Thread: The good ol' U S of A Board: Oblivion / Ship of Fools.


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Posted by moron (# 206) on :
 
The other morning* when I was working I decided to take my morose dose and listened to NPR on the radio.

The impression I got was that the USA was pretty much the least useful country ever created and it got me to wondering: just what have we done right?

(Besides elect Obama.)

TIA.


*and today I saw a bumper sticker that said 'Confederates: fighting terrorism since 1861'. It's difficult to be bored driving in Arkansas.


yet another typo

[ 19. March 2013, 21:06: Message edited by: moron ]
 

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Posted by Organ Builder (# 12478) on :
 
Strange--I listen to NPR every day and don't get that impression at all. Would you care to link to the specific stories that gave you that feeling?

Ten minutes of listening to Rush Limbaugh or Sean Hannity usually makes me wonder why we aren't being scourged by God for our sins. Your mileage probably varies.

[ 19. March 2013, 21:17: Message edited by: Organ Builder ]
 

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Posted by Gramps49 (# 16378) on :
 
Trolling, Trolling, Trolling,
 

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Posted by moron (# 206) on :
 

quote:

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Originally posted by Gramps49:
Trolling, Trolling, Trolling,

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Must we go there?
 

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Posted by moron (# 206) on :
 

quote:

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Originally posted by Organ Builder:
Strange--I listen to NPR every day and don't get that impression at all. Would you care to link to the specific stories that gave you that feeling?

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quote:

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Originally posted by moron:
The other morning* when I was working I decided to take my morose dose and listened to NPR on the radio.

The impression I got was that the USA was pretty much the least useful country ever created and it got me to wondering: just what have we done right?

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quote:

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Originally posted by moron:
The other morning* when I was working I decided to take my morose dose and listened to NPR on the radio.

The impression I got was that the USA was pretty much the least useful country ever created and it got me to wondering: just what have we done right?

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I don't know which "other morning" got you so down, but let's just do a quick rundown of today's installment of NPR's Morning Edition, the show that has you feeling morose.

Wish For Obama Trip, Ignite Stalled Peace Talks
The U.S. tries to find peace in a troubled region. Yay America! +1

Bioethics Panel Warns Against Anthrax Vaccine Testing On Kids
The U.S. is concerned about contagious disease, but not enough to expose children to harm. Again, yay America! +1

[musical interlude]

U.S. Families Forced To Adjust To Women Going Off To War
U.S. military ventures put hardship on American families. Boo, America. -1 But the U.S. runs its military on voluntary enlistment and assigns duties (mostly) by capability, not gender stereotypes. Yay America. +1

Historian Propels Connecticut To Claim 'First In Flight'
Historian questions whether heavier-than-air flight was invented by native-born Americans Orville and Wilbur Wright or immigrant American Gustave Whitehead. Either way, America invented powered flight. Yay America. +1

[another musical interlude]

Ex-Weapons Inspector In Iraq Hoped 'There Would Not Be A War'
U.S. rushed ahead with an ill-advised invasion despite lack of a credible threat. Boo America! -1

Baghdad, A Decade Later
Same as above. -2

[yet another musical interlude]

2 Former CalPERS Officials Indicted For Fraud
The U.S. pursues justice against pension thieves. Yay America. +1 But lax oversight allowed the thieves to rip people off in the first place. Boo America. -1

Visual-Effects Firms Having Trouble Seeing Green
There doesn't seem to be any market model available by which American CGI studios can be profitable. Boo America. -1

New Chinese Law: Filial Piety
Not about the U.S. 0

[even more musical interlude]

E.U. Tax Proposal On Cypriot Bank Deposits Riles Russia
Not about the U.S. 0

Catholics Embrace Pope Francis' Simple Gestures
Not about the U.S. (though may touch on American Catholics) 0

[music keeps interluding]

Interim Prime Minister Elected By Syrian Opposition
Not about the U.S. 0

What Is The Effect Of Asking Americans To Think About The Greater Good?
Americans are selfish bastards. Boo America. -1

[further interluding by music]

Alzheimer's 'Epidemic' Now A Deadlier Threat To Elderly
Americans are living longer. Yay America. +1 But if an American lives long enough to develop Alzheimer's there's still no treatment or cure. Boo America. -1

[can't stop the musical interlude]

For Middle East Peace, Israel Is 'Obligated' To Stop Building Settlements
The U.S. can't get its client state to follow U.S. policy recommendations. Boo America. -1

RNC Election Report Calls For Minority Outreach, Primary Changes
American conservatives realize they need to be less racist. Yay America. +1

[musical interlude again]

Tracking A $500 Million Art Heist From 23 Years Ago
The FBI pursues art thieves. Yay America. +1

'Drunken Botanist' Takes A Garden Tour Of The Liquor Cabinet
The U.S. makes good liquor. And mixed drinks. And books about both! Yay America! +1

[final musical interlude]

Installation Mass Launches Pope Francis' Papacy
Not about the U.S. 0

Cyprus Proposes Exempting Smaller Deposits From Tax
Not about the U.S. 0

A Guilty Conscience Needs No Accuser
Americans sometimes feel bad about committing crimes. Yay America? +0.5

Broncos Cut Player After Missed Contract Deadline
American sports teams are humorless martinets. Boo America. -1

So that comes to seven (six-and-a-half?) stories that portray the U.S. in a positive light, six that portray the U.S. negatively, three that are somewhat mixed, and six that aren't about the U.S.

It sounds like what you're really after is infotainment that consists of nothing beyond American boosterism, rather than anything that could be considered journalism.
 

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Posted by Horseman Bree (# 5290) on :
 
Toujours Dan: The cost of developing that happy, stable, diverse country was felt by a lot of people who couldn't answer back - the natives of almost the whole contry who were attacked and slaughtered or marginalised deliberately (most often by Christians), the immigrants of one era who were attacked (although not always slaughtered) by the previous gangs of immigrants; the slaves imported from other continents; the people who tried to protect themselves and their fellow workers by, for instance, unionising (still going on); the sick, who the Christians are desperate to avoid helping; the poor, ditto;... Yeah, for many, possibly the majority, the US is a great place, but let's not get too starry-eyed.

Oh, and before the usual riposte is thrown, that smug, happy Canada up North is only better on one count - universal health care - and that's under threat from the usual suspects.

No wonder the T-shirt says "Resisting Terrorism since 1492"
 

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Posted by Laurelin (# 17211) on :
 
There can hardly exist a nation on earth which doesn't have blood on its hands during its history and formation. Mine certainly does, but I still love my country and am glad to be British.

So I'm with Toujours Dan on this.

Although I wouldn't want your health care system.
 

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Posted by tclune (# 7959) on :
 

quote:

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Originally posted by Laurelin:
Although I wouldn't want your health care system.

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quote:

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Originally posted by Horseman Bree:
Toujours Dan: The cost of developing that happy, stable, diverse country was felt by a lot of people who couldn't answer back - the natives of almost the whole contry who were attacked and slaughtered or marginalised deliberately (most often by Christians), the immigrants of one era who were attacked (although not always slaughtered) by the previous gangs of immigrants; the slaves imported from other continents; the people who tried to protect themselves and their fellow workers by, for instance, unionising (still going on); the sick, who the Christians are desperate to avoid helping; the poor, ditto;... Yeah, for many, possibly the majority, the US is a great place, but let's not get too starry-eyed.

