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Source: (consider it)
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Thread: Sex robots - should they be banned?
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SvitlanaV2
Shipmate
# 16967
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by mousethief:
The GOP in the US has spent a great deal of money and political capital to demonize unmarried women who have sex, to make birth control difficult or impossible to get, to specifically make it legal to fire women for using birth control, and so forth. They seem to be VERY interested in limiting the sexual behavior of their people. Or of the female ones, at least.
[...]
You are confusing what they want to do with how good they are at it.
They seem to be very bad at it even when the Republican party is in office. This suggests to me that only a small portion of them really agree with this agenda. They don't seem to be giving it their all.
The capitalists among them are probably in conflict with the moralists.
Posts: 6668 | From: UK | Registered: Feb 2012
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cliffdweller
Shipmate
# 13338
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by SvitlanaV2:
This suggests to me that only a small portion of them really agree with this agenda. They don't seem to be giving it their all.
The capitalists among them are probably in conflict with the moralists.
I think the capitalists among them are callously and deliberately using/ manipulating the moralists.
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"Here is the world. Beautiful and terrible things will happen. Don't be afraid." -Frederick Buechner
Posts: 11242 | From: a small canyon overlooking the city | Registered: Jan 2008
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Kelly Alves
Bunny with an axe
# 2522
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by lilBuddha:
Yeah, I think you are wrong. As I've stated several times, current sex toys are not in the same class as robots can be. I think the link Kelly has about male prostitutes is telling. Though it focuses on women, ISTM, men also use prostitutes for more than just a warm set of orifices. Probably to a lower percentage than women, but likely more than you thin. .
This is the thing-- most sensual services-- be it massage or sex-- are marketed to men, and mostly provided by women.Whether a hetero man needs a woman to give a foot rub, a cuddle, or a blow job, he has a bounty of options aavailable to him.
After I wrote the above, I checked the Cuddle Buddy site again, this time being directed to their FB page. The admin had posted an article stating men liked cuddling more than women.
First of all, I would love to see who participated in that study, and how the questions were phrased, because I bet there was a factor of women downplaying their cuddle needs in order not to appear prudish about sex, because ( second of all) women are mammals. Eveything with skin on needs to cuddle. It's not up for debate, healthy cortisol levels depend on skin to skin contact. Women usually get this by providing it, but it seems like people struggle with the idea that they actually need it too. And IMO this was just the CEO's bullshit justification for not figuring out an effective way to provide this service to women.
(I'm not talking about individuals, I'm talking about survey takers and Cuddle Buddy CEO's, and a Larger Public Attitude. Although it is interesting that my defense of robot surrogates for women spins right back into a discussion of men's needs.)
[ 19. September 2015, 14:33: Message edited by: Kelly Alves ]
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I cannot expect people to believe “
Jesus loves me, this I know” of they don’t believe “Kelly loves me, this I know.”
Kelly Alves, somewhere around 2003.
Posts: 35076 | From: Pura Californiana | Registered: Mar 2002
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mousethief
Ship's Thieving Rodent
# 953
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by cliffdweller:
quote:
Originally posted by SvitlanaV2:
This suggests to me that only a small portion of them really agree with this agenda. They don't seem to be giving it their all.
The capitalists among them are probably in conflict with the moralists.
I think the capitalists among them are callously and deliberately using/ manipulating the moralists.
This. And if they completely eliminate the behaviors they claim to stand against, then they lose that leverage. But the moralists are, indeed, dead set against women enjoying sex. When the moralists gain the upper hand, which tends to happen at the state level rather than the national level, women suffer.
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This is the last sig I'll ever write for you...
Posts: 63536 | From: Washington | Registered: Jul 2001
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SvitlanaV2
Shipmate
# 16967
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by mousethief:
The moralists are, indeed, dead set against women enjoying sex. When the moralists gain the upper hand, which tends to happen at the state level rather than the national level, women suffer.
Well, I suppose the immoral majority (as it were) need to stand up for their freedoms and refuse to be cowed. They must have some comfort in the knowledge that most of the country doesn't share the moralists' agenda.
I wonder if the moralists would see any mileage in trying to ban sex robots? In this case, it's hard to see how the capitalists would let them win, since if these robots became popular there'd be a huge amount of money to be made.
Posts: 6668 | From: UK | Registered: Feb 2012
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Soror Magna
Shipmate
# 9881
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Posted
A sexbot would be a great way for a couple to have a three-way. Two bots and you have a real party.
And let's face it, we're perfectly happy with robotics doing all sorts of other things for us. We want them to clean our houses, do the shopping, drive our cars, and look after our elders. ISTM the main reason anyone wants to draw the line at sexbots is because we also make a distinction between sex work and every other kind of work for humans. In other words, if we think it is bad for humans to prostitute themselves, then it is bad to make robots do it. But most of the time we're perfectly happy to have robots do all sorts of other stuff that we don't want to do.
So let's picture a future where care facilities are staffed by a few people and lots and lots of robots who can monitor patients and be programmed to do all sorts of activities with them - sing songs, exercise, read a book, do crafts .... Where's the outcry that eldercare robots will mean that nobody will visit their relatives and we will lose our humanity? Oh, wait. That happens already.
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"You come with me to room 1013 over at the hospital, I'll show you America. Terminal, crazy and mean." -- Tony Kushner, "Angels in America"
Posts: 5430 | From: Caprica City | Registered: Jul 2005
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Brenda Clough
Shipmate
# 18061
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Posted
If you want legislation to ban sexbots, then the morality/dehumanzing angle is not the way to attack the issue. The clue is upthread -- the wincing, when a man contemplates putting his personal organ into something like a Waring blender. Safety, that's the ticket. One horrific accident with a mis-programmed sexbot and the cry will go up for stringent safety regulation. Imagine it, the YouTube video, the interviews on web sites illustrated with horrid color photographs, the outpouring of rage. And from there to limit marketing and distribution is easy.
