homepage
  roll on christmas  
click here to find out more about ship of fools click here to sign up for the ship of fools newsletter click here to support ship of fools
community the mystery worshipper gadgets for god caption competition foolishness features ship stuff
discussion boards live chat cafe avatars frequently-asked questions the ten commandments gallery private boards register for the boards
 
Ship of Fools


Post new thread  Post a reply
My profile login | | Directory | Search | FAQs | Board home
   - Printer-friendly view Next oldest thread   Next newest thread
» Ship of Fools   »   » Oblivion   » What gets in the way of pastoral care in church?

 - Email this page to a friend or enemy.    
Source: (consider it) Thread: What gets in the way of pastoral care in church?
nouwen
Shipmate
# 3103

 - Posted      Profile for nouwen     Send new private message       Edit/delete post   Reply with quote 
Apologies if this has already been asked here, or elsewhere...

What gets in the way of pastoral care within a church community? For example, my church are really active within our local community which is reflected in the numbers of new people coming along. But once they are in through the doors, folk tend to get overlooked and the nurture and care seems absent. I can't put my finger on it, other than to say that the church is massively busy and they are always 'doing' rather than being.

Has anyone else had this experience and if so, how do you address the balance and what actually is pastoral care anyway?

--------------------
Speaking the truth is not the same as being negative.

Posts: 477 | From: Oxford | Registered: Jul 2002  |  IP: Logged
Olaf
Shipmate
# 11804

 - Posted      Profile for Olaf     Send new private message       Edit/delete post   Reply with quote 
We had one pastor in our past who was excellent at pastoral care. When he wasn't visiting shut-ins or meeting, he would actually walk the streets in increasing circles around the church, to ask what he could do for them. Then he got us to help him as well. It was really successful, in terms of worship attendance.

What gave him this time? He accepted our help. We made the service bulletins, we put together the newsletter, we cleaned the church, etc.

In other pastorates, I have seen it where the pastor is so bogged down with responsibilities that could easily be delegated that s/he cannot do anything else but office tasks. Sometimes this is by choice, other times by necessity. It is unfortunate, really.

Yes, pastoral care does fall on all of us, but many people who receive the care seem to prefer it to come from the "official."

Posts: 8953 | From: Ad Midwestem | Registered: Sep 2006  |  IP: Logged
Lamb Chopped
Ship's kebab
# 5528

 - Posted      Profile for Lamb Chopped   Email Lamb Chopped   Send new private message       Edit/delete post   Reply with quote 
It helps if you have a pastor* who is genuinely fond of people, who likes to be around people, who is a people person. That makes it natural for them to do a lot of face-to-face visitation, conversation, phone calls, texting, what have you. Mr. L is one of these people,though I am not (by nature, anyway). He would gladly live in a shopping mall kiosk with people streaming by 24/7. That would drive me insane. But he thrives on it, he gets recharged by all the personal contact--and the benefit to the church is that people feel noticed, heard, cared for. And to many of us, that = love. There's just nothing can replace human contact.

* /staff person/dedicated volunteer(s)... I'm aware that not all pastors have this gift. But if a pastor does NOT have this gift, that pastor is responsible for making sure that someone else is covering that need.

This subject hits a sore spot for me right now, because I've come to the conclusion that our host congregation's lead pastors are just never, ever, EVER going to clue in about pastoral care. They have other interests, other gifts, yay. But there's a steady stream of hurting people who don't get a phone call, don't get on the prayer list, don't get a hello-how-are-you on Sunday, etc. who are simply walking right out the door. Hopefully to another church, but we can't be sure of that, can we?

I mean, if you know that a woman's husband has just left her for a new lover, for gosh sakes don't just ignore the situation and pretend nothing has happened. She is in pain. At least say "hi" and put out feelers to see if she wants to talk. (She did. Desperately. They didn't. We did instead.)

If one of your own elders is talking very publicly about feeling like he doesn't belong and maybe it's time to move on, that means a pastor or leader ought to at least pick up the phone. They didn't. We talked to them (their son played with ours, the usual). They found another church.

If your very own ethnic pastor, pastor's wife, and the whole ethnic church mysteriously vanishes during Holy Week services, and then resurfaces in much-diminished and distracted form for the next two Sundays, surely that ought to be noticeable? Rate a "what's going on?" from somebody in leadership?

