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Source: (consider it)
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Thread: Tried and True Hymns for Special Days
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BalddudePeekskill
Shipmate
# 12152
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Posted
This week I had the dubious pleasure of never having sung,nor played, any of the hymns on Easter Sunday. The organist chose hymns from the 82 Hymnal's Easter section, but not even one of them was familiar! I feel that a major holiday is not a day to veer from the tried and true.....I mean seriously, no "Jesus Christ is Risn' Today"? No "The Strife is O'er?" I truly felt that I had not properly celebrated Easter. I know the music is not the main focus, but poorly chosen selections can totally detract from the worship experience....I realize that picking music for the liturgy is no picnic at times (I did for 7 years straight), but Easter Sunday is pretty much a no-brainer!
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Christos Aneste
Posts: 308 | From: Peekskill, NY | Registered: Dec 2006
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Og, King of Bashan
Ship's giant Amorite
# 9562
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Posted
The former organist at the Episcopal Cathedral here in Denver used to tell a story about the organist who was sick and tired of "Jesus Christ is Risen Today" on Easter, and attempted to not program it. When the collection plate came in, a note had been placed on the top of the money. "We aren't leaving- and neither are you- until we sing 'Jesus Christ is Risen Today!'" The organist didn't call the congregation's bluff.
I am always one to argue that you have to program lots of different hymns throughout the year, or you are going to get stuck doing the same ten or so over and over again. But with the clergy and organist knowing that the church is going to be overflowing with visitors, it seems like there is nothing wrong with programing the old chestnuts.
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"I like to eat crawfish and drink beer. That's despair?" ― Walker Percy
Posts: 3259 | From: Denver, Colorado, USA | Registered: May 2005
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Chorister
Completely Frocked
# 473
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Posted
We didn't have the old favourites this year, either. Is there a conspiracy? ![[Paranoid]](graemlins/paranoid.gif)
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Retired, sitting back and watching others for a change.
Posts: 34626 | From: Cream Tealand | Registered: Jun 2001
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Antisocial Alto
Shipmate
# 13810
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Posted
Yes. This has been a pet peeve at our church for years; although not at Easter so much as Christmas. I feel like the Christmas chestnuts are better known to the general population than the Easter ones, so it's even more frustrating to the visitors not to sing them. We do usually manage "O come, all ye faithful" and "Joy to the world", and use "Angels we have heard on high" for the Gloria, but the rest is pretty much a crapshoot.
My biggest cringe is when we do the Huron Carol at the big service on Christmas Eve. OK, the tune is pretty, but the text in the Hymnal 82 sounds like the Indians in a bad western. Anybody visiting for the first time would think they'd wandered into a racist Disney special from the 1950s. (Plus it's really hard not to sing "a wagged wobe of wabbit skin".)
This is why we have the Sunday after Christmas.
Posts: 601 | From: United States | Registered: Jun 2008
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TomOfTarsus
Shipmate
# 3053
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Posted
I know what you mean; when it comes to Easter and Christmas, the depth of traditional hymns is rich and ought to be enjoyed.
At the church we visited, the worship band leader is a very talented artist who has had at least 1 nation-wide chart-topper amongst the Christian music stations. I like the guy and I like his work; my son used to visit with him and his family back in youth group.
But for Easter morning, when I want to bellow the traditional "Christ the Lord is Risen Today", the band played his "comtemporary worship" arrangement, which was a major let-down - I hardly could follow the tune. Now perhaps my bellowing is selfish or sensual, but to pull in a full chest of air and sing with all my being the great themes of redemption and victory is what I want to do, and I can't do it with wimpy, obscure tunes. The same would go for your hymns-that-you-never-heard-of.
These grand old hymns are around because age to age they resonate so deeply with us. There is nothing to be gained by being either avaunt-garde or needlessly obscure; many "ChrEaster" Christians come at Christmas and Easter and the grand themes and traditional hymns ought to be kept in place in my view.
Blessings,
Tom
(BTW I'm a great fan of modern, or "contemporary" Christian music, from country to hip-hop & rap)
ETA: Cross-posted with 3 others. You hit a nerve!
[ 11. April 2012, 20:05: Message edited by: TomOfTarsus ]
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By grace are ye saved through faith... not of yourselves; it is the gift of God; not of works, lest any man should boast. For we are His workmanship, created in Christ Jesus unto good works, which God hath ... ordained that we should walk in them.
Posts: 1570 | From: Pittsburgh, PA USA | Registered: Jul 2002
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Custard
Shipmate
# 5402
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Posted
There is only one hymn that should be compulsory at Easter, and that is Thine Be the Glory. It even has a good tune, thanks to Handel.
See what a morning comes close, but doesn't yet have the longeivity of TBtG.
You'd get complaints round here if you tried something as slow as Christ the Lord is risen today - it's blatantly not a celebratory tune.