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Science fiction and fantasy writer with a Patreon page
Posts: 6378 | From: Washington DC | Registered: Mar 2014
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cliffdweller
Shipmate
# 13338
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by SvitlanaV2:
quote:
Originally posted by mousethief:
The moralists are, indeed, dead set against women enjoying sex. When the moralists gain the upper hand, which tends to happen at the state level rather than the national level, women suffer.
Well, I suppose the immoral majority (as it were) need to stand up for their freedoms and refuse to be cowed. They must have some comfort in the knowledge that most of the country doesn't share the moralists' agenda.
I wonder if the moralists would see any mileage in trying to ban sex robots? In this case, it's hard to see how the capitalists would let them win, since if these robots became popular there'd be a huge amount of money to be made.
But again, the capitalists are gaining far more from their exploitation of the moralists than they could make even from the lucrative sex robot market.
Look at the abortion debate. The GOP has managed to maintain this reputation as the "pro-life party" for decades, based entirely on a line in their political platform. A couple of words. They've never done a single thing to actually back that up with any real action, legislative or otherwise. In fact, the economic policies of the GOP have been shown to actually increase abortions, while those of the DNC (like, say, funding contraception, child care, WIC, etc) decreases abortion.
No matter. The reputation for being "pro-life" has garnered the GOP the undying loyalty of a large cadre of conservative Christian moralists, without them having to lift a finger to support it. Leaving the capitalists free to do quite a lot of very not-very-pro-life things like wage wars, increase poverty, and block access to health care-- no matter. The capitalists have enticed these mostly working-class moralists to vote against their own interests, giving them (the wealthy capitalists) huge tax breaks again and again at the expense of the working class.
Quite brilliant actually.
And because the profit is really in the conflict, the capitalists don't really want to end anything. The worst thing in the world for the capitalists would be if abortion were outlawed tomorrow-- not because of economic interests but because they'd lose that leverage which allows them to do anything they want as long as they are still "pro-life" in name only. So the capitalists would never actually go so far as to outlaw sex robots. Their goal would be to keep them legal-- and controversial. In fact, the more ubiquitous and creepy/ icky they are, the better. Just like with the abortion debate, they will scream loudly against them, vilify those who use them, and do nothing whatsoever to actually get rid of them.
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"Here is the world. Beautiful and terrible things will happen. Don't be afraid." -Frederick Buechner
Posts: 11242 | From: a small canyon overlooking the city | Registered: Jan 2008
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rolyn
Shipmate
# 16840
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Posted
Is it worth over-thinking this.? I mean we are just talking about a bunk- up with a bot after all .
These things often tend to be associated with dirty old men, so I glad the matter of vibrators has been mentioned with the possibility of sex-bots for females.
The health and safety issue sounds rather minimal to me, unless we're getting into the realms of robots short circuiting while in use, or some such fantastical catastrophe that never happens. I should have thought H&S issues surrounding inter-human sex are far more real.
The psychological issues are as yet untested. Maybe there will be the odd case of some folk forming unhealthy relationships with these things, pleasuring themselves to the point of starvation. But aren't there already cases of this with youngsters playing computer games contiuously for days on end til they drop dead?
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Change is the only certainty of existence
Posts: 3206 | From: U.K. | Registered: Dec 2011
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Boogie
Boogie on down!
# 13538
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Soror Magna:
So let's picture a future where care facilities are staffed by a few people and lots and lots of robots who can monitor patients and be programmed to do all sorts of activities with them - sing songs, exercise, read a book, do crafts .... Where's the outcry that eldercare robots will mean that nobody will visit their relatives and we will lose our humanity? Oh, wait. That happens already.
What do you mean, future?
It's happening right now.
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Garden. Room. Walk
Posts: 13030 | From: Boogie Wonderland | Registered: Mar 2008
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Kelly Alves
Bunny with an axe
# 2522
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by rolyn:
These things often tend to be associated with dirty old men, so I glad the matter of vibrators has been mentioned with the possibility of sex-bots for females.
While the three or four nods in this conversation toward "women might like this, too" are an encouraging sign, the idea I was proposing is a lot stronger. I am suggesting that women should be the primary target group for this product.
I'm really not joking. Hear me out:
1. Women tend to outlive men by (pokes around on internet) roughly ten years. That means, a lot of heterosexual women will spend a fair amount of time without partners. simply down to biology alone.
2. (But they can remarry, you say!) The average 40+ woman checking out Match.com or the like is looking for someone roughly her own age., The average 40+ n is looking for someone significantly younger. Do the math. More unpartnered heterosexual women.
3. Casual sex has risk,but women will have more heightened concerns about assault and pregnancy (I now some men are assaulted via casual encounters, too, but as far as I know the risk of male pregnancy is nil.) Also, unlike with the paid options that men have, casual sex has no "get off or get your money back" guarantee.
4. Engaging a male prostitute (who doesn't come with a resume an inch thick) carries nearly e same risks as the above. You don't know what you are getting until the guy shows up. (famously, a man advertised his "services" on Craiglists as a way to lure them into being one of his murder victims.)
5. While the pros in the article sweetly assured the readers that they had no problem- um- preparing for the task at hand, even if they weren't particularly inspired, a less-than--stunning woman might not want to cross her fingers and hope for that level of dedication.
