quote:

---

...Westboro Baptist C****h of Topeka, Kansas, and her picketing ministry...

---

WTF is a 'picketing ministry'? [I get the definition - but to call it a ministry?!?!?]

Their latest stop along the way on said 'picketing ministry' is this; picketing the funerals of children killed when their school-bus came off the road.

Bastards.

Has the baptist c****h no authority to get rid of the man? If they do, why don't they?

[ 12. January 2011, 14:41: Message edited by: RooK ]
 

---

Posted by HangarQueen (# 6914) on :
 
I could be wrong, but I suspect his church is not actually affiliated to any Baptist denomination.
 

---

Posted by luvanddaisies (# 5761) on :
 
You're probably right, actually.
 

---

Posted by Frustrated Farmer (# 10782) on :
 
Since I live in the general area of the folks in question, I think that if you would ask them they would be proud to say that they are not connected with any other Baptist Church in the world, since they are the only true light.

I was informed this week that since the ECUSA parish they enjoy picketing was burned out of their building, they have been following them around to wherever they hold worship services.
 

---

Posted by Rossweisse (# 2349) on :
 
"Picketing ministry"?!?

FF, I wonder....have the police checked out the activities of all Westboro Baptist Church members on the night of the fire? After that other Episcopal Church was burned down because some kid didn't like their take on the Bible, this one doesn't look very random.

(Perhaps the Phelpses are here to force us to remember to turn the other cheek and pray for our enemies. It is hard sometimes.)

Ross
 

---

Posted by luvanddaisies (# 5761) on :
 
I thought it looked a bit suspicious too.
Surely even they couldn't justify that?
Well, actually, if they can picket funerals (especially kids' ones, which somehow seems worse), they probably can. Tiny-minded little bigots.
 

---

Posted by 206 (# 206) on :
 

quote:

---

WTF is a 'picketing ministry'?

---

You've got to give them points for the notion.

I've just been called by God to create a 'slap the shit out of assholes ministry' based in Topeka.
 

---

Posted by RooK (# 1852) on :
 
No need to worry about Phelps: Galactus is coming.
 

---

Posted by MouseThief (# 953) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by 206:
I've just been called by God to create a 'slap the shit out of assholes ministry' based in Topeka.

---

quote:

---

God's telling me non-sequential hundred pound notes. (Have to cover all of expenses listed by 206, plus trans-Atlantic flights, visas, and VAT.)

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by 206:

quote:

---

WTF is a 'picketing ministry'?

---

You've got to give them points for the notion.

I've just been called by God to create a 'slap the shit out of assholes ministry' based in Topeka.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by HangarQueen:
I could be wrong, but I suspect his church is not actually affiliated to any Baptist denomination.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by MouseThief:

quote:

---

Originally posted by 206:
I've just been called by God to create a 'slap the shit out of assholes ministry' based in Topeka.

---

I might donate to that.

---

quote:

---

I wonder if Phelps would regard Jack Chick as a heretic and vice versa. Maybe they could be installed in a room together to tear strips off each other, rather than the world at large.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Pigwidgeon:
Did he take the caramel? I can't imagine he would accept something from one of those f*g-loving 'Piscopalians*.

(*of which I'm one)

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by luvanddaisies:
I thought it might be handy to have a thread for people to rant about the leading light of Westboro Baptist Church, Fred Phelps, and his actions, rather than the regular new threads that pop up every so often.

Out of curiosity, I was checking up on his hideous godhatesfags.com website and discovered this wonderous quote ...

Their latest stop along the way on said 'picketing ministry' is this; picketing the funerals of children killed when their school-bus came off the road.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Al Eluia:

quote:

---

Originally posted by HangarQueen:
I could be wrong, but I suspect his church is not actually affiliated to any Baptist denomination.

---

I'm pretty sure that's right, and of course there's no such thing as "the Baptist Church," since even within Baptist denominations every congregation is self-governing. Does anyone on this board know, just out of curiosity, how much authority there is within various Baptist denoms to discipline wayward congregations?

---

Technically, none at all, I'm afraid. As you've said, each Baptist congo is autonomous and pretty much do and believe what the hell they like without sanction. Most Baptist congregations however do choose to affiliate together in various unions, conventions and associations with other like-minded Baptist congos: SBC, ABC and, over here, BUGB and Grace Baptists, to share clergy and other resources, but these associations are purely voluntary and do not in any way amount to denominations, and the worst that can happen is that a congregation can be disaffiliated from a particular grouping - the convention or association can't stop the congo doing what it's doing. AFAIK, Phucktard Phelps and Co have never been in affiliation with anyone else; after all, who would have them?

[ 27. November 2006, 08:52: Message edited by: Matt Black ]
 

---

Posted by My Duck (# 11924) on :
 
Has anyone ever picketed Fred?

Not a happy thought, going out deliberately to make contact with the slimeballs, but I was just wondering what would happen.....
 

---

Posted by altarbird (# 11983) on :
 
What I don't understand is how this guy and his ministry make enough money for all this travel, ballot initiatives, etc. Does anyone know? Did he inheirit a lot of money somewhere?

Although what is really scary is that when his daughter ran for office on a very open "I'm in complete agreement with Phelps" ticket, she got a pretty high percentage of the vote.
 

---

Posted by Matt Black (# 2210) on :
 
That kind of thing reminds me of the scenes in Borat with the rodeo crowd and university students
 

---

Posted by Sioni Sais (# 5713) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by altarbird:
What I don't understand is how this guy and his ministry make enough money for all this travel, ballot initiatives, etc. Does anyone know? Did he inheirit a lot of money somewhere?

Although what is really scary is that when his daughter ran for office on a very open "I'm in complete agreement with Phelps" ticket, she got a pretty high percentage of the vote.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by My Duck:
Has anyone ever picketed Fred?

Not a happy thought, going out deliberately to make contact with the slimeballs, but I was just wondering what would happen.....

---

Shipmeet for those in south USA?

quote:

---

Originally posted by Paul W.:

quote:

---

I wonder if Phelps would regard Jack Chick as a heretic and vice versa. Maybe they could be installed in a room together to tear strips off each other, rather than the world at large.

---

But then we'd be flooded with Chick tracts about nutjob protesters, and Phelps would be picketing comic shops, which would be a pain in the arse on both counts.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by luvanddaisies:

I thought it might be handy to have a thread for people to rant about the leading light of Westboro Baptist Church, Fred Phelps, and his actions, rather than the regular new threads that pop up every so often.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by RuthW:

This gave me an idea -- maybe we could designate one person on the Ship to read and summarize what's on Phelps' website so we're not all running up his hit count.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Orb:
You do realise that Phelps is the heart of American society though, right?

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by luvanddaisies:
Shipmeet for those in south USA? ...

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Pigwidgeon:
Did he take the caramel? I can't imagine he would accept something from one of those f*g-loving 'Piscopalians*.

(*of which I'm one)

---

[tangent]
Years ago on a mailing list now far away, you could request the listserver to send the FAQ for the list. The command was 'get anglican-faq'.

Every now and again somebody would slip and send the request to the list rather than to the server. And it seemed that every time somebody made the mistake, they would also make the second mistake, and ask to 'get anglican-fag'.

This was the source of some hilarity...
[/tangent]
b.
 

---

Posted by Frustrated Farmer (# 10782) on :
 
If someone would like directions to the church in question, please contact me by PM.
 

---

Posted by luvanddaisies (# 5761) on :
 
How about directions for the church in question?
 

---

Posted by SearchingForAbsolutes (# 11966) on :
 
An interesting point is when bad things happen (a.k.a. children dying in a bus crash), Phelps & Co. are there in a hurry 'cause "God is punishing the unrighteous", but when bad things happen to the WBC (i.e. bombings, acts of violence toward them) they're considered to be "attacks" from the sinful world.

B'golly gosh, yuh think he might jest be tryin' ta git attention?

Anyway, here's a great video of a faux-news reporter hitting on Fred Phelps Jr. It's definitely worth a view.

http://youtube.com/watch?v=KZPsTM-4qgg
 

---

Posted by Pigwidgeon (# 10192) on :
 

quote:

---

Anyway, here's a great video of a faux-news reporter hitting on Fred Phelps Jr. It's definitely worth a view.

http://youtube.com/watch?v=KZPsTM-4qgg

---

 

---

Posted by teddybear (# 7842) on :
 
Yes, the Phelps have been picketed in the past and all it did was give them more fodder for their hatred. It also made the group more newsworthy and that is the last thing they needed. Personally, having seen them in action on a daily basis since they began picketing, more attention is the last thing they need. From what I hear, they are also very controlling about who is allowed to join them for worship. You may have to undergo close scrutiny before they will allow you in their services. If anyone wants directions on how to find their church, I would be more than happy to give directions on getting there. As for me, no way on earth you would ever find me darkening their door. PM me for directions.
 

---

Posted by Campbellite (# 1202) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by Al Eluia:
If I remember the story correctly he did, although I don't know if he ate it. (And me too; I love f*g Newtons)

---

Repent sinner! Don't you know that God Hates F*gs?
 

---

Posted by luvanddaisies (# 5761) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by SearchingForAbsolutes:
Anyway, here's a great video of a faux-news reporter hitting on Fred Phelps Jr. It's definitely worth a view.

http://youtube.com/watch?v=KZPsTM-4qgg

---

That's rather satisfying to watch - particularly when he runs to hide behind his wife.

Maybe if a bunch of people were recruited to hit on Phelps and his wife whenever they're out picketing, they might be put off it a bit.

[ 28. November 2006, 10:24: Message edited by: luvanddaisies ]
 

---

Posted by leo (# 1458) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by Campbellite:

quote:

---

Originally posted by Al Eluia:
If I remember the story correctly he did, although I don't know if he ate it. (And me too; I love f*g Newtons)

---

Repent sinner! Don't you know that God Hates F*gs?

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Campbellite:

quote:

---

Originally posted by Al Eluia:
If I remember the story correctly he did, although I don't know if he ate it. (And me too; I love f*g Newtons)

---

Repent sinner! Don't you know that God Hates F*gs?

---

Remember what Jesus did to the f*g tree....
 

---

Posted by altarbird (# 11983) on :
 
Refresh my memory - split them open and grilled them lightly with a dash of honey and served it up with homemade vanilla bean ice cream?

Because that's what I do, and I do so try to emulate Christ in all my doings.
 

---

Posted by luvanddaisies (# 5761) on :
 
what, you eat the whole tree?
Burn the heretic
 

---

Posted by SearchingForAbsolutes (# 11966) on :
 
LINK

Found another gem! A Norwegian radio station does a little prank on Big Freddy himself. They call him and play a (quite obvious) prerecorded tape of questions, but Fred starts with his preaching and doesn't even notice (even when the audio starts repeating itself and malfunctions!).

[Are you sure that link name was long enough?]

[ 30. November 2006, 03:07: Message edited by: RooK ]
 

---

Posted by Golden Key (# 1468) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by luvanddaisies:
Maybe if a bunch of people were recruited to hit on Phelps and his wife whenever they're out picketing, they might be put off it a bit.

---

It would be funny, but I wouldn't recommend it.

IIRC, Matthew Shephard's murder was triggered by hitting on (?) a straight man in a bar. I'm NOT in any way, shape, or form blaming Matthew. Just saying that the proposed action could be very dangerous.

And I suspect that Fred is mentally ill, deeply closeted, possibly an abuse survivor, or some combination of the three. If someone pushed his buttons by hitting on him...

 

---

Posted by JArthurCrank (# 9175) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by Golden Key:

quote:

---

Originally posted by luvanddaisies:
Maybe if a bunch of people were recruited to hit on Phelps and his wife whenever they're out picketing, they might be put off it a bit.

---

It would be funny, but I wouldn't recommend it.

IIRC, Matthew Shephard's murder was triggered by hitting on (?) a straight man in a bar. I'm NOT in any way, shape, or form blaming Matthew. Just saying that the proposed action could be very dangerous.

And I suspect that Fred is mentally ill, deeply closeted, possibly an abuse survivor, or some combination of the three. If someone pushed his buttons by hitting on him...

---

I've often wondered whether Phelps doesn't have a David Koresh-esque cache of weapons. I suppose he's smart enough to just-barely stay on the right side of the law and that if he went over the edge, that would bring his travelling circus to an end.

He would be highly entertaining if it weren't for the funeral picketing.

I do like his church's rendition of "Faith is the Victory" though. One of my favorite Proddy hymns.
 

---

Posted by Kelly Alves (# 2522) on :
 
I gotta admit, when I saw Junior laugh,it made my unbridled hatred for the Phelps clan wane a bit.

Maybe we are underestimating the educational power of really good comedy. In any case, that faux- anchor has been added to my list of heroes.


GK-- it can be done. You get a van ready for the volunteer Romeos, you provide them with Mace, and you gun the engine the minute they dive through the open van door screaming "GO! GO! NOW!"


Heck, I'd volunteer to dress in drag and hit on Phelps himself just to get a closeup of the expression on his face. I know where to apply the knee if he gets out of line.
 

---

Posted by leo (# 1458) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by Golden Key:

quote:

---

Originally posted by luvanddaisies:
Maybe if a bunch of people were recruited to hit on Phelps and his wife whenever they're out picketing, they might be put off it a bit.

---

It would be funny, but I wouldn't recommend it.

IIRC, Matthew Shephard's murder was triggered by hitting on (?) a straight man in a bar. I'm NOT in any way, shape, or form blaming Matthew. Just saying that the proposed action could be very dangerous.

And I suspect that Fred is mentally ill, deeply closeted, possibly an abuse survivor, or some combination of the three. If someone pushed his buttons by hitting on him...

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Kelly Alves:
I know where to apply the knee if he gets out of line.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by leo:

quote:

---

Originally posted by Golden Key:

quote:

---

Originally posted by luvanddaisies:
Maybe if a bunch of people were recruited to hit on Phelps and his wife whenever they're out picketing, they might be put off it a bit.

---

It would be funny, but I wouldn't recommend it.

IIRC, Matthew Shephard's murder was triggered by hitting on (?) a straight man in a bar. I'm NOT in any way, shape, or form blaming Matthew. Just saying that the proposed action could be very dangerous.

And I suspect that Fred is mentally ill, deeply closeted, possibly an abuse survivor, or some combination of the three. If someone pushed his buttons by hitting on him...

---

I'd like to know the evidence that he was 'hitting on' a straight man. Men have got off murder charges on 'homosexual panic' defence.

Are straight men so insecure that they have to murder someone rather tan tell them to go away?

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Living in Gin:

quote:

---

Originally posted by Kelly Alves:
I know where to apply the knee if he gets out of line.

---

If anybody is begging for a good kick in the nuts, it's Phelps.

---

Thank you, Gin, thank you so much for that.

Now every time I see somebody get kicked in the nuts, I will think of you.
 

---

Posted by luvanddaisies (# 5761) on :
 
I think the smilie goes well with that link, Living in Gin.
 

---

Posted by Callan (# 525) on :
 
Originally posted by Leo:

quote:

---

I'd like to know the evidence that he was 'hitting on' a straight man. Men have got off murder charges on 'homosexual panic' defence.

Are straight men so insecure that they have to murder someone rather tan tell them to go away?

---

The Guardsman's Defence would hardly be of much use if some straight men weren't so insecure, would it?
 

---

Posted by Beautiful_Dreamer (# 10880) on :
 
I dont think they really have the authority to get rid of this guy, but I really wish they would because he makes all Christians look bad. I have been on his godhatesfags site, and I felt like taking a shower afterward.
 

---

Posted by Campbellite (# 1202) on :
 
I've checked out his website, too, BD. I felt that I needed to sterilize my screen and keyboard with bleach afterwards.
 

---

Posted by The Silent Acolyte (# 1158) on :
 
That's some sick twisted shit, Living in Gin.


In other news, Phelps gets a mosquito bite by being ordered to pay some court costs in the suit by the father of the Pennsylvania Marine whose funeral the Westboro haters picketed.
 

---

Posted by luvanddaisies (# 5761) on :
 
I really wonder what they think they're going to accomplish with this twisted "picketing ministry". It's unfathomable how they think that insulting grieving people is going to achieve anything positive. What sort of logic???
 

---

Posted by Sioni Sais (# 5713) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by luvanddaisies:
I really wonder what they think they're going to accomplish with this twisted "picketing ministry". It's unfathomable how they think that insulting grieving people is going to achieve anything positive. What sort of logic???

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by SearchingForAbsolutes:

Anyway, here's a great video of a faux-news reporter hitting on Fred Phelps Jr. It's definitely worth a view.

http://youtube.com/watch?v=KZPsTM-4qgg

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by luvanddaisies:
I really wonder what they think they're going to accomplish with this twisted "picketing ministry". It's unfathomable how they think that insulting grieving people is going to achieve anything positive. What sort of logic???

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by leo:


I'd like to know the evidence that he was 'hitting on' a straight man. Men have got off murder charges on 'homosexual panic' defence.

Are straight men so insecure that they have to murder someone rather tan tell them to go away?

---

You know, I've wondered that myself. I don't think all of them are, just the ones who have homosexual feelings that they are ashamed of. The more they slag off on homosexuals, the less likely anyone is to guess that they themselves are gay, in their mind. Silly, I know. But then so is the whole 'homosexual panic' defence.

And when I previewed this, it said I was supposed to grovel to Rook, Stoo, or Scot. Who should I grovel to first?
 

---

Posted by Kelly Alves (# 2522) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by Beautiful_Dreamer:

quote:

---

Originally posted by leo:


I'd like to know the evidence that he was 'hitting on' a straight man. Men have got off murder charges on 'homosexual panic' defence.

Are straight men so insecure that they have to murder someone rather tan tell them to go away?

---

You know, I've wondered that myself. I don't think all of them are, just the ones who have homosexual feelings that they are ashamed of. The more they slag off on homosexuals, the less likely anyone is to guess that they themselves are gay, in their mind. Silly, I know. But then so is the whole 'homosexual panic' defence.

---

Living where I do, I know plenty of men who are quite capable of simply smiling and saying "Thanks for the compliment, dude, but I'm straight/ not into guys /not interested."

In my experience, the guys that really have a panic attack at the idea of other guys hitting on them are the kind of guys who can't take a simple "no" from a woman, and assume all other men are wired like they are.
 

---

Posted by Beautiful_Dreamer (# 10880) on :
 
That is true too. My ex was like that, and he was also arrogant enough to think that every woman wanted him. Since to him a homosexual man is like a woman, then any homosexual man must want him too (in his mind). Can you see why he is an ex??
 

---

Posted by Kelly Alves (# 2522) on :
 
Thank God.
 

---

Posted by Karl: Liberal Backslider (# 76) on :
 
Tangentially, I note that according to his Wiki, Phelps was once a civil rights lawyer, even winning awards from black groups, and is a registered Democrat.

Which makes his current position even more bizarre. Hands up who'd have assumed he was a racist as well, and too far to the right for Democrats or Republicans?

Interestingly, his estranged son (some of his kids are with him, others have a brain) says that Phelps had little in the way of religious beliefs of any kind before starting his little hate club, I mean church. His belief is that Phelps has a pathological need to hate some person or group, and has chosen homosexuals, presumably because he thinks he can recruit religious fervour to assist his campaign.

It's a bizarre kind of redemption-in-reverse.
 

