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Source: (consider it)
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Thread: The Enforcement of Celibacy
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fletcher christian
Mutinous Seadog
# 13919
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Posted
Not quite sure where this should go, but purg seems the best place, and sorry to disappoint, but this isn't a thread that deals with the rights, wrongs and wherefores of celibacy in the Roman Catholic priesthood.
I have to be honest and say I haven't read enough to form a popular opinion just yet, but I have noticed what you might call 'anomalies' that seem to exist right up into the 1100's (in fact, anomalies isn't quite the right word as in some places the anomalies seem pretty widespread). I seem to be getting the impression - rightly or wrongly - that celibacy for those in orders (priestly or otherwise) doesn't seem to have been the 'norm' in Europe for religious from around 300 - 1100AD and that it doesn't in fact become normative until the Augustinian's populate the religious sites and communities with growing power and numbers. Was this part of the role of the Augustinian Order to bring discipline and standardization of practice, or was it a bi-product of their success?
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'God is love insaturable, love impossible to describe'
Staretz Silouan
Posts: 5235 | From: a prefecture | Registered: Jul 2008
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fletcher christian
Mutinous Seadog
# 13919
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Posted
Oops, the word popular should read 'proper'.
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'God is love insaturable, love impossible to describe'
Staretz Silouan
Posts: 5235 | From: a prefecture | Registered: Jul 2008
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Komensky
Shipmate
# 8675
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Posted
Put it this way, the eleventh-century Abbot of the Sázava Monastery in Bohemia, St Procopius, was succeeded by his son.
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"The English are not very spiritual people, so they invented cricket to give them some idea of eternity." - George Bernard Shaw
Posts: 1784 | From: UK | Registered: Oct 2004
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IngoB
Sentire cum Ecclesia
# 8700
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by fletcher christian:
I seem to be getting the impression - rightly or wrongly - that celibacy for those in orders (priestly or otherwise) doesn't seem to have been the 'norm' in Europe for religious from around 300 - 1100AD and that it doesn't in fact become normative until the Augustinian's populate the religious sites and communities with growing power and numbers. Was this part of the role of the Augustinian Order to bring discipline and standardization of practice, or was it a bi-product of their success?
The Catholic Encyclopedia has a good discussion of the history, see in particular the part "Second Period" and "In England". While clerical celibacy "won" decisively in the West only with the 1st Lateran Council of 1123, according to this article that was not a novelty but rather the final result of a development across many centuries. And at least in that write-up the Augustinians do not seem to feature very prominently.
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They’ll have me whipp’d for speaking true; thou’lt have me whipp’d for lying; and sometimes I am whipp’d for holding my peace. - The Fool in King Lear
Posts: 12010 | From: Gone fishing | Registered: Oct 2004
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fletcher christian
Mutinous Seadog
# 13919
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Posted
Thanks Ingo, that was very helpful.
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'God is love insaturable, love impossible to describe'
Staretz Silouan
Posts: 5235 | From: a prefecture | Registered: Jul 2008
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