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Source: (consider it)
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Thread: Rev. BBC2
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rolyn
Shipmate
# 16840
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Cartmel Veteran:
My only real problem with the show this week is that Adam never stands up to Colin.
I guess Adam hasn't forgotten the drunken head-butt he received at Christmas the one time when he did try and remonstrate with Colin .
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Change is the only certainty of existence
Posts: 3206 | From: U.K. | Registered: Dec 2011
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Cartmel Veteran
Shipmate
# 7049
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Schroedinger's cat:
Hmm. I think he chooses his battles. He does sometimes stand up to people. But there is no point in trying to argue with Colin. Adam tolerates him, because challenging him throws up too many issues.
The problem with Adam (or anyone else) taking that approach is that by doing so you give tacit approval to the offensive behaviour. By not standing up to Colin this week, it looked like Adam approved of running that bloke off church grounds.
I've seen plenty of this in the real world. Someone says something stupid to vicar, vicar remains silent, and later you hear "the vicar agrees with me when I say..."
I know that's part of what makes the show what it is, and Adam what he is. And so it doesn't so much annoy me on TV as when people do it in the real world. ![[Smile]](smile.gif)
Posts: 1041 | From: Dorset | Registered: May 2004
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Schroedinger's cat
Ship's cool cat
# 64
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Posted
And Adam also gets to snog Lucy Liemann and Olivia Coleman.
What I would give for that......
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Blog
Music for your enjoyment
Lord may all my hard times be healing times
take out this broken heart and renew my mind.
Posts: 18859 | From: At the bottom of a deep dark well. | Registered: May 2001
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rolyn
Shipmate
# 16840
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Posted
Adam's brief intimacy with Ellie did say a lot about vicars who fall off the fidelity wagon .
I should imagine it's a very difficult line to toe for vicars who have regular contact with vulnerable folk.
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Change is the only certainty of existence
Posts: 3206 | From: U.K. | Registered: Dec 2011
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Pyx_e
Quixotic Tilter
# 57
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by rolyn:
Adam's brief intimacy with Ellie did say a lot about vicars who fall off the fidelity wagon .
I should imagine it's a very difficult line to toe for vicars who have regular contact with vulnerable folk.
Not really, one of little known the perks of ordination is sex-pot partners who keep us satiated.
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It is better to be Kind than right.
Posts: 9778 | From: The Dark Tower | Registered: May 2001
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rolyn
Shipmate
# 16840
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Posted
I'm comforted to learn that .
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Change is the only certainty of existence
Posts: 3206 | From: U.K. | Registered: Dec 2011
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Jemima the 9th
Shipmate
# 15106
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Posted
You know this business about David Cameron saying Britain is a Christian country? I really hope (though I doubt) he means Britain is a lot like Rev. You know, sweary, people being crap but trying to be better, and sometimes the grace of God seems to break in.
Posts: 801 | From: UK | Registered: Sep 2009
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Nenya
Shipmate
# 16427
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Posted
I am. Have only seen one episode previously (the one with the statue) and been unimpressed but giving it another go as I'm sure I'm missing something.
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They told me I was delusional. I nearly fell off my unicorn.
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Miss Madrigal
Shipmate
# 15528
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Posted
There are mornings when I would appreciate the officiant taking Archdeacon Robert's approach to the liturgy.
Posts: 79 | From: The Bit In The Middle | Registered: Mar 2010
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Auntie Doris
Screen Goddess
# 9433
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Posted
I'm watching. Think it is quite a sad episode this week.
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"And you don't get to pronounce that I am not a Christian. Nope. Not in your remit nor power." - iGeek in response to a gay-hater :)
The life and times of a Guernsey cow
Posts: 6019 | From: The Rock at the Centre of the Universe | Registered: May 2005
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Auntie Doris
Screen Goddess
# 9433
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Posted
What was the beautiful piece of music that was being played as Adam was walking down the street with the cross?
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"And you don't get to pronounce that I am not a Christian. Nope. Not in your remit nor power." - iGeek in response to a gay-hater :)
The life and times of a Guernsey cow
Posts: 6019 | From: The Rock at the Centre of the Universe | Registered: May 2005
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Miss Madrigal
Shipmate
# 15528
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Posted
Nodded sadly as the bishop washed his hands.