---

Posted by Campbellite (# 1202) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by Karl: Liberal Backslider:
Phelps has a pathological need to hate

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Karl: Liberal Backslider:
Tangentially, I note that according to his Wiki, Phelps was once a civil rights lawyer, even winning awards from black groups, and is a registered Democrat.

---

A slight tangent, but if his now-estranged son is to be believed, he was pretty much a racist all along. Apparently all he ever went for in civil rights cases were settlements - which enrich both Phelps and his clients but do basically nothing to advance the cause. Think of it; if the parties in "Brown vs. Board of Education" had settled out of court, that rather crucial ruling from the Supreme Court might not have happened. And then, again according to what I've read, he was making fun of his clients and calling them ugly names behind their backs the whole time. I hadn't heard anything about the awards, though.
 

---

Posted by leo (# 1458) on :
 
If you are in the UK, you might want tpo watch BBC2 2100-2200 on Sunday - about the Phelps family.
 

---

Posted by da_musicman (# 1018) on :
 
I'm looking forward to that program. Good chacne to let my "heathen" freinds know who I'm ranting about.
 

---

Posted by dyfrig (# 15) on :
 
Karl, in the states, the nice cuddly, left wing Democrats have a long, interesting history on race. In fact, from about 1861 to 1960 it was the Republicans who championed equal rights. Strom Thurmond was a Democrat for a long time, and he ran as a "States Rights Democrat" in the 48 Presidential election - the Democrats were split evnely between those who thought segregation a good idea, and those who didn't. Nixon won in 68 partly because the Democrats were split again on the issue - the last time, I think, an openly segragationalist policy had an impact. Being registered Democrat doen't make you not-racist. In fact, in certain areas up to the 60s it more or less meant you were segregationally inclined.
 

---

Posted by SearchingForAbsolutes (# 11966) on :
 
I'm very interested in the Phelps phenomenon, and since I'm in university, I have ample time to think too much about complex issues. I'm wondering (aloud) if Phelps' actions could be considered terrorism (on a theoretical scale, not a U.S. legal one). His actions are used to instill fear in others in order to push a revolutionary political and social cause. His actions are not physically violent, but according to many leading terrorism experts, they don't have to be. The threat of harm, be it emotional, social, or violent, is what Phelps & Co. use to gain attention to their homophobic message. The Amish massacre in Pennsylvania is proof of that; when alternate, wider-scoping methods of spreading the message made themselves available (through the threat of emotional harm on the community), the WBC took to the radio waves provided by a sympathetic/attention-grabbing Mike Gallagher* (the adjective depends, of course, on interpretation of his bargain with the church). The WBC endorse violent conduct; as mentioned earlier, Phelps celebrated Matthew Shepard's murder, as well as the deaths of American troops. The group sees itself as the only moral arrow on the planet (let's play a game: who can name other terrorist groups who believe the same thing?), and through attention-grabbing acts they attempt to further their cause.

I realize their actions are protected under the Constitution, but I still think the theoretical comparisons to terrorist organizations are frighteningly similar. The FARC uses threats of violence in order to extract taxes from drug cartels in Columbia. Is the WBC's threat of protest, assuming the original motive for protest was standard attention-whoring, and subsequent bargain comparable with groups like FARC who gain through threats? FARC has proven themselves true to their threats in the past, as has the WBC.

Of course, I'm just thinking in syntax, but some intelligent, passionate responses, found so abundantly on the SoF , would be great.

*Did anyone listen to the broadcast? As disgusting as I think their beliefs are, it would have been interesting. Er... On second thought, it probably would have been the same speech Fred must have tattooed on the insides of their eyelids.
 

---

Posted by boppysbud (# 4588) on :
 
I think that Phred Phelps, and Akinola, and the arch-preacher of Sydney would all make great friends.
 

---

Posted by Sioni Sais (# 5713) on :
 
WBC, their wacko ideas and Phelps got a mention this morning on BBC Radio 2. The "Religious News" round up on Sarah Kennedy's "Dawn Patrol" mentioned it, probably to point people to Sunday's program.

Although that program is on April 1st, I'm afraid it's true.
 

---

Posted by Liopleurodon (# 4836) on :
 

quote:

---

The last documentary filmmaker to enter their world was so enamoured by the family that he joined them.

---

How the hell did that happen?
 

---

Posted by Sioni Sais (# 5713) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by Liopleurodon:

quote:

---

The last documentary filmmaker to enter their world was so enamoured by the family that he joined them.

---

How the hell did that happen?

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Liopleurodon:

quote:

---

The last documentary filmmaker to enter their world was so enamoured by the family that he joined them.

---

How the hell did that happen?

---

quote:

---

intelligent, high achieving, have good jobs, and they're kind, for the most part, when they're not on pickets.

---

quote:

---

In some ways they're a model family. ... They spend all their recreational time together and they all look out for each other. ...It's important to recognise the good qualities of the family as it helps explain why so many of them have stayed in it and embraced the hateful stuff.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Late Paul:

quote:

---

Originally posted by Liopleurodon:

quote:

---

The last documentary filmmaker to enter their world was so enamoured by the family that he joined them.

---

How the hell did that happen?

---

Well according to this interview Theroux found them

quote:

---

intelligent, high achieving, have good jobs, and they're kind, for the most part, when they're not on pickets.

---

Also

quote:

---

In some ways they're a model family. ... They spend all their recreational time together and they all look out for each other. ...It's important to recognise the good qualities of the family as it helps explain why so many of them have stayed in it and embraced the hateful stuff.

---

---

quote:

---

Theroux found them 'intelligent, high achieving, have good jobs, and they're kind, for the most part, when they're not on pickets.'

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Sioni Sais:
Lots of families, and "families" too for that matter, have looked out for themselves. It doesn't stop them being mad as a bag of rats either.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by leo:
If you are in the UK, you might want to watch BBC2 2100-2200 on Sunday - about the Phelps family.

---

I'll be away (playing at Word Alive in Costa-del-Skegness) then, but I was wondering whether to ask my flatmate to Sky+ it for me. Part of me would like to see it to see what on earth the man comes across as, and part of me just thinks .
 

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Posted by Lyda*Rose (# 4544) on :
 

quote:

---

Phelps-watch

---

Why would I want to watch Phelps?

Okay, except to protect our backs....
 

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Posted by Late Paul (# 37) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by Liopleurodon:
I don't know if everything they've said is true, but I imagine that as a family they're more than capable of putting on an act when the documentary-maker comes to visit.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by KenWritez:
Theroux joining the Phelps? No mention of it in the article. Unless offering a different perspective on Phelps equates to "joining" la famiglia. Unless by offering a perspective on the Phelps family that paints them as seemingly normal apart from their picketing, that equates to surrender to them.

---

I don't know if you've seen any of Louis Theroux's documentaries, but his style is to appear naive and neutral to the subject in an effort to get them to expose their prejudices and idosyncracies all by themselves. And he is very good at it, rarely giving himself away by expressing opinions.

Theroux looks for the weird & wonderful. He tends to choose either people with extreme views - the scariest interview I recall was with the South African AWB leader Eugune Terreblanche - or celebrities (Jimmy Savile, Paul Daniels, Michael Jackson's father - because they wouldn't let him MJ himself). He definitely likes the weirder aspects of US life: classics on the California porn industry, swingers or Montana anarchists come readily to mind.

You've probably guessed by now that I like his style. And definitely will be watching him on Sunday. And cringing most of the way through, no doubt.
 

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Posted by KenWritez (# 3238) on :
 
Excellent interviewing advice I've ever heard is, "If you hate your subject, quote them to death. If you love your subject, quote them to death." If Theroux knows what he's doing, he'll step out of the way and let Phelps & Co. hang themselves on their own tongues.
 

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Posted by altarbird (# 11983) on :
 
Let me state unequivocably: I can't stand what Phelps and his family do or stand for.

But part of the point of this documentary, it seems, and the danger where people sorely underestimate Phelps or anyone like him is to so completely demonise him that he must be some fire breathing monster 24/7. If only it were that simple. This is Theroux's point about the model family. If it were any other family that spent all this time together, prayed together, were God fearing, held down full time jobs and provided for themselves well, they'd be held up as great examples of parenting and family ties. And by that measure, they are a model family. The one aberrant aspect of them is the extremism of the views they hold and the extent to which they go to demonstrate them. Granted, those views are SO extreme there isn't even a chart to plot them on, but I would say it is the rest of that model family aspect that makes them so dangerous.

It is the same with a lot of dangerous things. When you can turn around to all that criticism and say "Look, we're not the fire breathing monsters people say." it makes people look again. And when they people looking closer see the familial support, and structure and that people were wrong about that aspect (so far as this person has seen), then the gap is opened up to "what else is the public wrong about". That's probably where the previous journo wound up joining them, and that's what the real real danger of the Phelps clan is. They hold very nasty views, and they upset a lot of people with them but so long as people fail to recognize that there are normal aspects to them they'll be even more dangerous than they should be.
 

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Posted by Matt Black (# 2210) on :
 
I'm watching the shite (the Theroux doc) now and my blood pressure is rising by the minute. The silver lining is that the younger generation seem to be turning against marriage which means hopefully they won't spawn again.
 

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Posted by Clint Boggis (# 633) on :
 
Bloody Hell!

How did he brainwash so many people? Are they not able to think for themselves?

Billy Graham is going to hell?

Jews are fag lovers?


 

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Posted by kentishmaid (# 4767) on :
 
It's enough to make you feel sick. I feel so sorry for all those little kids they've co-opted into it, too. They clearly don't understand what's on the banners and they're getting hurt as a result of it.

The whole thing's disgusting. I don't know how these people sleep at night.
 

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Posted by Matt Black (# 2210) on :
 
Phelps comes across as an arrogant rude old prick. (Quelle surprise!)
 

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Posted by kentishmaid (# 4767) on :
 
Is it me, or does he look scarily like Ian Paisley? (Not that I'm drawing any other comparisons between the two of them).

[ 01. April 2007, 20:55: Message edited by: kentishmaid ]
 

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Posted by Yerevan (# 10383) on :
 
Phelps actually makes Paisley look like a liberal, which is some achievement

You'd almost feel sorry for someone so wrapped up in obsessive hatred if it wasn't for the people he's dragged into his cult. The documentary was quite good at explaining why its so hard for the younger ones to leave. Their parents send them out every day to face the world's hostility and inevitably they grow up thinking that all outsiders hate them. Maybe it would help if more people could grit their teeth and reach out in love to the Phelps nuts instead of mocking and abusing them (not easy if they're picketing your kid's funeral, I know...)
 

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Posted by chukovsky (# 116) on :
 
I must be very holy today (having been to morning service for the first time in a while) because my instinct was to go and sit quietly by their pickets and sing some nice songs about how Jesus loves you whatever you are like, and to light some candles and offer them some chocolate.

Would be interesting to see their reaction.

On a slightly more serious note, I was disappointed they didn't talk about any of the allegations of child abuse (it must be Shirley's generation that suffered this) or try and talk to the family members that were "gone", but then I'm also surprised they actually got permission to air it.
 

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Posted by Clint Boggis (# 633) on :
 
What an arrogant, evil old sack of shit.

To corrupt the minds of his own family, so even a seven year old who doesn't understand their message ("God hates fags" if you missed it) gets injured because people hate them for spouting evil hateful lies. And then to tell the kids they are speaking God's word, surely THAT is taking God's name in vain if anything is?

Telling people that God hates them and laughing at the thought of people going to hell - how can they reconcile that with anything Jesus said?

Can't the children be taken into care so they have some hope of rehabilitation into society?

What happens when the old bastard dies (soon please God!) will his evil full-of-shit daughter just take over?
.
 

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Posted by Stumbling Pilgrim (# 7637) on :
 
Pretty much all I know about the Phelps brood is what I've learned from the Ship, so this is the first time I've actually seen them in action.

I really do genuinely feel quite ill.

I have to say I've never seen arrogance like it in my life. Did somebody tear the page out of Fred's first-ever Bible that says 'God is love'? Because that's the only way I can square his claim to be teaching what the Bible says with reality. It seems to be obvious to everybody except himself and (some of) his family that all he's doing is projecting his own hatred and blaming God for it.

Sorry everyone, I know I'm rambling, but I need to vent and I haven't anywhere else to do it at present. I do actually feel sorry for him, and more so for the family who are trapped in this because, as Yerevan says, they know nothing else. for the children. (Yes, I know it's Hell, but with an upbringing like that those kids need all the they can get.)
 

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Posted by TonyK (# 35) on :
 
It was in many ways an incredible program!

Not just because of the way 'Gramps' Fred Phelps came over - convinced he was right and everybody else wrong; not even prepared to give Louis Theroux a decent interview.

Not even because of the girls' responses to some of the questions.

Not even because of the way they used their children.

Louis Theroux has done several of this type of interview - basically living with the people he is studying. All the other programs I've seen have shown him in a very laid-back mode - questioning and probing, but very non-commital in his reactions. That wasn't true in this program - I got the real impression that he was revolted by the way they interacted with the world and by their lifestyle. He had difficulty at times even continuing to talk with them.

For those who couldn't see the program, the BBC website is running some stuff here.(I don't know how long this will be available.)

I have never had much time for the Phelps clan and WBC. The information posted in the past on the Ship and my very occasional forays into the WBC websites has sickened me enough.

But this was awful, dreadful, pretty much unbelievable. Nothing I heard the Phelpses say had the slightest hint of the Christian faith about it - other than the use of some of the words any preacher might use. They claim to be bible-believers - but I wonder how they read John 3:16?

There are times when I could almost wish our societies weren't quite so free and tolerant! Some people and organisations seem to take 'freedom of speech' too far.
 

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Posted by The Great Gumby (# 10989) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by Clint Boggis:
Jews are fag lovers?

---

And more - they killed Jesus, after all.

I watched it hoping to get some sort of idea of why these people believe such evil, hate-filled shit, but if there was an obvious reason, it didn't come across. There was no serious Biblical exposition to justify their crazy beliefs and practices in the whole programme, and Phelps himself more or less refused to answer any questions he was asked, in a quite breathtakingly rude way.

The one thing that really hit me wasn't the incredible rudeness with which they responded to the slightest challenge to their dogma, the fact that Phred's sermon was possibly the worst I've ever heard, apparently relying entirely on assertion, or even the scary way they laughed about people suffering eternal torment. It was the lack of any sort of consistent explanation of why they bother with their pickets. Apparently, people need to be told that God's punishing them - fair enough, at least its internal logic is consistent in a completely warped way. But if (as I think Shirley said) no one's going to change their minds anyway, why bother? What's it for? Is it just some bizarre way of storing up spiritual brownie points with the big, angry smiting bastard they seem to believe in? Why would he be interested in doing something that won't have any effect, and is his habit of killing random "fag enablers" (such a charming phrase) similarly impotent?

I wish Louis had pushed more about that, and also looked more into some of the throwaways that had more than a hint of a kind of prosperity gospel, but I suppose that's not his style. When the girl said that if she was run over, it would mean God had damned her, so it would be right to celebrate that she was dead, I felt sick. By the end of the programme, I was swearing at the TV, I was so angry.

The question is, do I really believe in a God who loves the Phelpses and wants them to be with him for eternity? Can I? Should I?
 

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Posted by Yerevan (# 10383) on :
 
Phelps is definitely one of the better arguments against universalism...
 

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Posted by Yerevan (# 10383) on :
 
No actually hold that thought....just picture the look on his face when he spots George Michael in universalist heaven.
 

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Posted by Gort (# 6855) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by The Great Gumby:
...But if (as I think Shirley said) no one's going to change their minds anyway, why bother? What's it for? Is it just some bizarre way of storing up spiritual brownie points with the big, angry smiting bastard they seem to believe in? Why would he be interested in doing something that won't have any effect...?

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by The Great Gumby:
[QUOTE]Originally posted by Clint Boggis:
[qb] When the girl said that if she was run over, it would mean God had damned her, so it would be right to celebrate that she was dead, I felt sick.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Liopleurodon:

quote:

---

Originally posted by The Great Gumby:
[QUOTE]Originally posted by Clint Boggis:
[qb] When the girl said that if she was run over, it would mean God had damned her, so it would be right to celebrate that she was dead, I felt sick.

---

I was completely confused by that, because I thought that these guys all thought they were going to heaven (even though nobody else was). Was it because she thought that the very fact of being hit by a car would indicate that God hated her too?

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Liopleurodon:
Was it because she thought that the very fact of being hit by a car would indicate that God hated her too?

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Late Paul:
When he persisted they displayed this exasperated annoyance as if he really knew that what they were saying was true but just wouldn't admit it. So Steve the ex-documentary make walks away saying Louis is being 'silly' and Shirley is reduced to saying "No chance poopy-pants".

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by davelarge:
The other thing that struck me about it was that we never heard them finish their pronouncements of hell and damnation with "but if you believe in God and repent you can avoid the flames". There was no gospel anywhere in their speech. Only damnation. That shows the totally screwed priorities to me.

---

This was the bit that puzzled me too. I'd had them mentally pegged as a cult, but there seemed to be no desire to increase their ranks, even just for extra cash. How do they fund all this?

I'm left speechless by them. Speechless and sickened.
 

---

Posted by davelarge (# 186) on :
 
The part that left me speechless and sickened (as opposed to the part which made me wonder, which I've already posted) was when an eight-year-old boy was hit by a plastic cup full of coke (or some other soft drink) which had been thrown at the picket from a passing car. The boy was really shaken up, and I think physically hurt by the impact (which was strong enough to break the cup and shower the contents all over him).

I think it's just plain abusive to take young children (who clearly don't understand what the signs they are holding say, as Louis showed skillfully) and put them in harm's way like that. There were all sorts of insults, abusive gestures and threats shouted at them while they were picketting and I just don't think it's fair to subject a child to that. It's no wonder they grow up fearing the outside world.


 

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Posted by dogwonderer (# 12169) on :
 
It's child abuse, plain and simple. It should be illegal.

Why does society tolerate this sort of thing?

That's the question!
 

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Posted by kentishmaid (# 4767) on :
 
That whole 'freedom of religion' thing, I believe. (If you'll pardon the pun).

Unfortunately, our right not to be persecuted is bracketed with their right to be as obnoxious as they are.

While I echo your sentiments, I'd rather not see that happen.
 

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Posted by sharkshooter (# 1589) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by dogwonderer:
It's child abuse, plain and simple. It should be illegal.

Why does society tolerate this sort of thing?

That's the question!

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by dogwonderer:
But when should freedom of religion become freedom to abuse children?

Society tolerates this because religion enjoys special privilege. I was thinking of Dawkins whilst watching that programme- I have to agree he has a point, vis a vis special privilege.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by dogwonderer:
But when should freedom of religion become freedom to abuse children?

---

quote:

---

Society tolerates this because religion enjoys special privilege.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Yo-Yo:

quote:

---

Originally posted by dogwonderer:
But when should freedom of religion become freedom to abuse children?

Society tolerates this because religion enjoys special privilege. I was thinking of Dawkins whilst watching that programme- I have to agree he has a point, vis a vis special privilege.

---

I'm with Sharkshooter on this one. As horrific as their picketing and message is in a democratic and free society there can be no justification for the violence directed at them.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by ken:

quote:

---

Originally posted by dogwonderer:
But when should freedom of religion become freedom to abuse children?

---

I have no idea what they get up to in private but what we were shown on the TV was not abuse of the children. The only person who attacked or insulted a child was the man who threw whatever it was out of the car.

quote:

---

Society tolerates this because religion enjoys special privilege.

