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Source: (consider it)
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Thread: Celebratory funerals
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John3000
Apprentice
# 18786
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Posted
Apologies if this has been discussed here already but I thought I would share this video of Ghanaian pall-bearers
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kvHhmGcFGnQ
I remember clearly the cold dread that came over me when the solemn undertakers entered the church carrying my father's coffin, me not having seen him or his body since he was alive and well.
I am just ruminating on the subject of funerals and wonder if anyone finds the celebrations in the video disrespectful?
Personally I think it's wonderful. I suppose one mustn't view it as celebrating the fact that the deceased is no longer with us(!), but rather as celebration of their life and that they are now moving on into the hands of God. Not sure how I'd feel about it if it were my nearest and dearest though.
Posts: 29 | From: England | Registered: May 2017
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Stetson
Shipmate
# 9597
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Posted
Logically, I can understand the reasons for viewing a funeral as the "celebration of a life".
On a gut/aesthetic level, however, it seems somewhere in the vicinity of a clergyman peppering his sermon with the current "cool" street slang, to show how down with the kids he is.
Posts: 6574 | From: back and forth between bible belts | Registered: Jun 2005
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Bishops Finger
Shipmate
# 5430
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Posted
Wow.
Whatever else, you have to admire their grace, and skill!
I helped carry the coffin of a young cousin of mine into the crematorium, and believe you me, it's not as easy as it looks.
As to respect, well, what is acceptable in the culture of Ghana might possibly not be so acceptable in parts of Ukland....
IJ
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Our words are giants when they do us an injury, and dwarfs when they do us a service. (Wilkie Collins)
Posts: 10151 | From: Behind The Wheel Again! | Registered: Jan 2004
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SvitlanaV2
Shipmate
# 16967
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Posted
It's just a different culture, that's all.
I'm impressed that the pall-bearers have the strength to dance and carry a coffin at the same time. I thought those things were supposed to be heavy!
Posts: 6668 | From: UK | Registered: Feb 2012
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Brenda Clough
Shipmate
# 18061
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Posted
I think it's been noted elsewhere that funerals are highly cultural and locale-dependent. What we do here is not what you might do three townships over. The range of practices is immense; you can find examples of just about anything you can imagine.
There's somebody, in California naturally, who has a business conducting Viking funerals. Yes, you too can be laid into a wooden boat, shoved out to sea at sunset, and set on fire while your family stands on the beach and toasts you with mead. There's also somebody out there who will, for a substantial price, mummify you -- remove the viscera, steep you in natron, wrap you in linen bands. I am told that there is a slight upcharge to add in your pets.
Haven't heard whether the church participates in these interments (there's nothing specifically unChristian about them) but I kind of think not.
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Science fiction and fantasy writer with a Patreon page
Posts: 6378 | From: Washington DC | Registered: Mar 2014
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Jengie jon
Semper Reformanda
# 273
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Posted
Given that it is Ghana, then there is a good chance that that is a Presbyterian funeral!!! ![[Eek!]](eek.gif)
Jengie
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"To violate a persons ability to distinguish fact from fantasy is the epistemological equivalent of rape." Noretta Koertge
Back to my blog
Posts: 20894 | From: city of steel, butterflies and rainbows | Registered: May 2001
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sabine
Shipmate
# 3861
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Posted
The video in the op comes from a completely different culture, so what seems appropriate to them may well not seem appropriate to a person not from that culture. I'm glad John3000 enjoyed it. It seems like something that might brighten the day of a bereaved person.
Traditional New Orleans funeral customs often include a jazz band parade, starting off with a dirge and then sweeping into something celebratory. See here for an example
Among Friends, the memorial is typically a remembrance of good/funny/bittersweet times with the departed.
We held my brother's memorial at a Holiday Inn because the funeral home could not accommodate the number of people who wanted to attend. We put his iPod on a speaker and played all his music (rock, jazz, whatever) during the memorial. It was a college game day, and the Holiday Inn was full of people from the out of town team, tailgating in the parking lot. We liked this and laughed that my brother would have loved to have had a tailgate memorial.