I had emergency surgery on Good Friday evening, forcing a sudden cancellation of Vietnamese worship and the complete brain-freeze of my husband the ethnic pastor for the next ten days. Doubtless he should have told the host pastors. I should have told them, after I got out of ICU. But we never thought of it, because we've never seen a caring response and it no longer even occurs to us to notify them. And this time, as usual, they never noticed we were missing. The whole bunch of us.

They finally found out when my young son asked for prayer for me the first Sunday I got home (no, they didn't pray either, don't know if they forgot or assumed that "Mom's back home" referred to the end of some embarrassing marital spat not to be mentioned during public worship). They then asked me, in passing at the church door, what was meant. I told them.

Did I get added to the prayer list? Of course not.

This kind of thing hurts like hell. And yet we haven't found any way to re-educate these people, though we've tried, explicitly, in private meetings. Nothing.

We're now hoping for their speedy retirement and the calling of a pastor who notices something other than programs.

--------------------
Er, this is what I've been up to (book).
Oh, that you would rend the heavens and come down!

Posts: 20059 | From: off in left field somewhere | Registered: Feb 2004  |  IP: Logged
Baptist Trainfan
Shipmate
# 15128

 - Posted      Profile for Baptist Trainfan   Email Baptist Trainfan   Send new private message       Edit/delete post   Reply with quote 
Ouch. I'm sure we all feel for you. But your post does raise another point.

You mention your "lead pastors" - which suggests that you have multiple pastors. In such a situation I would expect one of those to be a "Pastoral Pastor" with the requisite gifts - but it sounds more as if they are clones of one another with similar gifts. So, IMO, there has been a fault in appointing here: two or more ministers should (I would have thought) be chosen for having complementary rather than duplicated skill.

In most churches I know, there is only one Pastor - indeed, s/he may have more than one church to serve. The question then comes: what gifts are the church looking for, and how will they fill any deficit in them? For instance, it strikes me that a traditional minister is expected to lead worship, preach, do the Pastoral stuff, lead committees and carry out the admin. It's just unrealistic (and a denial of St. Paul's teaching on gifting within the church) to expect one person to be good at all these things.

For instance, I am a good worship leader but not a good Pastor. The church knew that when they appointed me - my predecessor was a fantastic Pastor but his services were pretty dire by all accounts. This isn't to say that I don't try to do my best (I did an emergency visit just yesterday, and another on Friday). But we have a team of lay visitors to do the routine stuff (and that goes back a long way) One Minister could never do all the "pastoring" alone.

Posts: 9750 | From: The other side of the Severn | Registered: Sep 2009  |  IP: Logged
South Coast Kevin
Shipmate
# 16130

 - Posted      Profile for South Coast Kevin   Author's homepage     Send new private message       Edit/delete post   Reply with quote 
My church's last two Sunday talks have been all about the multi-faceted gifting and equipping that you folks are talking about, with specific reference to the Ephesians 4 passage about the 'equipping gifts' of apostles, prophets, evangelists, pastors and teachers.

So my contribution to answering nouwen's question is that churches need to recognise that pastoral care (like apostling, prophesying, evangelism and teaching) is everyone's job, and also that those with a strong pastoral gift need to encourage it in others rather than solely doing the pastoring themselves.

--------------------
My blog - wondering about Christianity in the 21st century, chess, music, politics and other bits and bobs.

Posts: 3309 | From: The south coast (of England) | Registered: Jan 2011  |  IP: Logged
MrsBeaky
Shipmate
# 17663

 - Posted      Profile for MrsBeaky   Author's homepage   Email MrsBeaky   Send new private message       Edit/delete post   Reply with quote 
quote:
Originally posted by nouwen:

What gets in the way of pastoral care within a church community? For example, my church are really active within our local community which is reflected in the numbers of new people coming along. But once they are in through the doors, folk tend to get overlooked and the nurture and care seems absent. I can't put my finger on it, other than to say that the church is massively busy and they are always 'doing' rather than being.

I honestly believe that a lot of this is personality driven. A church can have a corporate personality derived from the leaders, be they priests/ ministers/ elders/ leadership team etc. So a church made up of people who are very active in the community as stated above often have little time left over for inward care unless that is part of the "personality".