6. Why would a guy want to make a (say) $150,000 investment, which he will have to pay off forever, for something he can walk down the block and get for $50, or pick up the phone and get for $200?(correct me, ladies, if you are out there)? As I said, hetero male options for the entire spectrum of sensual activity are abundant. It's the 40+ chick who is sick of guys expecting her to be 20 that will more likely make that kind of investment.
****
Now here's what I do find amusing-- what if my idea took off? What if I became the CEO of MenschBot, and women everywhere had one tucked in their closet? (along with the appropriate antimicrobial cleaning products). Imagine the convolutions moralists would have to go through to paint this as a problem:
"One sided sex breeds selfishness and isolation!" Yeah, which is why you are storming the offices of Fleshlight, right?
"Feminist dismissal of men!" Well, the target market would be dismissed by men to begin with, so what is your beef?
"Unnatural removal of sexual urges from relationships!" See Fleshlight, see also porn, red light districts, lap/ pole dance, etc.
An egg would never combine with a sperm, ever, so any complaints for the Pro-life squad would be irrelevant.
Basically every argument they could have would be so quickly matched by a counter-argument based on examples of things guys do all the time that Foster Friess will be reduced to screaming "YOU DON'T GET IT, YOU SLUTS! IT'S ALL ABOUT US! YOUR BODY IS DESIGNED TO GIVE US AN ORGASM! YOUR ORGASM IS DESIGNED TO GIVE US FEEDBACK ABOUT OUR PROWESS! WHEN YOU HAVE SEX YOU DO IT OUR WAY!"
Now,that would be funny. ![[Big Grin]](biggrin.gif)
[ 19. September 2015, 19:32: Message edited by: Kelly Alves ]
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I cannot expect people to believe “
Jesus loves me, this I know” of they don’t believe “Kelly loves me, this I know.”
Kelly Alves, somewhere around 2003.
Posts: 35076 | From: Pura Californiana | Registered: Mar 2002
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mousethief
Ship's Thieving Rodent
# 953
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Kelly Alves:
4. Engaging a male prostitute (who doesn't come with a [censored] an inch thick) carries nearly the same risks ....
Gave me a... um... chuckle.
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This is the last sig I'll ever write for you...
Posts: 63536 | From: Washington | Registered: Jul 2001
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Brenda Clough
Shipmate
# 18061
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Posted
An entrepreneur need invest in only one or two of these sexbots, to start a fine rental business. A woman may not want to own one of her very own, any more than she wants to own her own car or her own power-washer or or her own evening gown. Lease it out! You'd have to send it out with a 'sanitized for your safety' paper banner in the appropriate place, of course.
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Science fiction and fantasy writer with a Patreon page
Posts: 6378 | From: Washington DC | Registered: Mar 2014
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Kelly Alves
Bunny with an axe
# 2522
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by mousethief:
quote:
Originally posted by Kelly Alves:
4. Engaging a male prostitute (who doesn't come with a [censored] an inch thick) carries nearly the same risks ....
Gave me a... um... chuckle.
I should have worked in something about robots being "stiff competition."
And some women would definitely require at last a 2 1/2 inch resume...STOP. IT.
[ 19. September 2015, 19:41: Message edited by: Kelly Alves ]
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I cannot expect people to believe “
Jesus loves me, this I know” of they don’t believe “Kelly loves me, this I know.”
Kelly Alves, somewhere around 2003.
Posts: 35076 | From: Pura Californiana | Registered: Mar 2002
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Kelly Alves
Bunny with an axe
# 2522
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Brenda Clough:
An entrepreneur need invest in only one or two of these sexbots, to start a fine rental business. A woman may not want to own one of her very own, any more than she wants to own her own car or her own power-washer or or her own evening gown. Lease it out! You'd have to send it out with a 'sanitized for your safety' paper banner in the appropriate place, of course.
You're hired.
(If you write a book on this, I better get a finder's fee.)
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I cannot expect people to believe “
Jesus loves me, this I know” of they don’t believe “Kelly loves me, this I know.”
Kelly Alves, somewhere around 2003.
Posts: 35076 | From: Pura Californiana | Registered: Mar 2002
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mousethief
Ship's Thieving Rodent
# 953
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Brenda Clough:
You'd have to send it out with a 'sanitized for your safety' paper banner in the appropriate place, of course.
And women could flip a switch to -um- rip the banner, so to speak.
ETA: And the robot could say, quite honestly, "You really turn me on."
[ 19. September 2015, 19:47: Message edited by: mousethief ]
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This is the last sig I'll ever write for you...
Posts: 63536 | From: Washington | Registered: Jul 2001
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Kelly Alves
Bunny with an axe
# 2522
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Posted
That would make a FANTASTIC commercial.
Sorry, Hosts, I really did have a point I was making about the unwillingness of people to consider the idea of marketing sex to women in the same way they do to men. As something they are entitled to enjoy, rather than something they provide to please people. As( I hate the word) a commodity they can acquire as well as distribute.
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I cannot expect people to believe “
Jesus loves me, this I know” of they don’t believe “Kelly loves me, this I know.”
Kelly Alves, somewhere around 2003.
Posts: 35076 | From: Pura Californiana | Registered: Mar 2002
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LeRoc
Famous Dutch pirate
# 3216
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Posted
(I like Kelly's idea ![[Smile]](smile.gif) )
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I know why God made the rhinoceros, it's because He couldn't see the rhinoceros, so He made the rhinoceros to be able to see it. (Clarice Lispector)
Posts: 9474 | From: Brazil / Africa | Registered: Aug 2002
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cliffdweller
Shipmate
# 13338
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Kelly Alves:
That would make a FANTASTIC commercial.