---

Tolerates what? Taking children to a demonstration? Millions of people take their kids to political events which are as likely to see violences as these people seem to be. Should they all be banned? Or only ones that you disapprove of?

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by The Rogue:
Do they need much cash? Picketing costs nothing (except for some signs) unless they travel far.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by dogwonderer:
Well, I happen to think it is abuse of innocent children to involve them with such despicable fundamentalist bigotry- especially if it exposes them to third-party harm.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by dogwonderer:
Well, I happen to think it is abuse of innocent children to involve them with such despicable fundamentalist bigotry

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by mountainsnowtiger:
Plenty of nice, respectable-seeming parents do severe psychological damage to their children.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by dogwonderer:
Well, I happen to think it is abuse of innocent children to involve them with such despicable fundamentalist bigotry - especially if it exposes them to third-party harm.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by mountainsnowtiger:
... <snip> I don't think the state can legitimately intervene and I'm unconvinced that these facts say anything particularly significant about the place of religion in our societies.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by ken:
[QUOTE]Originally posted by dogwonderer:
[qb]So bigotry is OK in a safe environment?

And who gets to decide how despicable bigotry has to be before removing children from it? Will we have an Office of the Bigot-Finder General?

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Songs of Praise:
I think the most frightening thing was to be aware of the tremendous inner rage inside that old man and to ponder what possible source it may have.

As for Theroux, I think the one interesting thing that this particular documentary threw up was that the effectiveness of his "ingenue" approach to interviewing people is past its sell-by date. Say what you will, Phelps and his entourage had obviously done a fair bit of research on Theroux and his methods and were adept at parrying his usual MO.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by dogwonderer:
I suspect you are being a little disingenuous, Ken. Did you see the programme?

Tell me you didn't feel the urge to rescue those small children from that cult.

Thought so.

---

Going by only what's in the programme, not, I wouldn't want someone to come and take the kids away.

If the things written in the article Chukovsky linked to are true, than yes I would. That's a whole different category of behaviour.
 

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Posted by JArthurCrank (# 9175) on :
 
If the charges of child abuse and even murder are accurate, then removing children could be warranted. However, there is the possibility that the Phelps clan is armed to the teeth thereby raising the prospect of another Waco-like siege. It probably would be better just to wait for the nasty old man to die, hoping that with his death, his spell will be broken.
 

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Posted by SearchingForAbsolutes (# 11966) on :
 
I think that whatever sliver of (questionable) credibility these people have will be extinguished along with ol' Fred when he finally kicks the bucket. Imagine the irony: Shirley holds a sign proclaiming "Don't mourn the dead" while rejoicing about how Fred's in Heaven ( ). As we all know, Fred is a huge media whore, and most of the reason he does what he does seems to be for attention. His followers (with the exception of Shirley) seem to prefer not to bask in the media attention, and actually believe what they find in Fred's excrements. I think once he dies, and once the initial media sensationalism dies out, the WBC will be less visible (on the mass media stage) than ever.

P.S. Someone may have been fucking with Godhatesfags.com - direct access (by typing the address into the HTML search bar) doesn't seem to be working, although access through a search engine does. Is it just my computer, or has God finally answered prayers?
 

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Posted by Pigwidgeon (# 10192) on :
 
I haven't tried it (I hate to add to his click count), but I know the website has been hacked a number of times. Once it redirected to something like godlovesfags.com
 

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Posted by KenWritez (# 3238) on :
 
dogwonderer, is freedom of speech a right you're willing to support even if parents use it to teach their children values you hate?

As you've said, it's a tricky subject, and a few posters have wondered where the line is between persecuting parents for abuse vs. persecuting them for values you despise personally.

How would you answer vegans who believe feeding meat to children is abuse? How would you answer atheists who see religious teaching by parents as brain-washing and therefore abuse? Who decides what's abuse vs. what's a parent's right to teach his children?

If we continue down that road, how long until children are removed "for their own protection" from parents who teach them facts and values contrary to whatever is current fashion at the time? Political correctness run amok. (I recommend Ray Bradbudry's short story "Usher II" in his book, The Martian Chronicles.)
 

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Posted by Balaam (# 4543) on :
 
I was struck by this conversation between Louis Theroux and a female WBC member:

LT: What if you don't believe in the Bible?

FWBCM: <large grin on face> Then you're going to hell <giggles>.

It's the attitude, saying condemning words as if they are a joke - that is what appalled me, more than the actual things they did or said.
 

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Posted by kentishmaid (# 4767) on :
 
I wondered if that was out of embarrassment, perhaps? I know they picket funerals with exactly that message, but perhaps it's slightly different saying it directly to someone's face in front of the cameras. Perhaps she was vaguely aware of how awful it sounded.

Or maybe she is just heartless, I don't know. I'd love to believe it was the former and it's just Fred's hold on them all that convinces them to continue, though.
 

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Posted by chive (# 208) on :
 
One of the oddest things I found about watching the programme (which I fully expected to make me angry but it didn't, it just saddened me) was when the children were picking up the leaves before going to church. I had a momentary thought from my own church upbringing which said, 'These people can't be real Christians, they're picking up leaves on the Sabbath.'

It showed me the extent to which cultural conditioning is an enormously difficult thing to break away from.
 

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Posted by Paul W. (# 1450) on :
 
I only just watched this, couldn't find a download of it earlier (I'm still a BBC licence payer, so it seems fair that I can do that if I've paid for it already).

I've read a fair bit about the church in the past, but it was something else seeing them like that. Quite scary really, their beliefs seem to have passed down the generations pretty well. I'd be suprised if it all fell apart after Fred dies, it looks like the younger ones are more than capable and willing of carrying it on. But we can live in hope.

I'm actually amazed that no-one's done anything worse than throw drinks at them by now. Pissing off a bunch of grieving trained killers like that would normally be a sure way of winning yourself a Darwin Award.

Paul W
 

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Posted by dogwonderer (# 12169) on :
 
Dear KenWritez,

I italicise your quotes:

dogwonderer, is freedom of speech a right you're willing to support even if parents use it to teach their children values you hate?

Yes. I believe very strongly in freedom of speech, and support it (albeit less than ‘willingly’) even if parents use it to teach their children values I disagree with or despise (‘hate’ is too emotive a word here). However, I do not support freedom of speech when it is used/misused/abused in such a way as to cause harm- especially to innocents like small children.

How would you answer vegans who believe feeding meat to children is abuse?

I’d say it is only an abuse of our children to enforce such a lifestyle choice upon them if it causes them harm. AFAIK, ‘good’ veganism is harmless, so I would not presume to judge such parents.

How would you answer atheists who see religious teaching by parents as brain-washing and therefore abuse?

I have made my thoughts on this very clear in a previous thread in Purg. I would agree with the atheist that, by the same criteria as with veganism, it is abuse if it causes harm to the child. Not if it doesn’t.

Who decides what's abuse vs. what's a parent's right to teach his children?

A massive question, with no easy answer. In extremis, society decides what’s abuse (whatever society is), not the parents, however counter-intuitive this may seem.

If we continue down that road, how long until children are removed "for their own protection" from parents who teach them facts and values contrary to whatever is current fashion at the time? Political correctness run amok. (I recommend Ray
Bradbudry's short story "Usher II" in his book, The Martian Chronicles.)

Thanks for the book recommendation- I will look it up, since this subject fascinates me.

(Takes a deep breath). I have faith in society, despite its culture. Many people don’t, but I am an optimist by nature, and I feel that humans have a certain goodness about them which underwrites my faith in society. Hence, I do not believe that there is a real risk today (or in future) of children being removed from their parents who bring them up in an ‘unfashionable’ way.

The human ‘goodness’ I refer to is largely what qualifies us to make value judgements about when parents are abusing their children, even when this abuse is unintentional. Deliberate abuse, of course, is another matter. You don’t need goodness to appreciate that- just common sense.
 

---

Posted by ken (# 2460) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by Balaam:
I was struck by this conversation between Louis Theroux and a female WBC member:

LT: What if you don't believe in the Bible?

FWBCM: <large grin on face> Then you're going to hell <giggles>.

It's the attitude, saying condemning words as if they are a joke - that is what appalled me, more than the actual things they did or said.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Balaam:
I was struck by this conversation between Louis Theroux and a female WBC member:

LT: What if you don't believe in the Bible?

FWBCM: <large grin on face> Then you're going to hell <giggles>.

It's the attitude, saying condemning words as if they are a joke - that is what appalled me, more than the actual things they did or said.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by ken:
That was defensive giggling. She's there with three blokes (presenter, cameraman, soundman) getting these (to her) mildly suggestive questions which she perhaps can't honestly answer.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by dogwonderer:
...if it causes them harm. ..

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by sharkshooter:

quote:

---

Originally posted by dogwonderer:
...if it causes them harm. ..

---

Who do you think gets to decide what causes harm?

---

quote:

---

A massive question, with no easy answer. In extremis, society decides what’s abuse (whatever society is), not the parents, however counter-intuitive this may seem.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Liopleurodon:
I think everyone is terrified of Fred. Really, really scared of him.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by ken:

<snip>

Who's really in charge in that compound? I guess we can't ever know. Maybe they don't really know themselves. All very odd.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Sioni Sais:
No reaction is no satisfaction. Do not feed the troll.

---

quote:

---

It is important to challenge views like WBC so that there evil doesn't spread any further. We won't change their minds, but we can hopefully stop others from being influenced by them.

---

Do you suppose it is especially important for other Christians to be seen to make a stand on this? More so than atheists, for example?
 

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Posted by chukovsky (# 116) on :
 
I would say yes, in as much as we as Christians have a responsibility to witness to true Christian faith (i.e. not what the WBC is preaching).

However I'm not convinced this includes "shouting louder" (I'm not saying anyone here has advocated that). I really feel that the members of the Phelps family need love, desperately.
 

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Posted by Amazing Grace (# 95) on :
 
"Shouting louder" is exactly what they want. Phred and the gang thrive on that sort of adversity.

If I hear of their being around, I'll be standing nearby, not engaging them, in my church lady clothes, with a big "God is Love" sign.

People like Phred and Shirley (who seems to be the usual mouthpiece these days) hate it when you don't play to their script .

Charlotte
 

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Posted by Yerevan (# 10383) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by sharkshooter:

quote:

---

Originally posted by dogwonderer:
...if it causes them harm. ..

---

Who do you think gets to decide what causes harm?

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by dogwonderer:
Do you suppose it is especially important for other Christians to be seen to make a stand on this? More so than atheists, for example?

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by dogwonderer:
Excellent! Well said!

quote:

---

It is important to challenge views like WBC so that there evil doesn't spread any further. We won't change their minds, but we can hopefully stop others from being influenced by them.

---

Do you suppose it is especially important for other Christians to be seen to make a stand on this? More so than atheists, for example?

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by dogwonderer:
In extremis, society decides what’s abuse (whatever society is), not the parents, however counter-intuitive this may seem.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Yerevan:
...I think 99.99% of the population would agree that this causes harm, wouldn't you?...

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by sharkshooter:

quote:

---

Originally posted by dogwonderer:
In extremis, society decides what’s abuse (whatever society is), not the parents, however counter-intuitive this may seem.

---

Indeed, you are wronger than wrong.

It is God who decides.

It is the parents who are entrusted by God to raise their children. Parents answer to God for their actions, not to society.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by PataLeBon:
...There is a place for society to say, "That's abuse." Physical abuse, definitely. And I think that there is a place for society to say there can be mental abuse of children.

Whether or not this rises to that level, I don't know. But to say that abuse is between God and the parents and not society is just wrong.

There comes a time for people to say, "Stop. We won't let you hurt that child any longer."

---

quote:

---

Phelps wrote Saddam Hussein in 1998, opposing U.S.-led sanctions against Iraq and offering to visit Baghdad. Saddam accepted the offer but must have been perplexed when the Phelps clan showed up in the streets of Baghdad with placards denouncing anal sex.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by sharkshooter:
As soon as "you" decide for some other parents, you must allow that someone else will decide for you. So, whatever the state decides is OK with you?

---

quote:

---

You admit you "don't know", and thus, how can you decide, even for your own kids, nonetheless for someone else's?

---

quote:

---

I am not so willing to allow the state (or anyone else) to pass judgement on me as you are.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by sharkshooter:

quote:

---

Originally posted by dogwonderer:
In extremis, society decides what’s abuse (whatever society is), not the parents, however counter-intuitive this may seem.

---

Indeed, you are wronger than wrong.

It is God who decides.

It is the parents who are entrusted by God to raise their children. Parents answer to God for their actions, not to society.

quote:

---

Originally posted by Yerevan:
...I think 99.99% of the population would agree that this causes harm, wouldn't you?...

---

My opinion, and yours, are irrelevant. This is an issue between the parents and God.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by sharkshooter:

quote:

---

Originally posted by PataLeBon:
...There is a place for society to say, "That's abuse." Physical abuse, definitely. And I think that there is a place for society to say there can be mental abuse of children.

Whether or not this rises to that level, I don't know. But to say that abuse is between God and the parents and not society is just wrong.

There comes a time for people to say, "Stop. We won't let you hurt that child any longer."

---

As soon as "you" decide for some other parents, you must allow that someone else will decide for you. So, whatever the state decides is OK with you?

You admit you "don't know", and thus, how can you decide, even for your own kids, nonetheless for someone else's?

I am not so willing to allow the state (or anyone else) to pass judgement on me as you are.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by PataLeBon:
...
Considering that I live in a (well, supposedly) democratic nation, then the state is one that shows the common values of all of us.

...

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Balaam:

LT: What if you don't believe in the Bible?

FWBCM: <large grin on face>

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by sharkshooter:

quote:

---

Originally posted by PataLeBon:
...
Considering that I live in a (well, supposedly) democratic nation, then the state is one that shows the common values of all of us.

...

---

I am actually saying none of the things you suggest. The issue here is abuse that is not universally considered to be abuse, such as teaching a particular way of life or belief system. If you want to discuss physical harm or the Nazis, let's keep that separate in order to enable discussion.

You are fortunate that you live in a nation with values similar to yours. What would happen if you that changed? Would you be so content in any country in the world?

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by PataLeBon:
... You at no point have dealt with the fact that your own viewpoint allows parents to abuse children in ways that an overwhelming majority of people would find abhorrent. If you wanted to separate Phelps's teaching as abuse from a parent who decided to punish a child by beating them almost to death, then you need/needed to say so.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by PataLeBon:
As to whether or not I would be content anywhere else, I don't have a clue and don't even want to speculate. I have found simply by moving between states here that even in the same country things can be quite different from place to place. (Heck things are quite different from where I live and where I work!).

And mindless speculation, without facts, just isn't something I do.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Karl: Liberal Backslider:
SS - let me get this clear.

Suppose a parent tied their child to a chair and flogged them with a cat of nine tails such that their skin was removed and their bones exposed as a "punishment", you don't believe the state should intervene?

My God.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by sharkshooter:
It is the parents who are entrusted by God to raise their children. Parents answer to God for their actions, not to society.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by PataLeBon:
And I think that there is a place for society to say there can be mental abuse of children.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Henry Troup:

quote:

---

Originally posted by PataLeBon:
And I think that there is a place for society to say there can be mental abuse of children.

---

What if, for example, I decided to (living in Canada where we drive on the left) teach a child that cars drive on the right? Or that the words "red" and "green" had interchanged meanings from the standard; and that they should cross on the "green" signal?

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Henry Troup:

quote:

---

Originally posted by PataLeBon:
And I think that there is a place for society to say there can be mental abuse of children.

---

What if, for example, I decided to (living in Canada where we drive on the left) teach a child that cars drive on the right? Or that the words "red" and "green" had interchanged meanings from the standard; and that they should cross on the "green" signal?

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by sharkshooter:

quote:

---

Originally posted by dogwonderer:
Well, I happen to think it is abuse of innocent children to involve them with such despicable fundamentalist bigotry- especially if it exposes them to third-party harm.

---

I happen to think it is abuse of innocent children (or not-so-innocent adults) to fail to teach them about hell - because it condemns them to everlasting harm.

However, the law in most countries does not agree with either point of view.

---

Nothing you do condemns them to everlasting harm - its your God that does that.
 

---

Posted by Matt Black (# 2210) on :
 
It would appear that the law is finally beginning to catch up with Phred and Co
 

---

Posted by Lyda*Rose (# 4544) on :
 
Huzzah!
 

---

Posted by Matt Black (# 2210) on :
 
I hope (in Christian Love™, of course) that this opens the floodgates and the mean old bastard goes bankrupt
 

---

Posted by Sioni Sais (# 5713) on :
 
There's very little chance of that. However bankrupt his theology and doctrine may be the Phelpsians have plenty of cash and I suspect some rich backers who wouldn't be seen dead carrying those banners but have common cause with the Phelpsians.
 

---

Posted by Matt Black (# 2210) on :
 
A pox on them all, then
 

---

Posted by PeteCanada (# 10422) on :
 
That'll probably be appealed by WBC tame lawyers. But it did give me a momentary warm feeling.
 

---

Posted by Matt Black (# 2210) on :
 
Most of them are lawyers, aren't they? God help my profession...
 

---

Posted by PeteCanada (# 10422) on :
 
At least it's not the second oldest profession Matt! Be of good cheer!
 

---

Posted by Liopleurodon (# 4836) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by Sioni Sais:
There's very little chance of that. However bankrupt his theology and doctrine may be the Phelpsians have plenty of cash and I suspect some rich backers who wouldn't be seen dead carrying those banners but have common cause with the Phelpsians.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Matt Black:
It would appear that the law is finally beginning to catch up with Phred and Co

---

Here's a longer article about the story.
 

---

Posted by Pigwidgeon (# 10192) on :
 
Unfortunately, it hasn't slowed him down: Group Plans to Picket Va. Tech Funerals
 

---

Posted by Sioni Sais (# 5713) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by Liopleurodon:

quote:

---

Originally posted by Sioni Sais:
There's very little chance of that. However bankrupt his theology and doctrine may be the Phelpsians have plenty of cash and I suspect some rich backers who wouldn't be seen dead carrying those banners but have common cause with the Phelpsians.

---

Is that actually true, though? My guess is that the kind of far-right groups which might have sympathy with the extreme homophobia will probably be alienated by the "God hates America" stuff. I can't see an obvious audience for Phelps' views, other than his own family, who believe that their salvation depends on agreeing with him.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Pigwidgeon:
Unfortunately, it hasn't slowed him down: Group Plans to Picket Va. Tech Funerals

---

Oh. Fuck. Words fail me...
 

---

Posted by Golden Key (# 1468) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by Pigwidgeon:
Unfortunately, it hasn't slowed him down: Group Plans to Picket Va. Tech Funerals

---

Figured that was coming. I wonder if he applies "God is pissed off!" theology when something bad happens to him?
 

---

Posted by Matt Black (# 2210) on :
 
What a c*nt
 

---

Posted by Lookin (# 10855) on :
 
words fail.

i was trying to think of something else to put, but words really do fail.
 

---

Posted by Malin (# 11769) on :
 
They really do seem to have 'rejoice with those who rejoice and mourn with those who mourn' the wrong way round.

Haven't they read the gospel where Jesus tells us people killed by a falling tower were not being punished by God? How do they interpret Job?

At a loss to know what to do beyond turning anger to prayer somehow. And to thank God I didn't get born a Phelps!
 

