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Source: (consider it)
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Thread: Is it really the Last Jedi? Spoilers, too!! Beware!
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jedijudy
Organist of the Jedi Temple
# 333
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Posted
OK, this is for all of us who are jedi, clones, Corellian Scum, Sith lords, and other beings who have thoughts and opinions about the upcoming Star Wars movie.
Here's one trailer for those who haven't seen it.
Trailer.
Now, it looks suspiciously like Rey is talking to Kylo Ren, which upset Daughter-Unit and I greatly. However, since the backgrounds in that clip are different, I'm hoping that's a deliberate red herring!
D-U, my S-i-L and I will be seeing The Last Jedi the evening before it officially opens. But until then, speculate away! Let us know when new trailers are out! Help us! You're our only hope!!
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Jasmine, little cat with a big heart.
Posts: 18017 | From: 'Twixt the 'Glades and the Gulf | Registered: Aug 2001
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simontoad
Ship's Amphibian
# 18096
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Posted
Before the last film came out, the one with the Death Star AGAIN, I binge-watched the previous films. This was a huge mistake, as I became incensed at what I saw as a recycled storyline. I was so upset that when a bloke in the cinema got up and walked out I thought he was protesting and almost got up and followed him out, fist in the air. He came back a few minutes later, so it would have been really embarrassing if I had done it. Me: Solidarity brother. These bastards are ripping us off blind. Did they do the script during the writers' strike? Him: I'm just going for a piss mate.
When I spoke to my brother about it, he said I was crazy and pointed out all the differences, which were minor but sufficient. My big beef was that the Death Star had basically the same design flaw as the one Luke blew up, and I raved and ranted about that until my brother calmly pointed out that I was an idiot.
In order to curry favor with my Nephews, I have pre-purchased the video game Star Wars Battlefront 2: 2017, and my minor participation in the beta has re-kindled my interest in the franchise. I think I might see that film with Rey again, the Rogue Nation one, and this new one too. If I'm really polite about them, the nephews might look after me in my dotage.
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Human
Posts: 1571 | From: Romsey, Vic, AU | Registered: May 2014
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Trudy Scrumptious
BBE Shieldmaiden
# 5647
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by jedijudy:
Now, it looks suspiciously like Rey is talking to Kylo Ren, which upset Daughter-Unit and I greatly. However, since the backgrounds in that clip are different, I'm hoping that's a deliberate red herring!
Is this the thing that people were upset about and described as a big spoiler? To me that looked like a classic example of misleading scene-cutting in the trailer. You can't tell who either Rey or Kylo Ren is talking to in that scene: I think it's cut from two different scenes to make it look like they're talking to each other. But I guess we'll see!
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Books and things.
I lied. There are no things. Just books.
Posts: 7428 | From: Closer to Paris than I am to Vancouver | Registered: Mar 2004
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Trudy Scrumptious
BBE Shieldmaiden
# 5647
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Posted
Was there anything in the trailer that suggested Kylo killing Leia? If so, I missed it (not that I mind an excuse to watch it again).
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Books and things.
I lied. There are no things. Just books.
Posts: 7428 | From: Closer to Paris than I am to Vancouver | Registered: Mar 2004
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jedijudy
Organist of the Jedi Temple
# 333
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Posted
I took the scene where Leia was looking out the window of whatever space ship that was, and Kylo Ren with his finger on the trigger could be another red herring, or it could be how Carrie Fisher (msriparig) gets written out of the story.
Simontoad, that annoyed me too, but it seems the Evil Empire, or First Order or current bad dudes all seem to think they'll eventually get the Death Star right.
Bad Guy 1: "Let's just make it bigger!!"
Bad Guy 2: "Yeah, that'll work!"
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Jasmine, little cat with a big heart.
Posts: 18017 | From: 'Twixt the 'Glades and the Gulf | Registered: Aug 2001
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no prophet's flag is set so...
Proceed to see sea
# 15560
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Posted
Isn't it usual that Jedi have trouble with their teachers in some way? Daddy issues have already been repeated. Maybe we're going to do mummy issues now. It's in Freud somewhere, who got it from the ancient Greeks. What symbology is the big eared white cat-goat in the trailer. An archetype perhaps?
Posts: 11498 | From: Treaty 6 territory in the nonexistant Province of Buffalo, Canada ↄ⃝' | Registered: Mar 2010
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Kelly Alves
Bunny with an axe
# 2522
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by la vie en rouge:
I thought the big give-away was that Kylo-Ren is going to kill his mother. They have to write Carrie Fisher out of the series somehow (sniff).