Sorry, Hosts, I really did have a point I was making about the unwillingness of people to consider the idea of marketing sex to women in the same way they do to men. As something they are entitled to enjoy, rather than something they provide to please people. As( I hate the word) a commodity they can acquire as well as distribute.
It worked well with mousethief's sig line.
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"Here is the world. Beautiful and terrible things will happen. Don't be afraid." -Frederick Buechner
Posts: 11242 | From: a small canyon overlooking the city | Registered: Jan 2008
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Brenda Clough
Shipmate
# 18061
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Posted
Book, pooh. We need to start a business. With secure payment, online. Prompt delivery and discreet pickup, in plain vans -- a sexbot could sit up nicely in the seat of a car, belted in with the seat belt. They probably cannot locomote (one of the rules of machine design is no extraneous moving parts, so all the design work is going elsewhere, eh?) and so one would need a handtruck. But that would be all the investment you would need.
As you so cogently point out, there is absolutely nothing inappropriate or sinful about this. No babies engendered, no diseases spread (if those sanitizing banners tell true) and nobody hurt at all. All upside, no down side whatever. We could make a fortune.
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Science fiction and fantasy writer with a Patreon page
Posts: 6378 | From: Washington DC | Registered: Mar 2014
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cliffdweller
Shipmate
# 13338
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Brenda Clough:
All upside, no down side whatever.
Surely the position would be up to the purchaser?
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"Here is the world. Beautiful and terrible things will happen. Don't be afraid." -Frederick Buechner
Posts: 11242 | From: a small canyon overlooking the city | Registered: Jan 2008
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mousethief
Ship's Thieving Rodent
# 953
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by cliffdweller:
quote:
Originally posted by Brenda Clough:
All upside, no down side whatever.
Surely the position would be up to the purchaser?
Or down to the purchaser.
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This is the last sig I'll ever write for you...
Posts: 63536 | From: Washington | Registered: Jul 2001
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ProgenitorDope
Apprentice
# 16648
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by lilBuddha:
quote:
Originally posted by mousethief:
I'm not sure women are driven into prostitution by the demand so much as by lack of alternatives. (I mean alternatives for THEM, not for their clients.)
It is both. Desperate women (and men) and a demand for those services.
quote:
Originally posted by ProgenitorDope:
I don't see it being much of an issue. We have blow up dolls, fleshlights (don't ask) and stuff I don't think I even want to know about. All the above seem to see more punchlines than climaxes, so to speak, and I imagine sexbots would be the same once the novelty wore off.
Yeah, I think you are wrong. As I've stated several times, current sex toys are not in the same class as robots can be. I think the link Kelly has about male prostitutes is telling. Though it focuses on women, ISTM, men also use prostitutes for more than just a warm set of orifices. Probably to a lower percentage than women, but likely more than you think. Sex robots, once they become sophisticated enough, will fill the same role. Perhaps to a greater degree, because of the disease issue and because they will be machines. Like enough to fuel the fantasy, unlike enough to remove a host of social and moral issues.
I'm sorry if I misunderstand you, but your argument is essentially that advanced enough, the robots would fulfill the companionship role and thus not be a novelty, right? I can see that raising a slew of new issues certainly (though I am a bit worried that I've read so much anti-trust lately my first thought to an issue was "anti-competitive effects on the prostitution market").
That said, I don't know if computers are anywhere near advanced enough yet for that. It's on the horizon people keep saying, but I think ethics of Sapient AI is another issue than this one. Essentially, I think that these sex bots would have all the interactive fulfillment of an X-rated Cleverbot.
Posts: 50 | Registered: Sep 2011
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lilBuddha
Shipmate
# 14333
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Kelly Alves:
This is the thing-- most sensual services-- be it massage or sex-- are marketed to men, and mostly provided by women.Whether a hetero man needs a woman to give a foot rub, a cuddle, or a blow job, he has a bounty of options aavailable to him.
Loads of cultural expectations and accepted ideas behind this.
quote:
Originally posted by Kelly Alves:
After I wrote the above, I checked the Cuddle Buddy site again, this time being directed to their FB page. The admin had posted an article stating men liked cuddling more than women.
This caused me a serious WTF? moment.
Touch, as you point out, is very much a thing with our species, male and female. Cultures have to condition it out
quote:
Originally posted by ProgenitorDope:
I'm sorry if I misunderstand you, but your argument is essentially that advanced enough, the robots would fulfill the companionship role and thus not be a novelty, right?
Essentially, yes. I don't think they would dominate* everyone's sexual experience, but I think they could have a significant market.
*Unless, of course, that is your thing
quote:
Originally posted by Brenda Clough:
They probably cannot locomote (one of the rules of machine design is no extraneous moving parts, so all the design work is going elsewhere, eh?) and so one would need a handtruck. But that would be all the investment you would need.
OK, so you just want a RealDoll with a couple of motors added and perhaps some chat? They appear to be working on that.
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I put on my rockin' shoes in the morning
Hallellou, hallellou
Posts: 17627 | From: the round earth's imagined corners | Registered: Dec 2008
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mousethief
Ship's Thieving Rodent
# 953
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by lilBuddha:
I don't think they would dominate* everyone's sexual experience, but I think they could have a significant market.
*Unless, of course, that is your thing
What's my safe key combination?
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This is the last sig I'll ever write for you...
