anything else is cottage pie. I make extra gravy with the roast and add in mint sauce and sometimes, parsley.
When grazing first stated here in 19th century, shepherds were often employed to look after the sheep. A custom brought over from other countries. Meat was definitely part of the wage, along with some rough hut in the bush.
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Posts: 9745 | From: girt by sea | Registered: Aug 2003
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Zach82
Shipmate
# 3208
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by no prophet:
Tart = a hand-held thing and you eat it all. Christmas is tart time, with the tarts among all the other dainties.
Dainty = sweet squares, not cake, like Nanaimo bars, O Henry slice, matrimonial cake (which is not cake), date squares.
Pie = gets cut into pieces and you serve it out. Mostly as the final course of a meal. Rarely not a dessert.
As for pies I like the mostest: Seasonal, as in Xmas: maple sugar pie
Other times of year: does no-one like lemon meringue, banana cream, rhubarb?
Savoury pies? only tortiere. or maybe a quiche.
What about crusts?
Do you folks make your own crusts or do you use, as we say here "store boughten" pie crusts. Me, I make boiling water pastry.
I've made a lot of pie crusts from scratch in my days, but for the life of me I can't tell the difference between my crusts and store boughten ones.
I make hot lard crusts for pork pies, of course.
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Don't give up yet, no, don't ever quit/ There's always a chance of a critical hit. Ghost Mice
Posts: 9148 | From: Boston, MA | Registered: Aug 2002
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Karl: Liberal Backslider
Shipmate
# 76
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Lothlorien:
some rough hut in the bush.
Hyuck hyuck kersnipp kersnipp arf arf etc.
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Might as well ask the bloody cat.
Posts: 17938 | From: Chesterfield | Registered: May 2001
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no prophet's flag is set so...
Proceed to see sea
# 15560
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Zach82:
I've made a lot of pie crusts from scratch in my days, but for the life of me I can't tell the difference between my crusts and store boughten ones.
I make hot lard crusts for pork pies, of course.
It's only that we then know what's gone into the crust. We never use lard. Unsalted butter, that's the thing.
For gluten free (one of our kids has Celiacs for which wheat is toxic), crumbled gluten free cookies is best, with some butter to bind it. Lard is not reliably gluten free surprisingly.
[ 28. November 2013, 23:01: Message edited by: no prophet ]
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Posts: 11498 | From: Treaty 6 territory in the nonexistant Province of Buffalo, Canada ↄ⃝' | Registered: Mar 2010
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Zach82
Shipmate
# 3208
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by no prophet:
quote:
Originally posted by Zach82:
I've made a lot of pie crusts from scratch in my days, but for the life of me I can't tell the difference between my crusts and store boughten ones.
I make hot lard crusts for pork pies, of course.
It's only that we then know what's gone into the crust. We never use lard. Unsalted butter, that's the thing.
For gluten free (one of our kids has Celiacs for which wheat is toxic), crumbled gluten free cookies is best, with some butter to bind it. Lard is not reliably gluten free surprisingly.
I cut shortening into flour, then add a couple spoonfuls ice water, just like my mother taught me. Then I switched to Pillsbury pie crust, just like my mother taught me.
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Don't give up yet, no, don't ever quit/ There's always a chance of a critical hit. Ghost Mice
Posts: 9148 | From: Boston, MA | Registered: Aug 2002
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Palimpsest
Shipmate
# 16772
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Posted
I do make or buy dessert pies for thanksgiving. I don't do well with pie crusts and I'm fonder of cobblers, grunts, slumps, buckle or boy bait.
Pumpkin pie is the classic thanksgiving dish. In New England I used to encounter squash pie as a variant. Pumpkin pie is best made with heavy cream and not condensed milk and topped with fresh whipped cream.
Apple pie is my other thanksgiving pie. Always use 3 kinds of apples.. maybe a deep dish version. It can be topped with a lattice or streusel crumb and vanilla ice cream or a slice of cheddar cheese.
I'm not a big fan of pecan pie as it is usually too sweet and I don't live in a place with good southern cooking. Pecan pies have become very expensive. The reason is that the Chinese in the last decade have developed a huge taste for American pecans ( they don't grow in China) and are buying a quarter of the US crop now.