My personal feeling is that the memorial should benefit those who are grieving and the style should be chosen by them. This will be different for different groups of people. Other family members of mine have had somber church funerals for their loved ones, and that seemed fine, too.
sabine
[ 06. December 2017, 16:08: Message edited by: sabine ]
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"Hunger looks like the man that hunger is killing." Eduardo Galeano
Posts: 5887 | From: the US Heartland | Registered: Dec 2002
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John Holding
Coffee and Cognac
# 158
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Stetson:
Logically, I can understand the reasons for viewing a funeral as the "celebration of a life".
On a gut/aesthetic level, however, it seems somewhere in the vicinity of a clergyman peppering his sermon with the current "cool" street slang, to show how down with the kids he is.
Well, if s/he were addressing a group of people who habitually use such language, that would be perfectly appropriate. If s/he is talking to a bunch of the usual suspects -- over 60 -- then not so much. (Always assuming that s/he actually knows the language and can use it correctly, of course).
John
Posts: 5929 | From: Ottawa, Canada | Registered: May 2001
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Bishops Finger
Shipmate
# 5430
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Posted
SvitlanaV2 said:
quote:
I'm impressed that the pall-bearers have the strength to dance and carry a coffin at the same time. I thought those things were supposed to be heavy!
As I implied in my post immediately before that, I found by personal experience that that is indeed the case.
IJ
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Our words are giants when they do us an injury, and dwarfs when they do us a service. (Wilkie Collins)
Posts: 10151 | From: Behind The Wheel Again! | Registered: Jan 2004
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Stetson
Shipmate
# 9597
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by John Holding:
quote:
Originally posted by Stetson:
Logically, I can understand the reasons for viewing a funeral as the "celebration of a life".
On a gut/aesthetic level, however, it seems somewhere in the vicinity of a clergyman peppering his sermon with the current "cool" street slang, to show how down with the kids he is.
Well, if s/he were addressing a group of people who habitually use such language, that would be perfectly appropriate. If s/he is talking to a bunch of the usual suspects -- over 60 -- then not so much. (Always assuming that s/he actually knows the language and can use it correctly, of course).
John
Even in front of a youthful audience, I think the criterion would be how natural such language is to the speaker. Basically, if it is in any way calculated to make the audience think "Wow, this old guy isn't as much of a dork as I thought", it's a groaner for me.
But if it is the way he is always accustomed to speaking whenever in the presence of a certain age group, it's fine. There'd be no reason for him to do otherwise, in fact.
And yes, your "know the lingo and how to use it" would probably cover most cases in my second paragraph, but there are still situations where the speaker could be well-versed, but still unnatural.
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I have the power...Lucifer is lord!
Posts: 6574 | From: back and forth between bible belts | Registered: Jun 2005
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Nick Tamen
Ship's Wayfaring Fool
# 15164
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by sabine:
Traditional New Orleans funeral customs often include a jazz band parade, starting off with a dirge and then sweeping into something celebratory. See here for an example.
A traditional New Orleans funeral was the first thing I thought of seeing this thread.
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The first thing God says to Moses is, "Take off your shoes." We are on holy ground. Hard to believe, but the truest thing I know. — Anne Lamott
Posts: 2833 | From: On heaven-crammed earth | Registered: Sep 2009
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churchgeek
Have candles, will pray
# 5557
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Stetson:
quote:
Originally posted by John Holding:
quote:
Originally posted by Stetson:
Logically, I can understand the reasons for viewing a funeral as the "celebration of a life".
On a gut/aesthetic level, however, it seems somewhere in the vicinity of a clergyman peppering his sermon with the current "cool" street slang, to show how down with the kids he is.
Well, if s/he were addressing a group of people who habitually use such language, that would be perfectly appropriate. If s/he is talking to a bunch of the usual suspects -- over 60 -- then not so much. (Always assuming that s/he actually knows the language and can use it correctly, of course).