Posts: 79 | From: The Bit In The Middle | Registered: Mar 2010
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Nenya
Shipmate
# 16427
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Posted
I still think I'm missing something... Is it trying to say clergy often feel as though they're walking the way of the cross in an exact way like that?
Nen - feeling obtuse.
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They told me I was delusional. I nearly fell off my unicorn.
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Jemima the 9th
Shipmate
# 15106
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Posted
They were a bit heavy handed with the imagery (Colin denying Adam 3 times before the car alarm went off) but it was still wonderful. And they made me cry, the buggers.
I missed the critical bit with Liam Neeson on the hill, cos the baby woke up!
Posts: 801 | From: UK | Registered: Sep 2009
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Nenya
Shipmate
# 16427
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Posted
Please explain to me why it was wonderful... ![[Confused]](confused.gif) ![[Frown]](frown.gif)
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They told me I was delusional. I nearly fell off my unicorn.
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St Everild
Shipmate
# 3626
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Auntie Doris:
What was the beautiful piece of music that was being played as Adam was walking down the street with the cross?
Pie Jesu from Faures "Requiem"
Posts: 1782 | From: Bethnei | Registered: Dec 2002
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Hairy Biker
Shipmate
# 12086
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Posted
Loved it. It's all a bit in the wrong order - but stripping the altar and leaving the church in darkness and silence at the end... perfect.
Are we in for a happy ending do you think?
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there [are] four important things in life: religion, love, art and science. At their best, they’re all just tools to help you find a path through the darkness. None of them really work that well, but they help.
Damien Hirst
Posts: 683 | From: This Sceptred Isle | Registered: Nov 2006
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Miss Madrigal
Shipmate
# 15528
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Posted
Nenya, there's a whole heap of back story coming together which makes tonight's story so wonderful. Adam Smallbone had been beset on all sides by the hierarchy of the church, his congregation, his fellow clergy and his own failings. Tonight he reached the bedrock of his faith. I've never been in the same place as that character, but I recognise the feeling. To get that from a regular series broadcast on national television is indeed a wonder.
Posts: 79 | From: The Bit In The Middle | Registered: Mar 2010
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Kitten
Shipmate
# 1179
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Posted
I found it very moving and was fighting back the tears
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Maius intra qua extra
Never accept a ride from a stranger, unless they are in a big blue box
Posts: 2330 | From: Carmarthenshire | Registered: Aug 2001
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Jemima the 9th
Shipmate
# 15106
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Posted
Nenya - I find it wonderful as a series because it rings very true with my (non clergy person) experience of church. The people who sweep in asking about how we're going to "BE church" as a cover for cutting - I might have mentioned that before. The endless initiatives. The people who aren't perfect - in fact they're a bit rubbish but they try to be better. The prayers. The way Adam tried to justify his behaviour. Adam & Alex's relationship seems fairly real to me. Having to get on with people in the church who drive you a bit crazy.
Not all of it makes me laugh, but a lot of it is familiar. And the sometimes desperate hanging on to a dwindling faith, with all the doubts.
Er, perhaps I read more into it than is really there! ![[Hot and Hormonal]](icon_redface.gif)
[Sorry I cross posted with lots of people!]
[ 21. April 2014, 21:45: Message edited by: Jemima the 9th ]
Posts: 801 | From: UK | Registered: Sep 2009
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Jemima the 9th
Shipmate
# 15106
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Posted
No I don't think there'll be a happy ending - at least I think St Saviour's will close.
Posts: 801 | From: UK | Registered: Sep 2009
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Nenya
Shipmate
# 16427
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Posted
Thanks, MissM and Jemima.
I'll just head for bed, I think.
Edited as some cross-posting.
[ 21. April 2014, 21:48: Message edited by: Nenya ]
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They told me I was delusional. I nearly fell off my unicorn.
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Panda
Shipmate
# 2951
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Posted
*sniff*
Continued when, though? Are the rumours of a film true?
Posts: 1637 | From: North Wales | Registered: Jun 2002
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tessaB
Shipmate
# 8533
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Posted
I could totally get behind a God who looks like Liam Neeson.
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tessaB
eating chocolate to the glory of God
Holiday cottage near Rye
Posts: 1068 | From: U.K. | Registered: Sep 2004
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betjemaniac
Shipmate
# 17618
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Posted
That was genuinely one of the best 30 mins of television I've seen for a very long time.
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And is it true? For if it is....
