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Source: (consider it)
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Thread: Holy Week begins
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Adam.
Like as the
# 4991
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Posted
So, how did Palm Sunday go for everyone yesterday? I was celebrating in one of our dorm chapels in the evening, and it did feel odd to hear a Palm Sunday procession passing by in the morning yet not celebrate till the evening.
We just did the entrance gospel at the back of the church, then I blessed palms as I processed in, and I did miss having everyone in a procession, even if just from the back of the church. We had good readers for the Passion, though, and I always find taking the Christus part very moving. They had the congregation take the crowd parts. I've never been sure intellectually if I like this, but it does seem to work. In the homily, I did encourage people to think about who they identified with in the Passion, and that it probably wouldn't be the crowd for most of us.
Chrism Mass tonight, and then the week continues!
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Ave Crux, Spes Unica!
Preaching blog
Posts: 8164 | From: Notre Dame, IN | Registered: Sep 2003
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mr cheesy
Shipmate
# 3330
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Posted
At Compline, our usual, we had a visiting choir of unrobed adults, which is unusual for Compline and for Canterbury Cathedral.
Many of the services happen in the Quire, where we sit in the Victorian wooden stalls, and the choir usually processes in from the back. This time, the choir started singing from the back but moved along the outside of the pews emerging by the High Altar.
I'm not exactly sure what that space is called behind the stalls, but it has amazing acoustics, so there was a wall of sound as the choir moved along.
We also had a reflection, which was thinking about the entrance to Jerusalem and how there was an almost-but-not-quite-as-expected sense of the King taking his rightful place in the City of God.
In all, it was a very uplifting but very odd Palm Sunday service with a considerable element of mournfulness about it.
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arse
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A Feminine Force
Ship's Onager
# 7812
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Posted
We blessed the palms and then processed with incense and music and hosannahs through the streets down to the little church by the sea.
For a Baptist it was a very Catholic kind of experience, but very moving, with all the bells and smells.
So begins my favorite time of the year.
I love Holy Week!!!
AFF
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C2C - The Cure for What Ails Ya?
Posts: 2115 | From: Kingdom of Heaven | Registered: Jul 2004
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Brenda Clough
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# 18061
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Posted
We always do The Cry of the Whole Congregation by Walter Wangerin -- I wonder if anyone else does? We've used it for at least a decade, and I am rather bored with it. (Not that anyone ever asks me.)
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Science fiction and fantasy writer with a Patreon page
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georgiaboy
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# 11294
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Posted
This was my second Palm Sunday here at the abbey and this year I was more attuned and able to worship. (Last year I was too green and afraid I'd screw something up.)
Palms were blessed in the courtyard and procession wound its way to the church, with cantors singing a psalm-ish sort of thing, accompanied by hand chimes and refrain for everybody. (It was much better than this makes it sound!)
Once the ministers had gotten into the nave i struck up 'All Glory Laud -- organ on the refrain, TTBB cantors singing the stanzas. Excellent, though we only sang 2 stanzas.
Responsorial psalm was Gelineau, which didn't work!
Latin schola sang 'Christus factus est' before the Passion.
Passion, sung by the traditional 3 'deacons' plus 5 additional voices for the crowd parts. Setting was composed by one of the monks and was a knockout! Varying compositional styles captured the shifting moods of the text.
3 stanzas of 'O Sacred Head' followed, and I used the elaborate JSB harmonization from the 'Saint Matthew Passion' for the last one, with the Virgil Fox 'dying organ' effect at the end -- reducing the registration stop by stop through the last two lines, ending with just the softest celestes. The community and the many visitors caught the idea and went along with it!
i'd give it 8 out of 10, says I as who shouldn't(!)
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You can't retire from a calling.
Posts: 1675 | From: saint meinrad, IN | Registered: Apr 2006
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BabyWombat
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# 18552
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Posted
All 18 of us at the principal service fit comfortably into the library where I blessed palms (no holy water, no incense). Then we processed in silence the 20 feet or so down the hall to the narthex where I said the appropriate collect. The organist then began All Glory Laud and Honor and we processed into the church. I narrated the Passion read in parts – almost everyone had a part to read! Then I moved into assisting priest role and my priest colleague celebrated the Eucharist. Silent procession out, no postlude, no coffee hour.
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Let us, with a gladsome mind…..
