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Source: (consider it)
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Thread: Well, that was interesting wasn’t it?
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molopata
The Ship's jack
# 9933
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Sipech:
The Telegraph are also mooting about scrapping the NHS as we know it.
I might add that I've just waded my way through that totally fucked-up article. It says somewhere that the NHS is world-class on efficiency, but elsewhere there is "lower overall spending per head compared with other countries with universal health care systems, poorer staffing levels, fewer hospital beds or insufficient MRI and CT scanners."
That would suggest to me that the system is in fact very good, but that it is simply underfunded. The conclusion that the NHS in its current state is rather dubious.
It then goes on to claim that rival social health insurance models "are able to command rather higher levels of spending as a share of GDP than our NHS, forced as it is to compete with the demands of other public services for taxpayer funds."
This still means that money is the problem and that someone will to pay for improvements. Believe me, all of the rival social health insurance models quoted are hugely expensive, and certainly the one I currently use, the Swiss one, very effectively relieves the wealthy of the burden of paying much for it. It is not the government which decides to allocate more to health, it is our private health insurers who each October cheerfully announce a rise in insurance premiums typically amounting to 5% annually even in a pay-increase and inflation-free economy. We now pay £500 for a family of four for basic health insurance. That's every month. But if I earned 10x as much, I wouldn't pay more.
No wonder the conservative Swiss came quite close to replacing the current private model with a state-run insurance model (i.e. NHS-esque) in one of their famous referenda late last year. Meanwhile, the Terrorgaff is simply trying to sell you a model which will screw you further.
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... The Respectable
Posts: 1718 | From: the abode of my w@ndering mind | Registered: Aug 2005
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Stercus Tauri
Shipmate
# 16668
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by deano:
Sorry I haven’t been around for a bit, but I’ve been busy both with work and of course with helping to return the Conservatives to Government....waffle waffle waffle
When I was very young I was a conservative supporter, even before I could vote. It didn't take long to grow out of it, and by the time I could vote I was becoming liberal, at least in the political sense of the word. I know plenty of conservatives these days and they are mostly decent people, if somewhat hampered by excessive wealth and ignorance of their environment in some cases. Over the years - quite a lot of them - I've come to rather like that old idea about feeding the hungry, healing the sick, sheltering the homeless, comforting the oppressed, and so on, and I'll support political parties that think it's a good idea too. I have no idea what Deano really believes behind all his sniggering schoolboy bullshit, but I'd be surprised if many conservatives - including him - are really as thrawn and hateful as he wants us to believe he is.
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Thay haif said. Quhat say thay, Lat thame say (George Keith, 5th Earl Marischal)
Posts: 905 | From: On the traditional lands of the Six Nations. | Registered: Sep 2011
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Sioni Sais
Shipmate
# 5713
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by L'organist:
Welcome back Deano.
You haven't got it quite right - the SNP is far to the left of the Labour party; but the SNP gains from Labour were predictable, although I'm slightly surprised they did so well against the LibDems as well.
The LibDem losses in the rest of the country could also have been predicted if people had actually bothered to find out who voted for them in 2010: but I guess they didn't so hence the surprise at only the 8 seats.
My view is that the LibDem support in 2010 was fickle and much of it was simply those who didn't have much time for Gordon Brown, weren't going to vote Conservative, but would accept a Labour government moderated by the LibDems. That backfired then and in now deserting the LibDems *and* Labour they have screwed themselves more royally than before.
quote:
So, after DC goes we can expect at least five years of Boris ![[Yipee]](graemlins/spin.gif)
I doubt it. DC has some gravitas. Boris has only 'ass'.
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"He isn't Doctor Who, he's The Doctor"
(Paul Sinha, BBC)
Posts: 24276 | From: Newport, Wales | Registered: Apr 2004
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JoannaP
Shipmate
# 4493
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by leo:
Without the LibDems holding them back from some of their nasttier policies, we'll now see how wicked the Tories really are.
Indeed. I have seen it suggested that Dave came up with some of his nastier ideas, such as repealing the Human Rights Act, so that he could make some easy concessions to the Lib Dems in the coalition talks. If so, that has backfired rather - or should I adjust my tinfoil hat?