Posts: 1481 | From: behind the dreaming spires | Registered: Mar 2013
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Kitten
Shipmate
# 1179
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Panda:
*sniff*
Continued when, though? Are the rumours of a film true?
Next week, episode 6
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Maius intra qua extra
Never accept a ride from a stranger, unless they are in a big blue box
Posts: 2330 | From: Carmarthenshire | Registered: Aug 2001
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betjemaniac
Shipmate
# 17618
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Panda:
*sniff*
Continued when, though? Are the rumours of a film true?
2200 next Monday presumably, given that was episode 5 of 6...
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And is it true? For if it is....
Posts: 1481 | From: behind the dreaming spires | Registered: Mar 2013
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Panda
Shipmate
# 2951
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Posted
Alrighty! I'd miscounted and thought we were at the end. My TV listings didn't say anything helpful like 5/6 after the episode, and then when they started selling the box set during the credits I assumed that was the last.
Posts: 1637 | From: North Wales | Registered: Jun 2002
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Niminypiminy
Shipmate
# 15489
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by betjemaniac:
That was genuinely one of the best 30 mins of television I've seen for a very long time.
Absobloodylutely.
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Lives of the Saints: songs by The Unequal Struggle
http://www.theunequalstruggle.com/
Posts: 776 | From: Edge of the Fens | Registered: Feb 2010
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lapsed heathen
Hurler on the ditch
# 4403
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Posted
Hmmmmm, imagery a bit heavy handed but then again the audience their aiming for might need that.
I thought it was excellent, a superb culmination of the series. All the episodes up to this seemed to come together really well as we walked with Adam along the road carting his cross. I know he brought it on himself but that's kinda the point. We are not capable of it alone and without faith we can't find our way.
The writing in this is so good, lots of lovely small throw away lines that entertain, characters that seem real and a story with a beginning, middle and end.
Clever enough to amuse those of us who get the in jokes and specific observations, without becoming too self aware that it looses it primary purpose, telling a story.
Some times TV is just good and sometimes it's better than good. This is one of the latter times.
Can you tell I'm a fan!
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"We are the Easter people and our song is Alleluia"
Posts: 1361 | From: Marble county | Registered: Apr 2003
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lapsed heathen
Hurler on the ditch
# 4403
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Posted
Oh yeah and they did mention pre booking series 3!
Happy out!
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"We are the Easter people and our song is Alleluia"
Posts: 1361 | From: Marble county | Registered: Apr 2003
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Pia
Shipmate
# 17277
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Posted
Gosh... Doesn't bode well for Nigel though...
Posts: 151 | Registered: Aug 2012
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quetzalcoatl
Shipmate
# 16740
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Posted
Magnificent TV, awesome. The way they balance between comedy and serious is very good; what is funny is also semi-tragic. Loved Liam Neeson as God.
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I can't talk to you today; I talked to two people yesterday.
Posts: 9878 | From: UK | Registered: Oct 2011
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Cartmel Veteran
Shipmate
# 7049
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Pyx_e:
Not really, one of little known the perks of ordination is sex-pot partners who keep us satiated.
I didn't realise it was an official role I had in my parish. I shall have to put "sex-pot partner" on my business card now.
[ 21. April 2014, 22:59: Message edited by: Cartmel Veteran ]
Posts: 1041 | From: Dorset | Registered: May 2004
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ExclamationMark
Shipmate
# 14715
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Chorister:
Another great episode which was, again, even in Creamtealand (rural idyll?!) very true to life. These issues really happen in parishes (although they don't usually all happen at once in the same parish!).
A mere 20 miles or so away from you yet my perspective on Rev is that it is nothing like life in Creamtealand. Perhaps different away from the moor???
It's becoming for rather a caricature with its causes and inability to address some serious issues (pastoral irresponsibility particularly).
Posts: 3845 | From: A new Jerusalem | Registered: Apr 2009
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Cartmel Veteran
Shipmate
# 7049
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by ExclamationMark:
It's becoming for rather a caricature with its causes and inability to address some serious issues (pastoral irresponsibility particularly).
Rev is not a show designed to be a back-slapping exercise for members of the CofE. It's not the official vicar-procedural television show of Anglicanism. Thank goodness.
Posts: 1041 | From: Dorset | Registered: May 2004
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rolyn
Shipmate
# 16840
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Kitten:
I found it very moving and was fighting back the tears
I was alright watching the episode.