Adam Driver ( throwing down script) :"Are you shitting me? Are you out of your minds? Little kids will be shin- kicking me in the streets! "
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I cannot expect people to believe “
Jesus loves me, this I know” of they don’t believe “Kelly loves me, this I know.”
Kelly Alves, somewhere around 2003.
Posts: 35076 | From: Pura Californiana | Registered: Mar 2002
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jedijudy
Organist of the Jedi Temple
# 333
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Posted
For being such a great human being, Adam Driver sure plays a believable evil bad guy!
I'm hoping for a story of redemption, but what do I know?
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Jasmine, little cat with a big heart.
Posts: 18017 | From: 'Twixt the 'Glades and the Gulf | Registered: Aug 2001
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Trudy Scrumptious
BBE Shieldmaiden
# 5647
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Posted
Oh, I think we're getting a Kylo Ren redemption arc, but not to be completed in this movie. Also I think killing BOTH your parents might be a bit too far to come back from for a redemption story, but that's just me.
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Books and things.
I lied. There are no things. Just books.
Posts: 7428 | From: Closer to Paris than I am to Vancouver | Registered: Mar 2004
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Eutychus
From the edge
# 3081
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Kelly Alves:
quote:
Originally posted by la vie en rouge:
I thought the big give-away was that Kylo-Ren is going to kill his mother. They have to write Carrie Fisher out of the series somehow (sniff).
Adam Driver ( throwing down script) :"Are you shitting me? Are you out of your minds? Little kids will be shin- kicking me in the streets! "
"Leia shot first".
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Let's remember that we are to build the Kingdom of God, not drive people away - pastor Frank Pomeroy
Posts: 17944 | From: 528491 | Registered: Jul 2002
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jedijudy
Organist of the Jedi Temple
# 333
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Posted
OK. I just saw The Last Jedi! WooHoo!! ![[Big Grin]](biggrin.gif) ![[Yipee]](graemlins/spin.gif)
I'm not going to tell you all anything. Yet.
Daughter-Unit and my handsome Son-in-Law and I all thought it was a magnificent movie! There were so many surprises and we thought things were going one way, and they went another! And it was so good to see Carrie Fisher again. ![[Tear]](graemlins/tear.gif)
When more of you have seen it, and we think it's safe to discuss, I think we should do so and parse out what will happen next! Oh boy, oh boy!
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Jasmine, little cat with a big heart.
Posts: 18017 | From: 'Twixt the 'Glades and the Gulf | Registered: Aug 2001
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sharkshooter
Not your average shark
# 1589
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Posted
I can't believe we have to wait two full years before Episode IX comes out.
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Let the words of my mouth, and the meditation of my heart, be acceptable in thy sight, O LORD, my strength, and my redeemer. [Psalm 19:14]
Posts: 7772 | From: Canada; Washington DC; Phoenix; it's complicated | Registered: Oct 2001
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Prester John
Shipmate
# 5502
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by sharkshooter:
I can't believe we have to wait two full years before Episode IX comes out.
Two years is nothing. If Lucas was running things we would have to wait for the next presidential administration before seeing it. He took way too long.
Posts: 884 | From: SF Bay Area | Registered: Feb 2004
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sharkshooter
Not your average shark
# 1589
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Posted
Yeah, but I had lots more years left back then.
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Let the words of my mouth, and the meditation of my heart, be acceptable in thy sight, O LORD, my strength, and my redeemer. [Psalm 19:14]
Posts: 7772 | From: Canada; Washington DC; Phoenix; it's complicated | Registered: Oct 2001
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jedijudy
Organist of the Jedi Temple
# 333
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Posted
D-U and I were debating things about the movie this morning. It's fun to talk to her since she's as much a fanatic as I am. I did raise her right, and she married another one just like us!
We're going to see it again on Sunday. There was so much going on, there are things we have to check out. Of course, we may have to go a few more times to make sure our observations are correct.
![[Biased]](wink.gif)
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Jasmine, little cat with a big heart.
Posts: 18017 | From: 'Twixt the 'Glades and the Gulf | Registered: Aug 2001
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Wet Kipper
Circus Runaway
# 1654
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Posted
I saw it on Friday. Some bits i liked, some bits i didn't but on the whole I think it was a great film, a solid addition to both the overall story and the individual character arcs and that it set up the next film without us being able to guess exactly what will happen in the next film
Once we are able to discuss freely, without fear of spoiling, there are a few points I would like to chew over with other people
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- insert randomly chosen, potentially Deep and Meaningful™ song lyrics here -
Posts: 9841 | From: further up the Hill | Registered: Nov 2001
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jedijudy
Organist of the Jedi Temple
# 333
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Wet Kipper:
Once we are able to discuss freely, without fear of spoiling, there are a few points I would like to chew over with other people
I agree, Wet Kipper.