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Fr Weber
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# 13472
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Posted
We had the Palm Sunday liturgy yesterday morning, and a funeral in the afternoon for a 97-year-old parish woman who'd died earlier in the week.
Shortly after I woke up yesterday I received the news that our Senior Warden had died unexpectedly. I did my best to inform our people before the service, since I didn't want them to find out via the bidding of intentions in the Mass.
Palm Sunday started rocky, but soon hit its stride. My acolyte read the OT lesson from Exodus, and then seemed about to go on and read the Gradual afterward, but wound up righting himself. We had the full blessing and liturgy of the palms (essentially amounting to a separate Liturgy of the Word) before the procession, which led right into the Mass--"Glory, laud & honor" of course, in red vestments, switching to violet once we arrived back at the altar. Incense, too.
I chanted the Passion (St Matthew) with the choir, taking the Evangelist while members of the choir sang the parts of Jesus and Pilate. The turba sections were from the Victoria setting. It came off well; the pitch dropped a little bit throughout, but the singers were probably the only ones who noticed.
"O sacred head sore wounded" was sung at the Offertory, "Stabat Mater" post-Communion, and "Ah, holy Jesus" at the recessional. The choir sang Stainer's "God so loved the world" during Communion, wringing every ounce of schmaltz out of it--wonderful.
By the end of the funeral (Burial Service + Requiem + Absolution of the Dead, body present in the coffin) we were all pretty exhausted--but that's the job.
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"The Eucharist is not a play, and you're not Jesus."
--Sr Theresa Koernke, IHM
Posts: 2512 | From: Oakland, CA | Registered: Feb 2008
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betjemaniac
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# 17618
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Posted
out in mud-and-mattins land we had Family Communion (with Eucharistic Prayer H....) and a baptism. My Anglo-Catholic spidey-senses still tingle when people are baptised in Lent but it went well.
Usual Christening behaviour - the whole left side of the nave was family and friends of the baptism party, the villagers huddled together at the back on the right hand side. The usual congregation of about 18 (inc organist) swollen to nearer 60 but very "us and them" and the vicar having to explain what a response was.
Hymns were all over the place but overall glad to be there even if being this far down the candle is taking some getting used to!
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And is it true? For if it is....
Posts: 1481 | From: behind the dreaming spires | Registered: Mar 2013
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moonfruit
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# 15818
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Posted
I was leading Sunday School yesterday, and ended up with 4 delightful 5 year olds, who took great pleasure in re-enacting the Palm Sunday story, including waving the leafy branches I'd "borrowed" from church, and putting their coats on the ground to walk over. At least two of them had a turn at being Jesus, and we had a good talk about how the week was happy on Palm Sunday, then sad on Good Friday, then happy again on Easter Day. Something about having a group of kids all at the same level made the session really easy to lead and really good fun. I did have to remind them to go into church quietly though, not calling out "yay the King is coming"!
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All I know is that you came and made beauty from my mess.
Posts: 180 | From: Just outside the M25 | Registered: Aug 2010
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Amanda B. Reckondwythe
Dressed for Church
# 5521
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Posted
I attended a Lutheran church where the youth group performed a Passion mime. Oh no, I thought, not a mime! Mimes are so obnoxious when we encounter them on the street!
But it was extremely well done. The youth were in black leotards and whiteface, and enacted the Last Supper, the agony in the garden, Judas' betrayal, the trial before Pilate, the scourging of Jesus, the cruxifixion, and the burial of Jesus. All to Samuel Barber's Adagio for Strings playing over the PA system.
Very moving. They had obviously planned it out and rehearsed it well. I was glad to have witnessed it.
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"I take prayer too seriously to use it as an excuse for avoiding work and responsibility." -- The Revd Martin Luther King Jr.
Posts: 10542 | From: The Great Southwest | Registered: Feb 2004
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Sipech
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# 16870
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Posted
Planning to attend a fairly broad spread this week. Started off at my (comfortably low) home church yesterday. No processions, dressing up or the like. Just a little bit of spontaneous flag waving, which entails significantly less cleaning up than using palm leaves.
I was doing the reading from Matthew 21 and, as I usually do, in contradistinction to most, I read with intonation, not with all the character of a 1950s BBC newsreader. And yes, when the scripture says the crowd shouted, I shouted. Doesn't seem right to take all the zest from the text.