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blog
Adam's likeness, Lord, efface;
Stamp thine image in its place.
Posts: 4523 | From: Snot's Place | Registered: Jan 2004
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Horseman Bree
Shipmate
# 5290
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Posted
We had Christ the Lord Is Risen Today for Processional, and Thine Be the Glory for Recessional, with Now the Green Blade Rises during the Offertory giving, which happened to match the theme of the sermon well.
Having a violin to lead our small congo works well for these, and the singing was stronger than might be expected for the older group that was there. Musically, an excellent service.
Come to that, the rest of the service was pretty good, too.
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It's Not That Simple
Posts: 5372 | From: more herring choker than bluenose | Registered: Dec 2003
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Barnabas62
Shipmate
# 9110
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Posted
I think this is an Ecclesiantics topic, rather than Purgatory, but I'm checking it out with the Eccles Hosts.
Barnabas62
Purgatory Host
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Who is it that you seek? How then shall we live? How shall we sing the Lord's song in a strange land?
Posts: 21397 | From: Norfolk UK | Registered: Feb 2005
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Clodsley Shovel
Apprentice
# 16662
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Posted
quote:
You'd get complaints round here if you tried something as slow as Christ the Lord is risen today - it's blatantly not a celebratory tune. [/QB]
Really?!! I think its a magnificent, rousing, hymn made all the more beautiful in the knowledge that during the day millions of others around the world will be singing it.
We didn't sing JCiRT though unfortunately, as everyone knows Easter Sunday morning should start with that and end with Thine be the Glory... ![[Biased]](wink.gif)
We did get 'In Christ Alone' which I hadn't though of as an easter hymn but the third verse is apt I suppose.
Posts: 41 | Registered: Sep 2011
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Og, King of Bashan
Ship's giant Amorite
# 9562
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Posted
Is "Thine be the Glory" even in Hymnal 1982? I don't know that I have ever sung it.
As to "Jesus Christ is Risen Today" not being celebratory, you apparently have never heard our descanters do their thing. But this might start verging on the old contemporary vs traditional hymn dead horse, so I will just say "personal taste" and be done with it.
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"I like to eat crawfish and drink beer. That's despair?" ― Walker Percy
Posts: 3259 | From: Denver, Colorado, USA | Registered: May 2005
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John Holding
Coffee and Cognac
# 158
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Custard:
You'd get complaints round here if you tried something as slow as Christ the Lord is risen today - it's blatantly not a celebratory tune.
But the first few posts were about Jesus Christ Is Risen Today -- a different hymn, though similar in its structure.
It's really about the tune you want to sing -- round here, JCIRT is sung to Easter Hymn, which is a rousing and majestic piece of work unless played by an organist coping with 10 seconds of resonance.
I know of at least one, and possibly two other tunes that are traditionally sung to JCIRT, and it's certainly possible one of them could be described as not celebratory.
I'm also aware of a couple of tunes traditionally used for CTLIRT -- and though one at least is rousing, the other might not be if played improperly by a cathedral-level organist who thought s/he had a quarter-mile long nave to cope with.
John
Posts: 5929 | From: Ottawa, Canada | Registered: May 2001
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ken
Ship's Roundhead
# 2460
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Og, King of Bashan:
Is "Thine be the Glory" even in Hymnal 1982? I don't know that I have ever sung it.
![[Eek!]](eek.gif) It must be just about the most common Easter hymn here. Almost compulsory.
quote:
As to "Jesus Christ is Risen Today" not being celebratory...
... it so very much is celebratory and joyous. That's not a matter of taste - those who think it isn't are obviously Wrong ![[Razz]](tongue.gif)
And if they want to sing it faster, they can sing it faster!
But then we sang "We shall overcome" during communion, so what do we know? ![[Smile]](smile.gif) (it was genunely very moving)
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Ken
L’amor che move il sole e l’altre stelle.
Posts: 39579 | From: London | Registered: Mar 2002
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ken
Ship's Roundhead
# 2460
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by John Holding:
It's really about the tune you want to sing -- round here, JCIRT is sung to Easter Hymn, which is a rousing and majestic piece of work...
The Oremus website lists 42 hymn books that have a tune for the song, and according to them 41 print "Easter Hymn" (from the original tune tune in Lyra Davidica from which the words come) and one has "Llainfair" (also pretty rousing if not quite as majestic) The cyberhymnal website calles the tune "exuberant"!
Also JCIRT and CTLIRT basically are the same song, or different versions of the same song. They are translations of the same Latin original, and CTLIRT has been through the hands of Charles Wesley who expanded it a bit and added some 18th-century flourishes. Its sort of like the folk process And the original tune is "Easter Hymn" (or rather the very similar old tune that that is based on)
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Ken
L’amor che move il sole e l’altre stelle.