D-U and I saw it again yesterday, and enjoyed it as much or more than the first time. For some reason, the funny parts were even funnier because we knew they were coming!
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Jasmine, little cat with a big heart.
Posts: 18017 | From: 'Twixt the 'Glades and the Gulf | Registered: Aug 2001
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Sipech
Shipmate
# 16870
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Posted
THIS COMMENT CONTAINS SPOILERS
I saw it on Saturday.
This is a bumph sentence to fill space lest anyone failed to understand the top line.
OK?
Some have commented favourably about the film's humour. I thought it was laid on a little too thick at the start. There were some really obvious plotlines that could have been explored, but I thought they were dodged quite well.
What struck me most about the film was the abandoning of the sequential timeline that has been a feature in most of the other Star Wars films, instead opting for parallel stories. This was done to some extent in The Empire Strikes Back with Luke's training on Degobar (sp?) while the others went to the cloud city. But the plot of the The Last Jedi was sufficiently different, so I don't think any accusation of trying to copy The Empire Strikes Back would stand up to much scrutiny.
The only bit I really didn't like was the "flying/floating" scene. I thought it was a good juncture and was thinking "Ah, so that's how they resolved that point" only to then have that particular element of the film continue.
Though I did twig that there was something off with the beard colour later on in the film, which was quite well done, but as I said: I did spot it.
By the way, anyone else thing the crystal critters should've been called ice foxes? Crystal critters is such a crap name.
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I try to be self-deprecating; I'm just not very good at it.
Twitter: http://twitter.com/TheAlethiophile
Posts: 3791 | From: On the corporate ladder | Registered: Jan 2012
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Ian Climacus
Liturgical Slattern
# 944
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Posted
** SPOLIERS **
** REALLY, SPOILERS **
** LAST WARNING **
quote:
Originally posted by Sipech:
The only bit I really didn't like was the "flying/floating" scene. I thought it was a good juncture and was thinking "Ah, so that's how they resolved that point" only to then have that particular element of the film continue.
I didn't get this bit at all. I am not a huge fan (ducks), so does this relate to something else in a previous episode? What was the point? Did she "harness" the force, or did it surround her, to keep her alive in space?
I didn't get it.
But then I only have a small brain.
Posts: 7800 | From: On the border | Registered: Jul 2001
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jedijudy
Organist of the Jedi Temple
# 333
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Ian Climacus:
** SPOLIERS **
** REALLY, SPOILERS **
** LAST WARNING **
I am not a huge fan (ducks),
![[Eek!]](eek.gif) That's OK. I have come to understand over the decades that not everyone is quite as fanatic as I am.
quote:
...so does this relate to something else in a previous episode?
I didn't get it.
If I understand what you're asking, some of us were wondering how Leia would get written out of the Star Wars Universe. Apparently the Force wasn't done with her yet!
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Jasmine, little cat with a big heart.
Posts: 18017 | From: 'Twixt the 'Glades and the Gulf | Registered: Aug 2001
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Wet Kipper
Circus Runaway
# 1654
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Posted
Is what I'm about to ask actually a spoiler ?
.
.
I'm not sure really.
..
..
.
but I'll put in some blocking text anyway
..
(edited to add) - i then looked at this posy in the "today's threads, and discovred that lines of dots, or blank spaces with carriage returns is not enough to push the contentious text out of the scope of the "preview" of my contribution when it appears in that view
Hopefully this additional prose will assist in the "blinding" process
.
.
Was anyone else hoping they would categorically confirm Rey's parentage one way or the other, or explain her "abilities" ?
I say categorically because I do not trust anything Kylo Ren said in their conversations
[ 19. December 2017, 10:05: Message edited by: Wet Kipper ]
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- insert randomly chosen, potentially Deep and Meaningful™ song lyrics here -
Posts: 9841 | From: further up the Hill | Registered: Nov 2001
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Wet Kipper
Circus Runaway
# 1654
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Posted
and then the edited post didn't show the extra text in that preview. So i'm adding a throwaway post to make it not the "newest" entry
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Posts: 9841 | From: further up the Hill | Registered: Nov 2001
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Marvin the Martian
Interplanetary
# 4360
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Sipech:
THIS COMMENT CONTAINS SPOILERS
I saw it on Saturday.
This is a bumph sentence to fill space lest anyone failed to understand the top line.
OK?