Though I read from the NRSV that I tend to carry around, which prompted a change to the sermon in that the first 5 minutes were spent explaining why the NASB had better translated the "beast of burden". ![[Roll Eyes]](rolleyes.gif)
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I try to be self-deprecating; I'm just not very good at it.
Twitter: http://twitter.com/TheAlethiophile
Posts: 3791 | From: On the corporate ladder | Registered: Jan 2012
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Gamaliel
Shipmate
# 812
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Posted
The idea of the palm crosses is that you take them home with you - no mess involved.
In some churches they burn them and use the ashes for the Ash Wednesday 'ashing' the following year - which I think is quite a neat thing to do.
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Let us with a gladsome mind
Praise the Lord for He is kind.
http://philthebard.blogspot.com
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Brenda Clough
Shipmate
# 18061
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Posted
'Neat' only in one sense of the word. We did it one year and it is unbelievably messy. You have to sift the ashes after burning, to get out the chunky wooden bits. And then you have to somehow bag or box the ashes for use in a year. Not something to be done while wearing good clothing.
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Science fiction and fantasy writer with a Patreon page
Posts: 6378 | From: Washington DC | Registered: Mar 2014
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Nick Tamen
Ship's Wayfaring Fool
# 15164
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by moonfruit:
I did have to remind them to go into church quietly though, not calling out "yay the King is coming"!
See, for me if they had done that and caused a little disruption, that might have made it The Best Palm Sunday Service Ever.
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The first thing God says to Moses is, "Take off your shoes." We are on holy ground. Hard to believe, but the truest thing I know. — Anne Lamott
Posts: 2833 | From: On heaven-crammed earth | Registered: Sep 2009
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Lamb Chopped
Ship's kebab
# 5528
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Posted
We had a procession with palms and children to wave them, then the confirmands (eight of them, including my son) following. Our host congregation does confirmations on Palm Sunday, though I prefer Pentecost (not least because it makes the pastor's load lighter in Lent!). Had a very moving ceremony downstairs in the basement space our Vietnamese use for worship, where everybody laid hands on my kid and prayed for him--host pastors chose not to give my husband a role in the English worship service, possibly because there were two other pastors' kids in the lot, but a bit hard on my husband, who actually holds his call there!
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Er, this is what I've been up to (book).
Oh, that you would rend the heavens and come down!
Posts: 20059 | From: off in left field somewhere | Registered: Feb 2004
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Gee D
Shipmate
# 13815
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Posted
We did the usual ecumenical short service followed by procession, all to All Glory Laud and Honour, people peeling off to head to their own church. Then entry procession into St Sanity to Ride On, Ride On in Majesty. Last night was the first of the Holy Week evening Eucharists - about 3 dozen attended, not bad for a Monday evening after a wet day.
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Not every Anglican in Sydney is Sydney Anglican
Posts: 7028 | From: Warrawee NSW Australia | Registered: Jun 2008
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Pigwidgeon
Ship's Owl
# 10192
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Brenda Clough:
'Neat' only in one sense of the word. We did it one year and it is unbelievably messy. You have to sift the ashes after burning, to get out the chunky wooden bits. And then you have to somehow bag or box the ashes for use in a year. Not something to be done while wearing good clothing.
And the smell! I had a wool sweater that smelled of burnt palm after many washings/cleanings.
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"...that is generally a matter for Pigwidgeon, several other consenting adults, a bottle of cheap Gin and the odd giraffe."
~Tortuf
Posts: 9835 | From: Hogwarts | Registered: Aug 2005
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Nick Tamen
Ship's Wayfaring Fool
# 15164
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Brenda Clough:
'Neat' only in one sense of the word. We did it one year and it is unbelievably messy. You have to sift the ashes after burning, to get out the chunky wooden bits. And then you have to somehow bag or box the ashes for use in a year. Not something to be done while wearing good clothing.
It works much better if you let the palms dry out completely before you try to burn them. We save some palms in an out of the way/dry place, and we don't burn them until just before Ash Wednesday—often letting the children help. They burn quickly and can be ground down into fine ash easily.
You still don't want to wear particularly nice clothes, though.
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The first thing God says to Moses is, "Take off your shoes." We are on holy ground. Hard to believe, but the truest thing I know. — Anne Lamott
Posts: 2833 | From: On heaven-crammed earth | Registered: Sep 2009
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Brenda Clough
Shipmate
# 18061
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Posted
Our palm dealer (in Texas, where palms grow naturally) also sells ashes for Ash Wednesday. They are so very very cheap (a bag costs less than a cup of coffee, and remember we're ordering palms anyway) that we do not bother burning our own ever.
