Thread: Heaven: What did you think of REV? Board: Limbo / Ship of Fools.


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Posted by rugbyplayingpriest (# 9809) on :
 
I watched REV last night. Whilst more realistic than the pithy vicar of Dibley it was not really that funny IMO. I also was sad that the church seemed such a bleak and unhappy place.... and where was any sense of calling and dovotion in him?

But I did like a few of the characters and there were lots of truisms in there

[ 27. December 2014, 21:46: Message edited by: Spike ]
 
Posted by Benny Diction 2 (# 14159) on :
 
I thought it was very good. And perhaps it says about some of the churches I encounter that the church portrayed in the show seemed real. As did the portrayal of the vicar and his wife.

I found it laugh out loud funny most of the way through and very true.

"SPOILER ALERT"

I particularly liked the pit where he took off his dog collar to shout at builders who'd been giving him stick.

As a Methodist I can't say how accurate the portrayal of the Archdeacon was as we don't have those.

I loved it
 
Posted by wilson (# 37) on :
 
I enjoyed it. It felt real. I have no idea how real it was because my experience of CofE churches is very limited.

The humour was a bit predictable in places but the characters were strong and likeable (or love-to-hateable in the case of the Arch-Deacon).

What I liked most about it was that these felt like real flawed human beings. The fact that the congregation were something of a collection of oddballs without being caricatures or grotesques felt true to my non-Anglican experience of church in general - I've certainly met my fair share of Colins and Nigels.

And I did feel there was a sense of vocation about the vicar - it just wasn't overplayed. I enjoyed the scene where he prays and we hear it in voice-over.

Not laugh out loud funny but gently amusing and quite heart-warming in a way. I'd watch again.
 
Posted by Chorister (# 473) on :
 
I was sorry to miss it, as I'd read it has had really good reviews. Hopefully it will be on BBCi.
 
Posted by Thurible (# 3206) on :
 
I agree, Wilson. I had expected to hate it, expecting it to take the piss out of the Church and be a bit cringey (cf The Vicar of Dibley). As it was, though, the people felt real and the humour was gently amusing, especially to those of us who have met the same characters IRL (all churches have them, don't they?).

Thurible
 
Posted by kingsfold (# 1726) on :
 
Chorister, it is indeed on iPlayer, here .
 
Posted by Angloid (# 159) on :
 
I started another thread on this because I didn't see this one. This is what I said:
quote:
Any reactions? The Guardian thought it was the Vicar of Dibley-lite. There are many similarities, the setting and the gender of the Vicar notwithstanding. I thought it was an entertaining half-hour's viewing but there were few laughs (wry chuckles maybe). Hopefully as the series gets into its stride it will develop more character. Perhaps we church professionals are always going to be on the look-out for liturgical and other faux-pas, or insider-humour, that we're not the best judges of how it comes across to others.

I hope the Archdeacon continues to pop up in future episodes: his world-weary cynicism was spot on.

I like Colin too!
 
Posted by Angloid (# 159) on :
 
PS: Ecclesiantical tangent: considering his predecessor left 'for Rome' (according to the Archdeacon), the style of the church seemed very boringly MOTR. But there were no obvious solecisms that I noticed.
 
Posted by Earwig (# 12057) on :
 
I enjoyed it more than I thought I would. I agree the laughs were low in the first episode, but I'm quite heartened by that - we need time to get to know the characters. I'd rather have laughs from the characters coming up against situations rather than cheap gags - the bottle through the window was a bit rubbish.

And I LOVED the Archdeacon. [Big Grin]
 
Posted by Thurible (# 3206) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Angloid:
PS: Ecclesiantical tangent: considering his predecessor left 'for Rome' (according to the Archdeacon), the style of the church seemed very boringly MOTR. But there were no obvious solecisms that I noticed.

Indeed. Cassock-alb and stole; two candles on the altar (with dust cloth, IIRC).

Is the church St James, Bermondsey? If so, it's quite a coincidene that I'd only read their new MW report a couple of days ago.

Thurible
 
Posted by Curious (# 93) on :
 
quote:
Is the church St James, Bermondsey? If so, it's quite a coincidene that I'd only read their new MW report a couple of days ago.

Thurible

I think the exterior is St Leonard's Shoreditch .

I also enjoyed it - but I wonder if anyone who isn't acquainted with the C of E will stick with it long enough to understand the nuances?

Curious

[Code fix]

[ 29. June 2010, 19:27: Message edited by: jedijudy ]
 
Posted by Oxonian Ecclesiastic (# 12722) on :
 
If his predecessor went to Rome and he wears a cassock-alb and stole to celebrate (even at a holy table with a dust sheet on it!), who on earth introduced the very evangelical 'Hymns for Today's Church' (in which 'All creatures of our God and king' is indeed no. 13)?

But in general I thought it was surprisingly convincing, and I enjoyed the not inaccurate caricatures.
 
Posted by Oxonian Ecclesiastic (# 12722) on :
 
Also: what do we make of Nigel?
 
Posted by Thurible (# 3206) on :
 
The closeted, educated, bookish type who is higher than he'd like his church to be ("Hello, Father!" "Please call me Adam!") and has become a Reader [after being turned down by his BAP*] despite having the pastoral skills of a gnat?

We've never met anyone like that...

Thurible

* just my little theory
 
Posted by Baptist Trainfan (# 15128) on :
 
I found it gently humorous, but felt there was something badly wrong with the pacing.

That might improve as it gets into its stride ... or if they commission a second series?

[ 29. June 2010, 14:06: Message edited by: Baptist Trainfan ]
 
Posted by Spike (# 36) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Oxonian Ecclesiastic:
Also: what do we make of Nigel?

At first I didn't like the way he was portrayed as a Reader, but then I realise I've met far too many Readers like him!

Overall, I really enjoyed it but I'm trying to figure out why the Archdeacon seems to spend his time riding around in a black cab.
 
Posted by Angloid (# 159) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Thurible:


Is the church St James, Bermondsey? If so, it's quite a coincidene that I'd only read their new MW report a couple of days ago.

Thurible

Not the interior, if indeed the same church is used for both. No east window. And the Archdeacon would have had difficulty getting his black cab to go sarf of the river.

[ 29. June 2010, 14:51: Message edited by: Angloid ]
 
Posted by Spike (# 36) on :
 
It is St Leonard's, Shoreditch according to a newspaper report I read about the series.
 
Posted by rugbyplayingpriest (# 9809) on :
 
Yes but I found it very sad. There was NO sense of church as dynamic, exciting, happy, meaningful. It made it seem as if church was a dead place where people only go when forced to by silly school rules.

THank GOd my own church is a much more vibrant, lively, God filled and happy place!
 
Posted by Benny Diction 2 (# 14159) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Curious:
quote:
Originally posted by Thurible:
Is the church St James, Bermondsey? If so, it's quite a coincidene that I'd only read their new MW report a couple of days ago.

Thurible

I think the exterior is St Leonard's Shoreditch .

I also enjoyed it - but I wonder if anyone who isn't acquainted with the C of E will stick with it long enough to understand the nuances?

Curious

This Methodist will - though having trained with Anglicans maybe it does help to understand some of the machinations.

But as I said above, I think many ministers of whatever denomination will understand the situations e.g. the wife who is a professional in her own right but there's an expectation of the her being "the vicars wife"; the grotty vicarage / manse near the church; the over friendly geriatric parishioner.

[Fixed messed up quoted messed up code... [Roll Eyes] ]

[ 29. June 2010, 19:32: Message edited by: jedijudy ]
 
Posted by Loveheart (# 12249) on :
 
I thought it was hysterical, it reminded me of so many people (even the Reader [Hot and Hormonal] ). Was surprised at the language as there'd been no hint of that in the clips of it I'd seen.
 
Posted by Emma Louise (# 3571) on :
 
I found it very funny. Some of the characters were just so very recognisable and the vicar was just so vicar-ey...

Fab - can't wait til next week!
 
Posted by Angloid (# 159) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Benny Diction 2:
quote:
Originally posted by Curious:
quote:
Originally posted by Thurible:
Is the church St James, Bermondsey? If so, it's quite a coincidene that I'd only read their new MW report a couple of days ago.

Thurible

I think the exterior is St Leonard's Shoreditch .

I also enjoyed it - but I wonder if anyone who isn't acquainted with the C of E will stick with it long enough to understand the nuances?

Curious

This Methodist will - though having trained with Anglicans maybe it does help to understand some of the machinations.

But as I said above, I think many ministers of whatever denomination will understand the situations e.g. the wife who is a professional in her own right but there's an expectation of the her being "the vicars wife"; the grotty vicarage / manse near the church; the over friendly geriatric parishioner.

[Edited to say] Sorry, Benny Diction! I meant to select your penultimate phrase above, not pass off your words as mine. I've seen far too many vicarages like that [Disappointed] - though I've never had to live in one. The last 'proper' vicarage I had was far more elegant, but of course freezing cold.

[Fixed spaghetti mess of nested quotes. Sheesh.]

[ 29. June 2010, 19:40: Message edited by: jedijudy ]
 
Posted by Protozoan (# 15583) on :
 
I’m obviously missing something……. I found it depressing and at times rather cringe worthy. I would hate for people to think that church is such a dead enervating place. I suppose I shall have to give it a chance, but I hope that there will be a bit more going on in church than just singing badly on a Sunday.
[Confused]
 
Posted by Angloid (# 159) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Thurible:
has become a Reader [after being turned down by his BAP*] despite having the pastoral skills of a gnat?

[Killing me] I've met bishops with even less.
 
Posted by leo (# 1458) on :
 
Readers are primarily preachers and teachers.

Some take on pastoral work but it isn't in the job description.
 
Posted by Chorister (# 473) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by kingsfold:
Chorister, it is indeed on iPlayer, here .

Hooray! Just a pity I'll have to wait until the weekend....
 
Posted by Panda (# 2951) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Protozoan:
I’m obviously missing something……. I found it depressing and at times rather cringe worthy. I would hate for people to think that church is such a dead enervating place. I suppose I shall have to give it a chance, but I hope that there will be a bit more going on in church than just singing badly on a Sunday.
[Confused]

I know what you mean, but we are told that he'd only been there a month, after the previous vicar poped. It's not surprising it wouldn't look too lively, and from a story-line point of view, it gives us somewhere to go. Hopefully (this being the first episode) we get to see the fruits of his labours!

I loved his wife's line: 'Everyone was very impressed you can still do the splits' - and her delivery was brilliant.
 
Posted by Laurence (# 9135) on :
 
I was pleasantly intrigued, and there were a good few laugh-out-loud moments- although I did wonder how many people not in the Club would get jokes about not mentioning Mary and incense.

One thing that I rather liked was the matter-of-fact way the eponymous Rev said "Let's say Morning Prayer"- I never got the sense of day-to-day prayer life in the Vicar of Dibley. Day-to-day chocolate life, perhaps... [Biased]
 
Posted by Protozoan (# 15583) on :
 
That’s an encouraging thought Panda…
Perhaps that’s like a church I visited recently, the new Rev had only been in place for three months and the subject of his sermon was largely about coping with change. Chatting to people at tea/coffee (as y’ do), I asked whether his predecessor was a hard act to follow – I just got a v brief “no” and a little tight-lipped look – so didn’t push further. So – yes – I can see how a dull as dish-water beginning could at least give them somewhere to go. It could be more to do with my own hang-ups that the idea of subsequent ill judged attempts to liven up the place (with, perhaps the odd little success here and there) fills me with dread.
Do we know anything about the writers? Do they have any church *insider* experience? Or any known religious beliefs?
 
Posted by Miss Madrigal (# 15528) on :
 
I found a lot more resonance with my experience as an Anglican than I ever did with the Vicar of Dibley, I certainly got got more of a feeling that the central character had both a vocation and prayer life. I had quite a few smiles of recognition and I'm sure I'm not the only one convinced that they know the Archdeacon who that character was based on ...

I am hopeful that it develops from where it started.
 
Posted by QLib (# 43) on :
 
Ten times better than Dibley in all sorts of ways, and at least twice as funny, even though it might be seen as a bit of a slow starter. Pity that the line about doing the splits had been broadcast about 23 time already in the trailer - why does the BBC do that?
 
Posted by FooloftheShip (# 15579) on :
 
It's very hard to find a place for readers in the catholic tradition of the church, as preaching and teaching tend to be seen as central "priest's work". That was our experience anyway, and there is still blood in certain corners of the church to prove it.

There is very little feeling of a post-poping church to me, at least. Far too MOR.

otherwise, it's quite interesting.
 
Posted by Spike (# 36) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by FooloftheShip:
It's very hard to find a place for readers in the catholic tradition of the church, as preaching and teaching tend to be seen as central "priest's work".

Don't you believe it!

[ 29. June 2010, 22:33: Message edited by: Spike ]
 
Posted by Loveheart (# 12249) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Spike:
quote:
Originally posted by FooloftheShip:
It's very hard to find a place for readers in the catholic tradition of the church, as preaching and teaching tend to be seen as central "priest's work".

Don't you believe it!
Snap! [Yipee]
 
Posted by CJ (# 2166) on :
 
it was apparently researched in quite a lot of depth with the writers spending time following a couple of London priests around over a fairly long period.

I liked it, gentle and well observed, with promising signs of room to develop.
 
Posted by Sparrow (# 2458) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Protozoan:
I’m obviously missing something……. I found it depressing and at times rather cringe worthy. I would hate for people to think that church is such a dead enervating place. I suppose I shall have to give it a chance, but I hope that there will be a bit more going on in church than just singing badly on a Sunday.
[Confused]

I thought maybe that was because we saw very little of the day-to-day congregation - apart from the "cassock-chasing" lady. Hopefully they will address that in future episodes.
 
Posted by Snow Leopard (# 14991) on :
 
I think I must have been watching a different programme from practically everyone else! I caught up with episode 1 on i-Player, but never got to the end because I was just so bored.
 
Posted by +Chad (# 5645) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Spike:
I'm trying to figure out why the Archdeacon seems to spend his time riding around in a black cab.

Church Commissioners Expense Account!

The Archdeacon is magnificent. I can certainly think of one he reminds me of. I loved the purple scarf.

The "school whores" rang a few bells.

I have great sympathy with Colin's solution to the Dawkins delusion - "I'd kick him in the bollox".

And Adam's answer to the builders [Killing me]

But the Vicarage. Oh, the Vicarage. There must be hundreds like that up and down the country.

What a good programme.

I do hope we're going to see a Bishop at some point. Spotting the likeness there could be very interesting. [Biased]
 
Posted by Zappa (# 8433) on :
 
Alas; given that this series sounds a) reasonably intelligent / cultured / articulate, and b) british it is not likely to show on NZTV [Frown]
 
Posted by seasick (# 48) on :
 
I've just watched the first episode on iplayer and I did enjoy though think it probably needs to go up a notch if it's to remain amusing. I did like him pulling out his dog collar to rebuke the builders and I loved "Let's say morning prayer, but very quietly in case someone has a hangover". As +Chad says, the purple scarf on the Archdeacon is rather good. I'll be looking forward to the next episode.
 
Posted by Tyler Durden (# 2996) on :
 
I was disappointed. I loved Tom Hollander in 'In the Loop' and expected more from him. Perghaps it's all just too close to home (I'm a vicar) but for me it was almost like a drama with a few vaguely comic moments rather than an actual comedy (a bit like Chris Morris's recent film about islamist terrorists, Four Lions). Maybe it will get better...

Best bit in this for me was interplay between him and the wife (and the builders!) both of which I could identify with!!!
 
Posted by Zacchaeus (# 14454) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Tyler Durden:
..

Best bit in this for me was interplay between him and the wife (and the builders!) both of which I could identify with!!!

Most clergy I know have found something to identify with in the programme, so they must have got something right.

------------------------------------------------
 
Posted by seasick (# 48) on :
 
The Methodist Recorder's review today complains about the "sexually explicit and vulgar language" which I think is rather to miss the point.
 
Posted by tessaB (# 8533) on :
 
The scene with the builders certainly gave me a chuckle as our vicar always looks around to check no-one else is watching and then takes his dog collar off if he is going to swear. Whether he thinks God can't hear him if he isn't collared-up I'm not sure [Biased]
 
Posted by Panda (# 2951) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by seasick:
The Methodist Recorder's review today complains about the "sexually explicit and vulgar language" which I think is rather to miss the point.

Well, you didn't get that (much) in Dibley, you see, and it seems to have become something of a benchmark in clerical comedies, for good or ill.
 
Posted by Oscar the Grouch (# 1916) on :
 
It was a good(ish) beginning. Whether it will develop into something long lasting is another matter.

I really REALLY liked the archdeacon - (previously seen as the nerdy choirmaster at Dibley! Insider joke, perhaps?). I loved the fact that he drives around in black cabs and clearly hasn't got time for losers like the Rev Smallbone.

The bit with the builders was spot on and I cheered him on as he took off his dog collar and let rip. VERY true to life.

I think that there is more to come from his wife, but I'm a little worried about the weird guy and the orgasmic woman in the congregation. They seem a little too obvious at the moment. Alexander Armstrong is good but can play smarmy MPs in his sleep.

I'll be watching the next episode!
 
Posted by Schroedinger's cat (# 64) on :
 
I thought it was absolutely fantastic. It reflected some of the real problems of run-down urban ministry. And seeing the funny side of it. The response to the builders was priceless, and I have known clergy who might have said the same.

The window thing I liked. The various responses reflected the range of responses that you get - from the concern about the destruction of a priceless work of art, to the problems of how pay for the repairs, to an desire to find the people responsible and bring them to book. Not to mention the revelation as to what had actually happened at the end.

The discussion with the Archdeacon on attendance numbers was priceless. And I think the sense of calling/mission was there - the search through the episode for purpose and direction, and the final decision he made to not sell his morals just to get the money for the window. I thought that was awesome.

So I will be watching again.
 
Posted by Chorister (# 473) on :
 
Well he certainly was an Arch Demon.

I'll be interested to see how the series develops - it could either become terribly hackneyed or else get rather interesting. If it could be set slightly into the future, so that when the bishop turns up she is a woman, that would be rather fun. And of course the gay issue will have to be in there somewhere.

And call me naive, but I wasn't expecting the ending with the bottle!
 
Posted by follower (# 15597) on :
 
It was interesting, not laugh out loud funny though and afew too many annoying characters. I hope Nigel gets more air time, enjoyed the swearing at builers and the comment about the shag.
 
Posted by Keren-Happuch (# 9818) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Oscar the Grouch:
Alexander Armstrong is good but can play smarmy MPs in his sleep.

And they're always called Patrick. Maybe that should be on the baby names thread!

Definitely interested to see how this turns out. [Smile]
 
Posted by Carys (# 78) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by seasick:
The Methodist Recorder's review today complains about the "sexually explicit and vulgar language" which I think is rather to miss the point.

Indeed. On the whole, the sexually explicit and vulgar language came from the people around the vicar, much of it trying to shock him. That seems pretty realistic to me.

Carys
 
Posted by kentishmaid (# 4767) on :
 
I caught it on i-Player the other night and was quite impressed. With regard to the comments that the congregation didn't match the supposedly Anglo-Catholic previous incumbent, I didn't find that too much of a jar. After all, it's not THAT uncommon for the ecclesiology of the priest and congregation not to match. At any rate, I've certainly met it before.
 
Posted by Sparrow (# 2458) on :
 
One thing I thought was spot on was the complete and utter contempt shown to the vicar and by implication the church, from all the non-Christian characters in the show.

[Roll Eyes]
 
Posted by Jemima the 9th (# 15106) on :
 
I really liked it, although it had been billed as a "Thick of It for the church" or similar, and it wasn't that funny. I thought the evil Archdeacon was brilliant. The only bit I wasn't keen on was the Dawkins discussion at the end: it felt a bit shoe-horned in.

Otherwise, I'm really looking forward to the next episode. [Big Grin]
 
Posted by Angloid (# 159) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Sparrow:
One thing I thought was spot on was the complete and utter contempt shown to the vicar and by implication the church, from all the non-Christian characters in the show.

[Roll Eyes]

Depends what you mean by non-Christian, and what their motives were. The builders were clearly only 'avin a larf', and the slimy MP had his own agenda. But if the series is in any way realistic I would expect to see many members of the local community warming to the vicar and the church while remaining 'outside the fold'. If you want real contempt, I would wait for the first PCC meeting.

[ 02. July 2010, 17:19: Message edited by: Angloid ]
 
Posted by Andromeda (# 11304) on :
 
I was a little disappointed at first to find it so slow, however it did have a certain appeal. I found the vicar a quite positive character, which is refreshing on TV these days. The best thing though was the hot-headed Colin's Richard Dawkins line delivered in such a no-nonsense northern acceent:

If I met Richard Dawkins - I'd kick him the bollocks

That made me laugh out loud! I will be watching the series with interest. More of a comedy drama than a sit-com though.
 
Posted by Tyler Durden (# 2996) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by tessaB:
our vicar always looks around to check no-one else is watching and then takes his dog collar off if he is going to swear.

Tessa, do I know you?! [Biased]
 
Posted by Zappa (# 8433) on :
 
I am reminded of the occasion in 1990 when I was on my way to an induction, on my motorbike. A motorist pulled blindly out of a driveway and skittled me. As I strode towards her removing helmet, gloves and scarf, and temporarily forgetting the garb I was wearing, I snarled "what the fucking hell do you think you're doing ..." . Her eyes grew bigger and bigger, fixed on my dog collar.

I later sat through the induction with a growing wrist. [Frown]

[ 03. July 2010, 08:14: Message edited by: Zappa ]
 
Posted by leo (# 1458) on :
 
Could have been worse had she been the area dean.
 
Posted by Andromeda (# 11304) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Sparrow:
One thing I thought was spot on was the complete and utter contempt shown to the vicar and by implication the church, from all the non-Christian characters in the show.

[Roll Eyes]

I actually thought that the builders were quite over the top and unrealistic. That was one but that didn't really ring true for me.
 
Posted by Ricardus (# 8757) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Andromeda:
quote:
Originally posted by Sparrow:
One thing I thought was spot on was the complete and utter contempt shown to the vicar and by implication the church, from all the non-Christian characters in the show.

[Roll Eyes]

I actually thought that the builders were quite over the top and unrealistic. That was one but that didn't really ring true for me.
According to the producer it's based on a true story.

Mind you, when I watched it I thought the archdeacon came across as OTT, so I'm slightly scared by the number of clergy who find him true to life ... [Ultra confused]
 
Posted by Loveheart (# 12249) on :
 
My sainted mother phoned me up to say how offended she was, thats guaranteed to keep me watching [Killing me]


Here's a clip from this week's show, if anyone is interested....
 
Posted by Chorister (# 473) on :
 
Welcome to St. Ikea's.
 
Posted by Angloid (# 159) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Ricardus:

Mind you, when I watched it I thought the archdeacon came across as OTT, so I'm slightly scared by the number of clergy who find him true to life ... [Ultra confused]

We have cuddly Archdeacons in Liverpool, Ricardus! But this one is quite believable.
 
Posted by Robert Armin (# 182) on :
 
I'm alarmed to hear how many people thought the Archdeacon was true to life. Having finally watched the episode I thought he was a wild caricature, but maybe I've been lucky. Most of the programme didn't ring true to me, but I liked the bit where he prayed, and then did the right thing. (But why couldn't both weddings have been on the same day? In years gone by I've done five weddings on a single Saturday - not a lot of fun.)
 
Posted by Angloid (# 159) on :
 
I'm looking forward to tomorrow's episode in which apparently Adam responds to the Archdeacon's demand for more bums on pews, by linking up with a neighbouring (HTB?) evangelical cleric.
 
Posted by +Chad (# 5645) on :
 
And Alex's opinion of him is exactly the same as mine! [Big Grin]
 
Posted by Sparrow (# 2458) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Robert Armin:
(But why couldn't both weddings have been on the same day? In years gone by I've done five weddings on a single Saturday - not a lot of fun.)

If it's a typical inner London parish, the first bride would be at least an hour and a half late, which would make scheduling a second wedding a bit risky!

[Biased]
 
Posted by Alex Cockell (# 7487) on :
 
what's the likelihood that that bridegroom will miss that high note in Angels?
 
Posted by kankucho (# 14318) on :
 
I'm loving it. And I'm sure my experiences here on the Ship have primed me for a lot of the nuances — not least of which is the credibility of a vicar taking his collar off and telling someone to fuck off.

Rev is developing nicely into one of the best, most intelligent comedies the BBC has put out in years.
 
Posted by Roseofsharon (# 9657) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by kankucho:
my experiences here on the Ship have primed me for a lot of the nuances — not least of which is the credibility of a vicar taking his collar off and telling someone to fuck off.

Once upon a time that scene would have shocked me, but not after five years on The Ship. [Biased]

It seems more true to life than the po-faced buck-toothed TV portrayal of clergy that has had me wincing with embarrassment for years.
 
Posted by Jemima the 9th (# 15106) on :
 
Just watched the clip and laughed very very much, especially at the PA comment. Laughter from recognition, largely...
 
Posted by Gracious rebel (# 3523) on :
 
I'm surprised that noone else has mentioned what was REALLY shocking about this vicar's behaviour....(whisper) he was smoking! [Eek!] [Biased] [Big Grin]
 
Posted by Alex Cockell (# 7487) on :
 
RRev is on in the next couple of minutes if you fancied it... couple of us are int he cafe...
 
Posted by Amos (# 44) on :
 
I'm watching this through my fingers IYKWIM.
 
Posted by Auntie Doris (# 9433) on :
 
I'm still giggling at the 'what a knob-end' comment!

Auntie Doris x
 
Posted by Panda (# 2951) on :
 
I think he's going to regret using Darren as a kinky nickname...
 
Posted by Amos (# 44) on :
 
Sorry to graft in the 'names' thread, but the pseudo-HTB vicar wasn't really a 'Darren' was he? he was really a Jago or a Toby or possibly a Nicky.
 
Posted by parm (# 9287) on :
 
That was close to the mark in so very, very many ways. Someone's clearly done their research. I spent the whole programme on the line between laughter and deep, heartfelt sorrow. I mean, clearly there were some soft targets there and the charicature of charismatic/evo churches was painted with fairly broad strokes, but as someone who's been there... ouch. Really, really ouch.
 
Posted by yellowroom (# 11690) on :
 
I think the Archdeacon is turning into the star of the show. Lovely little scene when he backs Adam up at the end.
 
Posted by Alex Cockell (# 7487) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Amos:
Sorry to graft in the 'names' thread, but the pseudo-HTB vicar wasn't really a 'Darren' was he? he was really a Jago or a Toby or possibly a Nicky.

Yeah - seems to borrow mannerisms from Nicky G...
but I hope that some hTB dynamics aren't so sinister as the "Be my friend" line...
 
Posted by Angloid (# 159) on :
 
Brilliant!!! And brilliant casting to make Darren twice the size of Adam. The clothes and the grin were just right. And his dismissal of Adam's quoting of scripture because it didn't suit his purpose.
 
Posted by tessaB (# 8533) on :
 
Great episode. Loved the way the vicar stood up for Colin. I thought that for someone in a comedy programme (and it was funny) to really show Christ's love in that way was so refreshing. The vicar is a very sympathetic character who obviously has a real and deep faith and that is unusual I think in comedy shows.(The vicar of Dibley just didn't seem to have the same level of faith and reliance on God.)
 