Oh, and before the usual riposte is thrown, that smug, happy Canada up North is only better on one count - universal health care - and that's under threat from the usual suspects.

No wonder the T-shirt says "Resisting Terrorism since 1492"

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quote:

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Originally posted by tclune:

quote:

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Originally posted by Laurelin:
Although I wouldn't want your health care system.

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Not to worry -- we don't have a health care system.

--Tom Clune

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Now Tom, don't be so negative. There's always the emergency room if you really need care.


 

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Posted by sabine (# 3861) on :
 

quote:

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Originally posted by moron:
*and today I saw a bumper sticker that said 'Confederates: fighting terrorism since 1861'. It's difficult to be bored driving in Arkansas.

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quote:

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Originally posted by sabine:
"Fighting Terrorism since 1492"

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quote:

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Originally posted by Kaplan Corday:
...and the numbers of trendy-left bourgeoisie who threaten to leave it for Canada, but never seem to get around to doing so.

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quote:

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Originally posted by Jade Constable:
Maine Coon cats.

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Oh Jade--it's springtime in Atlanta and our Maine Coon is a mess right now. Keeping up with the shedding is a losing battle.
 

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Posted by Organ Builder (# 12478) on :
 
At this point I've posted enough fluff on this thread that it only seems fair I try to make a more substantive contribution.

I was born and raised in the US. I've lived in the West, the Midwest, New England, Mid-Atlantic, and Southern regions. My education is thoroughly American, reflecting its strengths and weaknesses. Whether I like it or not, my brain is thoroughly wired as an American--my sense of humor, my understanding and usage of language, my tastes and culture...

I will never be "at home" anywhere else on earth in the manner that I am here.

I love the US--it is far from perfect, but my life and my friends are here. Does it embarrass me sometimes? Yes. Does it make me proud sometimes? Yes. I could say the same about my favorite relatives.

So I will continue to stumble along, trying to make the country a little bit better when I see something that needs to be fixed, trying to preserve things of which I feel we should be justifiably proud and trying to keep myself informed so I can tell the difference until the day when my ashes become part of the landscape here.
 

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Posted by jbohn (# 8753) on :
 
Organ Builder:

What you said.
 

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Posted by ToujoursDan (# 10578) on :
 

quote:

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Originally posted by Kaplan Corday:

quote:

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Originally posted by sabine:
"Fighting Terrorism since 1492"

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America scores well in terms of the Leninist concept of voting with one's feet, in view of the numbers of common people who risk their lives to get there, and the numbers of trendy-left bourgeoisie who threaten to leave it for Canada, but never seem to get around to doing so.

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quote:

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Originally posted by Kaplan Corday:
America scores well in terms of the Leninist concept of voting with one's feet, in view of the numbers of common people who risk their lives to get there,

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Yes, it's better to live here than in Mexico. That's so much to be proud of. I have never understood this argument. "Things aren't so bad here; look at all the people from impoverished third-world countries trying to get here." Set the bar low, do we?
 

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Posted by Zach82 (# 3208) on :
 

quote:

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Originally posted by Doublethink:
One of the things I find odd in US culture as portrayed on TV anyway, is the amount of patronage. Is it like that in real life ?

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quote:

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Originally posted by Doublethink:
Well, legacy admissions to university. Large amounts of positions in the gift of elected officials. Discretionary pardons. Corporate control of small communities (this may just be a film trope). Employment law that allows at will firing. Sports scholarships and associated corruption issues.

Etc

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The right of employers to fire employees without notice for whatever the hell reasons they feel like (besides being a minority) is a fact of life in the United States. Sports scholarships are usually viewed (insultingly) as a service to disadvantaged segments of the population. I get the impression that government service positions are not really lucrative enough these days to be a huge gift in exchange for political support.

Corporate control of small communities is becoming a bigger problem these days- and corporations are pretty free to manipulate local politics at their pleasure.

Legacy admissions are a thing, but I hardly know how common they are. At least I didn't get any calls from Southern Illinois University, my father's alma mater, when I was bound for college.
 

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Posted by Zach82 (# 3208) on :
 

quote:

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[ETA That wierd thing when an elected official becomes incapacitated or dead in office and a spouse or random relative takes over.]

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quote:

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Originally posted by Doublethink:
One of the things I find odd in US culture as portrayed on TV anyway, is the amount of patronage. Is it like that in real life ?

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quote:

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Originally posted by mousethief:

quote:

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Originally posted by Kaplan Corday:
America scores well in terms of the Leninist concept of voting with one's feet, in view of the numbers of common people who risk their lives to get there,

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Yes, it's better to live here than in Mexico. That's so much to be proud of. I have never understood this argument. "Things aren't so bad here; look at all the people from impoverished third-world countries trying to get here." Set the bar low, do we?

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quote:

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Originally posted by Kaplan Corday:

quote:

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Originally posted by mousethief:

quote:

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Originally posted by Kaplan Corday:
America scores well in terms of the Leninist concept of voting with one's feet, in view of the numbers of common people who risk their lives to get there,

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Yes, it's better to live here than in Mexico. That's so much to be proud of. I have never understood this argument. "Things aren't so bad here; look at all the people from impoverished third-world countries trying to get here." Set the bar low, do we?

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Mexico?

There's probably scarcely a country in the world - even in the developed world - in which there is not a substantial proportion of people who would live in the USA given the opportunity.

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quote:

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Originally posted by moron:

quote:

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Originally posted by Gramps49:
Trolling, Trolling, Trolling,

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Must we go there?

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quote:

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Originally posted by moron:
...The impression I got was that the USA was pretty much the least useful country ever created and it got me to wondering: just what have we done right?

(Besides elect Obama.)

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Exported Ronald McDonald fast food "restaurants" all over the world, putting decent healthy food outlets out of business? But hey, you have Obama-care now, so everything will be OK!
 

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Posted by Alan Cresswell (# 31) on :
 

quote:

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Originally posted by Dave W.:

quote:

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Originally posted by Kaplan Corday:
Mexico?

There's probably scarcely a country in the world - even in the developed world - in which there is not a substantial proportion of people who would live in the USA given the opportunity.

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Now there's a bold declaration! What would you consider a "substantial proportion", and have you any data to support this?

I suspect you're vastly overestimating the attractiveness of the US, and vastly underestimating the strength of family, community, cultural, and linguistic ties.

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Anecdotally, from where I am in the UK there are very few people here who would want to live in the US. And, we share the same language (almost) and are probably closer culturally than many other places in the world. Plenty of people who enjoy going there on holiday, I'm in academia and so I know quite a few people who have gone to/would consider going to the US to work for a few years. But, actually wanting to permanently move to the US is unusual IME.
 

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Posted by Karl: Liberal Backslider (# 76) on :
 
I certainly wouldn't. No free at point of use health care, the fact it's actually legal to employ someone and only give them a week's paid leave a year, and far too many guns around are the first three reasons I'd give.

Plenty of positives of course, but those three are pretty hard to offset.

[ 21. March 2013, 09:55: Message edited by: Karl: Liberal Backslider ]
 

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Posted by deano (# 12063) on :
 
According to Hollywood the US has done an awful lot of things, such as send pilots to the Battle of Britain and extract a Enigma machine from U571!!!!