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"Freedom for the pike is death for the minnow." R. H. Tawney (quoted by Isaiah Berlin)
"Those who would give up essential Liberty, to purchase a little temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety." Benjamin Franklin
Posts: 1877 | From: England | Registered: May 2003
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rolyn
Shipmate
# 16840
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Posted
Nothing quite as nauseating as tory triumphalism personified ![[Projectile]](graemlins/puke2.gif)
At least the OP'er had good sense to post it in Hell where it belongs.
I wonder how many in the Party delight in having deano as an ambassador.
All deliciously hypothetical of course, but I happen to think it would have been a very long time before the Tories had another sniff without 9/11 and the bankers crash.
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Change is the only certainty of existence
Posts: 3206 | From: U.K. | Registered: Dec 2011
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fletcher christian
Mutinous Seadog
# 13919
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Posted
Posted by Piglet:
quote:
If you want a word meaning the Scottish people, the term you're looking for is Scots.
[/pedant alert OFF]
{pedant alert fully on} I think Scot is a derivative of Scoti meaning 'dark people', ie the Irish. But that's ok, it means you wouldn't have to change your name when you join the United Celtic Nations.
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'God is love insaturable, love impossible to describe'
Staretz Silouan
Posts: 5235 | From: a prefecture | Registered: Jul 2008
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Anglican't
Shipmate
# 15292
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Stercus Tauri:
quote:
Originally posted by deano:
Sorry I haven’t been around for a bit, but I’ve been busy both with work and of course with helping to return the Conservatives to Government....waffle waffle waffle
When I was very young I was a conservative supporter, even before I could vote. It didn't take long to grow out of it, and by the time I could vote I was becoming liberal, at least in the political sense of the word. I know plenty of conservatives these days and they are mostly decent people, if somewhat hampered by excessive wealth and ignorance of their environment in some cases. Over the years - quite a lot of them - I've come to rather like that old idea about feeding the hungry, healing the sick, sheltering the homeless, comforting the oppressed, and so on, and I'll support political parties that think it's a good idea too. I have no idea what Deano really believes behind all his sniggering schoolboy bullshit, but I'd be surprised if many conservatives - including him - are really as thrawn and hateful as he wants us to believe he is.
I'm a Conservative. I've met lots of Conservatives. I've never met a Conservative like Deano.
In many ways he's like a left-wing person's idea of what a Conservative must be like (loud, brash, obnoxious views, suburban, self-employed, likes the military, plays golf). Has Deano been created so that people on this site can feel better about themselves?
Posts: 3613 | From: London, England | Registered: Nov 2009
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Spike
Mostly Harmless
# 36
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Anglican't:
I've never met a Conservative like Deano.
I have. In fact I've met a few like that, but I'm happy to concede that they're not typical
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"May you get to heaven before the devil knows you're dead" - Irish blessing
Posts: 12860 | From: The Valley of Crocuses | Registered: May 2001
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Sioni Sais
Shipmate
# 5713
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Posted
I haven't met Conservatives like deano, but I have met a fair few people who are a lot like deano. I guess they are more like to vote Conservative than otherwise because they identify Labour and the LibDems with "do-gooders" which they cannot abide. None of them are politically active beyond voting at parliamentary elections (and at no others).
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"He isn't Doctor Who, he's The Doctor"
(Paul Sinha, BBC)
Posts: 24276 | From: Newport, Wales | Registered: Apr 2004
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Anglican't
Shipmate
# 15292
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Posted
I was thinking more of activists, rather than just voters. I thought Deano claimed to be a Conservative activist?
Posts: 3613 | From: London, England | Registered: Nov 2009
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Spike
Mostly Harmless
# 36
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Posted
I was referring to activists as well, but they are in the minority.
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"May you get to heaven before the devil knows you're dead" - Irish blessing
Posts: 12860 | From: The Valley of Crocuses | Registered: May 2001
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Albertus
Shipmate
# 13356
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by deano:
....Grammar Nazi's as well!
Actually, old boy, I think you'll find it's Nazis- without the apostrophe.
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My beard is a testament to my masculinity and virility, and demonstrates that I am a real man. Trouble is, bits of quiche sometimes get caught in it.