This morning though , reflecting on the bit where Adam carried the cross through the street of drunks and revellers , then falling over while hallucinating ? OK , I too was filling up, and is was impossible to tell this feeling was one of joy or sadness.
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Change is the only certainty of existence
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Spike
Mostly Harmless
# 36
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Posted
A few people seem to be taking the show too seriously or too literally. If it were being presented as a serious drama, then I'd be picking holes in it for wild factual inaccuracies, but it's not a serious drama, neither is it supposed to be. I see it more like a cartoon where the people and situations are exaggerated.
Of course the characters a caricatures - that's what makes it such a great programme. Archdeacon Robert is a classic pantomime villain (two archdeacons of my acquaintance both say he's their favourite character. I suspect they secretly want to be like him). Characters such as Adoha, Colin and Mick are rather grotesque caricatures of real people I'm sure many of us have met and I see each of those characters as several people all rolled into one.
As for the storylines, it's been well documented that a lot of the situations portrayed are based on real events although, as Chorister pointed out upthread, for all these things to happen at the same time, in the same place and to the same person would be extremely unusual, but they do happen.
Even if the storylines aren't 100% accurate they still highlight important issues. In last night's episode, the scene where Adam walks into the church to discover the Area Dean and Diocesan Secretary measuring up and calculating the value of the building was extremely far fetched to say the least, yet it demonstrated the insensitivity often shown by the church hierarchy in difficult situations and the entire episode (but particularly the meetings Adam had with the Archdeacon and the Bishop) really brought home a complaint I often hear about the lack of any decent pastoral care for the clergy when their lives are turning into shit.
I liken Rev to the Dilbert cartoons I used to follow religiously in my previous life as a database programmer. I knew Dilbert wasn't real, but could identify with every single character and situation. Those who don't get Rev are either missing the point of what it's supposed to be, or live in a different world.
ETA: And yes, last night's episode almost had me in tears as well.
[ 22. April 2014, 11:21: Message edited by: Spike ]
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"May you get to heaven before the devil knows you're dead" - Irish blessing
Posts: 12860 | From: The Valley of Crocuses | Registered: May 2001
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Matt Black
Shipmate
# 2210
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Posted
Found it very moving
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"Protestant and Reformed, according to the Tradition of the ancient Catholic Church" - + John Cosin (1594-1672)
Posts: 14304 | From: Hampshire, UK | Registered: Jan 2002
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quetzalcoatl
Shipmate
# 16740
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Posted
I admire the script-writers, as they could have settled for a pretty funny series, with good actors, but they have taken it to a darker place, which gives it added depth. Comedies about vicars have often been quite cosy really; this isn't.
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I can't talk to you today; I talked to two people yesterday.
Posts: 9878 | From: UK | Registered: Oct 2011
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The Great Gumby
Ship's Brain Surgeon
# 10989
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Posted
Just hopping back to this...
quote:
Originally posted by Lord Jestocost:
I couldn't quite buy Colin being on the PCC, but I suppose he's a better choice than Mick and they had to have someone.
Of course. St Saviour's isn't just the sort of place where the PCC is anyone who's mad enough to be on it (which is most churches), but more like the kind of place where they'll literally have anyone to make it less embarrassingly small, and it ends up consisting of the same few people who are the core of a meagre congregation. I've known stranger PCC members than Colin.
Now, as for this week - the symbolism was a little OTT for my taste, especially towards the end, but could be forgiven for a more general audience. It wouldn't surprise me in the least to find out that the figures being quoted for the property value of St Saviour's were based on a quick check online for the current cost of 30 pieces of silver.
I don't know what to make of the early morning vision on the bench, especially coming after a long series of obvious hallucinations. I was happy for it to be left hanging, but didn't feel that it fitted very well for Adam to then claim to have seen God. I'm now hoping that the same mysterious character turns up again in a more normal context, because that moment and his interpretation don't seem to sit very well with Adam's usual brand of faith, doubt and general humanity. I hope they tread carefully.
I thought from quite early in the series that we seemed to be heading for a downbeat and pretty final conclusion, but the narrative arc now seems to demand something at least partly uplifting. I suspect Adam's going to give it all up and find a job where he can be happy and make a difference. I can't decide whether he'll end up as a contented pew-filler or someone who feels he needs to walk away completely, but he'll probably feel more comfortable in his own skin either way.