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Science fiction and fantasy writer with a Patreon page
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ExclamationMark
Shipmate
# 14715
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Posted
Baptism service - 4 adults.
A very full church and a massive queue for lunch afterwards. A number of people have asked to chat about being baptised. Children waving the palm leaves they made plus the palms from the Easter Presentations for schools we had in church in the week.
We're perhaps unusual for a non Anglican Church in that we have a daily reflection in Holy Week (7 pm) to tell the unfolding story of the Passion. We read the story, have a silent or quiet time then pray.
Posts: 3845 | From: A new Jerusalem | Registered: Apr 2009
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Ceremoniar
Shipmate
# 13596
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Zappa:
Palm Sunday pulsed. I'm avoiding the mid-week masses - my lent has been purgatorial enough. Unfortunately, as this is a cathedral, the bishop has played his ace and demanded presidency at all the remaining services except any before 10.00 a.m. (I wonder why).
No "demand" involved. He is the bishop, and it is the cathedral.
Posts: 1240 | From: U.S. | Registered: Apr 2008
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Baptist Trainfan
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# 15128
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by ExclamationMark:
Baptism service - 4 adults.
A very full church and a massive queue for lunch afterwards. A number of people have asked to chat about being baptised. Children waving the palm leaves they made plus the palms from the Easter Presentations for schools we had in church in the week.
We're perhaps unusual for a non Anglican Church in that we have a daily reflection in Holy Week (7 pm) to tell the unfolding story of the Passion. We read the story, have a silent or quiet time then pray.
Brilliant. Being in our town centre, we tried lunch-time reflections through Holy Week a few years back, but hardly anyone came. Problem is, most of our folk would have to make a special trip to attend, and most "non-churchgoers" are more likely to pop into the Parish Church I suspect. Or perhaps your town is more akin to the real Jerusalem than ours (although we're physically closer!)
[ 22. March 2016, 13:44: Message edited by: Baptist Trainfan ]
Posts: 9750 | From: The other side of the Severn | Registered: Sep 2009
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leo
Shipmate
# 1458
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Posted
I reckon we started a day early - because we hosted a wedding for somebody who'd been homeless and a woman who said she couldn't give him any cash because she needed money for her electricity meter. So he gave her money that he had received while begging.
They married this Saturday and all the fees were waived.
As for Palm Sunday it started badly because I was in too much of a hurry and ripped the bit at the back of the red superfrontal that fixes it to the back of the altar table - so I had to keep it in place with a heavy Bible.
Palm procession with flutes accompanying. The university choir have already gone home despite Easter being so early so we had the Passion read by several voices rarther than chanted.
[ 22. March 2016, 15:25: Message edited by: leo ]
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My Jewish-positive lectionary blog is at http://recognisingjewishrootsinthelectionary.wordpress.com/
My reviews at http://layreadersbookreviews.wordpress.com
Posts: 23198 | From: Bristol | Registered: Oct 2001
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Angloid
Shipmate
# 159
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by leo:
I reckon we started a day early - because we hosted a wedding for somebody who'd been homeless and a woman who said she couldn't give him any cash because she needed money for her electricity meter. So he gave her money that he had received while begging.
They married this Saturday and all the fees were waived.
That was in the news! I thought it might have been your church. Well done everybody, and I hope their marriage is truly blessed.
Posts: 12927 | From: The Pool of Life | Registered: May 2001
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Brenda Clough
Shipmate
# 18061
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Posted
Many many disasters with hangings/robes can be fixed with office supplies: staplers, tape, and duct tape. I have hemmed up a robe with three minutes to spare, with a large roll of cellophane tape.
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Science fiction and fantasy writer with a Patreon page
Posts: 6378 | From: Washington DC | Registered: Mar 2014
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american piskie
Shipmate
# 593
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by leo:
They married this Saturday and all the fees were waived.
Pure curiosity, was the Diocesan Board of Finance fee waived, or will the PCC be paying it?
Posts: 356 | From: Oxford, England, UK | Registered: Jun 2001
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Angloid
Shipmate
# 159
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Posted
I think if I was the parish priest concerned I would write to the diocesan treasurer (including links to all the media reports about this couple) and defy them to ask for the fees. If they were hardfaced enough to insist I would just give that as much publicity as the original story. What actually happened Leo?
