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Source: (consider it)
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Thread: Purgatory: New blasts in London
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I_am_not_Job
Shipmate
# 3634
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Posted
More incidents. Unclear if copycat, or just trying a different tack. Seem to be minor, only one person injured. Causing panic and disruption, which at least does not include murder.
BBC report
The question is, how many more of these can we expect and why is it always on Thursdays?
[Thread title revised.]
[ 26. August 2005, 04:13: Message edited by: RuthW ]
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Hope for everything; expect nothing
Posts: 988 | From: London | Registered: Dec 2002
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Gill H
Shipmate
# 68
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Posted
"I never could get the hang of Thursdays" (Arthur Dent).
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*sigh* We can’t all be Alan Cresswell.
- Lyda Rose
Posts: 9313 | From: London | Registered: May 2001
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daronmedway
Shipmate
# 3012
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by I_am_not_Job:
More incidents. Unclear if copycat, or just trying a different tack. Seem to be minor, only one person injured. Causing panic and disruption, which at least does not include murder.
BBC report
The question is, how many more of these can we expect and why is it always on Thursdays?
'Cos it's the day before Friday.
Posts: 6976 | From: Southampton | Registered: Jul 2002
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PhilA
shipocaster
# 8792
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Posted
![[Frown]](frown.gif) Plese God, not again.
Lets hope this is just some wompet with a few firworks rather than yet more bombs.
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To err is human. To arr takes a pirate.
Posts: 3121 | From: Sofa | Registered: Nov 2004
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Mark M
Shipmate
# 9500
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by PhilA:
Plese God, not again.
Lets hope this is just some wompet with a few firworks rather than yet more bombs.
I'm praying it's some sad twat who thinks it's funny to scare people, rather than real terrorists.
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I only know three words of Latin: deus caritas est.
Posts: 139 | From: Edinburgh, Scotland UK | Registered: May 2005
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Nicolemr
Shipmate
# 28
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Posted
i had to be depressing, but since there were four new explosions, its not likely to be just one person playing around. my fear is that its a sort of "gentle reminder"... like, "we did it once, we can do it again, despite all your security".
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On pilgrimage in the endless realms of Cyberia, currently traveling by ship. Now with live journal!
Posts: 11803 | From: New York City "The City Carries On" | Registered: May 2001
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Nicolemr
Shipmate
# 28
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Posted
that was supposed to read "i hate to be depressing", but i suppose its accurate the way it is, too...
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On pilgrimage in the endless realms of Cyberia, currently traveling by ship. Now with live journal!
Posts: 11803 | From: New York City "The City Carries On" | Registered: May 2001
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Hazey*Jane
Ship's Biscuit Crumbs
# 8754
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by nicolemrw:
i had to be depressing, but since there were four new explosions, its not likely to be just one person playing around. my fear is that its a sort of "gentle reminder"... like, "we did it once, we can do it again, despite all your security".
Yes, that does sound likely. To be honest, they really don't need carnage to have an impact - just maximum chaos, and that is what they acheived.
In a way, I wouldn't be surprised if the perpetrators of this had absolutely nothing to do with the original group - or even their cause. A precendent has been set for how to cause chaos and I guess it is tempting for people that way inclined to follow the example. ![[brick wall]](graemlins/brick_wall.gif)
Posts: 4266 | From: UK | Registered: Nov 2004
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The Scrumpmeister
Ship’s Taverner
# 5638
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Posted
Lord, have mercy. ![[Votive]](graemlins/votive.gif)
I don't know what to say or feel.
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If Christ is not fully human, humankind is not fully saved. - St John of Saint-Denis
Posts: 14741 | From: Greater Manchester, UK | Registered: Mar 2004
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KenWritez
Shipmate
# 3238
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Posted
My prayers and sympathies with you all.
I hope this doesn't turn into something like our high school shootings, where one act fed multiple repetitions.