Posted by +Chad (# 5645) on :
 
The Archdeacon has a soul after all - and very good taste in young men. [Smile] And ambition - purple scarf and a pectoral cross.

I can't comment on HTB, but they gave Darren traits I've seen in some 'ministers' of that ilk - bragging about their vibrant, lively, God-filled, happy places, and the money they generate. "Awesome". [Biased]

I have to say that the Darren ego-trip reminded me of the ill-fated Nine O'Clock Service.
 
Posted by wilson (# 37) on :
 
Enjoyed it again though the Evos were very caricatured. But that's probably just my background/baggage showing through. I had to keep telling myself that that's how it must look from the outside.

But my bigger problem with the episode was the portrayal of the vicar being so timid and reserved sexually. I know he talked about being tired and that it was the job that got in the way rather than his lack of desire, but there was something in the performance that still felt too close to the sexless vicar cliche.
 
Posted by Alex Cockell (# 7487) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by wilson:
Enjoyed it again though the Evos were very caricatured. But that's probably just my background/baggage showing through. I had to keep telling myself that that's how it must look from the outside.

But my bigger problem with the episode was the portrayal of the vicar being so timid and reserved sexually. I know he talked about being tired and that it was the job that got in the way rather than his lack of desire, but there was something in the performance that still felt too close to the sexless vicar cliche.

Just maybe that his mental model didn't cover as wide a range as his wife? It is known...
 
Posted by Bob Two-Owls (# 9680) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by +Chad:
I have to say that the Darren ego-trip reminded me of the ill-fated Nine O'Clock Service.

Yes, it reminded me all to deeply of that poisonous little episode. I punched the air with tears in my eyes when the Archdeacon stood up to Darren at the end.

I think that Rev is more "The Office" to the Vicar of Dibley's "Last of the Summer Wine".
 
Posted by Uriel (# 2248) on :
 
Really looking forward to more of the Archdeacon over the rest of the series. I loved it when he backed Adam up over Colin. Very much enjoying this series, I hope it gains a wide following.
 
Posted by Benny Diction 2 (# 14159) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by tessaB:
Great episode. Loved the way the vicar stood up for Colin. I thought that for someone in a comedy programme (and it was funny) to really show Christ's love in that way was so refreshing. The vicar is a very sympathetic character who obviously has a real and deep faith and that is unusual I think in comedy shows.(The vicar of Dibley just didn't seem to have the same level of faith and reliance on God.)

I totally agree.

There is so much about this series that strikes a chord with me in ministry. Yes of cause some of it is exaggerated for laughs but there is so much truth in it.

I just have a sneaking feeling it might only last the one series which will be a pity.
 
Posted by Benny Diction 2 (# 14159) on :
 
Sorry for the double post.

I was saying to my wife last night that I was sure the actor playing the Archdeacon was the same chap who played the organist / choir master in the Vicar of Dibley. And I was right! Simon McBurney
 
Posted by Angloid (# 159) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Benny Diction 2:


I just have a sneaking feeling it might only last the one series which will be a pity.

Never mind. The DVDs will be in every vicar's (and minister's) Christmas stocking and will be watched many times.
 
Posted by Bob Two-Owls (# 9680) on :
 
Viewing figures of over 2 million for the first episode according to Wikipedia. For a BBC2 late-night comedy that is very respectable and if it doesn't drop off we might see a second series yet.
 
Posted by Deckhand (# 15545) on :
 
Like most who have posted, I regard 'Rev' as the treat of the week. I just wish the programme was a little longer, say 45 minutes, as this would allow exploration of the many points to be a little more leisurely and less one-liner sitcom style.
 
Posted by Panda (# 2951) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Amos:
Sorry to graft in the 'names' thread, but the pseudo-HTB vicar wasn't really a 'Darren' was he? he was really a Jago or a Toby or possibly a Nicky.

I think HTB would have sued for libel if they'd made him Nicky.

Also scary - 'we do take all major credit cards!' right at the beginning of the service...
 
Posted by Oxonian Ecclesiastic (# 12722) on :
 
Thurible:

quote:
The closeted, educated, bookish type who is higher than he'd like his church to be ("Hello, Father!" "Please call me Adam!") and has become a Reader [after being turned down by his BAP*] despite having the pastoral skills of a gnat?
Following last night's episode, not so closeted, it would seem! They've (thankfully?) done themselves out of a storyline there.
 
Posted by QLib (# 43) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Bob Two-Owls:
I think that Rev is more "The Office" to the Vicar of Dibley's "Last of the Summer Wine".

Yes, agree absolutely with the Dibley = Summer Wine comparison, though I'm hoping Rev will be more like "Green Wing" or "Scrubs" than "The Office", which I admire enormously, but somehow don't really like.
 
Posted by Amos (# 44) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Panda:
quote:
Originally posted by Amos:
Sorry to graft in the 'names' thread, but the pseudo-HTB vicar wasn't really a 'Darren' was he? he was really a Jago or a Toby or possibly a Nicky.

I think HTB would have sued for libel if they'd made him Nicky.

Also scary - 'we do take all major credit cards!' right at the beginning of the service...

HTB'd have sued for libel if they'd made Darren a Toby or a Jago too--how do you think I came to pick those particular monikers? But you really do have to do the Public School Evo ethos to be accurate in your satire, so Darren isn't quite right. Xander? Rupert? James even?
 
Posted by Sober Preacher's Kid (# 12699) on :
 
*sigh*

I dare the CBC to do something like this.
 
Posted by RadicalWhig (# 13190) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Sober Preacher's Kid:
*sigh*

I dare the CBC to do something like this.

Does BBC iPlayer work in Canada? If so you can watch it online.
 
Posted by Sober Preacher's Kid (# 12699) on :
 
The BBC restricts non-UK IP addresses from using iPlayer as we, the great unwashed, do not pay TV Licence fees or UK taxes, for that matter.
 
Posted by RadicalWhig (# 13190) on :
 
Ouch. When it comes out on DVD I'll buy you one and send it to you.
 
Posted by The Weeder (# 11321) on :
 
I was mildly hopeful after the first episode, but very disapointed after the second one. It seemed much more Dibley like and far fetched. And silly.
BUT the Arcdeacon is the star of the production. So I might give it another try,
 
Posted by Sober Preacher's Kid (# 12699) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by RadicalWhig:
Ouch. When it comes out on DVD I'll buy you one and send it to you.

Thanks. [Smile]

I used to follow The Magistrate's Blog, a sitting, anonymous JP who blogs. I think he's somewhere in Berkshire. Every so often he has to deal with "Private Prosecutions", particularly people who don't pay their TV licences. So he gets to spend a whole morning dealing with a parade of single mothers, penniless people with no other means of distraction, jobless people who have hit rock bottom, you name the sob story, it's there. All over non-payment of a TV tax.

I really don't begrudge the BBC lockout policy after reading that. I'd pay the fee myself as a subscription if the BBC allowed such a thing, but it doesn't, so I'm locked out.

I really don't want to spoof the system for the same reason.
 
Posted by Alex Cockell (# 7487) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by The Weeder:
I was mildly hopeful after the first episode, but very disapointed after the second one. It seemed much more Dibley like and far fetched. And silly.
BUT the Arcdeacon is the star of the production. So I might give it another try,

Oh - you'd be surprised. Yes, the evos were broad-brush, but the rapper definitely went into Crappy Choruses territory... "come see the size of my love", indeed...
 
Posted by Hawk (# 14289) on :
 
After seeing this thread I sat down and watched the first episode last night. I was so impressed I watched the second one striaght away. I'm not Anglican but I was chuckling all the way through. The characters are very well-written and I love the style of the show - not depressing like if it had been put on by Channel 4, or silly sit-com like BBC3. It's the perfect balance of real-life problems and hopeful, understated, very British optimism.

It's certainly not the Vicar of Dibley, which, though had more laughs, was almost unrecognisably Christian at times since Dawn French hardly mentioned God or faith and seemed to spend most of her time stuffing her face with chocolate and chasing men. Also, it's far from 'The Office', being much more positive and the characters more sympathetic than cringeingly awful.

I don't agree with wilson's post about the sexless vicar cliche. I'm amazed he was watching the same show as me. Adam's reaction to 'Vivien' was miles away from that idea.

The evos were broad brush and seemed to be a very concentrated form of the species, with their worst excesses all pushed into one service. But it was true to life. If this show continues I hope it will illuminate a lot of religious issues for non-religious people. I can just imagine teachers showing these episodes to their GCSE RE classes as part of the lesson, just like VoD was shown to me when I was doing it.

One question - what's 'HTB'?

[ 07. July 2010, 08:32: Message edited by: Hawk ]
 
Posted by Amos (# 44) on :
 
HTB: http://www.htb.org.uk/focus
 
Posted by Robert Armin (# 182) on :
 
I quite liked the first epsiode, but loved the second! Colin, for me, is the star of the show. His talk early on about wanting sex was both honest and hilarious - and that was even before he saved the day. ("She's a virgin. Well, a born again virgin." Wonderful.) The Archdeacon's moment of decency was good too, but I hope he doesn't get totally reformed. There's a lot of mileage in him as The-man-you-love-to-hate-the-most.
 
Posted by wilson (# 37) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Hawk:
I don't agree with wilson's post about the sexless vicar cliche. I'm amazed he was watching the same show as me. Adam's reaction to 'Vivien' was miles away from that idea.

I did acknowledge that it was an impression I got despite some of the things they showed to the contrary. I've been thinking about it some more and it's not that he shows no sex drive, nor that his wife seems to have a more adventurous streak (which I think is what AlexC was referring to with references to "mental model"s) it's the fact that he's reactive, almost passive and a bit timid when it comes to his sexuality. And there's nothing wrong with that per se it's just it seems to be of a type (the "sexless" vicar) with what we've seen plenty of times before.

It's a minor niggle.
 
Posted by Angloid (# 159) on :
 
Well, it's difficult being reckless and uninhibited when you've got a window-cleaner spying on you at all hours. Adam's lack of sex-drive, if indeed it is such, is an occupational hazard!

I agree that the evo takeover was caricatured, and it wouldn't happen just like that (I hope!). But the characterisation was pretty accurate, and some of the lines - 'I've written off this dying church and I'll take my money elsewhere' - or his patronising approach to the 'vicar's wife' - were spot on.
 
Posted by Earwig (# 12057) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Robert Armin:
The Archdeacon's moment of decency was good too, but I hope he doesn't get totally reformed. There's a lot of mileage in him as The-man-you-love-to-hate-the-most.

Indeed - but I noticed his words were on the lines of "We can't be seen to ban people from church". Note - be seen. It's the words of a man who would happily stop someone coming by subtler means, but knows that banning someone outright is a pr failure.

I love that character! [Big Grin]
 
Posted by Lola (# 627) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Earwig:
quote:
Originally posted by Robert Armin:
The Archdeacon's moment of decency was good too, but I hope he doesn't get totally reformed. There's a lot of mileage in him as The-man-you-love-to-hate-the-most.

Indeed - but I noticed his words were on the lines of "We can't be seen to ban people from church". Note - be seen. It's the words of a man who would happily stop someone coming by subtler means, but knows that banning someone outright is a pr failure.

I love that character! [Big Grin]

I thought it was a beautifully played moment - I thought the Arch Deacon was so delicious because it seemed he was enjoying the fact that by doing the right thing he would potentially get one over on the Area Dean too!
 
Posted by Lola (# 627) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by The Weeder:
I was mildly hopeful after the first episode, but very disapointed after the second one. It seemed much more Dibley like and far fetched. And silly.
BUT the Arcdeacon is the star of the production. So I might give it another try,

Dibley always used to end with Geraldine and Alice having coffee in the vestry after evensong, Geraldine telling Alice rude jokes that she didn't understand.

I am wondering if Rev will end its episodes with Adam and Colin smoking on the park bench in the church yard, talking about faith. The best part is that so far both of them get to say things that are pretty profound (Dawkins doesn't understand the concept of forgiveness, yeah but don't you still want to kick him in the balls, eh?....God's love is more profound than sex, sure but sometimes that just doesn't do it)
 
Posted by RadicalWhig (# 13190) on :
 
For those of us who aren't Church of England, could someone please briefly explain (without getting all purgatorial) how important an Arch Deacon is? Is he Adam's "boss"?

I mean, does Adam go along with all that pointless driving around in taxis because he has to - i.e. saying no and standing up to the Arch Deacon would get him spent to the headmaster's office, or does he go along with it because he is displaying a certain timidity of character?
 
Posted by Ricardus (# 8757) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Earwig:
quote:
Originally posted by Robert Armin:
The Archdeacon's moment of decency was good too, but I hope he doesn't get totally reformed. There's a lot of mileage in him as The-man-you-love-to-hate-the-most.

Indeed - but I noticed his words were on the lines of "We can't be seen to ban people from church". Note - be seen. It's the words of a man who would happily stop someone coming by subtler means, but knows that banning someone outright is a pr failure.
I thought it was wonderfully ambiguous - did he say that because he only cares about PR, or because he knows that's all Darren is interested in?
 
Posted by Boopy (# 4738) on :
 
I am loving the series and suggest that the Archdeacon is a direct descendant of Archdeacon Grantley in the 1981 TV version of Barchester Towers (who played him - was it Nigel Hawthorne?). Anyway, the Archdeacon in Rev seemed to have modelled many of the same mannerisms and basic character traits.
 
Posted by Bob Two-Owls (# 9680) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by RadicalWhig:
For those of us who aren't Church of England, could someone please briefly explain (without getting all purgatorial) how important an Arch Deacon is? Is he Adam's "boss"?

From my experience, Archdeacons are "middle management", the ones that deal with day to day practical problems, so in a sense it is like being sent to see the headmaster which is one step down from being interviewed by the police.

I loved the Archdeacon standing up to Darren, I saw it as a rather coldly calculated ploy - he can push Adam around and make him do exactly as he wants but Darren might outgrow his authority and he couldn't have that at all. Better to make a stand that would be eminently defensible to the upper echelons on moral grounds while being highly advantageous to keeping a firm hand on the tiller, so to speak. The Archdeacon is one of the best characters I have seen in ages, I just want him to use CJ's* "one, two, three, four, make'em wait outside the door..."

*CJ - the boss in Reggie Perrin
 
Posted by Angloid (# 159) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Boopy:
I am loving the series and suggest that the Archdeacon is a direct descendant of Archdeacon Grantley in the 1981 TV version of Barchester Towers (who played him - was it Nigel Hawthorne?). Anyway, the Archdeacon in Rev seemed to have modelled many of the same mannerisms and basic character traits.

He certainly has many of the traits of Sir Humphrey in Yes Minister. Nigel Hawthorne would have been superb (but this guy is pretty good).
 
Posted by Hawk (# 14289) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Amos:
HTB: http://www.htb.org.uk/focus

Thanks. I assume this church has a reputation for being like the St James' bunch. Are they that bad in RL or is it just a bit of satire?
 
Posted by Ricardus (# 8757) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Panda:
Also scary - 'we do take all major credit cards!' right at the beginning of the service...

I've definitely encountered that (though not in an Anglican service, and certainly not in connection with HTB). The speech included "overwhelm us with your giving ... Don't worry if you've come out without your chequebook or the Lord prompts you to give more than you have on you, we've got direct debit forms available".

[ 07. July 2010, 14:34: Message edited by: Ricardus ]
 
Posted by Oscar the Grouch (# 1916) on :
 
The second episode was very much a good development of the first. Great laughs and yet pretty believable.

The archdeacon is still the star, though:

"Play nicely, children"
 
Posted by dorothea (# 4398) on :
 
I'm enjoying it. And laughed out loud several times with this Monday's episode. The way the trendy evos shoehorned the white settees and the horrible big screens into the tradition church building was a hoot. (I so hate those screens!) The change of tack from the Arch Deacon was very faith enhancing.

The second episode showed some variation in form from the first but the scenes in the Arch Deacon's taxi (I'm assuming it's a taxi), with poor Rev being thrown out wherever the AD finds convenient, is a good running gag.

A wee gem in the BBC schedules.

J

(Edited for general incompetence.)

[ 07. July 2010, 19:14: Message edited by: dorothea ]
 
Posted by Lord Pontivillian (# 14308) on :
 
I have just watched both episodes on iPlayer. I am looking forward to the next episode.

The St. James crowd resembles my nightmares!

I'd like to think that HTB is not that bad, although I have heard of "churches" that are [Eek!]

[ 07. July 2010, 19:55: Message edited by: Lord Pontivillian ]
 
Posted by ecumaniac (# 376) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by The Weeder:
BUT the Arcdeacon is the star of the production. So I might give it another try,

When he snaps on his leather gloves, mmmmmm! He can come collect my parish share any day.
 
Posted by Jante (# 9163) on :
 
Am wondering if we will get to see it again as training material when we get to vicar factory!
Jante
 
Posted by Alex Cockell (# 7487) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Jante:
Am wondering if we will get to see it again as training material when we get to vicar factory!
Jante

DVD goes on sale on 25 October...
 
Posted by Gracious rebel (# 3523) on :
 
I just discovered (by accident when channel surfing) that it is repeated tonight BBC2, probably 10pm (I caught a bit of it about 10.20) - this was Monday's episode.
 
Posted by Spike (# 36) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Bob Two-Owls:
quote:
Originally posted by RadicalWhig:
For those of us who aren't Church of England, could someone please briefly explain (without getting all purgatorial) how important an Arch Deacon is? Is he Adam's "boss"?

From my experience, Archdeacons are "middle management", the ones that deal with day to day practical problems, so in a sense it is like being sent to see the headmaster which is one step down from being interviewed by the police.

From the Church English Dictionary:

Archdeacon (n) The crook at the head of the bishop's staff.
 
Posted by Saviour Tortoise (# 4660) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by RadicalWhig:
For those of us who aren't Church of England, could someone please briefly explain (without getting all purgatorial) how important an Arch Deacon is? Is he Adam's "boss"?

I mean, does Adam go along with all that pointless driving around in taxis because he has to - i.e. saying no and standing up to the Arch Deacon would get him spent to the headmaster's office, or does he go along with it because he is displaying a certain timidity of character?

In the CofE (to put it crudely) Archdeacon = Bishop's Enforcer. Usually 2 or 3 per diocese with defined geographical areas. Bishop sets policy, Archdeacon has to make it happen. They have to deal with the nitty-gritty of making the church work. Money, staffing, etc. In my experience they are the most managerial of clergy. This is not, in my book, a bad thing.

And I agree with everyone who says the the AD in Rev is the star character. (Although I'm enjoying the whole thing.)
 
Posted by Hawk (# 14289) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Ricardus:
quote:
Originally posted by Panda:
Also scary - 'we do take all major credit cards!' right at the beginning of the service...

I've definitely encountered that (though not in an Anglican service, and certainly not in connection with HTB). The speech included "overwhelm us with your giving ... Don't worry if you've come out without your chequebook or the Lord prompts you to give more than you have on you, we've got direct debit forms available".
I see that kind of attitude as one of the signs of a 'temple-merchant' attitude and one that I would run a mile from. When a church has direct debit forms on the seats or hands them out alarm bells should ring in the heads of all right-thinking Christians. I walked out of an evangelical Church my brother took me to in Wolverhampton when they started promoting and trying to sell their 'products' as one of the main points of the service (meaning the church's books and DVDs on a prominent table by the door). It is one of the things that really makes me angry when a so-called church uses the name of Jesus just to make money.
 
Posted by Sparrow (# 2458) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Hawk:
I see that kind of attitude as one of the signs of a 'temple-merchant' attitude and one that I would run a mile from. When a church has direct debit forms on the seats or hands them out alarm bells should ring in the heads of all right-thinking Christians. I walked out of an evangelical Church my brother took me to in Wolverhampton when they started promoting and trying to sell their 'products' as one of the main points of the service (meaning the church's books and DVDs on a prominent table by the door). It is one of the things that really makes me angry when a so-called church uses the name of Jesus just to make money.

I always remember reading some time ago, something to the effect that: "look at the lifestyle of the vicar. If he drives a bigger car, or lives in a more luxurious style than the poorest of his congregation, then run a mile"
 
Posted by Chapelhead (# 21) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by RadicalWhig:
For those of us who aren't Church of England, could someone please briefly explain (without getting all purgatorial) how important an Arch Deacon is? Is he Adam's "boss"?

I mean, does Adam go along with all that pointless driving around in taxis because he has to - i.e. saying no and standing up to the Arch Deacon would get him spent to the headmaster's office, or does he go along with it because he is displaying a certain timidity of character?

I wonder what suitable comparisons might be. Cardinal Ratzinger to Pope JPII, perhaps, or Norman Tebbitt (as depicted by Spitting Image) to Margaret Thatcher?
 
Posted by Emma Louise (# 3571) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Sparrow:
I always remember reading some time ago, something to the effect that: "look at the lifestyle of the vicar. If he drives a bigger car, or lives in a more luxurious style than the poorest of his congregation, then run a mile"

Hmmmm. Isn't that all vicars almost by definition? They get vicarages which mean that they are living better than all the people in their congregation in flats? If they have a car (which I'd hope most vicars could have if needed) then they're better off than all those without cars etc etc. Certainly our vicar has an amazing house and garden, supports lots of kids and lives in a way I could never expect to live in!
 
Posted by Angloid (# 159) on :
 
Unless every parish priest is expected to live in conditions like a shanty-town dweller in Kolkata or Rio de Janeiro, that is an impossible expectation. Even then, if s/he has a 'house' of whatever sort it will be better than the Big Issue sellers get.

The kitchen fittings in the 'Rev.''s house are typical of the crappiest, cheapest-available-20-years-ago, equipment installed by diocesan parsonages boards up and down the country. In poor inner-city parishes that, and the size of the house, might still put the vicar in a 'superior' category. But in average, and affluent, parishes, s/he will inevitably be a laughing-stock or an object of pity.

Either clergy pay and conditions vary according to the relative prosperity of their parish, or they are given enough money and a moderate living standard to allow them to do their job wherever they are. The fact that Adam might have a 'nicer' (pause for hollow laugh) house than the majority of his parishioners (what about the Tory MP?) is balanced by the fact that he has virtually no privacy and is on call 24/7.

Sorry for the purgatorial diversion!
 
Posted by Think² (# 1984) on :
 
Enjoyed very much in our household, mostly made sense to me because of all the time I spend reading Eccles ...
 
Posted by Jay-Emm (# 11411) on :
 
Delayed watching the episode from the blurb and comments here. [General vibes of shows up anyone whos ever done alpha, or whatever]

Not as bad as I expected, though still took a day to consider portrayal. It seemed a bit unfair, the equivalent of having the previous +Durham in every scene declaring a disbelief in God (instead of saying one issue was sometimes a bit difficult to believe), did anyone else notice the nearly direct Spring Harvest Reference?

But at the same time (especially after reflection) could see where all the elements might have come from, if you squeezed years and regions into a single 1.2 hour [/day/week]. Now I know how churchschool parents feel (despite not being a minister or solely evangelical)

[Would be interesting as a special to see the camera follow someone else (anyone would make good TV really), I expect it will jump the shark fairly soon, but while it lasts...it's ok]

[ 08. July 2010, 19:36: Message edited by: Jay-Emm ]
 
Posted by Andromeda (# 11304) on :
 
Loved the latest episode. It was a much faster pace than the first and made me laugh all too knowingly. I did think the evangelicals were portrayed a bit too villainously and that did spoil it a little. Otherwise - it was great.
I actually think it's quite amazing to see such a positive portrayal of people of faith.
 
Posted by kankucho (# 14318) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Angloid:
I agree that the evo takeover was caricatured, and it wouldn't happen just like that (I hope!). But the characterisation was pretty accurate, and some of the lines - 'I've written off this dying church and I'll take my money elsewhere' - or his patronising approach to the 'vicar's wife' - were spot on.

"Be my friend, Adam ... Be God's friend" [with arms raised and outstretched crucifixion-stylee]

Oh, yes! BINGO! [Big Grin] [Big Grin] [Big Grin]

I guess the point has been made about 'Darren', and the plot will move on to other targets. But I hope we haven't seen the last of this nemesis to Adam. The actor Darren Boyd is becoming almost as ubiquitous-in-a-good-way as Olivia Colman, so he was bound to show up alongside her sooner or later. When someone gets around to making 'The Life of Monty Python', he should be a shoo-in to play John Cleese.
 
Posted by RadicalWhig (# 13190) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by kankucho:
Olivia Colman

[Axe murder]

(Am I the only one who finds her absolutely jaw-droppingly attractive, not just in Rev, but in most roles she has played?)
 
Posted by kankucho (# 14318) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Spike:
It is St Leonard's, Shoreditch according to a newspaper report I read about the series.

Quite correct. [Smile]

The familiarity was bugging me until I found this. I've passed by there many times.

[ 09. July 2010, 13:29: Message edited by: kankucho ]
 
Posted by Thurible (# 3206) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by RadicalWhig:
quote:
Originally posted by kankucho:
Olivia Colman

[Axe murder]

(Am I the only one who finds her absolutely jaw-droppingly attractive, not just in Rev, but in most roles she has played?)

It's certainly not universal, it must be said.

Thurible
 
Posted by Qoheleth. (# 9265) on :
 
And while we're with the HTB references, Nicky G's wife is called ummm....
quote:
We may well prosecute.... Pip is a vital part of our congregation

 
Posted by Alex Cockell (# 7487) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Qoheleth.:
And while we're with the HTB references, Nicky G's wife is called ummm....
quote:
We may well prosecute.... Pip is a vital part of our congregation

No shit! [Killing me] [Killing me]
 
Posted by +Chad (# 5645) on :
 
What a coincidence! [Biased]
 
Posted by Zappa (# 8433) on :
 
*Drool*

I so hope it's shown here, but I don't like my chances, TVNZ basically buys crap US sitcoms, and the only UKTV that gets to air is third rate. Anything religious - or Christian, will be a cynical exposé of alleged moral or fiscal bankruptcy or, ebbing tide of faith, or at a push, the later series of Dibley.
 
Posted by Schroedinger's cat (# 64) on :
 
Another cracker. I love the way they are slightly emphasizing features of the characters, not wildly overdoing them ( as so often in Dibley ), but just gently, and so very true-to-life.

Adam is a very honest and realistic urban vicar. Mrs Vicar is a very realistic working vicars wife, and trying to live both parts of the life. And the engagement with the very difficult issue of clerical sex I thought was really well addressed - and I am sure that there are clergy couples who are "interrupted" by parish needs.

The Archdeacon is a very political character, which is accurate, as they are often political people ( I don't mean this in a negative way - his role is to manage the politics between the hierarchy and the clergy ).

Darren was a stereotype of all sorts of wild clergy. Everything in what he did was something that such clergy have done - the sofas, the screens, the money grabbing attitude. He did remind me of Nicky Gumbel in his smarmy smile, but that is not HTB, who do have a lively style of worship but not including a rapper. I thought the whole portrayal was excellent of those churches and clergy who feel that money and success is the measure of divine acceptance - and NOS probably epitomised this in the worst way ( although I never went ).

And the gentle way of exploring faith in difficult and challenging circumstances is awesome. It was introduced as a drama, which was interesting, but that probably covers it better than comedy or sitcom, even though it is humourous.
 