I love a good tart lemon meringue pie. Don't care much for key lime pie and love sour cherry pie as well as blueberry pie and strawberry rhubarb pie. Custard pie and Buttermilk pie don't show up here much but one of the local chefs has a spectacular coconut cream pie with white chocolate. Peach pie here is a very short season an usually eclipsed by the various berries that are so good fresh that cooking them seems unneeded.
When I was growing up there were a few places who had Bavarian pies and more berry cream pies. They don't seem to be around here, perhaps undercooked eggs made them too dangerous.
Another rarely seen pie is a strawberry cheese pie, it's been replaced by large cheesecakes in a bunch of silly flavors.
That is all. Time to put away the turkey before my slice of pumpkin pie.
Posts: 2990 | From: Seattle WA. US | Registered: Nov 2011
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Carex
Shipmate
# 9643
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Zach82:
I spent the day making pies for tomorrow. Pecan and pumpkin. Separately.
We combine them to make Pump-Can pie. It started as a joke, then we realized it actually would work. Not as sweet as traditional pecan pie, but that is more to our liking. This year we didn't have a pie crust and decided to make it gluten-free by simply pouring it into a baking dish without a crust. Also added some grated coconut on top. The baking dishes can be covered and fit in the fridge better than a pie pan. Not that it lasts very long... between the two of us we've already eaten half of it.
Posts: 1425 | Registered: Jun 2005
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Ariston
Insane Unicorn
# 10894
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Palimpsest:
I do make or buy dessert pies for thanksgiving. I don't do well with pie crusts and I'm fonder of cobblers, grunts, slumps, buckle or boy bait.
Okay, most of those I recognize from my copy of Joy of Cooking, but "boy bait?" That's a new one by me. Google tells me it's usually made with blueberries, and, looking it over, it reminds me of Nantucket cranberry pie (which isn't a pie at all, technically, more cakeish…something)—but that's quite a name, that one.
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Posts: 6849 | From: The People's Republic of Balcones | Registered: Jan 2006
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georgiaboy
Shipmate
# 11294
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Graven Image:
Around our house it is mincemeat,cranberry, apple pie. It came about one year when I was making a mincemeat pie and did not have enough mincemeat to fill the pie shell so I added some apples, and a handful of cranberries because they were sitting on the counter. Now it is our regular holiday pie along with pumpkin for Thanksgiving.
I've (almost) always added apples to mincemeat, but had never thought of cranberries. THANK YOU!
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Posts: 1675 | From: saint meinrad, IN | Registered: Apr 2006
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L'organist
Shipmate
# 17338
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Posted
quote:
posted by Jade Constable
Supper parties? Do you live in the 70s and/or Sloanesville, L'organist?
Supper parties?? What are they? I didn't use the two words.
Unless I can time travel (don't think I can) we're in the same space-time continuum - 21st century, second decade.
Sloanesville? Not a place I know - in the USA somewhere?
FYI "Entertaining" usually means I've a house full of the children's late teens/early twenties friends. They're not in my house because we're rich or we've got the space (2 v small bedrooms, 19 yr olds in bunks from necessity, not choice) but because I see a family home as being somewhere for friends of all the family to come, not just the parents. So on rare occasions "entertaining" may mean some of my friends will sit down to eat a meal - cheaper to eat at home than in a restaurant anyway.
Do I detect some silly class slant in your post? If so, you should know that "supper parties" would NEVER be used by 100% 24 carat ABs - the correct usage is "kitchen supps"
![[Biased]](wink.gif)
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Rara temporum felicitate ubi sentire quae velis et quae sentias dicere licet
Posts: 4950 | From: somewhere in England... | Registered: Sep 2012
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Firenze
Ordinary decent pagan
# 619
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by L'organist:
quote:
posted by Jade Constable
Supper parties? Do you live in the 70s and/or Sloanesville, L'organist?
Supper parties?? What are they? I didn't use the two words.
Ah well now, you did -
quote:
Originally posted by L'organist:
Brilliant for supper parties: its all in the pie, no need for extra veg.
But I knew what you meant. (I may have fewer hulking weans around the place, but I share the approach to communal food sharing).
Posts: 17302 | From: Edinburgh | Registered: Jun 2001
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Pomona
Shipmate
# 17175
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by L'organist:
quote:
posted by Jade Constable
Supper parties? Do you live in the 70s and/or Sloanesville, L'organist?
Supper parties?? What are they? I didn't use the two words.