 

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Posted by Alan Cresswell (# 31) on :
 
Someone, somewhere must have done a "if you had to move to another country, where would you go?" poll. My impression from the people I know, I would reckon that from the UK the top of that list would include Spain, Portugal, Greece (those warm, sunny places we go on holiday), Scandanavia (great welfare), New Zealand and Australia, Canada. I'm not sure of the order of those. Of the "I want somewhere where I don't have to learn a new language" group I would expect NZ, Australia and Canada to top the list.

Now, who has the Google-fu to find the results of the poll?
 

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Posted by Anyuta (# 14692) on :
 
I personally don't know anyone in the developed world (and I have extensive family and friends all over Europe) who would voluntarily move to the US. Not one. Unless you consider Russia the "developed world".. there I do know a few, but these days, many more who would not consider it for a moment.

Nope, not one, not in Finland, Sweeden, Norway, Germany, Switzerland.... granted, I don't know the whold population of the country, but still, can't imagine that my examples are all that unusual.

That's not to say that they don't have respect for the US, or think it's evil or going to hell in a hand basket. They just don't see any particular reason to prefer living here to living where they have free (or nearly free) healthcare, guaranteed 5 weeks of vacation a year, the ability to buy pretty much whatever they want, not to mention generally better primary education, and no fear of having their children taught "creationism" in science class.

NO, wait, I tell a lie. I do know one person in Switzerland who would move here if she could.. her boyfriend lives here and she'd drop everything to be with him. but.. then again, not everything, since she is currently studying in university, and not willing to give that up to come here.

I am very grateful to the US for taking in my family at a time when many countries refused to do so, and give the opportunities that they would not have had otherwise. Still, even so my family came here because they pretty much had to or die (post WWII, in fear of forced repatriation to the USSR). Still, even so, they would have gone elsewhere had elsewhere taken them. and the US now is not the US of the 1940s. I love my country. but I am under no illusion as to it's flaws.
 

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Posted by Barnabas62 (# 9110) on :
 
The Host view is that the thread will probably do better as a Hell rant, releasing more of its potential for invective over pond difference et al.

Good luck folks. Temperature rising.

Barnabas62
Purgatory Host
 

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Posted by Jane R (# 331) on :
 
Alan:

quote:

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Anecdotally, from where I am in the UK there are very few people here who would want to live in the US. And, we share the same language (almost) and are probably closer culturally than many other places in the world.

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And yet at the same time we are quite a long way apart, as becomes apparent every time we have a debate on guns or healthcare. It's not just a question of learning a different pronunciation of tomato.

I do know someone who voluntarily moved to the US; my uncle. Everyone else in the family thinks he's mad (he moved to TEXAS?! Surely everyone there is a gun-toting psychopath??*)

My own view is that it's a nice place to visit but I wouldn't want to live there, for much the same reasons that Karl gives. Of course if I was one of the 2% it might seem a more attractive prospect.

*except for Belle Ringer of course

[ 21. March 2013, 10:35: Message edited by: Jane R ]
 

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Posted by deano (# 12063) on :
 
I could live there if push came to shove. It's almost my second home as it is (for now!!) but I would have to move to a part that is more "appreciative" of old-world values, somewhere in the North-East or more probably in a nice part of SoCal for the climate (I HATE snow).
 

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Posted by orfeo (# 13878) on :
 

quote:

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Originally posted by Kaplan Corday:
There's probably scarcely a country in the world - even in the developed world - in which there is not a substantial proportion of people who would live in the USA given the opportunity.

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quote:

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Originally posted by Alan Cresswell:
Someone, somewhere must have done a "if you had to move to another country, where would you go?" poll. My impression from the people I know, I would reckon that from the UK the top of that list would include Spain, Portugal, Greece (those warm, sunny places we go on holiday), Scandanavia (great welfare), New Zealand and Australia, Canada. I'm not sure of the order of those. Of the "I want somewhere where I don't have to learn a new language" group I would expect NZ, Australia and Canada to top the list.

Now, who has the Google-fu to find the results of the poll?

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quote:

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I've met and worked with many Americans, and I've never met one I didn't like...

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quote:

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Originally posted by Og: Thread Killer:
BTW, I do wonder whether the trolling nature of the OP sheds more light on Western media then the articles on NPR that day. The OP creator hasn't really engaged after that first post, which seems to be his/her modus operandi.

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Perhaps you, after all these internet years, can finally define 'troll' adequately.

Thanks ever so much in advance.
 

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Posted by moron (# 206) on :
 
And has it ever occurred to you, Og, that what I post here is about the best I can do on any given day? That I recognize the superiority of many people who reply to my threads and humbly avoid dragging the thread down to my level?

Now I suppose I have to come up with a derogatory term to categorize you.


I agree about bacon but will pass on the cheese: too french for me.


 

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Posted by Marvin the Martian (# 4360) on :
 

quote:

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Originally posted by moron:
And has it ever occurred to you, Og, that what I post here is about the best I can do on any given day?

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quote:

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Originally posted by Marvin the Martian:
Not posting is an option as well. Sometimes it's the best option.

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quote:

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The problem for many Brits is, our nearest large neighbours in Europe aren't great options either...

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Speak for yourself. I wouldn't mind living in Germany either; they make great boardgames there and their bookshops are pretty good too.

Zach82, what makes you think we spend all our time comparing our countries to the US? We can go for days without thinking of you at all, or at least we could if you didn't have this unfortunate habit of starting wars everywhere...

[ 21. March 2013, 13:23: Message edited by: Jane R ]
 

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Posted by Karl: Liberal Backslider (# 76) on :
 

quote:

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Originally posted by Zach82:
Do people from other countries ever think about the worthiness of their nations outside of comparing them to the United States?

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quote:

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We get threads like this about the United States all the time, usually started by Americans. "Are we good? Do people love us? Why don't you love us?"

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quote:

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Originally posted by Jane R:
Perhaps it's a difference in culture. Further up the thread I said I liked you (which most Brits would interpret as a ringing endorsement); why aren't you focusing on that instead of worrying that I don't love you?

Loving a country is difficult, because none of them are perfect. I love my country because it's mine; I don't always approve of it or even like it. Sometimes I am downright ashamed of it or embarrassed by it. However, it is still my country and it would be very difficult to leave it for somewhere else. I don't *love* any other countries in the same way.

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quote:

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Originally posted by Zach82:
I oughtter add, when I said worthiness I wasn't asking whether people from other nations think about their nations economy/crime rate/drug trade/whatever. I was wondering whether people ask themselves silly questions like "Is my nation a force of good in the world?" "Are we the best nation on the earth?"

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quote:

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Originally posted by Jane R:

Adeodatus, if you're keen on opera I am really surprised you would not consider living in Germany. They have the largest number of opera houses anywhere in the world.

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quote:

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Originally posted by Jane R:
Oh, OK. Thanks for explaining.

I don't think 'Is my nation a force for good in the world?' is a silly question, btw. We should all be asking it.

Adeodatus, if you're keen on opera I am really surprised you would not consider living in Germany. They have the largest number of opera houses anywhere in the world.

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quote:

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Originally posted by Zach82:
Do people from other countries ever think about the worthiness of their nations outside of comparing them to the United States?