Posts: 6498 | From: Y Sowth | Registered: Jan 2008
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Gee D
Shipmate
# 13815
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Posted
Yes - in his thoughtless invective, his grammar continues to show no regard for the tender feelings of others.
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Not every Anglican in Sydney is Sydney Anglican
Posts: 7028 | From: Warrawee NSW Australia | Registered: Jun 2008
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Piglet
Islander
# 11803
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Anglican't:
I was thinking more of activists, rather than just voters. I thought Deano claimed to be a Conservative activist?
My mother-in-law stuffed envelopes for her local Conservatives for years, and wouldn't dream of voting any other way, but she's not the least bit like Deano.
Thank God. ![[Big Grin]](biggrin.gif)
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I may not be on an island any more, but I'm still an islander.
alto n a soprano who can read music
Posts: 20272 | From: Fredericton, NB, on a rather larger piece of rock | Registered: Sep 2006
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Palimpsest
Shipmate
# 16772
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Posted
I can't remember if it was Saki or Evelyn Waugh who had a minor character in his book who claimed to be helping bring on the revolution by being beastly to the serving classes.
Is Deano a secret socialist trying to goad the apathetic into becoming leftists? It makes more sense than any alleged logic in his posts.
Such a sad, sad troll.
Posts: 2990 | From: Seattle WA. US | Registered: Nov 2011
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deano
princess
# 12063
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Posted
It seems some of you are claiming that there are some reasonable Conservatives!
Now that isn't something you hear everyday on the Ship is it?
Conservatives that are reasonable, caring annd compassionate don't exist on the ship, we are all fascists.
I've said on many occaisions that I'm actually on the left of the Conservative party and actually supported Ken Clark in the last leadership election.
But the portside list to the ship never seems to recognise such subtleties so we all get painted as neocon-type Nazis. So I give the Ship what it seems to want. Enjoy it, getting rid of all that pent-up frustration is cathartic. You will feel better soon.
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"The moral high ground is slowly being bombed to oblivion. " - Supermatelot
Posts: 2118 | From: Chesterfield | Registered: Nov 2006
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Sioni Sais
Shipmate
# 5713
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by deano:
It seems some of you are claiming that there are some reasonable Conservatives!
Now that isn't something you hear everyday on the Ship is it?
Conservatives that are reasonable, caring annd compassionate don't exist on the ship, we are all fascists.
I've said on many occaisions that I'm actually on the left of the Conservative party and actually supported Ken Clark in the last leadership election.
But the portside list to the ship never seems to recognise such subtleties so we all get painted as neocon-type Nazis. So I give the Ship what it seems to want. Enjoy it, getting rid of all that pent-up frustration is cathartic. You will feel better soon.
OK then, maybe you are to the left of the Conservative party, but it doesn't alter the fact that if we had a competition you would be voted Shit of the Ship.
Posts: 24276 | From: Newport, Wales | Registered: Apr 2004
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Alan Cresswell
Mad Scientist 先生
# 31
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Posted
Did anyone suggest reasonableness is a function of position on the political spectrum? There are reasonable and unreasonable Conservatives, reasonable and unreasonable Socialists, reasonable and unreasonable where-ever-the-hell-they-are-on-the-spectrum-today Labour members.
There's at least one complete and utter gobshite on the left of the Conservative Party.
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Don't cling to a mistake just because you spent a lot of time making it.
Posts: 32413 | From: East Kilbride (Scotland) or 福島 | Registered: May 2001
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Spike
Mostly Harmless
# 36
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by deano:
It seems some of you are claiming that there are some reasonable Conservatives!
Now that isn't something you hear everyday on the Ship is it?
Conservatives that are reasonable, caring annd compassionate don't exist on the ship, we are all fascists.
I've said on many occaisions that I'm actually on the left of the Conservative party and actually supported Ken Clark in the last leadership election.
But the portside list to the ship never seems to recognise such subtleties so we all get painted as neocon-type Nazis. So I give the Ship what it seems to want. Enjoy it, getting rid of all that pent-up frustration is cathartic. You will feel better soon.
We have quite a few Tories on board, including a member of the Admin team. You seem to be deluding yourself that we don't like you because you're a Tory, but that's not the case. We don't dislike you because you're a Tory. We dislike you because you're a twat.
