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Source: (consider it) Thread: Archbishop Kay Goldsworthy
Gee D
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I'm not sure if this is the right board for this.

Bishop Kay Goldsworthy, currently Bishop of Gippsland, has been elected as Archbishop of Perth. She will be the first woman to become an Archbishop in Australia. Not doubting her qualifications at all, but there will be some in Perth who will be far from pleased that a woman has become Archbishop. Of course, it would not happen here in Sydney. We don't even have women ordained as priests.

[ 30. August 2017, 03:36: Message edited by: Gee D ]

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Barnabas62
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I think it's a Dead Horse, being about the role of women, initially a particular woman,in the church. Off it goes.

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simontoad
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Did she do a good job as Bishop of Gippsland?

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Banner Lady
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Indeed.

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Gee D
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Only a short time there, as was her predecessor Bp John - who died very unexpectedly. There are some rather strong anti-women among the Perth clergy IIRC. I'd think that the great majority would support her.

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Clutch
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quote:
Originally posted by simontoad:
Did she do a good job as Bishop of Gippsland?

I'd suspect that she would not have been elected to the Metropolitan if her administration/pastoral care of Gippsland was lackluster.

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Dark Knight

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As Perth was the first diocese to ordain women in Australia, and the first to consecrate a female bishop (who was Kay Goldsworthy), I have no idea what this thread is supposed to be about.

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Baker
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I don't really know the background of this story, as I'm not Australian. I'm Episcopal Church of the United States.

We don't call our head bishop an archbishop, we call them the Presiding Bishop, but it's really the same thing. And although our current PB is male, his predecessor was female. So we are used to such things.

One poster said the diocese that encompasses Sydney does not even ordain women. Here in the USA it's not diocese by diocese, there's only one policy across the church. I take it that makes the Australian church different?

What is someone from a church like mine was to move to Australia? I really wouldn't want to attend where women weren't on an even basis with men, so what would be the best thing to do?

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Gee D
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Bae - Presiding Bishop Schori was in effect an archbishop, so she was the first in the Anglican Communion. ++Kay is the second but the first to have that actual title.

Ordination/licensing is on a diocese by diocese basis. All now accept women as priests save for Sydney, Armidale and (I think) NW Australia. The current ++ Sydney will license as a deacon a woman priested elsewhere. What she does in a particular parish is then a matter for he, the local parish council and her rector. All sorts of problems with that, but a real step ahead of the previous ban. A pretty common assessment is that ++Glenn would be happy to ordain and license women but knows he would face a revolt in synod from the conservatives.

What to do, you ask. Well, you could settle in a diocese where women are fully accepted as equals. That means most of Australia. In Sydney you could do as we do, and travel to a parish where women, gays, transgender are all accepted.

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Baker
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Thanks Gee D for the reply. I'm not really planning on moving, that was a hypothetical, but it still has meaning for me.

I was raised in a conservative Lutheran denomination, the Lutheran Church-Missouri Synod. Only recently were women accepted as voting memembers of congregations. And there are still no female clergy of course. So I'd never want to backstep in my attitudes.

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Gee D
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Yes, I had assumed a hypothetical move. There are quite a few women working as priests in Sydney, even with the restriction (which of course still requires male consent of course). The present archbishop raises no objections. What he did do on being elected was to direct that women bishops in other dioceses be recognised as such. In ++Peter Jensen's day, the common description used in St Andrew's House was along the lines of "that woman who thinks she's a bishop"!

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Dark Knight

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quote:
Originally posted by Baker:

What is someone from a church like mine was to move to Australia? I really wouldn't want to attend where women weren't on an even basis with men, so what would be the best thing to do?

You could come to a diocese that recognises the ordination of women, such as Perth. Simples.

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Zappa
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+ Kay was a meteor ascending from the time of her ordination about 35 years ago. Had she been male she would have been a bishop long before she was. She performed a fine task as assistant bishop in Perth, then as Bishop of Gippsland. Apart from one or two in Perth who feel a little bit of a "searched the world and found a local" syndrome, most recognize that + Kaye is a fine person for the job, and while there were one or two other possible candidates, at least one that I know well, I suspect she is the best pick for the vagaries of a cosmoplitan, diverse and isolated diocese. God go with her.