Left in for obvious reasons. Read on at your own peril - this gets pretty spoilery towards the end.
quote:
Some have commented favourably about the film's humour. I thought it was laid on a little too thick at the start.
Yes, I'd have to agree there. I felt at times that they were making a bit of a mockery of the whole thing.
quote:
The only bit I really didn't like was the "flying/floating" scene. I thought it was a good juncture and was thinking "Ah, so that's how they resolved that point" only to then have that particular element of the film continue.
One thing I really liked was immediately before then, when everyone in the entire cinema thought one person was going to pull the trigger, only for them to back out at the last minute, only for two nameless mooks to do it instead. The double subversion of what was expected was just incredible.
I agree that the floaty-flying bit was pretty darn WTF. But without it we couldn't have had the awesome scene nearer the end where she casually stuns him on the bridge of the cruiser without saying a word.
quote:
Though I did twig that there was something off with the beard colour later on in the film, which was quite well done, but as I said: I did spot it.
I spotted it too. Not just the beard, but the saber colour, the avoidance of certain death by many many guns and the ducking and diving gave it away for me.
I could have believed the saber colour was a genuine mistake if not for the fact that they'd got it right earlier in the movie.
quote:
By the way, anyone else thing the crystal critters should've been called ice foxes? Crystal critters is such a crap name.
"Crystal critters" is almost certainly just a nickname that character thought up on the spot rather than the official species name. And wasn't it nice that a creature like that was thrown in with a genuine and important part to play in the plot rather than just as a bit of CGI eye candy?
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In no particular order, some other SPOILERY things I want to say about the movie:
- OK, Rian, we get it. War is bad. But maybe you shouldn't lay that message on quite so thickly in a movie called Star Fucking WARS?
- R2D2 is a master of emotional manipulation.
- Dark Side caves are trippy as fuck.
- Why do Resistance bombers move so bloody slowly? They're in space ferchrissakes!
- Why do First Order turbolaser bolts follow ballistic trajectories? They're in space ferchrissakes!
- Why do resistance ships stop moving when they run out of fuel? They're in space ferchrissakes!
- Snoke. Fun character, shame he had to split.
- "Don't go this way, Ben". *sniff*
- Now that's what I call ramming speed. Every jaw in the room was on the floor at that scene.
- "That's how we'll beat them. Not fighting what we hate, but saving what we love"
- "I don't want to do this right now" "yeah, me too"
![[Killing me]](graemlins/killingme.gif) - So that's where blue milk comes from.
- Luke: parking X-Wings underwater since 1980.
- Best. Lightsaber kill. EVER.
- "Amazing. Every part of what you just said was wrong."
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Hail Gallaxhar
Posts: 30100 | From: Adrift on a sea of surreality | Registered: Apr 2003
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Sipech
Shipmate
# 16870
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Posted
Martin, when the new ship launches, I fully expect you to deploy quote 15 quite liberally in Purgatory and Hell.
The silent moment was pretty good. Though I was bugged by where I'd seen that actress before. I just couldn't place her. Until I saw the final credits and twigged which other film featuring creatures I'd seen her in.
As for the best lightsabre kill, there were a few options. Was it the the one where the character was sat down or the rather forceful eye poke?
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I try to be self-deprecating; I'm just not very good at it.
Twitter: http://twitter.com/TheAlethiophile
Posts: 3791 | From: On the corporate ladder | Registered: Jan 2012
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Wet Kipper
Circus Runaway
# 1654
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Marvin the Martian:
from what was Originally posted by Sipech:
THIS COMMENT CONTAINS SPOILERS
I saw it on Saturday.
This is a bumph sentence to fill space lest anyone failed to understand the top line.
Left in for obvious reasons.
Read on at your own peril - this gets pretty spoilery towards the end.
[*]Why do Resistance bombers move so bloody slowly? They're in space ferchrissakes!
agreed, even though lot of mass would still need lots of energy to move it in space, you'd think they would give them stronger engines.
But I expect the "plan" was for more stalling time to allow them to be directly over the thing before de-cloaking or whatever it was they did
[*]Now that's what I call ramming speed. Every jaw in the room was on the floor at that scene.
but why did she wait until so many of the transports had been picked off (and conveniently not the "main characters' one) before she decided to do that ?
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- insert randomly chosen, potentially Deep and Meaningful™ song lyrics here -
Posts: 9841 | From: further up the Hill | Registered: Nov 2001
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Marvin the Martian
Interplanetary
# 4360
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Sipech:
As for the best lightsabre kill, there were a few options. Was it the the one where the character was sat down or the rather forceful eye poke?