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"The truth is you're the weak. And I'm the tyranny of evil men. But I'm tryin', Ringo. I'm tryin' real hard to be a shepherd." --Quentin Tarantino, Pulp Fiction
My blog: http://oxygenofgrace.blogspot.com
Posts: 11102 | From: Left coast of Wonderland, by the rabbit hole | Registered: Aug 2002
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ken
Ship's Roundhead
# 2460
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Posted
I wouldn't call what's going on here at the moment exactly chaos. More like business as usual.
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Ken
L’amor che move il sole e l’altre stelle.
Posts: 39579 | From: London | Registered: Mar 2002
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RuthW
liberal "peace first" hankie squeezer
# 13
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Posted
Hoping this doesn't appear insensitive, but please post the votive smilies and expressions of sympathy in All Saints. They tend to suppress discussion in Purgatory. I'm changing the thread title accordingly. Thanks for your cooperation.
RuthW
Purgatory host
Posts: 24453 | From: La La Land | Registered: Apr 2001
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Father Gregory
Orthodoxy
# 310
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Posted
From the point of view of terror, it doesn't matter that they were (apparently) damp squibs. It's the message ... "we did it and we can do it again."
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Yours in Christ
Fr. Gregory
Find Your Way Around the Plot
TheOrthodoxPlot™
Posts: 15099 | From: Manchester, UK | Registered: May 2001
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PhilA
shipocaster
# 8792
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Posted
This is just a theory and not backed up with anything, but, it sounds to me as though this could have been a real attempt to bomb London, but they the terrorists used some 'bad' stuff and it didn't explode as planned.
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To err is human. To arr takes a pirate.
Posts: 3121 | From: Sofa | Registered: Nov 2004
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Hazey*Jane
Ship's Biscuit Crumbs
# 8754
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Posted
There has been talk on the news that perhaps this was supposed to be a lot bigger than it actually was. Praise God that it wasn't, for whatever reason.
Posts: 4266 | From: UK | Registered: Nov 2004
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Glimmer
Ship's Lantern
# 4540
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Posted
I often wondered why bombers haven't caried out subsequent attacks. If I were a 'mastermind' behind a campaign, I would certainly not limit to one attack; in the 'terror ratings' surely repeat attacks in the same place a few weeks apart is how to maximise the effect?
Anyway, thank God there wasn't the destruction and loss of life this time. The police, etc were superb. As was the population of London; "we are not frightened" is the message from my friends there.
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The original, unchanged 4540.
The Temple area, Ankh Morpork
Posts: 1749 | From: Ankh Morpork, Dorset | Registered: May 2003
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Father Gregory
Orthodoxy
# 310
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Posted
True and for that we all give thanks. The hard truth though (as many as have warned us before) it's not IF the big one comes, but WHEN.
There is very little anyone can do to stop suicide bombers. Just how many rucksacks are there in London on any given day? Do we have enough manpower and sniffer dogs to mount guard over all entry and exit points on arterial routes and sensitive sites for, say, the next two decades?
That's why it's better (psychologically) to think of this as a long drawn out war rather than "a little local difficulty." I hope I'm wrong but it's what the professionals are saying as well.
Meantime we can do a lot by keeping out the imported rabble rowsers, hate mongers and violence inciters. Moreover we need to support the overwhelming Muslim majority as they seek to bat back the fanatics. It's going to be a long haul for everyone. The Olympics are going to prove especially testing.
[ 21. July 2005, 17:45: Message edited by: Father Gregory ]
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Yours in Christ
Fr. Gregory
Find Your Way Around the Plot
TheOrthodoxPlot™
Posts: 15099 | From: Manchester, UK | Registered: May 2001
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rugbyplayingpriest
Shipmate
# 9809
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Posted
Mark worte:
quote:
I'm praying it's some sad twat who thinks it's funny to scare people, rather than real terrorists.
quote:
The difference being??
I thought your definition summed them all up!
Posts: 130 | From: Kent | Registered: Jul 2005
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Alicïa
Shipmate
# 7668
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Posted
Like the Police Chief said, the intent was there to kill. I don't see a difference.
I hope they get some good information from this that leads to arrests. Some of the explosives didn't go off so they must get good forensics and stuff from that.