There are also other factors to consider. Firstly what does pastoral care look like? Is it visitation, time spent listening, advising, taking communion to the housebound, prayer, practical help to name but a few? My experience is that there are different expectations amongst different church traditions.I agree with SCK that all the members of a church community can and should be willing to care for one another in a variety of ways. But I also know that there are some people who only count it as "pastoral" if some one with the right label (see above) does the caring.....

Finally we can so easily raise false expectations by promising what we cannot deliver so I've learned the hard to be very careful in both giving/ receiving offers of help and support to avoid adding to disappointment!

All of that aside, if we all aspire to love expressed in word and deed perhaps we still stand a chance of getting pastoral care right? Or perhaps despite my age, I'm still hopelessly naive....

--------------------
"It is better to be kind than right."

http://davidandlizacooke.wordpress.com

Posts: 693 | From: UK/ Kenya | Registered: Apr 2013  |  IP: Logged
South Coast Kevin
Shipmate
# 16130

 - Posted      Profile for South Coast Kevin   Author's homepage     Send new private message       Edit/delete post   Reply with quote 
quote:
Originally posted by MrsBeaky:
...I also know that there are some people who only count it as "pastoral" if some one with the right label (see above) does the caring.....

Yes, sadly... I know it's a difficult and delicate issue but I think this attitude should be strongly resisted, rather than indulged. IMO such attitudes are fundamentally in opposition to the 'we are all ministers' concept that runs through the whole of the New Testament. It's also unrealistic and unjust to place such burdens on those people with that 'right label'.

--------------------
My blog - wondering about Christianity in the 21st century, chess, music, politics and other bits and bobs.

Posts: 3309 | From: The south coast (of England) | Registered: Jan 2011  |  IP: Logged
Lamb Chopped
Ship's kebab
# 5528

 - Posted      Profile for Lamb Chopped   Email Lamb Chopped   Send new private message       Edit/delete post   Reply with quote 
quote:
Originally posted by Baptist Trainfan:
Ouch. I'm sure we all feel for you. But your post does raise another point.

You mention your "lead pastors" - which suggests that you have multiple pastors. In such a situation I would expect one of those to be a "Pastoral Pastor" with the requisite gifts - but it sounds more as if they are clones of one another with similar gifts. So, IMO, there has been a fault in appointing here: two or more ministers should (I would have thought) be chosen for having complementary rather than duplicated skill.

Right. that was what I was alluding to in my footnote. You want to have somebody in the mix (staff, volunteer, whatever) who has caring/people gifts. And at least in our tradition, it's the pastor's responsibility to see to it that that happens, however it happens. That may mean pushing the church council about it (to seek out/fund/call a staff person so gifted, I mean), it may mean identifying lay leaders and sending them off for training, whatever. But the pastor is the one who ultimately bears responsibility for making sure it happens somehow, whether he has the gifts himself or not.

[ 14. May 2014, 13:12: Message edited by: Lamb Chopped ]

--------------------
Er, this is what I've been up to (book).
Oh, that you would rend the heavens and come down!

Posts: 20059 | From: off in left field somewhere | Registered: Feb 2004  |  IP: Logged
SvitlanaV2
Shipmate
# 16967

 - Posted      Profile for SvitlanaV2   Email SvitlanaV2   Send new private message       Edit/delete post   Reply with quote 
quote:
Originally posted by Lamb Chopped:
But the pastor is the one who ultimately bears responsibility for making sure it happens somehow, whether he has the gifts himself or not.

What's the point of having pastoral skills (and being employed for those skills) if you don't go to the trouble of using them? I don't understand that.

Is the problem a lack of structures to enable pastoral work to happen effectively? Maybe the 'pastoral pastor' (!!) could develop a team of pastoral visitors, with himself as the manager of the group, to look out for members and other attenders on a regular basis. 'Pastoral visitor' is a term from British Methodism. A pastoral visitor doesn't have to visit everyone on their pastoral list, but in theory it means that each church member has someone who is discreetly on their side. It doesn't work perfectly in Methodism, but it's just one structure that other denominations could adapt and improve.

But from my point of view as a provincial British Christian, a church with multiple pastors is burdened with an embarrassment of riches! Not to use such riches to their best advantage seems wasteful.