Posts: 63536 | From: Washington | Registered: Jul 2001
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Kelly Alves
Bunny with an axe
# 2522
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by lilBuddha:
quote:
Originally posted by Kelly Alves:
This caused me a serious WTF? moment.
Touch, as you point out, is very much a thing with our species, male and female. Cultures have to condition it out
For real. That just convinced me the CEO was justifying her decision to focus on what seemed to her to be the easiest moneymaker. Or maybe she doesn't understand that the legions of women she has recruited for this enterprise took the job because they think cuddling is fun, too. When you give a hug, you get skin/ cortisol enrichment as well.
If anything, maybe women who took the survey were reluctant to admit to liking cuddling because women who ask for cuddling are "high maintenance" Which goes back to the idea (some seem to have) that anything sexual/ sensual a man does for a woman is an extravagant gift worthy of high praise and anything a woman does for a man is-- part of the job description.
Forgive me, guys, I am sure in an enlightened group such I am addressing that kind of idea is a rarity. Just keep picturing Foster Friess.
[ 20. September 2015, 00:09: Message edited by: Kelly Alves ]
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I cannot expect people to believe “
Jesus loves me, this I know” of they don’t believe “Kelly loves me, this I know.”
Kelly Alves, somewhere around 2003.
Posts: 35076 | From: Pura Californiana | Registered: Mar 2002
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mousethief
Ship's Thieving Rodent
# 953
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Kelly Alves:
Forgive me, guys, I am sure in an enlightened group such I am addressing that kind of idea is a rarity. Just keep picturing Foster Friess.
If I told Josephine she had a "job description" which included making me happy she'd make some wise crack and then launch into a philosophical discussion about gender roles and agreed-upon marital expectations. Then fetch me a beer and my slippers and pipe.
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This is the last sig I'll ever write for you...
Posts: 63536 | From: Washington | Registered: Jul 2001
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lilBuddha
Shipmate
# 14333
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by mousethief:
quote:
Originally posted by lilBuddha:
I don't think they would dominate* everyone's sexual experience, but I think they could have a significant market.
*Unless, of course, that is your thing
What's my safe key combination?
Left nipple, left nipple, belly button, belly button, right nipple, Thrust
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I put on my rockin' shoes in the morning
Hallellou, hallellou
Posts: 17627 | From: the round earth's imagined corners | Registered: Dec 2008
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mousethief
Ship's Thieving Rodent
# 953
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by lilBuddha:
Left nipple, left nipple, belly button, belly button, right nipple, Thrust
Thank you. What do I owe you?
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This is the last sig I'll ever write for you...
Posts: 63536 | From: Washington | Registered: Jul 2001
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lilBuddha
Shipmate
# 14333
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by mousethief:
quote:
Originally posted by lilBuddha:
Left nipple, left nipple, belly button, belly button, right nipple, Thrust
Thank you. What do I owe you?
No need to thank me, I was more concerned with the dignity of the robot. ![[Biased]](wink.gif)
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I put on my rockin' shoes in the morning
Hallellou, hallellou
Posts: 17627 | From: the round earth's imagined corners | Registered: Dec 2008
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rolyn
Shipmate
# 16840
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by mousethief:
ETA: And the robot could say, quite honestly, "You really turn me on."
I knew there had to be a top gag in this thread somewhere. MT takes the prize.
<Reluctantly uses the ![[Killing me]](graemlins/killingme.gif) >
Me thinking on KA's long post,(and going way left of centre, and probably into the dark), this whole business could go a whole lot further.
Loyal sex-bots, having given man years of satisfaction to contented partners, could be re-programmed to do the eulogy at their funerals. Large sums of money accrued by singletons could go to bot factories instead of cat homes.
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Change is the only certainty of existence
Posts: 3206 | From: U.K. | Registered: Dec 2011
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SvitlanaV2
Shipmate
# 16967
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Kelly Alves:
Sorry, Hosts, I really did have a point I was making about the unwillingness of people to consider the idea of marketing sex to women in the same way they do to men. As something they are entitled to enjoy, rather than something they provide to please people. As( I hate the word) a commodity they can acquire as well as distribute.
Sex robots would also help to keep the population down. [Cue conspiracy theories about the New World Order....]
This is obviously a delicate issue, but I wonder how successfully they'd be promoted in parts of the developing world. The USP would have to be different in different cultures.
Posts: 6668 | From: UK | Registered: Feb 2012
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Kelly Alves
Bunny with an axe
# 2522
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by rolyn:
quote:
Originally posted by mousethief:
ETA: And the robot could say, quite honestly, "You really turn me on."
I knew there had to be a top gag in this thread somewhere. MT takes the prize.
<Reluctantly uses the >
Me thinking on KA's long post,(and going way left of centre, and probably into the dark), this whole business could go a whole lot further.
Loyal sex-bots, having given man years of satisfaction to contented partners, could be re-programmed to do the eulogy at their funerals. Large sums of money accrued by singletons could go to bot factories instead of cat homes.
Again, Foster Friess. In case you don't remember who he was, he was the guy who suggested birth control was best achieved by a bottle of aspirin between the knees. Hilarious, but at least here the fallout from that kind of belittling dismissal can be grim--Planned Parenthood got defunded Friday. On a Federal level. Tee-hee.
So, while most of the jokes on this thread have been pretty sex positive ( if giddily so), they at least have an element of "you go, girl," That last few years of debate about birth control accessibility lead me to believe the counter assault from the right wing ( if my scenario played out) would mostly involve demeaning jokes about ugly women-- much more aggressive than your mild poke about cat ladies. Again, research GOP /War on Women / Birth Control for a taste of what I mean.