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quote:

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Originally posted by Karl: Liberal Backslider:

quote:

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Originally posted by Jane R:
Oh, OK. Thanks for explaining.

I don't think 'Is my nation a force for good in the world?' is a silly question, btw. We should all be asking it.

Adeodatus, if you're keen on opera I am really surprised you would not consider living in Germany. They have the largest number of opera houses anywhere in the world.

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As Captain Blackadder observed - the Teutonic reputation for brutality is well founded. Their operas last several days.

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Oh, I love the operas. It's the diet I can't take. Dining (I use the word in its loosest sense) once with a friend in Munich, my friend ordered Schweinefleisch, thinking, "that sounds like pork". Technically, it was. It was a dead piglet on a plate. With - iirc - pickled cabbage.

And as for their wines! Even the drier-than-dry ones are sweet! How they're not a nation of diabetics is anybody's guess.
 

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Posted by jbohn (# 8753) on :
 
From this American's perspective, I can't imagine living anywhere else. Let's run through a short list of "possibilities":

UK - The weather stinks. CCTV everywhere - how's a guy to piss in an alley? If you carry a pocketknife they think you're a criminal. And what in hell are neeps and tatties?

Oz - too damned hot. And empty. And Foster's tastes like piss. That said, one of my best friends lives in Brisbane now, so I may have to visit. Koalas are kind of cute.

Germany - they talk funny. They're a bit too ethnically homogenous, really. Decent cuisine, though. I like their beer.

France - they're French. Ugh. Nice tower and all, but I can't say I'd stick around. The wine ain't bad.

Spain - They also talk funny. And have delusions of empire - kind of like the Brits. And have no idea how to run an economy. That said, the food's decent. And the Spanish ladies I work with are very nice. Still, not gonna move there.

China - Nice people. Tasty food. Oppressive single-party government. Just like being here in Minneapolis, with a different language. I enjoyed my visit, and I'd go back in a minute - but not moving there.

Canada - kind of like the U.S., but not. They say "eh" too much. Obsessed with hockey and curling. Too damned polite, really. Their beer's passable, I suppose. The French-speaking ones aren't to be trusted, to my mind - why don't they just speak English like civilized folk? Not moving there, either.



(For the humor/humour impaired, the above is what my UK friends call "taking the piss". The point is, any of us can find plenty of things to bitch about with regards to other countries, or other parts of our own country. Lord knows we hear about how bad the US is from the rest of you. )

[ 21. March 2013, 14:23: Message edited by: jbohn ]
 

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Posted by Zach82 (# 3208) on :
 
"Is the US a good place to live?" seems a might more sensible question than "Are we NUMBER ONE?!"

But before this becomes another avenue of criticism of Americans, I'll add that an excessive readiness to point out how one's country is better than the United States makes it look like you fear that the answer to the latter question might possibly be "Yes." "Are we better than THEM?" is only barely better than "Are we better than EVERYONE?"
 

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Posted by Karl: Liberal Backslider (# 76) on :
 
Tongue in cheek accepted, but I actually like our weather. It's seldom too cold, only too hot for a few days each year, and almost never homicidal compared with most parts of the world.

Endless days of overcast weather in Spring/Autumn can be a bit of a downer, but I'd not swap it if a bit of sunshine then meant I had to live with either months colder than a deep freeze, hotter than body heat, or, God help us, both.
 

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Posted by jbohn (# 8753) on :
 

quote:

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Originally posted by Karl: Liberal Backslider:
Endless days of overcast weather in Spring/Autumn can be a bit of a downer, but I'd not swap it if a bit of sunshine then meant I had to live with either months colder than a deep freeze, hotter than body heat, or, God help us, both.

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quote:

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Originally posted by jbohn:
I feel you there - MN weather goes from -20 F in winter to 100 F in summer all too regularly. Last year, St. Patrick's Day was 80 F. This year, 20-odd.

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quote:

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Originally posted by Adeodatus:

quote:

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Originally posted by jbohn:
I feel you there - MN weather goes from -20 F in winter to 100 F in summer all too regularly. Last year, St. Patrick's Day was 80 F. This year, 20-odd.

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That is a significant problem with the USA -

They still use weird measurements.

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quote:

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Originally posted by Karl: Liberal Backslider:

quote:

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Originally posted by Adeodatus:

quote:

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Originally posted by jbohn:
I feel you there - MN weather goes from -20 F in winter to 100 F in summer all too regularly. Last year, St. Patrick's Day was 80 F. This year, 20-odd.

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That is a significant problem with the USA -

They still use weird measurements.

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I can translate. -20F - Fucking cold. 100F - Fucking hot.

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quote:

---

Originally posted by Karl: Liberal Backslider:
Tongue in cheek accepted, but I actually like our weather. It's seldom too cold, only too hot for a few days each year, and almost never homicidal compared with most parts of the world.

Endless days of overcast weather in Spring/Autumn can be a bit of a downer, but I'd not swap it if a bit of sunshine then meant I had to live with either months colder than a deep freeze, hotter than body heat, or, God help us, both.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by deano:

quote:

---

Originally posted by Karl: Liberal Backslider:
Tongue in cheek accepted, but I actually like our weather. It's seldom too cold, only too hot for a few days each year, and almost never homicidal compared with most parts of the world.

Endless days of overcast weather in Spring/Autumn can be a bit of a downer, but I'd not swap it if a bit of sunshine then meant I had to live with either months colder than a deep freeze, hotter than body heat, or, God help us, both.

---

I agree Karl. It's the part that always seems to be missing from Genesis...

"... and after God made the Earth, he had a go at the countries, and once he'd perfected the technique he made England".

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Zach82:
-20 is definitely what Midwesterners would use at least three swears to describe. "Shit, it's so fucking cold, gawddamnit."

---

quote:

---

Germany: Damned if I have the time to sort my gawddamn trash.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Karl: Liberal Backslider:
Mind, with what you where whining about not liking snow upthread, have you seen the weather for the next three days?

Hint - golf could be tricky.

---

I know, I know, more fucking snow!

 

---

Posted by no prophet (# 15560) on :
 
It's when you get any country's people in large groups, drinking and singing. They are all awful.

It also helps if their country's educational system teaches the least bit of geography and cultural studies. I have noticed that Americans tend to know lots about their country and have rather limited ideas of the geography, culture and politics of other countries. We are generally able to say the name of our province to people from other countries (European, Asian, Pacific) and they can locate it, but almost always have tell Americans what states it is north of.
 

---

Posted by ArachnidinElmet (# 17346) on :
 
I vote for nomadism. We should all migrate like birds, according to the weather, the sports and arts seasons and whichever cultural festivities we fancy appropriating. Of course then we wouldn't have the pleasure of whinging about the weather, admittedly more a Uk failing than an American one.
 

---

Posted by no prophet (# 15560) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by ArachnidinElmet:
I vote for nomadism. We should all migrate like birds, according to the weather, the sports and arts seasons and whichever cultural festivities we fancy appropriating. Of course then we wouldn't have the pleasure of whinging about the weather, admittedly more a Uk failing than an American one.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Zach82:
Oz: I like being cold some of the gawddamn time, you know.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by orfeo:

quote:

---

Originally posted by Zach82:
Oz: I like being cold some of the gawddamn time, you know.