Posts: 6668 | From: UK | Registered: Feb 2012  |  IP: Logged
South Coast Kevin
Shipmate
# 16130

 - Posted      Profile for South Coast Kevin   Author's homepage     Send new private message       Edit/delete post   Reply with quote 
Maybe a tangent, but I wish we didn't use the word 'pastor' to mean 'church leader'. It's confusing because 'pastoring' is a specific gift / skill / talent and using that word to mean 'church leader' begs the question as to what skills leaders should have. (Whereas I guess pretty much all of us would say the leadership team of any church should ideally contain a variety of gifts, not just pastorally-gifted people).

--------------------
My blog - wondering about Christianity in the 21st century, chess, music, politics and other bits and bobs.

Posts: 3309 | From: The south coast (of England) | Registered: Jan 2011  |  IP: Logged
seasick

...over the edge
# 48

 - Posted      Profile for seasick   Author's homepage     Send new private message       Edit/delete post   Reply with quote 
Following some behind the scenes conversations, we think this thread is better fitted to Purgatory.

seasick, Eccles host

[ 14. May 2014, 14:59: Message edited by: seasick ]

--------------------
We believe there is, and always was, in every Christian Church, ... an outward priesthood, ordained by Jesus Christ, and an outward sacrifice offered therein. - John Wesley

Posts: 5769 | From: A world of my own | Registered: May 2001  |  IP: Logged
Raptor Eye
Shipmate
# 16649

 - Posted      Profile for Raptor Eye     Send new private message       Edit/delete post   Reply with quote 
quote:
Originally posted by South Coast Kevin:
My church's last two Sunday talks have been all about the multi-faceted gifting and equipping that you folks are talking about, with specific reference to the Ephesians 4 passage about the 'equipping gifts' of apostles, prophets, evangelists, pastors and teachers.

So my contribution to answering nouwen's question is that churches need to recognise that pastoral care (like apostling, prophesying, evangelism and teaching) is everyone's job, and also that those with a strong pastoral gift need to encourage it in others rather than solely doing the pastoring themselves.

This. If everyone is loving others as themselves and seeing their brothers and sisters in the church with equal importance as their kin, of course they will pray, visit, and care for each other in a co-ordinated way so that one person, whether with the title 'pastor' or not, is overburdened and criticised.

--------------------
Be still, and know that I am God! Psalm 46.10

Posts: 4359 | From: The United Kingdom | Registered: Sep 2011  |  IP: Logged
Olaf
Shipmate
# 11804

 - Posted      Profile for Olaf     Send new private message       Edit/delete post   Reply with quote 
quote:
Originally posted by Raptor Eye:
This. If everyone is loving others as themselves and seeing their brothers and sisters in the church with equal importance as their kin, of course they will pray, visit, and care for each other in a co-ordinated way so that one person, whether with the title 'pastor' or not, is overburdened and criticised.

This is true, yet our church found out the hard way that people who are shut-in, hospitalized, or in urgent need to expect a visit from the ordained leader. We found that it is beneficial to have lay people deliver communion weekly and drop by to check in or chat, but that visit from the ordained person is also expected, albeit on a less frequent basis.

It seemed to work out that once a month or so was sufficient for shut-ins, as long as they were receiving the lay ministers of Holy Communion in the meantime. Obviously, in cases of urgent need, the pastor's company is expected more suddenly. Of the many pastors I have known, only one or two would deflect this responsibility. The overwhelming majority bent over backwards (and then some) to do visitations whenever.

Lamb Chopped, I am very sorry to hear about your situation. I attended a meeting once about the importance of pastoral care committees. The idea was simply for a rotating group of people to keep track of the birthdays and important dates of the pastor's family, to send cards as appropriate, and to be the canary in the coal mine if pastor or congregation started showing signs of burnout. Based on what you have graciously shared, I would add that the committee should have the contact information of a pastor of another church to be notified in the event of an emergency. I recently contacted another local pastor for just this reason--my own was in a situation of crisis, and I reached out to a pastor (also a trusted friend of mine and my pastor's) who I knew would be able to offer discreet assistance. Perhaps I overstepped my bounds a bit, but I'm afraid I'm not very sorry about it.

Posts: 8953 | From: Ad Midwestem | Registered: Sep 2006  |  IP: Logged
Lamb Chopped
Ship's kebab
# 5528

 - Posted      Profile for Lamb Chopped   Email Lamb Chopped   Send new private message       Edit/delete post   Reply with quote 
quote:
Originally posted by SvitlanaV2:
quote:
Originally posted by Lamb Chopped:
But the pastor is the one who ultimately bears responsibility for making sure it happens somehow, whether he has the gifts himself or not.