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"The tendency to turn human judgments into divine commands makes religion one of the most dangerous forces in the world." Georgia Elma Harkness
Posts: 884 | From: Where the Art is. | Registered: Jun 2004
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Mark Wuntoo
Shipmate
# 5673
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Father Gregory:
. . . Moreover we need to support the overwhelming Muslim majority as they seek to bat back the fanatics. It's going to be a long haul for everyone...
I agree but I do think that the 'minority' is rather larger than is being acknowledged. I am thinking of the many, many young Muslim men who are disillusioned and marginalised, who feel they are ignored by both general society and their own elders. They are 'just waiting to go' (to quote one community worker).
This is not helped by Tony Blair and others talking about 'excuses' not justifying the actions. It is not 'excuses' that are behind the atrocities but 'reasons' (of course as seen through the eyes of the perpetrators), and we give these young men further 'reasons' for violence by talking about 'excuses' in this way.
I also suspect that we kid ourselves when we talk about 'Muslim' young men and suggest that it is not 'black' or 'Hindu' or 'Indian' (as I heard earlier today) or 'whites' come to that. Some of us remember the 1960's / 70's and I doubt that it would take very much (a long hot summer?) to spark wider violence.
I hope I'm wrong - on all counts.
Blessings!
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Blessed are the cracked for they let in the light.
Posts: 1950 | From: Somewhere else. | Registered: Mar 2004
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Mark Wuntoo
Shipmate
# 5673
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Posted
Took me a long time to compose the last one and Lady A jumped in!
quote:
Originally posted by Lady Alicia of Scouseland:
. . . I hope they get some good information from this that leads to arrests. Some of the explosives didn't go off so they must get good forensics and stuff from that.
But surely I heard that there were bombs in the Luton car - didn't they get forensics from that?
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Blessed are the cracked for they let in the light.
Posts: 1950 | From: Somewhere else. | Registered: Mar 2004
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Alicïa
Shipmate
# 7668
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Posted
Yes, I'm sure ... but isn't it about building a profile of the big picture rather than ... case solved?
They are 2 different not necessarily connected incidents but they must have been gaining more information (I would hope)
Sir Ian Blair (Police Chief)... Latest News Comment
[ 21. July 2005, 18:28: Message edited by: Lady Alicia of Scouseland ]
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"The tendency to turn human judgments into divine commands makes religion one of the most dangerous forces in the world." Georgia Elma Harkness
Posts: 884 | From: Where the Art is. | Registered: Jun 2004
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Alicïa
Shipmate
# 7668
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Posted
quote:
Police sources say the blasts may have been near-simultaneous and that they are being linked with the 7 July bombs.
from the article I linked to.
So I hope they will be able to build a better picture from the comparison of forensics and what turns up. I heard they had made a couple of arrests already and we still don't know what the outcome of the hospital incident was so maybe that was an arrest.
(Armed Police went in there after someone seemingly)
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"The tendency to turn human judgments into divine commands makes religion one of the most dangerous forces in the world." Georgia Elma Harkness
Posts: 884 | From: Where the Art is. | Registered: Jun 2004
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Mark Wuntoo
Shipmate
# 5673
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Posted
What?? ![[Confused]](confused.gif)
FOUR devices that failed to go off? Hard to believe, after the 'successes' of two weeks ago. ![[Ultra confused]](graemlins/confused2.gif)
The first casualty of war is the truth and I guess it's the same at this time - I reckon a whole lot of stuff is being witheld from us (I'm not saying we should be told everything).
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Blessed are the cracked for they let in the light.
Posts: 1950 | From: Somewhere else. | Registered: Mar 2004
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Alicïa
Shipmate
# 7668
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Posted
I think at least one of them did go off else how did we get the reports of a window being blown out on the bus earlier?
You're right of course, that the truth is often something we aren't too sure of especially in times like these, though the Met did say that they would not confirm anything until they were sure it was correct, and not jump to any conclusions until they had got all the evidence together.
quote:
Sir Ian said there was a "resonance" with the bomb attacks two weeks ago, but that it was too early to draw any conclusions about whether they were linked.