---

Ahem. We have an entire continent to choose from. You'll find the southern parts get reasonably chilly in the middle of the year.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Karl: Liberal Backslider:
arse about face.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Karl: Liberal Backslider:

quote:

---

Originally posted by orfeo:

quote:

---

Originally posted by Zach82:
Oz: I like being cold some of the gawddamn time, you know.

---

Ahem. We have an entire continent to choose from. You'll find the southern parts get reasonably chilly in the middle of the year.

---

Which is of course arse about face.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by mousethief:

quote:

---

Originally posted by Karl: Liberal Backslider:
arse about face.

---

Translation?

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by jbohn:
Koalas are kind of cute.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by orfeo:

quote:

---

Originally posted by jbohn:
Koalas are kind of cute.

---

I keep explaining here on the Ship that koalas are foul-tempered beasts (despite sleeping 23 hours a day) that will probably piss on you if you try to handle one. This seems to have no effect. People still keep saying they're cute.

---

quote:

---

I would rather be loved for myself rather than for happening to have been born in in the United States, or for sharing some generalized trait of the other people from the United States. I actually have a kind of horror at the idea of wrapping up too much of one's identity in nationality.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by orfeo:
[x-post replying to mousethief]

Which is exactly my point. Any appearance of cuteness is a cunning trap.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Zach82:

quote:

---

Originally posted by orfeo:
[x-post replying to mousethief]

Which is exactly my point. Any appearance of cuteness is a cunning trap.

---

Isn't everything in Australia?

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by orfeo:
Kangaroos generally just vaguely look at you with mild disinterest.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by mousethief:

quote:

---

Originally posted by orfeo:
Kangaroos generally just vaguely look at you with mild disinterest.

---

That was my experience of the girls in high school.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by lilBuddha:
Being proud of what is, most often, random chance.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by mousethief:

quote:

---

Originally posted by orfeo:
Kangaroos generally just vaguely look at you with mild disinterest.

---

That was my experience of the girls in high school.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Karl: Liberal Backslider:

quote:

---

Originally posted by mousethief:

quote:

---

Originally posted by orfeo:
Kangaroos generally just vaguely look at you with mild disinterest.

---

That was my experience of the girls in high school.

---

You too?

---

Oh wait, did he say "disinterest"? I thought he said "distaste".
 

---

Posted by irish_lord99 (# 16250) on :
 
Having spent a good amount of time living outside of my native US, I think I can safely say that I feel most 'at home' here, and probably will never live elsewhere again.

That said, we totally should import the metric system, dividing by 10 is so much better than 8th's, 16th's, 32nds' etc... that and calculating my truck's output of rods per hog's head of fuel gets tiresome.

Re the OP: I hear enough conservative talk radio at work to know that your talking heads think America is a pretty shit place to live too. They also think that we're doing poorly economically, and our foreign policy sucks, and basically everything is going down the toilet. They think the US is a horrible country, but of course it's still the 'best' at the same time. Somehow a single presidency seems to have destroyed the 'best and most well-founded' country of all time.

The cognitive dissonance astounds me, especially Glenn Beck: how he can spell out doom and gloom for this 'damned' country, and then turn around in the next half hour and chant the constitution while crossing himself and facing his holy wall on which hang icons of George Washington, Abe Lincoln, and Thomas Jefferson.

The guy probably masturbates to an American flag.
 

---

Posted by mousethief (# 953) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by irish_lord99:
That said, we totally should import the metric system, dividing by 10 is so much better than 8th's, 16th's, 32nds' etc... that and calculating my truck's output of rods per hog's head of fuel gets tiresome.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by mousethief:

quote:

---

Originally posted by irish_lord99:
That said, we totally should import the metric system, dividing by 10 is so much better than 8th's, 16th's, 32nds' etc... that and calculating my truck's output of rods per hog's head of fuel gets tiresome.

---

Bah. Nobody divides recipes into 10ths. Cutting a recipe in half, or in thirds, all the time. And nobody uses rods or chains or furlongs anymore so all that is just rhetorical crap. Does anybody use decimeters and dekameters and every other name for every power of ten? If so that's a bloody lot to memorize. If not it's all a bunch of rot. The metric system is a good thing in a practical sense because it's used so widely. In an intrinsic sense, it's an inconvenient gimmick.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by mousethief:
And nobody uses rods or chains or furlongs anymore so all that is just rhetorical crap.

---

A chain (22 yards) is the distance between the wickets on a cricket pitch. Although the word isn't used so much, the distance itself lives on around the world.

Furlongs are very much used still in horse racing.

[ 22. March 2013, 11:52: Message edited by: Anglican't ]
 

---

Posted by TomOfTarsus (# 3053) on :
 
In the interest of Dimensional Ecumenism, I should point out that in my office (engineers), we frequently use heat transfer units such as Watts/(inch-°C). It just makes the numbers more comfortable.

But I work wood at home an would far rather use fractions than millimeters, and can quickly add them in my head. I have a machinist's text from the 1940's that says the ability to use halves, quarters, etc. is what makes the imperial system superior and is why the metric system will never be adopted in the USA (or "The Lost Colonies", thanks for that! ). But once below 1/64ths of an inch (~ .015 in. or 0.4 mm), I'm into decimals anyway, and certainly so on any drawings requiring precision machining.

Funny how we get used to things. I don't like a lot of furniture from a certain Swedish big box store in the US solely because it is metric; the proportions are different from imperial sizes and for some reason I notice it. It's quality, ease of assembly, etc, is just fine, I just don't like the proportions.

And in the end, it doesn't matter. We use a whiteboard math program here at work that allows you to perform calculations pretty much as they would be written on paper. The added bonus is that it keeps track of your units and their consistency - for instance, you can add millimeters and miles (and rods and chains and hands and barleycorns), but not millimeters and milliliters. This of course inspires my shenanigans, as I have all these oddball units defined and can occasionally provide the boss with a completely correct, but totally incomprehensible, set of results.

I'm not real good at this Hell thing.... enjoy!
 

---

Posted by no prophet (# 15560) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by mousethief:

quote:

---

Originally posted by irish_lord99:
That said, we totally should import the metric system, dividing by 10 is so much better than 8th's, 16th's, 32nds' etc... that and calculating my truck's output of rods per hog's head of fuel gets tiresome.

---

Bah. Nobody divides recipes into 10ths. Cutting a recipe in half, or in thirds, all the time. And nobody uses rods or chains or furlongs anymore so all that is just rhetorical crap. Does anybody use decimeters and dekameters and every other name for every power of ten? If so that's a bloody lot to memorize. If not it's all a bunch of rot. The metric system is a good thing in a practical sense because it's used so widely. In an intrinsic sense, it's an inconvenient gimmick.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by no prophet:
Have been living in a hybrid system since the 1970s in Canada. We mix it up all the time.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Zach82:
Fact is, we do perfectly well with the imperial system, have always done so, and and whatever the charms of the metric system they aren't worth the effort of switching.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by irish_lord99:
Oh, and as far as cooking goes, a third of a liter is a lot easier to figure than a third of a quart.

---

Not really, by the by. 4 cups in a quart, divided by 3 equals 1 1/3 cups. It's the virtue of the imperial system. We can just make fractions and call it a day.