John
Even in front of a youthful audience, I think the criterion would be how natural such language is to the speaker. Basically, if it is in any way calculated to make the audience think "Wow, this old guy isn't as much of a dork as I thought", it's a groaner for me.
But if it is the way he is always accustomed to speaking whenever in the presence of a certain age group, it's fine. There'd be no reason for him to do otherwise, in fact.
And yes, your "know the lingo and how to use it" would probably cover most cases in my second paragraph, but there are still situations where the speaker could be well-versed, but still unnatural.
And even beyond that, there's the matter of what language is appropriate in different contexts. Most of us wouldn't go full-on slang in a sermon no matter how naturally we speak it outside the pulpit.
None of which is all that terribly relevant to the video in the OP, of course. Even on the gut/aesthetic level, what seems appropriate in a funeral is going to be determined largely by one's culture (the intersections between the larger culture, one's religion, socioeconomic class, etc.), just like what kind of language is appropriate in a sermon will similarly vary.
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Enoch
Shipmate
# 14322
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Posted
I was at a funeral at a crem a few years ago - a secular one, I might add - where at the end a jazz number was played and the widow danced out to it. I know it was meant to say, 'pick yourself up, dust yourself down and start all over again', but it looked like 'thank goodness he's gone'.
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Posts: 7610 | From: Bristol UK(was European Green Capital 2015, now Ljubljana) | Registered: Nov 2008
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Moo
Ship's tough old bird
# 107
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by sabine:
Traditional New Orleans funeral customs often include a jazz band parade, starting off with a dirge and then sweeping into something celebratory.
I have heard that sometimes on the way back from the cemetery, they sing a song with words something like, "I'm glad you're gone, you old rascal you."
Moo
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Kerygmania host
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See you later, alligator.
Posts: 20365 | From: Alleghany Mountains of Virginia | Registered: May 2001
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Pigwidgeon
Ship's Owl
# 10192
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Posted
I attended a very traditional church funeral for a dear older woman several years ago. The music was provided by a family friend, playing the piano. I don't remember what he played before and during the service, something traditional I believe. But as everyone was leaving the church he played "Put on a Happy Face." I loved it, knowing that my dear friend must have requested it. It was perfect for her.
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"...that is generally a matter for Pigwidgeon, several other consenting adults, a bottle of cheap Gin and the odd giraffe."
~Tortuf
Posts: 9835 | From: Hogwarts | Registered: Aug 2005
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Galloping Granny
Shipmate
# 13814
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Posted
Some years ago now, a new style of movie on a very wide screen circulated a 'sampler' of scenes that looked extra effective on the huge screen. One was a funeral procession in New Orleans. It was tremendously exciting, and made one want to get up and dance, The band was playing 'When the saints go marching in'.
As a style of funeral, I guess my reaction was.'Well, why not?'
GG
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The Kingdom of Heaven is spread upon the earth, and men do not see it. Gospel of Thomas, 113
Posts: 2629 | From: Matarangi | Registered: Jun 2008
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Augustine the Aleut
Shipmate
# 1472
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Posted
I have spoken to the Incumbent of my parish of how it would be nice if the little casket containing my ashes would be preceded by nymphs scattering rose petals, to which he responded that it would only be possible if they were regular attenders at evensong.
Posts: 6236 | From: Ottawa, Canada | Registered: Oct 2001
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Palimpsest
Shipmate
# 16772
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Posted
When I watched the last papal funeral I was struck by what is apparently a Roman tradition; applause for the deceaded.
Posts: 2990 | From: Seattle WA. US | Registered: Nov 2011
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Ian Climacus
Liturgical Slattern
# 944
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Posted
Not my style, but when in Ghana...
I have attended one "happy" funeral here. Sad to say it did not sit well with me, but I know that to be my issue alone [if I had funds I'd dress like this most days]. The nearest and dearest seemed to get much from it, so a good thing.