Posted by ToujoursDan (# 10578) on :
 
Even though I am in North America I have watching it [cough] as the episodes are posted on the internet [cough] and will definitely buy it if it comes out on DVD and send it to a few friends.

It's so much like my parish it's scary. From the abysmal attendance, to the financial woes, to the crazy parents trying to get their kids into our school. It could easily be set in New York. We have the same cast of characters.

Some of the story lines are a bit predictable but it doesn't take away from the humour. I hope it shows up on mainstream TV here.
 
Posted by Alex Cockell (# 7487) on :
 
On now..
 
Posted by ToujoursDan (# 10578) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Sober Preacher's Kid:
quote:
Originally posted by RadicalWhig:
Ouch. When it comes out on DVD I'll buy you one and send it to you.

Thanks. [Smile]
Keep in mind that a British DVD uses the PAL TV system and is in Region 2. Canada and the US use the NTSC TV system and are in Region 1. That DVD won't play on a regular Canadian DVD player.

You'd have to buy a "hacked" DVD player capable of converting PAL to NTSC, or try it on your computer. But most computer DVD drives are Region locked too nowadays.

They don't make it easy.
 
Posted by Alex Cockell (# 7487) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by ToujoursDan:
quote:
Originally posted by Sober Preacher's Kid:
quote:
Originally posted by RadicalWhig:
Ouch. When it comes out on DVD I'll buy you one and send it to you.

Thanks. [Smile]
Keep in mind that a British DVD uses the PAL TV system and is in Region 2. Canada and the US use the NTSC TV system and are in Region 1. That DVD won't play on a regular Canadian DVD player.

You'd have to buy a "hacked" DVD player capable of converting PAL to NTSC, or try it on your computer. But most computer DVD drives are Region locked too nowadays.

They don't make it easy.

Not quite. The disc is encoded as MPEG-2, the player handles format conversion. Just get a noname player and lock it to Region 2... job done.
 
Posted by ToujoursDan (# 10578) on :
 
Most players in North America don't do format conversion (PAL is 625 lines at 25 fps and NTSC is 525 lines at 30 fps). Playing a PAL DVD in North America merely gives you an error saying that they are unplayable. In other parts of the world it's different.

Here you'd have to buy a special "region free, code free" player, like this: Amazon: NEW JVC XVBP11 All Multi Region Code Free DVD BLU RAY Player. Plays all region DVD 0, 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6 PAL or NTSC and Zone A Blu Rays.

I have a collection of DVDs I have bought in the UK, New Zealand and Australia and had to some research before I was able to play them here.
 
Posted by ToujoursDan (# 10578) on :
 
quote:
In general, it is easier for consumers in PAL countries to view NTSC DVDs than vice versa. Almost all DVD players sold in PAL countries play both kinds of discs, and most modern PAL TVs can handle the converted signal. However, most NTSC players can't play PAL discs, and most NTSC TVs don't work with PAL video. Those in NTSC countries, such as in North America, generally require both a multi-standard player and television to view PAL discs, or a converter box. There are also differences in pixel aspect ratio (720x480 vs. 720x576), display frame rate (29.97 vs. 25), and surround audio options (Dolby Digital vs. MPEG audio). Again, NTSC discs (with Dolby Digital audio) play on over 95% of DVD systems worldwide, while PAL discs play on very few players outside of PAL countries.
Source: PAL/SECAM vs. NTSC

You guys have it much easier than we do.
 
Posted by Amos (# 44) on :
 
Little things please me. Like the way the Archdeacon pours his tea into the bucket for the leaks from the roof, and his coffee straight down the vicarage sink.
 
Posted by daisymay (# 1480) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Amos:
Little things please me. Like the way the Archdeacon pours his tea into the bucket for the leaks from the roof, and his coffee straight down the vicarage sink.

After he said, "Thank you"... [Big Grin]

And the REV telling the man not to wear a niquab!!!

And what about that teacher seeing a naked previous pupil?
 
Posted by +Chad (# 5645) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by ToujoursDan:
Most players in North America don't do format conversion (PAL is 625 lines at 25 fps and NTSC is 525 lines at 30 fps). Playing a PAL DVD in North America merely gives you an error saying that they are unplayable. In other parts of the world it's different.

Here you'd have to buy a special "region free, code free" player, like this: Amazon: NEW JVC XVBP11 All Multi Region Code Free DVD BLU RAY Player. Plays all region DVD 0, 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6 PAL or NTSC and Zone A Blu Rays.

I must have missed that episode.

Back to tonight's.

The Archdeacon knows a "men's day spa on Bond Street". [Biased]

I like him more and more.

And as for letting the Koran group use the church:

"Will they pay?"

"Yes."

"Fine. Good. Get as much off them as you can. In my experience muslims like men in cassocks. They can relate."
[Big Grin]

But, no cab tonight. Is he economising?
 
Posted by kentishmaid (# 4767) on :
 
I think this series is getting funnier by the episode. And I really like the way they get in serious points, too, like interfaith relations etc. It's fairly unusual for the media to portray Muslims as normal people (at least that's the impression I get), so I thought this was fabulous. Still loving Colin & the Archdeacon.
 
Posted by Son of a preacherman (# 4181) on :
 
On your knees... avoid the fees!
 
Posted by Yangtze (# 4965) on :
 
I couldn't help smiling because there is a real life strip club opposite the real life church (St Leonard's) which they used for Rev.
 
Posted by dorothea (# 4398) on :
 
The last two gags were visible a mile off but still very enjoyable.
 
Posted by Andromeda (# 11304) on :
 
Loved it yet again. I really hope this series is not just a one-off [Frown]
 
Posted by Schroedinger's cat (# 64) on :
 
There is a certain degree of predictability in some of the plot lines, but the real humour is not in the plots, it is in the way that Adam and others handle the plots.

And I think there are some real lessons about how we as Christians handle the issues that are raised - without ignoring them or just joking about them. Real depth.
 
Posted by Ricardus (# 8757) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Schroedinger's cat:
There is a certain degree of predictability in some of the plot lines.

I dunno ... In the second episode I predicted that someone would catch Adam chasing after an apparent prostitute, and in Monday's episode I thought he was being set up for a honeytrap at the strip club when the owner offered him free champagne. I didn't see the actual endings coming ...

[ 13. July 2010, 22:01: Message edited by: Ricardus ]
 
Posted by Uriel (# 2248) on :
 
One gag they missed, which I would have loved to see in episode 3, would have been cheesey Darren enjoying himself in the background of the stripclub. Not pointed out, no dialogue, but just there as the camera briefly panned across.
 
Posted by Caty M. (# 11996) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Ricardus:
quote:
Originally posted by Schroedinger's cat:
There is a certain degree of predictability in some of the plot lines.

I dunno ... In the second episode I predicted that someone would catch Adam chasing after an apparent prostitute, and in Monday's episode I thought he was being set up for a honeytrap at the strip club when the owner offered him free champagne. I didn't see the actual endings coming ...
I was also expecting both these things to happen. There's a definite predictability in some of the scenarios, but the resolutions are not always as obvious.

I'm quite enjoying the series.
 
Posted by dorothea (# 4398) on :
 
It's not too obvious in itself, just the couple of visual gags at the end of this week's episode. I think the approach to Christian faith is delightful and long overdue.

J
 
Posted by Hawk (# 14289) on :
 
I was a little bit disappointed with the latest episode. Adam was a playing the embarassed fumbling vicar schtick a little to closely IMO. I would like to see him develop more confidence as the series goes on. He's just so much the 'fish-out-of-water' at the moment that I suspect it may become somewhat wearing if his character doesn't develop in the next few weeks. Perhaps its just his character's reaction to the sexual storyline - he seemed more confident when standing up to Darren last week.

Also the episode didn't seem to be going anywhere. It just seemed to be half an hour of watching Adam squirm.
 
Posted by rugbyplayingpriest (# 9809) on :
 
My questions are these:

1) why does he dress like a tramp when his wife has a good wage?

2) why could they not have put at least forty in the pews...four just sells a REALLY dismall image of the church to society and is not accurate IMO

3) Why did they have to give us predictable political bious and not make it more interesting? ie..nasty evo, nice muslim, pro women and gays, yawn, yawn lefty yawn!

Overall it is watchable and it does touch on truths but overall the reality is downplayed and the sense of a dying and pointless institution comes accross
 
Posted by Yerevan (# 10383) on :
 
quote:
1) why does he dress like a tramp when his wife has a good wage?
If I listed all the men I knew who did that... [Razz]

quote:
2) why could they not have put at least forty in the pews...four just sells a REALLY dismall image of the church to society and is not accurate IMO

3) Why did they have to give us predictable political bious and not make it more interesting? ie..nasty evo, nice muslim, pro women and gays, yawn, yawn lefty yawn!

No sitcom about Christianity in the UK is going to stray far outside a particular comfort zone....the church concerned will never be too lively, Muslim characters will invariably be delightful and evo characters will always be annoying, because this is How Things Are and What Is Acceptable....and about half the time it actually is how things are, so I guess you can't complain too much. And it least it actually sounds funny.
 
Posted by Jemima the 9th (# 15106) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by rugbyplayingpriest:
My questions are these:

1) why does he dress like a tramp when his wife has a good wage?

2) why could they not have put at least forty in the pews...four just sells a REALLY dismall image of the church to society and is not accurate IMO

3) Why did they have to give us predictable political bious and not make it more interesting? ie..nasty evo, nice muslim, pro women and gays, yawn, yawn lefty yawn!

Overall it is watchable and it does touch on truths but overall the reality is downplayed and the sense of a dying and pointless institution comes accross

1. I thought he was just a bit scruffy. Bit like most 30 something men I know, including my husband. [Biased] Perhaps he doesn't want to be subsidised by her?

2. I agree 4 is a bit dismal, I think they're exaggerating for cominc effect. But I'm not at all fussed about the image it's presenting to the public at large - so far I think it's the truest depiction of the church I've seen, and I'm glad it's not trying to advertise or put across a good image of the church. It looks struggling to find its way and what it's supposed to be doing, not dying.

3. Bias, what bias? [Biased] Admittedly the nasty evos were painted with broad strokes, and I suspect I liked that episode in particular because it appealed to my own prejudices, and resonated all too painfully with my own experiences. But the prickliness and mutual incomprehension between the "2 sides" are pretty real in my experience, which I'm sure is more limited than most here.

There have only been 3 episodes so far, let's see what happens with the latter half of the series....
 
Posted by ToujoursDan (# 10578) on :
 
The scary thing is that there are a lot of U.S. megachurches that resemble the evos, complete with smoothie bars.

[ 14. July 2010, 12:58: Message edited by: ToujoursDan ]
 
Posted by wilson (# 37) on :
 
I am still enjoying it but I think the latest episode wasn't the best.

Also, did you notice that whilst last week he stood up to Evo Darren about too much certainty being a bad thing, this week he admired the moral certainty of the Muslims and tried to emulate it?
 
Posted by Baptist Trainfan (# 15128) on :
 
But haven't we all been inconsistent at times?

[ 14. July 2010, 13:37: Message edited by: Baptist Trainfan ]
 
Posted by Ricardus (# 8757) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by wilson:
Also, did you notice that whilst last week he stood up to Evo Darren about too much certainty being a bad thing, this week he admired the moral certainty of the Muslims and tried to emulate it?

Yes, but it made him look an idiot, which I think was the point.

i.e. The reason he squirmed so much when talking to the Muslim woman (Faiza?) was because he was desperate to be tolerant and not give offence. (And did anyone else think she was a bit self-righteous?) And he made a nit of himself over the strip-club because he wanted to be like the Muslims.

The Archdeacon (to my mind) was actually much more laid-back and sensible - he just wanted money from them, and correctly called out Adam for trying to play the hero. A truly complex character ...

ETA: in that sense, it wasn't all that "politically correct" - part of it was sending up Adam's PC attitudes.

[ 14. July 2010, 13:57: Message edited by: Ricardus ]
 
Posted by Angloid (# 159) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by rugbyplayingpriest:

2) why could they not have put at least forty in the pews...four just sells a REALLY dismall image of the church to society and is not accurate IMO

There were about forty when the 'on your knees, avoid the fees' parents turned up. Since then there have been few if any shots of the congregation at worship and though the impression is obviously given of a small and struggling congregation it's not exactly screaming at us 'look - only four!' And I do know churches with such tiny congregations. Perhaps Adam's predecessor took 100 or so over the Tiber with him. He's only new in the parish: give him a chance!

What the series does show is that vicars work hard for their living, and that the church is far from irrelevant in such an inner-city community.
 
Posted by The Great Gumby (# 10989) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by wilson:
I am still enjoying it but I think the latest episode wasn't the best.

Also, did you notice that whilst last week he stood up to Evo Darren about too much certainty being a bad thing, this week he admired the moral certainty of the Muslims and tried to emulate it?

I think you have to distinguish between Darren's theologically triumphalist certainty and the more secular moral certainty Smallbone was expressing about the club, and as Ricardus said, he was really just squirming around trying to look tolerant towards Muslims. He also has real, very public struggles (we all hear his prayers) to make sense of everything, arguing himself round in circles, so his internal conflicts aren't news. As I read the character, he probably feels happy enough saying that Darren's too certain (probably meaning too arrogant) because he knows that it isn't really like that, at least for him and probably most people he knows, but he doesn't have the same (realistic? jaded?) view of Islam.

I reckon he's got a sort of woolly sympathy for Muslims out of a sort of vague post-colonial guilt combined with oversensitive racism squeams, less knowledge of Islam, less direct experience of it, a fascination with the apparent quiet, firm simplicity of others' faith (the further away you are, the harder it is to see the legs paddling furiously under the water), and most importantly no painful memories of the practical difficulty of applying their principles to real life, which he has in spades for Christianity.

But even if he is inconsistent (I don't think that's the case, but it might not be a total surprise, given that much of the storyline is apparently taken from true stories from clergy of all stripes), I still find him the most "real" character I've seen on TV in many years. Maybe that's because he's allowed to be, whereas any other series would have had him snapped leaving the club looking rather tipsy, and spending the next half hour trying to explain away the local scandal rag's front page splash "Randy Ratarsed Rev"
 
Posted by Schroedinger's cat (# 64) on :
 
I didn't mean totally predictable - like Dibley became - just that the main stay of the drama and the comedy is not in the core plot. It is in the reactions and interactions with the plot. IMO.

And to me the classic line from this week was the woman who had a problem with pedophiles. As long as Adam could make a link to pedophiles, she was against it, whatever it was.

Brilliant and true.
 
Posted by wilson (# 37) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by The Great Gumby:
But even if he is inconsistent (I don't think that's the case, but it might not be a total surprise, given that much of the storyline is apparently taken from true stories from clergy of all stripes), I still find him the most "real" character I've seen on TV in many years.

I think it's this form of unthinking inconsistency that makes him real and I like that he's real. I just think it's interesting how this sort of thing happens. It's easier to forgive/overcome the hard teachings or rough edges of a less familiar faith than a version of our own. It also helps if feel like you've hit on an issue you can be more certain about.
 
Posted by Lord Pontivillian (# 14308) on :
 
I thought the Hearse being removed was the best part of episode 3. It was a nice opener. Compared to previous episodes this one wasn't as good, IMO.

The Archdeacon continues to be the star of the show.

[ 14. July 2010, 19:31: Message edited by: Lord Pontivillian ]
 
Posted by Lola (# 627) on :
 
I did think the hearse gag was good, but I thought the best part of the episode was Colin pleading with Adam to be allowed to carry on sleeping in the church because he had "such nice dreams". It wasn't played for laughs - just showing what feeling loved and accepted can do for someone on the margins of society.
 
Posted by kankucho (# 14318) on :
 
I had a moment of enlightenment during tonight's repeat of ep 3.

The Archdeacon is Simon McBurney -- who surely landed this gig on the strength of his portrayal of Foreign Office attache Stone in The Last King Of Scotland. The characters are so similar - constantly materialising from nowhere to offer sage advice in rather petulant manner. A couple of minor roles he had in The Vicar Of Dibley would be purely incidental.

[Edited out the cat's auxiliary typing]

[ 14. July 2010, 22:08: Message edited by: kankucho ]
 
Posted by kankucho (# 14318) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Benny Diction 2:
I was saying to my wife last night that I was sure the actor playing the Archdeacon was the same chap who played the organist / choir master in the Vicar of Dibley. And I was right! Simon McBurney

Just spotted this since making that last post. It wasn't intentionally a comment on Benny's point; but I rest my case all the same. [Smile]
 
Posted by The Weeder (# 11321) on :
 
Well, I watched again tonight, and will not bother again. Basically, it is not an entertaining programme. Not witty, not engaging, very obvious.
I am not a Vicar of Dibley fan, but it is at least amusing.
 
Posted by Gill H (# 68) on :
 
I am enjoying it, though I have a nagging feeling it could be so much better than it is. However, the fact that I found myself conducting an imaginary discussion with him about the 'more a show than a sacrament' remark shows that I do find him a credible character.

Just realised where I know Nigel from - he was Archie from Balamory!
 
Posted by Yerevan (# 10383) on :
 
quote:
The Archdeacon is Simon McBurney -- who surely landed this gig on the strength of his portrayal of Foreign Office attache Stone in The Last King Of Scotland. The characters are so similar - constantly materialising from nowhere to offer sage advice in rather petulant manner. A couple of minor roles he had in The Vicar Of Dibley would be purely incidental.

Though he is also becoming typecase as an Evil Priest (see 'The Golden Compass' and the new 'Robin Hood' movie).
 
Posted by Boopy (# 4738) on :
 
I find the Rev character extremely convincing. He's inconsistent and uncertain; which is how faith is for a lot of people - muddling through. I also like the way he holds Being and Doing in tension; the constant wavering between seeing the value of presence, and wondering if he should be getting on with being busy.

The bit I've liked best so far is his refusal to ban Colin 'because Colin matters only to God'. I love his acceptance of Colin, Nigel, Adoha etc even at the times when he finds them personally maddening. And, even when he doesn't agree with people, he tries to listen and attend. He doesn't always get it right but it's an orientation he seems to aim for. That orientation towards listening and careful attention seems to be a common thread in all the good clergy I've ever met. Adam comes across as quite 'formed' as a clergyperson to me. By which I mean not getting things right all the time, but reflective about what is going on and attentive to the inherent difficulties within the role. And he tries to see more than the surface of people and things.
 
Posted by Off Centre View (# 4254) on :
 
I like a lot of what this show is trying to do - a new Vicar in a very different parish trying to find his place and to understand his sense of vocation. However, a lot of it still feels very hit and miss.

The first episode had a lot of good things going for it and I particularly liked the way the Vicar dealt with the moral question at the centre of that episode. It felt genuinely like a Vicar at a new church trying to establish himself in a new, very different place and struggling with his role.

The second felt like it was setting up a bit of a straw man with Darren, who felt more like a parody than an actual person. Yes, the whole more "show than sacrament" line was good, but I thought it didn't really examine the evos in any real depth (I'm kind of waiting for their take on Charismatics like me with a "hands down for coffee gag" or something similar). Against that, it was easy for Smallbone to come across as more human and felt like lazy writing.

The third episode just plain didn't work and came across as very politically correct (I thought that the Muslim characters also came across as very two dimensional, though did I see Alex's friend drinking a glass of wine at the end?). Smallbone also looked like he was carrying the idiot ball in going to the strip club with the pretty headteacher - that just felt like it was forced by the plot rather than naturally in character. I did smile at the gag at the end when the bus moved out of the way.

All in all, despite it's faults I do think the series has potential. A lot of things do ring true, particularly the Vicar's internal prayer life and his relationship with his life (they do seem like a real couple). The other characters also have their strengths: the Archdeacon is the ensemble darkhorse; Nigel is well-meaning but socially awkward; while Colin comes across as both very flawed and human while genuinely searching for God (even if the plots seem to keep using him as a way to resolve some convoluted issues). However, it also does not feel like the church has its own character as of yet either.

Once the series has found its own voice it could be something special, but we might have to wait until the second series.
 
Posted by Chorister (# 473) on :
 
What I really enjoyed was when Adam came home to find his wife and the muslim woman laughing together in the kitchen. How appropriate that they should become close friends.
 
Posted by geroff (# 3882) on :
 
I recognised the Archdeacon as soon as he appeared. He is Fra Pavel of the Magisterium, he hasn't even changed his clothes.

As iPlayer doesn't work when your broadband speeds are similar to dial up [Mad] I have only seen a very juddery episode 1 and none of episode 2. But episode 3 was great when it was broadcast.
Thing is no TV yet in the new curatage....
 
Posted by ken (# 2460) on :
 
Managed to catch up with the last two episodes last night on the iplayer.

Two things I noticed that I don't think have been mentioned yet:

- the liturgy and vestments and general conduct of the church services are real. That's how real Anglicans really behave in church. I found myself almost automatically making the responses. I never got that from The Vicar of Dibley or the scenes set in church in other soap operas or dramas. (Even the great Cracker got church life wrong - as does The Archers, though its not so bad)

- the congregation look like real people in our congregation. I mean they are caricatures or comic parodies of course, but they are caricatures of the kind of people who actually go to church in London. Even Colin. We don't have a Colin in our congregation, but we have three or four people who could be combined in to him. Including the booze at the back of the church and threatening to beat people up for you.

Like others said its not uproariously funny - more light-hearted affectionate parody than either drama or slapstick. And the embarrassment factor is high. The "evangelicals" were pretty unrealistic, but it was obvious what kind of Christian they were getting at. I could hardly bear to look at the screen. Same goes for the lap-dancing club.

Maybe its not so much The Office transmogrified into the Church of England as The Royle Family. You recognise it and sometimes you wish you didn't.

The head-teacher got pretty decisively slapped down by her ex-pupil didn't she? "You said I'd never amount to anything?"

quote:

"O 'Melia, my dear, this does everything crown!
Who could have supposed I should meet you in Town?
And whence such fair garments, such prosperi-ty?"
"O didn't you know I'd been ruined?" said she.

"You left us in tatters, without shoes or socks,
Tired of digging potatoes, and spudding up docks;
And now you've gay bracelets and bright feathers three!"
"Yes: that's how we dress when we're ruined," said she.


 
Posted by Panda (# 2951) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Gill H:
... Just realised where I know Nigel from - he was Archie from Balamory!

Of course! He's very similar in character, I find.

Does Adam dress like a tramp? We've only seen him in a clerical shirt or cassock (39-button, mind!) so far. Some of my other half's clerical shirts are getting a bit faded - perhaps those ones need culling.
 
Posted by Tree Bee (# 4033) on :
 
I'm becoming fond of Adam.
When I see him all stubby and vulnerable in his cassock I get all maternal!
What a David he is against various recognisable modern Goliaths.
Any laughs are a bonus.
 
Posted by Thurible (# 3206) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Panda:
Some of my other half's clerical shirts are getting a bit faded - perhaps those ones need culling.

An ordained friend swears by washing them with black dye every so often.

Thurible
 
Posted by The Weeder (# 11321) on :
 
I have no problems with the lack of laughs. I just think it is pointless. Neither a Comedy or a Drama. And not particularly interesting.
I will not bothe watching again.
 
Posted by Angloid (# 159) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Panda:

Does Adam dress like a tramp?

It's that oversized jumble-sale overcoat that does it. But he needs to be a contrast with the Savile Row tastes of the Archdeacon.
 
Posted by Chorister (# 473) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by The Weeder:
I have no problems with the lack of laughs. I just think it is pointless. Neither a Comedy or a Drama. And not particularly interesting.
I will not bothe watching again.

Well it makes me think, 'What should a priest do in that situation?' and 'What would I do in that situation, if it were my church?' - both valuable questions, I think.

After watching this week's REV, I opened the church times and saw that a church in Oxford had been objecting to a lap dancing club opening near the church. So certainly a topical subject. Perhaps it all depends on context - the vicar of Soho would have a different answer to the question than the vicar of Budleigh Salterton.
 
Posted by The Weeder (# 11321) on :
 
Yes, Chorister, but is it entertaining? I think not. I will be suprised if it gets a second series.
 
Posted by Angloid (# 159) on :
 
I think you're in a minority there, Weeder. Chacun à son goût.
 
Posted by +Chad (# 5645) on :
 
Is 'one' a minority, or a singularity?
 
Posted by Earwig (# 12057) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by ken:
- the liturgy and vestments and general conduct of the church services are real. That's how real Anglicans really behave in church. I found myself almost automatically making the responses. I never got that from The Vicar of Dibley or the scenes set in church in other soap operas or dramas. (Even the great Cracker got church life wrong - as does The Archers, though its not so bad)

Yup, me too - I accidently joined in with Morning Prayer in one episode, earning very odd looks from my boyfriend. [Hot and Hormonal]
 
Posted by Saviour Tortoise (# 4660) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Earwig:
quote:
Originally posted by ken:
- the liturgy and vestments and general conduct of the church services are real. That's how real Anglicans really behave in church. I found myself almost automatically making the responses. I never got that from The Vicar of Dibley or the scenes set in church in other soap operas or dramas. (Even the great Cracker got church life wrong - as does The Archers, though its not so bad)

Yup, me too - I accidently joined in with Morning Prayer in one episode, earning very odd looks from my boyfriend. [Hot and Hormonal]
This was the first thing that really made me pay attention to the show.

The liturgy is smack on accurate. The issues are real issues. The people are real (carictatures, sure, but I recognise them.) Adam is a real vicar. This is a real church. It's so real I assumed the writers must have been CofE regulars. I was very suprised and impressed when I discovered they'd done this through proper research.
 
Posted by Sparrow (# 2458) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Saviour Tortoise:
quote:
Originally posted by Earwig:
quote:
Originally posted by ken:
- the liturgy and vestments and general conduct of the church services are real. That's how real Anglicans really behave in church. I found myself almost automatically making the responses. I never got that from The Vicar of Dibley or the scenes set in church in other soap operas or dramas. (Even the great Cracker got church life wrong - as does The Archers, though its not so bad)

Yup, me too - I accidently joined in with Morning Prayer in one episode, earning very odd looks from my boyfriend. [Hot and Hormonal]
This was the first thing that really made me pay attention to the show.

The liturgy is smack on accurate. The issues are real issues. The people are real (carictatures, sure, but I recognise them.) Adam is a real vicar. This is a real church. It's so real I assumed the writers must have been CofE regulars. I was very suprised and impressed when I discovered they'd done this through proper research.

Indeed they did - I know one of the advisers.
 
Posted by Chorister (# 473) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by The Weeder:
Yes, Chorister, but is it entertaining? I think not. I will be suprised if it gets a second series.

What is entertaining is the quirky little twist at the end of every plot. It was only after the image had disappeared that I realised the pole dancing club had relocated - as the owner said it would - away from the primary school, but was now smack bang opposite the church. Nothing was said - it was just a fleeting image accross the road as Adam left the church building. You keep watching because you're never quite sure what is going to happen next.

(And I'm speaking as someone who hardly ever watches TV, apart from University Challenge and Wimbledon. So it's got to be good to keep me interested.)
 
Posted by kankucho (# 14318) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Saviour Tortoise:
The liturgy is smack on accurate. The issues are real issues. The people are real (carictatures, sure, but I recognise them.) Adam is a real vicar. This is a real church. It's so real I assumed the writers must have been CofE regulars. I was very suprised and impressed when I discovered they'd done this through proper research.

