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Source: (consider it)
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Thread: How do you see time?
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Martin60
Shipmate
# 368
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Posted
Perfect balaam.
cliffdweller, we agree on the meaninglessness of God, The Movie, we've got the same DNA there. But we're hybridized differently with other species with regard to creation.
And I'm being too fair there. The unvigorous, sterile hybridization is entirely yours. The God, The Movie school is coherent based on that totally unnecessary but quaint premiss.
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Love wins
Posts: 17586 | From: Never Dobunni after all. Corieltauvi after all. Just moved to the capital. | Registered: Jun 2001
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cliffdweller
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# 13338
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Posted
I have no idea whether to feel delighted or offended or simply misunderstood by that. ![[Eek!]](eek.gif)
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Posts: 11242 | From: a small canyon overlooking the city | Registered: Jan 2008
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ChastMastr
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# 716
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by cliffdweller:
I would argue that this default view of the "timelessness" of God is pretty much incompatible with both Scripture and Reason.
... I suppose we'll just have to disagree, then. Indeed, it's the only description of God's nature that has ever made sense to me, fitting with Reason and Scripture.
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Church tradition is pretty diverse on this topic
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even within discrete groups much less from one group to another. Heck, even Calvin himself is internally inconsistent.
Ah, I mean Christian Tradition in terms of mainly the Catholic/Orthodox end of the spectrum. No offense to any Calvinists, but I would not include Calvinism as part of the kind of Tradition I'm talking about at all, for instance.
[ 25. May 2015, 20:03: Message edited by: ChastMastr ]
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My essays on comics continuity: http://chastmastr.tumblr.com/tagged/continuity
Posts: 14068 | From: Clearwater, Florida | Registered: Jul 2001
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ChastMastr
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# 716
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by balaam:
But the God fully outside time idea breaks down in that it isn't just through God becoming man that God relates within our time frame.
I think it is better to say that God transcends time (and, indeed, everything else--any other dimensions, etc.). He's not just outside of it, like a moon in orbit peering down with a telescope, but he's not just inside it either.
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My essays on comics continuity: http://chastmastr.tumblr.com/tagged/continuity
Posts: 14068 | From: Clearwater, Florida | Registered: Jul 2001
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cliffdweller
Shipmate
# 13338
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by ChastMastr:
quote:
Originally posted by cliffdweller:
[qb] I would argue that this default view of the "timelessness" of Church tradition is pretty diverse on this topic
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even within discrete groups much less from one group to another. Heck, even Calvin himself is internally inconsistent.
Ah, I mean Christian Tradition in terms of mainly the Catholic/Orthodox end of the spectrum. No offense to any Calvinists, but I would not include Calvinism as part of the kind of Tradition I'm talking about at all, for instance.
Obviously I was including Calvin, but also the Catholic/Orthodox spectrum as well.
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"Here is the world. Beautiful and terrible things will happen. Don't be afraid." -Frederick Buechner
Posts: 11242 | From: a small canyon overlooking the city | Registered: Jan 2008
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cliffdweller
Shipmate
# 13338
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by ChastMastr:
quote:
Originally posted by balaam:
But the God fully outside time idea breaks down in that it isn't just through God becoming man that God relates within our time frame.
I think it is better to say that God transcends time (and, indeed, everything else--any other dimensions, etc.). He's not just outside of it, like a moon in orbit peering down with a telescope, but he's not just inside it either.
Some Open Theists would espouse a view somewhat similar to that, fwiw-- that God inherently transcends time, but voluntarily chose to create and enter into a time-dependent universe because that is the only way to have relationship with his creatures.
[ 25. May 2015, 22:47: Message edited by: cliffdweller ]
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"Here is the world. Beautiful and terrible things will happen. Don't be afraid." -Frederick Buechner
Posts: 11242 | From: a small canyon overlooking the city | Registered: Jan 2008
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Martin60
Shipmate
# 368
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Posted
Both. What have I misunderstood? You believe in the demiurge. That creation was somehow changed for the bad in the second Planck tick or less in the person of Satan, having just been created good, who then changed all creation that followed. That makes God The Movie reasonable by comparison.
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Love wins
Posts: 17586 | From: Never Dobunni after all. Corieltauvi after all. Just moved to the capital. | Registered: Jun 2001
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OliviaCA
Shipmate
# 18399
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Posted
Something I love to think about is that, in this model world that we live in anyway, the future changes the past.
eg. Do you remember when dinosaurs had bare scaly/leathery skin, and no feathers?
![[Smile]](smile.gif)
[ 27. May 2015, 12:35: Message edited by: OliviaCA ]
Posts: 91 | From: Europe | Registered: May 2015
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Brenda Clough
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# 18061
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Posted
I remember when the future was supposed to have flying cars.
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OliviaCA
Shipmate
# 18399
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Brenda Clough:
I remember when the future was supposed to have flying cars.
Yes, but that's just normal.
The future changing the past, that is awesome.
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Posts: 91 | From: Europe | Registered: May 2015
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Schroedinger's cat
Ship's cool cat
# 64
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by OliviaCA:
Something I love to think about is that, in this model world that we live in anyway, the future changes the past.
eg. Do you remember when dinosaurs had bare scaly/leathery skin, and no feathers?
I don't because, despite appearances, I am not old enough to remember the dinosaurs.
While I know what you mean, this is not actually changing the past - it is improving our perception of it. Nothing has actually changed, but our understanding of it is now improved - that is progress.
It is well known that hindsight is 20:20. Actually, it isn't by a long way, but we do get a different and often bigger perspective of the past. We can see events in a new perspective, different, but not necessarily better than before. the thing is, we now think we know more about dinosaurs than we used to, but we still have a very small number of artefacts, we still know very very little. I suspect that if we were able to travel to the time of the dinosaurs, we would be in for some serious surprises.
History - that is, our way of seeing the past - nearly died as an academic study, because they realised just how distorted any view of the past was, because the insights we have are so few. We don't know know MORE, we know DIFFERENT. Science is the process of extrapolating from what we know to what we don't. But in truth, the whole structure of reality NOW is very flimsy, the structure of reality in the past (or the future) is even more so.
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