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"May you get to heaven before the devil knows you're dead" - Irish blessing
Posts: 12860 | From: The Valley of Crocuses | Registered: May 2001
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Albertus
Shipmate
# 13356
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Posted
There are numerous Conservatives and Tories (not quite the same thing) on the Ship who I would regard as reasonable and decent people. For example, Betjemaniac's Baldwinian Toryism is attractive if perhaps rather romantically nostalgic: Anglican't offers a robust and sometimes uncomfortably acute critique of the often prevailing left/liberal voices here; and Marvin, under that shell of sixth-form Randianism and his peculiar belief that a system that's good for the people who might be crapping on him is good for him too because one day he himself might be able to rise to be one of the crappers, has profoundly decent and generous instincts.
But deano is like none of these.
[ 10. May 2015, 14:05: Message edited by: Albertus ]
Posts: 6498 | From: Y Sowth | Registered: Jan 2008
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Patdys
Iron Wannabe
RooK-Annoyer
# 9397
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by deano:
It seems some of you are claiming that there are some reasonable Conservatives!
Now that isn't something you hear everyday on the Ship is it?
Conservatives that are reasonable, caring annd compassionate don't exist on the ship, we are all fascists.
I've said on many occaisions that I'm actually on the left of the Conservative party and actually supported Ken Clark in the last leadership election.
But the portside list to the ship never seems to recognise such subtleties so we all get painted as neocon-type Nazis. So I give the Ship what it seems to want. Enjoy it, getting rid of all that pent-up frustration is cathartic. You will feel better soon.
The people I like aren't defined by their beliefs. They are defined by their attitude.
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Marathon run. Next Dream. Australian this time.
Posts: 3511 | Registered: Apr 2005
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Erroneous Monk
Shipmate
# 10858
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Posted
So I'm thinking that the decent people on both sides of the debate want the same thing. They just disagree on the order of events. Some think that if you invest in people - education, care, housing, lives - you create a workforce that makes business strong. Others think that if you make business strong, it invests in people in the aforementioned ways, and you get the same outcome.
I guess this time around, enough people managed to persuade themselves that:
a) the second version *might* be true; and
b) if it isn't, they aren't in the immediate firing line
to vote the Conservatives back in.
I think very few people mean to hurt others.
Maybe we should talk about the results we can all celebrate ie South Thanet and Bradford West.
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And I shot a man in Tesco, just to watch him die.
Posts: 2950 | From: I cannot tell you, for you are not a friar | Registered: Jan 2006
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Piglet
Islander
# 11803
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Posted
EM, I think that's one of the most sensible things I've read in ages.
![[Overused]](graemlins/notworthy.gif)
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I may not be on an island any more, but I'm still an islander.
alto n a soprano who can read music
Posts: 20272 | From: Fredericton, NB, on a rather larger piece of rock | Registered: Sep 2006
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Penny S
Shipmate
# 14768
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Posted
Of course, the problem with Thanet is that it now has overall council control by Ukip, with very few left who know how things are done, and a bunch of people with very little experience of running things running things. Hopefully they won't make too much mess before they go the way of the Brighton Greens.
Posts: 5833 | Registered: May 2009
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Marvin the Martian
Interplanetary
# 4360
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Albertus:
and Marvin, under that shell of sixth-form Randianism and his peculiar belief that a system that's good for the people who might be crapping on him is good for him too because one day he himself might be able to rise to be one of the crappers, has profoundly decent and generous instincts.
You're too kind, sir.
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Hail Gallaxhar
Posts: 30100 | From: Adrift on a sea of surreality | Registered: Apr 2003
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Albertus
Shipmate
# 13356
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Posted
I suppsoe it does sound a bit 'damning with faint praise', doesn't it? Didn't mean to. I don't know you IRL but from what I see of you on the Ship my bafflement at your views is only matched by my great respect for your tremendous personal decency. I mean, you give the impression sometimes of thinking that people are basically motivated by self-interest and then you mention in passing that you have carried some bit of litter three miles home because you couldn't find a bin- plus all the work you put it to help keep this place going.
Posts: 6498 | From: Y Sowth | Registered: Jan 2008
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Gamaliel
Shipmate
# 812
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Posted
This.