Eye poke.
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Hail Gallaxhar
Posts: 30100 | From: Adrift on a sea of surreality | Registered: Apr 2003
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Marvin the Martian
Interplanetary
# 4360
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Wet Kipper:
but why did she wait until so many of the transports had been picked off (and conveniently not the "main characters' one) before she decided to do that ?
For that matter, what in hell were the other Star Destroyers doing during that whole set piece? If I was in charge of the First Order fleet I'd have told two of them to go to hyperspace for half a second, drop out right in front of the Resistance ship and either pulverise the shit out of it or force it to waste fuel going to hyperspace itself. ![[Roll Eyes]](rolleyes.gif)
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Hail Gallaxhar
Posts: 30100 | From: Adrift on a sea of surreality | Registered: Apr 2003
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Karl: Liberal Backslider
Shipmate
# 76
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Wet Kipper:
quote:
Originally posted by Marvin the Martian:
from what was Originally posted by Sipech:
THIS COMMENT CONTAINS SPOILERS
I saw it on Saturday.
This is a bumph sentence to fill space lest anyone failed to understand the top line.
Left in for obvious reasons.
Read on at your own peril - this gets pretty spoilery towards the end.
[*]Why do Resistance bombers move so bloody slowly? They're in space ferchrissakes!
agreed, even though lot of mass would still need lots of energy to move it in space, you'd think they would give them stronger engines.
But I expect the "plan" was for more stalling time to allow them to be directly over the thing before de-cloaking or whatever it was they did
There is also the question of how when a ship in orbit (i.e. freefall) opens its bomb doors the bombs would drop at all. We'll chalk that down to Movie Space Physics Is Not Real Physics.
quote:
[*]Now that's what I call ramming speed. Every jaw in the room was on the floor at that scene.
but why did she wait until so many of the transports had been picked off (and conveniently not the "main characters' one) before she decided to do that ?
Takes a minute or two to steel yourself for a suicide move.
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Might as well ask the bloody cat.
Posts: 17938 | From: Chesterfield | Registered: May 2001
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Karl: Liberal Backslider
Shipmate
# 76
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Posted
Anyhoo, I gather the nerdier end of the Star Wars fanbase (that's a bit like saying "the more Charismatic end of HTB") don't like it much. From what I gather the objections are:
1. Fan theories uncomfirmed - ie Rey's parents not being anyone in particular, the "who is Snoke" question being answered with "that dead guy".
2. Too many main characters being female, brown or both. qf. Ghostbusters remake, Gamergate.
I despair of my fellow geeks sometimes. There are some right misogynistic knob-ends amongst them. I suppose it's natural that when your one hope of the companionship of the opposite sex is the only girl in your Warhammer group, and you're competing against thirteen other geeks, and she's going out with the captain of the football team anyway, there's a bit of resentment, but, guys, give it time, wait until your earning potential in SQL and Linux Development starts being sexier than a fading ability to score from the opposite side of the field and you'll be right.
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Might as well ask the bloody cat.
Posts: 17938 | From: Chesterfield | Registered: May 2001
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lilBuddha
Shipmate
# 14333
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Posted
Questioning the physics in Star Wars is like counting bullets shot from a cowboys six-shooter.
It misses the point and if that is what pulls you back, perhaps it is not the genre for you.
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I put on my rockin' shoes in the morning
Hallellou, hallellou
Posts: 17627 | From: the round earth's imagined corners | Registered: Dec 2008
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la vie en rouge
Parisienne
# 10688
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Posted
I have been studiously avoiding this thread until now but finally got the cinema last night.
Spoiler buffer
Spoiler buffer
Spoiler buffer
I liked it but less than the previous one. I found it a bit overlong and thought it took a while to get going.
Kylo-Ren isn’t villainous enough for me. I get the rationale for making him a conflicted character – after all, they were always going to be on a loser if they tried to come up with another baddie as evil as Darth Vader – but I still find him a bit wet behind the ears. I’m glad he’s lost the mask, OTOH. It was never as badass as his grandfather’s.
I was glad to see Yoda who has always been my favourite Jedi.
I’m intrigued that they kept Princess Leia alive until the end of the film and am intrigued as to how they’re going to write her out.
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Rent my holiday home in the South of France
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Marvin the Martian
Interplanetary
# 4360
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by la vie en rouge:
Kylo-Ren isn’t villainous enough for me. I get the rationale for making him a conflicted character – after all, they were always going to be on a loser if they tried to come up with another baddie as evil as Darth Vader – but I still find him a bit wet behind the ears.