Posts: 12927 | From: The Pool of Life | Registered: May 2001
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Sipech
Shipmate
# 16870
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Posted
Night off tonight. Moving to the other (burny) end of the candle tomorrow night, with a Tenebrae service. Thursday is a hike/pilgrimage from Cambridge to Ely. Might see if I can make it to the cathedral for Evensong at 5:30. That'd mean keeping up an average speed of 2.25mph cross country for 8 hours. ![[Help]](graemlins/help.gif)
Posts: 3791 | From: On the corporate ladder | Registered: Jan 2012
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stonespring
Shipmate
# 15530
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Posted
I was at an Anglo-Catholic Palm Sunday service, being used to RC ones, and I noticed that people knelt at the words "at the name Jesus every knee should bend" in the Epistle (which I was not used to) but that when Christ breathed his last in the reading of the Passion no one knelt, although silence was kept (whereas I was used to everyone kneeling at this time). Is this typical in Anglican Churches? In Anglo-Catholic Churches? Does anyone know the history or the origin of kneeling during that particular Epistle (is it only on Palm Sunday)?
Posts: 1537 | Registered: Mar 2010
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Fr Weber
Shipmate
# 13472
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Posted
We did both genuflections at our place.
Other proper genuflections : when the same Epistle is read on Holy Cross Day, or at the Votive of Our Lord's Passion; during the Gospel for Epiphany; during the Tract on Mondays, Wednesdays, and Fridays in Lent; and during the Alleluia in Pentecost (at the words "Come, Holy Ghost").
Probably not an exhaustive list...
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"The Eucharist is not a play, and you're not Jesus."
--Sr Theresa Koernke, IHM
Posts: 2512 | From: Oakland, CA | Registered: Feb 2008
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Emendator Liturgia
Shipmate
# 17245
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Posted
Our Palm/Passion Sunday was a very special one for our little corner of the vineyard: the Most Reverend Ronald Langham, Presiding Bishop of the Ecumenical Catholic Church was our special guest preacher. We had the Liturgy of the Palms outside, then processed in to the church (which had been decked out in Passion Red - including a new altar frontal made by Judith Couley of YJude Vestments) to the sounds of 'All glory, praise and honour' before proceeding with the rest of the Eucharist.
During the reading of the passion various people took the different parts: with the archbishop reading the part of Jesus. We had musical interludes between the passion reading and the sermon (‘Salvator mundi’ by Thomas Tallis) and after the sermon the meditation was ‘O Vos Omnes’ by Tomás Luis de Victoria. The music during Communion was "Tenebrae facta sunt", also by Victoria.
Between all the components which make up the liturgy: music, sermon, readings and the Ordo (along with the visual additions), it was a fitting start to the joys and trembles of Holy Week.
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Don't judge all Anglicans in Sydney by prevailing Diocesan standards!
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Forthview
Shipmate
# 12376
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Posted
Stonespring it used to be the custom in RC churches before the reforms of Vatican 2 for the priest and people to genuflect at the words you mention.
Your experience of RC churches probably postdates Vatican 2.
Posts: 3444 | From: Edinburgh | Registered: Feb 2007
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BroJames
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# 9636
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Posted
If all fees were waived then the DBF will have waived its £189 (towards the cost of stipend) and the PCC will have waived its £226. If banns were called, but not charged for then the PCC will have waived another £27. There may also be other local fess which could have been asked for, but they are always optional. The ones I have listed are the statutory fees at 2016 rates.
[Fingers typing what they hear, not what they know to be right!]
[ 23. March 2016, 12:32: Message edited by: BroJames ]
Posts: 3374 | From: UK | Registered: Jun 2005
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stonespring
Shipmate
# 15530
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Fr Weber:
We did both genuflections at our place.
Other proper genuflections : when the same Epistle is read on Holy Cross Day, or at the Votive of Our Lord's Passion; during the Gospel for Epiphany; during the Tract on Mondays, Wednesdays, and Fridays in Lent; and during the Alleluia in Pentecost (at the words "Come, Holy Ghost").
Probably not an exhaustive list...
Why would a parish kneel at the Epistle but not during the Passion? That's what seemed most odd to me. Are they saving the kneeling during the Passion for Good Friday? Did people kneel at any point during the Gospel reading on Palm Sunday before liturgical reforms? Was this church trying to be Old School? I just didn't get it.