What's the point of having pastoral skills (and being employed for those skills) if you don't go to the trouble of using them? I don't understand that.
"pastor" in this context means "clergy, minister, rector" or whatever else you call the person who stands up front Sunday morning, preaches, baptizes, (hopefully) visits the sick... etc. Most churches have only one, and that person may not have the full range of gifts needed for church care--in fact, I can virtually guarantee one person won't. In the case of our host congregation, the lead pastors are both very hot on running programs, starting community projects (nursing home Bible studies, re-organizing a sinking neighbor church, community committee work stuff) and on denominational politics. One is known as a great preacher, though I'm afraid I have a different opinion. They also do a lot of the liturgical shuffle--you know, write-your-own-service once a month alternating with traditional alternating with blended.

Neither of them, as far as I'm aware, have any gifts at all in terms of counseling, visiting the sick, caring for the dying or grieving, or defusing explosive family situations. In other words, all the touchy-feely stuff that is IMHO the lifeblood of most enduring congregations. And sad to say, nobody has stepped up to take on this area, and they haven't done anything to recruit people. Hints and straight-out bold statements that this needs to be dealt with are simply ignored.

In an ideal world the church council would overrule their "doesn't matter" attitude and either call or appoint somebody(ies) to do the caring. But the reality is that even if the full council threw its weight in that direction, the two pastors pulling the other way (because they simply don't see the need, and don't want to waste money) could split the church. And nobody wants to do that.

--------------------
Er, this is what I've been up to (book).
Oh, that you would rend the heavens and come down!

Posts: 20059 | From: off in left field somewhere | Registered: Feb 2004  |  IP: Logged
SvitlanaV2
Shipmate
# 16967

 - Posted      Profile for SvitlanaV2   Email SvitlanaV2   Send new private message       Edit/delete post   Reply with quote 
quote:
Originally posted by Lamb Chopped:

Neither of them, as far as I'm aware, have any gifts at all in terms of counseling, visiting the sick, caring for the dying or grieving, or defusing explosive family situations. In other words, all the touchy-feely stuff that is IMHO the lifeblood of most enduring congregations.

Very interesting.

Studies show that many mainstream churches in the UK, and possibly even in the USA, now tend to prioritise pastoral skills in their ministers. The other gifts tend to be sidelined. There are a number of reasons for this, but I think it comes down to the psychological tendencies of contemporary mainstream congregations and ministerial candidates. People want to be cared for, and they want attention.

On the negative side, overemphasis on the pastoral tends to make a church very set in its ways, rather narrow-minded, poor at making decisions, and fairly indifferent to evangelism and growth, although the caring side of mission (sending money to charity, running drop-in centres for old people, etc.) is highly valued. So you should probably be grateful that your church isn't over-preoccupied with pastoral things.

The only option in your situation would be to encourage the lay leaders to take on the role of organising some kind of pastoral care system themselves with a group of willing volunteers. Of course, to suggest something in a church = being willing to do it yourself, so be prepared!

Posts: 6668 | From: UK | Registered: Feb 2012  |  IP: Logged
Lamb Chopped
Ship's kebab
# 5528

 - Posted      Profile for Lamb Chopped   Email Lamb Chopped   Send new private message       Edit/delete post   Reply with quote 
quote:
Originally posted by SvitlanaV2:
On the negative side, overemphasis on the pastoral tends to make a church very set in its ways, rather narrow-minded, poor at making decisions, and fairly indifferent to evangelism and growth, although the caring side of mission (sending money to charity, running drop-in centres for old people, etc.) is highly valued. So you should probably be grateful that your church isn't over-preoccupied with pastoral things.

The only option in your situation would be to encourage the lay leaders to take on the role of organising some kind of pastoral care system themselves with a group of willing volunteers. Of course, to suggest something in a church = being willing to do it yourself, so be prepared!

IMHO the opposite (no pastoral concern emphasis) is just as deadly, as we are losing people out the back door left and right. What is the use of evangelizing if the people don't "stick" due to our own fault?

As for me organizing something--

Our call is specifically to Vietnamese ministry in this metro area, and we are overloaded already. It's a pity, but the kingdom will not be served by us dropping what we've been given and going off to do something else. We have however spoken with people who are less overloaded, and hopefully some of them will find their calling in this area. There are encouraging signs, though not far along yet.