This is exactly why the CEO of Cuddle Buddies doesn't bother to market to women-- because the purchase of sensual experience is something that is seen as an understandible necessity for men, but for women it is a sign of desperation and neediness. Because women are just not supposed to ask for pleasure or comfort. Even if they pay for it fair and square, just as men do, people have a problem even thinking about women being proactive about their sex lives, about doing anything sensual or sexual that involves her receiving pleasure from a man rather than providing it..( which again, was kind of my larger point when I started. Thanks for givng me a way to head back there.)
To return to my scenario, this definitely would be the first level of attack through ads-- the same way erotic massage liquid is advertized as a way for already happy hetero couples to make each other happier, the sex bot can be marketed as a way loyal wives keep themselves busy while their very capable man is gone for that convention, a neutral party to prevent unfortunate cross attachment in three ways-- I dunno, we'd have to get creative, though.
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I cannot expect people to believe “
Jesus loves me, this I know” of they don’t believe “Kelly loves me, this I know.”
Kelly Alves, somewhere around 2003.
Posts: 35076 | From: Pura Californiana | Registered: Mar 2002
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Kelly Alves
Bunny with an axe
# 2522
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Posted
(scene--very attractive, wealthy looking man gives a huge, extravagently wrapped package to his equally attractive and polished wife in front of a Christmas tree.)
VO : Darling, sometimes I am just not in the mood. You know it is not you, you gorgeous, sexy thing. I want a long, happy life ith you darling, so no harsh pills for me. But what makes me happiest in this world is hearing your sighs of bliss and so...
( Mam tears down front panel of package, revealing Menschbot-- a bit shorter than him, but reasonably attractive and nattily dressed)
I'm asking a trusted friend to help us out.
(Menchbot bows with a kind, non- leery smile, and extends a hand to the man and woman)
( Fade out. Product info on black screen.)
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I cannot expect people to believe “
Jesus loves me, this I know” of they don’t believe “Kelly loves me, this I know.”
Kelly Alves, somewhere around 2003.
Posts: 35076 | From: Pura Californiana | Registered: Mar 2002
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mousethief
Ship's Thieving Rodent
# 953
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Posted
Pot-bellied man with a dirty, too-short t-shirt and a 9 o'clock shadow sits at a kitchen table piled with children's toys, a toaster on its side, dirty breakfast dishes, etc. A wife in rollers and a frayed housecoat is standing with her back to him, cooking something on the stove.
He: "Sweetie, didn't I make the bed before I left for work? Why are the covers and both pillows in a heap on the floor? Is there something you need to tell me?"
She, turning: "Oh darling, you know I love you and could never love another man. I just had a romp with my sister's Menschbot is all. She brought him over to show me."
He: "Of course! I'm so sorry I doubted you!"
Man stands up and they embrace. He sits down, starts reading paper. Woman returns to cooking.
Voiceover: "You can trust your woman to Menschbot. Buy her one of her own today."
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This is the last sig I'll ever write for you...
Posts: 63536 | From: Washington | Registered: Jul 2001
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rolyn
Shipmate
# 16840
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Posted
I think giving the woman in one,s life a menschbot for Christmas is likely to go down as well as a copy of 50 shades.
In other words "not"
As a man I always held female sexuality in a positive light. The 'cat home' jibe was uncalled for, I apologise for that.
If people are sexually contented then that should make for a more contented world in theory. If sex-bots are a step in that direction then they shouldn't be opposed.
[ 20. September 2015, 17:08: Message edited by: rolyn ]
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Change is the only certainty of existence
Posts: 3206 | From: U.K. | Registered: Dec 2011
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Kelly Alves
Bunny with an axe
# 2522
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by mousethief:
Pot-bellied man with a dirty, too-short t-shirt and a 9 o'clock shadow sits at a kitchen table piled with children's toys, a toaster on its side, dirty breakfast dishes, etc. A wife in rollers and a frayed housecoat is standing with her back to him, cooking something on the stove.
He: "Sweetie, didn't I make the bed before I left for work? Why are the covers and both pillows in a heap on the floor? Is there something you need to tell me?"
She, turning: "Oh darling, you know I love you and could never love another man. I just had a romp with my sister's Menschbot is all. She brought him over to show me."
He: "Of course! I'm so sorry I doubted you!"
Man stands up and they embrace. He sits down, starts reading paper. Woman returns to cooking.
Voiceover: "You can trust your woman to Menschbot. Buy her one of her own today."
killingme: ![[Overused]](graemlins/notworthy.gif)
See, this would be the one that would sell me:
(Tired-looking women of average level of attractiveness and various ages are seen busting their asses in blue-collar service/ caregiving jobs-- feeding patients, changing diapers, serving beer, cleaning hotel rooms, you name it)
(All of them at some see some cheesy ass flier on a work bulletin board about a local singles night)
Cut to them going home and going through various frustrations trying to prepare to go out-- trying and discarding inadequate clothes, deciding shoes, practicing flirty baby doll dialogue. [Mirror pep talks-- "Mom said, Make him chase you until you catch him!]" Definitely there needs to be a close up of a long line of cosmetics for a multitude of corrective issues.)
(at some point each women either verbally or non-verbally communicates-- "fuck it.")
Mid Shot of a closet door opening, revealing the sweetly smiling Menschbot. "Hi,Beautiful!")
Either voiceover or text over-- "Sometimes you want someone else to do the work."
To return this to Purg-type analysis, rather than encouraging a string of commercial pitches-- note that this is how most appliances, from washing machines to potato peelers, are indeed marketed to women. Why, then, are vibrators not marketed this way? Because the people who make such ads have a problem encouraging women think of sexual pleasure as something of their own.