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Forthview
Shipmate
# 12376
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Posted
Yes,before Vatican 2 rubrics of the Roman Liturgy directed a genuflection at an appropriate time during the reading of the Passion - now it is left to choice.
Before Vatican 2 there was also a genuflection at each of the individual Solemn Prayers of Good Friday, when the deacon would say 'Flectamus genua' and then a moment later 'Levate' ('down' and 'up' would be an English translation)
I think you'll find that Anglo Catholic churches consult many different books of rubrics from different periods and then do what pleases them.
Posts: 3444 | From: Edinburgh | Registered: Feb 2007
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Ceremoniar
Shipmate
# 13596
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Posted
For those of us who follow the Extraordinary Form of the Roman Rite (a growing number each year, due to the fresh supply of priests from the FSSP and ICRSS, as well as diocesan priests who have been trained to offer the old rite), the genuflection during the epistle on Palm Sunday is still carried out.
Posts: 1240 | From: U.S. | Registered: Apr 2008
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Enoch
Shipmate
# 14322
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Emendator Liturgia:
..: the Most Reverend Ronald Langham, Presiding Bishop of the Ecumenical Catholic Church was our special guest preacher. ...
Is that the Catholic Church whose Patriarch is Pope Francis with its headquarters in Rome, or is it some other, different, one? If it's a different one, how does it differ from the moe usual one?
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Brexit wrexit - Sir Graham Watson
Posts: 7610 | From: Bristol UK(was European Green Capital 2015, now Ljubljana) | Registered: Nov 2008
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Fr Weber
Shipmate
# 13472
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by stonespring:
Why would a parish kneel at the Epistle but not during the Passion? That's what seemed most odd to me. Are they saving the kneeling during the Passion for Good Friday? Did people kneel at any point during the Gospel reading on Palm Sunday before liturgical reforms? Was this church trying to be Old School? I just didn't get it.
I dunno--it seems weird to me too. When the Passion is read during Holy Week, the custom is to kneel (both knees) after the point where Jesus gives up the ghost.
Forthview, the original Latin is
V. Oremus. Flectamus genua.
R. Levate.
"Down" and "up" are to the point, but a more literal translation would be
V. Let us pray. Let us bow the knee.
R. Arise.
V. being intoned by the deacon, and R. by the subdeacon.
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"The Eucharist is not a play, and you're not Jesus."
--Sr Theresa Koernke, IHM
Posts: 2512 | From: Oakland, CA | Registered: Feb 2008
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leo
Shipmate
# 1458
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Forthview:
Before Vatican 2 there was also a genuflection at each of the individual Solemn Prayers of Good Friday, when the deacon would say 'Flectamus genua' and then a moment later 'Levate' ('down' and 'up' would be an English translation)
I remember those - but the genuflection was omitted before the prayer for the Jews.
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My Jewish-positive lectionary blog is at http://recognisingjewishrootsinthelectionary.wordpress.com/
My reviews at http://layreadersbookreviews.wordpress.com
Posts: 23198 | From: Bristol | Registered: Oct 2001
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stonespring
Shipmate
# 15530
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Forthview:
Yes,before Vatican 2 rubrics of the Roman Liturgy directed a genuflection at an appropriate time during the reading of the Passion - now it is left to choice.
Before Vatican 2 there was also a genuflection at each of the individual Solemn Prayers of Good Friday, when the deacon would say 'Flectamus genua' and then a moment later 'Levate' ('down' and 'up' would be an English translation)
I think you'll find that Anglo Catholic churches consult many different books of rubrics from different periods and then do what pleases them.
I'm no expert on the rubrics but when I have been to Novus Ordo RC services on Palm Sunday and Good Friday people have kneeled when Christ brethed his last at the reading of the Passion. I have never been at an RC parish where people did not kneel at this point, I think. Even if it is optional, I think people are just very, very used to it. Most Novus Ordo RC places I have been to have knelt at each of the Solemn Prayers on Good Friday, but I have been to at least one that did not. Of course, when it comes to bowing and genuflecting quite a few RC parishes, priests, publications, and laypeople either bend or ignore the rubrics even as they have been changed since Vatican II.
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L'organist
Shipmate
# 17338
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Posted
Irrelevant who the officiant is: fees for weddings and funerals are seen as part of the stipend and a return has to be made to the DBF/Church House which then deducts the amount of the fee due from the stipend to be paid from central funds.