[ 05. September 2017, 01:29: Message edited by: Zappa ]

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Baptist Trainfan
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As a slight tangent, we shall have to see what happens this week in the Church in Wales. The issue here may be that the two women have only recently come to their present posts.
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Gee D
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quote:
Originally posted by Baptist Trainfan:
As a slight tangent, we shall have to see what happens this week in the Church in Wales. The issue here may be that the two women have only recently come to their present posts.

Yes, an interesting opportunity although +Joan was probably too recently consecrated to be a serious contender.

Zappa - certainly agree about ++Kay.

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Knopwood
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quote:
Originally posted by Gee D:
NW Australia.

Whose metropolitan she will be, so that will be interesting.

The Murray finally ordained a woman as a deacon earlier this year but doesn't appear to have taken any decisions about priesting women, so you can add them to the list.

[ 07. September 2017, 02:34: Message edited by: Knopwood ]

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Gee D
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Knopwood, thanks for that - it had escaped me. The Chancellor of the diocese is Robert Tong, a leading light in the Anglican Church League. A very odd combination indeed.

++Glenn is metropolitan to +Sarah Grafton. He did not go to her enthronement (she'd already been consecrated as an assistant) but did visit her afterwards. I understand that the meeting was very cordial, very cordial indeed. Of course he'd already given the Bishops' Farewell at +Barbara Darling's funeral. That was very moving and heartfelt.

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keibat
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So, is ++Glenn the Gorbachev or F W de Klerk of Sydney, the initially safe choice taking cautious steps towards a previously unimaginable shift in direction?

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Gee D
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++Glenn won't take any clear steps, just tinker as much as he can around the edges. He was not really the safe choice either. There were some funny things happen at the Synod. The Anglican Church League was promoting Canon Rick Smith as their candidate. Sydney has a strange electoral system with 3 ballots. The first ballot is to decide which candidates are worth considering further, nothing more. Despite 3 goes at counting, Canon Smith did not get over the line at this preliminary stage. ++Glenn was then elected unopposed.

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Dark Knight

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I appreciate the assessment from someone I know and trust, Zap. I was at Kay Goldsworthy's consecration. Till then, the memorial service for Diana was the biggest crowd we had ever had at St George's Cathedral (no one knows why). The consecration shattered that record - multiple fire hazards as well over a thousand gathered.

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Evensong
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I remember that. I had to stand way up the back the whole time. [Big Grin]

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Evensong
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Gee D

There will indeed be some in the diocese that will not appreciate a female archbishop: but thankfully not many.

I had a friend who approached their parish priest about the possibility of a vocation to ordained ministry and the parish priest told her to go home and raise children.

What I find bizarre, is that this kind of thing is tolerated in our diocese. When you are ordained you have to sign things saying you assent to the statutes etc and authority of the bishops and the Archbishop. Those in this diocese that do not accept the ordination of women are still given a license and authorised to be clergy. How on earth does that work?

Is it simply being too soft or an attempt at unity in diversity?

Curiously, I have found this disdainful attitude to the ordained ministry of women in the diocese present not only among my "evangelical" colleagues but my very high church ones as well.

I suppose it to be true that the extremes often end up in the same boat or holding hands at the edges where the full circle comes around.

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Vulpior

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quote:
Originally posted by Gee D:
Knopwood, thanks for that - it had escaped me. The Chancellor of the diocese is Robert Tong, a leading light in the Anglican Church League. A very odd combination indeed.

++Glenn is metropolitan to +Sarah Grafton. He did not go to her enthronement (she'd already been consecrated as an assistant) but did visit her afterwards. I understand that the meeting was very cordial, very cordial indeed. Of course he'd already given the Bishops' Farewell at +Barbara Darling's funeral. That was very moving and heartfelt.

In fact, +Sarah's enthronement was also her consecration. +Stuart Canberra and Goulburn was chief consecrator given ++Glenn's "unavailability".

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Gee D
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Thanks Vulpior, I had thought that she was consecrated when she became an assistant in Canberra and Goulburn with +Stuart being the lead consecrator, and then enthroned at Grafton.

And welcome back.

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magnum mysterium
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+Sarah Grafton was never an assistant in Canberra and Goulburn. The most senior role she occupied in that diocese was archdeacon.

You may perhaps be confusing her with +Genieve, who was consecrated to be an assistant bishop in Canberra and Goulburn, and was subsequently appointed to Melbourne as an assistant bishop in that diocese.

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Gee D
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Thank you, I was.

Welcome back.

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