Posts: 39579 | From: London | Registered: Mar 2002
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Olaf
Shipmate
# 11804
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Og, King of Bashan:
Is "Thine be the Glory" even in Hymnal 1982? I don't know that I have ever sung it.
Funny you should mention that. It is not. I decided to go to a TEC church on Easter Sunday, and the only thing that I was disappointed about was that I knew my own church would be singing Thine Is the Glory while the Hymnal 1982 does not have it.
Lo and behold, what was sung at the TEC place? Thine Is the Glory, printed as a bulletin insert! I was ever so happy.
Changing Gears:
As a worship committee member at my place, we have some very "set" hymns that we stick with for particular occasions. Fortunately, these make our lives much simpler, and pretty much everybody is happy.
Honestly, I would feel a bit lost without some of these hymns, and it would make me sad if they were not used. The nice thing about these is that they transcend age boundaries.
Following are the hymns that would be missed by the "normal" people in the pews, and would be complained about if absent. Thankfully, we the committee do not roll that way, and we tend to pride ourselves on giving the people what they want without them having to ask for it or complain in its absence.
A special advantage that should not be discounted is the fact that people know these hymns. At your services on festivals, when you have lots of infrequent attendees and visitors, it is a good idea to choose hymns that your regulars want to sing and can sing vigorously and easily. Save the new, odd, and uncommonly-used stuff for the Sunday thereafter!
Christmas must-haves:
*O Come, All Ye Faithful
*Hark, the Herald Angels Sing
*Silent Night
Palm Sunday must-have:
*All Glory, Laud, and Honor
Easter must-have[s]:
*Jesus Christ Is Risen Today
*[We must use Thine Is the Glory during Easter season, but not necessarily on Easter Sunday. It is becoming more and more "required" every year.]
Holy Trinity must-have:
*Holy, Holy, Holy (Nicaea)
Reformation must-have:
*A Mighty Fortress
All Saints must-have:
*For All the Saints
Posts: 8953 | From: Ad Midwestem | Registered: Sep 2006
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Olaf
Shipmate
# 11804
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Posted
Sorry for the double, but I wanted to clarify:
In the US, some denominations use "Jesus Christ is Risen Today...our triumphant holy day..." to EASTER HYMN. (Tends to be "middle" to "higher church" denoms and RC)
Other denominations use "Christ the Lord is risen today...sons of men and angels say..." to EASTER HYMN. (Tends to be "middle" to "lower church" denoms)
The commonality is that most use the tune EASTER HYMN on Easter Sunday.
Posts: 8953 | From: Ad Midwestem | Registered: Sep 2006
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Alogon
Cabin boy emeritus
# 5513
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Posted
One lesson I've learned over the years is that so many good traditions are threatened these days and need defending, even when the locals will see the defense as innovation, that one should not waste one's ammunition and credibility in overthrowing a perhaps mediocre but fairly harmless tradition just for the sake of change. If people love singing a certain hymn on a certain day, and there isn't too much wrong with that hymn, then respect their sense of tradition by letting them sing it.
So "Jesus Christ is risen today" (Easter Hymn) is always the opener here.
I'l draw the line, however, at going on to sing two Arthur Sullivan tunes on the same day. We can do either Fortunatus or Saint Kevin on Easter Day, but please, God, not both. ![[Help]](graemlins/help.gif)
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Patriarchy (n.): A belief in original sin unaccompanied by a belief in God.
Posts: 7808 | From: West Chester PA | Registered: Feb 2004
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Barefoot Friar
Ship's Shoeless Brother
# 13100
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Posted
We're United Methodist, so CTLIRT is de rigueur*. The choir sang it, and I was in the choir, but it was not a congregational piece. Perhaps later in the season.
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*Translation: "Prescribed or required by fashion, etiquette, or custom."
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Do your little bit of good where you are; its those little bits of good put together that overwhelm the world. -- Desmond Tutu
Posts: 1621 | From: Warrior Mountains | Registered: Oct 2007
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Olaf
Shipmate
# 11804
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Posted
St. Thomas Hollywood (a fairly well-known Nosebleed AC place) posted this video clip from the 2011 Easter Day liturgy.
As an Eccles regular, I am not ashamed to say that this particular choice of opening hymn for Easter Day would keep me from joining that church if I lived in the area.
Posts: 8953 | From: Ad Midwestem | Registered: Sep 2006
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orfeo
Ship's Musical Counterpoint
# 13878
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Posted
Always a tricky issue, hymn selection.
I usually took the view that you couldn't introduce more than one 'new, interesting' hymn (so the OP where nothing was familiar sounds like a no-no), and if you're going to do that it's probably not best to pick one of the really big days to do it. Also, assess whether the tune is one that people will grasp easily.
I'd usually find that there were enough good ones within the well-known material for times like Easter and Christmas. Good Friday would always provide me with an opportunity for, to me, some of THE greatest classics in our hymn book - When I Survey the Wondrous Cross, O Sacred Head Sore Wounded and My Song Is Love Unknown are three of my favourite hymns of all.