Apparently, the realism of some of the secular details caused a bit of a stir among bystanders witnessing the opening scene of Ep 3...

Insert finger here for full story and pictures

[Big Grin]
 
Posted by RadicalWhig (# 13190) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by kankucho:
Insert finger here for full story and pictures

Ugh! [Projectile]
It was The Sun. I feel dirty and contaminated now.
 
Posted by Sandemaniac (# 12829) on :
 
And no-one moaned about the "poor departed" being carried out of chuch on the huh? Dear me - picture two made me wince.

Mind you, that might be through having an undertaker for a father. He nearly had a fit when the Queen Mother was carried in with one short pallbearer struggling to keep his corner up!

AG
 
Posted by Niminypiminy (# 15489) on :
 
I've just watched all three episodes on i-play (yep, a lot of work displacement activity going on here today). I enjoyed it a lot, and thought it was pretty well written and acted.

I started to think about Adam's backstory though. Has he spent his entire adult life in Suffolk? How does someone do that and then end up in Shoreditch? But then I thought, well, actually in a 30 minute sitcom you can't have too much of characters' history, they've just got to seem plausible in that situation.

But then I started to think about the fact that Adam and Alex don't have children, and I was suddenly struck by the similarities with the Tom and Barbara in the Good Life -- couples who aren't in the first flush of marriage who are still quite couple-y and where all the humour in the marriage centres around their romantic/sexual life.

It's true that it they had children it would turn into a family sitcom, and Rev is obviously not that. It's just that when you combine it with the lack of backstory for Adam and Alex the whole situation begins to seem a bit peculiar -- as does that of The Good Life when you pull it apart a bit.

Probably that's a reason not to analyse too much ... hope anyway it gets recommissioned so that it gets a chance to bed down and develop.
 
Posted by Angloid (# 159) on :
 
How about: Adam and Alex met at university (in London of course); he being a country lad who naturally gravitated back to his roots for his first curacy (and maybe a team vicarship in a rural team ministry). Alex meanwhile, a city girl intent on making her way in the legal profession, got fed up of working for Stephen Fry and landed a plum job in the City. The strains of commuting prompted Adam to write to his friend (!) Archdeacon Robert, and so the story continues...
 
Posted by Matt Black (# 2210) on :
 
Except that doesn't quite work, since Alex is a criminal defence lawyer, about as low a paid position as you can get in the legal profession (essentially, you are paid by the government). She could as easily have done this in, say, Ipswich.
 
Posted by Angloid (# 159) on :
 
I must have missed that. But you get a better class of criminal in the East End.
 
Posted by Jemima the 9th (# 15106) on :
 
This reviewer in the Guardian doesn't think much of it:
http://www.guardian.co.uk/culture/2010/jul/18/another-view-on-rev
I thought it was interesting that he said you don't get any sense of Adam's spiritual convictions; I thought they came over very well. Ho hum. Looking forward to tonight's episode. [Smile]
 
Posted by Spike (# 36) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Jemima the 9th:
This reviewer in the Guardian doesn't think much of it:
http://www.guardian.co.uk/culture/2010/jul/18/another-view-on-rev
I thought it was interesting that he said you don't get any sense of Adam's spiritual convictions; I thought they came over very well. Ho hum. Looking forward to tonight's episode. [Smile]

I can understand why the writer of that piece doesn't find it realistic. I don't know him personally, but I do know the church where he's Vicar as it's on my old stamping ground. Let's just say they don't exactly inhabit the same planet as the rest of us!
 
Posted by leo (# 1458) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Jemima the 9th:
This reviewer in the Guardian doesn't think much of it:
http://www.guardian.co.uk/culture/2010/jul/18/another-view-on-rev
I thought it was interesting that he said you don't get any sense of Adam's spiritual convictions; I thought they came over very well. Ho hum. Looking forward to tonight's episode. [Smile]

A bad review. he said: He even invites a Muslim prayer group to hold their meeting in the church. I'm in favour of interfaith dialogue, but that's just a step too far.

Actually, I know two evangelical ministers and one anglo-catholic priest who do just that.

Then: One African lady in the congregation, Adoha, is known as a "cassock-chaser" because she has a thing for priests. You do get people a bit like her in the church. People from Africa and the Caribbean are particularly deferential to their priests – but not to those extremes.

I know at least three women, in different churches that I belong to, who are much more extreme.
 
Posted by Jemima the 9th (# 15106) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Spike:
quote:
Originally posted by Jemima the 9th:
This reviewer in the Guardian doesn't think much of it:
http://www.guardian.co.uk/culture/2010/jul/18/another-view-on-rev
I thought it was interesting that he said you don't get any sense of Adam's spiritual convictions; I thought they came over very well. Ho hum. Looking forward to tonight's episode. [Smile]

I can understand why the writer of that piece doesn't find it realistic. I don't know him personally, but I do know the church where he's Vicar as it's on my old stamping ground. Let's just say they don't exactly inhabit the same planet as the rest of us!
Ah, that's interesting. Thank you!
 
Posted by daisymay (# 1480) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by leo:

A bad review. he said: He even invites a Muslim prayer group to hold their meeting in the church. I'm in favour of interfaith dialogue, but that's just a step too far.

Actually, I know two evangelical ministers and one anglo-catholic priest who do just that.


And I know a local CofE church who also have Muslims meeting in and using their church - Sufi Muslims. Some churches don't allow other religions to meet in their church, some do...
 
Posted by Angloid (# 159) on :
 
Well that was brilliant!
 
Posted by Amos (# 44) on :
 
Yes, though parts of it had me absolutely cringing. It was very, very good.
 
Posted by dj_ordinaire (# 4643) on :
 
That was the first episode I'd watched, and I'm very impressed!

Yes, it's gentle rather than laugh-out-loud funny, but so very very real! If I wandered into a random church in London, or many other cities, and found it exactly like that, then I wouldn't be at all surprised. Prestigious cappuccino machine and all!

Oh, and in answer to the article quoted above: I didn't get the impression any of tonight's characters were mere caricatures. If anything, I thought quite a few of them were rather toned down from the real-life equivalents one runs into from time to time. Or indeed the real-life equivalents that one actually is

... the 'Single Men's Supper' - 'We're not ALL gay!' [Killing me]
 
Posted by Jante (# 9163) on :
 
Have enjoyed this since the first episode but particularly enjoyed tonights. I feel the characters are devolping and are less charicatures now. Loved Mrs Rev's response to the addict coming for money again.
Jante

[ 19. July 2010, 22:01: Message edited by: Jante ]
 
Posted by +Chad (# 5645) on :
 
The best yet!

"I find congregations prefer cornflakes to muesli - theologically speaking."

"There are 10,000 vicars and only 350 top jobs.....so, the chances of promotion in the Church of England are about the same as in the Chinese army."

The Archdeacon gets better.

A Cuddesdon man?!

And Adam's response to the posing models on the vestment website:

"Oooh, look at her!"

Now, as for Roland. I can't begin to imagine who is the inspiration for that character! [Biased]
 
Posted by Spike (# 36) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by +Chad:


The Archdeacon gets better.

A Cuddesdon man?!

Of course he is. No doubt about that! What about Adam though? I don't think he's a Staggers Bag. Westcott maybe?
 
Posted by Amos (# 44) on :
 
Probably. I think he must have had a residential training. The daily office is ingrained!
 
Posted by +Chad (# 5645) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Spike:
quote:
Originally posted by +Chad:
The Archdeacon gets better.

A Cuddesdon man?!

Of course he is. No doubt about that!
Pre-merger.

quote:
What about Adam though? I don't think he's a Staggers Bag. Westcott maybe?
I thought Westcott. Probably AffCath too. [Big Grin]
 
Posted by Chapelhead (# 21) on :
 
Like many others I found it amusing rather than lough-out-loud funny, but very enjoyable and it's good to see a depiction of the church that has moved on from Derek Nimmo. And it has some nice touches, such as the 'More tea vicar?' mug at Adam's bedside and the nun salt and pepper shakers in the kitchen.
 
Posted by Tyler Durden (# 2996) on :
 
I thought last night's was by far and away the best so far. I also thought the piece in teh Guardian was appaling: it sounded like it had been written by a 12 year old and said nothing (or perhpas, like Adam, I'm just jealous that I haven't been asked to write a piece for the guardian...?)

PS I'd love to know who Roland Wise is supposed to be. Can anyone PM me?
 
Posted by dj_ordinaire (# 4643) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Amos:
Probably. I think he must have had a residential training. The daily office is ingrained!

I'd say Westcott for sure. This would also explain why a man from 'Snakebelly Suffolk' was wearing a 'jessie-bell'....

I loved all the little character touches too - for example, the fact that even when he was comforting Roland he was still only able to say 'You're .... quite funny'.

Admittedly, I did see the final gag coming a mile off, but hey!
 
Posted by +Chad (# 5645) on :
 
Yes, you just knew Roland was going to nick his line!
 
Posted by Moth (# 2589) on :
 
I love this series more and more as it goes on. Odd moments make me laugh, but at times it makes me cringe as I recognise the odd little habits we religious types have!

I thought the review in the Gauardian about par for the course for the Guardian. It has a real blind spot when it comes to religion.
 
Posted by Angloid (# 159) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Moth:


I thought the review in the Gauardian about par for the course for the Guardian. It has a real blind spot when it comes to religion.

Sometimes, yes. In this case, I think its more of a blind spot when it comes to the subtleties of the Anglican church, which is more forgiveable. I presume they just thought 'let's get another East End vicar to comment', despite the fact that he has clearly -to us - got a different perspective from another part of the candle as it were.
 
Posted by Loveheart (# 12249) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Tyler Durden:
I thought last night's was by far and away the best so far.

Same here! [Yipee]

I'm glad they got round to explaining why Adam didn't have a chasuble, although I'd have thought he'd have ordered a full set, rather than just the green. Perhaps as we're in ordinary time, the church is saving up for the rest of them???
 
Posted by Spike (# 36) on :
 
We only got to see the green, but he must have ordered a full set as we saw the Rastafariian bloke wearing a red stole over the green chazzie.
 
Posted by Miffy (# 1438) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by +Chad:
The best yet!

"I find congregations prefer cornflakes to muesli - theologically speaking."

"There are 10,000 vicars and only 350 top jobs.....so, the chances of promotion in the Church of England are about the same as in the Chinese army."

The Archdeacon gets better.

A Cuddesdon man?!

And Adam's response to the posing models on the vestment website:

"Oooh, look at her!"

Now, as for Roland. I can't begin to imagine who is the inspiration for that character! [Biased]

If it helps, a friend I was watching with picked up on Roland's 'courtly' goodnight to Alex; sooo reminded us of our old chaplain. [Axe murder] And he was definitely a Cuddeston man.

No, I'm not telling you who he was.
 
Posted by ken (# 2460) on :
 
For the first time it was really really good. I mean I almost cried at one point. The scenes between Adam and Roland (or whatever his name was) seemed very real. People really do behave like that.

Then when he suggested they go and say the Office - well it was the nearest I have ever seen on TV to a credible depiction (or even a justification) of liturgical approach to Christianity. I don't think anyone will ever persuade this Protestant to be an Anglo-Catholic but that was about as near as it gets...
 
Posted by +Chad (# 5645) on :
 
Roland isn't Cuddesdon. The style's all superficial.

He was at college with Adam - Westcott.

What of Darren Betts, our fresh expression of two episodes ago, do we think Wycliffe Hall or S John's, Nottingham?
 
Posted by ken (# 2460) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by +Chad:
What of Darren Betts, our fresh expression of two episodes ago, do we think Wycliffe Hall or S John's, Nottingham?

Trinity, Bristol. And he's older than he tries to look - he was there in the early 1980s.
 
Posted by Spike (# 36) on :
 
Could feasibly be Oak Hill then.
 
Posted by Roseofsharon (# 9657) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by +Chad:

What of Darren Betts, our fresh expression of two episodes ago...
...S John's, Nottingham?

Not in John Goldingay's time?
 
Posted by Boopy (# 4738) on :
 
Wonderful episode. As well as the Archdeacon's cornflakes/muesli line, and the usual opportunity to see him discard his coffee undrunk, I very much enjoyed the unstated unfolding of how Adam's sudden interest in getting on radio/TV meant that in this episode he constantly overlooked his usual 'small acts of kindness' that he so loved the idea of in the poem he quoted. (So, failing to go to the Singles Supper, closing the door on the man wanting to use the loo, not making time to talk to Colin at the door etc). The difference between what he said and what he did in this episode - and using that to show that he was going in the wrong direction for a time - was beautifully done, and all the more so for remaining unspoken.

Good to see Morning Prayer treated as a normal and unspectacular part of the daily routine too.

[ 20. July 2010, 15:20: Message edited by: Boopy ]
 
Posted by leo (# 1458) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Spike:
We only got to see the green, but he must have ordered a full set as we saw the Rastafariian bloke wearing a red stole over the green chazzie.

Could have been a reversible set to save money - red one side, green the other.
 
Posted by Miffy (# 1438) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by ken:
quote:
Originally posted by +Chad:
What of Darren Betts, our fresh expression of two episodes ago, do we think Wycliffe Hall or S John's, Nottingham?

Trinity, Bristol. And he's older than he tries to look - he was there in the early 1980s.
Please don't say any of these three are spawning montrosities like Darren IRL. [Eek!] I'm still recovering from that episode. Shudders.
 
Posted by +Chad (# 5645) on :
 
Well, he didn't train at Mirfield or Staggers. [Smile]

Actually, he could have come by the Church Army route.

Church Army evangelist and then trained for ordination on a local course! [Devil]

[ 20. July 2010, 17:12: Message edited by: +Chad ]
 
Posted by Angloid (# 159) on :
 
Assuming you mean Darren, surely not the Church Army. He's too posh for that (though his name lets him down a bit; maybe he got to public school on a scholarship. Or maybe he's antipodean and has toned down his accent.)
 
Posted by ken (# 2460) on :
 
Darren was never Oak Hill! Far too flaky. An Oak Hill man would have had an altar call!

And has the Archdeacon eaten or drunk *anything* yet?

Does he need normal human food?
 
Posted by RadicalWhig (# 13190) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by ken:
And has the Archdeacon eaten or drunk *anything* yet?

Does he need normal human food?

He must be a very peculiar man!
 
Posted by Chapelhead (# 21) on :
 
Darren refers to himself as a 'vicar'. Would an Oak Hill person have gone with 'minister'?
 
Posted by Schroedinger's cat (# 64) on :
 
The Archdeacon looking at the pub food and putting it aside was priceless, in the context of his other food dismissals. I am sure he eats, but only proper food.

the obviousness of Roland pinching his line was what I means about obviousness. But that didn't detract from the episode as a whole - it was just what you knew was liable to happen, but may not have.

I went away from it thinking it was not so good. But I continued thinking about it, and the plotlines became clearer, and I realised that it worked brilliantly. That is what I love about it. Adam struggling practically with pride and expectation. His realisation that Roland was as unhappy in his role as Adam was in his, and the reversal that his own pride in vestments etc. And getting his vestments eventually "because he looks good in them".

So excellent again. And I love the prayer that we hear, because it is so realistic to how I pray - not formal, not structured, but chatting and sharing.
 
Posted by Chapelhead (# 21) on :
 
According to the Radio Times, next week's episode sees Adam Pope-ing up and swinging the smoking handbag. Sound like fun.
 
Posted by +Chad (# 5645) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Angloid:
Assuming you mean Darren, surely not the Church Army. He's too posh for that (though his name lets him down a bit; maybe he got to public school on a scholarship. Or maybe he's antipodean and has toned down his accent.)

The accent could well be a recent acquisition. Keeping up with the Bromptons! [Snigger]
 
Posted by Son of a preacherman (# 4181) on :
 
I'm loving it... the line that makes me chuckle every time is.. 'Hello Mrs Vicarage'

It would have made my mother fume!!
 
Posted by Adeodatus (# 4992) on :
 
I'm a latecomer to this. I watched the first episode on iplayer last night, and part of me wishes I hadn't. It's funny, clever, extremely well observed and nicely acted ... but it excels in reminding me of everything I loathe about the Church of England. Everything I connect with the worst times in my life are there - the downtrodden, unsupported parish clergy (accurately, Adam always looks tired); the boxlike vicarages in the bleak urban wilderness; the ghastly Archdeacon; every congregation with its wearying cassock-chaser and vile parents trying to get their sprogs into the school. Even the scenes of the church interior seemed to communicate a feeling of cold and damp through my computer screen.

I'm afraid I also caught the first ten minutes of the second episode. Tell me, does Darren end up being shredded in an industrial waste recycling machine? Or is that just the way I'd write the script?
 
Posted by Zacchaeus (# 14454) on :
 
this week the spent £900 for new vestments and a fancy capuccino machine,it made me wonder where the parish was getting it's money from?
 
Posted by wilson (# 37) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Zacchaeus:
this week the spent £900 for new vestments and a fancy capuccino machine,it made me wonder where the parish was getting it's money from?

Well Darren gave them 10 grand a couple of weeks ago. Some of that went to window and the parish share I believe but I expect there's some left over.
 
Posted by Jemima the 9th (# 15106) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Adeodatus:
I'm afraid I also caught the first ten minutes of the second episode. Tell me, does Darren end up being shredded in an industrial waste recycling machine? Or is that just the way I'd write the script?

Sadly, no [Biased] although I'm pleased to report that episode 2 does end reasonably cheerfully. I think it was far better than episode 1 too.
 
Posted by Lola (# 627) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Adeodatus:
Even the scenes of the church interior seemed to communicate a feeling of cold and damp through my computer screen.

I think thats deliberate and down to the lighting - there are some "making of" clips on the Rev site and in these the church building is bright and sunny and much cheerier!
 
Posted by RadicalWhig (# 13190) on :
 
I wonder about Alex. Do you think she's deeply into the religion thing? I get the impression that she goes along with it because it is hubby's job. She accepts that it's quite an usual and demanding job, and probably a worthy one, but doesn't seem to be "practising Christian" herself. I can't imagine her in the Lawyer's Christian Fellowship, for example.

What do you think?
 
Posted by Amos (# 44) on :
 
I get the impression that Alex is 'normal CofE', but that she really loves Adam, and in loving him, loves his faith.

I can't imagine any of the Christian lawyers I know joining the Lawyers' Christian Fellowship.
 
Posted by Hawk (# 14289) on :
 
I liked this episode far more. My favourite bit was the Archdeacon spending time preparing his pub food, even squeezing lemon onto the fish to season it. And then putting it aside without even tasting it! Brilliant.
 
Posted by Hawk (# 14289) on :
 
And regarding the Guardian review, its par for the course unfortunately. While their articles on Christianity are not always ignorantly scathing, their reviews of television and film just never 'get it'. Its got to the point where if their reviewer loathes a film I'll consider seeing it - I know it must be pretty good if the Guardian doesn't get it. Their reviewers do seem to be on a different planet from anyone else.
 
Posted by sanityman (# 11598) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Hawk:
And regarding the Guardian review, its par for the course unfortunately. While their articles on Christianity are not always ignorantly scathing, their reviews of television and film just never 'get it'. Its got to the point where if their reviewer loathes a film I'll consider seeing it - I know it must be pretty good if the Guardian doesn't get it. Their reviewers do seem to be on a different planet from anyone else.

I felt like that about Grauniad film reviews for a long time - thought they'd been getting better lately, but perhaps not.

Loving Rev though - it's really grown on me. I love the amount of affection the producers seem to have for Adam and his situation, and that it manages to be affirming without ever slipping into schmaltz. The last episode summed it up perfectly, even to the level of having Tom end where he started ("I hate that man!").

Is it just me, or does it remind anyone of a very peculiar practice?

- Chris.
 
Posted by Baptist Trainfan (# 15128) on :
 
What has happened to the Archdeacon's taxi? We haven't seen it for two episodes.

Has the Diocese been cutting back on his expense allowance?

Or is it the Archdeacon's own private taxi, and his chauffeur is on holiday/got nicked for driving without a licence/rebelled at being treated like a skivvy/gone over to Rome (or the Methodists)? Perhaps it's just in for a service and its MOT.

[ 21. July 2010, 14:00: Message edited by: Baptist Trainfan ]
 
Posted by Yangtze (# 4965) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Adeodatus:
...the boxlike vicarages in the bleak urban wilderness....

Well I can see that vicarage from my kitchen window (actually to be truly accurate I can see the church roof it's next door to from my kitchen window) and I'll have you know that we're very up-and-coming round here these days. Less of your urban wilderness thank you very much. We have patisseries and trendy arty young twenty somethings setting up trendy bars now......
 
Posted by ken (# 2460) on :
 
The bit of London its set in is a lot posher than the bit I live in! (And Adam's vicarage is much nicer as well as much larger than the flat I live in as well - and very similar to our vicar's vicarage)
 
Posted by tessaB (# 8533) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by sanityman:

Is it just me, or does it remind anyone of a very peculiar practice?

- Chris.

I loved that series! Yes, the down-played peculiarity is a bit like it. And the feeling that it is probably truer to life than one would like to really believe.
 
Posted by Zacchaeus (# 14454) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by wilson:
quote:
Originally posted by Zacchaeus:
this week the spent £900 for new vestments and a fancy capuccino machine,it made me wonder where the parish was getting it's money from?

Well Darren gave them 10 grand a couple of weeks ago. Some of that went to window and the parish share I believe but I expect there's some left over.
I wouldn't have thought £10,000 would go far towards the parish share?
 
Posted by ken (# 2460) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Zacchaeus:
I wouldn't ave thought £10,000 would go far towards the parish share?

It might well be most of it for a church with a congregation that size. My guess is that a church with 30 regular attenders, so maybe 10-15 adults in full-time work, would probably be asked to pay somewhere between 10,000 & 20,000. Of course that no-where near covers the cost to the diocese of paying the parish priest, but that's the problem, isn't it?

We've got a much larger congregation (100-150) but our quota is not, I think, in six figures. (I'm not completely sure - I am not very good at staying awake when accounts are discussed at the PCC)
 
Posted by Adeodatus (# 4992) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Yangtze:
quote:
Originally posted by Adeodatus:
...the boxlike vicarages in the bleak urban wilderness....

Well I can see that vicarage from my kitchen window (actually to be truly accurate I can see the church roof it's next door to from my kitchen window) and I'll have you know that we're very up-and-coming round here these days. Less of your urban wilderness thank you very much. We have patisseries and trendy arty young twenty somethings setting up trendy bars now......
Sorry if my review has alarmed your local estate agents. Maybe it was the lighting again. But come on, really - that vicarage had all the aesthetic appeal of a shoe box. What is it about diocesan (alleged) architects that leads them to believe a vocation to parish ministry involves a willingness to live in a house they themselves wouldn't go within a hundred yards of?
 
Posted by Zacchaeus (# 14454) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Adeodatus:
quote:
Originally posted by Yangtze:
quote:
Originally posted by Adeodatus:
...the boxlike vicarages in the bleak urban wilderness....

Well I can see that vicarage from my kitchen window (actually to be truly accurate I can see the church roof it's next door to from my kitchen window) and I'll have you know that we're very up-and-coming round here these days. Less of your urban wilderness thank you very much. We have patisseries and trendy arty young twenty somethings setting up trendy bars now......
Sorry if my review has alarmed your local estate agents. Maybe it was the lighting again. But come on, really - that vicarage had all the aesthetic appeal of a shoe box. What is it about diocesan (alleged) architects that leads them to believe a vocation to parish ministry involves a willingness to live in a house they themselves wouldn't go within a hundred yards of?
And to believe you should be grateful for it!
 
Posted by FreeJack (# 10612) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by ken:
quote:
Originally posted by Zacchaeus:
I wouldn't ave thought £10,000 would go far towards the parish share?

It might well be most of it for a church with a congregation that size. My guess is that a church with 30 regular attenders, so maybe 10-15 adults in full-time work, would probably be asked to pay somewhere between 10,000 & 20,000. Of course that no-where near covers the cost to the diocese of paying the parish priest, but that's the problem, isn't it?

We've got a much larger congregation (100-150) but our quota is not, I think, in six figures. (I'm not completely sure - I am not very good at staying awake when accounts are discussed at the PCC)

You're thinking south of the river logic! We don't tax ER round here.

A north of the river standard vicar common fund ask would be around £64,000. A very poor area might be expected to raise £40k, with a plan to increase it to £50k over a period of years, and grow the congregation.
 
Posted by Angloid (# 159) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by FreeJack:
A very poor area might be expected to raise £40k, with a plan to increase it to £50k over a period of years, and grow the congregation.

I'm so glad to be out of parish administration and fund-raising! But how is it feasible for a small poor congregation to contribute £40k a year to the parish share, let alone for all the other costs? That's a thousand pounds for each member, assuming a congregation of around 40, which is on the large size of average. In other words £20 a week for someone living on benefits or state pension.

I know this is getting purgatorial but the C of E is living in a fantasy world if it thinks this is either practical or just.

To get back to the OP: I squirm with grim recognition when I see the vicarage. Not that we've lived in one like that, but we've had the standard issue kitchen units. I can sympathise with Adeodatus's feelings, but would ask him 'doesn't it make you feel glad to have escaped?'

[ 21. July 2010, 21:04: Message edited by: Angloid ]
 
Posted by Gill H (# 68) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by tessaB:
quote:
Originally posted by sanityman:

Is it just me, or does it remind anyone of a very peculiar practice?

- Chris.

I loved that series! Yes, the down-played peculiarity is a bit like it. And the feeling that it is probably truer to life than one would like to really believe.
I was getting flashbacks to that series too.
 
Posted by Boopy (# 4738) on :
 
Am I the only person who thinks the vicarage is acceptable and the kitchen units adequate?

OK it's not an attractive building, inside or outside - it has the aesthetic appeal of a cardboard box, but it is a reasonable size family home. And the kitchen units are basic but at least they all match and are clean and functional......and the kitchen is a reasonable size....and there is a downstairs loo as well as upstairs...the living room whilst horribly furnished looked quite spacious......

Compared with modern expectations of middle class comfort I suppose it's a bit basic, but compared with a lot of inner city living accommodation I think it starts to look pretty good. And I speak as one who has lived in church-owned accommodation in which maintenance, fixtures and fittings and decoration had been done very much on the cheap, but it did have the advantage of being reasonably spacious (considerably more so than the homes of most of the congregation).

What are reasonable expectations to have of vicarage accommodation?
 
Posted by Adeodatus (# 4992) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Angloid:
To get back to the OP: I squirm with grim recognition when I see the vicarage. Not that we've lived in one like that, but we've had the standard issue kitchen units. I can sympathise with Adeodatus's feelings, but would ask him 'doesn't it make you feel glad to have escaped?'

Seriously, I count myself very blessed and very lucky to have had the opportunity to get out of parish ministry and into a very different career. Parish ministry was not-very-slowly but surely destroying me, and I couldn't have lasted much longer. "Rev" is a good, light comedy, but for me it brings back some very uncomfortable memories.

I watched episode 2 last night. It was good to see Adam standing up for himself a bit against Darren, and very funny when Darren completely lost his cool and childishly mimicked Adam's "seventy times seven".
 