[/qb][/QUOTE]We have quite a few Tories on board, including a member of the Admin team. You seem to be deluding yourself that we don't like you because you're a Tory, but that's not the case. We don't dislike you because you're a Tory. We dislike you because you're a twat. [/QB][/QUOTE]
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Let us with a gladsome mind
Praise the Lord for He is kind.
http://philthebard.blogspot.com
Posts: 15997 | From: Cheshire, UK | Registered: Jul 2001
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Gamaliel
Shipmate
# 812
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Posted
For the record, I quite like Ken Clark. I also like quite a number of Conservatives I've met from across the Tory spectrum.
I know there's a fair bit of unnuanced lefty/liberal do-gooder-ness on these Boards, but there are plenty of counter-balancing voices - L'Organist, for instance, even Matt Black too at times ...
Charitably, I suspect Deano either doesn't read people's posts properly or else likes to play up to a kind of 'Only Tory in the village' persona ... particularly here in Hell.
Less charitably ...
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Let us with a gladsome mind
Praise the Lord for He is kind.
http://philthebard.blogspot.com
Posts: 15997 | From: Cheshire, UK | Registered: Jul 2001
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Alan Cresswell
Mad Scientist 先生
# 31
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Posted
That's Comprehensive education for you, totally fails to teach vital life skills like how to do UBB code properly. Bring back Grammar Schools, beat UBB code skills into the brats. Then Britain will be great again.
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Don't cling to a mistake just because you spent a lot of time making it.
Posts: 32413 | From: East Kilbride (Scotland) or 福島 | Registered: May 2001
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Doc Tor
Deepest Red
# 9748
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Gamaliel:
... ... ...
There are other punctuation marks, you know. Teilhard didn't wear them all out.
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Forward the New Republic
Posts: 9131 | From: Ultima Thule | Registered: Jul 2005
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Porridge
Shipmate
# 15405
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Posted
No, but OliviaCA is giving Teilhard a run for his money.
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Spiggott: Everything I've ever told you is a lie, including that.
Moon: Including what?
Spiggott: That everything I've ever told you is a lie.
Moon: That's not true!
Posts: 3925 | From: Upper right corner | Registered: Jan 2010
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no prophet's flag is set so...
Proceed to see sea
# 15560
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Gamaliel:
For the record, I quite like Ken Clark.
plenty of counter-balancing voices - L'Organist, for instance.
Everyone has their good Tory who says they can repair the waste cities and the desolations of the many generations.
For the record, it's better to put the voices all together on the same track: Ken Clark eternal funky with his organ.
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Out of this nettle, danger, we pluck this flower, safety.
\_(ツ)_/
Posts: 11498 | From: Treaty 6 territory in the nonexistant Province of Buffalo, Canada ↄ⃝' | Registered: Mar 2010
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Gamaliel
Shipmate
# 812
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Posted
Fair points.
Grammar and punctuation fascists should unite.
Mind you, George Orwell wanted to proscribe certain punctuation marks he believed to be redundant
Typical socialist. Restricting freedom of choice. People should be free to use what punctuation errors they choose and as many grammatical mistakes as deano does without it reflecting in any way on the impression it gives of their own ignorance.
While we're at it, this yet another reason to vote Tory as the lefties and do-gooders might one day tax grammar and punctuation.
Those who overuse ... will have to pay a fine of £150 rising to £250 or £300. The proceeds would go to repair the damage Gove has done to our education system or the havoc he is about to wreak on our justice system - or indeed anything else he touches.
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Let us with a gladsome mind
Praise the Lord for He is kind.
http://philthebard.blogspot.com
Posts: 15997 | From: Cheshire, UK | Registered: Jul 2001
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Baptist Trainfan
Shipmate
# 15128
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Posted
Shouldn't the fine be in Euros? I mean, surely all this stupid views on punctuation emanate from Brussels and its bureaucracy? I mean, the Europeans even have accents on some of their letters - why can't they use plain old British script?
Posts: 9750 | From: The other side of the Severn | Registered: Sep 2009
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Alan Cresswell
Mad Scientist 先生
# 31
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Baptist Trainfan:
the Europeans even have accents on some of their letters - why can't they use plain old British script?