Mind you, the best Christmas service I was ever involved in was one where we managed to extend ourselves at least slightly and not just roll out the utterly predictable ones. I'm sure we did at least 1 or 2 of the chart-toppers but we also threw in a version of The Little Drummer Boy that will stay with me forever, and I think that was also the year we did God Rest Ye Merry (Gentlemen).
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Technology has brought us all closer together. Turns out a lot of the people you meet as a result are complete idiots.
Posts: 18173 | From: Under | Registered: Jul 2008
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Barnabas62
Shipmate
# 9110
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Posted
Eccles it is. Moving ...
Barnabas62
Purgatory Host
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Who is it that you seek? How then shall we live? How shall we sing the Lord's song in a strange land?
Posts: 21397 | From: Norfolk UK | Registered: Feb 2005
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Mamacita
Lakefront liberal
# 3659
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Martin L:
St. Thomas Hollywood (a fairly well-known Nosebleed AC place) posted this video clip from the 2011 Easter Day liturgy.
As an Eccles regular, I am not ashamed to say that this particular choice of opening hymn for Easter Day would keep me from joining that church if I lived in the area.
What a bizarre selection for Easter Day. I've never seen a procession done in that manner and find it odd as well (not to start a tangent). For the processional hymn on a major feast day - especially one that brings visitors - you really do need one that's sing-able, belt-it-out festive, and familiar. Kind of like auricular comfort food.
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Do not be daunted by the enormity of the world’s grief. Do justly, now. Love mercy, now. Walk humbly, now. You are not obligated to complete the work, but neither are you free to abandon it.
Posts: 20761 | From: where the purple line ends | Registered: Dec 2002
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George6833
Apprentice
# 14995
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Posted
I've got a particular problem with the Handel " Thine is the Kingdom". I confabulate the tune with "Frosty the Snowman". Probably my personal problem......Happy Easter all.
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Keep what is Holy, Holy.
Wholly keep our creation sacred.
Posts: 28 | From: Boston, Massachusetts | Registered: Aug 2009
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MrMusicMan
Shipmate
# 16343
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Posted
Last Easter, our Pastor (who selects the hymns -- not me, thankfully!), programmed something else for the Gathering Hymn. I complained that Easter Hymn (Jesus Christ is Risen Today in ELW) should be programmed as the first hymn, for God and Charles Wesley ordained it be so (at least according to one of you Fools). She was not amused.
However, she programmed it during Communion as the third Distribution Hymn. A dear, sweet, college student, home for the Holiday cornered me and begged me to change the order of the Distribution Hymns. When I asked why, she told me that she really likes to sing Jesus Christ is Risen Today, and if we didn't get to it during Communion, it just wouldn't be Easter.
So, I changed the order of the Distribution Hymns to put JCIRT first, to ensure that it would be Easter for this young lady (I'm sure that her big, brown, puppy dog eyes looking up at me, or the lower cut of her neckline inviting me to look down at her had NOTHING to do with it). The gal's grandmother (who this year was rumored to be on a tear about the screaming toddler at Easter worship) also chimed in that we needed to sing JCIRT.
When the Pastor quizzed me after, I told her about the student who begged me to do it first because it wouldn't be Easter without JCIRT. She harumphed at me, at which time I reminded her that it's supposed to be the first hymn of the service, as God and Charles Wesley intended.
Guess what our Gathering Hymn this Easter was. ![[Cool]](cool.gif)
Posts: 167 | From: Wisconsin | Registered: Apr 2011
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Fr Weber
Shipmate
# 13472
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Alogon:
I'l draw the line, however, at going on to sing two Arthur Sullivan tunes on the same day. We can do either Fortunatus or Saint Kevin on Easter Day, but please, God, not both.
Scrap 'em both and do Lux Eoi instead!
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"The Eucharist is not a play, and you're not Jesus."
--Sr Theresa Koernke, IHM
Posts: 2512 | From: Oakland, CA | Registered: Feb 2008
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Ariston
Insane Unicorn
# 10894
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Posted
It's not Easter without the Easter Hymn. Period.
However, it's also not Maundy Thursday without "Tis Midnight and on Olive's Brow," which would be my mother's favorite hymn of all time. I think it's the biggest reason she attends MT services, really.
In America, you're pretty much required to do "We Gather Together" and "Harvest Home" on the Sunday before Thanksgiving. It's the one time besides Christmas you can be sure everyone learned the words to the song in elementary school.
I'm still wondering if I couldn't find a daring RC priest—and enough bribe money!—to get his congregation to sing "A Mighty Fortress" on the last Sunday in October. I'd even be willing to exchange Lutherans singing "Habemas Papam" for it . . .
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“Therefore, let it be explained that nowhere are the proprieties quite so strictly enforced as in men’s colleges that invite young women guests, especially over-night visitors in the fraternity houses.” Emily Post, 1937.