Posted by BroJames (# 9636) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Angloid:
But how is it feasible for a small poor congregation to contribute £40k a year to the parish share, let alone for all the other costs? That's a thousand pounds for each member, assuming a congregation of around 40, which is on the large size of average. In other words £20 a week for someone living on benefits or state pension.

The cost to the dioceses of an incumbent (stipend, pension, housing, training) in my part of the world is about £50k a year. There is a considerable degree of cross-subsidy between parishes, but it can still represent a heavy demand for a small congregation. In rural areas round here that leads to multi-church incumbencies.

The Church of England would like more clergy than it has got, and more than it can afford to pay for. The pinch is recognised all round which is one reason why it is cutting back on clergy pensions, and the aspiration some years ago of a real terms increase in the stipend. In my area at least the level of the stipend presupposes that in a family with two children at school there will be a second income for the household not to fall below the Minimum Income Standard for UK households.

There is a nasty gap in the middle between what the church can afford to pay, the number of clergy it wants and observing the principle that the labourer is worthy of his/her hire. (
 
Posted by Emma Louise (# 3571) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by BroJames:
. In my area at least the level of the stipend presupposes that in a family with two children at school there will be a second income for the household not to fall below the Minimum Income Standard for UK households.


I've had a look at that site before and I think many middle class families would fall below the "minimum income standard" if they didn't have a second income. Unfortunately in this day and age 2 incomes (often with one part time) is the norm rather than the exception (to meet those standards at least which include holidays etc) apart from those with *very* well paid jobs, especially once kids are school age its quite unusual to have a stay at home parent now.

Certainly most families I know do not have the luxury of a stay-at-home-parent for long, and that's degree educated teachers, OTs, etc.
 
Posted by BroJames (# 9636) on :
 
Yes. I think you are right. Round here (assuming a fairly basic rented property for a family of four) a single earner in the household would need to be earning about £39,000 p.a. to meet the minimum income standard. That is roughly in the top 40% of earners.
 
Posted by Yangtze (# 4965) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Adeodatus:
quote:
Originally posted by Yangtze:
quote:
Originally posted by Adeodatus:
...the boxlike vicarages in the bleak urban wilderness....

Well I can see that vicarage from my kitchen window <snip> I'll have you know that we're very up-and-coming round here these days.

Sorry if my review has alarmed your local estate agents. Maybe it was the lighting again. But come on, really - that vicarage had all the aesthetic appeal of a shoe box. What is it about diocesan (alleged) architects that leads them to believe a vocation to parish ministry involves a willingness to live in a house they themselves wouldn't go within a hundred yards of?
Oh I agree, the house is ugly. But functional. Assume cost is the contributing factor to why architects are prepared to build such things. Though it's actually pretty pleasant compared with some of the local post-war architecture round here (though not the neighbouring Victorian terraces). Mind you the church it serves is a big, ugly, late Victorian barn of a place.
 
Posted by ken (# 2460) on :
 
My wages are far higher than that "Minimum Income Standard". But I would not possibly be able to afford to buy a house like the one the Rev lives in in the part of London I live in, which is one of the cheaper areas in London. In fact I couldn't afford a house round here at all

Checking some house sales websites, Shoreditch seems to be about half as expensive again as Lewisham (rather cheaper than I would have guessed and bloody good value for somewhere so near to the City) But still utterly out of the range of anyone without either lots of money in the bank or a very high income.
 
Posted by St Everild (# 3626) on :
 
I liked the wallpaper (not!) in Adam's sittng room - you could see when the previous occupant's pictures had been...
 
Posted by Schroedinger's cat (# 64) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by FreeJack:
quote:
Originally posted by ken:
quote:
Originally posted by Zacchaeus:
I wouldn't ave thought £10,000 would go far towards the parish share?

It might well be most of it for a church with a congregation that size. My guess is that a church with 30 regular attenders, so maybe 10-15 adults in full-time work, would probably be asked to pay somewhere between 10,000 & 20,000. Of course that no-where near covers the cost to the diocese of paying the parish priest, but that's the problem, isn't it?

We've got a much larger congregation (100-150) but our quota is not, I think, in six figures. (I'm not completely sure - I am not very good at staying awake when accounts are discussed at the PCC)

You're thinking south of the river logic! We don't tax ER round here.

A north of the river standard vicar common fund ask would be around £64,000. A very poor area might be expected to raise £40k, with a plan to increase it to £50k over a period of years, and grow the congregation.

When I was in East London, which was a deprived urban area ( admittedly in Chelmsford diocese, not London ), the big church I attended paid 30K pa ( edging up to 40k ), but the smaller church that was under our wing paid 9K. And that was a struggle.
 
Posted by leo (# 1458) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Yangtze:
quote:
Originally posted by Adeodatus:
quote:
Originally posted by Yangtze:
quote:
Originally posted by Adeodatus:
...the boxlike vicarages in the bleak urban wilderness....

Well I can see that vicarage from my kitchen window <snip> I'll have you know that we're very up-and-coming round here these days.

Sorry if my review has alarmed your local estate agents. Maybe it was the lighting again. But come on, really - that vicarage had all the aesthetic appeal of a shoe box. What is it about diocesan (alleged) architects that leads them to believe a vocation to parish ministry involves a willingness to live in a house they themselves wouldn't go within a hundred yards of?
Oh I agree, the house is ugly. But functional.
It looks pretty much like our vicarage in posh Clifton.
 
Posted by sanityman (# 11598) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by leo:
It looks pretty much like our vicarage in posh Clifton.

You should have seen the student house I used to live in in Clifton!

- Chris.
 
Posted by yellowroom (# 11690) on :
 
there's quite a good article in the Guardian
 
Posted by Andromeda (# 11304) on :
 
Loved the latest episode again.

Olivia Colman is brilliant in it.
 
Posted by Jengie Jon (# 273) on :
 
Please those comparing vicarages with their own homes realise that you are not comparing like with like. The vicarage is intended to be a place of work for the vicar as well as his and his families home. Also if you think that when a vicar at about 8pm on Saturday night (I wish this was a caricature) gets down to finally writing his sermon, he goes and sits in the cold vestry in the church rather than puts a pot of coffee on the stove and go into his study in the relative warmth of vicarage study then I am not sure quite which planet you are on.

The study and the downstairs loo(for the convenience of parishioner really) are actually due to that these are seen as part of what a vicar needs to conduct his role. It is a requirement of the job although my parents down stairs loo was in an outhouse so I suspect church members went upstairs like the rest of the family.

There is an expectation that some meetings will be held at the manse, that the minister when at home will be available for pastoral need (basically equivalent to on call for doctors) and having the vicarage near a church is to facilitate such requirements.

So yes the house is larger than probably the average family have in the area. Then your average family home is not also business premises.

Really you should know better, its the vicar only works on Sundays in another guise.

Jengie
 
Posted by Chapelhead (# 21) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by yellowroom:
there's quite a good article in the Guardian

Shurley shome mishtake!

For a moment I wondered why a church would have 1,740 doors, before realising it was a date.
 
Posted by Angloid (# 159) on :
 
I love their description of the Archdeacon: ' a stage villain who swishes into each episode to spread crisp, prissy menace, like Malcolm Tucker minus the swearing. '

More like Mandelson I think.
 
Posted by Boopy (# 4738) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Jengie Jon:
Please those comparing vicarages with their own homes realise that you are not comparing like with like. The vicarage is intended to be a place of work for the vicar as well as his and his families home. Also if you think that when a vicar at about 8pm on Saturday night (I wish this was a caricature) gets down to finally writing his sermon, he goes and sits in the cold vestry in the church rather than puts a pot of coffee on the stove and go into his study in the relative warmth of vicarage study then I am not sure quite which planet you are on.

The study and the downstairs loo(for the convenience of parishioner really) are actually due to that these are seen as part of what a vicar needs to conduct his role. It is a requirement of the job although my parents down stairs loo was in an outhouse so I suspect church members went upstairs like the rest of the family.

There is an expectation that some meetings will be held at the manse, that the minister when at home will be available for pastoral need (basically equivalent to on call for doctors) and having the vicarage near a church is to facilitate such requirements.

So yes the house is larger than probably the average family have in the area. Then your average family home is not also business premises.

Really you should know better, its the vicar only works on Sundays in another guise.

Jengie

I think you are describing a situation which used to be a universal expectation of clergy/minister accommodation but no longer is. I too have lived in a manse and have had friends who lived in vicarages; I'm aware that in part it is designed as a place of work. However, there is no longer always an expectation that meetings would be held there, particularly where there are children and it's primary a family home; this really is something that varies from church to church nowadays. Yes,as a place of work and therefore there needs to be a study - but nowadays the pattern of work for a great many middle class families also involves having a study/office in the home so this is no longer something specific only to the role of a vicar. I think the comparison with other homes is a valid one and I stand by my point that the vicarage in Rev is probably better accommodation than that available to most of his congregation. To maintain this is in no way to denigrate the work that a vicar does (I'm not sure where your 'vicar works on sundays in disguise' comment comes from but I don't think that has been implicit in the discussion until you introduced it).

Plenty of modern vicarages are not right next to the church and not externally identifiable as vicarages so the 'on call at the door' expectation doesn't always apply to the extent that it would have when all vicarages were next to the church and could be easily identified.

It sounds to me as if you are describing the vicarage of your childhood and I do think things have changed somewhat; though no doubt there are plenty of examples remaining of the scenario you describe.
 
Posted by RadicalWhig (# 13190) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Andromeda:
Olivia Colman is brilliant in it.

Brilliant, dreamy, gorgeous, sexy and rapidly turning me into the sort of drooling hound who tries to hump peoples' legs. (Ok, that's enough. I'll stop now. Promise. Just don't mention the lovely and adorable Olivia Colman, and I'll be ok).
 
Posted by Mr Clingford (# 7961) on :
 
Olivia Coleman. But I much prefer the Headteacher.

I enjoyed this episode more than the last one. But more Archdeacon in a taxi.

[ 24. July 2010, 01:38: Message edited by: Mr Clingford ]
 
Posted by BroJames (# 9636) on :
 
I think things are changing, Boopy. But it is still the case that the size and design of clergy housing is based on the assumption that one of the living rooms needs to be large enough for a small meeting, and that another (usually) downstairs room will be the main place of work for the clergy person (and quite often the parish office as well). There are still plenty of places where the parish's expectation matches the design of the house, and "we always used to have a garden party in the vicarage garden"... It is changing, but it is sometimes not much fun being at the cutting edge of that change.

However grand the house may be, it is only worth as much to those living in it as they would choose to spend on suitable accommodation for themselves. The most recent official estimate is that it is worth £9680 p.a. gross. Obviously the actual value varies from place to place. Where property prices are high then it is worth more, but clergy on the level of income they receive would not choose/be able to buy in those areas. That is why housing is provided and clergy are required to live in it.

Even living 5-10 minutes walk from the church, the clergy house is well known to the community's 'Colins'. Other callers at the door are rarer in these days of ubiquitous telephones, but it is not uncommon to have a phone call that goes something like. "I would like to see your church. How can I do that...", "Where are you?" "Standing outside the church..."
 
Posted by +Chad (# 5645) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Angloid:
I love their description of the Archdeacon: ' a stage villain who swishes into each episode to spread crisp, prissy menace, like Malcolm Tucker minus the swearing. '

More like Mandelson I think.

Oh, no! The Archdeacon has style, and, I think, underneath it all, integrity.

Not a word that springs easily to mind when thinking of the Dark Lord.
 
Posted by Jengie Jon (# 273) on :
 
Every one is presuming by meetings that I mean formal church meetings. I don't on the whole. I mean far smaller ones than that which are probably the majority of meetings held at the manse, for example: Preparations for Weddings or Baptisms, Pastoral care meetings even if done over the phone can necessitate a quick exit to the study and informal meetings with officers of the church e.g. church wardens. These are meetings which rarely have more than two or three present beside the cleric. Don't require a large living room but do require a room outside the general family space.

Jengie
 
Posted by Angloid (# 159) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by +Chad:
quote:
Originally posted by Angloid:
I love their description of the Archdeacon: ' a stage villain who swishes into each episode to spread crisp, prissy menace, like Malcolm Tucker minus the swearing. '

More like Mandelson I think.

Oh, no! The Archdeacon has style, and, I think, underneath it all, integrity.

Not a word that springs easily to mind when thinking of the Dark Lord.

I realise that! I think you're right about the AD's integrity. Nevertheless superficially he is much closer to Mandelson than Tucker.
 
Posted by +Chad (# 5645) on :
 
I take your point, Fr A.
 
Posted by fletcher christian (# 13919) on :
 
quote:

I'm aware that in part it is designed as a place of work. However, there is no longer always an expectation that meetings would be held there

I think that's true, for various reasons. Among those reasons are that the room for holding meetings is embarrassing - the carpet has been there from the early 60's, so it smells now. The last vicar kept 300 cats before his final breakdown, and eau de cat piss still invades every corner of the house. The ceiling is stained with water from the leaking shower and the hole in the corner still has water dripping out of it, from God know's where! There are four floorboards missing from the centre of the room, but because they are covered in carpet you have to warn every visitor not to step there lest they disappear mysteriously. That suite of furniture Ms Crabby donated really should have gone to the dump a few decades ago. In summer the room is 'pleasantly cool', but your pictures on the wall have become the epicentre of damp, mildew and rot. In winter the fireplace unfortunately can't be used, but heat comes in the form of a portable heater that goes into the only plug in the room, but this is tempered by windows with ventilation on a windy night that feels like sitting in a wind tunnel and sends the curtains horizontal.

So yes, things have changed in parishes. Now they have meetings in the collapsing church hall with vinyl flooring, strobe lights and electric heaters, because it's more cosy there and they never have to look at the state of many a neglected vicarage.

[ 24. July 2010, 13:29: Message edited by: fletcher christian ]
 
Posted by Schroedinger's cat (# 64) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by +Chad:
Oh, no! The Archdeacon has style, and, I think, underneath it all, integrity.

I think the AD has a lot of integrity, but is also a politician, and someone under a lot of political pressure from all sides. Just like a real AD. Keeping his integrity under those circumstances is really problematic, which is why I think he sometimes comes over rather distant.
 
Posted by dorothea (# 4398) on :
 
Re: comments on Guardian review.

Despite the main TV critics lukewarm reception, there's been some really good plugs in 'The Guide' section on Saturdays, which are reprinted on the 'today's telly' section on Mondays. That's what put me on to Rev in the first place.

J

[ 25. July 2010, 12:19: Message edited by: dorothea ]
 
Posted by MrsDoyle (# 13579) on :
 
Whatever your opion of the series, the sentence (delivered well) "the tintinnabulation of a pregnant thurible" calls forth much respect, just for it's construct.
 
Posted by dorothea (# 4398) on :
 
Another good episode but only Jonathan Harvey could have worked in such a unbelievably outrageous, school yard level female anatomy/fish joke.

J
 
Posted by Yangtze (# 4965) on :
 
quote:
"I've been Baptised, not Lobotomised" - the Archdeacon
Brilliant
 
Posted by wilson (# 37) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Zacchaeus:
quote:
Originally posted by wilson:
quote:
Originally posted by Zacchaeus:
this week the spent £900 for new vestments and a fancy capuccino machine,it made me wonder where the parish was getting it's money from?

Well Darren gave them 10 grand a couple of weeks ago. Some of that went to window and the parish share I believe but I expect there's some left over.
I wouldn't have thought £10,000 would go far towards the parish share?
Well this probably shows my lack of knowledge of Anglican finances. I'd kind of got the impression the "parish share" was a monthly or quarterly payment. The subsequent discussion on this thread seems to imply it's a yearly thing.

Anyway. Tonight's episode was great. I really felt for Adam - both in his loneliness and his jealousy. It was really well portrayed, it felt achingly real. The more I watch Rev the more it feels like quite a dark psychological drama about the difficulties of parish life - with the odd joke thrown in. (Except it's more than the odd joke but you know what I mean).

Of course all great comedy is very close to tragedy.

OK Question: is 'Pope-ing' generally felt to be such a betrayal? It seemed like there was a terrible sense of hurt and anger there.
 
Posted by Curiosity killed ... (# 11770) on :
 
Parish Share is calculated annually. In this diocese we're encouraged to pay by monthly instalments, so it can be a monthly charge.

A parish priest is given cure of all the souls in his (geographical) parish on behalf of the bishop at his induction. Any reason for him to leave that cure before his time of tenure is completed, or often when the time of tenure is up, can be seen as a betrayal of the parish.
 
Posted by Lola (# 627) on :
 
Loneliness seems to be a strong motif for the whole series.
 
Posted by Spike (# 36) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by wilson:


OK Question: is 'Pope-ing' generally felt to be such a betrayal? It seemed like there was a terrible sense of hurt and anger there.

That's something I didn't get. In the Diocese of London, (and especially in the East End) very few people would turn a hair at the use of a thurible.
 
Posted by Chapelhead (# 21) on :
 
My assumption was that there had been much bitterness over the previous incumbent's swimming of the Tiber (taking some of the congregation with him?), which made the issue a hot potato in the parish. Otherwise, I agree, there seemed to be some strong reactions about a matter that in most places would not have seemed particularly important (especially at a wedding, where much odder things than a bit of incense can happen).
 
Posted by Curiosity killed ... (# 11770) on :
 
It does depend on where you are. We have occasional incense - as in planned four times a year for major feasts - and it's a bone of contention each and every time.

The Church of England is a broad church, so within a parish (outside the major cities) you can have people who are comfortable marking saints' days, incense, benediction, candles, full liturgy and vestments and also people who see all of that as unnecessary barriers to reaching to God and Jesus as the Bible is The Way™ and anything else gets in the way if not unnecessary Popish nonsense. We do within the parish I attend.
 
Posted by Angloid (# 159) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Spike:
quote:
Originally posted by wilson:


OK Question: is 'Pope-ing' generally felt to be such a betrayal? It seemed like there was a terrible sense of hurt and anger there.

That's something I didn't get. In the Diocese of London, (and especially in the East End) very few people would turn a hair at the use of a thurible.
That was the only bit that didn't ring true. Though it might if the parish had originally been evangelical and was 'spiked up' by the previous vicar. There might have been some resentment around about that, and relief that Adam was toning things down somewhat.

Despite the generally accurate liturgical details in the series Adam was decidedly underdressed, not overdressed, for a nuptial mass in cotta and stole.
 
Posted by Ricardus (# 8757) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Curiosity killed ...:
It does depend on where you are. We have occasional incense - as in planned four times a year for major feasts - and it's a bone of contention each and every time.

Indeed. I know one priest (not in this diocese) who likes a bit of incense, but if he wants it in a service he has to announce it several weeks beforehand in the Parish Magazine so that certain of his congregation know to stay away ...
 
Posted by Matt Black (# 2210) on :
 
I loved it last night - Nigel not the AD for once stole the show for me this time ("Abramovich", "I've left that [Simon Le Bon] immaturity behind: now I'm Desmond Tutu", and his attempted covert use of the thurible).
 
Posted by Curiosity killed ... (# 11770) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Ricardus:
quote:
Originally posted by Curiosity killed ...:
It does depend on where you are. We have occasional incense - as in planned four times a year for major feasts - and it's a bone of contention each and every time.

Indeed. I know one priest (not in this diocese) who likes a bit of incense, but if he wants it in a service he has to announce it several weeks beforehand in the Parish Magazine so that certain of his congregation know to stay away ...
And there is hell to pay if anyone forgets, people storming out and lots of excitement. I've seen it happen in more than one church. The one that had more repercussions was the priest covering in the interregnum using incense for Epiphany, and the churchwarden storming out in high dudgeon into the arms of the new incumbent sneaking late into the back of the church for a quiet service.
 
Posted by Gamaliel (# 812) on :
 
They use lashings, and I mean lashings, of incense at a liberal catholic parish near me. The rest of it is pretty 'catholic-lite' as the priest there likes to call it.

What both amuses and irritates me is that the local evangelical parish thinks of them as both dangerously liberal and dangerously catholic whilst they, for their part, think of the evangelicals as tantamount to a bunch of Appallachian snake-handlers ...

[Roll Eyes]

The CofE is broad, but it can equally be pretty polarised at times.

I didn't think last night's was as funny as previous episodes but still worth a watch.
 
Posted by Thurible (# 3206) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Gamaliel:

I didn't think last night's was as funny as previous episodes

True but it was very good!

Thurible
 
Posted by Roseofsharon (# 9657) on :
 
I was a little sad at the end of last night's story. I still enjoyed it, and it had some very funny moments, but I was left feeling vaguely melancholy.
quote:
Originally posted by Niminypiminy:
...then I started to think about the fact that Adam and Alex don't have children, and I was suddenly struck by the similarities with the Tom and Barbara in the Good Life -- couples who aren't in the first flush of marriage who are still quite couple-y and where all the humour in the marriage centres around their romantic/sexual life.
It's true that it they had children it would turn into a family sitcom, and Rev is obviously not that. It's just that when you combine it with the lack of backstory for Adam and Alex the whole situation begins to seem a bit peculiar

Well, we've now had a bit of back-story - at least a bit of Alex's - and we know why they don't have children.
Can't be many more episodes to come - I do hope they do another series, I will miss them.
 
Posted by Chapelhead (# 21) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Matt Black:
I loved it last night - Nigel not the AD for once stole the show for me this time ("Abramovich", "I've left that [Simon Le Bon] immaturity behind: now I'm Desmond Tutu", and his attempted covert use of the thurible).

Nigel has been my favourite character from the start - indeed, my favourite TV role-model since Niles Crane in Frasier.
 
Posted by Pine Marten (# 11068) on :
 
Originally posted by Roseofsharon:
quote:

<snip>

Well, we've now had a bit of back-story - at least a bit of Alex's - and we know why they don't have children.


Why don't they have children? Sorry - I missed most of the episode because one of the cats had brought in a mouse and I was trying to get him to take it back into the garden rather than leave it on/in/under the bed!

eta: I'm at work and can't get to an iplayer for a while...

[ 27. July 2010, 10:17: Message edited by: Pine Marten ]
 
Posted by Niminypiminy (# 15489) on :
 
yes, I thought the bit where Adam in his jealousy said 'he could have made you pregnant' (or something like that) was really poignant.

I've grown really fond of this series.
 
Posted by Tyler Durden (# 2996) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Pine Marten:
Originally posted by Roseofsharon:
quote:

<snip>

Well, we've now had a bit of back-story - at least a bit of Alex's - and we know why they don't have children.


Why don't they have children? Sorry - I missed most of the episode because one of the cats had brought in a mouse and I was trying to get him to take it back into the garden rather than leave it on/in/under the bed!


Yes, I must have missed that as well. Can anyone enlighten us?
 
Posted by Zacchaeus (# 14454) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Niminypiminy:
yes, I thought the bit where Adam in his jealousy said 'he could have made you pregnant' (or something like that) was really poignant.

I've grown really fond of this series.

And she replied 'I don't want children' that couple of lines spoke volumes about their story. And I can see why Adam feels insecure and that he had faile dhis wife in some way, even though she is not feeling that way.
 
Posted by MrsDoyle (# 13579) on :
 
A litle late on contributing but here goes.
Our parish share is worked out on the basis of anonymous income surveys; although small (100 registered members) and poor, our share for the last year was calculated at £15,000 plus. To late did we realise that the survey was mostly filled in by the very few affluent members, parishioners of more modest means feeling uncomfortable giving their income even anonymously. We cannot afford it and so are appealing.
On another note (aural variety) , as with all parish churches in the Diocese we have a Health and Safety rep, to her falls the task of putting up notices prior to services with insence for those whose breathing may be adversly effected.
 
Posted by Alex Cockell (# 7487) on :
 
Is it just me or was Adam's fantasising about beiing all spiky and rc quite similar to Galadriel's response when Frodo offered her Sauron's ring? Or Smeagol, come to think of it?

In effect, The Thurible Of Power?
 
Posted by RadicalWhig (# 13190) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Alex Cockell:
Is it just me or was Adam's fantasising about beiing all spiky and rc quite similar to Galadriel's response when Frodo offered her Sauron's ring? Or Smeagol, come to think of it?

In effect, The Thurible Of Power?

Good point. He's tempted by the allures of priestcraft - it seems to offer a quick-fix way of ending his problems, realising his dreams and ambitions, manifesting to his desire to "Be someone" and to gain power, prestige and esteem. But he resists. Very well portrayed, I thought. You could see the glimpse of evil in his eye - like the devil's handbag held him for a moment.
 
Posted by Boogie (# 13538) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by MrsDoyle:
A litle late on contributing but here goes.
Our parish share is worked out on the basis of anonymous income surveys; although small (100 registered members) and poor, our share for the last year was calculated at £15,000 plus. To late did we realise that the survey was mostly filled in by the very few affluent members, parishioners of more modest means feeling uncomfortable giving their income even anonymously. We cannot afford it and so are appealing.
On another note (aural variety) , as with all parish churches in the Diocese we have a Health and Safety rep, to her falls the task of putting up notices prior to services with insence for those whose breathing may be adversly effected.

What do those whose breathing may be adversly effected do then?

(Sorry about the tangent - I am just interested - as I have asthma but love insence, being a Methodist it has never been an issue [Smile] [Smile]
 
Posted by Saviour Tortoise (# 4660) on :
 
Another great episode I thought.

The Archdeacon still steals the show for me. I loved his sarcastic and slightly menacing "I hear you're thinking of employing a distinctive Latinate form of choreography in your divine theatre" when referring to the use of incense!

[edited for typo]

[ 27. July 2010, 18:19: Message edited by: Saviour Tortoise ]
 
Posted by Chorister (# 473) on :
 
I thought the second half of this week's episode was appallingly badly acted - as if they'd run out of time to rehearse properly.
Otherwise, the surprising story lines continue apace - I'm not giving up watching yet!

Favourite part - when Adam's wife goes to visit her parish priest to talk over the fact that her husband is not talking to her. [Cool]
 
Posted by Schroedinger's cat (# 64) on :
 
"pope-ing up" would have been a real problem as the previous incumbent had defected. I think in the circumstances, it would have been a very risky to do.

I thought it was an excellent episode again, dealing so well with loneliness, and really addressing the problems of loneliness for a vicar. And also dealing with the facade of friendship - not only Adam with Leon, but also Leon and Alex from years ago, and the fragility of their sexual relationship. And Leon was the loneliest person in the episode.
 
Posted by sanityman (# 11598) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by RadicalWhig:
quote:
Originally posted by Alex Cockell:
Is it just me or was Adam's fantasising about beiing all spiky and rc quite similar to Galadriel's response when Frodo offered her Sauron's ring? Or Smeagol, come to think of it?

In effect, The Thurible Of Power?

Good point. He's tempted by the allures of priestcraft - it seems to offer a quick-fix way of ending his problems, realising his dreams and ambitions, manifesting to his desire to "Be someone" and to gain power, prestige and esteem. But he resists. Very well portrayed, I thought. You could see the glimpse of evil in his eye - like the devil's handbag held him for a moment.
Yes! I thought exactly that when I was watching it - I was half expecting to come out with "all shall love me, and despair!", but the final quip punctured it nicely.

- Chris.
 
Posted by Angloid (# 159) on :
 
Schroedinger's cat: Your second paragraph is spot on.