[ 22. March 2013, 13:45: Message edited by: Zach82 ]
 

---

Posted by TomOfTarsus (# 3053) on :
 
But in case you do, Zach82, it's 251,040 (with a comma, not a decimal point!).

I like your take... it really is just that. On a woodworking forum I've posted on, by far the longest thread they have is a metric-vs-imperial one. And guess what? The wood doesn't care!

ETA: Oh, blast it. CP'd with Anglican't and Zach82

[ 22. March 2013, 13:46: Message edited by: TomOfTarsus ]
 

---

Posted by Zach82 (# 3208) on :
 
If we can't live with fractions, a third of a cup is one third of 16 tablespoons, which works out to 5 1/3 table spoons, which is the very easy 5 tablespoons 1 teaspoons.

Though now we're just being masochistic.
 

---

Posted by orfeo (# 13878) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by Anglican't:
I agree - after all, the Americans put a man on the moon and built a coast-to-coast railway using the imperial system, so it can't be all bad, can it?

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by mousethief:
Does anybody use decimeters and dekameters and every other name for every power of ten? If so that's a bloody lot to memorize. If not it's all a bunch of rot.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Zach82:

quote:

---

Originally posted by irish_lord99:
Oh, and as far as cooking goes, a third of a liter is a lot easier to figure than a third of a quart.

---

Not really, by the by. 4 cups in a quart, divided by 3 equals 1 1/3 cups. It's the virtue of the imperial system. We can just make fractions and call it a day.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by no prophet:
If you want to be more confused, Wikipedia demonstrates the confusion.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by orfeo:
Christ on a bike.

---

quote:

---

I think you picked the wrong one to make a point with - quarts....

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by orfeo:

quote:

---

Originally posted by Anglican't:
I agree - after all, the Americans put a man on the moon and built a coast-to-coast railway using the imperial system, so it can't be all bad, can it?

---

They also crashed a spacecraft into Mars because of their inability to talk with their European colleagues.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by RuthW:
How many vehicles has your country launched into space? Landed on the moon? Mars? How many vehicles launched from Australia are reaching the farthest edges of the solar system?

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Anglican't:
Furlongs are very much used still in horse racing.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by orfeo:
They also crashed a spacecraft into Mars because of their inability to talk with their European colleagues.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by no prophet:
When I cook, 2 tablespoons is 1/8 of a cup, which is the way I do small amounts. Not sure if 2 Tbsp is 1/8 of a cup in the USA or not.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by RuthW:

quote:

---

Originally posted by orfeo:

quote:

---

Originally posted by Anglican't:
I agree - after all, the Americans put a man on the moon and built a coast-to-coast railway using the imperial system, so it can't be all bad, can it?

---

They also crashed a spacecraft into Mars because of their inability to talk with their European colleagues.

---

How many vehicles has your country launched into space? Landed on the moon? Mars? How many vehicles launched from Australia are reaching the farthest edges of the solar system?

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by mousethief:

quote:

---

Originally posted by Anglican't:
Furlongs are very much used still in horse racing.

---

Well enough. But does anybody worry about converting them to anything? Indeed does anybody worry about just how long they are, except racetrack designers?

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Zach82:
If we can't live with fractions, a third of a cup is one third of 16 tablespoons, which works out to 5 1/3 table spoons, which is the very easy 5 tablespoons 1 teaspoons.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Anglican't:
I suppose if one is interested at all in horse racing one needs to have an understanding of how long a furlong actually is, so that when the commentator says 'there are two furlongs to go' you know what sort of distance is involved.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by orfeo:
Christ on a bike. If that's simpler than a system where you simply move the decimal point up and down between numbers that don't have to change because we count in base 10 in the first place

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by John Holding:

quote:

---

Originally posted by Zach82:
If we can't live with fractions, a third of a cup is one third of 16 tablespoons, which works out to 5 1/3 table spoons, which is the very easy 5 tablespoons 1 teaspoons.

---

But only if you use US cups and Tablespoons. Imperial cups (10 imperial oz, not 8 US oz)and Tablespoons are different. I have no idea whether the relationship between them is the same.

John

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by John Holding:
I was merely pointing out that the relationship between UK cups and tablespoons was (potentially) different, given that both cups and Tablespoons are different sizes in the UK.

John

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by mousethief:
[QUOTE]Originally posted by orfeo:
[qb]...The computations we have to do with measurements in every day life require multiplying or dividing by powers of ten just about zero times.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Jay-Emm:
If daily life includes school level calculations, then it it does in the metric system, because that's where all the unit conversion goes.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by mousethief:

quote:

---

Originally posted by Jay-Emm:
If daily life includes school level calculations, then it it does in the metric system, because that's where all the unit conversion goes.

---

Huh?

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Karl: Liberal Backslider:

quote:

---

Originally posted by mousethief:

quote:

---

Originally posted by orfeo:
Kangaroos generally just vaguely look at you with mild disinterest.

---

That was my experience of the girls in high school.

---

You too?

---

Huh! You don't know how lucky you are! They nearly all liked me.

Just Not In That Way

[ 22. March 2013, 19:50: Message edited by: ken ]
 

---

Posted by comet (# 10353) on :
 
are we really having an argument over units of measurement?

just can't get any decent reading around here. pathetic.
 

---

Posted by ken (# 2460) on :
 
And Americans did not build the first atom bomb in Imperial units. They used metric like everyone else. Well, not quite like everyone else, they used cgs instead of mks but you can't have everything.

American scientists tend to be sensible about these things. And they now use SI like the rest of us. Its the engineers that stick to the old units.

Its sort of quid pro quo among the great old civilisations. In the future (a future that is already here in science) every serious project anywhere in the world will use the English language to write in (and often to talk in), French units of measurement, American software & telecommunications standards (except for the Web, we did that one), and Chinese date formats. We had to leave something for the Chinese.

And I still don't get what this thread is about.
 

---

Posted by no prophet (# 15560) on :
 
The one that is highly curious is related to computers. Everyone assumes the metric "10" applies to them. Except that a byte is 8 bits. Thus a megabyte or gigabyte does not actually represent what it is.

The other ones that might convince us that, although metric can assist in calculations, God prefers esoteric numbers, are pi (3.14), phi (1.6) and e (2.7)**. God obviously likes us to have to calculate in complex ways or we'd have different sensible 10-based numbers built into mathematical constants of the universe.

** Hellish footnote: if you don't know these numbers, your school was crap, you didn't pay attention or you're just stupid (or all of these).
 

---

Posted by Organ Builder (# 12478) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by ken:
And I still don't get what this thread is about.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by ken:

Its sort of quid pro quo among the great old civilisations. In the future (a future that is already here in science) every serious project anywhere in the world will use the English language to write in (and often to talk in), French units of measurement, American software & telecommunications standards (except for the Web, we did that one), and Chinese date formats. We had to leave something for the Chinese.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Firenze:
So America is the Great Satan on account of measuring cake mix in spoons - and possibly furlongs - which differ from other people's spoons/furlongs. ?