Posts: 6849 | From: The People's Republic of Balcones | Registered: Jan 2006
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orfeo
Ship's Musical Counterpoint
# 13878
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Barnabas62:
Eccles it is. Moving ...
Barnabas62
Purgatory Host
Eek! Don't think I've been here before.
*Waves a nervous hello to the natives*
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Technology has brought us all closer together. Turns out a lot of the people you meet as a result are complete idiots.
Posts: 18173 | From: Under | Registered: Jul 2008
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The Scrumpmeister
Ship’s Taverner
# 5638
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by ken:
quote:
Originally posted by Og, King of Bashan:
Is "Thine be the Glory" even in Hymnal 1982? I don't know that I have ever sung it.
It must be just about the most common Easter hymn here. Almost compulsory.
It was new to me when I moved back to the UK. It was simply unknown in the Caribbean. I always felt it had potential as a triumphal hymn but I only knew that to be the case once, when a rather superb organist did wonders with it. The problem is that most hymnals set it so low that, without a talented organist to make up for the deficit, the singing is rather insipid. Most people just can't bellow out with any reasonable volume when they're growling away down there because the key is too low.
I believe TBTG is also not a part of the established repertoire of English Roman Catholic congregations. Some parishes may know it, and it may even appear in the hymnals, but I'm told that most people would find it unfamiliar.
"The Day of Resurrection" to Ellacombe is always good to start with, or to end with, for that matter. It's just a metrical version of this but I like it.
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If Christ is not fully human, humankind is not fully saved. - St John of Saint-Denis
Posts: 14741 | From: Greater Manchester, UK | Registered: Mar 2004
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venbede
Shipmate
# 16669
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Posted
"Jerusalem the Golden" is one of my favourite hymns, although St Thomas Hollywood starting with it at Easter is a bit odd. We sang as an introit "Hail the day that sees him rise" to the tune Llanfair from the Ascension section. Also a bit odd, but OK.
At my last church we always ended with "Jesus Christ is risen today" as the sanctuary party moved to the robed statue of Our Lady so we could then sing "Joy to thee, O Queen of Heaven" as the fourth verse to the same tune. (We always had the Angelus at that point outside Eastertide.)
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Man was made for joy and woe;
And when this we rightly know,
Thro' the world we safely go.
Posts: 3201 | From: An historic market town nestling in the folds of Surrey's rolling North Downs, | Registered: Sep 2011
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Jolly Jape
Shipmate
# 3296
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Custard:
You'd get complaints round here if you tried something as slow as Christ the Lord is risen today - it's blatantly not a celebratory tune.
You're obviously too young to remember After The Fire doing CTLIRT (tempo of about 240 bpm, if I recall!)
Seriously, it can be done at a cracking pace, especially the wesleyan variant, and Wesley's lyrics are great. "Ours the cross, the grave, the skies, hallelujah!"
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To those who have never seen the flow and ebb of God's grace in their lives, it means nothing. To those who have seen it, even fleetingly, even only once - it is life itself. (Adeodatus)
Posts: 3011 | From: A village of gardens | Registered: Sep 2002
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busyknitter
Shipmate
# 2501
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Posted
I'd agree that Thine Be the Glory is pretty much compulsory on Easter Sunday in any CofE church.
We also sang In Christ Alone, Low in the Grave He Lay and Happy Day (Tim Hughes version) - all completely suitable for the occasion.
My list of must-sings for other seasons of the year is fairly short, but FWIW:
Harvest - We Plough the fields and scatter (though our vicar doesn't like it)
Advent Sunday - O Come, O Come Immanuel
Christmas - Silent Night (Of course we always sing O Come all ye Faithful and Hark the Herald and it wouldn't be Christmas without them, but frankly I'm bored stiff of them both).
Posts: 903 | From: The Wool Basket | Registered: Mar 2002
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Liturgylover
Shipmate
# 15711
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Posted
Come Down O love Divine for Pentecost and for any confirmation service.
Although not a particular favourite, For All the Saints on All Saints.
For Mary Mother of Our God and Sing we of the Blessed Mother for any Marian feast.
Of the Glorious Body Telling for Maundy Thursday during the procession to the altar of repose.
Brightest and Best of the Sons of the morning and O Worship the Lord for Epiphany.
Sweet Sacrament Divine for Corpus Christi.
Though an anthem rather than a hymn, I always look for a church that sings Hymn to the Trinity on Trinity Sunday.
Posts: 452 | From: North London | Registered: Jun 2010
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Jolly Jape
Shipmate
# 3296
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by busyknitter:
We also sang In Christ Alone, Low in the Grave He Lay and Happy Day (Tim Hughes version) - all completely suitable for the occasion.