---

Posted by GoodCatholicLad (# 9231) on :
 
Has anyone seen this?
this crowd makes hell attractive


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=My8KxRj_Pwo

[ 22. April 2007, 21:11: Message edited by: GoodCatholicLad ]
 

---

Posted by Filius Luciferi (# 12571) on :
 
206:'I've just been called by God to create a 'slap the shit out of assholes ministry' based in Topeka.'

How did He get your number?
How do you know it wasn't me?
Did He call 'collect' like they do in Church?
I like the Phelpses ... they're a bunch of cretins. Just one question though, when they say that 'God Hates Fags', do they mean it in the Brit or Yank sense? Can't see what God has against 20 Woodbines.
 

---

Posted by Pigwidgeon (# 10192) on :
 
Welcome, Filius Luciferi -- I never thought of "godhatesfags" as an anti-smoking campaign!

 

---

Posted by Ariel (# 58) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by Pigwidgeon:
I never thought of "godhatesfags" as an anti-smoking campaign!

---

quote:

---

How did He get your number?
How do you know it wasn't me?
Did He call 'collect' like they do in Church?

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Ariel:

quote:

---

Originally posted by Pigwidgeon:
I never thought of "godhatesfags" as an anti-smoking campaign!

---

Jesus hates it when you smoke.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by 206:


Given that Fred and his ilk scare the bejeezus out of us, our official ministry policy is 'Cash first; action later'.

Much cash.

---

Great stuff! I'm glad to see that you maintain your priorities in good order.

[Go practice coding in the Styx.]

[ 25. April 2007, 11:35: Message edited by: Sarkycow ]
 

---

Posted by Filius Luciferi (# 12571) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by Ariel:
Jesus hates it when you smoke.

---

In Hades we have no other option since all you God-botherers decided we should suffer eternal fire and brimstone. It may not exactly be Benson & Hedges ... but WE like it!
 

---

Posted by Filius Luciferi (# 12571) on :
 
[Go practice coding in the Styx.]

[ 25. April 2007, 11:35: Message edited by: Sarkycow ]

In Hades we still use the Enigma machine.
Somewhat slow, but adequate since we added a seventh rotor wheel. We tried hiding messages under wax as did the Lady Gorgo, but it melts as fast as you can apply the damn stuff down here. Hence the hi-tech solution.
 

---

Posted by Mr Clingford (# 7961) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by Filius Luciferi:

quote:

---

Originally posted by Ariel:
Jesus hates it when you smoke.

---

In Hades we have no other option since all you God-botherers decided we should suffer eternal fire and brimstone.

---

quote:

---

God-botherers?

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Emma.:
I still havent quite worked out *how* they manage to pratice as lawyers. Would any client really go to someone as screwed up as the phelps? Would the Phelps be able to take a case unjudgementally? It does seem very odd.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Matt Black:
According to his Wikipedia entry, Fred started out as a fairly successful civil rights lawyer! Truth is indeed stranger than fiction...

---

quote:

---

Lawsuits were filed, but rarely went to trial-and even more rarely reached a decision. Instead, Phelps practiced what he always had: 'take-the-money-and run'....In the multi-million dollar Kansas Power and Light case, Phelps filed a class-action on behalf of 2,000 blacks who had accused the utility of discrimination in their hiring and promotion practices.

Fred settled out of court for the following: *Two black employees received $12,000 each. *$100,000 was paid out to the other plaintiffs. If one counts the original 2,000, that made for 50 bucks each.

---

quote:

---

During their teenage years, both Mark and Nate worked as law clerks in their father's office. "When a black client was in there," recalls Nate, "my father would play the 'DN' game with us. It stands for 'dumb <you can figure it out>'. We would all try to use the acronym as often as possible in the presence of the person involved."

---

I also love how, when three of his kids failed to make the cut at Washburn law school, he sued the school on affirmative action grounds, claiming that his kids should be accorded the same privileges as black kids because of his civil rights litigation history. When two of them failed to make the cut again the next year, he turned around and sued the school again, this time for reverse discrimination because the school had admitted less qualified black candidates in 1984.

Oh, and by the way, I don't think that book ever actually got published. There were lawsuits involved...
 

---

Posted by Matt Black (# 2210) on :
 
Thanks for the clarification; I thought it sounded a bit too much out of character.
 

---

Posted by Doublethink (# 1984) on :
 
Yeah that does make a lot more sense. Have to say I went back over the life history in wikki, wondering if there was some accident when he banged his head or something. The sermon he preached on the Louis Theroux's program was very perseverative - made me wonder if he had a form of dementia.
 

---

Posted by Louise (# 30) on :
 
I do wonder if people will picket his funeral.

L.
 

---

Posted by Lamb Chopped (# 5528) on :
 
Ya think?

I think he'd be sadly disappointed if nobody did. The ultimate attention whore.
 

---

Posted by Louise (# 30) on :
 
Sadly, too true.

L.
 

---

Posted by Gort (# 6855) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by Louise:
I do wonder if people will picket his funeral.

---

I doubt there will be pickets; more likely wild partying, balloons, clowns and street dancing... that is unless he dies in prison and the ashes are buried out behind cellblock "F".
 

---

Posted by Louise (# 30) on :
 
Yeah but whatever way people respond, apart from ignoring it, he'd still be gratified to get a reaction. He's like an internet troll who needs his fix of attention to feel important, but he's become such a media 'celebrity' now that it's impossible to get people to ignore him.

To attention whores there is no such thing as negative attention.

L.
 

---

Posted by Gort (# 6855) on :
 
How timely and apropos!
 

---

Posted by justlooking (# 12079) on :
 
It occurred to me when watching the Louis Theroux programme that Fred Phelps could be gay. Yes really! There's some research around to suggest that people who express hate and aggression towards homosexuals are in denial about their own homosexual inclinations. I wish Louis Theroux had been able to put this to Phelps - his reaction would have been wonderful to behold.
 

---

Posted by Jahlove (# 10290) on :
 
Well, he clearly has a *thing* about homosexuality as the *cause* of all the problems experienced in American society, I doubt, though, whether *confronting* 'Pastor Fred' with such an accusation would have got Louis Theroux (or anyone) any more satisfactory responses than were demonstrated on that programme.

Interviewer: Pastor Fred: are you not, in fact, a repressed gay?

Pastor Fred: The Bible clearly states that homoseckshuls go to Ha-yull to burn fer all eternity.

Interviewer: Oh, OK, then

Unless and until everyone can either ignore or just point and laugh at Fred and his ilk, howe'er disguised, we will have these discussions
 

---

Posted by justlooking (# 12079) on :
 
I think Theroux could have pursued the point. The 'burn in hell' response wouldn't have answered the point about Phelps being a repressed gay.

Perhaps some enterprising group could produce car stickers etc with the question. 'Is Fred Phelps Gay?
 

---

Posted by Golden Key (# 1468) on :
 
I shudder to think what Fred might do if someone started a campaign like that...


 

---

Posted by Kelly Alves (# 2522) on :
 
What the hell could he do? He's been hiding behind the first amendmant forever. How would he backtrack?

I'd prefer something a little more pungent: "Phred Phelps: Textbook Closet Case."
 

---

Posted by Jahlove (# 10290) on :
 
Phred, the Lion and the Wardrobe?
 

---

Posted by Golden Key (# 1468) on :
 
Kelly--

Well, he could step up what he's already doing, he could do it in a more extreme way, he could get violent.

If people do a "Fred's gay!" campaign, he's not apt to stop what he's already doing and he's not apt to move to the Castro district of SF and march proudly in the next Gay Pride parade.

That kind of campaign would help people vent, but it would only make the situation worse.



 

---

Posted by Kelly Alves (# 2522) on :
 
He's gonna keep up what he's doing and find excuses to do it no matter what anybody does. If people help each other laugh at his silly ass, it might at least take away some of his power.
 

---

Posted by Gort (# 6855) on :
 
Maybe an expeditionary force (with night-goggles and stuff) could sneak through his bedroom window, strap a leather mask and ball gag on him, drag him out in the front yard and work him over with truncheons and stun guns while taking pictures. Yeah, that's the ticket.
 

---

Posted by Kelly Alves (# 2522) on :
 
Or maybe a strapping healthy man can attempt to seduce him. Go ahead, Gort.
 

---

Posted by Gort (# 6855) on :
 
Gort looked deeply into Phred's eyes over the dry martini. Understanding flickered there as his hand moved to the tinman's knee...
 

---

Posted by comet (# 10353) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by Gort:
Maybe an expeditionary force (with night-goggles and stuff) could sneak through his bedroom window, strap a leather mask and ball gag on him, drag him out in the front yard and work him over with truncheons and stun guns while taking pictures. Yeah, that's the ticket.

---

oooh me! pick me! pick me! I wanna go!

(what the hell is a ball gag? do I want to know?)
 

---

Posted by davelarge (# 186) on :
 
I should imagine that Google is your friend. Perhaps best not to do that search at work though
 

---

Posted by comet (# 10353) on :
 
nah, I'll let my poor innocent mind stay in it's Happy Place and not traumatize it anymore than necessary.

you sickos can just carry on...

( a ball gag? but they don't have little mouths to gag...? what is the point?)
 

---

Posted by Filius Luciferi (# 12571) on :
 
Comet:'( a ball gag? but they don't have little mouths to gag...? what is the point?)'


Haven't you watched Pulp Fiction?

Maybe somebody goan get mediaeval on yo ass!

[ 07. May 2007, 08:40: Message edited by: Filius Luciferi ]
 

---

Posted by comet (# 10353) on :
 
no.

life is too short to waste it on stupid looking movies.
 

---

Posted by Teufelchen (# 10158) on :
 
Filius Luciferi, learn to quote.

Comet, a ball gag is a charming piece of S&M paraphenalia, as I'm sure Google has told you by now.

But (to drag the thread kicking and screaming back on topic) I don't think Fred is a closet case, and I'm not sure that claming it would help at all. It might well have the unwanted effect of making people associate homosexuality in positive, instead of negative, correlation with horrifying beliefs and behaviour like his.

T.
 

---

Posted by The Crab (# 12250) on :
 
Careful about saying Fred is closet gay - he might sue! according to several online sources his intent is to provoke people into doing something he can claim damages for. this is the only one I could find offhand
http://www.blackfive.net/main/2005/08/the_intent_of_f.html
It is speculation, but given the character of the man, seems to me it well might be the real reason and the source of his fundign.
 

---

Posted by Gort (# 6855) on :
 
Phelps couldn't sue his way out of a wet paper docket.
 

---

Posted by Beautiful_Dreamer (# 10880) on :
 
I wonder what makes people so hateful like that. I know some pretty hateful people and they are usually either incredibly ignorant, angry, or miserable in and of themselves and thus have a need to make sure no one else around them is happy. Either way, I feel disgust and pity for people like that.

What I really hate is that some non-Christians think he speaks for us.
 

---

Posted by Filius Luciferi (# 12571) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by Teufelchen:
Filius Luciferi, learn to quote.

---

No!
 

---

Posted by Gort (# 6855) on :
 
No sense taxing your learning skills, eh?
 

---

Posted by Campbellite (# 1202) on :
 
Please note, Gort, that he did, in fact, quote properly.
 

---

Posted by Kelly Alves (# 2522) on :
 
(slumps over keyboard in fit of hysterical laughter.)

Campbellite
 

---

Posted by Gort (# 6855) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by Campbellite:
Please note, Gort, that he did, in fact, quote properly.

---

Yes, obviously. And it was no doubt a difficult accomplishment.
 

---

Posted by teddybear (# 7842) on :
 
The Phelps are in the local news again. It seems they are being sued for copyright infringement. And here.
 

---

Posted by Pigwidgeon (# 10192) on :
 
Fred and his gang are picketing the funeral of Jerry Falwell.

 

---

Posted by comet (# 10353) on :
 
from the above website:

quote:

---

It is plain to the servants of God, that America is taking a blood bath in Iraq because America is busily persecuting WBC for preaching the Word of God to this evil nation of perverts.

---

quote:

---

And, as Christ warned doomed Jerusalem, even so WBC -- warns doomed America: "O America, America, thou that killest the prophets, and stonest them which are sent unto thee (translate: thou that persecutest WBC), how often would I have gathered thy children together, even as a hen gathereth her chickens under her wings, and ye would not! Behold, your house is left unto you desolate." Matt. 23:37-38.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by comet:
He's just not that into you, babe.

---

 

---

Posted by SeraphimSarov (# 4335) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by teddybear:
The Phelps are in the local news again. It seems they are being sued for copyright infringement. And here.

---

well, they are a family of lawyers!


 

---

Posted by Beautiful_Dreamer (# 10880) on :
 
I'm sorry, but picketing funerals shows an incredible amount of tackiness in my book. Sure, maybe Fred didn't like Falwell much, I didn't agree with him on a lot of things either. But he could at least have some respect for the family and friends who mourn him. But apparently that is too much to ask.
 

---

Posted by Lyda*Rose (# 4544) on :
 
Gee. Ol' Fred's got me almost liking Jerry Fallwell.

Praise Jaysusss! It's a muhr-uh-kle!
 

---

Posted by Kelly Alves (# 2522) on :
 
Y'know, sometimes in my wierder moments, I wonder if Phelps is the Andy Kaufman of religion. Know what I mean? That he sets up situations in which his ideas seem so repulsive and over-the-top ugly that you can't help but rush away from them screaming. Maybe somewhere in there is a glimmer of humanity crying out, "Learn! Learn from me! And don't be like me! See the horror that I am, and choose wisely!"

And then I think, "Nahhhh."
 

---

Posted by Kelly Alves (# 2522) on :
 
(As Kelly continues on with a Christopher Walkenesque bout of philosophical fixation...)

Or, maybe the Moral Majority paid him of to make Jer look good by comparison.

Or, maybe the Rainbow Coalition paid him off to underline the few gay-friendly comments Jer made.

Or...
 

---

Posted by Filius Luciferi (# 12571) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by Gort:
No sense taxing your learning skills, eh?

---

Why not? NuLab tax every other bloody thing they can think of.

 

---

Posted by Kelly Alves (# 2522) on :
 
Nobody appreciates my conspiracy theories. Phooey.
 

---

Posted by comet (# 10353) on :
 
I'm with you, Kelly.

I've already decided that he's being secretly funded by Falwell/Roberts/et al to make them look moderate by comparison.

it's the only logical explanation, isn't it?
 

---

Posted by Kelly Alves (# 2522) on :
 
There's just too many coincedences.

And have you ever seen him and Pat Robertson in the same room?
 

---

Posted by comet (# 10353) on :
 
oooOOOOoooooo
 

---

Posted by Pigwidgeon (# 10192) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by Lyda*Rose:
Gee. Ol' Fred's got me almost liking Jerry Fallwell.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Pigwidgeon:

quote:

---

Originally posted by Lyda*Rose:
Gee. Ol' Fred's got me almost liking Jerry Fallwell.

---

Then this video should really do it.

---

quote:

---

Then this video should really do it.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by 206:
[QUOTE]

I wonder if you have to work at not blinking or if it comes natural.

---

Nah ... 4 office staples does the trick for me!
 

---

Posted by Stoker (# 11939) on :
 
From the sound of this rather bitter and sad sounding rant, the only people who are going to make it into heaven are the Phelps clan!

That's my idea of hell! Imagine arriving there and finding the Phelps gang have got the monopoly on the place!

Not very 'hellish' words, but thank God that mercy and grace triumph over judgement.
 

---

Posted by Henry Troup (# 3722) on :
 
A Phelps daughter got arrested in a protest in Nebraska for "contributing to the delinquency of a minor". Some inconsistencies in the story, though.
 

---

Posted by comet (# 10353) on :
 
continuing on that theme, from the "truth is stranger than fiction" department:

Head: Westboro Baptist Church Found in Bed with ACLU!
sub: Hellhosts buy hats, scarves
 

---

Posted by Golden Key (# 1468) on :
 



Iccccceeee skates! Get yer ice skates heeeere!

This might be the time to buy stock in pharmaceutical companies, given all the pain relievers and psych meds the ACLU will need to cope with the Phelps clan. And vice-versa, for that matter.
 

---

Posted by Sioni Sais (# 5713) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by Golden Key:



Iccccceeee skates! Get yer ice skates heeeere!

This might be the time to buy stock in pharmaceutical companies, given all the pain relievers and psych meds the ACLU will need to cope with the Phelps clan. And vice-versa, for that matter.

---

Would that be the ice skate to go with the one in your bag, along with your lunch box and reading matter?

ps, I love the quote from Shirley Phelps-Roper in the Omaha paper about the "Nebraska law being out of date"

[ 13. July 2007, 07:31: Message edited by: Sioni Sais ]
 

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Posted by Golden Key (# 1468) on :
 
Sioni, I'm sure that's meant to be funny, but I'm missing it.
 

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Posted by Henry Troup (# 3722) on :
 

quote:

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Originally posted by Golden Key:
...psych meds the ACLU will need to cope with the Phelps clan.

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quote:

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Originally posted by Henry Troup:
the American N*z* Party [/URL]

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bunch of self-deluded losers who were even more out of tune with the US people than the American Communists. Or for that matter the Phelpists.
 

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Posted by Squirrel (# 3040) on :
 
And the Nebraska ACLU has a link to Lincoln's Gay Pride parade page. Maybe Fred will take time away from protesting at dead Marines' funerals to attend on behalf of those who are giving him free legal support.
 

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Posted by Saint Hedrin the Lesser-Known (# 11399) on :
 
this just in?

Goodness!
 

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Posted by hamletta (# 11678) on :
 

quote:

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Originally posted by Saint Hedrin the Lesser-Known:
this just in?

Goodness!

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Oh, my! The Phelpses aren't so good with the ol' Photoshop, are they? I imagine they'll be hearing from Notre Dame and General Mills soon.
 

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Posted by Saint Hedrin the Lesser-Known (# 11399) on :
 
Ah, yes, the trademark infringement/parody thing at the courts.

Sick, isn't it.
 

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Posted by JArthurCrank (# 9175) on :
 


Where's the provisional IRA when you need 'em?

No, I can HARDLY wait for the Fred Phelps to show up at a St. Patrick's Day parade somewhere ranting about "Fag Paddy" and "Fag Ireland." That may very well be the last we will hear of the Phelps clan.
 

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Posted by Saint Hedrin the Lesser-Known (# 11399) on :
 

quote:

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Originally posted by JArthurCrank:


Where's the provisional IRA when you need 'em?

No, I can HARDLY wait for the Fred Phelps to show up at a St. Patrick's Day parade somewhere ranting about "Fag Paddy" and "Fag Ireland." That may very well be the last we will hear of the Phelps clan.

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I prefer a Monty Python-esque demise for their lot: thing the Hand of God extending a finger to obliterate Westboro Baptist and everybody in it.
 

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Posted by flighty (# 11364) on :
 
In regards to the godhatesireland ediarrhoea Phelpsy Sr spewed out...

He seems awfully sure that an invitation to a debate is a plot to arrest him.

I'm pretty sure that if the Irish wanted to stop the Phelps klan (yes it was an intentional k) then they would just use some of their surplus IRA boys and/or girls instead of in international public invitation to a debate on GAY RIGHTS which he publicly despises.

Hmmmm....Phelpsy Sr seems paranoid. But it's not paranoia when they ARE out to get ya!!!