I disagree, mostly because I think Vader's evil has always been a bit oversold. I mean, what does he actually do in the original trilogy?
ANH - picks up a guy by the throat, fails to get Leia to talk, watches passively as Tarkin destroys Alderaan, kills Obi-Wan (mostly because Obi-Wan lets it happen) and takes out a few X-Wings before being shafted by Han's heroic return.
TESB - force chokes a couple of subordinates, hires a few bounty hunters, sets a trap to catch Luke, fails to catch Luke despite being a clearly superior Force user.
ROTJ - handles a dispute with some contractors who look like not hitting their deadline, lets the rebels get through the Death Star shield, accepts Luke's surrender, mopes around a bit due to conflict between the light and dark within him, loses to Luke in a lightsaber fight, kills the Emperor, turns to the light, dies.
Kylo, by contrast, has killed Max von Sydow in cold blood, directly ordered the extermination of an entire village, literally mind raped two leading characters, murdered his own father, taken out every resistance fighter in a pretty darn cool bit of flying, killed his mentor in order to replace him as Supreme Leader, and made several good attempts to kill Luke (he didn't know it wasn't really Luke). And all while being far more conflicted about it than Vader was, which means he's having to actively and knowingly choose every act of evil rather than merely doing what he believes is right as Vader did.
It's the choice and conflict that make him such a good villain. The choice because it means he's actively trying to be evil, and the conflict because you never know what he's going to do next.
quote:
I’m intrigued that they kept Princess Leia alive until the end of the film and am intrigued as to how they’re going to write her out.
I wasn't massively surprised about it, as I knew they'd finished shooting the movie before Carrie died. They'll probably write her out via a time-skip between this movie and the next. Bets on the first line of the next opening scrawl being "Leia has died"?
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Hail Gallaxhar
Posts: 30100 | From: Adrift on a sea of surreality | Registered: Apr 2003
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lilBuddha
Shipmate
# 14333
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Posted
Vader is like Gandalf in that it is the implied power rather than its detailed use that makes them powerful.
People in the ST universe fear Vader and that is enough for the space western that the original movie is.
It is a valid story telling technique and we saw how bad Lucas is at filling in the details, so...
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I put on my rockin' shoes in the morning
Hallellou, hallellou
Posts: 17627 | From: the round earth's imagined corners | Registered: Dec 2008
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lilBuddha
Shipmate
# 14333
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Posted
OK, there are few people who hate spoilers more than I do.
But this is a thread that the title explicitly states might contain spoilers. It was started before the film’s release and there are loads of people who haven’t seen it.
Do we need a seperate thread to more organically discuss the film without risking spoiling it for people who do not mind speculation but do not want actual details confirmed?
I don’t mind putting in rows of stops or filler text to buffer what I write, but that will not be enough for some.
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I put on my rockin' shoes in the morning
Hallellou, hallellou
Posts: 17627 | From: the round earth's imagined corners | Registered: Dec 2008
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Dafyd
Shipmate
# 5549
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by la vie en rouge:
I’m glad he’s lost the mask, OTOH. It was never as badass as his grandfather’s.
That is his whole character concept right there though: try as he might he's never as badass as his grandfather.
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we remain, thanks to original sin, much in love with talking about, rather than with, one another. Rowan Williams
Posts: 10567 | From: Edinburgh | Registered: Feb 2004
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Ariston
Insane Unicorn
# 10894
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Marvin the Martian:
quote:
Originally posted by Wet Kipper:
but why did she wait until so many of the transports had been picked off (and conveniently not the "main characters' one) before she decided to do that ?
For that matter, what in hell were the other Star Destroyers doing during that whole set piece? If I was in charge of the First Order fleet I'd have told two of them to go to hyperspace for half a second, drop out right in front of the Resistance ship and either pulverise the shit out of it or force it to waste fuel going to hyperspace itself.
Have star destroyers ever been much more than set dressing in any Star Wars movie? I get that they're big and scary, but I'm trying to think of a time since Episode IV that one's actually landed a shot in anger. Even then, they don't shoot much.
Along with the obnoxiously slow bombers, I'm chalking this one up to Star Wars being Japanese WWII flying ace movies in space—lots of carrier combat, dogfights over battleships and carriers (that were by then outdated and vulnerable to small attack ships), and the like. The bomb bay shots—and slow bomber/fighter escort scenes—make more sense in that context.
For whatever reason, that's always explained Star Wars. Lucas is more interested in the warrior monks, ronin, and fighter pilots than anyone else.