The problem with "The greatest day in history (O happy day)" is the vocal range! Gruntingly low to screechingly high. It just about works for a bloke, but the poor ladies, singing an octave higher, really struggle. I agree it's a fine song, but not easy for the congo.
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To those who have never seen the flow and ebb of God's grace in their lives, it means nothing. To those who have seen it, even fleetingly, even only once - it is life itself. (Adeodatus)
Posts: 3011 | From: A village of gardens | Registered: Sep 2002
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Chorister
Completely Frocked
# 473
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Posted
Sometimes an old favourite gets changed to something weird, new, unusual (duty clergy and readers have the power of overriding choices if they so choose, and often do so to fit a point they wish to make in a sermon, eg.). However, there are various ways in which the old favourites can still be accommodated - for example, during the administration (which can often be long on Festival occasions) the choir can sing an extra anthem, which could be a harmonised version of a favourite hymn (in some churches, the congregation are in the habit of joining in with hymns sung during the administration). The organist could also play the hymn as a voluntary. People who have attended church then feel at least their known favourites have been included, even if they didn't get to actually sing all of them.
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Retired, sitting back and watching others for a change.
Posts: 34626 | From: Cream Tealand | Registered: Jun 2001
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busyknitter
Shipmate
# 2501
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Jolly Jape:
quote:
Originally posted by busyknitter:
We also sang In Christ Alone, Low in the Grave He Lay and Happy Day (Tim Hughes version) - all completely suitable for the occasion.
The problem with "The greatest day in history (O happy day)" is the vocal range! Gruntingly low to screechingly high. It just about works for a bloke, but the poor ladies, singing an octave higher, really struggle. I agree it's a fine song, but not easy for the congo.
I know. It is a shame as it is a fantastic song.
[Tangent alert] I'm used to singing first soprano so am quite happy with it as it is written. But to make it manageable for the congregation we usually take it down two semitones, which always gives me a comedy low note to cope with in the middle of the verse.
It seems to be a bit of tendency with contemporary worship songs that they don't take account of the comfortable singing range of the average congregation.
Posts: 903 | From: The Wool Basket | Registered: Mar 2002
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Jolly Jape
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# 3296
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Posted
Yes, BK. I'm married to a soprano, though she usually sings seconds these days, and we usually sing it a tone down. But, as you say, the first "alive" can be a bit droll! I'm sure much of the popularity of Brian Doerksen and Stuart Townend as tunesmiths is down to the fact that they write with congregations in mind.
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To those who have never seen the flow and ebb of God's grace in their lives, it means nothing. To those who have seen it, even fleetingly, even only once - it is life itself. (Adeodatus)
Posts: 3011 | From: A village of gardens | Registered: Sep 2002
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TomOfTarsus
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# 3053
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Posted
Christ the Lord is Risen Today isn't celebratory?
This video show it overdone to the extreme, and it didn't pick up the choir very well, but gee some of the kids ringing handbells are cute! Esp. the little girl with the really tiny bell - how do you get someone that young to do well with handbells? Wow!
I know at least one other tune that can be used, a church I attend uses it for "Jesus Christ is Risen Today" and I agree it is not a celebratory. That church alternates these two year by year. Obviously, I prefer this one!
Off to look up some of the others!
Blessings,
Tom
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By grace are ye saved through faith... not of yourselves; it is the gift of God; not of works, lest any man should boast. For we are His workmanship, created in Christ Jesus unto good works, which God hath ... ordained that we should walk in them.
Posts: 1570 | From: Pittsburgh, PA USA | Registered: Jul 2002
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venbede
Shipmate
# 16669
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Liturgylover:
For Mary Mother of Our God and Sing we of the Blessed Mother for any Marian feast.
"Her Virgin eyes saw God Incarnate born" is the one I'd like to have.2
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Man was made for joy and woe;
And when this we rightly know,
Thro' the world we safely go.
Posts: 3201 | From: An historic market town nestling in the folds of Surrey's rolling North Downs, | Registered: Sep 2011
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Siegfried
Ship's ferret
# 29
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Posted
The version Tom posted above is the one I'm familiar with and has been sung at every Easter Service I've attended.
Out of curiosity, could someone link to the other music used?
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Siegfried
Life is just a bowl of cherries!
Posts: 5592 | From: Tallahassee, FL USA | Registered: May 2001
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ken
Ship's Roundhead
# 2460
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Michael Astley:
The problem is that most hymnals set it so low that, without a talented organist to make up for the deficit, the singing is rather insipid. Most people just can't bellow out with any reasonable volume when they're growling away down there because the key is too low.
That brings us back to the Bad Singer Problem. You are a good singer. Busyknitter is a good singer. I am a bad singer. Lots of people are bad singers. In fact most people are. In England more men are bad singers than women (entirely cultural, it doesn't seem to be the case in the Caribbean, South Africa, Wales, or the Baltic countries) so the lower parts of songs suffer greatly from bad singing.
