Posted                      

quote:

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Originally posted by Pigwidgeon:
Whereas, if gays are not allowed to marry each other, they'll all turn straight, marry people of the opposite sex, and start producing lots of babies.

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Posted                          

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Originally posted by SvitlanaV2:
FWIW, in IngoB's homeland, Germany, the population is facing precipitous decline.

Perhaps a little serious Catholicism there to boost the population wouldn't be such a dreadful thing. In the absence of practising Catholics, though, practising Muslims will probably have to do.

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Posted                      

quote:

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Originally posted by Starlight:

quote:

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Originally posted by Pigwidgeon:
Whereas, if gays are not allowed to marry each other, they'll all turn straight, marry people of the opposite sex, and start producing lots of babies.

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Exactly.

It's also crucial that we ban same sex couples from raising children via adoption, IVF, or artificial methods, because otherwise we will experience overpopulation, and DIE.

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Posted                      

art dunce, thank you for sharing that heartwarming story.



Now, back to our regularly scheduled sarcasm and Ingo mocking sessions...

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Originally posted by orfeo:
I don't think Ingo's a racist. He might be a religionist, but there are plenty of Latin American Catholics doing their bit for the cause. Heck, they even have their own Pope now.

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Originally posted by Starlight:
but this is the hell board

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Originally posted by Karl: Liberal Backslider:
... Equal Marriage will leave the toilet seat up ...

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Only when it's between two blokes ...

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I may not be on an island any more, but I'm still an islander.
alto n a soprano who can read music

Posted                       

quote:

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Originally posted by Pigwidgeon:
]Whereas, if gays are not allowed to marry each other, they'll all turn straight, marry people of the opposite sex, and start producing lots of babies.

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Originally posted by orfeo:

The need of the human race to procreate is not the need of any individual human being to procreate. The need of the human race to procreate is not the duty of every human being to procreate.

Really, the argument you're making founders on that confusion. No one suggests that every human being must create food despite the fact that all human beings must eat.

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Don't you know that social animals are immoral?

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Originally posted by Starlight:
I guess not everyone shares my sense of humour.

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Originally posted by Macrina:
Many here would say he is prejudiced towards gay people but I actually don't think that's fair - he has religious convictions (that I think are wrong) that tell him he must take a certain view - same unjust and wrong result but different starting point than blanket and ignorant hatred.

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Originally posted by Starlight:

The problem I have with such people is that their reasoning tends to completely leave out considering the wellbeing of the people involved. If they'd lived a couple of hundred years earlier, it would be like them discussing the topic of whether slavery is biblical, without at all thinking that it might be relevant to consider whether slavery had negative effects on the slaves.

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Posted                   

quote:

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Originally posted by Starlight:

quote:

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Originally posted by Pigwidgeon:
Whereas, if gays are not allowed to marry each other, they'll all turn straight, marry people of the opposite sex, and start producing lots of babies.

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Exactly.

It's also crucial that we ban same sex couples from raising children via adoption, IVF, or artificial methods, because otherwise we will experience overpopulation, and DIE.

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Posted                      

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Originally posted by Starlight:
I often think internet forum posts are a bit like inkblot tests, as the ways people choose to resolve ambiguities and infer different emotions often says a lot about the interpreter.

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Originally posted by orfeo:
The fact that any particular subset of the human race might be in decline isn't the same as the human race being in decline, unless you start valuing certain members of the human race more than others.
[...]
In terms of Germany as a geographic location, there are plenty of people to import from elsewhere.

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Originally posted by SvitlanaV2:
... If I remember rightly, you're Canadian. What you need to understand is that the rest of the world hasn't quite been psychologically 'Canadianised'. ...

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Originally posted by Louise:
I don't agree with Chesterbelloc on this, but I'd like to thank him for sticking around and contributing on something where he's very much in the minority. I appreciate it even when I don't agree.

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Posted                       

quote:

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Originally posted by Starlight:

quote:

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Originally posted by Macrina:
Many here would say he is prejudiced towards gay people but I actually don't think that's fair - he has religious convictions (that I think are wrong) that tell him he must take a certain view - same unjust and wrong result but different starting point than blanket and ignorant hatred.

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The problem I have with such people is that their reasoning tends to completely leave out considering the wellbeing of the people involved. If they'd lived a couple of hundred years earlier, it would be like them discussing the topic of whether slavery is biblical, without at all thinking that it might be relevant to consider whether slavery had negative effects on the slaves.

It's a level of disinterest in the wellbeing of other humans that I find downright scary whenever I encounter it... it seems to evidence such a complete lack of empathy as to border on the psychopathic. But a lot of these sorts of people turn out to be otherwise good people, who if they actually knew and understood the harms they were doing to gay people they would be genuinely horrified. But they simply don't think to even explore that issue... they don't even actively reflect on questions of how gay people might feel about the situation, or what their motivations might be for wanting rights, or what harms might be done to them by denying those rights.