But the previous vicar 'defected'??? (I nearly read 'defecated'). Is that an appropriate word to use of someone moving from one part of the Christian church to another (and one which has arguably more claim to represent the tradition)? Purgatorial tangent perhaps, but it seems to betray the same sort of visceral and irrational anti-popery that still persists in the mindsets of otherwise reasonable, liberal and educated Englishmen and women.

[ 27. July 2010, 20:30: Message edited by: Angloid ]
 
Posted by Saviour Tortoise (# 4660) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Angloid:
Schroedinger's cat: Your second paragraph is spot on.

But the previous vicar 'defected'??? (I nearly read 'defecated'). Is that an appropriate word to use of someone moving from one part of the Christian church to another

No. But I'm sure it's an accurate way to describe how the (remaining) congregation and the Archdeacon perceive the event. That's why Adam moving up the candle was so "dangerous". If you're in a delicate situation, you don't ruffle things up by reminding people of recent trauma.

That's how I read it, anyway.
 
Posted by Enoch (# 14322) on :
 
I thought this week's was the best yet. The combination of comedy and poignancy was so good there were some points I could hardly bear to watch, and the thurible episode was hilarious. I also like the way Alex can convey so much by small movements of the eyes which her husband and the viewers can pick up be other people in the scene can't.

Does anyone else see any resemblance to how they would imagine Mark and Sophia Ainger transported to the bleaker present day?

Like them one suspects that childlessness is an elephant.
 
Posted by Ricardus (# 8757) on :
 
I know of two priests who went to Rome fairly recently. In one case there was understanding and sympathy, in the other it was seen as a betrayal.
quote:
Originally posted by Angloid:
But the previous vicar 'defected'??? (I nearly read 'defecated'). Is that an appropriate word to use of someone moving from one part of the Christian church to another (and one which has arguably more claim to represent the tradition)? Purgatorial tangent perhaps, but it seems to betray the same sort of visceral and irrational anti-popery that still persists in the mindsets of otherwise reasonable, liberal and educated Englishmen and women.

In the Ultra-High, more Popish than the Pope circles I sometimes frequent, "defect" is quite often used in a jocular sense for priests who go to Rome.

[ 27. July 2010, 20:46: Message edited by: Ricardus ]
 
Posted by Qoheleth. (# 9265) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Saviour Tortoise:
The Archdeacon still steals the show for me.

This week, drinking Proper Coffee&trade.
 
Posted by Panda (# 2951) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by RadicalWhig:
quote:
Originally posted by Alex Cockell:
Is it just me or was Adam's fantasising about beiing all spiky and rc quite similar to Galadriel's response when Frodo offered her Sauron's ring? Or Smeagol, come to think of it?

In effect, The Thurible Of Power?

Good point. He's tempted by the allures of priestcraft - it seems to offer a quick-fix way of ending his problems, realising his dreams and ambitions, manifesting to his desire to "Be someone" and to gain power, prestige and esteem. But he resists. Very well portrayed, I thought. You could see the glimpse of evil in his eye - like the devil's handbag held him for a moment.
I got the impression that was more for Nigel's benefit (who was obviously happy to be mistaken for 'the other priest' earlier in the episode - warning him of the dangers of any position of power. Nigel seemed to be staring at him open-mouthed at any rate.
 
Posted by Saviour Tortoise (# 4660) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Qoheleth.:
quote:
Originally posted by Saviour Tortoise:
The Archdeacon still steals the show for me.

This week, drinking Proper Coffee&trade.
Indeed.

I'm a bit of a coffee snob myself, but I like to think I'm not as openly rude about it as the Archdeacon!
 
Posted by Roseofsharon (# 9657) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Pine Marten:
Why don't they have children? Sorry - I missed most of the episode

The conversation went -
Adam: "Thought he was everything I wasn't. Thought he could give you things I couldn't. He only has to look at a woman to get her pregnant."

Alex: "I don't want kids. I've already got one, a great big one, stupid..."
quote:
Originally posted by Panda: I got the impression that was more for Nigel's benefit (who was obviously happy to be mistaken for 'the other priest' earlier in the episode - warning him of the dangers of any position of power. Nigel seemed to be staring at him open-mouthed at any rate.
Oh yes, that was certainly for Nigel's benefit, a warning not to get carried way by the trappings.
 
Posted by ken (# 2460) on :
 
The thurible power trip was hilarious! And definitely aimed at Nigel - he's the one who fantasises about being called "father". And poignant as well, as its Adam who wants kids.
 
Posted by +Chad (# 5645) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Saviour Tortoise:
The Archdeacon still steals the show for me. I loved his sarcastic and slightly menacing "I hear you're thinking of employing a distinctive Latinate form of choreography in your divine theatre" when referring to the use of incense!

Yes! I've added that one to my arsenal. [Snigger]

Archdeacon Robert's character develops by the week.

I loved his "Wotcher" when he met Adam near the start of the episode.

Underneath his acid-drop asides lurks a mischievous sense of humour.
 
Posted by Angloid (# 159) on :
 
Archdeacon Robert for +Southwark. Just the man! (He's got the cross and purple scarf already).

[ 28. July 2010, 08:11: Message edited by: Angloid ]
 
Posted by +Chad (# 5645) on :
 
Yes. There is something Mervynesque about him. [Biased]
 
Posted by Pine Marten (# 11068) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Roseofsharon:
quote:
Originally posted by Pine Marten:
Why don't they have children? Sorry - I missed most of the episode

The conversation went -
Adam: "Thought he was everything I wasn't. Thought he could give you things I couldn't. He only has to look at a woman to get her pregnant."

Alex: "I don't want kids. I've already got one, a great big one, stupid..."

Thanks, Roseofsharon. That's really sad...
 
Posted by Spike (# 36) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by +Chad:
Yes. There is something Mervynesque about him. [Biased]

I hadn't thought of that, but now you mention it ...
 
Posted by kingsfold (# 1726) on :
 
I'm another one who is thoroughly enjoying the series.

If nothing else, it's given a number of us nice shiny new sigs! [Big Grin]

[ 28. July 2010, 12:15: Message edited by: kingsfold ]
 
Posted by Loveheart (# 12249) on :
 
My vicar has taken to calling me Nigel [Paranoid] , and asked me today if I'd placed an order yet for clerical shirts and if I've been practising my Latin. I told him that I still remember it all, so don't need to practise! As we were in the open air, I didn't give a rendition though... [Snigger]
 
Posted by Chapelhead (# 21) on :
 
So which Mystery Worshipper slagged off Adam's preaching, causing him to go into a complete tailspin in next week's episode?

And why do I feel that the boundary between reality and fantasy is getting ever thinner?
 
Posted by Qoheleth. (# 9265) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by kingsfold:
it's given a number of us nice shiny new sigs! [Big Grin]

Indeed.
 
Posted by Japes (# 5358) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by kingsfold:
I'm another one who is thoroughly enjoying the series.

If nothing else, it's given a number of us nice shiny new sigs! [Big Grin]

My first thought when I heard that was it would make a brilliant sig! [Hot and Hormonal]
 
Posted by Hazey*Jane (# 8754) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Chapelhead:
So which Mystery Worshipper slagged off Adam's preaching, causing him to go into a complete tailspin in next week's episode?

I saw the episode summary in the Radio Times and the MW project sprang to mind. I found myself thinking 'What have we done to him?!' [Ultra confused]

There was a silly piece in there saying that maybe it'd benefit from canned laughter or more obvious jokes. Daft idea - one of the joys is the subtlety. The Archdeacon wouldn't be half as good a character if each of his remarks was punctuated by an audience reaction. The quiet simplicity and chance to recognise the familiar is one of its strengths.
 
Posted by Adrienne (# 2334) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Chapelhead:
... why do I feel that the boundary between reality and fantasy is getting ever thinner?

Indeed - yesterday I almost called our very own churchyard resident 'Colin'.

I'm loving it - best programme for ages - compulsive yet occasionally almost unbearable to watch!

A
 
Posted by dorothea (# 4398) on :
 
Hazey Jane wrote:
quote:
I saw the episode summary in the Radio Times and the MW project sprang to mind. I found myself thinking 'What have we done to him?!' [Ultra confused]

There was a silly piece in there saying that maybe it'd benefit from canned laughter or more obvious jokes. Daft idea - one of the joys is the subtlety. The Archdeacon wouldn't be half as good a character if each of his remarks was punctuated by an audience reaction. The quiet simplicity and chance to recognise the familiar is one of its strengths.

Couldn't agree more.

J
 
Posted by Ferijen (# 4719) on :
 
Caught up on this yesterday. The loneliness scene in the pub really got me...

But birettas are designed for comedy, don't you think? [Two face]
 
Posted by Rev per Minute (# 69) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by kingsfold:
I'm another one who is thoroughly enjoying the series.

If nothing else, it's given a number of us nice shiny new sigs! [Big Grin]

I'm resisting the urge to make mine

"I've been baptised AND lobotomised"

but I'm resisting manfully [Roll Eyes]

There's a BBC blog/interview with Olivia Coleman from before the series was launched. She said that the original title was 'Handle with Prayer' [Ultra confused] so the change to 'Rev.' was a definite improvement. I did feel quite sad at the end of Monday's episode, with Adam still trying to come to terms with the loneliness of his office.

And why does Adam walk so oddly in a cassock? I know the actor might not be used to it, but he walks like a duck kicking the 'skirt' every time he moves!
 
Posted by Thurible (# 3206) on :
 
It's too long and too heavy (the cassock, I mean).

Thurible
 
Posted by Spike (# 36) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Rev per Minute:
And why does Adam walk so oddly in a cassock? I know the actor might not be used to it, but he walks like a duck kicking the 'skirt' every time he moves!

I think it's the way he walks normally rather than just in a cassock. He walked in the same manner when he played Cal in The Thick of It
 
Posted by kingsfold (# 1726) on :
 
quote:
posted by Spike:
I think it's the way he walks normally rather than just in a cassock.

Agreed. That's also how he walked in Pride & Prejudice - I was particularly reminded of the scene when he stalked away in a huff after Lizzie turned down his proposal.

[ 29. July 2010, 14:00: Message edited by: kingsfold ]
 
Posted by Chapelhead (# 21) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Hazey*Jane:
I saw the episode summary in the Radio Times and the MW project sprang to mind. I found myself thinking 'What have we done to him?!' [Ultra confused]

There was a silly piece in there saying that maybe it'd benefit from canned laughter or more obvious jokes. Daft idea - one of the joys is the subtlety.

What does she want, 'Last of the summer wine'?

Some of Alison Graham's articles are very good - when she writes on the use of violence against women as 'entertainment', for example, but in this case she is wronger than a wrong thing that's mistaken.
 
Posted by Schroedinger's cat (# 64) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Hazey*Jane:
There was a silly piece in there saying that maybe it'd benefit from canned laughter or more obvious jokes.

No comedy programs are actually improved by either of these. Canned laughter is always a bad idea.
 
Posted by Angloid (# 159) on :
 
I can't say that I've ever consciously noticed the lack of canned laughter, in this or any other programme. But one of the irritating things about Summer Wine is just that.
 
Posted by Saviour Tortoise (# 4660) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Angloid:
I can't say that I've ever consciously noticed the lack of canned laughter, in this or any other programme. But one of the irritating things about Summer Wine is just that.

M*A*S*H is a classic series which has been broadcast both with and without the laughter track. The version with is pretty awful!
 
Posted by Miss Madrigal (# 15528) on :
 
As M*A*S*H was shown in the UK without a laugh track, I was really thrown when I saw it in the US for the first time - it really distracted from the subtlety and quality of the writing and performance. I am glad that we are allowed to approach both in Rev without such a barrier.

Back to the thread ... I may be starting to fall in love, ever so slightly, with the Reverend Smallbone. Watching him fight to follow his calling and his moral compass in the face of the difficulties that beset him and seeing him always trying to do the right and Christ-like thing, makes me wish that I were the one that he'd chosen as his companion rather than Alex. Funnily enough though, my suitors have always had more of the AD about them. Ho hum.
 
Posted by Ancient Mariner (# 4) on :
 
We had suspected it for a while, now we have proof.

James Wood, writer of Rev, told us today that Ship of Fools inspired '...the final (and best) episode of Rev next week featuring Adam having a crisis of faith entirely sparked by a bad review of his sermon he gets on an irreverent Christian website we called Godslot!'

[Cool]

[ 01. August 2010, 21:31: Message edited by: Ancient Mariner ]
 
Posted by Loveheart (# 12249) on :
 
Thats cool, Ancient Mariner! [Yipee]

Personally I am developing a soft spot for Nigel, which frankly I find very perturbing! [Ultra confused]
 
Posted by Chapelhead (# 21) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Ancient Mariner:
James Wood, writer of Rev, told us today that Ship of Fools inspired the '...the final (and best) episode of Rev next week featuring Adam having a crisis of faith entirely sparked by a bad review of his sermon he gets on a irreverent Christian website we called Godslot!'

So now we need life to imitate art by having someone MW a service at St Leonard's, Shoreditch (where the series is filmed). Then we can wake up and discover we are butterflies dreaming we are people, or like the Oozlum bird, fly in ever decreasing circles until we disappear up...

[ 01. August 2010, 21:32: Message edited by: Ancient Mariner ]
 
Posted by Alex Cockell (# 7487) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Ancient Mariner:
We had suspected it for a while, now we have proof.

James Wood, writer of Rev, told us today that Ship of Fools inspired the series, to the extent that '...the final (and best) episode of Rev next week features Adam having a crisis of faith entirely sparked by a bad review of his sermon he gets on a irreverent Christian website we called Godslot!'

[Cool]

YES!
[Killing me] [Overused] [Angel]

OK - so that's Radio 2 around Kitschmas... MW for Rev... weren't some shippies on Songs of Praise at some point?
 
Posted by angelica37 (# 8478) on :
 
perhaps mystery worshipping could expand to other BBC programmes? I'd love to read a report from Ambridge...
 
Posted by Baptist Trainfan (# 15128) on :
 
... Walmington-on-Sea ...
 
Posted by leo (# 1458) on :
 
Coronation Street.
 
Posted by St. Stephen the Stoned (# 9841) on :
 
..or East Enders?
 
Posted by Ancient Mariner (# 4) on :
 
Simon's blog on Rev here.
 
Posted by Panda (# 2951) on :
 
Is next week the last episode? That seems a short run.
 
Posted by Gracious rebel (# 3523) on :
 
That makes six episodes. A fairly typical first series I would have thought.

Lets hope there is a series two.
 
Posted by ToujoursDan (# 10578) on :
 
Even though it was presented as a comedic faux-pas, the Vicar's description of the Bible was brilliant.

From this side of the pond, the whole association between using a thurible and biretta and going to Rome was rather amusing, given that both are common in my Episcopal Diocese. No one would associate them with necessarily Roman leanings.
 
Posted by Sparrow (# 2458) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by angelica37:
perhaps mystery worshipping could expand to other BBC programmes? I'd love to read a report from Ambridge...

Or Dibley?
 
Posted by Baptist Trainfan (# 15128) on :
 
That would be far too obvious, although it could be fun trying to describe a typical Dibley service in suitably measured MW tones. The choirmaster (before he took holy orders and ended up in London Diocese, of course) would certainly be marked down as a "distraction".

There must be many church services described in literature which would make interesting subjects for MW reports ... How would one mark the Rector's preaching in "Lark Rise to Candleford", for instance? I can't think of any nonconformist ones, though, except for a dreadful one in "How Green Was My Valley".
 
Posted by Angloid (# 159) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by ToujoursDan:

From this side of the pond, the whole association between using a thurible and biretta and going to Rome was rather amusing, given that both are common in my Episcopal Diocese. No one would associate them with necessarily Roman leanings.

As several of us have already remarked on this thread. They are both common in London diocese too, and I would guess less so in the parallel (Westminster) RC diocese. (Birettas at any rate)
 
Posted by Auntie Doris (# 9433) on :
 
It would seem that James Wood is also making an appearance at Greenbelt. Looks like it will be worth going to see.

Auntie Doris x
 
Posted by RadicalWhig (# 13190) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Baptist Trainfan:
There must be many church services described in literature which would make interesting subjects for MW reports [...] I can't think of any nonconformist ones, though.

What about the fierce fundamentalist service in Cold Comfort Farm? That would be a cracker!
 
Posted by Alex Cockell (# 7487) on :
 
Or any of the services from Oranges are not the only fruit?
 
Posted by rufiki (# 11165) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Ancient Mariner:
...an irreverent Christian website we called Godslot!'

[Cool]

Hoping that Darren comes back to say it's not a Christian website [Big Grin]

[ 30. July 2010, 19:05: Message edited by: rufiki ]
 
Posted by RadicalWhig (# 13190) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Alex Cockell:
Or any of the services from Oranges are not the only fruit?

Yeah. What was that with the animal masks? I didn't understand that at all.
 
Posted by Alex Cockell (# 7487) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by RadicalWhig:
quote:
Originally posted by Alex Cockell:
Or any of the services from Oranges are not the only fruit?

Yeah. What was that with the animal masks? I didn't understand that at all.
Start of episode 2 wasn't it? Lemme replay my DVD and I'll see if I can garner it...
 
Posted by Emma Louise (# 3571) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Auntie Doris:
It would seem that James Wood is also making an appearance at Greenbelt. Looks like it will be worth going to see.

Auntie Doris x

We will SO be there! That and jars of clay and Stanley Haweras and it looks like I've actually got stuff I want to go see this year [Smile]
 
Posted by Yangtze (# 4965) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Chapelhead:
[QUOTE]So now we need life to imitate art by having someone MW a service at St Leonard's, Shoreditch (where the series is filmed). Then we can wake up and discover we are butterflies dreaming we are people, or like the Oozlum bird, fly in ever decreasing circles until we disappear up...

Well.....I was planning a trip to Columbia Road, which is just round the corner from St Leonard's, on Sunday anyway.....
 
Posted by leo (# 1458) on :
 
Just caught up with the last episode.

The loneliness and feeling of being a 'loser' is very true to the experience of many priests that I have known well.

The sexual inexperience portrayed is less true. Most priests under 50 are likely to have played the field before they got married - they just tend not to boast about it.
 
Posted by Ricardus (# 8757) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by RadicalWhig:
quote:
Originally posted by Baptist Trainfan:
There must be many church services described in literature which would make interesting subjects for MW reports [...] I can't think of any nonconformist ones, though.

What about the fierce fundamentalist service in Cold Comfort Farm? That would be a cracker!
Or the whaling sermon at the beginning of Moby Dick?

(I remember at the time finding it one of the most powerful parts of the book. In hindsight, though, I can't remember a thing about it ...)
 
Posted by Zappa (# 8433) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by leo:
Most priests under 50 are likely to have played the field before they got married - they just tend not to boast about it.

Well didn't I miss out on the fun then.
[Waterworks]
 
Posted by Roseofsharon (# 9657) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by leo:
The sexual inexperience portrayed is less true.

I didn't get the impression that Adan was necessarily inexperienced, nor that he was unaware, or unhappy, that Alex had a previous sexual history - just that his feeling of inadequacy (lack of babies, height, social success) were intensified by the thought of Alex's adventurous coupling with whateverhisnamewas.

Can't have been much fun having that picture planted in his head [Eek!]
 
Posted by Ancient Mariner (# 4) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Zappa:
quote:
Originally posted by leo:
Most priests under 50 are likely to have played the field before they got married - they just tend not to boast about it.

Well didn't I miss out on the fun then.
[Waterworks]

... and visits to the clinic.
 
Posted by Schroedinger's cat (# 64) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Roseofsharon:
quote:
Originally posted by leo:
The sexual inexperience portrayed is less true.

I didn't get the impression that Adan was necessarily inexperienced, nor that he was unaware, or unhappy, that Alex had a previous sexual history - just that his feeling of inadequacy (lack of babies, height, social success) were intensified by the thought of Alex's adventurous coupling with whateverhisnamewas.

Can't have been much fun having that picture planted in his head [Eek!]

I would agree - he did say that he knew and expected that Alex had a sexual history, but he would rather not know about it, or meet the other people responsible for it.

And in the context of the loneliness theme, I think it was just enhancing Adams sense of loneliness.
 
Posted by pete173 (# 4622) on :
 
An alternative view from someone who looks after clergy working precisely in those circumstances that Rev claims to portray.

Unfunny because it reflects wet liberal angst. Most of our clergy are missional, heroic and vibrantly full of faith.

A bit what you expect from some of the clergy who whinge in private and talk behind their hands at chapter meetings. They espouse a "glass half empty" view of the CofE. They've never actually met an Archdeacon like that, but they like to pretend that that's how we all are.

Yes, the lay people in the series inhabit every inner city parish that I've ever worked in, but they aren't the norm.

And the series is full of cheap shots (HTB plants in Stepney just aren't like that; most parishes worked out years ago how they relate to issues of hospitality with Muslims; you'd never appoint a wet country parish vicar to a parish like that). But don't let the reality get in the way of fantasies...

The pity of it is that it reinforces Dibley. "The CofE is lovable and wonderfully accepting of everybody. But it also doesn't believe anything, wouldn't be worth joining, and has no relevance to real life."

And it certainly doesn't have a life-changing, radical message about the Kingdom of God.

Rev just feels like the jaundiced maundering of a few of our sadder clergy sniggering behind the bike sheds and needing to get a life. But clearly I'm in a minority on this!
 
Posted by Boogie (# 13538) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by pete173:


And it certainly doesn't have a life-changing, radical message about the Kingdom of God.

Is that its purpose?
 
Posted by Schroedinger's cat (# 64) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by pete173:
The pity of it is that it reinforces Dibley. "The CofE is lovable and wonderfully accepting of everybody. But it also doesn't believe anything, wouldn't be worth joining, and has no relevance to real life."

And it certainly doesn't have a life-changing, radical message about the Kingdom of God.

While I accept your comments about the speed that some of the changes, that is the nature of a series, that time is often compressed, but the above I do not agree with. I think he series has shown that the rev at least does believe in something, and is trying very hard to live that out in very difficult circumstances. In the first episode, the real challenges of using his influence just for the churches financial gain, or staying true to his understanding of his faith were clearly brought out, and very well, I think. In Dibley, she would have given in ( especially if the MP was good looking ).

And in the last one on loneliness, the reality that people who seem to be busy, active, and the centre of a social life may be very lonely in reality, and the truth that the Rev had a community of people around him, who were his real friends ( even though they were parishoners ), was excellent.

It is not everything, but I think it shows Adam struggling to make the "life-changing, radical message" a reality in the environment that he is in. And so makes it not just a nice set of words, but something practical and real. And that is what I like about it.

It is not Dibley, or Dibley-lite. The characters are all over-done, of course, but teh stories and the messages are about relating the Christian message to reality.

[ 01. August 2010, 15:31: Message edited by: Schroedinger's cat ]
 
Posted by Miss Madrigal (# 15528) on :
 
Quite so, Schroedinger's cat, most of the comedy and pathos comes from the fact that someone did appoint a wet country parish vicar to a parish like that, not to mention that it reflects wet liberal angst. There would be little room for exploration of character if the central protagonist was building upon a foundation of rock-solid faith in a thriving church that presented them no challenges.
 
Posted by Spike (# 36) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by pete173:
[Waterworks] [Waterworks] [Waterworks]

The IT Crowd is unfunny as it portrays people who work in IT as being geeks who cannot form relationships when many IT professionals are not like that at all.

Fawlty Towers is unfunny because it portrays a manic hotelier with no people skills whatsoever when many hoteliers are charming people.

Til Death Us Do Part is unfunny because it portrays a bigoted working class racist when many working class people aren't racist at all.

Rev is a comedy show. Lighten up!
 
Posted by Chorister (# 473) on :
 
Pete, I'd love to see you playing a cameo part as the visiting Bishop. Perhaps you'd get a chance to air some of these views in person! [Big Grin]
 
Posted by RadicalWhig (# 13190) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Spike:
]The IT Crowd is unfunny

The fourth series really wasunfunny. Such a disappointment.

Pete's comments about Rev are really depressing. It's almost as if his approach to religion admits of no humour, no criticism and no self-mockery. Personally, I think Rev provides a very positive and encouraging view of the CofE - almost as if there really was a point to it all (other than just as a preservation society for nice buildings, old rituals, and cake - which as we know, its its true divine mission).
 
Posted by BroJames (# 9636) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Boogie:
quote:
Originally posted by pete173:


And it certainly doesn't have a life-changing, radical message about the Kingdom of God.

Is that its purpose?
I think Pete meant the series doesn't portray the C of E as having a life-changing, radical message… , and I do think that is (part of) the C of E's purpose. Clearly I wouldn't expect the comedy to have that purpose.

I confess to mixed feelings about Rev. There are some things which are there for the comedy - which simply wouldn't happen in real life in quite that way*, and I'm not quite sure that I'm really happy with the overall take on the C of E which I am getting from the series. ISTM the message is "maybe loveable, but a bit sad and hopeless". I'm sure that it would be possible to do comedy with a rather different tone to it.
(*E.g., the mechanics of the school places question, the role of the archdeacon - and ISTM his odd understanding of the 'hierarchy')
 
Posted by pete173 (# 4622) on :
 
Well, the reason I find it unfunny is that I find it unfunny. Humour is like that. It's personal. So it's OK not to laugh at stuff that other people find hilarious. It's less appalling than a lot of what passes for humour on the TV, which often depends on cruelty and mockery, but that's another discussion. I leave it to those who know me in real life to tell you whether I have no sense of humour!

The point I'm making about Rev is that it plays into the generally depressing portrayal of the Christian faith as contentless but nice humanism with a nod to a God who's probably absent, and of the Church as a bunch of shambolic and witless wets who couldn't organise the proverbial in the brewery. The clergy who "advised" on it may have got the vestments right, but they sure as anything didn't help the series depict the CofE in urban London that I know and love.

Of course it's a comedy - but it's just one more pointless nail in the coffin of credibility for a faith that is transformative and dynamic. I have to watch it every week in order to keep in touch with what's being said. But it gives me no pleasure.
 
Posted by Amos (# 44) on :
 
Well, if there's another series maybe it will include some of the comical clerical antics in the Willesden area. Ruislip is a hotbed of them I'm told.

[ 01. August 2010, 18:08: Message edited by: Amos ]
 
Posted by Zappa (# 8433) on :
 
[Hostly biretta waving]

Sniff ... sniff. is this the faintest aroma of deep seriousness I detect?

quote:
... creativity, comedy and random questions. A blessed state of e-being, free from weeping and gnashing of teeth, where the cup of absurdity runneth over
While Heaven is not ipso facto devoid of intellect (I hope) perhaps the serious theo-socio-harmitiological undertones belong elsewhere.

Find the fluff, desist the weeping and gnashing, or perhaps we will all go down for deeper debates in the realm of indulgences.

REV ZAPPA, twitching benignly
[/Hostly biretta waving]

 
Posted by leo (# 1458) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by pete173:
An alternative view from someone who looks after clergy working precisely in those circumstances that Rev claims to portray.

Unfunny because it reflects wet liberal angst. Most of our clergy are missional, heroic and vibrantly full of faith.

I think you are being a bit hard on this issue. Granted that you seem to be one of the more pastoral bishops, it is still the case that the clergy you meet will see you as their 'boss', or at least a representing your diocesan. So they may not tell you about their loneliness and doubts.