So I guess they are reasonably unclear that people will draw their own conclusions, but that the intention was not to deliver biscuits.
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"The tendency to turn human judgments into divine commands makes religion one of the most dangerous forces in the world." Georgia Elma Harkness
Posts: 884 | From: Where the Art is. | Registered: Jun 2004
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Jenn.
Shipmate
# 5239
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Posted
The reports I saw said that the detonators went off, which gives off some force, since it is a small explosive, however the large explosive failed. This would account for the bangs and the injury, as well as the windows on the bus, and explain why there were no other significant injuries.
Posts: 2282 | From: England | Registered: Nov 2003
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Mark Wuntoo
Shipmate
# 5673
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Posted
Yes, sorry, some things did go off - but there are reports that these were probably detonators.
It is also being said that the intention was to kill - so I think they didn't 'go off' properly (or they were very, very much smaller and designed to cause fear rather than to kill).
Still bad.
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Blessed are the cracked for they let in the light.
Posts: 1950 | From: Somewhere else. | Registered: Mar 2004
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Vikki Pollard
Shipmate
# 5548
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Posted
NB Let's not forget there are plenty of white Muslims before going the colour route.
Well either it was a spectacular coincidence, all four failing to go off, a copycat (as there's strong evidence the bus on the 7th should never have happened but should have been a train too) OR let's hope there's someone in there sabotaging the bombs. Bit much to hope I know, but you never know.
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"I don't get all this fuss about global warming, Miss. Why doesn't the Government just knock down all the f**king greenhouses?" (One of my slightly less bright 15 year old pupils)
Posts: 5695 | From: The Far Side | Registered: Feb 2004
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Ariel
Shipmate
# 58
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by I_am_not_Job:
The question is, how many more of these can we expect and why is it always on Thursdays?
This is only the second wave we've had, I'd hardly say it "always" happens. Both have been on Thursdays but I doubt very much that they're trying to lull us into some kind of sense of false security by deciding only to plant bombs on Thursdays. You can't deduce a pattern from just two instances.
We were bloody lucky this time to get off this lightly. What worries me though is that the perpetrators seem to have escaped unharmed i.e. are still at large and free to do it again. They should have CCTV footage of the people who escaped, I hope this will lead to something.
Posts: 25445 | Registered: May 2001
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Alfred E. Neuman
What? Me worry?
# 6855
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Posted
This should open up the case for the investigators. Lots of good evidence to be gathered. I expect you'll see lots of arrests soon. Hang in there, Londoners! Our hearts are with you!
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--Formerly: Gort--
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Sir Kevin
Ship's Gaffer
# 3492
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Posted
I'm sorry to hear that you're being terrorized once again, even if it was only detonators, not bombs. I read an article in the Guardian or Telegraph that there are some 'moderate' (i.e. radical) Muslim clerics who should be deported from the UK. Soonest.
Last I heard, they seem to have arested someone.
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If you board the wrong train, it is no use running along the corridor in the other direction Dietrich Bonhoeffer
Writing is currently my hobby, not yet my profession.
Posts: 30517 | From: White Hart Lane | Registered: Oct 2002
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HopPik
Shipmate
# 8510
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Gort:
This should open up the case for the investigators. Lots of good evidence to be gathered. I expect you'll see lots of arrests soon. Hang in there, Londoners! Our hearts are with you!
Thanks Gort, yes does look good, no serious casualties, loadsa forensics and I hear, two arrests already. May they long continue to f**k up!
[ 21. July 2005, 20:41: Message edited by: HopPik ]
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Never wrestle with a pig. You get dirty, and supposedly the pig enjoys it. G.B. Shaw
Posts: 2084 | From: London | Registered: Sep 2004
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Niënna
Ship's Lotus Blossom
# 4652
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Ariel:
quote:
Originally posted by I_am_not_Job:
The question is, how many more of these can we expect and why is it always on Thursdays?