I really hope they don't make it completely happy and lovely, though, because that wouldn't strike the right note.
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The first principle is that you must not fool yourself, and you are the easiest person to fool. - Richard Feynman
A letter to my son about death
Posts: 5382 | From: Home for shot clergy spouses | Registered: Feb 2006
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Amika
Shipmate
# 15785
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Posted
I didn't like the 'meeting with God' part, not least because 'God' initially spouted a series of trite sayings. The whole scene came across as trite to me.
There is a depth of sadness in this series (more than the previous ones, even) that doesn't look like it will be assuaged. Thank goodness for the Archdeacon, definitely my favourite character. I don't see him as a 'baddie', but more of an ambivalent character, and we're never quite sure whether he's on Adam's side or not. He seems to take pleasure in his discomfiture while secretly supporting him - or that's how I see it.
Either way, it's an excellent series, a different kind of comedy from the run-of-the-mill we mostly get these days.
Posts: 147 | From: Ingerland | Registered: Aug 2010
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leo
Shipmate
# 1458
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Amika:
I didn't like the 'meeting with God' part, not least because 'God' initially spouted a series of trite sayings....... the Archdeacon, definitely my favourite character. I don't see him as a 'baddie', but more of an ambivalent character, and we're never quite sure whether he's on Adam's side or not.
Maybe vicars make God in their own image - vicars tend to come out with trite sayings.
And the archdeacon - a bit like God - you never know if her is on your side or not.
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My Jewish-positive lectionary blog is at http://recognisingjewishrootsinthelectionary.wordpress.com/
My reviews at http://layreadersbookreviews.wordpress.com
Posts: 23198 | From: Bristol | Registered: Oct 2001
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Schroedinger's cat
Ship's cool cat
# 64
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Posted
That was very powerful. Actually, coming over the Easter weekend, it served as my Easter bout of religion.
The imagery was overdone, but that is the nature of drama - it is all overdone, to a degree. But it was powerful - it was not overdone to the point of being parody, but to the point of intensity instead.
What also struck me is that, throughout, we have assumed that somehow the church would be saved. I mean, it is an important community, doing some good work. The shocker is that the church has not survived. However good and important the work is, the church has closed.
I am also struck by the fact that it is Nigels complaint that has closed his church, and he will probably be the one most deeply affected by this.
Will there be resurrection? I suspect there will be, for Adam, but not for the church. That seems to be the theme this series - Adam can survive, but over and against the church system, not with it.
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Blog
Music for your enjoyment
Lord may all my hard times be healing times
take out this broken heart and renew my mind.
Posts: 18859 | From: At the bottom of a deep dark well. | Registered: May 2001
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betjemaniac
Shipmate
# 17618
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Schroedinger's cat:
What also struck me is that, throughout, we have assumed that somehow the church would be saved. I mean, it is an important community, doing some good work. The shocker is that the church has not survived. However good and important the work is, the church has closed.
Weeeell, maybe. Although, noting as you did the heaviness of the symbolism, I'd say those closed doors at the end last night are just waiting to be flung open to let the light through the windows again....
We shall see, anyway.
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And is it true? For if it is....
Posts: 1481 | From: behind the dreaming spires | Registered: Mar 2013
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Schroedinger's cat
Ship's cool cat
# 64
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Posted
It may not be the conclusion, but for now, the church has closed. We are left at the end of Ep 5 with the church closed, despite all that it does. And this having had a valuation of 6M.
Yes, I suspect that there will be something more next week. While I don't think it is the end of the church, I think it does serve as an ending, however temporary.
Given where the church they use for filming is, the land is in very high demand. I suspect that the land - irrespective of the presence of a building - would easily fetch 10M. Somewhere, you have to justify maintaining a location like this at a cost of half a million per congregation member.
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Blog
Music for your enjoyment
Lord may all my hard times be healing times
take out this broken heart and renew my mind.
Posts: 18859 | From: At the bottom of a deep dark well. | Registered: May 2001
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Chorister
Completely Frocked
# 473
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Panda:
Alrighty! I'd miscounted and thought we were at the end.
That's what people thought on Good Friday, too.
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Retired, sitting back and watching others for a change.
Posts: 34626 | From: Cream Tealand | Registered: Jun 2001
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