Good singers tend to sing higher than their natural range, and as they get better, or get trained more, they get even higher. I can't remember where I read about it but I read some research once where someone taught simple songs to people and got them to sing them back the next day. Apparentl;y those with musical training or experience did it in pretty much the key they were taught in, but others dropped considerably - I'm not sure but I think I remember them saying that the natural range of the untrained adult women singers they tested (in America) was about a fourth or fifth lower than soprano, and the natural range of untrained adult men was mostly bass. You have to learn to be a tenor.
So maybe a celebratory and triumphant song that is a bit low for a good singer like you is actually more fun for the rest of us because we can belt it out. A hypothesis that might well explain "Thine be the glory" and even "Guide me O though great Jehovah".
And I agree about many modern choruses having a big range.
And Graham Kendrick's work might benefit by having someone come and rewrite the last two bars of most of his songs so they go places bad singers might expect and can reach.
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Ken
L’amor che move il sole e l’altre stelle.
Posts: 39579 | From: London | Registered: Mar 2002
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Edgeman
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# 12867
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Posted
There was actually a bit of an argument in the choir loft and many, many disappointed comments from parishioners that we didn't sing 'My song is love unknown' on palm Sunday, having sung it each year for who knows how long. It's the only day of the year that hymn gets and outing, but it's supposedly too joyful to follow the reading of the passion.
But also on the list of Hymns That You May Not Ever Replace For Any Reason Whatever are:
On Jordan's Bank the Baptist's Cry, for Advent I
The Angel Gabriel form Heaven came, on Lent 4
Hark The Herald as the processional on Christmas day. (If it's in any other place, it doesn't count.)
As With Gladness Men of Old on Epiphany
Ah! Holy Jesus on Passion Sunday
Hail all Hail great Queen of Heaven! on the patron's feast day. (Absolutely, can never be changed. It's been sung here on that date for the entire history of the parish. There would be an uprising were it left out.)
Holy God, We Praise Thy Name, on Trinity Sunday
Jesus, My Lord, My God, My all, on Corpus Christi
Hail Holy Queen, Enthroned Above, on Assumption
JCIRT At the end of the Easter Vigil is another tradition that got broken this year so that the Hallelujah Chorus could be sung. (Not my choice.) Usually it's at the beginning of the easter day service, and we have I Know That My Redeemer Lives, sung to Duke Street as the recessional. This year, the first hymn was The Strife is O'er, and JCIRT was at the end.
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http://sacristyxrat.tumblr.com/
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Anglican_Brat
Shipmate
# 12349
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Posted
For me, there are certain hymns that just fit for specific feast days:
Christmas "Once in Royal David's City" for the Procession
"Of the Father's Love Begotten" (Especially if the Gospel is the Prologue from St John's Gospel)
First Sunday of Lent "Forty Days and Forty Nights"
Palm Sunday "All Glory, Laud and Honor" and "Ride on, Ride on in Majesty"
For the Passion: "My Song is Love Unknown"
Maundy Thursday: "O Thou at Thy Eucharist Didst Pray", "Now my Tongue, the Mystery Telling"
Good Friday: "O Sacred Head, surrounded", "Sing my Tongue the Glorious Battle"
Easter Sunday: Either "Jesus Christ is risen today" or "Christ the Lord is risen today", "Ye Choirs of New Jerusalem"
Ascension: "Hail the Day that sees him rise"
Pentecost: A translation or a paraphrase of "Veni Creator Spiritus"
Trinity Sunday: Either "I bind unto thee today" or "Holy, Holy, Holy", "Bright the Vision that Delighted" especially if the reading is from Isaiah 6.
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It's Reformation Day! Do your part to promote Christian unity and brotherly love and hug a schismatic.
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FatherRobLyons
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# 14622
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Posted
I have never heard this "Thine Be The Glory" hymn of which y'all speak. Will have to look it up.
Our plate for Easter Sunday was:
PROCESSIONAL: Jesus Christ is Risen Today
COVENANT RENEWAL: Baptized in Water
OFFERTORY: At the Lamb's High Feast
COMMUNION INSTRUMENTAL: Be Joyful, Mary
RECESSIONAL: Alleluia! Alleluia! Let the Holy Anthem Rise
For our Mass setting, we used the Mass of Renewal by Curtis Stephan (Oregon Catholic Press).
We use Gather Comprehensive, Volume II from GIA as our hymnal now, though we are looking at other hymnals for the future. Not sure how that might impact us next year, but I can say the five hymns above pretty much summarize what we do every Pascha. On the Sundays of Eastertide, we'll get some other good Easter Music in, but I promise that Holy Anthem will get at least another airing or two... mainly because it is my favorite Easter hymn ever.
Rob+
Posts: 321 | From: Bargersville, IN | Registered: Mar 2009
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busyknitter
Shipmate
# 2501
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by FatherRobLyons:
I have never heard this "Thine Be The Glory" hymn of which y'all speak. Will have to look it up.