Think that's enough filler. As for Rey's parents being "nobody"—probably true. She really is Just Nobody from Nowhere, put among a bunch of royalty from Somewhere. It's a new age of the Force; no more dynasties, giant temples, or preordained heroes, but rather a renewed, reformed Force.
Also, rather conveniently, it might free up Episode IX to do its own thing. That's something that's always plagued the Star Wars Expanded Universe—the desire to remake the films, but under different names. Palpatine has clones. The Imperial Remnant rises. We replace the Death Star with another Death Star with the Sun Crusher. It's the same old same old all over again.
Expanded Universe solved this by killing Chewie and starting the Yuuzhan Vong war. Suddenly, there was something New among galaxy far, far away, something that didn't fit in the old Tale of the Force. It seems LotJ is doing what TFA should have done—killing the old plot lines along with the old characters, giving them their dignified exits, and ending their dynasties. The story of Anakin Skywalker finally ended; now there's room to tell entirely new stories, without hewing to those bloodlines or baggage.
I am going to miss seeing the alien biomonsters and their living starships on screen, though.
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“Therefore, let it be explained that nowhere are the proprieties quite so strictly enforced as in men’s colleges that invite young women guests, especially over-night visitors in the fraternity houses.” Emily Post, 1937.
Posts: 6849 | From: The People's Republic of Balcones | Registered: Jan 2006
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Brenda Clough
Shipmate
# 18061
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Posted
There is of course going to be a third movie. Like the Ramans, SW does everything in threes.
I saw it today in Georgia, for =cheap.= Tickets are a third what they are in DC!
This movie is at least an hour too long. Nearly 3 hours! I have only contempt for the pandering to the toy market (the puffin-like creatures, the crystal cats, etc.) I have long ago given up on the notion of physics or space. But gosh! If you have a fleet of unarmed troop transports, and they're being picked off one by one, why not split off and separate? You have nothing to lose at this point.
If there is a less charismatic and convincing villain than Kyle Ren, I have yet to see him.
[ 27. December 2017, 20:20: Message edited by: Brenda Clough ]
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Science fiction and fantasy writer with a Patreon page
Posts: 6378 | From: Washington DC | Registered: Mar 2014
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lilBuddha
Shipmate
# 14333
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Posted
Spoilers
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quote:
Originally posted by Brenda Clough:
There is of course going to be a third movie. Like the Ramans, SW does everything in threes.
I saw it today in Georgia, for =cheap.= Tickets are a third what they are in DC!
This movie is at least an hour too long. Nearly 3 hours! I have only contempt for the pandering to the toy market (the puffin-like creatures, the crystal cats, etc.) I have long ago given up on the notion of physics or space. But gosh! If you have a fleet of unarmed troop transports, and they're being picked off one by one, why not split off and separate? You have nothing to lose at this point.
If there is a less charismatic and convincing villain than Kyle Ren, I have yet to see him.
You did not watch the wretched 3 which shall not be named, then? Kylo Ren is a vast improvement over young Darth Vader.
I hate the @#&^%@!!!! porgs, but blame Lucas for that. Fucking Ewoks. And toys were part of the point from the very beginning.
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I put on my rockin' shoes in the morning
Hallellou, hallellou
Posts: 17627 | From: the round earth's imagined corners | Registered: Dec 2008
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Brenda Clough
Shipmate
# 18061
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Posted
Oh Lord, I have purged the loathsome Anakin from mind and now you h ad to bring him back. At least that actor (totally negligible otherwise) was conventionally good-looking.
Oh, and another gripe: limp and wooden dialogue. This too is a SW hallmark of course. What's deeply annoying is the sense that fixes would be easy. A pass through the dialogue, of course, but a larger tidying of the plot. Improvement is so close, so easy...
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Science fiction and fantasy writer with a Patreon page
Posts: 6378 | From: Washington DC | Registered: Mar 2014
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Dafyd
Shipmate
# 5549
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Brenda Clough:
If there is a less charismatic and convincing villain than Kyle Ren, I have yet to see him.
One word: orange.
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we remain, thanks to original sin, much in love with talking about, rather than with, one another. Rowan Williams
Posts: 10567 | From: Edinburgh | Registered: Feb 2004
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Doc Tor
Deepest Red
# 9748
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Posted
POI: Lucas is not to blame for the porgs. UNESCO is.
Skellig Michael is a specially protected site - and is inhabited by a large colony of puffins. And rather than digitally remove all the puffins, the CGI people gave each of them a virtual porg suit.
I liked the porgs. Especially roasted.
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Forward the New Republic
Posts: 9131 | From: Ultima Thule | Registered: Jul 2005
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jedijudy
Organist of the Jedi Temple
# 333
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Doc Tor:
I liked the porgs. Especially roasted.