Unless I can time travel (don't think I can) we're in the same space-time continuum - 21st century, second decade.
Sloanesville? Not a place I know - in the USA somewhere?
FYI "Entertaining" usually means I've a house full of the children's late teens/early twenties friends. They're not in my house because we're rich or we've got the space (2 v small bedrooms, 19 yr olds in bunks from necessity, not choice) but because I see a family home as being somewhere for friends of all the family to come, not just the parents. So on rare occasions "entertaining" may mean some of my friends will sit down to eat a meal - cheaper to eat at home than in a restaurant anyway.
Do I detect some silly class slant in your post? If so, you should know that "supper parties" would NEVER be used by 100% 24 carat ABs - the correct usage is "kitchen supps"
I am of course very much teasing ![[Big Grin]](biggrin.gif)
As Firenze points out, you definitely DID mention supper parties!
(I don't think I've ever even attended a bog-standard dinner party although that's probably just my introverted dad who doesn't like lots of non-family round the house)
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Consider the work of God: Who is able to straighten what he has bent? [Ecclesiastes 7:13]
Posts: 5319 | From: UK | Registered: Jun 2012
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Firenze
Ordinary decent pagan
# 619
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Posted
Dinner parties just sort of creep up on you. There you are, spooning out spag bol to a few friends round the landlady's Formica and next thing you know it's 5 courses with different cutlery for each one and even separate glasses for the white and red.
Posts: 17302 | From: Edinburgh | Registered: Jun 2001
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L'organist
Shipmate
# 17338
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Posted
Supper parties should have read SUPER parties - but I suppose that brands me too???
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Posts: 4950 | From: somewhere in England... | Registered: Sep 2012
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Firenze
Ordinary decent pagan
# 619
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Posted
You are Jilly Cooper and I claim my £5.
Posts: 17302 | From: Edinburgh | Registered: Jun 2001
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Ariel
Shipmate
# 58
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Posted
Shepherd's pie and champagne was what Jeffrey Archer was said to have served at his dinner parties, IIRC.
Posts: 25445 | Registered: May 2001
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balaam
Making an ass of myself
# 4543
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Firenze:
Dinner parties just sort of creep up on you. There you are, spooning out spag bol to a few friends round the landlady's Formica and next thing you know it's 5 courses with different cutlery for each one and even separate glasses for the white and red.
I'd prefer the spag bol, with unmatched cutlery. There's pleasure to be got from a single course, well made. Faffing about lowers the enjoyment factor.
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Posts: 9049 | From: Hen Ogledd | Registered: May 2003
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balaam
Making an ass of myself
# 4543
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Ariel:
Shepherd's pie and champagne was what Jeffrey Archer was said to have served at his dinner parties, IIRC.
I've never been keen on Champagne. Shepherd's pie and pale ale is another matter. Yum.
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Posts: 9049 | From: Hen Ogledd | Registered: May 2003
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Firenze
Ordinary decent pagan
# 619
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by balaam:
I've never been keen on Champagne.
Oh goody. Can I have your share?
The greater part of what I cook is one course meals, but sometimes it's fun to push the boat out. And if you're going to drink something extraordinary - I'm thinking of a 1944 Setúbal - it needs a build up.
Posts: 17302 | From: Edinburgh | Registered: Jun 2001
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Angel Wrestler
Ship's Hipster
# 13673
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Pulsator Organorum Ineptus:
A pie has to have pastry base, sides and top.
If it doesn't have pastry on top, it's a tart, or maybe a flan, but definitely not a pie.
If it only has pastry on top and not underneath and at the sides, there isn't a name for it and it belongs in the dustbin.
Steak and kidney gets my vote every time.
[/B] [B]If it doesn't have pastry on top, it's a tart, or maybe a flan, but definitely not a pie.
Yes it does; it's called cobbler!
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(unknown)
Posts: 2767 | From: half-way up the ladder | Registered: May 2008
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Angel Wrestler
Ship's Hipster
# 13673
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Posted
quote:
Do you folks make your own crusts or do you use, as we say here "store boughten" pie crusts.
I make a mean pie crust! Flaky and just right. However, I promise you that I simply cannot make a crust without slinging flour everywhere! Therefore, I now buy crusts. The roll-out kind where the canned refrigerated biscuits are (such as Pillsbury) is actually ok. Not as good as mine, but mine - er - WERE better than most, if I do say so, myself, and the roll-out refrigerated kind are as good as most others' pie crusts. ... the only part of baking I ever had a knack for was pie crusts.