This is only the second wave we've had, I'd hardly say it "always" happens. Both have been on Thursdays but I doubt very much that they're trying to lull us into some kind of sense of false security by deciding only to plant bombs on Thursdays. You can't deduce a pattern from just two instances.
We were bloody lucky this time to get off this lightly. What worries me though is that the perpetrators seem to have escaped unharmed i.e. are still at large and free to do it again. They should have CCTV footage of the people who escaped, I hope this will lead to something.
9/11 was a Thursday
3/11 (Madrid bombings was it only a march?) was a Thursday
7/7 was a Thursday
7/21 a Thursday
Thursday is the day before the celebrated holy day of Islam, Friday.
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[Nino points a gun at Chiki]
Nino: Now... tell me. Who started the war?
Chiki: [long pause] We did.
~No Man's Land
Posts: 2298 | From: Purgatory | Registered: Jun 2003
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Living in Gin
Liturgical Pyromaniac
# 2572
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Posted
Um, 9/11/01 was a Tuesday.
[ 21. July 2005, 20:45: Message edited by: Living in Gin ]
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It's all fun and games until somebody gets burned at the stake.
Posts: 1893 | From: Cincinnati, USA | Registered: Apr 2002
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Niënna
Ship's Lotus Blossom
# 4652
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Posted
opps... 9/11 a tuesday...
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[Nino points a gun at Chiki]
Nino: Now... tell me. Who started the war?
Chiki: [long pause] We did.
~No Man's Land
Posts: 2298 | From: Purgatory | Registered: Jun 2003
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RuthW
liberal "peace first" hankie squeezer
# 13
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Posted
And Bali was a Wednesday, wasn't it?
Posts: 24453 | From: La La Land | Registered: Apr 2001
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HopPik
Shipmate
# 8510
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Posted
Tis strange though... when I saw footage of a suspect sprawled on the ground with police aiming machine guns at him I thought... Yay!! But now they say he had nothing to do with it. Natural reaction yes, but shows how you have to keep a grip, whatever's going down.
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Never wrestle with a pig. You get dirty, and supposedly the pig enjoys it. G.B. Shaw
Posts: 2084 | From: London | Registered: Sep 2004
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Ariel
Shipmate
# 58
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Posted
I'd have thought one thing they'd try to avoid would be anything that might make it look as if there was a pattern to dates when they struck.
With the benefit of hindsight I remember saying to a friend that there seemed to be an unusual number of police around some railway stations at the beginning of July (before the blasts) to which he replied that he'd noticed that too. They were patrolling the platforms in pairs and searching the toilets. I've rarely seen a heavy police presence at stations other than on occasions like Cup Final days. I wonder if they'd got wind that something might be about to happen.
[ 21. July 2005, 21:26: Message edited by: Ariel ]
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Robert Armin
All licens'd fool
# 182
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Posted
I took a train into London yesterday afternoon, and then travelled around on the Tube a bit. It seemed to me to be business as usual, but that may have been because the line I was using (Central) hadn't been affected. Certainly the Tube seemed just as crowded as ever, with the whole cross section of ages and nationalities that you normally find.
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Keeping fit was an obsession with Fr Moity .... He did chin ups in the vestry, calisthenics in the pulpit, and had developed a series of Tai-Chi exercises to correspond with ritual movements of the Mass. The Antipope Robert Rankin
Posts: 8927 | From: In the pack | Registered: May 2001
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Jack the Lass
Ship's airhead
# 3415
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Posted
On BBC London radio this morning there was some heated discussion about some American reports which stated that Londoners were fleeing from the Tubes in terror yesterday and comparing central London to central Baghdad. And some of the headlines even here this morning talk about "City in Fear" and all that sort of thing. Generally that sort of talk seems to be just cheesing people off - it really seems basically to be business as usual, with inconvenience and delay thrown into the mix (not that Londoners are unused to public transport inconvenience and delay). Those types of headlines and reports seem more reminiscent of the extremist headlines that came out after the bombings a couple of weeks ago crowing that thanks to the glorious martyrs Londoners were cowering in fear etc, which is why I think it's really irresponsible for the press to come out with them - they're providing the hype of publicity the bombers thrive on.