You'll find that Bòrd na Gàidhlig would explain that accents are also used in British languages. What you clearly mean to say is "plain old English script". You, you ... sasunnach!
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Don't cling to a mistake just because you spent a lot of time making it.
Posts: 32413 | From: East Kilbride (Scotland) or 福島 | Registered: May 2001
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Karl: Liberal Backslider
Shipmate
# 76
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Posted
Maen nhw'n cael eu defnyddio yn y Gymraeg, Hefyd / They're used in Welsh as well.
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Might as well ask the bloody cat.
Posts: 17938 | From: Chesterfield | Registered: May 2001
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Alan Cresswell
Mad Scientist 先生
# 31
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Posted
Which are the British languages. Not the language of people from the rest of the European continent (Angles, Saxons, Jutes, Normans, Danes ...)
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Don't cling to a mistake just because you spent a lot of time making it.
Posts: 32413 | From: East Kilbride (Scotland) or 福島 | Registered: May 2001
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Karl: Liberal Backslider
Shipmate
# 76
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Posted
Some versions of revised Cornish use them as well ![[Biased]](wink.gif)
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Might as well ask the bloody cat.
Posts: 17938 | From: Chesterfield | Registered: May 2001
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Doc Tor
Deepest Red
# 9748
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Posted
I'm reasonably certain that the finer points of accents, diacritics, and other inflexions belongs in the place diametrically opposite Hell. Feel free to take it there.
DT
HH
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Forward the New Republic
Posts: 9131 | From: Ultima Thule | Registered: Jul 2005
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Alan Cresswell
Mad Scientist 先生
# 31
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Posted
But, we can presumably still call Baptist Trainfan all sorts of names in British languages for using "British" to mean "English"? It is almost up there in the "how to piss of the Scottish" league as American tourists declaring "We had a wonderful vacation in England, we saw Loch Ness and Edinboro castle ..."
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Don't cling to a mistake just because you spent a lot of time making it.
Posts: 32413 | From: East Kilbride (Scotland) or 福島 | Registered: May 2001
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Alan Cresswell
Mad Scientist 先生
# 31
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Posted
Quickly adding, of course, that that would only apply to some American tourists. Recognising that the majority of citizens of the United States are a) fully aware of the difference between Britain and England and b) are capable of pronouncing Edinburgh.
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Don't cling to a mistake just because you spent a lot of time making it.
Posts: 32413 | From: East Kilbride (Scotland) or 福島 | Registered: May 2001
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Albertus
Shipmate
# 13356
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Posted
...and perhaps some of them are even aware enough of the differences to want to wind up the Scots ![[Smile]](smile.gif)
Posts: 6498 | From: Y Sowth | Registered: Jan 2008
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Tubbs
Miss Congeniality
# 440
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Erroneous Monk:
So I'm thinking that the decent people on both sides of the debate want the same thing. They just disagree on the order of events. Some think that if you invest in people - education, care, housing, lives - you create a workforce that makes business strong. Others think that if you make business strong, it invests in people in the aforementioned ways, and you get the same outcome.
I guess this time around, enough people managed to persuade themselves that:
a) the second version *might* be true; and
b) if it isn't, they aren't in the immediate firing line
to vote the Conservatives back in.
I think very few people mean to hurt others.
Maybe we should talk about the results we can all celebrate ie South Thanet and Bradford West.
And Wirral West.
Then there's an oppoortunity to speculate what some of them will do next ... House, Jungle or Strictly, Celebrity Masterchef or day time quiz shows ... ![[Snigger]](graemlins/snigger.gif)
The hashtag #edballs4strictly seems to be gaining some traction on Twitter. Although it seems unlikely. But there are a few that I'd cheerfully nominate for a few minutes in a tub with a load of creepy crawlies being thrown over them.
Irritatingly, there's talk of kicking some of the MPs who lost their seats upstairs to the Lords so they can continue making a contribution and their talents aren't lost. Which proves that many people directly involved in the politcal process don't have a clue. If we'd wanted them involved, we'd have voted for them. We didn't, so they should be excluded from the honours process for a bit.