[ 20. September 2015, 17:29: Message edited by: Kelly Alves ]
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I cannot expect people to believe “
Jesus loves me, this I know” of they don’t believe “Kelly loves me, this I know.”
Kelly Alves, somewhere around 2003.
Posts: 35076 | From: Pura Californiana | Registered: Mar 2002
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Kelly Alves
Bunny with an axe
# 2522
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by rolyn:
As a man I always held female sexuality in a positive light. The 'cat home' jibe was uncalled for, I apologise for that.
Meh--it was pretty mild. Like I said it helped me return to one of the points I was trying to make so I actually appreciated it.
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I cannot expect people to believe “
Jesus loves me, this I know” of they don’t believe “Kelly loves me, this I know.”
Kelly Alves, somewhere around 2003.
Posts: 35076 | From: Pura Californiana | Registered: Mar 2002
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SvitlanaV2
Shipmate
# 16967
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by rolyn:
I think giving the woman in one,s life a menschbot for Christmas is likely to go down as well as a copy of 50 shades.
In other words "not"
That book was a bestseller, though, so quite a few women must have enjoyed it.... Just not the ones with intellectual, feminist inclinations or aspirations.
The Menschbot may similarly appeal to less educated consumers.
BTW, 'Menschbot' sounds neither cuddly nor sexy.
Posts: 6668 | From: UK | Registered: Feb 2012
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Kelly Alves
Bunny with an axe
# 2522
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by SvitlanaV2:
quote:
Originally posted by rolyn:
I think giving the woman in one,s life a menschbot for Christmas is likely to go down as well as a copy of 50 shades.
In other words "not"
That book was a bestseller, though, so quite a few women must have enjoyed it.... Just not the ones with intellectual, feminist inclinations or aspirations.
The Menschbot may similarly appeal to less educated consumers.
BTW, 'Menschbot' sounds neither cuddly nor sexy.
We can address that at the next marketing meeting.
(I actually thought of "studbot" first, but I rejected that-- men want to be studs, women want a mensch! maybe there is a more sonorous equivalent, but I definitely decided to move away from a name that would suggest that the bot would be intrinsically dominant. Dominant on request is another issue. )
Here's the thing about the book-- I actually knew several women who bought "50 Shades" out of curiosity, but I don't know a single one who didn't wind up using it to quote unintentionally hilarious passages to their friends over the phone. Just my personal observation.
One moment of sisterly pride--after the movie came out, I ran into a bunch of teen/ twenty aged girls giggling over a display of cologne and perfume branded with 50 shades. I naturally scooted over to eavesdrop, and they were talking about doing just what I described above with their girlfriends-- buying the book and seeing the film just to spend a bunch of time trashing it over lattes. So, I appreciate the box office numbers, but I sense they don't mean everything they imply
[ 20. September 2015, 17:41: Message edited by: Kelly Alves ]
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I cannot expect people to believe “
Jesus loves me, this I know” of they don’t believe “Kelly loves me, this I know.”
Kelly Alves, somewhere around 2003.
Posts: 35076 | From: Pura Californiana | Registered: Mar 2002
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SvitlanaV2
Shipmate
# 16967
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Posted
Yeah, yeah - everyone read the book or watched the film in order to pour scorn. I get it! They all made E L James a multi-millionaire though.
If Menschbot Inc. can get millions of sales out of a product everyone jokes about at then they too will be laughing all the way to the bank. Everyone's a winner, baby....
Posts: 6668 | From: UK | Registered: Feb 2012
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Kelly Alves
Bunny with an axe
# 2522
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Posted
(More thinking, slightly tangential) I think the really positive thing about "50 Shades" is, in a way, it forced women to speak up. The book/ movie said, women think it is sexy to be dominated and shamed-- sex is better if you feel kind of dirty. The fallout from that was some women said, "Yeah, down with that," but a lot of women said, "Nah, fuck that."
And the conclusion the world should have reached from all that was, "The only way to find out what any given woman is into is to ask her." But that would be giving her "high maintenance," right?
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I cannot expect people to believe “
Jesus loves me, this I know” of they don’t believe “Kelly loves me, this I know.”
Kelly Alves, somewhere around 2003.
Posts: 35076 | From: Pura Californiana | Registered: Mar 2002
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Kelly Alves
Bunny with an axe
# 2522
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by SvitlanaV2:
Yeah, yeah - everyone read the book or watched the film in order to pour scorn. I get it! They all made E L James a multi-millionaire though.
If Menschbot Inc. can get millions of sales out of a product everyone jokes about at then they too will be laughing all the way to the bank. Everyone's a winner, baby....
But I predict the dynamic would be the opposite of what happened with 50 shades-- people would pretend to buy it as a laugh, and the bunches of women you came across gossiping in the department store would be blushingly exchanging flamboyant war stories...
(That's kind of what happens with vibrators. At least in the SF Bay Area, so that might skew things vis a vis girlfriends chatting. But word of mouth does more to serve vibrator sales than the the scanty advertisement they get, even around here.)
[ 20. September 2015, 17:56: Message edited by: Kelly Alves ]
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I cannot expect people to believe “
Jesus loves me, this I know” of they don’t believe “Kelly loves me, this I know.”
Kelly Alves, somewhere around 2003.
Posts: 35076 | From: Pura Californiana | Registered: Mar 2002
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mousethief
Ship's Thieving Rodent
# 953
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Kelly Alves:
Either voiceover or text over-- "Sometimes you want someone else to do the work."
quote:
Originally posted by SvitlanaV2:
That book [50 shades] was a bestseller, though, so quite a few women must have enjoyed it.... Just not the ones with intellectual, feminist inclinations or aspirations.