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The fact that no one understands you does not make you an artist.
(unknown)
Posts: 2767 | From: half-way up the ladder | Registered: May 2008
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Palimpsest
Shipmate
# 16772
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Ariston:
quote:
Originally posted by Palimpsest:
I do make or buy dessert pies for thanksgiving. I don't do well with pie crusts and I'm fonder of cobblers, grunts, slumps, buckle or boy bait.
Okay, most of those I recognize from my copy of Joy of Cooking, but "boy bait?" That's a new one by me. Google tells me it's usually made with blueberries, and, looking it over, it reminds me of Nantucket cranberry pie (which isn't a pie at all, technically, more cakeish…something)—but that's quite a name, that one.
Blueberry Boy Bait, a coffee cake with blueberries, was the winner of the national Pillsbury bakeoff one year. The girl who won with the recipe said boys found it irresistible.
Posts: 2990 | From: Seattle WA. US | Registered: Nov 2011
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Ariel
Shipmate
# 58
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Posted
Ah. I thought when you said "a coffee cake" you meant a cake made with coffee flavourings (which is something I like a lot). But the recipe doesn't call for any. I assume you mean a cake to have with your coffee... I haven't seen that distinction used over here, cake is cake, mostly with either tea or coffee and a lot less usually as the end of a meal.
Posts: 25445 | Registered: May 2001
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Firenze
Ordinary decent pagan
# 619
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Posted
The constituent bits of the game pie are currently thawing. My proposed MO will be stew the meat with onion, carrot, juniper berries in a rather nice Spanish red for, what, 45 minutes? Slap on a puff pastry lid and an egg wash and 25 in a hot oven. That sound about right?
Posts: 17302 | From: Edinburgh | Registered: Jun 2001
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Moo
Ship's tough old bird
# 107
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Ariel:
Ah. I thought when you said "a coffee cake" you meant a cake made with coffee flavourings (which is something I like a lot). But the recipe doesn't call for any. I assume you mean a cake to have with your coffee... I haven't seen that distinction used over here, cake is cake, mostly with either tea or coffee and a lot less usually as the end of a meal.
As you suggest, a coffee cake is usually served with coffee. Unlike ordinary cake, it is frequently served for breakfast; it is not normally served at the end of a meal. It may have a glaze on top, but never thick frosting.
Moo
[ 30. November 2013, 13:11: Message edited by: Moo ]
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Kerygmania host
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See you later, alligator.
Posts: 20365 | From: Alleghany Mountains of Virginia | Registered: May 2001
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Lyda*Rose
Ship's broken porthole
# 4544
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Posted
Cinnamon-brown crumbles on top is a favorite on coffee cakes.
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Posts: 21377 | From: CA | Registered: May 2003
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balaam
Making an ass of myself
# 4543
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Moo:
quote:
Originally posted by Ariel:
Ah. I thought when you said "a coffee cake" you meant a cake made with coffee flavourings (which is something I like a lot). But the recipe doesn't call for any. I assume you mean a cake to have with your coffee... I haven't seen that distinction used over here, cake is cake, mostly with either tea or coffee and a lot less usually as the end of a meal.
As you suggest, a coffee cake is usually served with coffee. Unlike ordinary cake, it is frequently served for breakfast; it is not normally served at the end of a meal. It may have a glaze on top, but never thick frosting.
Moo
Yet another pond difference. East of the Atlantic coffee cake contains coffee.
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Posts: 9049 | From: Hen Ogledd | Registered: May 2003
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Palimpsest
Shipmate
# 16772
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Posted
That's an interesting difference. By coffee cake I did mean a cake for eating with coffee. It often has a marbling of brown sugar and cinnamon and is covered with a crumb topping. I think it's originally German or Dutch in origin and frequently has a lot of butter. It's usually considered a breakfast pastry.
When I was in high school, there was a German Delicatessen at the terminal stop of my bus before I had to climb a very steep hill to School. They made a variant which had apple slices mixed in the crumbs. The odd thing was that the topping was burnt black. It was a little odd to come in every day and see a new burnt cake.
Posts: 2990 | From: Seattle WA. US | Registered: Nov 2011
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