I imagine Chewy would have liked to like them also! ![[Two face]](graemlins/scot_twoface.gif)
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Jasmine, little cat with a big heart.
Posts: 18017 | From: 'Twixt the 'Glades and the Gulf | Registered: Aug 2001
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Timothy the Obscure
Mostly Friendly
# 292
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Posted
Saw it today. Not bad (mostly harmless). Of course I'm more of a Trekkie, really, but not a snob about it...still...when spacecraft run out of fuel, they stop accelerating, but don't slow down. (And BTW--with reference to Rogue 1--is it really credible that people with a technological level that includes FTL spaceships rely on a data storage system composed of a vast tower of VHS cassettes? Just saying...)
It was too long, and dragged in the middle. The bad guys' dialogue was just as tediously trite as ever (Carrie Fisher apparently rewrote some of her own lines--they should have let her rewrite Snoke's). But it worked overall. I'm looking forward to the next one, though I expect they're frantically rewriting the script, since obviously Leia was supposed to be in it...
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When you think of the long and gloomy history of man, you will find more hideous crimes have been committed in the name of obedience than have ever been committed in the name of rebellion.
- C. P. Snow
Posts: 6114 | From: PDX | Registered: May 2001
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Brenda Clough
Shipmate
# 18061
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Timothy the Obscure:
Saw it today. Not bad (mostly harmless). Of course I'm more of a Trekkie, really, but not a snob about it...still...when spacecraft run out of fuel, they stop accelerating, but don't slow down. (And BTW--with reference to Rogue 1--is it really credible that people with a technological level that includes FTL spaceships rely on a data storage system composed of a vast tower of VHS cassettes? Just saying...)
It was too long, and dragged in the middle. The bad guys' dialogue was just as tediously trite as ever (Carrie Fisher apparently rewrote some of her own lines--they should have let her rewrite Snoke's). But it worked overall. I'm looking forward to the next one, though I expect they're frantically rewriting the script, since obviously Leia was supposed to be in it...
Yes. If Han Solo shuffled off the mortal coil in the first, and Luke is now no more as of this film, then Leia's up at bat for the next film. You can see it coming, ponderous as an aircraft carrier on the ballet floor.
I am beginning to sense that the Jedi’s fatal error was going big. They had an HQ, a large number of members, all that fancy stuff in #s 1-3. They had all the trappings of power and success. They made the classic error of the winner — they became their enemy.
So it all went to pieces, a long process detailed in #s 4 through 8, and at the end of this movie they’re eating dirt like they deserve. Fine. It’s in this movie that we see how they really have to win. From the bottom, as a liberating force of justice for the toilers in rags at the bottom of the economic pile. They don’t need brown hoodie robes. They need pussy hats.
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Posts: 6378 | From: Washington DC | Registered: Mar 2014
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Golden Key
Shipmate
# 1468
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Posted
I saw it Friday.
I liked it. I would've done a few production things differently, but it was basically good. I went to a morning (cheap!) showing of the plain film--no IMAX or 3D, which was exactly right for me. I do need to see it again, though--unusually, the theater had the volume way down, so I didn't get all the lines.
I'm still processing it, a bit, so will post more later.
But I don't have to dodge related ads and media anymore!
![[Smile]](smile.gif)
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--"Oh bat bladders, do you have to bring common sense into this?" (Dragon, "Jane & the Dragon")
--"Oh, Peace Train, save this country!" (Yusuf/Cat Stevens, "Peace Train")
Posts: 18601 | From: Chilling out in an undisclosed, sincere pumpkin patch. | Registered: Oct 2001
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Sarasa
Shipmate
# 12271
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Posted
I saw it last week and enjoyed it to. As my hearing is dire I always go to subtitled performances which is useful - I certainly wouldn't have got a lot of it otherwise. I liked the DJ character, who I assume will turn up in Part 3 and despite all the battles the basic message about saving what you love.
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'I guess things didn't go so well tonight, but I'm trying. Lord, I'm trying.' Charlie (Harvey Keitel) in Mean Streets.
Posts: 2035 | From: London | Registered: Jan 2007
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The5thMary
Shipmate
# 12953
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Posted
If I haven't seen the first one (I know whiny Kylo Ren kills his dad, Han Solo), will I be completely lost watching this new movie?
I avoided the previous one because I just couldn't bear the thought of it being schmaltzy as hell..."here's Leia, looking a hundred years old...and, Chewie, good old Chewie...". and what seemed to me a completely
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God gave me my face but She let me pick my nose.
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