I wonder what the Irish would do...
It brings a smile to my face


-[spleeling]-

[ 27. July 2007, 05:41: Message edited by: flighty ]
 

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Posted by Beautiful_Dreamer (# 10880) on :
 
I was not sure if the Godhatesireland.com site was a spoof or was real. It was just so ridiculous. What is Phelps' damage anyway? He comes across as a very sad person who wants to make sure everyone else is miserable too.
 

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Posted by Jimmy B (# 220) on :
 

quote:

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Kelly:
maybe the Rainbow Coalition paid him off to underline the few gay-friendly comments Jer made.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Beautiful_Dreamer:
I was not sure if the Godhatesireland.com site was a spoof or was real. It was just so ridiculous. What is Phelps' damage anyway? He comes across as a very sad person who wants to make sure everyone else is miserable too.

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quote:

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Originally posted by Beautiful_Dreamer:
I was not sure if the Godhatesireland.com site was a spoof or was real. It was just so ridiculous.

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quote:

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Originally posted by Squirrel:
I hardly think Pastor Fred is sad. He's done damn well for himself and his family.

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What do you mean by this accusation?
 

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Posted by Beautiful_Dreamer (# 10880) on :
 
Yes, but look how many people he had to step on to do it. The fact that this thread has gone on as long as it has shows that he is at least successful in getting people to hate him. He seems to have made a living out of being completely depraved. I shudder to think what it must be like to be related to this guy.
 

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Posted by Frater_Frag (# 2184) on :
 
And here is another way to deal with these jerks...

Solution?

[WARNING: advertisements on the linked site are not work/toddler safe.
comet
Hellhost]

[ 02. August 2007, 08:57: Message edited by: comet ]
 

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Posted by Squirrel (# 3040) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by Beautiful_Dreamer:
Yes, but look how many people he had to step on to do it. The fact that this thread has gone on as long as it has shows that he is at least successful in getting people to hate him. He seems to have made a living out of being completely depraved. I shudder to think what it must be like to be related to this guy.

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quote:

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Originally posted by Zach82:
I dunno. I think it's kinda sad that these people seem to fanatically devoted the Jesus and the Bible, yet seem to have missed the point so utterly. Like squeezing blood out of turnips or or getting yet another turn of the screw or some other apt metaphor for futility....


Zach

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quote:

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Originally posted by Saint Hedrin the Lesser-Known:
this just in?

Goodness!

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If that isn't a pisstake I'm quite proud of my little island for attracting the ire of the Phelps clan.
 

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Posted by SeraphimSarov (# 4335) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by Yerevan:

quote:

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Originally posted by Saint Hedrin the Lesser-Known:
this just in?

Goodness!

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If that isn't a pisstake I'm quite proud of my little island for attracting the ire of the Phelps clan.

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quote:

---

In a press release issued the day after the bridge collapse, the church called for protests at the funerals and outlined its feelings about the relationship between God's plan and the sins of Minneapolis and Minnesota, which it calls the "land of the Sodomite damned."

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oh yah! Doncha know what a hotbed of hedomism and kinky sex they have up there! What else ya gonna do on the prairie when the winds'r blowin'? Yer gonna corrupt the world, that's what! After you make a tuna hotdish, of course. Good hotdish always comes first. Yah!

*nods*
 

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Posted by Izzybee (# 10931) on :
 
Gosh. I wonder if you colored in every state, city and country that's the "land of the sodomite damned" according to Phelps, whether you'd have any land left uncolored?

Presumably there's at least a small patch of Topeka, KS that he feels is OK, and presumably Antarctica couldn't have done anything to offend him...

[ETA: Fixing quote. Not just depraved but sodomite damned. Scary]

[ 10. August 2007, 14:58: Message edited by: Izzybee ]
 

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Posted by DaisyM (# 9098) on :
 
Wow !! We could stop doing red states and blue states and just do "gay agenda" states and "resisting the danger of damnation" states.


 

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Posted by Pigwidgeon (# 10192) on :
 
I wonder if the mining collapse in Utah -- probably the most conservative state in the U.S. -- is for the same reason?
 

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Posted by rosamundi (# 2495) on :
 

quote:

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Originally posted by Paul W.:
Ooo look, the Minnesota bridge collapse was apparently caused by gays too! Who would have guessed?

Paul W

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quote:

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Twice they stole our picket signs violently, and right out of our hands - on the public sidewalk in front of the Basilica of St. Mary, 88 N. 17th St., Minneapolis, MN - as the police looked on and laughed. Typical Minnesotans.
We want our property back.

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quote:

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Originally posted by Pigwidgeon:
I wonder if the mining collapse in Utah -- probably the most conservative state in the U.S. -- is for the same reason?

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Well, duh!


[ 13. August 2007, 21:22: Message edited by: rosamundi ]
 

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Posted by JArthurCrank (# 9175) on :
 
I really hope they try to protest the Merv Griffin funeral mass. Perhaps the choir can step outside and sing "I've Got a Lovely Bunch of Coconuts" in their general direction.
 

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Posted by Golden Key (# 1468) on :
 

quote:

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Originally posted by Izzybee:
Presumably there's at least a small patch of Topeka, KS that he feels is OK, and presumably Antarctica couldn't have done anything to offend him...

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quote:

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Originally posted by Golden Key:

quote:

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Originally posted by Izzybee:
Presumably there's at least a small patch of Topeka, KS that he feels is OK, and presumably Antarctica couldn't have done anything to offend him...

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Ah, but aren't some of those penguins gay?

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Even if they aren't, they haven't done anything to prevent the gayness that goes on in other parts of the globe. If they were good, red-blooded, God-fearing Christian penguins, they would be here with us picketing outside the funerals of puffins, whom we all know are ... well, you know.
 

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Posted by Paul W. (# 1450) on :
 
Well, these are South American gay penguins, but I guess they get up to that kind of stuff in Antarctica too.

godhatespenguins.com - just watch this space...

Paul W
 

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Posted by flighty (# 11364) on :
 
MT...


 

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Posted by flighty (# 11364) on :
 
I wonder why Phelps and his clan of inbreds will never agree to a debate with a christian...?
 

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Posted by SearchingForAbsolutes (# 11966) on :
 

quote:

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Originally posted by flighty:
I wonder why Phelps and his clan of inbreds will never agree to a debate with a christian...?

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quote:

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Originally posted by Songs of Praise:
I think <snip>* his usual MO.

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quote:

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Posted 03 April, 2007 02:52

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Ah well - it was nice to see her/him pop up again. Kinda nostalgic, really. [/Further tangent]
 

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Posted by Songs of Praise (# 8435) on :
 
Hi Zappa (and others). I am still around, nearly three years on from a cancer scare. I'm still in remission and in good health. I also kicked in my job after nearly 20 years to work as a freelance musician, web designer and journalist - which, as any other self-employed person might tell you, is probably the reason I've not found time to visit here.

There - enough nice talk in hell for now!
 

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Posted by infinite_monkey (# 11333) on :
 

quote:

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Originally posted by Paul W.:
Well, these are South American gay penguins, but I guess they get up to that kind of stuff in Antarctica too.

godhatespenguins.com - just watch this space...

Paul W

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quote:

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Originally posted by infinite_monkey:
Indeed, penguins are the wanton Sodomites of the avian world. Behold, more evidence of their transgressions!

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Has someone told our Smudgie?
 

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Posted by Campbellite (# 1202) on :
 

quote:

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Originally posted by SearchingForAbsolutes:
The guy would do great in politics (and I hear he's a Democrat!)

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What? That bunch of gay-friendly libruls? I doubt it.

By his own (twisted) logic, if he votes at all, he is collaborating with The Gay Agenda™ (whatever that is), and thus is going to Hell. (To everyone's delight, except, perhaps, Satan's)
 

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Posted by Squirrel (# 3040) on :
 
Even the military is too librul and gay-friendly for Pastor Fred. I doubt whether any organization, political party or other, would meet his demanding standards.
 

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Posted by Welease Woderwick (# 10424) on :
 

quote:

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Originally posted by Campbellite:
... The Gay Agenda™ (whatever that is)...

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quote:

---

Originally posted by Campbellite:

quote:

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Originally posted by SearchingForAbsolutes:
The guy would do great in politics (and I hear he's a Democrat!)

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What? That bunch of gay-friendly libruls? I doubt it.

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He's run as a Dem in 5 Kansas primaries. Back in the day, he had Al and Tipper over for a support rally at his home/compound. I guess he's disappointed in the Democrat support for gay rights, but we all know, American politics works best when you pick a party and stick with it, regardless of whether or not you like what they stand for.
 

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Posted by Nicolemrw (# 28) on :
 
For anyone interested, the latest from Phelps: (or at least his organization)

Anti-Gay Church: Thompson Agreed With Us
 

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Posted by Beautiful_Dreamer (# 10880) on :
 
The smartest thing Fred Thompson could do (and anyone else, for that matter) would be to completely distance himself from *anything* that comes out of Westboro Baptist. Their support is not worth anything. Thompson should consider it an *honor* to be told by the Phelps clan that they do not agree anymore, if they ever really did.

And I thought Thompson was smarter than to agree with anything that comes from Fred Phelps. I hope I wasn't wrong.
 

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Posted by Frustrated Farmer (# 10782) on :
 
According to the local newspaper today, a bomb threat was alleged to have been called in to Phred's church yesterday, while most of the gang was out of town. No bomb found, however plenty of TV air time.
 

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Posted by SearchingForAbsolutes (# 11966) on :
 
Phelps Theology 101

1- Every act on Earth is controlled by God.
ex: The U.S. army is being punished by God, who uses "perverts" to kill soldiers. Mine collapses, Amish school shootings, etc. are also God's judgments. God should be praised for these, no matter what they are.

However, any bad happenings for Phelpsco or their compound is the sinful world persecuting them.

If he wasn't a clergyman, I'd think he was manipulative.


Anyone into copyright laws? With that banner on GodHatesIreland.com, I'd love to see Notre Dame and General Mills put these folks in the red for a loooooong time.
 

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Posted by Pigwidgeon (# 10192) on :
 

quote:

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A federal jury on Wednesday awarded the father of a fallen Marine $2.9 million in compensatory damages after finding an anti-gay Kansas church and three of its leaders liable for invasion of privacy and intent to inflict emotional distress for picketing the Marine's funeral in 2006...

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I'm trying to find a good link to this.
 

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Posted by sandushinka (# 13021) on :
 
Here's one.
 

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Posted by DaisyM (# 9098) on :
 
Good for the Charm City jury!
 

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Posted by OliviaG (# 9881) on :
 
It's a wonderful victory for the Snyder family, with a cherry on top:

quote:

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The judge said the church's financial statements, sealed earlier, could be released to the plaintiffs.

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Oh, dear. Do you think the plaintiffs will be able to resist the temptation to make the financial shena- excuse me, statements of Fred's cult/family public? OliviaG
 

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Posted by Frustrated Farmer (# 10782) on :
 
I am sure that the state of Phred's finances would be of great interest to many people in his home community.
 

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Posted by teddybear (# 7842) on :
 
Now everyone keep your fingers crossed that they lose the inevitable appeal.
 

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Posted by TonyK (# 35) on :
 
Can a USA friend enlighten us here over this side of the water?
What happens now if Phelps and Co can't and/or won't pay?
The news article implied that the judge felt that the award was higher than the defendants' assets. Am I reading this OK? If so, what next?

But I agree - a wonderful result
 

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Posted by Frustrated Farmer (# 10782) on :
 
Now that they have a judgement, I would guess that the Phelps would have to put up all of their assets to pay the award. If they plead poverty, I believe that they can be hauled into court occasionally if the winners believe they have acquired something of value that can be used to pay the judgement.

Perhaps someone who is more knowledgeable about this can comment.
 

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Posted by 206 (# 206) on :
 

quote:

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Originally posted by TonyK:
Can a USA friend enlighten us here over this side of the water?
What happens now if Phelps and Co can't and/or won't pay?

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quote:

---

Originally posted by Tortuf:
Additionally, the church building is bound to have some value as a tourist attraction if nothing else.

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quote:

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Originally posted by 206:

quote:

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Originally posted by Tortuf:
Additionally, the church building is bound to have some value as a tourist attraction if nothing else.

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If memory serves their church building is also their home. Can they lose their primary place of residence?

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quote:

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Originally posted by 206:
If memory serves their church building is also their home. Can they lose their primary place of residence?

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Yes, under the right circumstances, they can lose their primary residence. It depends on the equity they have in the place among other things.
 

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Posted by Saint Hedrin the Lesser-Known (# 11399) on :
 
I ventured idly into their official website and looked at their picketing schedule. It appears that the millions they stand to lose due to the lawsuit does not hinder them from staging a picket at Helsinki for the Jokela massacre.

Silly people! Me-doubts that they'll even get visas to visit Finland.

Lord help me if they decide to picket the nearest Finnish consulate in the region.
 

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Posted by Golden Key (# 1468) on :
 
IIRC, they were wisely kept out of the UK some years back.
 

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Posted by Saint Hedrin the Lesser-Known (# 11399) on :
 
With recent news of a bombing at the Philippine House of Representatives' compound, resulting in the death of a Muslim congressman (Rep. Wahab Akbar of Basilan), I won't be surprised if Phred Felps and his little horde will want to picket the Batasan ("Legislature") complex.

what's worse is that a lot of people enjoy 3 weeks' worth of visa-free stay in this country. Then again, the millions they have to pay the Snyders might delay that jaut a bit, and by then, that part of Batasan will have been cleared of rubble and restored to its regular use, although the business of legislation will be conducted with some mourning over the loss of one of their own.

I pray God that should any member of the Fleps family set foot on these Islands, let them be detained and deported as personae non gratae, or be welcomed by the local Hare Krishna in full force... Or the Catholic Bishops with the ghost of Cardinal Sin hovering overhead.
 

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Posted by Frustrated Farmer (# 10782) on :
 
I have a report that the clan is headed to Omaha, Nebraska to demonstrate at the shopping mall that was the scene of some violence this week.


 

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Posted by Pigwidgeon (# 10192) on :
 
"Fall from Grace" is being televised in the U.S. this week -- for those who have premium cable t.v.
 

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Posted by RadicalWhig (# 13190) on :
 
The most interesting element of the Phelps' warped theology is the concept of the "fag enabler". This is a person who, although not personally homosexual, is nevertheless deserving of condemnation for not opposing homosexuality. This guilt is corporate - entire nations are to blame especially the EVIL COUNTRY OF SWEDEN . Even if you are personally opposed to homosexuality, by the very fact of living in a country where homosexuality is tolerated you become a fag enabler, and thus a fair target for picketting. It was by this curious logic that the Phelps ended up picking a shop in the US which sold Swedish domestic appliances - complete with "Fag Nation" signs in abundance. Incidentally, the King of Sweden is suing for defamation.
 

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Posted by Living in Gin (# 2572) on :
 
So, if the US decided to pass a federal law protecting the civil rights of GLBT people, Phelps and his minions would be forced to move somewhere more conservative like, say, Afghanistan?

Sounds like everybody comes out a winner in that deal.

(grammar)

[ 11. December 2007, 22:01: Message edited by: Living in Gin ]
 

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Posted by Golden Key (# 1468) on :
 
Gin, ROTFL!
 

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Posted by Sioni Sais (# 5713) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by Living in Gin:
So, if the US decided to pass a federal law protecting the civil rights of GLBT people, Phelps and his minions would be forced to move somewhere more conservative like, say, Afghanistan?

Sounds like everybody comes out a winner in that deal.

(grammar)

---

Afghanis

Like they don't have enough trouble.
 

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Posted by Rev per Minute (# 69) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by Sioni Sais:

quote:

---

Originally posted by Living in Gin:
So, if the US decided to pass a federal law protecting the civil rights of GLBT people, Phelps and his minions would be forced to move somewhere more conservative like, say, Afghanistan?

Sounds like everybody comes out a winner in that deal.

---

Afghanis

Like they don't have enough trouble.

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quote:

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Originally posted by RadicalWhig:
If the US Constitution guarantees the right of the Phelps clan to go about their strange business more-or-less without restraint or molestation, does this mean that the United States is a nation of Phelphs-enablers?

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I hope to God, yes.

Better to acknowledge the boil than let it fester under layers of smug censorship.
 

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Posted by Campbellite (# 1202) on :
 
It's that whole "market place of ideas" thing. By allowing them to expose their ideas in public, they expose themselves to the ridicule and comtempt of all right thinking people, which would be pretty much the rest of the entire human race.

In other words, they protest; everyone else points and laughs.
 

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Posted by Billfrid (# 7279) on :
 
Points and laughs?
Oh yes, the Irish site is a hoot "the poison potato earth" and so on, you couldn't make it up.
Seriously though - have the Phelpses bought up every domain name starting with "godhates" and then the name of a geographical area? (Thinks a bit then goes on to the electric internet...)

I don't believe it!!!
https://secure.uk2.net/cgi-bin/register/newdomain.pl?domain=godhatesphelpses&x=8&y=12&javascript=on
GODHATESPHELPSES.COM IS FREE!


Please somebody - buy it, pretty pretty please.
 

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Posted by RooK (# 1852) on :
 
Please refrain from appearing to promote any questionable or adversarial public actions.

Thanks.

-RooK
Hellhost
 

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Posted by Frustrated Farmer (# 10782) on :
 
If I might be allowed a moment, the clan was back out on the street corner today across from the ECUSA parish I lurk at. The first Sunday back at their old location since the fire, and I got to see their clever signs.
 

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Posted by comet (# 10353) on :
 
You see, Farmer, I think your parish has some great opportunity here. I'm not sure what, exactly. kill them with kindness?

x-lax brownies?

calling in 5,000 hare krishnas to tambourine them to death? there has just got to be something basically harmless but really devious and funny, too.

something worth videotaping.

WWMPD*....

I'll put my thinking cap on. I feel a special shipmeet coming on.

*what would monty python do?

(hope you survived the storm intact, by the way)
 

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Posted by Billfrid (# 7279) on :
 
Dear Hellhost - I didn't "advocate" anything - I just pointed out that a domain name was free, and legally purchasable.
Though if you think you can read minds and predict actions, you could get a real job somewhere.
 

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Posted by RooK (# 1852) on :
 
Dear Billfrid,

I knew you were going to say that, thanks to my mystical Hellhost powers. If you don't like my instruction, feel free to pursue it in the Styx.

My powers also have divined that you're a shithead. Just thought I'd mention that, in case you hadn't noticed it yourself.
 

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Posted by RooK (# 1852) on :
 
comet!

What did I just say about not appearing to promote anything on these boards? At least have the common decency of undermining my appearance of an illusion of authority on a separate thread. Don't make me pull rank and flog you with your own pitchfork.
 

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Posted by comet (# 10353) on :
 
whups, sorry boss.

got carried away in the moment.

*hangs head in shame*
 

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Posted by Billfrid (# 7279) on :
 
rookisacunt.com is also free - maybe I'll buy it.

[removed link, just in case it confuses the slowest amongst us. comet, Hellhost

[ 17. December 2007, 17:21: Message edited by: comet ]
 

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Posted by Sioni Sais (# 5713) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by Billfrid:
rookisacunt.com is also free - maybe I'll buy it.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Billfrid:
I have an infinite number of alter-egos at my command.

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quote:

---

A million Kansans will be taking their Bibles to church in the coming week but they will not be bashing them.