--------------------
Er, this is what I've been up to (book).
Oh, that you would rend the heavens and come down!

Posts: 20059 | From: off in left field somewhere | Registered: Feb 2004  |  IP: Logged
SvitlanaV2
Shipmate
# 16967

 - Posted      Profile for SvitlanaV2   Email SvitlanaV2   Send new private message       Edit/delete post   Reply with quote 
Yes, it does seem rather wasteful to work hard to bring new people into the church and then fail to care for them.

I hope it all works out well!

Posts: 6668 | From: UK | Registered: Feb 2012  |  IP: Logged
Zappa
Ship's Wake
# 8433

 - Posted      Profile for Zappa   Email Zappa   Send new private message       Edit/delete post   Reply with quote 
I guess I've had a few years in this game so here's a few thoughts:

The biggest obstacle to "pastoral care" is suffering silently. I've had marriages break up in a faith community and not be told for months ... I've had people attempt suicide after never telling anyone they were depressed ... they didn't want to bother anyone ...

There are some woolly areas about job description: in the anglican model and variant in which I have lived and moved and had my lunch that which has absorbed my greatest time consumption is communications (newsletters, sermons, thank you letters ... ), liturgical preparation, and networking (attending obscure civic or church-based meetings either within or beyond the parish, diocese and local community ...). I try to make writing and study a priority, too ...

"pew-based" pastoral care training programmes work quite well (we've used Pastoral Partners sometimes) but it involves an unbelievable amount of energy to run and oversee and administer, let alone launch ...

In the end the key is training people to cry for help when they/we need it ... building community, building small groups of prayer and faith-based fellowship. Most of the time pastoral care becomes common sense ... "how are you traveling?" "I haven't seen you for a while." But people are so busy ...

--------------------
shameless self promotion - because I think it's worth it
and mayhap this too: http://broken-moments.blogspot.co.nz/

Posts: 18917 | From: "Central" is all they call it | Registered: Sep 2004  |  IP: Logged
churchgeek

Have candles, will pray
# 5557

 - Posted      Profile for churchgeek   Author's homepage   Email churchgeek   Send new private message       Edit/delete post   Reply with quote 
Depending on the size of a church, it can help if one of the clergy is in charge of pastoral care - not necessarily that s/he is the one trying to do it all, but that pastoral care is their focus so they can ensure it's getting done somehow. Empowering the laity is also important, I think - having lay ministers in various capacities (even beyond the important but basic roles of taking the Eucharist to the sick and shut-ins or providing healing prayer during services).

I'm sure some of the matter has to be discerned locally, though. And as Zappa said, sometimes the problem is people don't express their needs. Maybe community-building work has to be a part of the pastoral care plan, so that people feel a part of the church family and will be more likely to reach out.

--------------------
I reserve the right to change my mind.

My article on the Virgin of Vladimir

Posts: 7773 | From: Detroit | Registered: Feb 2004  |  IP: Logged
Garasu
Shipmate
# 17152

 - Posted      Profile for Garasu   Email Garasu   Send new private message       Edit/delete post   Reply with quote 
Perhaps an issue is what pastoral care actually means?

That is, (in contemporary Western church settings) I've heard it said that pastoral care doesn't aim to replace professional counseling services, or health care services, or social work services... so what is it actually offering?

(I think there's enough evidence of issues around a decline in "neighbourliness" and an increase in loneliness to suggest that there might be something... but does that feed in to the "civic religion" vs. "believer's religion" issue kicking off elsewhere on these boards?)

--------------------
"Could I believe in the doctrine without believing in the deity?". - Modesitt, L. E., Jr., 1943- Imager.

Posts: 889 | From: Surrey Heath (England) | Registered: Jun 2012  |  IP: Logged
Antisocial Alto
Shipmate
# 13810

 - Posted      Profile for Antisocial Alto   Email Antisocial Alto   Send new private message       Edit/delete post   Reply with quote 
Our church has gotten an associate for the first time (after being a one-cleric joint for pretty much forever). Our associate is a naturally pastoral type and has started a Stephen Ministry to involve the rest of us. (This is viewed with suspicion. A lot of people only want to talk to a collar.) Our newish rector is more talented as an administrator, although he will absolutely come and see you if you ask him to and will even remember to ask follow-up questions later. Now a significant minority of the congregation is angry at him for a) not being psychic and b) not doing all the pastoral work himself. [Roll Eyes]
Posts: 601 | From: United States | Registered: Jun 2008  |  IP: Logged
Lamb Chopped
Ship's kebab
# 5528

 - Posted      Profile for Lamb Chopped   Email Lamb Chopped   Send new private message       Edit/delete post   Reply with quote 
Stephen Ministry can be useful, though it's really designed for long-term one-on-one support and as such is going to pick up a minority of needs. But that's much better than nothing.