I think you'd be surprised. People don't have to think something is real or even desirable to enjoy reading it. Many women read and enjoy books with rape scenes. No woman wants to be raped. Myself I don't understand it, but the phenomenon is there.
---
I think in all of this kidding around, Kelly has a very valid point. Our culture tends to think women ought not to enjoy sex. I think it's a huge part of what's behind the conservative backlash against birth control. How dare those women enjoy sex. That's not something good "girls" do.
Our culture still has a bizarre cleavage (pun intended) between how it regards men and how it regards women -- women aren't just defective men, they're incomplete men. They have no penis, they're smaller, they have less brainpower, they have incomplete desires and aspirations, including the inability to fully and "really" enjoy sex the way men do. Perhaps few people would come out and say this openly (except maybe Anne Coulter), but the feeling is there. Women just aren't all there, in every sense of the word.
Held together in the face of overwhelming contrary evidence by the glue of confirmation bias.
[ 20. September 2015, 17:55: Message edited by: mousethief ]
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This is the last sig I'll ever write for you...
Posts: 63536 | From: Washington | Registered: Jul 2001
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Kelly Alves
Bunny with an axe
# 2522
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Posted
MT--
Just in case you were wondering what the term "mensch" was supposed to convey, see above.
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I cannot expect people to believe “
Jesus loves me, this I know” of they don’t believe “Kelly loves me, this I know.”
Kelly Alves, somewhere around 2003.
Posts: 35076 | From: Pura Californiana | Registered: Mar 2002
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Kelly Alves
Bunny with an axe
# 2522
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Posted
(more thinking)
And I think a big reason various media glommed onto 50 Shades is that they could spin in a little subtext of, "Ladies, if you want to make yourself more appealing to men, learn to love this kind of sex. It's actually very sexy if you are not, you know, inhibited."
So, even this exploration of one woman discovering her deepest darkest impulses could be spun into a Cosmo style, "Here's something else you can add to your bag of tricks, girls." More magazines, fashion furniture, a &^%$ing cologne sold. It's like when we convinced women that investing in a $1000 living room dancing pole was a sign of uber-sexiness.
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I cannot expect people to believe “
Jesus loves me, this I know” of they don’t believe “Kelly loves me, this I know.”
Kelly Alves, somewhere around 2003.
Posts: 35076 | From: Pura Californiana | Registered: Mar 2002
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mousethief
Ship's Thieving Rodent
# 953
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Posted
How I pity the purg hosts having to read this. Not enough to stop however.
quote:
Originally posted by SvitlanaV2:
Yeah, yeah - everyone read the book or watched the film in order to pour scorn.
To pour scorn, or to score porn?
---
Kelly: re. "mensch" -- yeah, I think the word is a little too unromantic. And "bot" positively reeks of flaccid libido (flaccid clit? is that a thing?). The name for a woman-pleasing sex robot (this is my opinion so take it with a grain of Mansplain™ brand salt) needs to communicate not so much strength and cyberness, but warmth and respect and momentarily-sheathed (if you'll pardon the expression) but ready-to-emerge (if you'll pardon the expression) passion. I'm afraid I can't think of anything that meets those criteria and maybe they're a bit too, um, stringent.
Love-o-matic is probably NOT the right word.
Oh, and would our Menschbot (for want of a better term) have a fully functional tongue? I mean there's more to sex than V-I-V.
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This is the last sig I'll ever write for you...
Posts: 63536 | From: Washington | Registered: Jul 2001
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Kelly Alves
Bunny with an axe
# 2522
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Posted
I see your point-- I also wanted to avoid anything too cutesy, too- someone looking for red hot sex is not gonna settle for cute. Obviously this needs more thought.
Oh, God, yes, a tongue. Not just for Downtown, but never underestimate the foreplay value of plain-old making out.
(In fact, if that bit is lackluster for me, the rest probably won't be much better. So I would set my bot* for Ultrasnog.)
[ETA: wow, I must really be a geek-- while the word "bot" doesn't necessarily arouse me, it does nothing to un-arouse me, either. Hm.]
[ 20. September 2015, 18:19: Message edited by: Kelly Alves ]
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I cannot expect people to believe “
Jesus loves me, this I know” of they don’t believe “Kelly loves me, this I know.”
Kelly Alves, somewhere around 2003.
Posts: 35076 | From: Pura Californiana | Registered: Mar 2002
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Kelly Alves
Bunny with an axe
# 2522
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by SvitlanaV2:
Yeah, yeah - everyone read the book or watched the film in order to pour scorn. I get it! They all made E L James a multi-millionaire though.
If Menschbot Inc. can get millions of sales out of a product everyone jokes about at then they too will be laughing all the way to the bank. Everyone's a winner, baby....
The best thing that ever happened to the hack that wrote "Vox" was when two highly placed idiots* decided to use it as a phone sex tool. I never bought anything related to "50 Shades" but I did buy that little piece of crap. Second hand, thankfully, but I still cringe to admit it.
Ugh. The handheld shower scene. What the hell was I thinking?
![[Disappointed]](graemlins/disappointed.gif)
*the comedy team of Clinton and Lewinsky.
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I cannot expect people to believe “
Jesus loves me, this I know” of they don’t believe “Kelly loves me, this I know.”
Kelly Alves, somewhere around 2003.
Posts: 35076 | From: Pura Californiana | Registered: Mar 2002
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