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quote:

---

It's that whole "market place of ideas" thing. By allowing them to expose their ideas in public, they expose themselves to the ridicule and comtempt of all right thinking people, which would be pretty much the rest of the entire human race.

---

Eh, I think by ridiculing them, we're still giving them attention, which is what they seem to get off on. They're like badly behaved children who will do anything to get people to look at them, always looking for the next most absurd stunt they could pull. If it were possible for us all to collectively ignore them when they act up, I bet they would find some other way to deal with their issues. (But they make it hard by being so shockingly offensive.)
 

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Posted by Lynn MagdalenCollege (# 10651) on :
 
I don't know where the video was originally posted, but here is a valuable comment on and opportunity to view something I hope Michael Jackson will sue over...

The only thing that really scares me is that someone might actually think Phelps and his hate-clan are Christians--
 

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Posted by Clairvauxant (# 13271) on :
 
That video is one of the most disturbing things that I have ever seen.
 

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Posted by bc_anglican (# 12349) on :
 
Freaking.

I think the Phelps clan is a classic case of a cult in the United States. The fact is, the Phelps family are pretty much isolated from everyone.

They really don't understand anything of the Gospel message. They are following after something, but it isn't Jesus.
 

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Posted by RooK (# 1852) on :
 
I just realized that they've somehow confused christ with Cthulhu.
 

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Posted by comet (# 10353) on :
 
how big is the WBC? is it really just an extended family, as it looks from here? or do they have actual followers?

anyone know?

(Frustrated Farmer?)
 

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Posted by Squirrel (# 3040) on :
 
I read somewhere that it has about 30 members.
 

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Posted by luvanddaisies (# 5761) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by Lynn MagdalenCollege:
I don't know where the video was originally posted, but here is a valuable comment on and opportunity to view something I hope Michael Jackson will sue over...

The only thing that really scares me is that someone might actually think Phelps and his hate-clan are Christians--

---

Fucking .
I thought I wouldn't be surprised any more by the things they get up to - clearly I was wrong.

Where did I read something along the lines of;

quote:

---

For God so loved the world, that he gave his only Son, that whoever believes in him should not perish but have eternal life. For God did not send his Son into the world to condemn the world, but in order that the world might be saved through him.

---

[ 23. December 2007, 13:56: Message edited by: luvanddaisies ]
 

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Posted by Welease Woderwick (# 10424) on :
 
Once again I think the best response is to pray for these people - God loves them regardless, just as much as he loves you or me.


 

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Posted by Welease Woderwick (# 10424) on :
 
A further thought:

Yes, these people are appalling and their views are appalling but then I have been faced with homophobia on a pretty much daily basis since before I was even sexually aware so it isn't really news to me - indeed similar views, although generally not couched in such extreme language, are quite a regular occurrence here on the Ship of Fools. In a sense give me the open homophobes any day rather than those that attempt to hide their venom behind sweet words - an honest enemy in front of me is preferable to the honey-tongued back-stabbing bastard behind me!

And because it now involves folks other than fags, indeed the whole world, am I suddenly supposed to take it more seriously?

Well, I'm not sure I can to do that - I'll continue to pray for them and those anti-human rights advocates here on the Ship. I'll even continue to love them all and seek that of God in them all - and I shall thank God that I am not commanded to like them all!
 

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Posted by Beautiful_Dreamer (# 10880) on :
 
Stupid, slightly tangental question.

How can anyone really be against human rights? Especially if they call themselves Christian? It really doesn't add up.
 

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Posted by Frustrated Farmer (# 10782) on :
 
Comet:

I cannot say how many members they have in their church, other than family members, but I do not think that there are many. When anyone from the church is quoted, it is one of the children.

After a 9 inch snow storm yesterday, I do not know if they made their usual Sunday schedule of picketing.
 

---

Posted by Squirrel (# 3040) on :
 
I also read that most of the WBC's members are related to dear Pastor Fred. As the host of that video site remarked, they do look related to one another. Perhaps inbreeding has caused some mental deficiency.
 

---

Posted by Bishops Finger (# 5430) on :
 
Hmm. No 'perhaps' about it, IMHO.

Even if there are only 30 or so of them, they still make a hell of a noise and cause a hell of a fuss.



Ian J.
 

---

Posted by comet (# 10353) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by Welease Woderwick:
In a sense give me the open homophobes any day rather than those that attempt to hide their venom behind sweet words - an honest enemy in front of me is preferable to the honey-tongued back-stabbing bastard behind me!

---

[ 23. December 2007, 21:37: Message edited by: comet ]
 

---

Posted by Lynn MagdalenCollege (# 10651) on :
 
That's very scriptural, WW - "faithful are the wounds of a friend" -- (actually Prov. 27:4-6 is all pretty relevant: Wrath is fierce and anger is a flood, but who can stand before jealousy? (5) Better is open rebuke than love that is concealed. (6) Faithful are the wounds of a friend, but deceitful are the kisses of an enemy.) and Psalm 55:12-14 is profound: For it is not an enemy who reproaches me, then I could bear it; nor is it one who hates me who has exalted himself against me, then I could hide myself from him. But it is you, a man my equal, my companion and my familiar friend; we who had sweet fellowship together walked in the house of God in the throng. Both God and man know a thing or two about betrayal.

A really scary thought is that these people might be Christians in some way yet they actively refute so much of what Jesus explicitly said... talk about grieving God...
 

---

Posted by RooK (# 1852) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by comet:

quote:

---

Originally posted by Welease Woderwick:
an honest enemy in front of me is preferable to the honey-tongued back-stabbing bastard behind me!

---

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Bishops Finger:
Hmm. No 'perhaps' about it, IMHO.

Even if there are only 30 or so of them, they still make a hell of a noise and cause a hell of a fuss.



Ian J.

---

I also read that a lot of them are lawyers. Goes to show it doesn't take too much smarts to get through law school nowadays.
 

---

Posted by OliviaG (# 9881) on :
 
Yep, the song parody was horrid, and I found myself hoping for a knock-down, drag-out, copyright violation lawsuit... until I saw the last 20 seconds - for the love of the sweet baby Jesus, that's CHILD ABUSE. Now I'm hoping the child protection authorities in Kansas see that video and do something about these Phucking Phelpses before there's another Waco or People's Temple. OliviaG
 

---

Posted by The Wanderer (# 182) on :
 
May God bless that child, and set her free from the evil that has been done to her.

And the rest of her family as well.
 

---

Posted by Beautiful_Dreamer (# 10880) on :
 
I saw the parody video, and to me it seems more like an instruction of how NOT to be Christ-like than anything else. What really makes me sick is that there are people who actually believe this crap, and that there are people who think this represents all of us Christians.

If I had to change the label I used for my faith to disassociate from these people, I would. Hopefully I won't have to, because these people will be seen for the hateful bigots they are.

And yes, I agree that teaching that to the child is a form of abuse. We can only pray that she comes to see the real Jesus and rejects what she has been taught in terms of this evil.
 

---

Posted by flighty (# 11364) on :
 
Here is the latest.

Apparently anyone having anything to do at all with Brokeback Mountain is a fag enabler.

I wonder how WBC found out about Brokeback Mountain? Wouldn't reading about it/reading plot lines equate to reading gay propaganda? What about hearing about it? Isn't that the same as listening to gay propaganda?

the best part about these morons is that nobody took them seriously before, and now they have proven themselves just a punch-line to a joke.

who honestly forms an opinion of someone based on a character they portrayed as a critically acclaimed professional actor?

Even the regular lunacy of Phred and Klan has been surpassed by this!!

(dammit can't spel proppperley )

[ 24. January 2008, 10:39: Message edited by: flighty ]
 

---

Posted by PeaceFeet (# 11001) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by flighty:
(dammit can't spel proppperley )

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by flighty:
Here is the latest.

Apparently anyone having anything to do at all with Brokeback Mountain is a fag enabler.

I wonder how WBC found out about Brokeback Mountain? Wouldn't reading about it/reading plot lines equate to reading gay propaganda? What about hearing about it? Isn't that the same as listening to gay propaganda?

the best part about these morons is that nobody took them seriously before, and now they have proven themselves just a punch-line to a joke.

who honestly forms an opinion of someone based on a character they portrayed as a critically acclaimed professional actor?

Even the regular lunacy of Phred and Klan has been surpassed by this!!

(dammit can't spel proppperley )

---

Bastards! Vile, shitty, moronic bastards!

BTW, wtf is a 'fag-enabler'? Someone who dishes out condoms at Gay Pride?
 

---

Posted by rosamundi (# 2495) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by Matt Black:
BTW, wtf is a 'fag-enabler'? Someone who dishes out condoms at Gay Pride?

---

As best I can judge, a "fag enabler" is anyone who, by whatever means, in Revd. Phelps' opinion, supports homosexuals.

So every Catholic is a fag-enabler, because by supporting the Catholic Church, they are supporting a network of paedophile priests with every penny they put in the collection plate.

Every Swedish person is a fag-enabler merely by virtue of living in Sweden, because of their extensive gay rights laws. Even if they don't specifically agree with the law, by not emigrating, they automatically become a fag enabler. Etc.
 

---

Posted by Matt Black (# 2210) on :
 
So all Brits are fag-enablers because we have civil partnerships?

Hang on a minute - Phreaky Phred Phelps is a US citizen, right? And the US hasn't banned same-sex relationships, right? So, isn't Phreddy a fag-enabler also, and thus hell-bound spawn of the Devil?

Hey, my day just started to look better...
 

---

Posted by rufiki (# 11165) on :
 
I think you're only a fag-enabler if you don't protest. So perhaps amend that to "all Brits except for Mr Christian Voice".

Sorry Matt.
 

---

Posted by rosamundi (# 2495) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by Matt Black:
So all Brits are fag-enablers because we have civil partnerships?

---

quote:

---

Hang on a minute - Phreaky Phred Phelps is a US citizen, right? And the US hasn't banned same-sex relationships, right? So, isn't Phreddy a fag-enabler also, and thus hell-bound spawn of the Devil?

---

Alas no, because his God hates fags, and so does he, and thus he is doing the Lord's work. I'm sure I read somewhere on his mad site that only members of WBC are saved.
 

---

Posted by Matt Black (# 2210) on :
 
The Warsash Bowling Club? Great - I'm joining!
 

---

Posted by bc_anglican (# 12349) on :
 
http://youtube.com/watch?v=SVGQONqhGcY

I have a dumb question. If America is as evil as the Phelps gang says, then why would they use the American court system to get off from not paying damages? If the whole system is as rotten as they say it is, then why do they immerse themselves in it?
 

---

Posted by Beautiful_Dreamer (# 10880) on :
 
Parody of Phelps sites

You know, they do have a point. Why only focus on one Levitical law and ignore others?

This made me laugh out loud.

[ 26. January 2008, 04:20: Message edited by: Beautiful_Dreamer ]
 

---

Posted by Golden Key (# 1468) on :
 
They were going to picket the funeral of Mr. Rogers, beloved and compassionate kids' show host and advocate, some years back...but IIRC they didn't show up.
 

---

Posted by rufiki (# 11165) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by bc_anglican:
http://youtube.com/watch?v=SVGQONqhGcY

---

"Today, nine of [Fred's] thirteen children carry on his work." I wonder what the other four are doing.

The interview with his two grandsons (8 and 10) is particularly worrying, but the fact that they don't seem to understand the message may be cause for some hope.
 

---

Posted by flighty (# 11364) on :
 
This video so definitely needs to get circulated more!!!
 

---

Posted by SpikeyPants (# 12953) on :
 
So, Fred Phelps is the head of a "picketing church", hunh? Well, I got pickets for him and his ass clown family members! I watched "Buffy The Vampire Slayer", I know how to deal with the undead!

If Freddie and Co. aren't the Undead, I don't know who is!

"You want some fries with that STAKE, eh, Freddie?!"

And that's my Christian response. Sorry, Jesus.

 

---

Posted by comet (# 10353) on :
 
I enjoyed this very much.

ah.... simple pleasures...
 

---

Posted by Kelly Alves (# 2522) on :
 
I remember seeing that before. Only time I haven't despised a Phelps family member.
 

---

Posted by Pigwidgeon (# 10192) on :
 
Which one didn't you despise?

 

---

Posted by Kelly Alves (# 2522) on :
 
The fact that the guy holding the sign (I assume he's a family member-- isn't that the whole church?) was giggling like a grade schooler instead of getting murderously angry made me not hate him so much. Maybe there's hope for that guy.
 

---

Posted by Lietuvos Sv. Kazimieras (# 11274) on :
 
Yeah, it seemed rather like play acting, didn't it? Fred Phelps himself is a super-sicko, but I wonder if some of his hangers-on are just weak egos desperately in need of something to belong to. I would have expected the "admiree" to get really angry and bent out of shape, but he seemed to be disarmed, and even the vociferous women in the group came across in a decidely superficial way that didn't seem to ring true.
 

---

Posted by Beautiful_Dreamer (# 10880) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by Golden Key:
They were going to picket the funeral of Mr. Rogers, beloved and compassionate kids' show host and advocate, some years back...but IIRC they didn't show up.

---

Stupid question, but...why? What did he ever do to deserve that sort of attention?
 

---

Posted by Lietuvos Sv. Kazimieras (# 11274) on :
 
He wasn't a good enough example of chest-thumpin' masculine protest and reaction formative homophobia, perhaps?
 

---

Posted by Golden Key (# 1468) on :
 
Re Mr. Rogers:

IIRC, it seemed to be because he was compassionate, accepting, and didn't speak out against LGBT folks.

Of course, you don't have to do anything for Fred & Co. to picket you. They've picketed funerals of soldiers, evidently on the grounds that God is against LGBT folks, the US enables LGBT folks, and the soldiers work for the US gov't.

It's the same kind of "thinking" that had *other* ministers blaming LGBTs, feminists, etc. for 9/11. We're a good, Christian nation, established and protected by God; 9/11 could only happen if God removed that protection; God would only do that if we were really really bad; most people aren't THAT bad; therefore it has to be certain groups of people.

It's at about this point that I start humming John Lennon's "Imagine".


 

---

Posted by PeaceFeet (# 11001) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by Golden Key:
Of course, you don't have to do anything for Fred & Co. to picket you.

---

It’s almost a stamp of your good character if they hate you…
 

---

Posted by The Silent Acolyte (# 1158) on :
 
I know this isn't specifically a Phelps-watch item, but the Phelps Crowd doesn't grow as an isolated perennial; there is an entire Garden of Haters providing a comfortable sun-kissed hillside for their crazy shit.

Herewith is another flower set adjacent to the Phelps perennial.
 

---

Posted by Frustrated Farmer (# 10782) on :
 
I just had a report that Fred and Co. picketed a memorial service held for four high school students who were killed in an automobile accident. The residents of this community were in a state of shock over this terrible loss, and then found out that the gang was coming to the area.
 

---

Posted by infinite_monkey (# 11333) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by The Silent Acolyte:
I know this isn't specifically a Phelps-watch item, but the Phelps Crowd doesn't grow as an isolated perennial; there is an entire Garden of Haters providing a comfortable sun-kissed hillside for their crazy shit.

Herewith is another flower set adjacent to the Phelps perennial.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Frustrated Farmer:
I just had a report that Fred and Co. picketed a memorial service held for four high school students who were killed in an automobile accident. The residents of this community were in a state of shock over this terrible loss, and then found out that the gang was coming to the area.

---

Are they close to picketing the papal vist, too?
 

---

Posted by Frustrated Farmer (# 10782) on :
 
I just checked Phred's website, and not only are they picketing the Pope in Washington and New York, they are picketing the funeral of four Nazarenes that were killed in an automobile accident in California.

My only hope is that if there is a grand accounting some day for what we have done on earth, the clan will not be able to explain away all their calumny.
 

---

Posted by Golden Key (# 1468) on :
 
It would be nice if the pope would stroll over to them and have a little chat...even if he just quietly said "you're going the wrong way" or "you don't know what kind of Spirit you are of".

It would need to be clear, though, that he wasn't agreeing with them--otherwise, they'd say he was, and use it as propaganda. (If they could bring themselves to accept the "support" of a Catholic.)
 

---

Posted by Campbellite (# 1202) on :
 
Don't hold your breath, Golden Key.
 

---

Posted by Golden Key (# 1468) on :
 
I won't hold my breath. But I thought I'd run the idea up the ship's mast. You never know who might be reading...

and it would be a good spiritual act...

and good PR.

(Whatever might prompt one to do such a thing!)
 

---

Posted by Kelly Alves (# 2522) on :
 
I hate to admit this, GK, but when I thought of "cool things the Pope could do with Phelps" , the unbidden image of his eyes glowing red as they blasted the Phelps clan into a flat patch of cinder flashed before my eyes. But I might have just subliminally picked up on the "X Files" in your sig.

I'm not being snarky, that really did happen. Which means I am a fucked- up person, but there ya go.
 

---

Posted by Kelly Alves (# 2522) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by Frustrated Farmer:


My only hope is that if there is a grand accounting some day for what we have done on earth, the clan will not be able to explain away all their calumny.

---

When Phelps and Co. pass into the Afterlife, they will walk into what looks like a huge summer picnic. A huge banner reading "Welcome Home, Phred!" will wave over the picnic table. Seated grinning at the table will be everybody Phelps ever picketed-- and Jesus.

"Corn on the cob, son?"
 

---

Posted by Golden Key (# 1468) on :
 
Kelly--



And/or God will appear as a beautiful drag queen.


There's a story I've heard that goes something like this:

A man had a dream. He was at a dinner table with a beautifully-prepared meal and many other diners. But there was a problem: The forks (the only utensils) were several feet long. No one could feed themselves, and they were starving. The man realized he was in hell.

Then he found himself at a similar dinner table, with long utensils. But everyone was happy and eating...by feeding each other across the table.

(I picked this up from the book "The Bean Trees", but I've heard it elsewhere. I think it's supposed to be a Latin-American tale.)


Re the pope and zapping: do we still have the Dalek pope on the front page of the ship? That might have influenced you.
 

---

Posted by duchess (# 2764) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by Frustrated Farmer:
I just checked Phred's website, and not only are they picketing the Pope in Washington and New York, they are picketing the funeral of four Nazarenes that were killed in an automobile accident in California.

My only hope is that if there is a grand accounting some day for what we have done on earth, the clan will not be able to explain away all their calumny.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Kelly Alves:
I hate to admit this, GK, but when I thought of "cool things the Pope could do with Phelps" , the unbidden image of his eyes glowing red as they blasted the Phelps clan into a flat patch of cinder flashed before my eyes.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by davelarge:

quote:

---

Originally posted by Kelly Alves:
I hate to admit this, GK, but when I thought of "cool things the Pope could do with Phelps" , the unbidden image of his eyes glowing red as they blasted the Phelps clan into a flat patch of cinder flashed before my eyes.

---

And in a tangential way, this reminds me of a film set in hell (I can't remember it's title) where one of the incidental scenes shows Hitler and his eternal punishment. He has to spend all his time hunched on all-fours while a demon inserts a pineapple in his anus. Perhaps this would be a suitable ending for Phred?

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by davelarge:

quote:

---

Originally posted by Kelly Alves:
I hate to admit this, GK, but when I thought of "cool things the Pope could do with Phelps" , the unbidden image of his eyes glowing red as they blasted the Phelps clan into a flat patch of cinder flashed before my eyes.