And yes, the whole pastor-as-psychic thing is stupid, and a pain.

--------------------
Er, this is what I've been up to (book).
Oh, that you would rend the heavens and come down!

Posts: 20059 | From: off in left field somewhere | Registered: Feb 2004  |  IP: Logged
Zappa
Ship's Wake
# 8433

 - Posted      Profile for Zappa   Email Zappa   Send new private message       Edit/delete post   Reply with quote 
quote:
Originally posted by Garasu:
Perhaps an issue is what pastoral care actually means?

That is, (in contemporary Western church settings) I've heard it said that pastoral care doesn't aim to replace professional counseling services, or health care services, or social work services... so what is it actually offering?

(I think there's enough evidence of issues around a decline in "neighbourliness" and an increase in loneliness to suggest that there might be something... but does that feed in to the "civic religion" vs. "believer's religion" issue kicking off elsewhere on these boards?)

It's a critical question, and one I have wrestled with a lot - not least in my recent stint as a school chaplain in which it was made quite clear to me by the "pastoral care team" that religion and godstuff was a wank and I was tolerated at meetings only because the principal wanted me there.

There was a frustrating and debilitating experience, but it was related to my "thirty year question" with which I have wrestled since theological school, which I believe should be fundamental in theological formation. What is the "shepherding care" that the Christ Community offers, and for which it trains its professionals? In my current diocese there is I suspect massive confusion about this, spilling over into questions of "what is a priest". The dominant ethos in NZ's low liberal Anglican and parallel scenes is that clergy (and other pastoral care-givers, but in this diocese we tend to ordain anyone who can hold a hand) are somewhere between social workers, low-grade teacher-lecturers and counsellors, perhaps even nurses. I have long fought against that and am clearly seen as an oddity.

Pastoral care, to me, is about rumouring resurrection into any given context. Sometimes it will be sitting silently, sometimes it will be laughing and joking over a glass of something nice, sometimes it will be a phone call ... it can also be "time wasting in the name of God" - that is to say we as carers (ordained or not) are called to be alongside those in a valley of darkness (for as long as we are welcome and not watch the clock, for we too are a place, as the Easter liturgy says, where heaven kisses earth.

Wasting time (chronos) purposefully (kairologically) alongside the hurting, I guess.

Ironically and tragically now I sit near the top of the ego-heap of church hierarchy I do far too little of it ... but perhaps I have to learn how to breathe resurrection hope into the endless cycles of Important Meetings™ to which I am summoned ...

I have also made myself unpopular by saying that Pastoral Care begins and ends in the liturgical action of breaking bread, sharing wine and breaking open the word week by week ... which many here see as a quant and unnecessary adjunct to the real work

--------------------
shameless self promotion - because I think it's worth it
and mayhap this too: http://broken-moments.blogspot.co.nz/

Posts: 18917 | From: "Central" is all they call it | Registered: Sep 2004  |  IP: Logged
Amos

Shipmate
# 44

 - Posted      Profile for Amos     Send new private message       Edit/delete post   Reply with quote 
Brilliant post, Zappa. Thanks. That's what I'm trying to do here too, but it's hard, and the dominant ethos in the Church doesn't know what to do with it either.

--------------------
At the end of the day we face our Maker alongside Jesus--ken

Posts: 7667 | From: Summerisle | Registered: May 2001  |  IP: Logged


 
Post new thread  Post a reply Close thread   Feature thread   Move thread   Delete thread Next oldest thread   Next newest thread
 - Printer-friendly view
Go to:

Contact us | Ship of Fools | Privacy statement

© Ship of Fools 2016

Powered by Infopop Corporation
UBB.classicTM 6.5.0

 
follow ship of fools on twitter
buy your ship of fools postcards
sip of fools mugs from your favourite nautical website
 
 
  ship of fools