Here it is in its most natural habitat, BBC Songs of Praise. ![[Big Grin]](biggrin.gif)
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TomOfTarsus
Shipmate
# 3053
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by busyknitter:
quote:
Originally posted by FatherRobLyons:
I have never heard this "Thine Be The Glory" hymn of which y'all speak. Will have to look it up.
Here it is in its most natural habitat, BBC Songs of Praise.
Thanks for that! I recall singing it now.
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By grace are ye saved through faith... not of yourselves; it is the gift of God; not of works, lest any man should boast. For we are His workmanship, created in Christ Jesus unto good works, which God hath ... ordained that we should walk in them.
Posts: 1570 | From: Pittsburgh, PA USA | Registered: Jul 2002
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Gamaliel
Shipmate
# 812
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Posted
'The greatest day in history (O happy day)' has to be one of the worst in the repetoire.
Go for Philip Doddridge's original 'O happy day that fixed my choice ...'
But leave this crap out.
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Let us with a gladsome mind
Praise the Lord for He is kind.
http://philthebard.blogspot.com
Posts: 15997 | From: Cheshire, UK | Registered: Jul 2001
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busyknitter
Shipmate
# 2501
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by Gamaliel:
'The greatest day in history (O happy day)' has to be one of the worst in the repetoire.
Go for Philip Doddridge's original 'O happy day that fixed my choice ...'
But leave this crap out.
Blimey! I can imagine folk not liking it because they don't like the contemporary worship song genre in general. But it's a good example of it's kind and I think "crap" is a bit harsh.
[Eccles a scarier place than I expected.......]
Posts: 903 | From: The Wool Basket | Registered: Mar 2002
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seasick
...over the edge
# 48
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Posted
Those of you who have entries for "Crappy choruses and horrible hymns" can enter them on the appropriate thread in Dead Horses. Can we confine this one to the OP subject, please?
seasick, Eccles host
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We believe there is, and always was, in every Christian Church, ... an outward priesthood, ordained by Jesus Christ, and an outward sacrifice offered therein. - John Wesley
Posts: 5769 | From: A world of my own | Registered: May 2001
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busyknitter
Shipmate
# 2501
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Posted
Oops, sorry. Gamaliel, have posted in the DH thread if you are interested (which you very likely aren't.....)
[ 12. April 2012, 19:06: Message edited by: busyknitter ]
Posts: 903 | From: The Wool Basket | Registered: Mar 2002
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venbede
Shipmate
# 16669
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by BalddudeCrompond:
This week I had the dubious pleasure of never having sung,nor played, any of the hymns on Easter Sunday.
As a matter of interest, what hymns did you have?
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Man was made for joy and woe;
And when this we rightly know,
Thro' the world we safely go.
Posts: 3201 | From: An historic market town nestling in the folds of Surrey's rolling North Downs, | Registered: Sep 2011
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Olaf
Shipmate
# 11804
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Posted
quote:
Originally posted by MrMusicMan:
Last Easter, our Pastor (who selects the hymns -- not me, thankfully!), programmed something else for the Gathering Hymn. I complained that Easter Hymn (Jesus Christ is Risen Today in ELW) should be programmed as the first hymn, for God and Charles Wesley ordained it be so (at least according to one of you Fools). She was not amused.
...
When the Pastor quizzed me after, I told her about the student who begged me to do it first because it wouldn't be Easter without JCIRT. She harumphed at me...
Seminary Preschool Lesson 1: Don't do the above! This is a frequent occurrence, and I have come to the conclusion that the seminaries must be teaching them to be difficult. (After which they have a colloquium about declining church attendance...)
quote:
AristonAstuanax:
In America, you're pretty much required to do "We Gather Together" and "Harvest Home" on the Sunday before Thanksgiving. It's the one time besides Christmas you can be sure everyone learned the words to the song in elementary school.
I'm still wondering if I couldn't find a daring RC priest—and enough bribe money!—to get his congregation to sing "A Mighty Fortress" on the last Sunday in October. I'd even be willing to exchange Lutherans singing "Habemas Papam" for it . . .
Thanksgiving is tricky because it usually coincides with Christ the King and/or the First Sunday in Advent. I usually put the Thanksgiving hymns on the second Sunday in November, the one between All Saints and Christ the King. If Christ the King is after Thanksgiving Day, then I can use Thanksgiving hymns on the Sunday directly before.
As for Habemus Papam, I know a few Lutheran choirs that would most likely be willing to sing it as a snarky comment about their leadership...
quote:
Venbede:
We sang as an introit "Hail the day that sees him rise" to the tune Llanfair from the Ascension section. Also a bit odd, but OK.
The (Wesley?) Ascension hymn "Hail the day that sees him rise" is certainly sung to LLANFAIR in the US.
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