---

And in a tangential way, this reminds me of a film set in hell (I can't remember it's title) where one of the incidental scenes shows Hitler and his eternal punishment. He has to spend all his time hunched on all-fours while a demon inserts a pineapple in his anus. Perhaps this would be a suitable ending for Phred?

---

I thought hell for Hitler would be a group of Hasidic rabbis dancing on his face singing Havah Nagila for all of eternity with the above demon doing the pineapple thang, leaf side down.
 

---

Posted by Frustrated Farmer (# 10782) on :
 
Apparently someone decided to set a fire early this morning to a garage that the family owns.


details at: cjonline.com
 

---

Posted by Golden Key (# 1468) on :
 
Oh boy.
 

---

Posted by mousethief (# 953) on :
 
Arson seems to be a popular pastime in and around Lawrence.
 

---

Posted by Wesley J (# 6075) on :
 
Direct link here. Picture gallery as well.

Interesting to see some of the Phelpses in nighties. Almost human.

[ETA: Interesting comments to the story on that site too.]

[ 03. August 2008, 01:11: Message edited by: Wesley J ]
 

---

Posted by Pigwidgeon (# 10192) on :
 
I can't believe they were picketing their own garage fire!

 

---

Posted by Wesley J (# 6075) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by Pigwidgeon:
I can't believe they were picketing their own garage fire!

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Wesley J:
Some comments are saying the fire was possibly started by a discarded cigarette. Thus, 'God hates fags'.

---

 

---

Posted by Annieoldiron (# 11967) on :
 
Hard to imagine this tribe could stoop any lower! They are planning to picket the funeral of a young man tragically beheaded on a bus in Manitoba
God may hate Canada, but what has the victim of a senseless tragedy got to do with them? I hope they rot long before they get to hell And I'm being polite, I'd like to see Canada offer them some free northwoods land, strip them, paint them with honey, tie them to a tree in bear country, The bears are looking for food to fatten up for hibernation right now!!
 

---

Posted by Pigwidgeon (# 10192) on :
 
I wouldn't do that to the bears.
 

---

Posted by Annieoldiron (# 11967) on :
 
I would, after the pineapple treatment!! Bears are scavengers, like to feed on garbage, would prob find the Phelps gourmet!!
 

---

Posted by PeteC (# 10422) on :
 
If Canada Customs is on the ball they may be turned away at the border. They probably don't know you need passports if you fly into Canada.
 

---

Posted by Wesley J (# 6075) on :
 
I thought the Phelpses were garbage?
 

---

Posted by Sober Preacher's Kid (# 12699) on :
 
Could we please get Phelps to picket in Manitoba? Please, pretty please? I SOOOO want to acquaint him and his followers with Sections 176 and 319 of the Criminal Code. That is Obstructing Clergy or Disrupting a Religious Meeting, and Public Incitement of Hatred, respectively. Punishable upon summary conviction (up to two years less a day in jail).

He'll lose any protection of bullshit First Amendment arguments too the second he crosses the border. The Charter of Right and Freedoms has an explicit clause saying that all rights are subject to such limitations as are reasonable in a free and democratic society.

Hi Ho, Hi Ho, it's off to Jail we go...


 

---

Posted by Annieoldiron (# 11967) on :
 
I wonder if Canada Customs are aware of thie impending arrival? A few e-mails might help them to remember the law!! Like the idea on the use of the criminal code to put the scum where they belong. Won't be helping to raise bail for them!
 

---

Posted by mousethief (# 953) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by Wesley J:
I thought the Phelpses were garbage?

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Wesley J:
This is Hell, mate. Go play in Heaven.

---

quote:

---

I SOOOO want to acquaint him and his followers with Sections 176 and 319 of the Criminal Code. That is Obstructing Clergy or Disrupting a Religious Meeting, and Public Incitement of Hatred, respectively. Punishable upon summary conviction (up to two years less a day in jail).

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Sober Preacher's Kid:
Could we please get Phelps to picket in Manitoba? Please, pretty please? I SOOOO want to acquaint him and his followers with Sections 176 and 319 of the Criminal Code. That is Obstructing Clergy or Disrupting a Religious Meeting, and Public Incitement of Hatred, respectively. Punishable upon summary conviction (up to two years less a day in jail).

He'll lose any protection of bullshit First Amendment arguments too the second he crosses the border. The Charter of Right and Freedoms has an explicit clause saying that all rights are subject to such limitations as are reasonable in a free and democratic society.

Hi Ho, Hi Ho, it's off to Jail we go...

---

Sadly, while whacko, they are cannier than that. Apparently, they are picketing a play this evening in Toronto (part of SummerWorks drama festival) entitled something like Pastor Phelps: A Fundamentalist Cabaret, but have said that they won't have "God Hates Fags" placards because they know that would leave them open to criminal prosecution here. Bugger. Or, rather, I'd like to see them buggered in Kingston Pen.

They inspire even less Christian thoughts in me than that. They really, really do. For that reason, they are obviously servants of the Dark One.
 

---

Posted by Sober Preacher's Kid (# 12699) on :
 


He's picketing a cabaret held in his honour? C'mon, give him a free ticket. Since money is being made from his reputation, it's only fair to give him a seat. Preferably up front so he doesn't miss the message, and the rest of the audience can stare at him. If he remains silent for that long, which he won't.
 

---

Posted by Prosfonesis (# 1158) on :
 

quote:

---

Thoughtlessly posted by The Blessed Pangolin:
Or, rather, I'd like to see them buggered in Kingston Pen.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by PeteC:
If Canada Customs is on the ball they may be turned away at the border. They probably don't know you need passports if you fly into Canada.

---

IIRC, now you need one to re-enter the US. So even if Canada Customs slips up, US Customs might not let them back in!

 

---

Posted by Sober Preacher's Kid (# 12699) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by Prosfonesis:

quote:

---

Thoughtlessly posted by The Blessed Pangolin:
Or, rather, I'd like to see them buggered in Kingston Pen.

---

I share your dislike of Phred Phelps and his spawn, but must you use the horror of prison rape to make your point?

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by mousethief:

quote:

---

Originally posted by Wesley J:
I thought the Phelpses were garbage?

---

No human being is garbage. Although I'll warrant the Phelpses tempt one to say so.

---

quote:

---

Are you smoking something? Section 176 is anything BUT archaic. It is written to apply to any religious body, Muslim, Sikh, Hindu, or Rastafarian. It is one of the primary guarantees of religious freedom in Canada.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Stetson:
Sober Preachers Kid wrote:

quote:

---

Are you smoking something? Section 176 is anything BUT archaic. It is written to apply to any religious body, Muslim, Sikh, Hindu, or Rastafarian. It is one of the primary guarantees of religious freedom in Canada.

---

We have laws against trespassing in Canada. If I go into a church, mosque or rastafarian whatever and start shouting slogans against the faith, I can be charged with trespassing as soon as I refuse any request to leave.

Therefore, I do not see why we need a special law about religious(or benevolent) meetings, UNLESS its intended to prosecute people who have not actually gone onto church property, or maybe to pile on extra charges over and above trespassing. Either way, it sounds pretty dubious to me.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Timothy the Obscure:

quote:

---

Originally posted by mousethief:

quote:

---

Originally posted by Wesley J:
I thought the Phelpses were garbage?

---

No human being is garbage. Although I'll warrant the Phelpses tempt one to say so.

---

They do tempt one to a certain nostalgia for the burning of heretics... Get thee behind me...

---

May I humbly point to my latest suggestion on the matter? Thank you.
 

---

Posted by Stetson (# 9597) on :
 

quote:

---

Wonder if they would consider picketing a Mob funeral, or one for the Hells Angels?

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Prosfonesis:

quote:

---

Thoughtlessly posted by The Blessed Pangolin:
Or, rather, I'd like to see them buggered in Kingston Pen.

---

I share your dislike of Phred Phelps and his spawn, but must you use the horror of prison rape to make your point?

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Stetson:
We have was against trespassing in Canada. If I go into a church, mosque or rastafarian whatever and start shouting slogans against the faith, I can be charged with trespassing as soon as I refuse any request to leave.

---

quote:

---

quote:
Originally posted by Stetson:
We have was against trespassing in Canada. If I go into a church, mosque or rastafarian whatever and start shouting slogans against the faith, I can be charged with trespassing as soon as I refuse any request to leave.

The downside of course is that they would actually have to make a request to leave, there would already have been a disruption etc.

---

quote:

---

So, they are just words to you: "buggered in Kingston Pen," and not very potent ones.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Stetson:
I take your point about the trespassing laws being unable to stop the original disruption. I guess for me the question then becomes why religious groups are getting privileges not given to anyone else.
...
But if I walk into a Pentecoastal service and do the same thing, suddenly there is a whole new set of laws that can be tossed at me, over and above trespassing? Simply because the Pentecostals claim to do what they do in the name of God, as opposed to the Tories who do it in the name of politics? I dunno, seems like a fairly arbitrary distinction to be making.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Sober Preacher's Kid:
Section 176

It applies not only to religious meetings, but to any social or benevolent meeting. It doesn't have to be public, there merely has to be an assembly. A funeral certainly meets the criteria. Doesn't have to be in a church.

---

Does that help? Or are you saying the Tories are neither social nor benevolent? OliviaG
 

---

Posted by Gort (# 6855) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by Annieoldiron:
They're back in! Made it through another Border point, without any prob it seems.

---

quote:

---

Does that help? Or are you saying the Tories are neither social nor benevolent?

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Stetson:
Heh heh. But seriously, I'd be very curious to know how the courts would define "social or benevolent" for the purposes of enforcing this law.

---

quote:

---

If even the Land of the Free can legislate some limits on "free speech", then maybe the rest of us can too.

---

quote:

---

I also note there is disquiet among some because Canada has laws that might reduce the aggravation caused by the Phelpses.

---

quote:

---

I don't see why you feel the need for unfettered picketing at funerals, but, hey, have a good time!

---

quote:

---

All societies, as opposed to individuals, have some sort of limit on what one can do in public. Why is it so grievous to you that there should be a law against disturbing people at a time when they are preoccupied and vulnerable?

---

quote:

---

When one is attending to the divine one ought to be left alone.

---

So if a clergyman is known for giving sermons about how homosexuality is immoral, gay activists should not picket his services, because anyone who is attending to the divine has an inalienable right to be left alone?

[ 10. August 2008, 07:51: Message edited by: Stetson ]
 

---

Posted by Sober Preacher's Kid (# 12699) on :
 
Yes. The protesters can make alternate arrangements.
 

---

Posted by davelarge (# 186) on :
 
I live in Winnipeg, but unfortunately was out of town this weekend. I would have been at the funeral as part of the human wall, if I had been at home.

The Phelps' truly disgust me. They deserve to be soundly ridiculed for their hateful, bile-filled rhetoric.

Gah.
 

---

Posted by marsupial. (# 12458) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by Stetson:

quote:

---

When one is attending to the divine one ought to be left alone.

---

So if a clergyman is known for giving sermons about how homosexuality is immoral, gay activists should not picket his services, because anyone who is attending to the divine has an inalienable right to be left alone?

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Sober Preacher's Kid:
Yes. The protesters can make alternate arrangements.

---

But I have, numerous times, heard clergymen speak out against this or that alleged sociopolitical evil. If a Catholic priest doesn't like having communists(for example) picketting outside his church, maybe he should lay off the sermons explicating on the Blessed Virgin's denunciation of Communism at Fatima? Isn't he kind of setting himself up as a legitimate target for protestors by engaging in such speech in the first place?
 

---

Posted by fatpanda (# 2709) on :
 
Wrong thread .....

I've really been enjoying the Swimming at the Olympics ......
 

---

Posted by Horseman Bree (# 5290) on :
 
That's the issue that Stetson doesn't want to answer.

It may be arguable that priests/ministers/imams/leaders should have to accept some form of heckling or disagreement if they use their pulpits(?whatever) to issue racist or other hateful thoughts, although I would tend to think that "religious" services should not be interrupted. A strong public statement of disagreement should be allowed as "free speech", if necessary.

But why should a funeral for a truly innocent victim be allowed to become a political-agenda parade? Why is hate speech in need of protection in this case?

Not to mention: why is hate speech necessary at all? It is possible to express disagreement without being hateful, and it is necessary to express disagreement without being hateful if you are actually a Christian or Muslim or Buddhist or Jew or just about any other flavour.

The reason we have laws limiting speech is exactly that: there is no need to express hatred at any time. Even an atheist will tell you that.

So why should we protect hate speech at all? (I guess I'll start a Purg thread)

[ 10. August 2008, 23:38: Message edited by: Horseman Bree ]
 

---

Posted by Stetson (# 9597) on :
 

quote:

---

But why should a funeral for a truly innocent victim be allowed to become a political-agenda parade? Why is hate speech in need of protection in this case?

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Horseman Bree:
So why should we protect hate speech at all? (I guess I'll start a Purg thread)

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Holy Moley:
Bah, I thought this thread was a discussion about that swimmer chap who won all the medals.

---

This being a Hell thread didn't tip you off that this wasn't about the swimmer?!
 

---

Posted by jlg (# 98) on :
 


Psddy, do please go away. You're giving Hell a bad name.
 

---

Posted by Gort (# 6855) on :
 
Bunnies lambasting each other. Next, we'll have rubber chickens at 20 paces. May a thousand blood-thirsty parasites feast upon your furry privates.
 

---

Posted by Paddy O'Furniture (# 12953) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by jlg:


Psddy, do please go away. You're giving Hell a bad name.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Gort:
Try finding some personal attribute [short, old, anglican...bald ] that may be sensitive and withwhich you can compose a blistering rebuttal.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Gort:
Meanwhile, go polish your Hummels.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Paddy O'Furniture:
I wasn't talking to you so why the hell don't you shut your pie-hole?

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Twilight: I'd steer clear of jlg though, the old battle ax beats groundhogs with shovels.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by jlg: Actually, it was a baby groundhog.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Comet: and she made its mommy watch.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by comet:
...and no, I have nothing like that in my home. but then, I lack the "cute and cuddly" gene myself.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Gort:
Well, it's like this, Spikey: you post here, you paint a great ringed, dayglow sphincter upon your forehead that all can take pot-shots at. The last thing you want to do is whine about others target practice. If out of your league, best to deflect sarky comments with self-effacing rhetorical posts implying your antagonist has missed the mark. Otherwise you simply confirm their criticism. If you haven't the wit or wherewithal to compose a suitably witty response, simply ignore them. [Zwingli is a good example of this tactic]

I know it's difficult for a nice person like you to accept - but there are mean people like jlg just waiting to take advantage of your basic good nature in order to make themselves look clever or tough. Try finding some personal attribute [short, old, anglican...bald ] that may be sensitive and withwhich you can compose a blistering rebuttal.

Meanwhile, go polish your Hummels.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Organ Builder:

quote:

---

Originally posted by Paddy O'Furniture:
I wasn't talking to you so why the hell don't you shut your pie-hole?

---

I wouldn't mess with jlg. It hasn't been that long since I learned the following:

quote:

---

Originally posted by Twilight: I'd steer clear of jlg though, the old battle ax beats groundhogs with shovels.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by jlg: Actually, it was a baby groundhog.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Comet: and she made its mommy watch.

---

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by jlg:
Organ Builder has obviously never messed with a groundhog, baby or adult.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Paddy O'Furniture:
Actually, I think I'll polish my gun collection.

---

Paddy - this is exactly the kind of thing RooK was talking about in the other thread. this lacks any sort of class or subtlety or "betterthanyew" ethos, and therefore is just laughable as far as Hell rebuttals go.

Seriously, this sounds like a half-hearted attempt at "tough" cred. like those boys who talk about sex all the time - the more they talk about sex, the less they've ever experienced.

Am I right?

those of us who have ballistics and a variety of sharp objects in the home seldom feel the need to discuss them. So, by saying you're polishing your gun collection, you're in essence telling the denizens that you're about as rough and tough as a preschool teacher's aide.

who wears pink.

ribbons.

with teddy bears on them.



basic rules of Hell -

1) aloofness beats snarkiness 9 times out of ten. the best response to an asshole in Hell is no response at all. ("oh, were you talking to me? HAahaha! I thought you were just gibbering to yourself and your little friends...")

2) the tenth time, it is best to appear to be talking over the head of the other person, so as to maintain the aloofness schtick.

3) keep all anger to yourself and your computer desk. dont post until you can sound like you really couldn't care less what the other denizens think.

4) if you really want to sound intimidating, use lots of syllables. make some up, even. and write long text-dense posts about how the other person is wrong because, according to the 12th century philosopher Logorrheus, the synergy of the creation myth with the story of the 3-legged giraffe of Luxembourg means that anyone arguing the outdated theology of Cartouche's Brioche is obviously compensating for the innate miniscule size of their rhinocephalon and couldn't truly tell their adventita from a hole in the ground.

then, even if you dont know what you're talking about none of us will argue because we will have fallen into a coma by your third sentence.

Seriously, there is an art to this place. get your undies out of a knot and you might learn something... and have some fun, eventually. because despite what RooK said on the other thread, I was teasing you, in a har-har-aren't-we-buds kind of way. your response shows a complete lack of Hellish Cool. You can overcome this, I promise.

let your Inner Bitch have a voice, darling.
 

---

Posted by Sober Preacher's Kid (# 12699) on :
 
Gun collections are like Japanese body tattoos. They are assembled over a lifetime, and are a physical expression of a person's inner self. As it is so personal, it isn't casually shown in public.

Both a body tattoo and a gun collection are meant to be exposed once in a deep expression inner beauty to someone who truly appreciates it.
 

---

Posted by Firenze (# 619) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by Sober Preacher's Kid:
Both a body tattoo and a gun collection are meant to be exposed once in a deep expression inner beauty to someone who truly appreciates it.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by comet:
RooK and Teuf are going to gnaw on my various cuter bits for continuing this trainwreck, but my inner bitch-mentor just won't let this pass. sorry fellas.

quote:

---

Originally posted by Paddy O'Furniture:
Actually, I think I'll polish my gun collection.

---

Paddy - this is exactly the kind of thing RooK was talking about in the other thread. this lacks any sort of class or subtlety or "betterthanyew" ethos, and therefore is just laughable as far as Hell rebuttals go.

Seriously, this sounds like a half-hearted attempt at "tough" cred. like those boys who talk about sex all the time - the more they talk about sex, the less they've ever experienced.

Am I right?

those of us who have ballistics and a variety of sharp objects in the home seldom feel the need to discuss them. So, by saying you're polishing your gun collection, you're in essence telling the denizens that you're about as rough and tough as a preschool teacher's aide.

who wears pink.

ribbons.

with teddy bears on them.



basic rules of Hell -

1) aloofness beats snarkiness 9 times out of ten. the best response to an asshole in Hell is no response at all. ("oh, were you talking to me? HAahaha! I thought you were just gibbering to yourself and your little friends...")

2) the tenth time, it is best to appear to be talking over the head of the other person, so as to maintain the aloofness schtick.

3) keep all anger to yourself and your computer desk. dont post until you can sound like you really couldn't care less what the other denizens think.

4) if you really want to sound intimidating, use lots of syllables. make some up, even. and write long text-dense posts about how the other person is wrong because, according to the 12th century philosopher Logorrheus, the synergy of the creation myth with the story of the 3-legged giraffe of Luxembourg means that anyone arguing the outdated theology of Cartouche's Brioche is obviously compensating for the innate miniscule size of their rhinocephalon and couldn't truly tell their adventita from a hole in the ground.

then, even if you dont know what you're talking about none of us will argue because we will have fallen into a coma by your third sentence.