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Originally posted by mousethief:
FWIW, I took Starlight to be mocking people attacking IngoB, not attributing Nazidom to IngoB himself.

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You win a prize for correct interpretation.

It was intended as satire of people on the internet in forums like this one making unfounded Nazi analogies. But clearly, Poe's law applies.

[ 19. July 2015, 02:04: Message edited by: Starlight ]

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Originally posted by Starlight:
I often think internet forum posts are a bit like inkblot tests, as the ways people choose to resolve ambiguities and infer different emotions often says a lot about the interpreter.

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Originally posted by orfeo:
This would be relevant if you were ambiguous. You weren't - you explicitly referenced Nazism.

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And importantly, your post was sorely lacking in the kind of signals one needs in a text forum to indicate irony.

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I thought it was possible that's what you were trying to do, but really you did a pretty poor job of it.

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I posted it at 2am, so it was never going to be my best work.

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Saying you were joking doesn't actually save you from the fact that you weren't being funny.

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You are, of course, the objective judge of humour.

Posted                          

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Originally posted by Starlight:
You are, of course, the objective judge of humour.

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Posted                       

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Originally posted by Organ Builder:
orfeo is not Canadian, so Svitlana's rather condescending point is also rather immaterial.

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SvitlanaV2: All this being the case, it's hard to see how the cause of gay rights - and other liberal rights - in the future is likely to be served by increasing immigration to places like Germany, an option that you suggested was the best way to deal with the low German birthrate.

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quote:

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Originally posted by SvitlanaV2:
... What you need to understand is that the rest of the world hasn't quite been psychologically 'Canadianised'. Governments will have to do a lot more work to convince ordinary Germans, Englishmen, Poles and everyone else that all that matters is making use of geographical space, and that there's no particular cultural value in Germanness, Englishness, or Polishness, etc., as such. ...

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Originally posted by lilBuddha:
Rabid secularists. Rabid secularists? Such an odd phrase, generally trotted out by those who think their religion is under attack when their privilege is threatened.
What is wrong with the state being separated from religion? It doesn't mean religion goes away, look at the US.
Hmmm, maybe you are correct. US religious nutters manage to incorporate religion into everything, maybe the state can serve to better muzzle the rabid dogs of intolerance.

Just to clarify, I'm not anti-religion. Just anti state religion.

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Originally posted by SvitlanaV2:
I don't understand how my point is condescending.

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Posted                       

quote:

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Originally posted by Chesterbelloc:


It's the Fall, innit.

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Posted                       

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Originally posted by SvitlanaV2:

Nevertheless, I don't understand how my point is condescending. ...
The assumption on the Left is that the ideal modern nation is both multicultural yet also socially liberal, but creating harmony between these two elements is not always easy. If the liberal element declines because of a low birthrate and immigration increases the more conservative element that's likely to present challenges at some point.

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Posted                       

quote:

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Originally posted by Leaf:

quote:

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Originally posted by SvitlanaV2:
I don't understand how my point is condescending.

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What you need to understand is that "what you need to understand" is a condescending way to begin a sentence.

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Posted                       

quote:

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Originally posted by Soror Magna:

quote:

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Originally posted by SvitlanaV2:
... What you need to understand is that the rest of the world hasn't quite been psychologically 'Canadianised'. Governments will have to do a lot more work to convince ordinary Germans, Englishmen, Poles and everyone else that all that matters is making use of geographical space, and that there's no particular cultural value in Germanness, Englishness, or Polishness, etc., as such. ...

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Well, that's obviously a misunderstanding of Canada's commitment to multiculturalism. We actually do think there is value in Englishness and Polishness. We just don't think that they are more valuable or need to be protected or separated from e.g. Punjabiness or Beijingness. One hundred years ago, my neighbourhood was a working class area for colonists from the UK who built their own houses from kits. Today it is a complete scramble of Aboriginal, Filipino, Latin American, Middle Eastern, North African, South-East Asian, you name it, plus yuppies and hipsters looking for cheap(er) real estate in the centre of town. Many of those 100-year-old kit houses are still here, now homes to immigrant families or groups of university students. The Anglican church bills itself as "a multi-ethnic community of richness and diversity ... determined to be free of racism and we are a community that provides meals for the poor." The best pizzeria in the area is operated by a family from Afghanistan, and the best sushi is made by a chef from Korea.

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Posted                       

quote:

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Originally posted by SvitlanaV2:


Nevertheless, I'm still not convinced that our societies (especially outside the most multicultural areas) are prepared for the kinds of challenges that lie ahead.

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quote:

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The people of the world will do as they see best, as is their right, with regards to SSM, immigration or anything else. I simply wanted to point out that replacing one culture with another (as someone proposed in an earlier post) may not necessarily serve the interests of all groups in society. This is not just about immigration either; all cultures change regardless of immigration, and there are always winners and losers.

But in the long run it's all in God's hands and we're all dead, so I'm not complaining as such. I do find it interesting, though.

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