I am not being rude but simply pointing out that the role of bishop as it has become makes it harder for a bishop to be perceived as the pastor s/he is meant to be.
 
Posted by Angloid (# 159) on :
 
I wonder if a serious discussion about fluffy vicars would slip under the hostly radar? If not exactly fluffy, Adam is not the kind of priest we want to have: vague, liberal, well-meaning but hesitant to state what he really believes, because he probably doesn't believe very much at all. Or so Pete173 thinks.

Humour, as he says, is a personal thing so there's no reason why he should necessarily find Rev funny. But as a bishop, has he never encountered priests like this? Priests who struggle with doubts, and nevertheless believe that they are meant to keep the flame of faith alive; who are aware of the dangers of priestly authority; who recoil from the slick certainties of more doctrinaire members of the church; who somehow believe they are called to live alongside the outcast and poor and through them recognise their own vulnerability...

Are they a bad advertisement for the modern, confident, assertively evangelical Church of England? I doubt it. I think that more people who have watched this series will think again about the role of the church in our society, than ever did after the Vicar of Dibley, or will do in a month of Sundays of tele-evangelism. In a media-driven, image-conscious world, it's surely refreshing to see a portrayal of someone who is not driven by the need to put on a good face, or give a convincing presentation. Someone who is honest to God, in other words.
 
Posted by Amos (# 44) on :
 
Oooooh! Angloid said 'Honest to God!' I'm telling!
 
Posted by Angloid (# 159) on :
 
[Killing me]

(This has landed at the top of the page! Referring to Amos's post.)

[ 01. August 2010, 22:49: Message edited by: Angloid ]
 
Posted by Ancient Mariner (# 4) on :
 
Ship interviews writer Rev writer James Wood here.

Last episode on BBC 2 tonight (Mon 2 Aug) 10pm when Adam receives a bad review from the Mystery Worshipper.
 
Posted by Gill H (# 68) on :
 
Life is starting to reflect art. Yesterday we were approached on the street by a guy asking for money, and he looked the absolute image of the guy who always comes to Adam. He didn't actually say "Y'see, what it is, yeah" but it was pretty close.
 
Posted by Snags (# 15351) on :
 
<Tangent>

quote:
Originally posted by RadicalWhig:
quote:
Originally posted by Spike:
]The IT Crowd is unfunny

The fourth series really wasunfunny. Such a disappointment.
i tend to agree, although it did have flashes of brilliance - the start of "Bad Boys" when Roy's depressed about "Can you turn it off and on again", then sees the state of Jen's laptop, and Jen's attitude to it all, was excellent. But overall, those moments have been much sparser.

</Tangent>
 
Posted by amber. (# 11142) on :
 
I absolutely love the series. I'd rather go to a vicar who is genuinely 'human' and puzzled and bit lonely at times and struggling with this and that than one who is trying to act like a faith-salesman/woman filled with radical ideas about things. A personal choice, of course.

I think for most people, life isn't radicalised and they don't really want it to be. I'm ever minded of the big Evangelical conference I attended which was there to rave about our amazing new 'take' on faith...and the only people at it were fit, healthy, smiley white folk of the same class and age group and identikit dress code. About as radical in reality as giving loo roll a different name.

Most of society are just bloody desperate to feel loved and included - to feel as if they have something to give to God, and by gum that man (albeit fictional) knows how to make the marginalised and tired and worn down in his parish feel loved and included and accepted and wanted for who they are. There they are, taking part in that church, loving being in it, giving back to him and to God. Brilliant, just brilliant in its simplicity and quiet message. And very funny in parts, too.
 
Posted by Gill H (# 68) on :
 
I have to admit, I've had recent experience of a very Rev-esque church. Perhaps some of them are just better at hiding their messiness when someone in authority turns up (rather like the Queen thinking everywhere smells of paint...)

Apparently there were objections to 'Dad's Army' when it first ran, because people saw it as disrespectful to the Home Guard. And yet (to me anyway) it leaves me with a profound respect for what these ordinary, totally unqualified but brave people were trying to do, in the best way they knew. Perhaps there's a comparison there.
 
Posted by Angloid (# 159) on :
 
+Pete's view is not shared by all his episcopal colleagues.
 
Posted by +Chad (# 5645) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Amos:
Oooooh! Angloid said 'Honest to God!' I'm telling!

South Bank Religion, Father? For shame! [Biased]
 
Posted by RadicalWhig (# 13190) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Angloid:
..vague, liberal, well-meaning but hesitant to state what he really believes, because he probably doesn't believe very much at all [...] and nevertheless believe that they are meant to keep the flame of faith alive; who are aware of the dangers of priestly authority; who recoil from the slick certainties of more doctrinaire members of the church; who somehow believe they are called to live alongside the outcast and poor and through them recognise their own vulnerability. [...] not driven by the need to put on a good face, or give a convincing presentation. Someone who is honest to God, in other words.

I wish there were more like this. To me, that's convincing, not the doctrinal certainties of the evangelical or catholic parties.

ETA: In fact, it's almost an "employee profile" for a good clergyman.

[ 02. August 2010, 12:00: Message edited by: RadicalWhig ]
 
Posted by Zacchaeus (# 14454) on :
 
I suppose Adam is a charicature but like all charicatures it is based on truth.

I see the series as definitely coming from Adam point of view, it is how his mind sees his life at this moment in time. And I have met more that one idealist, unassertive young(ish) christian driven to being Adam by getting ordained and taking on the relentless demands of urban life. Self doubt, wondering what their theological training was all about, working their socks off for their parish an so on.

But his relationship with God seems to be one of the things that sustains him.

I have met archdeacons who, when viewed from a certain angle, could be seen as being like this one. An angle which Adam is looking from, doubting feeling threatened unsure of themselves in new territory. Of course when viewed form another angle they may be totally different but this is Adam's view we can see, as a hesistant new boy.
 
Posted by Robert Armin (# 182) on :
 
I've only just seen last week's episode (in time to catch tonight's) and thought it was the best yet. Adam's loneliness, the honesty of his praying, his desire to help others and the way he gets hurt as a result - all of these were deeply moving and wryly funny. As for Pete's comment:
quote:
Unfunny because it reflects wet liberal angst. Most of our clergy are missional, heroic and vibrantly full of faith.
I find it hard to disagree more. I know clergy of every description - high, low and middling - who struggle with the same issues Adam faces. I also know clergy of every stripe who hide their problems, pretend everything is great and succesful, and give a vibrant facade. My suspicion (as a "wet liberal") is that it is the first group who really transform lives, while the second help people pretend.
 
Posted by Schroedinger's cat (# 64) on :
 
Pete - I do appreciate your views, and you probably have a point, that it does not reflect the entire church across the area. But I recognise the church situations, the empty churches, the doubts, the struggles, from my time in East London. So for some of those in the pews, this is the reality that we see.

I still think that it shows a true picture of the church in urban areas, even if not the true picture, which is a bit of both views. In a drama/comedy series, the whole big complex picture of the church even in a small area cannot be shown. I don't even think that anyone knows that picture.

For me, Rev shows some of the struggles of making the faith actually work. I find that a really useful and helpful think to watch. And I think it does show the church in a good light - of people who don't know the answers, but are trying to find them.

IMO!!
 
Posted by Chapelhead (# 21) on :
 
To my mind Adam is a hero. He is a hero because he is prepared to walk alongside the outcast and rejected, and he does so in spite of his own weakness and also because of it. He doesn’t have blind certainty that convinces him of the rightness of his belief and his God. He has doubts and insecurities, and he is tempted and fails. But he is still there. He has no arrogant pride; he is prepared to ‘feel the fear and do it anyway’ and that is courage.

The Archdeacon is also no pantomime villain. He pushes Adam and makes him strive for more, and he would rather there were more ‘Darrens’ in the church, with big congregations bringing in more money. But, when push comes to shove, he also knows that Adam has his own integrity. He doesn’t dismiss Adam as a worthless, wet liberal. He respects Adam for who Adam is. His pastoring may be uncomfortable, but he is pastoral – I’ve known worse Archdeacons and Bishops.

And I know which of these Priests I’d want as my Vicar.
 
Posted by dj_ordinaire (# 4643) on :
 
Oh. My. God.

It's us! [Ultra confused]
 
Posted by Avila (# 15541) on :
 
'Can you prove you are a vicar?'

I have wondered about this for a while, particularly when we would encourge folk to check id of people calling on them. Some kind of photo id card from ordaining church?? After all the uniform and business cards can be got by anyone.

ETA - correct typo

[ 02. August 2010, 21:17: Message edited by: Avila ]
 
Posted by daisymay (# 1480) on :
 
He ended up losing faith, boozing, getting MW citicism, other criticism also, and being miserable - and then prayed well for an elderly woman dying, having restated his ordaining words to the policeman and was helpful to her and seemed to feel better then - IMO a useful way of finishing and showing his real usefulness and kindness...
 
Posted by Benny Diction 2 (# 14159) on :
 
I was frightened by the part where he was watching Bargain Hunt at lunchtime. That's just what this minister does!

Brilliant way to end an excellent series.
 
Posted by Angloid (# 159) on :
 
Not much in the way of laughs but I had tears in my eyes at the end. This series should be compulsory viewing for every ordination course and theological college.
 
Posted by Amos (# 44) on :
 
Absolutely. And for every ordination retreat. Perhaps even for the lock-in at the House of Bishops.

Seriously, I never thought I'd see anything so funny and so seriously religious on TV. Ever.

[ 02. August 2010, 21:55: Message edited by: Amos ]
 
Posted by Chapelhead (# 21) on :
 
Absolutely, Angloid.

And there was at least one line that would make an excellent SOF sig. [Biased]
 
Posted by Ancient Mariner (# 4) on :
 
That final episode - I cannot remember a better religious TV drama. Excruciating, pathetic and yet redemptive without a single hint of cloying sentiment. If you missed it, think of the last two minutes of Blackadder Goes Forth and stir in Isaiah 6:8.

[Votive]
 
Posted by The Weeder (# 11321) on :
 
I had given up on it and only watched because of the Mystery Worshipper theme, having been 'done' myself.
But this episode redeemed it for me. I hope there is another series.

[ 02. August 2010, 22:22: Message edited by: The Weeder ]
 
Posted by The Royal Spaniel (# 40) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Gill H:
I have to admit, I've had recent experience of a very Rev-esque church. Perhaps some of them are just better at hiding their messiness when someone in authority turns up (rather like the Queen thinking everywhere smells of paint...)

Apparently there were objections to 'Dad's Army' when it first ran, because people saw it as disrespectful to the Home Guard. And yet (to me anyway) it leaves me with a profound respect for what these ordinary, totally unqualified but brave people were trying to do, in the best way they knew. Perhaps there's a comparison there.

Leesten very care-ful-ly I will say zeese only once...... [Smile]

There were quite a few complaints IIRC about 'Allo! 'Allo! because its setting ( occupied France) when it first came out
 
Posted by Cadfael (# 11066) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Angloid:
Not much in the way of laughs but I had tears in my eyes at the end. This series should be compulsory viewing for every ordination course and theological college.

I'm at the end of the first year of my course, and have to agree. So important to see the calling in the moments when it really matters, and to envisage how a broken, messed up, ordinary person (like me) could still make a difference.

Also, I'm amazed at the serious and reflective trajectory across the series - what an engaging and inspiring work. The only trouble is, I can't imagine how it could now return as a comedy - it's shown it's hand as something more serious, honest and heartbreaking.

Anyway...

Um...

Err...

...Here am I; send me.

[Tear]

[edited for clarity]

[ 02. August 2010, 23:00: Message edited by: Cadfael ]
 
Posted by Chapelhead (# 21) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Cadfael:

Anyway...

Um...

Err...

...Here am I; send me.

[Tear]


Perhaps there should be a new version of 'I, the Lord of sea and sky' for ordination services...

Here I 'um', Lord

[ 03. August 2010, 06:30: Message edited by: Chapelhead ]
 
Posted by Tyler Durden (# 2996) on :
 
Amazed there's not more chatter on here: last night's episode afaic was AMAZING. Yes the end was worthy of the last episode of Blackadder 4 but contrary to what someone else said above, I (and my church warden who watched it with me) thought it was LOL hilarious from start to finish: some great lines and (another comparison with true greatness) the sequence where he was moving in on the head teacher at the party with his comedy moustache dangling off reminded me of Peter Sellers doing Clouseau (I can give no higher compliment).

So, I think Tom Hollander is a great comic actor (I already did having seen In the Loop but more so now) and the fact that he could spin on a dime and give that incredibly moving performance at the end blew me away. It's also a tribute to the writing of course but wasn't that a great dramatic moment?

Which leads me to +Pete's point which I am now going to take to purg...
 
Posted by wilson (# 37) on :
 
Quite sad and very funny (oh my word - the dancing!) a fitting end to the first season.

I've been thinking about why Pete thinks it's not a very flattering picture of the CofE. Someone cleverer than me said that great sitcoms, certainly great British sitcoms, are usually about characters that are trapped in a situation. Adam is "trapped" by choice - a choice he almost rejects and yet finally re-affirms in last night's episode - in a situation that is frustrating, difficult, thankless and seems all but pointless much of the time. We warm to Adam because he's a nice guy trying to the right thing and because we sympathise with him.

But the situation he's in that's trapping him is the Church of England (as portrayed not necessarily as she really is) - and I'm no more attracted to that than I am to want to share Blackadder's trench.

I'd go for a beer with Adam but I'm not sure St Saviour's would tempt me back to church.
 
Posted by Alex Cockell (# 7487) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by dj_ordinaire:
Oh. My. God.

It's us! [Ultra confused]

Just rewatching it - you're right! It's our copy!

[Killing me]
 
Posted by angelica37 (# 8478) on :
 
I'm not sure whether I liked the last episode or not, there was a bit too much of the F word and I didn't like Adam's treatment of Alex and the headteacher. That didn't seem true to the character, even going through a crisis of faith I'd have expected his love for Alex and innate good manners to have stayed with him.
 
Posted by Earwig (# 12057) on :
 
I laughed through the whole series, but the Isaiah 6:8 bit? That had me in tears. [Tear]

[ 03. August 2010, 08:17: Message edited by: Earwig ]
 
Posted by Chapelhead (# 21) on :
 
I loved Nigel's party outfit.
 
Posted by St Everild (# 3626) on :
 
Last nights episode was a bit too close to home...and therefore was brilliant. Held a light up to stuff. Brought me to tears.

I can't see there being another series - where could you go from there? But I want another series...
 
Posted by Hazey*Jane (# 8754) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by angelica37:
I'm not sure whether I liked the last episode or not, there was a bit too much of the F word and I didn't like Adam's treatment of Alex and the headteacher. That didn't seem true to the character, even going through a crisis of faith I'd have expected his love for Alex and innate good manners to have stayed with him.

I enjoyed the episode but I do agree with you. While the sitting at home in dejection bits seemed 'real', some of his other reactions seemed unlikely. Drunkenly trying to flirt with Ellie was one thing, but I found it hard to believe that he would have tried to invite her out to lunch while stone cold sober. And even if he was mad enough to think that the Tarts and Vicars party was a good idea, I don't think Ellie and Nigel would really have pursued the idea (although my goodness, didn't Nigel embrace the tat?) Given that the rest of the series has been so quietly honest about people and their real strengths and weaknesses, it did feel a little overblown and heading into Dibley slapstick territory.

I suppose the truth is that many a meltdown, personal or spiritual, has far more mundane manifestations that would be rather dull to portray in either a drama or comedy. So I guess there needed to be some 'big' moments. Fortunately there were still enough of the gentle touches to redeem it - his extended 'Why?' prayer in the church, Alex's comment about Adam believing in God but being unsure that God believed in him, and the recollection of his ordination and attendance to duty even when he was still in a lot of conflict being the most touching.

Overall, the last episode wasn't perfect, but I've loved the series, and it's been such a relief to see a portrayal of Christianity that is honest about the flaws of both people and institutions, but not in a derogatory way.
 
Posted by Arrietty (# 45) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by angelica37:
I'm not sure whether I liked the last episode or not, there was a bit too much of the F word and I didn't like Adam's treatment of Alex and the headteacher. That didn't seem true to the character, even going through a crisis of faith I'd have expected his love for Alex and innate good manners to have stayed with him.

People who are cracking up do all sorts of things that are out of character. It was also out of character for him to tell Colin not to come round to the vicarage any more.

Very brave to show clergy burnout in all its unglorious, gory detail.

I also thought the sub plot - where Colin proves to be better at impersonating a vicar than Adam is - was wonderfully subtle. [Big Grin]
 
Posted by MrsDoyle (# 13579) on :
 
Tangent Alert
Cadfael, I agree with you very much.
The other compulsary viewing for ordinands should be "A bed among the lentils" in Alan Bennets Talking Head series! Also usefull for the intended significant others of any priests to be.
 
Posted by Alex Cockell (# 7487) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by angelica37:
I'm not sure whether I liked the last episode or not, there was a bit too much of the F word and I didn't like Adam's treatment of Alex and the headteacher. That didn't seem true to the character, even going through a crisis of faith I'd have expected his love for Alex and innate good manners to have stayed with him.

Adam was VERY drunk by that point in the evening, and was seen to be mostly on shorts iirc. Almost drunk enough to risk being arrested for being Drunk And Disordeely, hence his initial reaction to the police.

If he was sober, your point would stand.

precedent for how pissed he gets was set in ep 1 and 5 ("swift one" then cut to table groaning with empties - I'd guess about 8 pints each and on 9th).
 
Posted by The Weeder (# 11321) on :
 
Did I miss a bit? I did not see him agonising over who had written the Mystery Worshipper report.

Was there a stranger in Church? Or is it Nigel or the Archdeacon?

[ 03. August 2010, 10:53: Message edited by: The Weeder ]
 
Posted by Hawk (# 14289) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by angelica37:
I'm not sure whether I liked the last episode or not, there was a bit too much of the F word and I didn't like Adam's treatment of Alex and the headteacher. That didn't seem true to the character, even going through a crisis of faith I'd have expected his love for Alex and innate good manners to have stayed with him.

Personally I really didn't like Alex's treatment of Adam. He was obviously going through a terrible time and she was just flippant, jokey and patronising up to the party. And then at the end when he was the worse for wear she had no sense of damage control, she just let him embarrass himself and then told him to fuck off. Surely she should have got him out of the party as soon as she could see where it was going (the Headmistress' warning) and helped him home. Pushing a drunk, self-destructive, crisis-ridden husband off into the night so she can continue a party stuck me as an incredibly selfish thing to do. And possibly inconsistent character-writing after last week's episode where she was saying she wanted to be his friend as well as his wife etc.

Her attitude stank IMO - she treated Adam's major crisis of faith as 'oh, well, here we go again'. Maybe she's got bored by his emotional problems after however long they've been married. Especially if it's a bi-annual thing as she says. But perhaps that's part of the problem - why this crisis hit so hard and why Adam feels so lonely. Alex just isn't there for him emotionally anymore. Perhaps if, instead of just standing across the room and making light of his problems, she sat down beside him and gave him a nice hug once or twice, his crisis wouldn't have been so bad.
 
Posted by amber. (# 11142) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Hawk:
quote:
Originally posted by angelica37:
...I didn't like Adam's treatment of Alex and the headteacher....

Personally I really didn't like Alex's treatment of Adam. ... Perhaps if, instead of just standing across the room and making light of his problems, she sat down beside him and gave him a nice hug once or twice, his crisis wouldn't have been so bad.
Glad it's not just me who was gobsmacked by Alex's attitude. I know she was trying to cope with him making a pass at the headmistress in later scenes, but even earlier she appeared to be belittling him at a time when he desperately needed a friend.
 
Posted by wilson (# 37) on :
 
Actually I think the Alex-Adam dynamic, and its problems, would be the perfect place to explore in season 2.

For example last night there was the implication that she is actually succeeding in helping people in her job. There's some tension there.

quote:
Originally posted by Hawk:
Her attitude stank IMO - she treated Adam's major crisis of faith as 'oh, well, here we go again'. Maybe she's got bored by his emotional problems after however long they've been married. Especially if it's a bi-annual thing as she says.

It's been left open but the hints are that she's not actual a believer herself. If that's the case then I think his crisis of faith - particularly if it's a regular event - could become pretty tiresome, especially if accompanied by the kind of childishness he showed here.

Also, despite being more naturalistic in many ways, there is more than a hint of that sitcom staple - the silly husband with the sensible wife who mothers him.
 
Posted by wilson (# 37) on :
 
Meant to add: not just tiresome per se, but tiresome because she can't fully empathise with it.
 
Posted by daisymay (# 1480) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Alex Cockell:
quote:
Originally posted by angelica37:
I'm not sure whether I liked the last episode or not, there was a bit too much of the F word and I didn't like Adam's treatment of Alex and the headteacher. That didn't seem true to the character, even going through a crisis of faith I'd have expected his love for Alex and innate good manners to have stayed with him.

Adam was VERY drunk by that point in the evening, and was seen to be mostly on shorts iirc. Almost drunk enough to risk being arrested for being Drunk And Disordeely, hence his initial reaction to the police.

If he was sober, your point would stand.

precedent for how pissed he gets was set in ep 1 and 5 ("swift one" then cut to table groaning with empties - I'd guess about 8 pints each and on 9th).

And he somehow seemed to be sober again when he went with the policeman and prayed for/with that woman...
 
Posted by Earwig (# 12057) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by daisymay:
[QUOTE]And he somehow seemed to be sober again when he went with the policeman and prayed for/with that woman...

ISTM that he the shock of it all sobered him up.
 
Posted by Alex Cockell (# 7487) on :
 
He had just got a Subway sandwich (probably a footlong) down him... so that mahy have helped soak up the booze a bit.
 
Posted by +Chad (# 5645) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Chapelhead:
.....there was at least one line that would make an excellent SOF sig. [Biased]

quote:
Who are these sad, green-ink losers, typing away in their underpants, sniping at people, without the guts to actually declare themselves?
or

quote:
A tiny clique of virtual god’s bods with nothing better to do.
Alex hit a couple of nails very firmly on the head.

Archdeacon Robert ('The Dark Lord') didn't like getting a taste of his own sarcastic medicine:
quote:
You have literally no idea how I spend my evenings.
But I have a sneaking feeling, as his character has developed, that he probably does something surprisingly worthwhile.

And I wonder, if there was a particular vicar on whom Colin based his impersonation.....

Adam's angst is too terrifyingly familiar, with that wonderfully clever line in the school assembly:
quote:
Jesus isn't always the answer to everything.
The final scene..... [Tear]

A brilliant end to the series, but I hope it's not the end of it all.
 
Posted by Sandemaniac (# 12829) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Alex Cockell:
He had just got a Subway sandwich (probably a footlong) down him... so that may have helped soak up the booze a bit.

Ah yes - Subway, the Cut-Me-Own-Throat Dibbler of the High Street. One of those would definitely cut through the booze!

AG
 
Posted by +Chad (# 5645) on :
 
I thought it was a kebab.
 
Posted by Simon (# 1) on :
 
Like others here, I was a bit moist eyed in the closing scenes of last night's episode. In my experience, it's rare for TV to get into the bone and marrow of religious faith, how it feels from the inside, and this was a pretty wonderful exception to all that.

When Adam turned and looked out into the darkness to remind himself of the words of Isaiah 6, I felt all sorts of things (including wistfulness at having turned down the chance to be a Rev myself once), but I also admired the architects of Rev for daring to do this with a comic character, even one who's gained such dramatic depth over the past few weeks.

I've written a bit more about it over here.
 
Posted by Old Hundredth (# 112) on :
 
Last night I went from laugh-out-loud (Nigel dancing with Adam) to the verge of tears (the scenes with the policeman and the dying woman).
 
Posted by wilson (# 37) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by +Chad:
I thought it was a kebab.

Me too.
 
Posted by Amos (# 44) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by wilson:
quote:
Originally posted by +Chad:
I thought it was a kebab.

Me too.
I did too.
 
Posted by Matt Black (# 2210) on :
 
Me too: the only kill-or-cure remedy for having drunk too much.

Although the last five minutes moved me, I thought it ended rather oddly and abruptly.
 
Posted by Robert Armin (# 182) on :
 
Last week's episode was great; this week's only so-so. Somehow Adam's depression didn't convince me, the "funny dance" was simply pantomime padding, the identity of the fake vicar was easy to guess, and it was predictable that Adam would do something good in the end. There were still some very good moments however - the two minute's silence, and Adam's prayers (as always) rang true.

Overall, I think the series has been very up and down. It has had brilliant incidents, as well as longeurs. Episode 5 (where Adam wants a friend) I found the most moving, Episode 2 (Adam's church gets taken over) the funniest.

ETA: Surely it was a kebab?

[ 03. August 2010, 16:46: Message edited by: Robert Armin ]
 
Posted by Enoch (# 14322) on :
 
quote:
Royal Spaniel said
There were quite a few complaints IIRC about 'Allo! 'Allo! because its setting ( occupied France) when it first came out

This probably makes me look very sad, but because of the subject matter, I've never watched that series.

quote:
Hawk said
Personally I really didn't like Alex's treatment of Adam. He was obviously going through a terrible time and she was just flippant, jokey and patronising up to the party. And then at the end when he was the worse for wear she had no sense of damage control .... etc ..

Sorry. No. I'm a bloke but even I think he was behaving appallingly towards her. Even if she didn't actually know he'd tried to invite Ellie out to lunch, he was visibly leering after her in the presence of Alex and lots of other people they knew. He was an embarrassment to be with and he was behaving as though he thought his own immediate angsts were more important than their matrimonial hearth.

quote:
Daisy May said
And he somehow seemed to be sober again when he went with the policeman and prayed for/with that woman...

Oddly, and I don't understand this, I can vouch that that happens. If it's really necessary you do sober up suddenly.

Not that I've had to do what Adam did. I'm not a rev.
 
Posted by Jante (# 9163) on :
 
quote:
Last night I went from laugh-out-loud (Nigel dancing with Adam) to the verge of tears (the scenes with the policeman and the dying woman).
Me too!
As someone heading for vicar factory I've gained so much from watching this 'comedy'.
 
Posted by mimsey (# 3757) on :
 
Look at this! Rev has brought me back from a 4 year absence from SoF, just to say how much I loved the series and hope there is another one. As the wife of a priest living in Suffolk (perhaps we're the next Adam and Alex?) I recognised so many aspects of the church I love, loathe and live in.

But who's +Pete calling a "wet rural vicar"?! Feeble clergy don't survive any longer out here in deepest darkest Suffolk than they do in the city, and I would get crosser, but this is Heaven.
 
Posted by +Chad (# 5645) on :
 
mimsey, you could always post here.
 
Posted by Tree Bee (# 4033) on :
 
Adam's dancing had me in tears of laughter. So much funnier than the ape like antics of Ricky Gervais. I loved this last episode though I was saddened that a critical MW report could have such an effect on a sincere but flawed vicar.

Alex's attitude IMO was wonderful. Her flippant, non judgemental attitude to Adam's wanking amazed me [Overused] . Her detachment from his behaviour is just what a wife needs to do when a husband breaks down.

Pete just may be too close to the subject matter to appreciate the comedy. I know that I cringe at any scene that takes place in a library as I can pick so many holes in the action.
 