Posts: 7800 | From: On the border | Registered: Jul 2001
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georgiaboy
Shipmate
# 11294
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Enoch:
I was at a funeral at a crem a few years ago - a secular one, I might add - where at the end a jazz number was played and the widow danced out to it. I know it was meant to say, 'pick yourself up, dust yourself down and start all over again', but it looked like 'thank goodness he's gone'.
This calls for a singing of Coward's 'In a Bar on the Piccola Marina'
(A performance of this by Dame Felicity Lott may be found on YouTube.)
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You can't retire from a calling.
Posts: 1675 | From: saint meinrad, IN | Registered: Apr 2006
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Pigwidgeon
Ship's Owl
# 10192
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by georgiaboy:
quote:
Originally posted by Enoch:
I was at a funeral at a crem a few years ago - a secular one, I might add - where at the end a jazz number was played and the widow danced out to it. I know it was meant to say, 'pick yourself up, dust yourself down and start all over again', but it looked like 'thank goodness he's gone'.
This calls for a singing of Coward's 'In a Bar on the Piccola Marina'
(A performance of this by Dame Felicity Lott may be found on YouTube.)
Not familiar with that piece (I'll Google it), but I've met Dame Felicity -- she's a delight!
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"...that is generally a matter for Pigwidgeon, several other consenting adults, a bottle of cheap Gin and the odd giraffe."
~Tortuf
Posts: 9835 | From: Hogwarts | Registered: Aug 2005
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Boogie
Boogie on down!
# 13538
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Posted
Hmmmmm ...
It just reminded me of Terry Pratchett’s Luggage 🤔🙄
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Garden. Room. Walk
Posts: 13030 | From: Boogie Wonderland | Registered: Mar 2008
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rufiki
Ship's 'shroom
# 11165
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Moo:
I have heard that sometimes on the way back from the cemetery, they sing a song with words something like, "I'm glad you're gone, you old rascal you."
Moo
I attended a secular funeral earlier this year at which the invitation to the wake was something like “come and raise a glass to the old bugger”. Gentle piss-taking had been the tone of the whole service. It’s what the widow and daughter wanted, and it felt right for this particular chap. Each to their own I say.
Posts: 1562 | Registered: Mar 2006
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Og, King of Bashan
Ship's giant Amorite
# 9562
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Posted
There is a whole group of artists and funeral industry folks here in the States who have gotten together to form something called the Order of the Good Death.
The basic idea is that we essentially have a one-size-fits-all funeral industry, which sanitizes death, and isn't really in line with what lots of people want from a memorial service. By educating people about practices and options, they hope to turn funerals into something that you can really personalize to the desires of the individual.
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"I like to eat crawfish and drink beer. That's despair?" ― Walker Percy
Posts: 3259 | From: Denver, Colorado, USA | Registered: May 2005
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Rossweisse
High Church Valkyrie
# 2349
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by georgiaboy:
This calls for a singing of Coward's 'In a Bar on the Piccola Marina'
(A performance of this by Dame Felicity Lott may be found on YouTube.)
And here is Dame Flott, in a spirited and delightful performance of the tune.
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I'm not dead yet.
Posts: 15117 | From: Valhalla | Registered: Feb 2002
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Laud-able
Ship's Ancient
# 9896
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Posted
At the funeral of one my friends, held at St Paul's, Covent Garden (the actors' church), his partner arranged for the music of the procession out to segue into Coward's 'I'll see you again'.
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'. . . "Non Angli, sed Angeli" "not Angels, but Anglicans"', Sellar, W C, and Yeatman, R J, 1066 and All That, London, 1930, p. 6.
Posts: 279 | From: Melbourne, Australia | Registered: Jul 2005
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Augustine the Aleut
Shipmate
# 1472
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Posted
A few years ago I attended the funeral of a colleague where the proceedings, which featured very carefully chose hymns, ended with a trumpet rendition of Luiz Bonfá's Manhă de Carnaval from the film Black Orpheus, which caused smiles among a few of us who knew of his excursions into Rio nightlife.
Posts: 6236 | From: Ottawa, Canada | Registered: Oct 2001
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