Seriously, there is an art to this place. get your undies out of a knot and you might learn something... and have some fun, eventually. because despite what RooK said on the other thread, I was teasing you, in a har-har-aren't-we-buds kind of way. your response shows a complete lack of Hellish Cool. You can overcome this, I promise.

let your Inner Bitch have a voice, darling.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Firenze:

quote:

---

Originally posted by Sober Preacher's Kid:
Both a body tattoo and a gun collection are meant to be exposed once in a deep expression inner beauty to someone who truly appreciates it.

---

By gum, mating habits in the Far North are even weirder than previously thought.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by comet:
4) if you really want to sound intimidating, use lots of syllables. make some up, even. and write long text-dense posts about how the other person is wrong because, according to the 12th century philosopher Logorrheus, the synergy of the creation myth with the story of the 3-legged giraffe of Luxembourg means that anyone arguing the outdated theology of Cartouche's Brioche is obviously compensating for the innate miniscule size of their rhinocephalon and couldn't truly tell their adventita from a hole in the ground.

then, even if you dont know what you're talking about none of us will argue because we will have fallen into a coma by your third sentence.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Sober Preacher's Kid:

quote:

---

Originally posted by Firenze:

quote:

---

Originally posted by Sober Preacher's Kid:
Both a body tattoo and a gun collection are meant to be exposed once in a deep expression inner beauty to someone who truly appreciates it.

---

By gum, mating habits in the Far North are even weirder than previously thought.

---

Actually I live a considerable ways south of you. Peterborough is at 44 degrees North Latitude, and Edinburgh is at 54 degrees North Latitude.

---

By gum, mating habits in the Deep South are even weirder than previously thought.
 

---

Posted by Sober Preacher's Kid (# 12699) on :
 
No, no, my dear. The Deep South refers to the US States of South Carolina, Georgia, Alabama, Mississippi, and Louisiana. I live in the Great Lakes Region, in particular Southern Ontario or Upper Canada.

The Scottish school system seems to be slipping.
 

---

Posted by Firenze (# 619) on :
 
As far as I am concerned, you are all effete southerners (along with people from Yorkshire).

OK, there are people to the south of you, but that is irrelevant.

And my education owes nothing to Scottish schools: my original and independent habit of thought (in contradistinction to yours, which seems pitiably in thrall to convention) was forged in other fires.
 

---

Posted by comet (# 10353) on :
 
Latitude 62.

and alas, our mating rituals often do include tattoos and guns.

unlike you effete southerners down there at 54.


 

---

Posted by Campbellite (# 1202) on :
 
But we have sunlight in the winter, so there.
 

---

Posted by Firenze (# 619) on :
 
Personally, I would like to see sunlight in summer.

(It's not all waving palms and the cicadas calling at noon down here you know).

[ 18. August 2008, 08:18: Message edited by: Firenze ]
 

---

Posted by The Blessed Pangolin (# 13623) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by comet:

and alas, our mating rituals often do include tattoos and guns.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by comet:
Latitude 62.

and alas, our mating rituals often do include tattoos and guns.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by HenryT:
I thought it was blue tarps and duct tape?

---

I thought that was Homeland Security.
 

---

Posted by Sober Preacher's Kid (# 12699) on :
 
You can't beat the romance of a dead furry critter. A relative of mine went on a hunting-moon.

Nothing reaffirms your manliness like killing and butchering a deer. Though nothing beats the taste of bear.

Mmmm, bear.
 

---

Posted by Firenze (# 619) on :
 
There are probably bears out there who think: Mmmm, nothing beats the taste of fresh honeymooners.

(Note for anyone scouring this thread for Tips to Successful Seduction: stiffening pile of fur, draggled in blood, once-liquid eyes glazed, tongue lolling from foam-flecked jaws - no. Venison medallion in cream sauce beside a glass of Côte Rôtie - possibly).
 

---

Posted by Paddy O'Furniture (# 12953) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by Golden Key:

quote:

---

Originally posted by luvanddaisies:
Maybe if a bunch of people were recruited to hit on Phelps and his wife whenever they're out picketing, they might be put off it a bit.

---

It would be funny, but I wouldn't recommend it.

IIRC, Matthew Shephard's murder was triggered by hitting on (?) a straight man in a bar. I'm NOT in any way, shape, or form blaming Matthew. Just saying that the proposed action could be very dangerous.

And I suspect that Fred is mentally ill, deeply closeted, possibly an abuse survivor, or some combination of the three. If someone pushed his buttons by hitting on him...

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Sober Preacher's Kid:
Though nothing beats the taste of bear.

Mmmm, bear.

---

Dead, or alive?
 

---

Posted by Sober Preacher's Kid (# 12699) on :
 
Dead. Game must be throughly cooked in order to prevent Trichinosis.
 

---

Posted by Frustrated Farmer (# 10782) on :
 
According to the local paper, while the fire department has not made an official determination of the cause of the fire at Phred's compound, one of his children is sure that it was set intentionally.

Once again I had the joy of seeing the clan out picketing on my way into church today.
 

---

Posted by Sioni Sais (# 5713) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by Frustrated Farmer:
According to the local paper, while the fire department has not made an official determination of the cause of the fire at Phred's compound, one of his children is sure that it was set intentionally.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Frustrated Farmer:
According to the local paper, while the fire department has not made an official determination of the cause of the fire at Phred's compound, one of his children is sure that it was set intentionally.

Once again I had the joy of seeing the clan out picketing on my way into church today.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Sober Preacher's Kid:
Dear Lord! Having to share a town with the Phelps Klan? You and neighbours must be models of patience to have to live with that circus.

---

Please note the minor change in spelling which is bolded.
 

---

Posted by Sober Preacher's Kid (# 12699) on :
 
Yes, I thought about that jibe but didn't go for it. That'll teach me to pull my punches.
 

---

Posted by Frustrated Farmer (# 10782) on :
 
Thanks Comet

The fire department did rule this week that Phred's fire was arson.

At one time the clan had the telephone number for many of the fax machines in town. They would send out information on their picketing schedule for the week and also who they considered bound for hell for being a f** enabler. Mrs. Farmer would bring some of them home from work to share with me.
 

---

Posted by Frustrated Farmer (# 10782) on :
 
An article today in the local paper about the clans court case in Nebraska, I believe the subject is flag desecration.

I am not skilled in posting links, however going to www.cjonline.com and looking for the story about Phelps-Roper on the left hand side should get you there.
 

---

Posted by Low Treason (# 11924) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by Frustrated Farmer:
An article today in the local paper about the clans court case in Nebraska, I believe the subject is flag desecration.

I am not skilled in posting links, however going to www.cjonline.com and looking for the story about Phelps-Roper on the left hand side should get you there.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Frustrated Farmer:
... court case in Nebraska, I believe the subject is flag desecration.
...

---

Desecrating the flag is a crime over there? It's a good job it isn't in the UK, especially given that said desecration seems to involve having a kid stand on it and a woman wear it as 'a skirt that dragged on the ground'.
What a difference The Pond makes.

Still, the more inconvenience that can be caused to them, the less of their time they can spend ranting at bereaved and vulnerable families.
 

---

Posted by comet (# 10353) on :
 
must be a state thing, because it's not a crime here.
 

---

Posted by Frustrated Farmer (# 10782) on :
 
The clan was busy picketing on the corner across from the church this evening when I went in for services.

There is a report out that a record label is after the clan for unauthorized use of one of their songs.
 

---

Posted by Jahlove (# 10290) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by Frustrated Farmer:
The clan was busy picketing on the corner across from the church this evening when I went in for services.

There is a report out that a record label is after the clan for unauthorized use of one of their songs.

---

I'd be interested to know what the song was - All You Need Is Love perhaps?
 

---

Posted by luvanddaisies (# 5761) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by Jahlove:

quote:

---

Originally posted by Frustrated Farmer:
The clan was busy picketing on the corner across from the church this evening when I went in for services.

There is a report out that a record label is after the clan for unauthorized use of one of their songs.

---

I'd be interested to know what the song was - All You Need Is Love perhaps?

---

There clearly used to be a link to it in this post, but the video's been removed because of the copyright claim, and I can't remember what the song was. I think I clicked on the link and watched it and was left with a feeling, but can't picture the actual song.

Ahhh - got it, someone had mentioned it here. According to the article, it was a parody of "We Are the World". If my newly-jogged memory serves, I think their version was something along the lines of "God Hates the World". The video ended with a tiny little girl, aged maybe about two, singing it - it was really quite
 

---

Posted by OliviaG (# 9881) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by Frustrated Farmer:
...
There is a report out that a record label is after the clan for unauthorized use of one of their songs.

---

quote:

---

must be a state thing, because it's not a crime here.

---

quote:

---

Nate agrees with prominent atheist and scientist Richard Dawkins, who has said that religion can be "real child abuse."

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by auntbeast:
Apparently Phelps is trying to head out here to Vancouver to protest a production of the Laramie Project. Can you say free publicity?!?! The venue that it is being performed in is only 60 seats so a good public run at the border and or a good loud protest could give them enough coverage to sell the show out.... you can't pay for coverage like that. Of course I would rather that we just sent him back from whence he came at the border which could still make some news and give some fallout publicity for the show without running the risk of letting him in the country and then not being able to get rid of him... sort of like some evil virus that you can't kill you just have to contain it until it dies of it's own accord.

Cheers,
Auntbeast

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by OliviaG:
PS Sorry, Minister for Public Safety. You can read the MPs' statement here:
http://libbydavies.ca/

---

 

---

Posted by PeteC (# 10422) on :
 
And has Doris responded? Or has he been shifted to yet another post? He'd probably be on Phred's side, anyway.
 

---

Posted by OliviaG (# 9881) on :
 
Pete, Doris was shuffled to International Trade. OliviaG
 

---

Posted by OliviaG (# 9881) on :
 
There's an interview with Libby Davies and Shirley Phelps-Roper on the CBC website:

ETA link: Stop anti-gay group...

Anyway, Ms. Davies explains the situation. Ms. Phelps-Roper just screams. OliviaG

[ 20. November 2008, 00:08: Message edited by: OliviaG ]
 

---

Posted by Wiff Waff (# 10424) on :
 
I agree with one of the comments on the first link - allow them in to Canada, allow them to start demonstrating then arrest them and throw the lot in jail for a year or ten. They won't be missed and I'm sure they'd make lots of lovely new friends.
 

---

Posted by Anglican_Brat (# 12349) on :
 
I don't know about arresting the Phelps' clan. The Phelps' family live on a persecution complex. Arrest them, and they will start screaming "You are persecuting us!".

Better to ignore them, and focus on other things in the world. You do not pay attention to idiots, you let them wallow in their own stupidity, and sooner or later, they will get their own comeuppance.
 

---

Posted by PeteC (# 10422) on :
 
Idiot who break the law, however mouthy, are entitled to the same consideration as silent idiots.
 

---

Posted by Timothy the Obscure (# 292) on :
 
They were in Portland on Monday. There was a little glitch in their plans, since the Swedish consulate closed in June. There was a fairly non-confrontational counterdemonstration, which included one person with a sign saying "I'm reasonably certain God does not hate fags." One of Fred's granddaughters was quoted as saying "we're not trying to save anybody," which kind of sums the whole thing up, dontcha think?

[preview psot!]

[ 27. November 2008, 05:18: Message edited by: Timothy the Obscure ]
 

---

Posted by OliviaG (# 9881) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by Anglican_Brat:
I don't know about arresting the Phelps' clan. The Phelps' family live on a persecution complex. Arrest them, and they will start screaming "You are persecuting us!". ...

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Timothy the Obscure:
...included one person with a sign saying "I'm reasonably certain God does not hate fags."

---

I guess that person was British, then - or if not, Episcopalian .

Phelps and co bring out the worst anti-libertarian in me to fight with the bleeding-heart liberal I usually am. It's like the BNP issue - everyone has a right to free speech, except the ones who preach hatred and prejudice. If anyone finds out how to square that circle, do let me know.
 

---

Posted by the_raptor (# 10533) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by Rev per Minute:
Phelps and co bring out the worst anti-libertarian in me to fight with the bleeding-heart liberal I usually am. It's like the BNP issue - everyone has a right to free speech, except the ones who preach hatred and prejudice. If anyone finds out how to square that circle, do let me know.

---

I don't think there should be many limits on what one can say, but there should be on where. People shouldn't be allowed to harass and intimidate ordinary people as part of "free speech".

On your soap box in the park? Fine.
Outside someone's funeral? No.

Personally I am amazed the Phelpses are still alive. One day they are going to protest at the funeral of the wrong soldier, and his buddies are going to snap.
 

---

Posted by Frustrated Farmer (# 10782) on :
 
While driving in the city tonight, the clan were out picketing on a busy street not far from the local synagogue. They have added Santa Claus to their list of #$%^.

[ 06. December 2008, 03:46: Message edited by: Frustrated Farmer ]
 

---

Posted by Pigwidgeon (# 10192) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by Frustrated Farmer:
While driving in the city tonight, the clan were out picketing on a busy street not far from the local synagogue. They have added Santa Claus to their list of #$%^.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Pigwidgeon:

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Frustrated Farmer:
There is a story in the local paper tonight that someone vandalized the church that the clan attends.

www.cjonline.com

---

"Police have identified a suspect and warn the public not to approach a heavily built man wearing red, who fled the scene on a sleigh drawn by eight moose."
 

---

Posted by ozowen (# 8935) on :
 
Pat them on the head
Tell them "Everything will be all right" and give them a biscuit.

Make sure this is televised.
When they rant and rave talk to the camera saying "Aren't they cute? I wonder what they will be like when they grow up."
 

---

Posted by Frustrated Farmer (# 10782) on :
 
http://cjonline.com/stories/010909/bre_phelps.shtml


The clan is at it again! Law suit filed over anti-funeral picketing ordinance.
 

---

Posted by Frustrated Farmer (# 10782) on :
 
Just so Phred does not completely fade from our memories:

While driving to church yesterday morning, the clan was busy standing on the sidewalk in front of the Methodist church up the street with their less than clever signs. Driving on to the corner that the Episcopalians share with the Lutherans, I discovered that they were working there also.



 

---

Posted by Sioni Sais (# 5713) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by Frustrated Farmer:
Just so Phred does not completely fade from our memories:

While driving to church yesterday morning, the clan was busy standing on the sidewalk in front of the Methodist church up the street with their less than clever signs. Driving on to the corner that the Episcopalians share with the Lutherans, I discovered that they were working there also.

---

Let me get it right: instead of picketing military funerals the Phelpsians are picketing churches? Why churches? Why aren't they picketing stores, factories and banks?
 

---

Posted by Frustrated Farmer (# 10782) on :
 
Phred and the clan do not believe that most churches interpret scripture correctly, especially on homosexuality. Hence they picket churches that do not share their interpretation of the same. I have seen signs that suggest that all clergy are f@#s or enablers of f&#s.

At one time they sent out a schedule of which churches were going to be picketed during the week. RC and Episcopal churches seem to be favorites, but Methodists, Lutherans and the local synagogue are also on the list.



If you would like the link to his website, send me a private message. I will not give him free publicity on the web.
 

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Posted by leo (# 1458) on :
 
They are coming to Basingstoke UK.
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/newstopics/religion/4640967/Westboro-Baptist-Church-announces-first-anti-homosexuality-picket -in-Britain.html
 

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Posted by Lord Jestocost (# 12909) on :
 
Interested to see that God will destroy the UK (and the rest of the world). Presumably not while the clan are here picketing our low budget art projects, though, so maybe we should ask them to stay?
 

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Posted by the_raptor (# 10533) on :
 

quote:

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Originally posted by Lord Jestocost:
Interested to see that God will destroy the UK (and the rest of the world). Presumably not while the clan are here picketing our low budget art projects, though, so maybe we should ask them to stay?

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quote:

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Originally posted by Pigwidgeon:
Will the U.K. actually let them in?

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We should let them in, then arrest them using our draconian anti-hate speech laws. I knew they'd be useful one day...
 

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Posted by Wesley J (# 6075) on :
 
Send 'em to Gaytanamo Gay!
 

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Posted by Sandemaniac (# 12829) on :
 
They could always picket this church.

One wonders if it is possible to throw rocks at people in Christian love...

AG
 

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Posted by Wesley J (# 6075) on :
 
Thank you, sandemendiac!

Proof that despite mighty erections, the manner of humpin' gays leads to destruction!
 

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Posted by Sandemaniac (# 12829) on :
 


I like that a lot!

AG
 

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Posted by leo (# 1458) on :
 

quote:

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Originally posted by Pigwidgeon:
Will the U.K. actually let them in?

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quote:

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Originally posted by leo:

quote:

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Originally posted by Pigwidgeon:
Will the U.K. actually let them in?

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They are already here. According to one newspaper, they travelled here in separate little groups on different flights over a period of time. [...]

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Have you got a link, leo?
 

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Posted by Wesley J (# 6075) on :
 
Oh dear! Q&As with the Torygraph... - well, not so much "As" as "ass".
 

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Posted by comet (# 10353) on :
 

quote:

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Originally posted by leo:
I don't know hpw they smuggled their little banners and placards in but I expect the airports agreed with their message about fags since the smoking ban came in.

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Heh. fabulous. there's got to be some way of incorporating the anti-smoking message.

can't you just see it? "No Smoking in this Church. God Hates Fags!"

 

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Posted by Sioni Sais (# 5713) on :
 

quote:

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Originally posted by Wesley J:
Oh dear! Q&As with the Torygraph... - well, not so much "As" as "ass".

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Wonderful! Even ALL in capitals, in green ink on pages torn from exercise books it could not read more barking and frothing at the mouth than it does it that.

I might have gone to a counter-picket but the event is at Basingstoke.
 

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Posted by Qoheleth. (# 9265) on :
 

quote:

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Originally posted by Sioni Sais:
I might have gone to a counter-picket but the event is at Basingstoke.

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Anyone fancy an impromptu Shipmeet on the picket lines?


 

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Posted by Hiro's Leap (# 12470) on :
 

quote:

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Originally posted by Sioni Sais:
Wonderful!

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quote:

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And what will you do when you all land in hell FOR EVER where the worm that eats on you NEVER dies and the fire is NEVER quenched and the smoke of your torment ascends up for ever and ever and ever and ever and ever - never ending

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quote:

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Thanks for asking!


Shirley Phelps-Roper

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quote:

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Originally posted by The Great Gumby:
That's just too funny. There's so much brilliant comedy. The Obama=antichrist schtick is rubber-walls loony, but it's been done to death. And I want to know who the "UNREPINENTANT" is, and why the poor guy has to be sent to hell for ever.

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Aw shucks, Gumby got there first. I wanted to be the first to express my delight at being an UNREPINENTANT Brit
 

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Posted by Earwig (# 12057) on :
 
My favourite bit is

quote:

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The God Smacks are HIS WORK!

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quote:

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Originally posted by Wesley J:

quote:

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Originally posted by leo:

quote:

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Originally posted by Pigwidgeon:
Will the U.K. actually let them in?

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They are already here. According to one newspaper, they travelled here in separate little groups on different flights over a period of time. [...]

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Have you got a link, leo?

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