Thus, if you as PP decide to let your curate take a wedding and have the fee it will still be deducted from your stipend, regardless.
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Rara temporum felicitate ubi sentire quae velis et quae sentias dicere licet
Posts: 4950 | From: somewhere in England... | Registered: Sep 2012
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moonfruit
Shipmate
# 15818
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Nick Tamen:
quote:
Originally posted by moonfruit:
I did have to remind them to go into church quietly though, not calling out "yay the King is coming"!
See, for me if they had done that and caused a little disruption, that might have made it The Best Palm Sunday Service Ever.
It was slightly tempting, but ultimately I decided that enough people would be sniffy about it not to bother. Maybe next year, I'll be braver!
I also teach in a primary school, and today was my turn to lead Junior assembly (ages 7 - 11), so since we're at school during Holy Week, I decided to do a tour through the Stations of the Cross. The kids seemed to respond well, although I did finish with a reminder that the story does have a happy ending.
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All I know is that you came and made beauty from my mess.
Posts: 180 | From: Just outside the M25 | Registered: Aug 2010
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leo
Shipmate
# 1458
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by L'organist:
Irrelevant who the officiant is: fees for weddings and funerals are seen as part of the stipend and a return has to be made to the DBF/Church House which then deducts the amount of the fee due from the stipend to be paid from central funds.
Thus, if you as PP decide to let your curate take a wedding and have the fee it will still be deducted from your stipend, regardless.
Not quite - NSMs and LLMs now get the fees for occasional offices directly - because we aren't paid and often have to take unpaid leave from work.
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My Jewish-positive lectionary blog is at http://recognisingjewishrootsinthelectionary.wordpress.com/
My reviews at http://layreadersbookreviews.wordpress.com
Posts: 23198 | From: Bristol | Registered: Oct 2001
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Nick Tamen
Ship's Wayfaring Fool
# 15164
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by moonfruit:
quote:
Originally posted by Nick Tamen:
quote:
Originally posted by moonfruit:
I did have to remind them to go into church quietly though, not calling out "yay the King is coming"!
See, for me if they had done that and caused a little disruption, that might have made it The Best Palm Sunday Service Ever.
It was slightly tempting, but ultimately I decided that enough people would be sniffy about it not to bother. Maybe next year, I'll be braver!
Just plan your response when someone gets sniffy—"If I told these children to be quiet, the rocks themselves would shout out."
![[Devil]](graemlins/devil.gif)
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The first thing God says to Moses is, "Take off your shoes." We are on holy ground. Hard to believe, but the truest thing I know. — Anne Lamott
Posts: 2833 | From: On heaven-crammed earth | Registered: Sep 2009
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Gee D
Shipmate
# 13815
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by stonespring:
I was at an Anglo-Catholic Palm Sunday service, being used to RC ones, and I noticed that people knelt at the words "at the name Jesus every knee should bend" in the Epistle (which I was not used to) but that when Christ breathed his last in the reading of the Passion no one knelt, although silence was kept (whereas I was used to everyone kneeling at this time). Is this typical in Anglican Churches? In Anglo-Catholic Churches? Does anyone know the history or the origin of kneeling during that particular Epistle (is it only on Palm Sunday)?
We don't genuflect at the Epistle, but kneel and the reading stops for a minute or so reflection in the Passion reading on both Palm Sunday and Good Friday as Christ gives up his spirit.
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Not every Anglican in Sydney is Sydney Anglican
Posts: 7028 | From: Warrawee NSW Australia | Registered: Jun 2008
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stonespring
Shipmate
# 15530
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Gee D:
quote:
Originally posted by stonespring:
I was at an Anglo-Catholic Palm Sunday service, being used to RC ones, and I noticed that people knelt at the words "at the name Jesus every knee should bend" in the Epistle (which I was not used to) but that when Christ breathed his last in the reading of the Passion no one knelt, although silence was kept (whereas I was used to everyone kneeling at this time). Is this typical in Anglican Churches? In Anglo-Catholic Churches? Does anyone know the history or the origin of kneeling during that particular Epistle (is it only on Palm Sunday)?
We don't genuflect at the Epistle, but kneel and the reading stops for a minute or so reflection in the Passion reading on both Palm Sunday and Good Friday as Christ gives up his spirit.
It seems asymmetric to kneel at that Epistle, although it is a pretty important Epistle, but not at the most important moment in the Passion reading.
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