Posted by ken (# 2460) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by daisymay:
And he somehow seemed to be sober again when he went with the policeman and prayed for/with that woman...

That's true-to-life. Many people act drunk and snap out of it when something urgent turns up.
(that still doesn't mean you should give them the car keys)
 
Posted by Schroedinger's cat (# 64) on :
 
Awesome. Probably he most intense exploration of a faith crisis I have ever seen.

Yes it was slightly overdone, as always,for dramatic and comedy effect. But not hugely. I think it indicated a real faith crisis, a complete crash and rejection of his "vicardom". OK, all too crushed in, but that's TV for you. All of the elements are what I experience on occasions, when I am having faith problems, and I know others experience in the same situation.

It was partly prompted by the bad review, which was quite strange to see, but that was just the focus of a crisis that has been coming for a while. He felt that, for all of his work, the one sermon that was picked up was rubbish, and it was just his luck that this was when he had been reviewed.

Adams crash, watching daytime tv (that is a clear indication of brain death), having a wank, and admitting it to Alex made sense - he wanted not to care, not to play a part anymore. His treatment of Alex was bad, but he was having a serious crisis (and it could have been a nervous breakdown), which explains (not justifies) it.

Adams admission of his feelings for the headmistress was good to get out in the open, and he almost wanted to have an affair, or at least try it.

Alex's treatment of Adam was harsh, probably not helped by the fact that they were both drunk. And She was probably fed up with his crises, and working hard so not really wanting to have to deal with one.

And the final scene - just out of this world. It could have ended with a complete loss of faith, being the last of the series. As it was, Adam re-affirmed his own ordination - sort of a re-ordination - before embracing what he was good at.
 
Posted by Angloid (# 159) on :
 
It was one of the few happy endings that didn't make me puke.
 
Posted by Orlando098 (# 14930) on :
 
Liked it, especially the last one. Though I did think the vicar's job seemed to involve a rather inordinate amount of time hanging out with Colin (and I found his catchphrase of calling Adam 'Vicarage' a bit odd), and I agree with people who said maybe it didn't give such a great impression of the church that there were only around half a dozen people there for his Sunday services.. but then again I guess it added to the comedy factor that things were all a little bit of a struggle, and you warm to someone who is a bit of an underdog. Pleased to have found it thanks to this site - and impressed that the Ship inspired part of the last episode's storyline. Liked how they showed the crisis of faith in the last one, but still came up with a dignified, moving end. Watching a good BBC comedy made me feel a bit homesick.
 
Posted by Carys (# 78) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Robert Armin:
Last week's episode was great; this week's only so-so. Somehow Adam's depression didn't convince me,

It rang all too true for me -- but then again I watched it this lunchtime having had a really dopey morning and on the verge of that myself.

quote:
..., the identity of the fake vicar was easy to guess,
was it? That was the thing I didn't find convincing given that Adoha said something about going to see the other one and surely she would have recognised Colin.

Carys
 
Posted by +Chad (# 5645) on :
 
I took Adoah's comment about the other vicar to refer to Adam - the nice, likeable one not having a crisis.
 
Posted by Chorister (# 473) on :
 
The midlife crisis, followed by a quick sober up and back to business when faced with a dying parishioner was a brilliant way to end the series. When is it returning? Soon, hopefully.

I'd not have believed the drunken escapades until that bishop story broke last year....

'I AM the vicar, it's what I do!'
 
Posted by Gracious rebel (# 3523) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by +Chad:
I took Adoah's comment about the other vicar to refer to Adam - the nice, likeable one not having a crisis.

Yes that's what I thought too.
 
Posted by Spike (# 36) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Chorister:
The midlife crisis, followed by a quick sober up and back to business when faced with a dying parishioner was a brilliant way to end the series. When is it returning? Soon, hopefully.

I'd not have believed the drunken escapades until that bishop story broke last year....

'I AM the vicar, it's what I do!'

I was really hoping they'd do a "it's what I do" joke, but I suppose that could have landed them it hot water [Snigger]
 
Posted by Panda (# 2951) on :
 
But we know he's in London, not south of the river...
 
Posted by Schroedinger's cat (# 64) on :
 
I was thinking today that the most fantastic thing about the last episode was that it showed a faith crisis as it actually is. It also reminded me of a vicar I used to know, who Adam reminded me of, who ran off with his organist.

Most times a faith crisis is presented, it is either "vicar runs off with headmaster". Which is where Adam could have ended up. Or it is an intellectual discussion of "can one really believe this?". Whereas Adams crisis was real. He could have lost his job, his house, his wife, everything. That is the reality of a faith crisis - if faith means anything, losing it means everything.
 
Posted by Zappa (# 8433) on :
 
Amen and amen.
 
Posted by jedijudy (# 333) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Schroedinger's cat:
It also reminded me of a vicar I used to know, who Adam reminded me of, who ran off with his organist.

Nobody ever runs off with me. [Disappointed]
 
Posted by mrs whibley (# 4798) on :
 
I've only just realised we were meant to be shocked by the 'wank'! Am I a total degenerate with no respect for the clergy?
 
Posted by Schroedinger's cat (# 64) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by jedijudy:
quote:
Originally posted by Schroedinger's cat:
It also reminded me of a vicar I used to know, who Adam reminded me of, who ran off with his organist.

Nobody ever runs off with me. [Disappointed]
Obviously, your clergy are in a well-adjusted phase. It is something to be grateful for.
 
Posted by RadicalWhig (# 13190) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by mrs whibley:
I've only just realised we were meant to be shocked by the 'wank'! Am I a total degenerate with no respect for the clergy?

Somehow, I found that harder to take than their sexy games - in a lift! - in episode two. The idea of Adam and Alex having normal, even somewhat adventurous, sex lives, didn't jar at all. But the mental image of Adam masturbating is one I found a little bit discomforting, and would rather have been spared.
 
Posted by Chorister (# 473) on :
 
He only said it - quite mild for post 10pm I'd have thought. And it was said to shock his wife - I loved her totally unfazed reply!
 
Posted by Orlando098 (# 14930) on :
 
Are we meant to be shocked that vicars sometimes wank? It's not unheard of for humans to do this, and vicars are human..

[ 05. August 2010, 21:49: Message edited by: Orlando098 ]
 
Posted by Chorister (# 473) on :
 
Well blimey, they actually go to the loo, as well. Even Archdeacons and Bishops.

(Although I prefer not to actually see such portrayals on television.)
 
Posted by The Great Gumby (# 10989) on :
 
Just caught up with the eagerly-anticipated last episode, and feeling strangely desolate. Blackadder is a good parallel, but maybe not a complete one, as Rev's conclusion was so much more complex. Should the conclusion be viewed as redemption, self-sacrifice, acceptance of the inevitable, or all or none of those? What does he believe, and does that matter? Did he remember what he used to believe, and does that mean he believes that now, or that he trusts his past self to get it right? Did he realise that it's useful for him and others if he pretends to believe? Is there any difference in the long term?

Unlike some, I found his breakdown and reactions to it all too believable. To him, the headmistress was both forbidden fruit and a potential gateway to a different life, so his advances made sense if he'd stopped caring about anything. The question of exactly what he was thinking (or whether he was really thinking with his brain at all) is complex, but it doesn't seem unusual behaviour. ISTM that as this is a fairly regular occurrence, Alex has learnt that when he's feeling like that, he sorts himself out faster if he's chivvied along ("you're not still moping about that, are you?"), rather than being drowned in sympathy. I imagine there was a similar rationale for letting him make an idiot of himself at the party, rather than dragging him home to sleep it off.

It would be great if they could make another series, but only if the standard can be maintained. I'd rather leave it where it is than see it turned into a "normal" sitcom.
 
Posted by Schroedinger's cat (# 64) on :
 
Gumby -yes. And no. And maybe.

I think the point is that he has not resolved his doubts and problems, but he has realised his calling. And his calling from God, along with his acceptance of it, is all that he needs.

Thats my take on it, at least. He is called as his is, with his doubts, problems and wanking. And his calling is what makes him a vicar, not his behaviour or feelings.
 
Posted by Dormouse (# 5954) on :
 
I don't know if I'm being too shallow, and not getting all the nuances of the final episode, but I saw it as Adam spiralling into a bit of a breakdown, as discussed above, and then, as the policeman asked him to minister to the dying woman, he recalled his ordination vows. In ministering to the woman God kind of pulled him up short, and reminded him that he is needed by God.

So when the policeman offered him his flask at the very end, and Adam said "No thanks, I'm fine" it wasn't just "No thanks I don't want any whisky (or whatever)" it was also "No, I'm fine - God has reminded me what I'm here for". It was that final "I'm fine" that brought a lump to my throat, as Adam affirmed that actually, after all the crap that he'd gone through, yes, he *was* fine.

Though, as I say, maybe I'm not thinking bout it all deeply enough.
 
Posted by Ricardus (# 8757) on :
 
Dormouse - that was my interpretation as well.
 
Posted by The Rogue (# 2275) on :
 
I've just watched it and agree where he says he is fine because he is hearing God again. I don't think he is necessarily over it but is on the way and recognises that. That's my interpretation, anyway.

I also loved all his prayers throughout the series.
 
Posted by The Ship's Chaplain (# 15751) on :
 
I wonder if I'm the only person who thinks that Reverend Adam Smallbone is similar to the Reverend Peter Owen Jones?
 
Posted by Ondergard (# 9324) on :
 
quote:
I really REALLY liked the archdeacon - (previously seen as the nerdy choirmaster at Dibley! Insider joke, perhaps?).
I wondered where I'd seen him... I'd been racking my brains, so thatnk you SO much for putting that annoyance to rest!
 
Posted by Ondergard (# 9324) on :
 
quote:

(Am I the only one who finds her absolutely jaw-droppingly attractive, not just in Rev, but in most roles she has played?)

Yes. I think she's a complete munter... but then again, I'm a minister who is married to a woman who truly is jaw-droppingly attractive.
 
Posted by Boogie (# 13538) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by The Ship's Chaplain:
I wonder if I'm the only person who thinks that Reverend Adam Smallbone is similar to the Reverend Peter Owen Jones?

Me too - it's the "intense gaze" they both share.


[Smile]
 
Posted by Andromeda (# 11304) on :
 
I've loved the series and thought the last episode was great. I'm sad to see it end and hope there'll be more. (Hope it comes out on DVD)

Highlights for me were:
Colin's Richard Dawkins comment (see sig)
Head shot of Adam praying in earnest, and then coming out of a toilet cubicle
Nigel's costume at the vicars and tarts party
Reference to the mystery worshipper (of course)
The final scene of episode 6 (I cried)
The whole of episode 2

Great stuff

PS It was a kebab.
PPS adrenaline is a great soberer

[ 08. August 2010, 16:46: Message edited by: Andromeda ]
 
Posted by Matt Black (# 2210) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Chorister:
He only said it - quite mild for post 10pm I'd have thought. And it was said to shock his wife - I loved her totally unfazed reply!

If Olivia Colman offered to help me with a wank, I'd be quite pleased!
 
Posted by dorothea (# 4398) on :
 
This was really great little series, which brought out the way God just gets you in the end. So often Christianity is presented as a sort of lifestyle choice, when in fact that isn't how it works at all.

It was quite beautiful, in the final episode when, after all the childish angst and ego, when it came down it the Rev fully accepted his calling: 'Then I heard the voice of the Lord saying, 'Whom shall I send, and who will go for us?' And I said 'Here I am; send me!'

I think there's amply room for another series if the writer's, actors, producers and the Beeb have the will to do it.

J

[ 10. August 2010, 15:37: Message edited by: dorothea ]
 
Posted by dorothea (# 4398) on :
 
Forgive me my apostrophe errors. [Hot and Hormonal]
 
Posted by QLib (# 43) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by dorothea:
Forgive me my apostrophe errors. [Hot and Hormonal]

As we forgive those who apostrophyerror against us. [Votive] [Smile]
 
Posted by Schroedinger's cat (# 64) on :
 
For those who liked it, can I suggest that you tell the BBC, to encourage them to do it again.
 
Posted by BelandtheDragon (# 14708) on :
 
Apologies for coming in a bit late on this thread, but I have just finished watching the series and thought I would comment (this will be massively purgatorial/hellish as well - sorry)

I must say that I largely agree with the comments of the bishop up-thread. The central character was a pathetic wimp who made occasional nods to having a prayer-life - frankly I think Fr Ted Crilly is a better ambassador as a man of God.

The problem with the programme as a whole - like so many BBC series - was that it dripped with contemporary metropolitan liberal attitudes, to the extent of making it unwatchable. I found Alex and the improbably young headmistress quite repellent, two-dimensional perfect women without apparent flaw, doing the sort of 'worthy' 'caring jobs that the secular Guardianista probably thinks Christianity is about. Note neither had any apparent faith, but were much more together than Rev Smallbone. A series that truly challenged people's attitudes would have seen the smug smiles wiped off the faces that pair at least once.

I really wanted to like Rev. And there were a quite a few laughs for me. Nigel was a potentially brilliant character as foil for Adam, but totally underused. The archdeacon seemed to be a character written for the political comedies the writers worked on previously, shoe-horned into a dog-collar, but - if not necessarily realistic - did amuse. But apart from my dislike of the vicar, his wife, and the headmistress, too many things did not ring true:

Episode 1: School-whores suddenly turned up on the rumour of a good Ofsted. This is not how it works. VA schools are identified as a way of middle-class parents to segregate their offspring, the church attendance game is played almost from birth, and played well (getting involved in church activities etc). The good Ofsted's follow once a school has a middle-class roll-call. The Church quite happily colludes in this behaviour as it means bums on pews - a genuine moral dilema that the programme could have addressed. Was St Martin's school even VA - the classroom demographics suggest it was not the sort of place Mumsnetters go for? Oh, and the arrogant MP seemed to be from 80s casting for a Tory bastard, in real life its smoothy NuLab types (who represent these sorts of constituency) who play the faith school game , see self-proclaimed atheist David Milliband's choice for his offspring. Oh, and most decent people don't yell obscenities in the street when mildly provoked.

Episode 2: It's always good to have a laugh at HTP type evangelicals, but could the political motivations in the portrayal of the "Darren" character be any less subtle. Clergymen who actually win souls are all bastards and charlatans, but harmless liberals like Adam are OK. I can't think any voluntary organisation who would exclude an irritating but harmless and loyal member like Colin for such a minor indiscretion. Oh, and struggling congregations in urban areas means 40 turning up on a bad day, not 4. Total rubbish, even allowing for comic effect.

Episode 3&4: Offended me less, although the bishop up-thread commented on the unrealistic portrayal of relationships with Muslims.

Episode 5: Why is Rev S married to the awful Alex? It would probably shock the reprobates at the Beeb to know that the are married couples who don't have any sexual past, but isn't it the sort of thing a genuinely committed wife would bring up early on in the relationship? Nice middle-class girls tend not to have black ex-boyfriends, but even in PeeCee land the oafish groom seemed rather unlikely. A suave and intelligent Felix Dexter / Don Warrington type for whom Alex still had a flame would have been more realistic, and posed more serious questions and doubts in Adam's mind.

Episode 6: The "meltdown" was completely unbelievably portrayed. The worst episode of the series.
 
Posted by QLib (# 43) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by BelandtheDragon:
... it dripped with contemporary metropolitan liberal attitudes, to the extent of making it unwatchable.

But clearly not quite unwatchable enough, as far as you were concerned.
 
Posted by Leaf (# 14169) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by BelandtheDragon:
Nice middle-class girls tend not to have black ex-boyfriends

Really?
 
Posted by Chorister (# 473) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Schroedinger's cat:
For those who liked it, can I suggest that you tell the BBC, to encourage them to do it again.

Last week, one of the clerics very closely involved with the series consultation got up into the pulpit and declared, 'Don't worry - there will be another series'.

I heard it with my own ears.
 
Posted by Alex Cockell (# 7487) on :
 
And to those wishing it out on DVD - it will be. Release date is 25th October at the moment.

I've already got mine on pre-order...
 
Posted by Tina (# 63) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by BelandtheDragon:
Nice middle-class girls tend not to have black ex-boyfriends, but

... I know quite a few with black husbands.
 
Posted by Chorister (# 473) on :
 
Heh, heh - then we can ditch all those outdated Alpha videos!

REV - the new new 'introduction to Christianity course'.
 
Posted by Tina (# 63) on :
 
... some are mixed-race marriages, and some are between two nice middle-class black people [Big Grin]

(x-post with Chorister)

[ 01. September 2010, 07:59: Message edited by: Tina ]
 
Posted by Alan Cresswell (# 31) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Leaf:
quote:
Originally posted by BelandtheDragon:
Nice middle-class girls tend not to have black ex-boyfriends

Really?
Shock, horror! Nice girls sometimes dump their boyfriends.
 
Posted by Loveheart (# 12249) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by BelandtheDragon:
Nigel was a potentially brilliant character as foil for Adam, but totally underused.

Like many Readers are in real life! [Two face]
 
Posted by Jemima the 9th (# 15106) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by BelandtheDragon:

...the programme as a whole - like so many BBC series - was that it dripped with contemporary metropolitan liberal attitudes

You say that like it's a bad thing. [Two face]
 
Posted by Son of a preacherman (# 4181) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Chorister:
quote:
Originally posted by Schroedinger's cat:
For those who liked it, can I suggest that you tell the BBC, to encourage them to do it again.

Last week, one of the clerics very closely involved with the series consultation got up into the pulpit and declared, 'Don't worry - there will be another series'.

I heard it with my own ears.

Excellent news!! [Yipee]
 
Posted by QLib (# 43) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Jemima the 9th:
quote:
Originally posted by BelandtheDragon:

...the programme as a whole - like so many BBC series - was that it dripped with contemporary metropolitan liberal attitudes

You say that like it's a bad thing. [Two face]
[Snigger] Nice one, Jemima.
 
Posted by Schroedinger's cat (# 64) on :
 
Beland:

School whores - I have known them, they do tend to appear for a week or so just at the right time.
And all sorts of people would tell the builders to fuck off, even clergy.

Was Adam winning souls? Or - like many churches I have known of this type - putting people off church long time. And numbers are not everything.

In the urban areas that the series was set, mixed-race relationships are very common. And the couple were very believable. And Adam and Alex make a good couple - also very believable. Try not being so narrow minded and bigotted.

The meltdown was utterly and completely believable. With some license, because of the format, but very very close to a real breakdown - probably the best I have ever seen in a drama.

So sorry if the series did not conform to your narrow view of how Christianity should be, but in terms of realism, it was excellent. The Bishop of London liked it, although his archdeacons did not, which would indicate that it had some real sense of truth.
 
Posted by BelandtheDragon (# 14708) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Jemima the 9th:
quote:
Originally posted by BelandtheDragon:

...the programme as a whole - like so many BBC series - was that it dripped with contemporary metropolitan liberal attitudes

You say that like it's a bad thing. [Two face]
If it makes it a grind for the majority of people who don't have such a world-view, yes.


ITV3 were running repeats of "Benidorm" in the 9.30 slot before Rev. The contrast with a series that was about and for ordinary people was striking.
 
Posted by Roseofsharon (# 9657) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by BelandtheDragon:
ITV3 were running repeats of "Benidorm" in the 9.30 slot before Rev. The contrast with a series that was about and for ordinary people was striking.

What are 'ordinary' people?
 
Posted by mattyou (# 15646) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Roseofsharon:
quote:
Originally posted by BelandtheDragon:
ITV3 were running repeats of "Benidorm" in the 9.30 slot before Rev. The contrast with a series that was about and for ordinary people was striking.

What are 'ordinary' people?
I think this means Sun readers (circulation 3 million) rather than Guardian readers (circulation 280,000).
 
Posted by ken (# 2460) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by BelandtheDragon:
Nice middle-class girls tend not to have black ex-boyfriends

In London, that's not really true.

And the story was set in London. So "metropolitan attitudes" are mere versismo.
 
Posted by +Chad (# 5645) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by BelandtheDragon:
Episode 1: School-whores suddenly turned up on the rumour of a good Ofsted. This is not how it works. VA schools are identified as a way of middle-class parents to segregate their offspring, the church attendance game is played almost from birth, and played well (getting involved in church activities etc). The good Ofsted's follow once a school has a middle-class roll-call.

I'd better tell our two VA Primary Schools with no Church-going admissions policy in our deprived UPA patch not to expect a good OFSTED.

Wait a minute, they have good OFSTEDs. [Confused]

Perhaps the inspectors thought they were middle-class Church-goers.
 
Posted by Angloid (# 159) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by ken:
quote:
Originally posted by BelandtheDragon:
Nice middle-class girls tend not to have black ex-boyfriends

In London, that's not really true.


Especially of nice black middle-class girls.
 
Posted by Robert Armin (# 182) on :
 
Bel:
quote:
The central character was a pathetic wimp who made occasional nods to having a prayer-life
This puzzles me. We were shown quite a bit of Adam's prayer life; the Office was part of the structure of his day, while he spontaneously spoke to God about all sorts of things on a regular basis. What else was the chap supposed to do?
 
Posted by mattyou (# 15646) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Jemima the 9th:
quote:
Originally posted by BelandtheDragon:

...the programme as a whole - like so many BBC series - was that it dripped with contemporary metropolitan liberal attitudes

You say that like it's a bad thing. [Two face]
Well it was a bit excessive. Recognising for instance that the evangelicals probably do more outreach than Adam's one-man-and-his-dog congregation might not have been a bad thing.

Of course it is a comedy but the targets were a little predictable.
 
Posted by leo (# 1458) on :
 
But what if their 'outreach' puts people off.
 
Posted by mattyou (# 15646) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by leo:
But what if their 'outreach' puts people off.

Dunno, what if it does?
 
Posted by thomasm (# 4618) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by mattyou:
quote:
Originally posted by leo:
But what if their 'outreach' puts people off.

Dunno, what if it does?
Well if it puts people off, and the man and dog don't, then the man and dog are doing better 'outreach'!
 
Posted by Niminypiminy (# 15489) on :
 
an article just appeared on the Guardian web site saying the series has been recommissioned hurrah!
 
Posted by Alex Cockell (# 7487) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Niminypiminy:
an article just appeared on the Guardian web site saying the series has been recommissioned hurrah!

and here's a link.
 
Posted by Alex Cockell (# 7487) on :
 
For those who missed it, and out cross-pond friends, search for the following string in Youtube - someone's put the series up...

Rev - s01e01

I won't link directly, as it might be taken down.. but someone's been kind enough - tide-over till the DVD arrives in the post..
 
Posted by Alex Cockell (# 7487) on :
 
ARGH! Got an email from Amazon yesterday - the DVD release has been pushed back until April 18 next year! Bastards! [Mad] [Mad]

BBC/2ENTERTAIN - you're doing yourself no favours.. it's ALREADY available via torrent!

Maybe they're rerunning it in the new year to tide people over until series 2.. and selling through series 1 - and going with Easter releases each year?

[Mad] [Mad] [brick wall] [brick wall]
 
Posted by Loveheart (# 12249) on :
 
I have it stored on my Sky+ box - family deletes it on pain of death... or worse! [Devil]

The BBC've missed the Christmas market by doing that - seems stupid really. What do they have to gain by it?
 
Posted by ken (# 2460) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Loveheart:

The BBC've missed the Christmas market by doing that - seems stupid really. What do they have to gain by it?

Ten to one they are timing the DVD for just before a new series, so we will all buy it to catch up.
 
Posted by Jemima the 9th (# 15106) on :
 
Nooo! [Waterworks]
 
Posted by Alex Cockell (# 7487) on :
 
new series is apparently being filmed next summer, this is being timed for easter next year. I wonder, is series 1 being rerun during Lent?
 
Posted by Loveheart (# 12249) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Alex Cockell:
new series is apparently being filmed next summer, this is being timed for easter next year. I wonder, is series 1 being rerun during Lent?

And if so, will you give it up for Lent? [Devil]
 
Posted by Schroedinger's cat (# 64) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Loveheart:
And if so, will you give it up for Lent? [Devil]

Surely the right attitude is to give up whatever you were going to do when it was on...
 
Posted by Deputy Verger (# 15876) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Alex Cockell:
new series is apparently being filmed next summer, this is being timed for easter next year.

[Confused] Computer says no.

In Adam Smallbone's church, Easter precedes summer. YMMV in the Antipodes, but surely they aren't filming REV in the footsteps of Lord of the Rings?
 
Posted by Alex Cockell (# 7487) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Deputy Verger:
quote:
Originally posted by Alex Cockell:
new series is apparently being filmed next summer, this is being timed for easter next year.

[Confused] Computer says no.

In Adam Smallbone's church, Easter precedes summer. YMMV in the Antipodes, but surely they aren't filming REV in the footsteps of Lord of the Rings?

No. Series 1 DVD release date is April 18. Series 2 has been commissione,d and according to the trade press is being filmed in summer 2011, for broadcast late 2011.
 
Posted by dorothea (# 4398) on :
 
Something to look forward to then.
 
Posted by Loveheart (# 12249) on :
 
Slight tangent, but on Miles Tupp (who played Nigel in Rev) was on Michael MacIntyre's roadshow last night, as a stand up comedian, and I thought he was pretty funny (if a little controversial at times).
 
Posted by QLib (# 43) on :
 
Wow - I only had half an eye on it and didn't recognise him. Was he the one going on about village hall fascists?
 
Posted by Loveheart (# 12249) on :
 
Yes, that was the one.
 
Posted by Earwig (# 12057) on :
 
Oh my gosh! Well spotted, Loveheart! I thought he looked familiar. He was the only decent one on, I thought, I must stop watching Macintyre, he annoys me too much.
 
Posted by Cottontail (# 12234) on :
 
Of course, Miles Jupp first hit the big time as Archie from Balamory!

This makes me happy [Smile]
 
Posted by Loveheart (# 12249) on :
 
I found him scary as Archie in Balamory, as I did all of the characters. They seemed to take a bunch of weirdos and put them all together in one programme!
 
Posted by Zacchaeus (# 14454) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Cottontail:
Of course, Miles Jupp first hit the big time as Archie from Balamory!

This makes me happy [Smile]

I never connected the two at all!

-
 
Posted by Gill H (# 68) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Loveheart:
I found him scary as Archie in Balamory, as I did all of the characters. They seemed to take a bunch of weirdos and put them all together in one programme!

The guy who plays Spencer is a friend of ours and could tell you some stories...!
 
Posted by Niminypiminy (# 15489) on :
 
You know Spencer, wow! He was the top favourite character in our house.
 
Posted by Spike (# 36) on :
 
Which character was he in Rev? I don't remember anyone call Spencer [Confused]

[ 06. October 2010, 14:13: Message edited by: Spike ]
 
Posted by Thurible (# 3206) on :
 
I assume he was in Ballamory.

Thurible
 
Posted by Loveheart (# 12249) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Gill H:
quote:
Originally posted by Loveheart:
I found him scary as Archie in Balamory, as I did all of the characters. They seemed to take a bunch of weirdos and put them all together in one programme!

The guy who plays Spencer is a friend of ours and could tell you some stories...!
I think Spencer seemed the most normal of them... if thats any comfort [Two face]
 
Posted by Gill H (# 68) on :
 
He's done dafter things in his previous job as an evangelistic kids' worker - including dressing up as a sheep and dancing to Michael Jackson ...!
 


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