Tubbs
[ 13. May 2015, 11:59: Message edited by: Tubbs ]
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"It's better to keep your mouth shut and be thought a fool than open it up and remove all doubt" - Dennis Thatcher. My blog. Decide for yourself which I am
Posts: 12701 | From: Someplace strange | Registered: Jun 2001
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ExclamationMark
Shipmate
# 14715
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Tubbs:
...so they should be excluded from the honours process for a bit.
For " a bit" read permanently. Nothing sadder than a class warrior like Prescott campaigning to abolish the other place, then going into it. Traitor.
Posts: 3845 | From: A new Jerusalem | Registered: Apr 2009
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Tubbs
Miss Congeniality
# 440
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by ExclamationMark:
quote:
Originally posted by Tubbs:
...so they should be excluded from the honours process for a bit.
For " a bit" read permanently. Nothing sadder than a class warrior like Prescott campaigning to abolish the other place, then going into it. Traitor.
The ones being touted this time include McVey, Alexander and a few others. I've got no problem with someone getting a gong a few years after they've lost their seat. But almost immediately after an election?! No chance. That's just attempting to sneak someone back into policy making via the backdoor.
Prescott is another problem entirely!
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"It's better to keep your mouth shut and be thought a fool than open it up and remove all doubt" - Dennis Thatcher. My blog. Decide for yourself which I am
Posts: 12701 | From: Someplace strange | Registered: Jun 2001
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Albertus
Shipmate
# 13356
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Posted
Peerages tend not to be treated as 'gongs' nowadays- there's pretty much always an expectation that new peers will be what used to be called 'working peers'.
But if you've lost somebody from Parliament who you think is valuable after an election, what's necessarily wrong - given for a moment that we have a House of Lords- with giving them a seat in the Lords so that they can continue to make a contribution? The job isn't the same as an MP's job, not least because the prospects for advancement are quite rightly much more limited. I wouldn't want the whole upper house (in whatever form) to be composed of 'rejects' from the Commons, but there's a place for a few people with experience who have been defeated at the polls.
Posts: 6498 | From: Y Sowth | Registered: Jan 2008
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Tubbs
Miss Congeniality
# 440
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Albertus:
Peerages tend not to be treated as 'gongs' nowadays- there's pretty much always an expectation that new peers will be what used to be called 'working peers'.
But if you've lost somebody from Parliament who you think is valuable after an election, what's necessarily wrong - given for a moment that we have a House of Lords- with giving them a seat in the Lords so that they can continue to make a contribution? The job isn't the same as an MP's job, not least because the prospects for advancement are quite rightly much more limited. I wouldn't want the whole upper house (in whatever form) to be composed of 'rejects' from the Commons, but there's a place for a few people with experience who have been defeated at the polls.
But not immediately or shortly after the election. There should be some sort of meaningful gap between an MP losing their seat and becoming a working peer. Say of between a year to five years. Let them go out and find a proper job outside the political bubble for a bit.
And frankly, having seen McVey's "contribution", I'm not convinced there is ever a place for someone with that kind of "experience". This is a woman who told a journalist that they were making too much about deaths and hardship resulting from benefit sanctions.
There have been at least 49 documented deaths. The only reason we know about those is due to Freedom of Information requests. The DWP wouldn't dream of supplying that kind of information.
When asked to provide updated figures, the DWP refused. The Information Commissioner has told them they have to but not until after the election. Can't think why.
Tubbs
[ 13. May 2015, 15:11: Message edited by: Tubbs ]
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"It's better to keep your mouth shut and be thought a fool than open it up and remove all doubt" - Dennis Thatcher. My blog. Decide for yourself which I am
Posts: 12701 | From: Someplace strange | Registered: Jun 2001
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Belle Ringer
Shipmate
# 13379
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Tubbs:
There should be some sort of meaningful gap between an MP losing their seat and becoming a working peer. Say of between a year to five years. Let them go out and find a proper job outside the political bubble for a bit.
In my country, those laid off from legislature don't get a real job where they have to make ends meet and worry about lay-off and work extra without pay at the boss's whim. They get a "rent my name for your "non-political" partisan think tank letterhead or lawyer office door, collect "billable hours" to eat lunch with moneybags and to work on planning the next election.
No real world for the ruling class.
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