Damn, no wonder they're hated across two hemispheres.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by no prophet:
The one that is highly curious is related to computers. Everyone assumes the metric "10" applies to them. Except that a byte is 8 bits. Thus a megabyte or gigabyte does not actually represent what it is.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Augustine the Aleut:

Still, this is a USA-related thread and I should let you all get back to it, all the while regretting that, on its foundation, the USA did not adopt the more honest name of The Lost Provinces.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by ken:
In the future (a future that is already here in science) every serious project anywhere in the world will use the English language to write in (and often to talk in), French units of measurement, American software & telecommunications standards (except for the Web, we did that one), and Chinese date formats.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by RuthW:

quote:

---

Originally posted by ken:
In the future (a future that is already here in science) every serious project anywhere in the world will use the English language to write in (and often to talk in), French units of measurement, American software & telecommunications standards (except for the Web, we did that one), and Chinese date formats.

---

That's the utopian future. In the dystopian future, every serious project will use the Chinese language to communicate, American units of measurement, French software & telecommunications standards, and Mayan date formats.

---

 

---

Posted by mousethief (# 953) on :
 
...the Germans are the police, the English are the cooks, ...
 

---

Posted by orfeo (# 13878) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by RuthW:

quote:

---

Originally posted by orfeo:

quote:

---

Originally posted by Anglican't:
I agree - after all, the Americans put a man on the moon and built a coast-to-coast railway using the imperial system, so it can't be all bad, can it?

---

They also crashed a spacecraft into Mars because of their inability to talk with their European colleagues.

---

How many vehicles has your country launched into space? Landed on the moon? Mars? How many vehicles launched from Australia are reaching the farthest edges of the solar system?

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by mousethief:

quote:

---

Originally posted by orfeo:
Christ on a bike. If that's simpler than a system where you simply move the decimal point up and down between numbers that don't have to change because we count in base 10 in the first place

---

And people are far too stupid to do anything else. This attitude just coddles math ignorance. It's no more difficult to divide 10 by 2 and get 5 than it is to divide 12 by 2 and get 6. The computations we have to do with measurements in every day life require multiplying or dividing by powers of ten just about zero times.

---

How convenient of you to use whole numbers like that.

I'm pretty damn sure, though, that I can work out how many centimetres there are in 1.83 metres way, WAY quicker than you can work out how many inches there are in 1.83 yards.

Ready? Go. 183!
 

---

Posted by Zach82 (# 3208) on :
 
I've somehow managed to live 31 years without once having to know how many inches are in 1.83 yards. So who gives a shit?

[ 23. March 2013, 01:24: Message edited by: Zach82 ]
 

---

Posted by Dark Knight (# 9415) on :
 
You and the other idiots who keep banging on about it, apparently.
A rant about America that turns into a nerd off about units of measurement.
If anyone needs me, I will be dunking my head in a litre of water until I pass out. Or maybe it will be a quart.
 

---

Posted by Evensong (# 14696) on :
 
Important difference. It will significantly effect the passing out rate!

<I'll get me coat>
 

---

Posted by Lyda*Rose (# 4544) on :
 
Did someone declare a truce in the Pond War and forget to memo me?
 

---

Posted by Palimpsest (# 16772) on :
 
I'm an American born and raised. There are many things wrong here, including the war on terror eating up the rule of law.
However, America does have a number of good things many recognized around the world

Hollywood Movies
Jazz
Barbecue

Oh and that grossly oversized standing army does come in useful sometimes. I keep thinking that the US is at an inflection point, like Britain during the Suez crisis, where it becomes clear that we can't afford our empire any more.
 

---

Posted by lilBuddha (# 14333) on :
 
Don't forget the Blues. Though it did take Brits to make Yanks realise it was cool.
 

---

Posted by Anglican't (# 15292) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by mousethief:
... the English are the cooks, ...

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Palimpsest:
I keep thinking that the US is at an inflection point, like Britain during the Suez crisis, where it becomes clear that we can't afford our empire any more.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by John Holding:

quote:

---

Originally posted by Zach82:
If we can't live with fractions, a third of a cup is one third of 16 tablespoons, which works out to 5 1/3 table spoons, which is the very easy 5 tablespoons 1 teaspoons.

---

But only if you use US cups and Tablespoons. Imperial cups (10 imperial oz, not 8 US oz)and Tablespoons are different. I have no idea whether the relationship between them is the same.

John

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Zach82:
With the US set to be the top oil producer, and North America set to become self reliant in its oil needs, there seems a good chance that the Middle East will just not be our problem anymore. Which may not be the unequivocal blessing some people imagine, but it's a possibility not entirely without charms.

---

quote:

---

Unless the United Church of Canada Taliban arises and, with preaching bands starched, the Moderator cuts off our regular 3,131 thousand barrels per day to the United States.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Zach82:

quote:

---

Unless the United Church of Canada Taliban arises and, with preaching bands starched, the Moderator cuts off our regular 3,131 thousand barrels per day to the United States.

---

Puh-LEEZE. We'd march over the weak opposition and on the capital (Toronto), where we'll be greeted as liberators!

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Anglican't:

quote:

---

Originally posted by mousethief:
... the English are the cooks, ...

---

This is not necessarily a bad thing.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by lilBuddha:
Sorry, that is merely the culinary version of the Stockholm Syndrome.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Zach82:
With the US set to be the top oil producer, and North America set to become self reliant in its oil needs, there seems a good chance that the Middle East will just not be our problem anymore. Which may not be the unequivocal blessing some people imagine, but it's a possibility not entirely without charms.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Zach82:

quote:

---

Unless the United Church of Canada Taliban arises and, with preaching bands starched, the Moderator cuts off our regular 3,131 thousand barrels per day to the United States.

---

Puh-LEEZE. We'd march over the weak opposition and on the capital (Toronto), where we'll be greeted as liberators!

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Firenze:

quote:

---

Originally posted by Zach82:

quote:

---

Unless the United Church of Canada Taliban arises and, with preaching bands starched, the Moderator cuts off our regular 3,131 thousand barrels per day to the United States.

---

Puh-LEEZE. We'd march over the weak opposition and on the capital (Toronto), where we'll be greeted as liberators!

---

Wait. Aren't you the chap who went off bang one time at the suggestion that there might be a war between the USA and Canada over natural resources (water, in that instance).

---

And they say Americans don't get sarcasm.
 

---

Posted by mousethief (# 953) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by Zach82:
I've somehow managed to live 31 years without once having to know how many inches are in 1.83 yards. So who gives a shit?

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Dark Knight:
You and the other idiots who keep banging on about it, apparently.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Doublethink:
usually because someone is selling you white goods and they tend to quote the dimensions in centimetres. However, being centimetres all you have to do is take the decimal point out.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Zach82:

quote:

---

Originally posted by Doublethink:
usually because someone is selling you white goods and they tend to quote the dimensions in centimetres. However, being centimetres all you have to do is take the decimal point out.

---

That's precisely why the ease of converting 1.83 years to inches in irrelevant. No one says "I'd like 1.83 yards of material please!" A sane person says "Gimme five and a half feet, if you don't mind."

---

quote:

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Originally posted by Zach82:
I like English cooking. I even bake pork pies from scratch since they don't sell them at convenience stores here.

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Originally posted by Zach82:

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Originally posted by Firenze:

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Originally posted by Zach82:

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Unless the United Church of Canada Taliban arises and, with preaching bands starched, the Moderator cuts off our regular 3,131 thousand barrels per day to the United States.

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Puh-LEEZE. We'd march over the weak opposition and on the capital (Toronto), where we'll be greeted as liberators!