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"My body is a temple - it's big and doesn't move." (Jo Brand)
wiblog blipfoto blog
Posts: 5767 | From: the land of the deep-fried Mars Bar | Registered: Oct 2002
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Marvin the Martian
Interplanetary
# 4360
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Ariel:
What worries me though is that the perpetrators seem to have escaped unharmed i.e. are still at large and free to do it again.
Yeah, WTF's up with that? I'd have thought that as soon as the commuters realised they were still alive they'd have taken their chance to 'apprehend'* the slime.
.
*= with extreme prejudice, naturally...
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Hail Gallaxhar
Posts: 30100 | From: Adrift on a sea of surreality | Registered: Apr 2003
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Foaming Draught
The Low in Low Church
# 9134
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Posted
Good-o, one of 'em's just been shot at Stockwell station.
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Australians all let us ring Joyce
For she is young and free
Posts: 8661 | From: Et in Australia Ego | Registered: Feb 2005
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Boreal
Shipmate
# 9550
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Posted
Do we know it was one of them? BBC's just saying that "a man was shot".
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I think that God, in creating Man, somewhat overestimated His abilities. - Oscar Wilde
Posts: 376 | From: Deepest, eastest Maine. | Registered: May 2005
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Cedd
Shipmate
# 8436
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Posted
Man shot in Stockwell is a suspected suicide bomber. Other breaking news on the BBC Website is that a mosque in East London is being surrounded by armed police.
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Cedd
Churchmanship: This week I am mostly an evangelical, catholic, orthodox with both liberal and illiberal tendancies. Terms and conditions apply.
Posts: 377 | From: England | Registered: Sep 2004
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Rat
Ship's Rat
# 3373
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Posted
According to what I just heard, there are rumours that the mosque is surrounded because of a suspected bomb inside. So it isn't yet clear who is possibly attacking who in that case. Time will tell, I suppose.
The shooting sounds extraordinary, it appears to have occured in front of a train full of people after a chase - not the sort of thing that the police normally do if they can help it. But yes, reports so far seem to indicate this was a suspected bomber.
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It's a matter of food and available blood. If motherhood is sacred, put your money where your mouth is. Only then can you expect the coming down to the wrecked & shimmering earth of that miracle you sing about. [Margaret Atwood]
Posts: 5285 | From: A dour region for dour folk | Registered: Oct 2002
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Cedd
Shipmate
# 8436
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Posted
Incident at mosque now "all clear" - false bomb alert by all accounts.
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Cedd
Churchmanship: This week I am mostly an evangelical, catholic, orthodox with both liberal and illiberal tendancies. Terms and conditions apply.
Posts: 377 | From: England | Registered: Sep 2004
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ken
Ship's Roundhead
# 2460
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Posted
And now rumours about some shooting near Tottenham Court Road a short while ago.
Literal rumours I mean - I overheard someone telling someone else that she'd overheard someone...
But apart from that things seem pretty normal. The buses are running their normal routes round here, which they weren't last week.
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Ken
L’amor che move il sole e l’altre stelle.
Posts: 39579 | From: London | Registered: Mar 2002
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Ariel
Shipmate
# 58
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Marvin the Martian:
quote:
Originally posted by Ariel:
What worries me though is that the perpetrators seem to have escaped unharmed i.e. are still at large and free to do it again.
Yeah, WTF's up with that? I'd have thought that as soon as the commuters realised they were still alive they'd have taken their chance to 'apprehend'* the slime.
Well, I think they tried. I don't know what I'd do in that situation though - to be honest, I don't know if I'd try to tackle someone who might possibly have a jacket or belt stuffed with explosives.
quote:
Originally posted by Jack the Lass:
The BBC site is still just saying someone was shot. But the link above suggests they may have been a suspected bomber, possibly from yesterday.
On the other hand, there was that man who got arrested at Downing St yesterday and made to lie face down and half stripped. It turned out he was nothing to do with it.
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