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Wait. Aren't you the chap who went off bang one time at the suggestion that there might be a war between the USA and Canada over natural resources (water, in that instance).

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And they say Americans don't get sarcasm.

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Originally posted by Zach82:
You are so smart, and your observations are so insightful, Firenze.

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Originally posted by comet:
are we really having an argument over units of measurement?

just can't get any decent reading around here. pathetic.

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Originally posted by RooK:
I've been too busy to wade into this thread until now. I'd just like to point out that pretty much all of you are totally full of shit.

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Originally posted by Evensong:

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Originally posted by RooK:
I've been too busy to wade into this thread until now. I'd just like to point out that pretty much all of you are totally full of shit.

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At least orfeo was on the money describing our country.

Viva la Oztralia!

p.s. It's not too hot. You're all just soft.

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No, people who are soft (or nesh as we say around here) complain of the cold when it's just a tad nippy, as over the last couple of days or so. Honestly, it's barely been below zero. Celsius, that is, not the random opium dream that is Fahrenheit.
 

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Posted by Boogie (# 13538) on :
 
My reply is far too heavenly for down here - so here is a thread to discuss it
 

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Posted by Otter (# 12020) on :
 

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Originally posted by mousethief:
Originally posted by Zach82:
Not to be argumentative (not that I mind that), but any stitcher in this country would just ask for the nearest half or quarter yard, and would not measure fabric in feet at all.

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Originally posted by Otter:
Actually, Zach82 seems to be channelling the minds of the damn fabric stores in the greater Chicago 'burbs. They've moved away from fractional-yards to feet, or maybe inches.

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Originally posted by Porridge:

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Originally posted by Otter:
Actually, Zach82 seems to be channelling the minds of the damn fabric stores in the greater Chicago 'burbs. They've moved away from fractional-yards to feet, or maybe inches.

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How extremely odd. What kind of sewing project would ever require only inches of fabric?

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Originally posted by Otter:

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Originally posted by Porridge:

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Originally posted by Otter:
Actually, Zach82 seems to be channelling the minds of the damn fabric stores in the greater Chicago 'burbs. They've moved away from fractional-yards to feet, or maybe inches.

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How extremely odd. What kind of sewing project would ever require only inches of fabric?

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Quilters often buy "fat quarters", which is equal in area to a quarter-yard, or just 9 inches, of 45" fabric, but in a form factor that's closer to a square. I sometimes buy fat quarters for trim or doll clothes.

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Originally posted by RooK:
Which is how we end up with Americans who are so blatantly myopic about any objective context of their circumstances. And I don't just mean Republicans (though, you know, definitely including most of them). So - every American here "speaking for all America": a pat on the head, and "that's nice for you".

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Originally posted by mousethief:

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Originally posted by Zach82:

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Originally posted by Doublethink:
usually because someone is selling you white goods and they tend to quote the dimensions in centimetres. However, being centimetres all you have to do is take the decimal point out.

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That's precisely why the ease of converting 1.83 years to inches in irrelevant. No one says "I'd like 1.83 yards of material please!" A sane person says "Gimme five and a half feet, if you don't mind."

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Not to be argumentative (not that I mind that), but any stitcher in this country would just ask for the nearest half or quarter yard, and would not measure fabric in feet at all.

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Originally posted by PataLeBon:
...(And who uses a ruler that measures in hundredths of a foot anyhow??)

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Originally posted by the gnome:
Female suffrage. At the national level we weren't especially quick to adopt female suffrage. But in some states, especially those in the West, women had the vote from the 1860s.

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"We had already taken the resolute action of pulling out of the Nuclear Non-Proliferation Treaty and have manufactured nuclear arms for self-defence to cope with the Bush administration's evermore undisguised policy to isolate and stifle the DPRK [Democratic People's Republic of Korea]," a North Korean Foreign Ministry statement said regarding the issue.

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Originally posted by ExclamationMark:
I heard on the BBC news last night that the US Secretary of State has said that North Korea is not allowed to have nuclear missiles.

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Originally posted by ExclamationMark:
On another point that the USesn't do well ... I heard on the BBC news last night that the US Secretary of State has said that North Korea is not allowed to have nuclear missiles. Who does he think he is to make such pronouncements? Arrogance of the first order!

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Originally posted by RuthW:
[QUOTE]He thinks he's one of the people charged with preventing North Korea from launching nuclear missiles at the U.S. As I'm living rather close to one of the supposed targets, I'm glad to see he's doing his job.

So either get yourself up to speed on this topic or fuck off. Either one works for me.

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Originally posted by ExclamationMark:
Unless you happen to be black of course or one of the native tribes. Don't they still own the land on which New York was built?

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Originally posted by moron:
you speak with the rare authority of dual citizenship

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if you had to choose between your Motherland and your adopted one, which would it be?

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Originally posted by ExclamationMark:
On another point that the USesn't do well ... I heard on the BBC news last night that the US Secretary of State has said that North Korea is not allowed to have nuclear missiles. Who does he think he is to make such pronouncements? Arrogance of the first order!

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quote:

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Originally posted by RooK:
There is a portion of getting an American citizenship where I would need to swear to renounce Canadian loyalties, and while it is functionally meaningless I still won't do it.

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But it's possible I can only afford that view because I'm a moderately affluent white male in a progressive region.

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You can also have a similar view if you're merely a striving to be moderately affluent white male in a less than progressive region.




[and WHO would have ever thought you lot would coax 4000 posts out of me ]

[ 17. April 2013, 15:31: Message edited by: moron ]
 

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Posted by RooK (# 1852) on :
 

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Originally posted by moron:
You can also have a similar view if you're merely a striving to be moderately affluent white male in a less than progressive region.

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Originally posted by Organ Builder:
Not that we have any right to be proud of the way we treated the native Americans once we were on our own, but the dreadful policies were a continuation of the policies put in place when we were English colonies. For that matter, there is no reason to believe the the 19th century would have been any better for native tribes if we had NOT become independent.

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Originally posted by Hawk:
There was always a tension between what the local colonist settlers wanted (more land to the West) and the official policy of the British government (usually trade with the natives to make money and protect these sources of revenue - in this case the lucrative fur trade). But I think the British government would have restrained the worst excesses of the genocide if they'd still been in charge. You can see their approach in the Proclamation of 1763, which barred colonial migration west of the Appalachians, and they posted soldiers along the frontier to enforce this decree.

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Like they did in Canada and Australia?

Honestly, you would think the UK would have gotten over its white man's burden, enlightened colonizer complex by now.

 

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Posted by Horseman Bree (# 5290) on :
 
How does a comment about policies of 1763 mean that we are still imbued with the Empire spirit? Might just as well say that everyone in America believes in witches because of the Puritans of Salem.
 

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Posted by Sioni Sais (# 5713) on :
 
Please guys, while we have low standards in Hell, we really don't want a Pond War. They always turn out unhappily, like marching on Moscow.

FWIW, it's wrong to treat the pre-Revolutionary colonies as a whole. Some were founded for trade, some for religious freedom. They were created for a variety of purposes and that is reflected in their history.
 

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Posted by orfeo (# 13878) on :
 

quote:

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Originally posted by Horseman Bree:
How does a comment about policies of 1763 mean that we are still imbued with the Empire spirit? Might just as well say that everyone in America believes in witches because of the Puritans of Salem.

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